nku5:


Adaka Boro gathered some guys, raided a police station and looted weapons, blew a few pipelines and kidnapped some people within a small area the size of Lekki. Not even up to the level of militancy that Ateke Tom and co were doing few years ago. How can anybody who knows what he's talking about compare it to declaration of Biafra.

Excuses for same crime committed by two different groups, big or small, they are both guilty

0monnak0da:

Do not rope me in with "others"

Please show where I said he has no source?

I want to believe that you actually have some form of schooling.


If you make a claim it is your responsibility to prove it

You said he had no source, oya prove he has no source

0monnak0da:
Lies left unanswered become truth

SOURCE??

Aburi accord was never signed by anyone.

Anyone with evidence to the the contrary should provide it

If Gowon signed it there must be a copy

brightokechukwu:

Apples and oranges to compare Adaka Boro to Ojukwu, for one Boro led an Niger Delta insurrection for his Ijaw people in then Eastern region, and the government of Ironsi crushed it without going on an ethnic cleaning spree of the Ijaw people, Boro and his men were simply rounded up, tried and jailed in accordance with the law.

Ojukwu on the other hand had a mandate to secede by a consultative assembly of Eastern leaders (not only Igbos), on the basis of the pogroms unleashed on Igbos and other Eastern Nigerians all over Nigeria, and of course as a result of Gowon's refusal to implement the Aburi accord... remember it was the same Ojukwu who in the spirit of one Nigeria initially encouraged his people to return to North during the first wave of killings, after assurances of safety and peace to the East from Gowon... it was when the second wave of killings started in September on a more devastating and unprecedented scale that he knew he had to act fast for the interest of his region.

He had no mandate to get a mandate.
He was never elected and was APPOINTED by Nigeria. as a MILITARY Governor

So he had no mandate to secure any mandate

0monnak0da:

He had no mandate to get a mandate.
He was never elected and was APPOINTED by Nigeria. as a MILITARY Governor

So he had no mandate to secure any mandate

Wow total crap but Gowon had mandate to abolish the regions and create states. Who appointed Gowon?

nku5:

Like I said I want to believe you have some form of schooling and are actually literate with a capacity to read and comprehend simple English
I asked for a source I did not say there is or there isn't a source?
Once again


Source?..

0monnak0da:

He had no mandate to get a mandate.
He was never elected and was APPOINTED by Nigeria. as a MILITARY Governor

So he had no mandate to secure any mandate

Huh? He was military governor of the Eastern region and in that capacity had EVERY moral and legal authority to decide the fate of his people in however way he saw fit. You can't blame Ojukwu for been the only military leader with the balls to stand up to the North by not recognizing Gowons position, sucks that the Western region cowered in fright rather than stand up for Brigadier Ogundipe (the rightful successor based on rank to Ironsi)... Ojukwu got the mandate to secede from his people, and that's all that mattered at the end... whether or not he had the jurisdiction of power to do that... is just your opinion not fact.

nku5:


Wow total crap but Gowon had mandate to abolish the regions and create states. Who appointed Gowon?

The guy is not the sharpest tool in the shed, just had to give his intellectual limitations some benefit of doubt.

0monnak0da:
Lies left unanswered become truth

SOURCE??

Aburi accord was never signed by anyone.

Anyone with evidence to the the contrary should provide it

If Gowon signed it there must be a copy

How do you think that an agreement like that was agreed and written down, but not signed? You think Ojukwu and Gowon went all the way to Ghana for a mere peace of paper? You think that the President of Ghana, General Ankrah soent his time hosting Ojukwu and Gowon just to reach an unsigned agreement?

Two people who were on Ojukwus entourage, Philip Effiong(Biafra: My story), NU Akpan(struggle for secession) said in their books that not only did Gowon sign the document, all the for military Governors of the time signed after him.

Gowon broke the agreement and caused the war

nku5:


Wow total crap but Gowon had mandate to abolish the regions and create states. Who appointed Gowon?

Yes he was in power.and enacted decrees which he went on to enforce .
He was recognised by the United Nations

Eventually Phillip Effiong saw things his way

Answer the question directly. Why do you hate Igbos and want them in the same country with you?

Area4Area:
Adaka Boro declared his Niger Delta republic and was he attacked and by who?
If he was attacked what makes you think that the declaration of Biafra by Ojukwu won't be attacked?

gidgiddy:


How do you think that an agreement like that was agreed and written down, but not signed? You think Ojukwu and Gowon went all the way to Ghana for a mere peace of paper? You think that the President of Ghana, General Ankrah soent his time hosting Ojukwu and Gowon just to reach an unsigned agreement?

Two people who were on Ojukwus entourage, Philip Effiong(Biafra: My story), NU Akpan(struggle for secession) said in their books that not only did Gowon sign the document, all the for military Governors of the time signed after him.

Gowon broke the agreement and caused the war

If I gave you my opinion it would be speculation.
If indeed there was such an agreement signed the real question was why did Biafra not publish it to this day signatories and all?
That would have been a real propaganda coup for Biafra at the time and copies would have been preserved to this day
Also there would have been or ought to have been neutral witnesses from Ghana and elsewhere.

brightokechukwu:

Huh? He was military governor of the Eastern region and in that capacity had EVERY moral and legal authority to decide the fate of his people in however way he saw fit. You can't blame Ojukwu for been the only military leader with the balls to stand up to the North by not recognizing Gowons position, sucks that the Western region cowered in fright rather than stand up for Brigadier Ogundipe (the rightful successor based on rank to Ironsi)... Ojukwu got the mandate to secede from his people, and that's all that mattered at the end... whether or not he had the jurisdiction of power to do that... is just your opinion not fact.

You call it balls
I call it idiocy

Pursuing the predictable course that played out with defeat,loss of millions of live and an overall diminished status in Nigeria might seem like " balls" to you
It looks to me like idiocy

gidgiddy:


How do you think that an agreement like that was agreed and written down, but not signed? You think Ojukwu and Gowon went all the way to Ghana for a mere peace of paper? You think that the President of Ghana, General Ankrah soent his time hosting Ojukwu and Gowon just to reach an unsigned agreement?

Two people who were on Ojukwus entourage, Philip Effiong(Biafra: My story), NU Akpan(struggle for secession) said in their books that not only did Gowon sign the document, all the for military Governors of the time signed after him.

Gowon broke the agreement and caused the war

If an agreement was signed are we to believe Ojukwu had no copies?

Where are they?
Are we to believe there were no observer signatories?

But do you know there is a right to self determination? And this includes your ancestral land? A group of people have the right to determine where they want to belong. If you look at Europe, the are countries of less than a million that determined their position recently like Croatia, Serbia, Montenegro. Remember East Timor? Eritrea, South Sudan?
If you keep people who do not want to be in your team forcefully, that team can never make progress because there will not be unity of purpose! Its shortsightedness to insist on Nigeria remaining one. It's like flogging a dead horse

0monnak0da:

Igbos declared secession by what authority?
Including the territory of Ijaw ,Efik Ikwerre etc?
Very clever
Did not attack anyone? Really

What about attack on Benin, Ore, Lagos?

Was that an NYSC community development?


Here is the reality your ancestral land was conquered and annexed into Nigeria by force by the British.

They handed that to the Nigerian state.

That is the REALITY

You did not one day declare yourself a part of Nigeria. YOU WERE CONQUERED INTO IT.


So you will not be freed by DECLARATION .

You are ALL free to exit the country but the Land was conquered and annexed a long time ago
You can pack and go back to Israel

REALITY

Indigenous people who originally owned Canada,USA, Australia cannot wake up one day and DECLARE themselves to be in charge


That is childish

Their land has been conquered



So no one wants to keep Igbos in Nigeria. They are free to leave.

The land is NOW Nigeria

0monnak0da:
The killing of Northern and Western leaders by Ibo officers and the taunting behaviour of the Ibos including making records and even images of the killed leaders on loaves of bread caused the pogrom in the North.
The stubborn defiance of Ojukwu even though he had no weapons or friends led to the war.

Let me ask you this. When Northerners slaughtered Igbos in Jos in 1945 and again in 1945, should Igbos have conducted their own pogrom against Northerners in the East? Igbos did kill a y political leader nor taunt anyone in 1945 and 1953, but that didnt stop Northerners killing them for no reason

So do you think Igbos should have killed Northerners in 1945 and 1953?

gidgiddy:


Let me ask you this. When Northerners slaughtered Igbos in Jos in 1945 and again in 1945, should Igbos have conducted their own pogrom against Northerners in the East? Igbos did kill a y political leader nor taunt anyone in 1945 and 1953, but that didnt stop Northerners killing them for no reason

So do you think Igbos should have killed Northerners in 1945 and 1953?

Not relevant to this subject
The only thing of interest here is the veracity and verifiability of the claim that what is posted is true

I listened to IBB and Gowon recently, and they said that it will not be fair to people who have died to keep Nigeria one in the civil war if Nigeria breaks up and as such we should keep Nigeria one. Can you see how foolish these leader are. So the dead should control the destiny of the living? Because we want to please the dead, we should suffer the living perpetually?
Britain conquered Nigeria? Is Britain here now? Why should we continue to maintain the chain Britain put us in? Do you know almost all colonies in africa changed their colonial names except Nigeria?

0monnak0da:

Igbos declared secession by what authority?
Including the territory of Ijaw ,Efik Ikwerre etc?
Very clever
Did not attack anyone? Really

What about attack on Benin, Ore, Lagos?

Was that an NYSC community development?


Here is the reality your ancestral land was conquered and annexed into Nigeria by force by the British.

They handed that to the Nigerian state.

That is the REALITY

You did not one day declare yourself a part of Nigeria. YOU WERE CONQUERED INTO IT.


So you will not be freed by DECLARATION .

You are ALL free to exit the country but the Land was conquered and annexed a long time ago
You can pack and go back to Israel

REALITY

Indigenous people who originally owned Canada,USA, Australia cannot wake up one day and DECLARE themselves to be in charge


That is childish

Their land has been conquered



So no one wants to keep Igbos in Nigeria. They are free to leave.

The land is NOW Nigeria

0monnak0da:


You call it balls
I call it idiocy

Pursuing the predictable course that played out with defeat,loss of millions of live and an overall diminished status in Nigeria might seem like " balls" to you
It looks to me like idiocy

It's so to you cause you are a coward with no principles(you kissed the aSS of the Northerners and today they are the same people spiting you while politically relegating you to mere second fiddlers in the power equation)... , yes maybe the outcome of the war would have been averted in the hindsight of better planning, but given the circumstances of the time - heated polity, massacre of civilians, no assurance of safety for the lives of beleaguered Easterners all over Nigeria... you can't jettison sheer principle of will to survive at all cost on the altar of some unsavory and forced unity with people who had little to no regard for you.

And which people are really diminished in the Nigerian status quo? Lmaoo surely not the Igbos who lead in all the indices of economic/commercial wealth and sustainability in Nigeria, with an arguably better quality of life than their counterparts despite not even fairly invested in the politics of Nigeria... if you ask me, that doesn't seem or look like a particularly diminished status when putting everything in perspective...ironically the region(s) that claim to enjoy the better privileges of power, have arguably some of the poorest people in the whole continent, PERSPECTIVE brother, PERSPECTIVE.

DMerciful:
I listened to IBB and Gowon recently, and they said that it will not be fair to people who have died to keep Nigeria one in the civil war if Nigeria breaks up and as such we should keep Nigeria one. Can you see how foolish these leader are. So the dead should control the destiny of the living? Because we want to please the dead, we should suffer the living perpetually?
Britain conquered Nigeria? Is Britain here now? Why should we continue to maintain the chain Britain put us in? Do you know almost all colonies in africa changed their colonial names except Nigeria?

All of that is sentimental talk
No one should go to bed hungry but millions do
The problem with many Igbos is refusal to deal with reality.
Reality is Igboland was conquered by the British and handed over to the Nigerian state.
No amount of righteous indignation will change that reality.

If the Igbo want to achieve Biafra then they need to figure out an approach that will work.

Will this current approach work?

This logic of

Our cause is just and therefore it will happen is quite childish

My opinion is that to succeed the Igbos need fewer antagonists and more friendships within and outside Nigeria.
Strangely Igbos believe enmity with Yoruba and Hausa is the right strategy. Good luck with that


Let us imagine that Biafra does happen what is the vision of what the Nigerian space would look like?
Any vision of friendship or partnership?

Another problem Igbos have is emotionalism

Germany caused so much mayhem in WWII
Today they are at the centre of the EU
The Igbos on the other hand continue to spout rhetoric of their perceived superiority and to project their bitterness from the loss in 1970.

Get over yourselves that desire for revenge which seems to to motivate many of you will not happen

0monnak0da:

Yes he was in power.and enacted decrees which he went on to enforce .
He was recognised by the United Nations

Eventually Phillip Effiong saw things his way

Ojukwu was in power in the Eastern Region and had the backing of the Eastern Regional legislature and council of chiefs to form an independent state. Gowon and co that executed a bloody coup and abolished the regions were even less legitimate but had more guns.

Which Effiong? Quit this clowning

[quote author=nku5 post=86079274]

Ojukwu was in power in the Eastern Region and had the backing of the Eastern Regional legislature and council of chiefs to form an independent state. Gowon and co that executed a bloody coup and abolished the regions were even less legitimate but had more guns.

Which Effiong?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bviS5aqi3fk

Ojukwu thought he was in power but Obasanjo showed otherwise

When you say British conquered Nigeria, you made it seems they are still enforcing their conquest, are they? If Igbos have enmity with Yorubas and Hausas(already conquered by Fulanis) as you claim, that should actually speed the breakup of Eastern Nigeria from Nigeria.
Remember how Singapore was driven from Indonesia? If there is enmity between persons, breakup should be easier actually. Its difficult for friends to break up!
Having said that, something must give so the longer you insist on suppressing Biafra, the longer Nigeria remains in the woods because no unity of purpose. You are only hurting yourself in the process. Igbos are very resilient people so Nigeria go tire!

0monnak0da:

All of that is sentimental talk
No one should go to bed hungry but millions do
The problem with many Igbos is refusal to deal with reality.
Reality is Igboland was conquered by the British and handed over to the Nigerian state.
No amount of righteous indignation will change that reality.

If the Igbo want to achieve Biafra then they need to figure out an approach that will work.

Will this current approach work?

This logic of

Our cause is just and therefore it will happen is quite childish

My opinion is that to succeed the Igbos need fewer antagonists and more friendships within and outside Nigeria.
Strangely Igbos believe enmity with Yoruba and Hausa is the right strategy. Good luck with that

0monnak0da:

Like I said I want to believe you have some form of schooling and are actually literate with a capacity to read and comprehend simple English
I asked for a source I did not say there is or there isn't a source?
Once again


Source?..

This is you backtracking smh

brightokechukwu:

The guy is not the sharpest tool in the shed, just had to give his intellectual limitations some benefit of doubt.

He wants to replace facts with bad belle and personal opinion

0monnak0da:

If I gave you my opinion it would be speculation.
If indeed there was such an agreement signed the real question was why did Biafra not publish it to this day signatories and all?
That would have been a real propaganda coup for Biafra at the time and copies would have been preserved to this day
Also there would have been or ought to have been neutral witnesses from Ghana and elsewhere.

If you think like that, then why do you think Gowon didnt publish the 'unsigned copy' of the Aburi agreement to show the world he signed nothing?

Who in their right minds would travel to another country for an agreement that wont be signed?

It is not done. The President of Ghana would never waste his time to host a meeting which the outcome would not be signed. Rather than do that, he would arrange for Gowon and Ojukwu to talk on the phone

0monnak0da:
The killing of Northern and Western leaders by Ibo officers and the taunting behaviour of the Ibos including making records and even images of the killed leaders on loaves of bread caused the pogrom in the North.
The stubborn defiance of Ojukwu even though he had no weapons or friends led to the war.

Everything here has been discredited and torn to shreds over and over and you think repeating the same nonsense beer parlour gist will make it true?

0monnak0da:

Not relevant to this subject
The only thing of interest here is the veracity and verifiability of the claim that what is posted is true

You were saying that Northerners commited pogrom because Igbos killed their political leaders and taunted them.

But when the Notherners were killing Igbo before then, Igbos did not commit pogrom. Do you know why? Because Igbos knew that it is wrong to visit pogrom on the Northerners living in the East for what some other Northerners did elsewhere

It a classic example of why we are different people who should not be together since we do not reason alike

DMerciful:
When you say British conquered Nigeria, you made it seems they are still enforcing their conquest, are they? If Igbos have enmity with Yorubas and Hausas(already conquered by Fulanis) as you claim, that should actually speed the breakup of Eastern Nigeria from Nigeria.
Remember how Singapore was driven from Indonesia? If there is enmity between persons, breakup should be easier actually. Its difficult for friends to break up!
Having said that, something must give so the longer you insist on suppressing Biafra, the longer Nigeria remains in the woods because no unity of purpose. You are only hurting yourself in the process. Igbos are very resilient people so Nigeria go tire!

If you focus less on being a victim you will see reality as it is and then make plans to achieve objectives

Nigeria is the de jure successor of colonial Britain
That is the reality and international legal position

Indeed it was those colonial era agreements that determined the fate of Bakassi

The Igbos like to think they are senior partners in Nigeria they should start acting like it
Stop playing victim, swallow their pride and think of a practical realistic strategy

At the moment lining up behind Nnamdi Kanu smacks of profound confusion.

Develop a plan and strategy. Noise is not music

gidgiddy:



It a classic example of why we are different people who should not be together since we do not reason alike

There are classic examples of so many bad things on this Earth e.g cancer
Naming them doesn't solve the problem.
What is the solution?
Another war?
Talking till kingdom come about bad things does not fix them

gidgiddy:


If you think like that, then why do you think Gowon didnt publish the 'unsigned copy' of the Aburi agreement to show the world he signed nothing?

Who in their right minds would travel to another country for an agreement that wont be signed?

It is not done. The President of Ghana would never waste his time to host a meeting which the outcome would not be signed. Rather than do that, he would arrange for Gowon and Ojukwu to talk on the phone

So where is the signed document?.

You would say they should go through the NASS but in truth you know it's dead on arrival. Even if Igbos were friendly with Yorubas and Hausas, it's still dead on arrival in NASS because people esp Northerners see their existence as tied to South
and the Sea. Igbos breaking out will make others go and this is the issue, it has nothing to do with insults or respect. Same reason the North is kicking against Amotekun and Igbos are supporting it. The North fears that if Amotekun succeeds as it is proposed without amendments, then others in SS, SE, NC will do theirs and they begin to loose their stronghold on Nigeria. As a learned person, you know this but somehow wants to blame Igbos for trivialities as been responsible for anything. You have far more Northerners in Yoruba land than Yorubas in the North. You have more Easterners in Yoruba land than Yorubas in the East. What those this tell you? Yorubas prefer to stay on their own but afraid of uncertainty if they break out of Nigeria!
But just like Soviet, the internal issues became too much and everybody exhaustedly left the USSR without any resistance! It's just a matter of time, by the time our population reaches 300 million people with this meager revenue, it will be extremely difficult to hold Nigeria together!

0monnak0da:

If you focus less on being a victim you will see reality as it is and then make plans to achieve objectives

Nigeria is the de jure successor of colonial Britain
That is the reality and international legal position

Indeed it was those colonial era agreements that determined the fate of Bakassi

The Igbos like to think they are senior partners in Nigeria they should start acting like it
Stop playing victim, swallow their pride and think of a practical realistic strategy

At the moment lining up behind Nnamdi Kanu smacks of profound confusion.

Develop a plan and strategy. Noise is not music

gidgiddy:



It a classic example of why we are different people who should not be together since we do not reason alike

Let me illustrate a simple fact for you

Igbos CLAIM they want Biafra which I doubt

The question is do they want it through war or other means

If they want war that is their choice


Otherwise the way I see it they are more likely to get that with a restructured Nigeria and then to gradually strengthen their position
This will require patience and discipline which Igbos do not have in the field of politics.

This lack of patience and discipline has manifested in the clear declarations of enmity against the Yoruba people. Also the behaviour when Jonathan was in power.
That was a highly indisciplined performance in which they showed their hands too early
That toothpaste can no longer be put in the tube

Objectively how does the position that we would rather a Fulani than Yoruba president help Biafra or Igbo interest?

You folk behave like children when it comes to politics
It would be tragic for you when a Yoruba wins the presidency with your 5 % votes