These players have allegiances to both countries. You won't understand unless you are in their shoes.

TheSuperNerd:
Ofcos you won't see the test of character on the line.

You analyse issues of national allegiance like they are just jobs one can change at will. I am sorry but your analogy is really poor.

That's up to him really. The decision is for life. It goes as deep as allegiance to a flag and a nation's values. Not like he can switch again when he is not feeling it anymore. Anyway, it is his decision to make. We shall see the end of it eventually.

andrewbaba44:


Agreed

I hope say traore go use him brain

Those Europeans want all the talents at their disposal JUST IN CASE. You for believe say Netherlands will go for Arnaut?

edi287:

LMFAO abi? Belgium dey a bit stacked Sha. The guy sef go dey do shakara now.

There is nothing rocket scientific about this abeg. They have to pledge to one flag and one flag only and there is no way they will be drawn to both with same passion. No way. They must prefer one over the other for whatever reason.

You just got the wrong analogy. I know exactly how this goes. I thought you said you don't want to argue. Joe... Your analogy with jobs is wrong. This is about Nations.

Joebie:
These players have allegiances to both countries. You won't understand unless you are in their shoes.

That's the choice one has to make as the analogy suggests. in the Job scenario you look at which company you are more drawn to in terms of their vision etc. You also think of your future and prospects. There are several things you have to look into.. That flag thing to me na wash wash.. when we bring these things to reality and we apply it to ourselves it's a different story. But it's easy to just talk when you have a fan perspective.

TheSuperNerd:
There is nothing rocket scientific about this abeg. They have to pledge to one flag and one flag only and there is no way they will be drawn to both with same passion. No way. They must prefer one over the other for whatever reason.

You just got the wrong analogy. I know exactly how this goes. I thought you said you don't want to argue. Joe... Your analogy with jobs is wrong. This is about Nations.

TheSuperNerd:
Up to him to turn them down or turn back on his agreement to Mali. This is always a test of character. If he falls into the Spain trap, then he is not that smart... but then this will show where his heart always was and if he is truly thinking about his international future.

I don't see him turning Spain down, he'll definitely heed their call

my bro let's be real with ourselves. Nigeria does not have a good image administratively etc speaking. it will take people who want to make sacrifices for this country... Those are the true patriots. And there are not many of them.

modified
And I hope they won't regret it

jihday:
I don't see him turning Spain down, he'll definitely heed their call

Time will tell. But if he does that, then he just played Mali. I wonder what generation supports men who pretend about a decision to commit to a nation being their best and their heart's choice only to see them exposed when a "glittering, cannot resist" offer of nationality change comes calling.

If Mali and Adams had no agreement and unveiling with him giving him their words, then I will have no issues with him accepting Spain. But it turns out Adama will be proven an opportunist only out for material fame and not the true fame that comes with wanting and having a truly blessed international career, if he indeed goes back on his Mali allegiance and chooses Spain.

jihday:
I don't see him turning Spain down, he'll definitely heed their call

I speak beyond the scope of a fan. I have seen this situation play out a couple of times and it boiled down to Character. This is not your daily materialistic job... This is about committing to a nation. You cannot change Nations after you have been "officially" capped same way you change Clubsides.

Adama gave his words to Mali as a Malian-born and even agreed to be unveiled with them. He told them he is committed and there is no going back. Now Spain comes calling... A more prestigious nation and he is eligible too because of his Spanish citizenship. If he accepts it will only be because he thinks of the huge financial gains and prestige he thinks and believes it will add to his standing as a player.

He is willing to sacrifice a potentially successful international football life with Mali for the pride of being called a one time Spanish international with maybe five caps and no impact at that level. It will then add financial premiums to his saallary standings clubwise... And then what? He misses out on a dream.

Mehn... This is akin to Esau selling his birthright for a pot of sweet satisfying soup.

Character is definitely at the core here.



And you are doing what you said you don't want to do... You are arguing.

Joebie:
That's the choice one has to make as the analogy suggests. in the Job scenario you look at which company you are more drawn to in terms of their vision etc. You also think of your future and prospects. There are several things you have to look into.. That flag thing to me na wash wash.. when we bring these things to reality and we apply it to ourselves it's a different story. But it's easy to just talk when you have a fan perspective.

How can you be too sure of the bolded? There are many possible reasons why he could choose Spain over Mali.
There is no guarantee he will have a good international career with Mali either.

And what if he chooses Mali over Spain because he feels he would have a better international career? will that then still be due to his love for the Malian flag?

TheSuperNerd:
I speak beyond the scope of a fan. I have seen this situation play out a couple of times and it boiled down to Character. This is not your daily materialistic job... This is about committing to a nation. You cannot change Nations after you have been "officially" capped same way you change Clubsides.

Adama gave his words to Mali as a Malian-born and even agreed to be unveiled with them. He told them he is committed and there is no going back. Now Spain comes calling... A more prestigious nation and he is eligible too because of his Spanish citizenship. If he accepts it will only be because he thinks of the huge financial gains and prestige he thinks and believes it will add to his standing as a player.

He is willing to sacrifice a potentially successful international football life with Mali for the pride of being called a one time Spanish international with maybe five caps and no impact at that level. It will then add financial premiums to his saallary standings clubwise... And then what? He misses out on a dream.

Mehn... This is akin to Esau selling his birthright for a pot of sweet satisfying soup.

Character is definitely at the core here.

And by the way, I'm in a discussion mode.. I don't take everything as an argument. There are no points to score.

TheSuperNerd:
I speak beyond the scope of a fan. I have seen this situation play out a couple of times and it boiled down to Character. This is not your daily materialistic job... This is about committing to a nation. You cannot change Nations after you have been "officially" capped same way you change Clubsides.

Adama gave his words to Mali as a Malian-born and even agreed to be unveiled with them. He told them he is committed and there is no going back. Now Spain comes calling... A more prestigious nation and he is eligible too because of his Spanish citizenship. If he accepts it will only be because he thinks of the huge financial gains and prestige he thinks and believes it will add to his standing as a player.

He is willing to sacrifice a potentially successful international football life with Mali for the pride of being called a one time Spanish international with maybe five caps and no impact at that level. It will then add financial premiums to his saallary standings clubwise... And then what? He misses out on a dream.

Mehn... This is akin to Esau selling his birthright for a pot of sweet satisfying soup.

Character is definitely at the core here.



And you are doing what you said you don't want to do... You are arguing.

You are asking as if you are new to this scenario. Like I said, even beyond football, I have seen this play out.

There is no other reason behind it so please don't act naive. He stands a better chance of achieving his international football dream with Mali than with Spain. Fact.

If he does that, he is likely to earn the love and respect of a whole nation. He will become a living idol to Malians if all goes well and he stands a greater chance of doing that with Mali than with Spain.

Dumping these will be because of the fame and more monetary endorsements the Spanish national team badge brings. That ia the truth.

Joebie:
How can you be too sure of the bolded? There are many possible reasons why he could choose Spain over Mali.
There is no guarantee he will have a good international career with Mali either.

And what if he chooses Mali over Spain because he feels he would have a better international career? will that then still be due to his love for the Malian flag?

So it all boils down to what you can achieve (recognition etc) from what you are suggesting, and that's the point. So the analogy with my explanation of it, is very appropriate. So lets slow down with this patriotic talk.

We never question the true motives of the players who turn out for us, some of which were persuaded that they would have better international careers playing for Nigeria. Then why the double standard questioning the patriotism of those choosing another country? At the end of the day it boils down to choices, and we can't read their minds unless they express their reasons why they made that choice.

TheSuperNerd:
You are asking as if you are new to this scenario. Like I said, even beyond football, I have seen this play out.

There is no other reason behind it so please don't act naive. He stands a better chance of achieving his international football dream with Mali than with Spain. Fact.

If he does that, he is likely to earn the love and respect of a whole nation. He will become a living idol to Malians if all goes well and he stands a greater chance of doing that with Mali than with Spain.

Dumping these will be because of the fame and more monetary endorsements the Spanish national team badge brings. That ia the truth.

I see it more as you trying to establish a "there is nothing wrong" in turning down your country of blood origins whom you pledged allegiance to because a more prestigious nation like Spain or England or Germany comes calling.

Would Adama get this call if the Malian FA had not unveiled the "conclusions" to ther luring Adama? Is Spain's call up for Adama not filled with some kill joy tactics just aimed at not wanting to lose out to a small African nation in Mali?

Adama honoring this call will be a big slap on his country of origins having already committed to them. You want the man to be selfish in this case thinking only about the prestige and bigger "temporary" fame he stands to gain... But man... The fathers I grew up with and true character principles demand you also take into consideration how your decision represents you as a person.



You wanna make it sound like they are thinking about their careers. But truthfully, they aren't... They are thinking of the fame and financial gains and other worldly benefits that come with dorning an european nation's jersey even if just for a moment in an official game.

If they think about their careers, they won't subscribe to settling for less than a dream of having a fulfilling International football career where you are truly an active player and not a mere spectator or one of the fringe players called up once in a while.

Joebie:
And by the way, I'm in a discussion mode.. I don't take everything as an argument. There are no points to score.

You cannot throw away the patriotic talk. because it is at the very Heart of it. You cannot reduce this issue to a mere business transaction discussion because it goes way beyond that. Period.

And we do know the motives for why a player turns down an African nation he had as "backup" when his Adopted euro nation comes calling to prevent him from turning out for the African nation. For those of us who don't act naive anyway, we do know.


You cannot dribble out of the fact that allegiance to a nation is a big deal and not a mere business decision. It is a question of connecting with the people of that flag and a vow to fight for the Flag anyday. It is like an initiation... It is funny you don't get that. You only see "business".

Please I am done discussing this. This is my last major take on this. Your stance is clear... You just want to justify the shady decisions of these guys including Tammy. It is okay. Run with your stand... But the world, in general, knows it goes beyond "business" when it comes to commitment to a flag

Joebie:
So it all boils down to what you can achieve (recognition etc) from what you are suggesting, and that's the point. So the analogy with my explanation of it, is very appropriate. So lets slow down with this patriotic talk.

We never question the true motives of the players who turn out for us, some of which were persuaded that they would have better international careers playing for Nigeria. Then why the double standard questioning the patriotism of those choosing another country? At the end of the day it boils down to choices, and we can't read their minds unless they express their reasons why they made that choice.

In a discussion you are looking to learn something. While in an argument you are trying to win. I'm having this discussion with an open mind, looking at it from both sides. Although I can't reply to your ever line. But I have a few questions for you in this. why is it never a slap to Spain's face (or England's face as it pertains to us) if Adama turns down their invitation? Are you saying Adama does not really deserve Spain's call? If Spain had called up Adama first, would you have said Mali is employing kill joy tactics by trying to get the player also? Just a few question for you to check yourself if you are really balanced in this.

TheSuperNerd:
I see it more as you trying to establish a "there is nothing wrong" in turning down your country of blood origins whom you pledged allegiance to because a more prestigious nation like Spain or England or Germany comes calling.

Would Adama get this call if the Malian FA had not unveiled the "conclusions" to ther luring Adama? Is Spain's call up for Adama not filled with some kill joy tactics just aimed at not wanting to lose out to a small African nation in Mali?

Adama honoring this call will be a big slap on his country of origins having already committed to them. You want the man to be selfish in this case thinking only about the prestige and bigger "temporary" fame he stands to gain... But man... The fathers I grew up with and true character principles demand you also take into consideration how your decision represents you as a person.



You wanna make it sound like they are thinking about their careers. But truthfully, they aren't... They are thinking of the fame and financial gains and other worldly benefits that come with dorning an european nation's jersey even if just for a moment in an official game.

If they think about their careers, they won't subscribe to settling for less than a dream of having a fulfilling International football career where you are truly an active player and not a mere spectator or one of the fringe players called up once in a while.

You didn't address my second paragraph. That actually cancels out the patriotic talk.

TheSuperNerd:
You cannot throw away the patriotic talk. because it is at the very Heart of it. You cannot reduce this issue to a mere business transaction discussion because it goes way beyond that. Period.

And we do know the motives for why a player turns down an African nation he had as "backup" when his Adopted euro nation comes calling to prevent him from turning out for the African nation. For those of us who don't act naive anyway, we do know.


You cannot dribble out of the fact that allegiance to a nation is a big deal and not a mere business decision. It is a question of connecting with the people of that flag and a vow to fight for the Flag anyday. It is like an initiation... It is funny you don't get that. You only see "business".

Please I am done discussing this. This is my last major take on this. Your stance is clear... You just want to justify the shady decisions of these guys including Tammy. It is okay. Run with your stand... But the world, in general, knows it goes beyond "business" when it comes to commitment to a flag

Madam u dey watch Ball no mean Say u Sabi the business aspect of it. United is a very rich club and a renowned brand in world football.

Have you asked yourself why maguire dished Leicester for mediocre man untd? Also Maddison and chillwill may follow suit next summer.

History no help you because u re ignorant of it cus if you ain't u will pray and hope ndidi dump Leicester for a massive clubs as united and arsenal.

Like i pointed out earlier big clubs do face challenges which may last decades before it is rectified. The likes of Liverpool, almighty real madrid, barca, Juventus, ajax just to mention a few had dark periods but bounced back to what they were known of in European football.

Tommorow you will argue with me that spurs is a bigger club than arsenal and Chelsea because of their good run in the league and Europe in the last 2-3 seasons or Atalanta is bigger than inter and AC milan

safarigirl:
who history epp? Ndidi doesn't have time like that, how are we sure it will not take United and Arsenal another thirty years to find their lost glory, like Liverpool?

Let's hear from the horse' mouth

Wolves' Adama Traore called up for Spain qualifiers
Last Updated: 10/11/19 12:09am



Wolves winger Adama Traore has received his first call up to the Spain national team.

Traore, who came up through the Barcelona youth ranks, replaces the injured Valencia forward Rodrigo in Roberto Moreno's squad for their Euro 2020 Qualifiers against Malta and Romania.

The 23-year-old has represented Spain, the county where he was born, at various youth levels but is also eligible to play for Mali.

Reports had emerged this week Traore had elected to play his international football for Mali, but he insists that is not entirely accurate.

"The truth is I've spoke with Mali, but I didn't sign anything," Traore told the Express and Star.

"I've been in contact with them and they've shown interest. There has been a bit of confusion. I haven't decided yet."


Traore left Barcelona in 2015 to join Aston Villa, who he will come up against playing for Wolves on Sunday, live on Sky Sports.

After a season at Villa, Traore moved on to Middlesbrough before being signed by Wolves in 2018.

--SkySports

wahala dey hahahahahaha

This Europeans no dey shame? Imagine Spain inviting a player from lowly wolves just to stop him from being capped by Mali? This one na desperation oooo lolz

I think fifa have to readdress this this nationality issue because it makes no sense tying down a player who won't be an integral part of your team just to wade off interest from his other affiliated nations.

Joebie:
Let's hear from the horse' mouth

Wolves' Adama Traore called up for Spain qualifiers
Last Updated: 10/11/19 12:09am



Wolves winger Adama Traore has received his first call up to the Spain national team.

Traore, who came up through the Barcelona youth ranks, replaces the injured Valencia forward Rodrigo in Roberto Moreno's squad for their Euro 2020 Qualifiers against Malta and Romania.

The 23-year-old has represented Spain, the county where he was born, at various youth levels but is also eligible to play for Mali.

Reports had emerged this week Traore had elected to play his international football for Mali, but he insists that is not entirely accurate.

"The truth is I've spoke with Mali, but I didn't sign anything," Traore told the Express and Star.

"I've been in contact with them and they've shown interest. There has been a bit of confusion. I haven't decided yet."


Traore left Barcelona in 2015 to join Aston Villa, who he will come up against playing for Wolves on Sunday, live on Sky Sports.

After a season at Villa, Traore moved on to Middlesbrough before being signed by Wolves in 2018.

--SkySports

Adama's stats have been pretty decent. He scored a brace against Man City away amongst other exploits in Champions League qualifiers. Although I don't know who he comes against in the Spainish national team, but he's grown the ranks of the Spanish junior national team. Let's stop to assume Spain just dey dey try prevent Mali from getting him, why e be say Nigeria dey shame if all these European countries no dey shame?

charlesemeka85:
This Europeans no dey shame? Imagine Spain inviting a player from lowly wolves just to stop him from being capped by Mali? This one na desperation oooo lolz

I think fifa have to readdress this this nationality issue because it makes no sense tying down a player who won't be an integral part of your team just to wade off interest from his other affiliated nations.

Addressing your second paragraph, shouldn't the player choose the flag he loves regardless of what happens eventually?

charlesemeka85:
This Europeans no dey shame? Imagine Spain inviting a player from lowly wolves just to stop him from being capped by Mali? This one na desperation oooo lolz

I think fifa have to readdress this this nationality issue because it makes no sense tying down a player who won't be an integral part of your team just to wade off interest from his other affiliated nations.

And where have Spain been all this while but only gave him a call up to just because he has opened talks with Mali?

He was called up to replace Rodrigo who is currently injured but those that mean the Spanish national team selectors can't fish out another Spanish young talent from the almighty laliga to replace Rodrigo instead of stooping so low to invite a player from wolves?


In your own valuation do you think traore is good enough to have a long career with the Spanish national team? Why is the call this sudden? Because he scored a brace against man City made it good enough for Spain?

Go relax abeg

Joebie:
Adama's stats have been pretty decent. He scored a brace against Man City away amongst other exploits in Champions League qualifiers. Although I don't know who he comes against in the Spainish national team, but he's grown the ranks of the Spanish junior national team. Let's stop to assume Spain just dey dey try prevent Mali from getting him, why e be say Nigeria dey shame if all these European countries no dey shame?

I had already said I don't know who he comes against and entertained the possibility that Spain is actually trying to wade Mali off.
But what is the ruse? Is the player not mature enough to consider the implications of his decision?

A brace against Man City in their backyard no be mean fit oh.

abeg no vex

charlesemeka85:
And where have Spain been all this while but only gave him a call up to just because he has opened talks with Mali?

He was called up to replace Rodrigo who is currently injured but those that mean the Spanish national team selectors can't fish out another Spanish young talent from the almighty laliga to replace Rodrigo instead of stooping so low to invite a player from wolves?


In your own valuation do you think traore is good enough to have a long career with the Spanish national team? Why is the call this sudden? Because he scored a brace against man City made it good enough for Spain?

Go relax abeg

I have nothing against the players choice but why is it now that Spain wants him?

Is the almighty spanish national team that bad that they have to invite a player who is just finding his feet at lowly wolves in the epl?

Is there no better Spanish youngsters in laliga who would have been called up to replace the injured Rodrigo?

Do you see traore's style of play suitable to the Spanish national team?

Joebie:
Addressing your second paragraph, shouldn't the player choose the flag he loves regardless of what happens eventually?

Oga this is just a plot to stop the guy from turning out for Mali, it's obvious.

He scored against man City and then what? You and I watch football and know the strenght and playing style of the best national teams in the world so do you think or see traore having a long career with the Spaniards?

Lets just be factual here instead of been logical. Do you think traore would have been called up to the Spanish national team if Mali re yet to approach him?

Joebie:
I had already said I don't know who he comes against and entertained the possibility that Spain is actually trying to wade Mali off.
But what is the ruse? Is the player not mature enough to consider the implications of his decision?

A brace against Man City in their backyard no be mean fit oh.

abeg no vex

Personally, this is how I see it. Let me use investments as an analogy, if you see a promising stock would you not consider investing in it?
If you feel there is something special about a player and you are in danger of losing the player and you MAY regret it in future won't you go for him? The problem is when we think these countries should give us a handout and make things easy for us. It's never been so. It's always competition even from pre-colonial years.

Africa need to wake up and really compete in every regard and stop talking about PRIDE.

charlesemeka85:
I have nothing against the players choice but why is it now that Spain wants him?

Is the almighty spanish national team that bad that they have to invite a player who is just finding his feet at lowly wolves in the epl?

Is there no better Spanish youngsters in laliga who would have been called up to replace the injured Rodrigo?

Do you see traore's style of play suitable to the Spanish national team?

To your question, probably not. And I have already addressed this in my other response.

charlesemeka85:
Oga this is just a plot to stop the guy from turning out for Mali, it's obvious.

He scored against man City and then what? You and I watch football and know the strenght and playing style of the best national teams in the world so do you think or see traore having a long career with the Spaniards?

Lets just be factual here instead of been logical. Do you think traore would have been called up to the Spanish national team if Mali re yet to approach him?

There is absolutely nothing shameful about a player turning a country down. It's on us to make playing for us attractive. That should be our goal, and things will change with time. You win some, you lose some. But make the move at the right time and win when you can.

Joebie:
Personally, this is how I see it. Let me use investments as an analogy, if you see a promising stock would you not consider investing in it?
If you feel there is something special about a player and you are in danger of losing the player and you MAY regret it in future won't you go for him? The problem is when we think these countries should give us a handout and make things easy for us. It's never been so. It's always competition even from pre-colonial years.

Africa need to wake up and really compete in every regard and stop talking about PRIDE

.

I agree to the bolded but it's only folks here who talk about pride always. The aim of this Europeans is to stock pile talented kids of immigrants for the purpose of leaning on them if their pan out to be world class in the near future.

I hv stated in previously in this forum for the need to incorporate this kids to our various national teams when they are yet to hit stardom but I was called all sort of names for suggesting such.

Germany few months ago invited an unproven Felix agu to their u21 team just because he had a positive discussion with Rohr to represent Nigeria and was penciled down for the Ukraine friendly.

The same with the case of ebere eze, danjuma and now adama traore. Fifa really needs to look into this matter seriously and that won't happen unless CAF makes the move.

Imagine ex barca youngster munir left in limbo just because Spain rushed and capped him which denied him the chance to represent Morocco at the last world cup and have since then overlooked for call up to the Spanish national team.

Look at the case of dele alli now who have been abandoned because of the emergence of Maddison and Mount.

Also I blame the advisers and parents of this kids who fell advise this kids well to weigh their options very well before rushing to decide.

Rabiu Ibrahim assist.. I'm late to this


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjrNjW0K-XE