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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Islam for Muslims / How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? (2322 Views)
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Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by tintingz(m): 10:27pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
budaatum:I'm talking about social myths. |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by budaatum: 10:31pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
tintingz:There was never a time when humans did not have belief. They had beliefs precisely because they had no knowledge. And religion is simply the process by which people were taught beliefs. Its like telling you Phytagoras Theorem without teaching you how it came about. You believe it because you are ignorant, but once you understand it you stop believing because you now know it. 1 Like |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by budaatum: 10:34pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
tintingz:Stop splitting hairs. All myths are social or they are just crap you independently create in your own head and chose to believe. And trust me when I say I need you far more than to let you think up your own myths in your head by yourself, least you become uncontrollable like us! |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by tintingz(m): 10:34pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
budaatum:Lmao, you should go for stand up comedy. Religion introduced reading and written, skepticism advanced it. Without skepticism we would still believe the earth is flat. Example are the Greek scholars. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by tintingz(m): 10:38pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
budaatum: What do I choose to believe? |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by tintingz(m): 10:41pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
budaatum: Do animals have beliefs? |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by budaatum: 10:42pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
tintingz:Choose? You? In a world where I get to invest in temples and write books to indoctrinate you into my own myths with religion? Nothing, of course! That would be like you using your own brain to think up things for yourself, and I just can't let you do that least you become like us! |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by tintingz(m): 10:44pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
budaatum: You said I chose some believe in some things, and i ask you what are they? |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by budaatum: 10:49pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
tintingz:Don't mind those silly Greeks, daring to doubt what I tell them! You, tingz are Nigerian I hope, stuck in the dark and ready to believe what I tell you to, though, I must admit that I'm losing control of you! See you here daring to think for yourself! Don't you know that will lead you to the mythical hell I created to scare you so you do not think for yourself? You must believe, least you too become like us, knowing the Knowledge of the Good and the Evil and reaching out for the Fruits of the Tree of Life that will make you be free and live! |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by budaatum: 10:53pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
tintingz:No, I never said you choose. You don't choose. I tell you what to believe! Its why I created religion and built temples and went up to heaven to bring you a book from God so that you may believe what I tell you. You only get to choose when you realise you have a brain in your head and learn how to use it, and God forbid that happens least you become a living being like us! |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by budaatum: 10:54pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
tintingz:They must have. They must believe where their food is for instance, or else they would actually know where it is or starve to death. |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by budaatum: 11:04pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
tintingz:Those were the days! And then you increased in number and began teaching those beliefs to each other and then we organised and it became a religion. We needed it see, religion. Or everyone might just have begun choosing to believe whatever they wanted, and that would have been rather messy because we would have found it difficult to control you if you all believed whatever you wanted. Its why we hide the knowledge of the Greeks from you see. Imagine the chaos that would have been created if you'd all learnt to become like those uncontrollable skeptical independently thinking Greeks! Yuk! 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by tintingz(m): 11:11pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
budaatum:For there to be a belief there must be a concept like the knowledge you said, animals don't have that. Humans were once like that. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by tintingz(m): 11:14pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
budaatum:Lmao! Prophet Buda (salad macaroni salad) 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by tintingz(m): 11:16pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
budaatum: Lol. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by budaatum: 11:19pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
tintingz:I never said there has to be a "concept of knowledge" for there to be a belief, though one might call it that so long as you mean the 'existence of an awareness', which animals clearly must have. An example would be a goat in the wild hearing the roar of a lion and believing it might make them disappear if they do not run. It might have gained this "concept of awareness" through the religion of its co-goats who also run if it had not been religionised into the "lion roar, run!" belief. You just need imagine what a goat who never heard a lion roar would do. It might just stand there and be eaten by the lion, though the roar is likely to make it jump. |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by budaatum: 11:26pm On Oct 30, 2019 |
tintingz:See! Just a few posts and you are already turning me into a prophet who is telling you what to believe. I bet when I build a temple and claim I went up a mountain and brought these my own words down from a god you would say Ṣallā Allāhu ʿalayhi Wa-ʿala Āli-hi Wa-sallam buda! |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by IMAliyu(m): 12:03am On Oct 31, 2019 |
tintingz:It's been a while man. We seem to be in agreement here. I wasn't really arguing that the answers were correct or factual. Just that it gave an explanation to phenomena beyond their/our comprehension (at that time) even if incorrect. It gave majority a peace of mind, a way to imagine it. On the note of the abolishment of slavery. English Protestants played a role. A realisation of the idea that all men are created equal even if that's not factually true. "The Committee for the Abolition of the Slave Trade was formed in 1787 by a group of Evangelical English Protestants allied with Quakers, to unite in their shared opposition to slavery and the slave trade. The Quakers had long viewed slavery as immoral, a blight upon humanity." https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slave_Trade_Act_1807 Now I'm not saying that morality is exclusive to religion, an amoral person will always be amoral with or without a religion and vice versa. my point is that some religions have some set of stories and instructions that if you acted it out as if they were true (a metatruth) has more benefits than down sides e.g. "love to your neighbor what you love for yourself" "Everything happens for a reason"(this stops people from beating themselves when something bad happens to them speaking from personal experience). "You will be rewarded or punished for all your good and bad deeds" Not fully disagreeing here Some practices though, but not all. E.g. human sacrifices that existed in some ancient south American and African religions were without a doubt barbaric. And the actions of self proclaimed jihadists. That's why being an ideologue is problematic. Really depends on how early we are talking about here. I would think our primitive tribalistic nature would had gave birth to the first tribe wars and wars for resources and religious wars would come up as an extension of that. The secular governments that formed in Europe and later in the Americas (I don't know about asia) came about through the interpretation of Matthew 22:21 Jesus said "Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's; and to God the things that are God's." A separation of church and state (Although wars for national interest came to replace religious wars.) Unfortunately Islam doesn't have such a thing as far as anyone is concerned at the moment. Wasn't making the point that it unified all beliefs, I was making the point that it unified some (inherently different) people under a shared belief, but group identity is always going to create conflicts. There are NO prove to this. It's normal to have emotional sensation when you listen to emotional things, I listen to music and feel emotional.Ok. So we can agree that no good comes from forcing one's ideals onto another. Actually yes it was and the fact that I wrote everything off the top of my head so you should take it with a teaspoon of salt and the things I said maybe wrong. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by tintingz(m): 12:05am On Oct 31, 2019 |
budaatum: Animals behave as they are naturally engineered like a code, they don't have concept of beliefs, they have no skill of knowledge. 1 Like |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by budaatum: 12:07am On Oct 31, 2019 |
tintingz:Only a God can naturally engineer! A goat that has no knowledge of a lion might not fear being eaten! I insist that it was religionised into running by its co-goats! |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by tintingz(m): 12:10am On Oct 31, 2019 |
budaatum: Prophet Buda(Salad macaroni salad) what should I believe in? |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by budaatum: 12:16am On Oct 31, 2019 |
tintingz:Whatever I tell you to of course, unless you are Greek and are capable of considering available evidence, and looking for your own, which I hope you aren't or else you might become like us! Have you ever wondered why animals avoid dangers by sensing some "signs" possibly related to the danger? A simple form of this phenomenon is called "fear conditioning", which is a type of learning commonly seen in every animal on the earth. By manipulating activity of specific neurons of the zebrafish brain, scientists at the National Institute of Genetics (NIG) in Japan have elucidated a neuronal population essential for fear conditioning in zebrafish. The study, published in the April 25 issue of BMC Biology, suggests that such a neural circuit essential for fear conditioning exists and is conserved during vertebrate evolution. How can animals avoid dangers to survive? If animals experienced dangerous events together with some "signs", animals memorize the sign, became in fear of it, and perform fear responses, for instance an escape behavior. This is a type of learning, which is called "fear conditioning". In mammals including humans, the amygdala, one of the structures of the brain, plays an important role in fear conditioning. https://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2018-04/rooi-hca042318.php |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by IMAliyu(m): 12:31am On Oct 31, 2019 |
tintingz:Then that would mean it was a time when humans lacked imagination and abstraction then. Organized religion would had came about at around the beginning of something resembling civilization when rule and order would become useful. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by budaatum: 1:07am On Oct 31, 2019 |
tintingz:I guess I have to settle for "Salad macaroni salad" or work harder for my Ṣallā Allāhu ʿalayhi Wa-ʿala Āli-hi Wa-sallam. But we made progess tingz. Thanks for understanding buda so far. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by tintingz(m): 1:38am On Oct 31, 2019 |
IMAliyu:Yeah it's been a while. I wasn't really arguing that the answers were correct or factual. Just that it gave an explanation to phenomena beyond their/our comprehension (at that time) even if incorrect. If it is fantasize or imaginary answers I will agree with you. On the note of the abolishment of slavery. English Protestants played a role. A realisation of the idea that all men are created equal even if that's not factually true.The point I'm making is religions like Islam, Judaism and Christianity dogmatism didn't abolish slavery, slavery was seen as normal and even divine order in the past. Not fully disagreeing hereGood. Really depends on how early we are talking about here.Correct. The secular governments that formed in Europe and later in the Americas (I don't know about asia) came about through the interpretation of Matthew 22:21 Jesus said "Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's; and to God the things that are God's."Care to provide this source? Wasn't making the point that it unified all beliefs, I was making the point that it unified some (inherently different) people under a shared belief, but group identity is always going to create conflicts.Ok So we can agree that no good comes from forcing one's ideals onto another.Touché Actually yes it was and the fact that I wrote everything off the top of my head so you should take it with a teaspoon of salt and the things I said maybe wrong. Ok. |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by tintingz(m): 1:40am On Oct 31, 2019 |
budaatum:Lol. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by tintingz(m): 1:43am On Oct 31, 2019 |
IMAliyu:Exactly. Touché. |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by Rashduct4luv(m): 7:34am On Oct 31, 2019 |
tintingz: Where is the evidence for that? |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by tintingz(m): 1:32pm On Oct 31, 2019 |
Rashduct4luv:There are various members of homo(genus) in human evolution, there's nothing like single couples or first man. It's ridiculous to think some single couples were responsible for the population of this world and human race. |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by tintingz(m): 1:34pm On Oct 31, 2019 |
budaatum: Hahahahahaha. |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by tintingz(m): 1:38pm On Oct 31, 2019 |
budaatum: Animals can recognize signs, fear etc these are natural instinct, but they don't have concept of knowledge that can develop some imaginary thoughts like myths and beliefs. Animals don't have beliefs. |
Re: How Would The World Be If There Wasn't Any Religion? Your Opinions? by budaatum: 1:45pm On Oct 31, 2019 |
tintingz:I bet you've never had a dog or a cat or a chicken. If you ever did, I bet they never had the knowledge to recognise you as their owner, so they instinctively bit you and scratched you and pecked at you and never believed nor knew their food came from you. |
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