Seconded, still wondering how Ugo4u isn’t any Officer yet.

Dayordee4:
What can I say...........

You guys would make good officers.......
I was just wondering how knowledgeable and current you guys are but much more your professionalism and maturity in response without insults....Gentlemen officers.....All the way.....
victory is from God alone

Salute......ugo4u and jafdoc

ugo4u:

Who told you the army needs the helicopters more than the airforce? and even if they give them the helos who will fly them? do you think it is easy to train just one pilot? you must be type rated to fly a specific Heli the fact that you can fly helicopter doesn't mean you can fly all kinds just like vehicles. That's why after the basic helicopter training they go for further training on specific aircraft the army wanna operate with.
That's by the way is it not money you will need to fly the helicopters? to fly just one sorties do you know how many million it cost the airforce in fuelling and maintenance for each mission. Infact the airforce under Abubakar Sadique has seen tremendous growth in its history, we now have more platforms and we've refitted moribund aircrafts to fly again, all this within very tight budget.
The whole thing still boils down to funds, even if the airforce hand over its entire fleet to the army things will even get worst, because you need avgas to fly them which cost huge sums of money.

The army obviously needs the helicopters more in this scenario.

The war has exposed lack of organizational coherence among the three services when it comes to warfare.

Soldiers have often complained about lack of Air support when needed. The air force in response has stated that necessary authorization is needed before deploying their air assets.

If the army has their own fighter helicopters fitted with all the necessary paraphernalia, it wouldn't need to radio the air force for support. Also, I will eliminate the bureaucracy (of authorization) that stands in the way of decimating an enemy from the air.

ugo4u:

I'm also speaking from a position of knowledge of the air force, and how they work, I've even flown with them in a mission in 2014 (Augusta 109) when GEJ went to commission the then newly built stadium.
First of all the main role of the air force is to protect the territorial integrity of the nation by air.
This includes routine air interdiction operations/close air support, that is why you have a joint task force command that comprises of both the Army, Airforce and navy formerly headed by Man. Gen Irabor.
We are not America that has the huge resources to equip it's Army with lots of combat helicopters, yes it's a good idea for the army to have an aviation unit but it is laughable to suggest the air force hand over its entire rotor wing fleet to the army, it's never done anywhere in the world, it's a recipe for disaster.
Even at present the best army can do is to train pilots in transport helicopters for troop insertion and evacuation, that's why they went for the gazelle helicopters instead of the Mi's, Agustas, Chinooks etc that are primarily built for offensive operations.
For you to think NAF is not doing enough only shows you ain't an insider, last year 2 Naf pilots (Kalto Silks and Jacob Perowei) whom I know personally when they where students of IHFS Enugu during my internship in the flight school , lost their lives in one of the close air support missions in the northeast. In 2014, we lost two pilots and the entire crew while they where returning from an air interdiction operation I was also in the briefing room with some pilots when the signal came in.
Again you said if any agency keep such assets they've budgetary provisions for such. My brother you made laugh so hard, do you know that customs have an aviation wing which is now moribund, do you think if they have budgetary allocations for such that unit will go extinct? It's one thing to submit budget and another to get funds, let me burst your bubble as of now we don't have more than two operational Mi35 attack helicopters, one was deployed to Zamfara because of banditry there, while the other is in the tactical air support group Makurdi. You think the NAF have all the money they need and some of the helicopters and fixed wings are grounded.
As for moving personnel from one service to another, it is no longer possible it happened in the 60's because the NAF/NN where newly setup and highly under manned that's why some NA officers where drafted to the NAF. It can't happen now, not even in NDA.
Can you mention any officer that have crossed service in this modern day.

Oga, the US army has their own helicopter fighter pilots. I'm sure you've heard of the Apache helicopter series flown by US army pilots not just for insertion but also for providing air support.

ugo4u:


When I talk about the air force I speak from a position of strength I'm not being boastful I have 1st class information about them, even the army aviation unit you're talking about I know when it was setup, and their first set of pilots where students at International Helicopter flying school emene Enugu before I left.
The choppers army ordered are gazelle helos and other light platform for troops and light attack. Go and Search for information about gazelle helicopters. I won't be surprised sef if they even use the helicopters for VIP transport. Maintaining an air fleet is extremely expensive, and training personnel takes an average of 3 to 4 years for an (accelerated program). Is it the army that is struggling to maintain its battle tanks and other ground equipments because of funds that will suddenly start maintaing sophisticated air machines, even the airforce was forced to look inwards , it was Innoson that they had to collabo with to design fighter jets brakes and refit some of their moribund machines.
Everything boils down to money, we have never spent upto $2bn solely for military purchase at any point in our history, yet you want the military to perform magic.
The US you're mentioning spent over $500bn alone on military spendings alone in 2018 fiscal year, their army have more aircraft than the Nigerian airforce entirely. So don't even compare them with Nigeria.
As for going to eastern Europe (Russia, Ukraine etc) to source for helicopters, do you have the budget to also fly in their technicians to maintain their equipments which in itself is too expensive and difficult to procure parts.
The issues are complex, far more than you'll understand untill you're inside.
That's why I say hold your elected officials to account, you don't procure military hardware on credit.

There you go again, talking about how you have inside info. I don't need to start boasting about my military family or about which military base I am currently residing.

OUR GOVERNMENT MAY BE MESSING UP BY NOT FUNDING THE MILITARY ENOUGH.

But please DO NOT TELL ME THAT ARMY DON'T NEED COMBAT AIRCRAFTS

One does not need to be inside or have military family before he or she could apply common sense.

I am NOT saying we should become America. That's not possible. Their army have over 5,000 aircrafts.

I did mentioned Britain, in population and landmass we are greater than Britain, in size Benue State is bigger than Israel. I am NOT even saying we should have the number of aircraft that these people have. I am just saying our army can make a difference if they own combat aircrafts.

durella32:
all this one wey u dy talk..na long story..if u make the list just zero your mind kawai..u think say all those generals know anything about modern combat...bro na new breed of servicemen like you we need and na why men like you and others gats answer the clarion call.. ND if God helps.. we are able to climb up the ladder and become senior men..maybe then things will change... but note one thing u cant change anything if u are not around the decision making table.. so let's all pray we live to be among those making decisions for the army sooner rather than later.. cos time is not our side.. the army is crying out for radical progressives...u don't learn that in school it is just imbedded in some humans..i mean humans that are not moved by money.. any human not moved by money always takes a rational decision...NG5over ND out..

ma guy...hope say you don't add more height like this...lol OD18

Helicopters ooooo aircrafts oooooo...LIST! LIST! LIST! LIST! is the most important thing that's directly before us now...

I know that once list shows, people wey go leave nairaland till another form commot dey...

All this helicopter gist doe very good and I have much respect for ugo and the other guy for having so much knowledge about it doesn't appeal to me one bit....local man is just waiting for army to publish in daily sun... So that local man can quit his Job and fire there..

darkelf:


Oga, the US army has their own helicopter fighter pilots. I'm sure you've heard of the Apache helicopter series flown by US army pilots not just for insertion but also for providing air support.

Did you see me say army don't need an aviation unit? what I said is very clear, the army won't have the requisite spending power to effectively maintain and operate combat helicopters for combat mission.
See air support is very very difficult to plan and execute it's not just flying aircraft and throwing bombs as most of you think, ask yourself what is happening to most of our aircraft that can't fly in NAFs inventory you think the airforce is happy being grounded abi, without funds there is nothing they can do.
Even most of the army's main battle tanks T72s are not serviceable, which boils down to inadequate funds and you think the same army will spend scarce fund to procure combat helicopters. It's well.

Jafdoc:


There you go again, talking about how you have inside info. I don't need to start boasting about my military family or about which military base I am currently residing.

OUR GOVERNMENT MAY BE MESSING UP BY NOT FUNDING THE MILITARY ENOUGH.

But please DO NOT TELL ME THAT ARMY DON'T NEED COMBAT AIRCRAFTS

One does not need to be inside or have military family before he or she could apply common sense.

I am NOT saying we should become America. That's not possible. Their army have over 5,000 aircrafts.

I did mentioned Britain, in population and landmass we are greater than Britain, in size Benue State is bigger than Israel. I am NOT even saying we should have the number of aircraft that these people have. I am just saying our army can make a difference if they own combat aircrafts.

Being accused of boasting is what is making hold brakes to certain things. But if you want us to go ballistics two can play, that you come from a military family or stay in the barracks don't mean you fully have a grasp of the operational modalities of the military. Moreover I have seen children of military officers that are totally disinterested in anything concerning the military.

I've being opportuned to sit in boards chaired by senior airforce officers(IHFS) and directors from Triax engineering services (owned by Arthur Eze) responsible for buying aircrafts and parts for the NAF, and I have commendation letter from NAF(if you want I'll post it here). It's not about being boastful, is having access to info on workings of the military.
I FYI I never said army doesn't need helicopters, my point has always being clear, what we need at the interim is light attack/transport helos, not Mi35s Apahes. Not all missions require use of helos especially when your enemies have the weapons to bring any low flying aircraft down, or you think there won't be breifing/planning which includes knowledge of your enemies weapon systems before any mission.
We don't even have enough funds to maintain the combat helos in NAF inventory, talkmore of the army.

ugo4u:

Being accused of boasting is what is making hold brakes to certain things. But if you want us to go ballistics two can play, that you come from a military family or stay in the barracks don't mean you fully have a grasp of the operational modalities of the military. Moreover I have seen children of military officers that are totally disinterested in anything concerning the military.

I've being opportuned to sit in boards chaired by senior airforce officers(IHFS) and directors from Triax engineering services (owned by Arthur Eze) responsible for buying aircrafts and parts for the NAF, and I have commendation letter from NAF(if you want I'll post it here). It's not about being boastful, is having access to info on workings of the military.
I FYI I never said army doesn't need helicopters, my point has always being clear, what we need at the interim is light attack/transport helos, not Mi35s Apahes. Not all missions require use of helos especially when your enemies have the weapons to bring any low flying aircraft down, or you think there won't be breifing/planning which includes knowledge of your enemies weapon systems before any mission.
We don't even have enough funds to maintain the combat helos in NAF inventory, talkmore of the army.

Ugo pls I need to have a discussion with you on phone, I urgently need your advice on an important issue.

My ph people please can we meet up somewhere

ugo4u:

Being accused of boasting is what is making hold brakes to certain things. But if you want us to go ballistics two can play, that you come from a military family or stay in the barracks don't mean you fully have a grasp of the operational modalities of the military. Moreover I have seen children of military officers that are totally disinterested in anything concerning the military.

I've being opportuned to sit in boards chaired by senior airforce officers(IHFS) and directors from Triax engineering services (owned by Arthur Eze) responsible for buying aircrafts and parts for the NAF, and I have commendation letter from NAF(if you want I'll post it here). It's not about being boastful, is having access to info on workings of the military.
I FYI I never said army doesn't need helicopters, my point has always being clear, what we need at the interim is light attack/transport helos, not Mi35s Apahes. Not all missions require use of helos especially when your enemies have the weapons to bring any low flying aircraft down, or you think there won't be breifing/planning which includes knowledge of your enemies weapon systems before any mission.
We don't even have enough funds to maintain the combat helos in NAF inventory, talkmore of the army.

I think ugo4u is right, it all boils down to funding.. you can see for yourselves https://www.nairaland.com/5468177/2020-military-police-spend-91

Even if I know about operational modalities, or classified info, you think I will come here on Nairaland and start spilling it?

There is nothing you mentioned that is new. Inability to maintain platform is common knowledge to most Nigerians.

In fact I mentioned earlier on this thread that "when it comes to effective use of technology to solve problem Nigeria as a country is a total failure". The country have the resources but poor management is a big problem. From poor road maintenance, to epileptic supply of power to non functional refineries. You can continue to name them. In so far as technology is involved, maintenance cost is involved and that's where management issues mess things up in Nigeria whether military or civil agency.

We are all arguing to keep the thread alive, perhaps, some people will learn one or two things. No hard feelings bro. If you have info that is beneficial to the group, feel free to share. Are you going to deny the group important info just because of one nigga?

Just because the military faces setbacks in the lake Chad region, tomorrow someone will come and say the navy should hand over all its gunboats to the amphibious unit of the army because they lack organisational structure (which is false). When the best special forces unit in the country is in the navy.
Why do we have the JTF in the first place that is even chaired by an army officer, why does the NDA train both army, NAF and NN cadets together.

Jafdoc:
Even if I know about operational modalities, or classified info, you think I will come here on Nairaland and start spilling it?

There is nothing you mentioned that is new. Inability to maintain platform is common knowledge to most Nigerians.

In fact I mentioned earlier on this thread that "when it comes to effective use of technology to solve problem Nigeria as a country is a total failure". The country have the resources but poor management is a big problem. From poor road maintenance, to epileptic supply of power to non functional refineries. You can continue to name them. In so far as technology is involved, maintenance cost is involved and that's where management issues mess things up in Nigeria whether military or civil agency.

We are all arguing to keep the thread alive, perhaps, some people will learn one or two things. No hard feelings bro. If you have info that is beneficial to the group, feel free to share. Are you going to deny the group important info just because of one nigga?

No hard feelings on my side either. There are somethings I can't say here/share here,(documents, signals etc) because I can be easily traced by the air force.

[quote author=ugo4u post=83073935]
No hard feelings on my side either. There are somethings I can't say here/share here,(documents, signals etc) because I can be easily traced by the air force.[/quote

Need to talk with u bro

ugo4u:
Just because the military faces setbacks in the lake Chad region, tomorrow someone will come and say the navy should hand over all its gunboats to the amphibious unit of the army because they lack organisational structure (which is false). When the best special forces unit in the country is in the navy.
Why do we have the JTF in the first place that is even chaired by an army officer, why does the NDA train both army, NAF and NN cadets together.

This one you mentioned is a different case o. The army already have gunboats. Also Area of Operational Responsibility is clearly defined. The amphibious forces of the army in the riverine area have no intentions to take over the function of the navy. Army only have gunboats for riverine operations, they don't have seaworthy vessels because they have no intentions to go to the sea.

Same with the air asset thing, army have no intentions to take over the function of the air force. No army general will ever talk about fighter jets and bombers. That is entirely the province of the air force.

The suggestion I made about transferring assets is because of the urgency with which this war has to be brought to an end. It is clearly my opinion, no apologies about that. There have been serious complain from lower and mid level commanders about air force not responding to calls for air support. Army high command is aware of this, that's why they asking federal government for their own helicopters.

One thing I know about the NAF is that they don't joke with the lives of their officers and men, they hold them in high esteem because of their investments in their personnel. To train even an NCO in specialist certified(ATCs, Airframe powerplant, Load masters etc) runs into millions, talkmore of pilots where to train one to the level of combat readiness will cost nothing less than N60million.
For the army you're disposable, infact they value their rifles more than their personnel. That's why if you dessert with army rifle or loose it during operation your own done finish. It is not called a "mad man's" job for no reason.

ugo4u:

No hard feelings on my side either. There are somethings I can't say here/share here,(documents, signals etc) because I can be easily traced by the air force.

Where will those who study education (computer science education) be posted during or after train)

ugo4u:
One thing I know about the NAF is that they don't joke with the lives of their officers and men, they hold them in high esteem because of their investments in their personnel. To train even an NCO in specialist certified(ATCs, Airframe powerplant, Load masters etc) runs into millions, talkmore of pilots where to train one to the level of combat readiness will cost nothing less than N60million.
For the army you're disposable, infact they value their rifles more than their personnel. That's why if you dessert with army rifle or loose it during operation your own done finish. It is not called a "mad man's" job for no reason.

All service branch have their own issues bro. The dead body of a pilot can be charged and dismissed from service if investigation find him responsible for the crash of an aircraft.

Jafdoc:


All service branch have their own issues bro. The dead body of a pilot can be charged and dismissed from service if investigation find him responsible for the crash of an aircraft.

wawu!

TheFuckQueen:


Where will those who study education (computer science education) be posted during or after train)

If it's SSC you can be posted anywhere, but if it's DSSC you will be moved to education corp.

TheFuckQueen:


Where will those who study education (computer science education) be posted during or after train)

lmao front line...you'll go and teach boko haram how to do software...
Wey u suppose wait make list show first and then ensure you get to training, you dey ask this kind question.... Na ugo go post you?

Make una go check 2020 budget for army and airforce know how far, awon combat helicopters.
The Army for example only have N14bn to spend on purchases including armoured vehicles, tanks, weapons etc To train just 20 combat pilots and technicians will gulp almost 1bn alone talkmore of purchasing a frontline helicopters that cost roughly $30m per unit. We never begin talk about arming them, mind you, one heat seeking missile cost as much as $30k.

jameh48:
Ugo4u, and jafdoc...You guys are too much...I hope others on this thread are learning...Very knowledgeable...Again, show how knowledgeable you are on when the list will be out.

Exactly my brother.

Na list I dey cry for, guy men dey argue Apache Helo.

My eyes just dey do wigulu wigulu for their mata

KODACK:



Exactly my brother.

Na list I dey cry for, guy men dey argue Apache Helo.

My eyes just dey do wigulu wigulu for their mata

Hahahaha

Insufficient funding is one thing spending priority is another thing.

Do you know the Customs don't have scanners for inspection of containers at our seaport and border control points? This important tool is in the service of modern customs around the world. The manual inspection of containers is partly responsible for the delay in clearing goods and responsible for the traffic gridlock around the port axis. Why am I citing this one? I am only trying to say that no Nigerian agency is immune to all this bad management thing.

The federal government of Nigeria have more spending on recurrent expenditure more than on capital project. Many of the staff on pay roll are idle and inefficient. They can be easily replaced by machine, robots (AI). They are ways to cut unnecessary cost thereby freeing money for capital project and other priority items.

Nobody want to solve any problems. We are facing systemic failure, all these problems we are enumerating are signs of systemic failure.

No sign that this problem will go away. Just take your army job and enjoy your salary jejely. You no go fit solve Nigeria problems. And if u fear death. abeg avoid infantry and armour corp. That's all.

ugo4u:

If it's SSC you can be posted anywhere, but if it's DSSC you will be moved to education corp.

Ugoooooo I have an urgent matter to discuss with you ASAP. Plsssssssssss

LexyJay02:


Ugoooooo I have an urgent matter to discuss with you ASAP. Plsssssssssss

check your mail

I will say it again for the umpteenth time. If you are joining the army just condition your mind for the worst so that nothing you see in the field will take you by surprise, if it's only the salary or job security that is attracting you, and you're not a lady, e go too red for you oo!! when posting show irrespective of the corp you find yourself. The navy or airforce should be what you should be gunning for.

This is war

Who goes to war without backup

Funny how people in this thread wish to see the list , if possible today

After pop sambisa straight without backup from helo and some agreed too this , how long do you think you can push with helo coming in at times

Only if you know the income Nigeria generate , you will ask for the needful

To win a war you need all the money you can get ( or else , play with peoples life )



Well , other regular intakes will come after us , just as we have entered to die a quick DEATH
Within short period of time like others before us




Rest in peace to the dead ...


I stick with Jafdoc argument .

.

.