thorrvik55:
Even dat one dey used to Swissh on/off, it is a Chelsea ex-player dat would never affiliate himself with anything Arsenal he'll want to use to drag a Chelsea great..

Shey Arsenal self no get midfielders??

I don't have your time so I will just drop this.

Swissh:

If we look at peak form fabregas has the best attacking stats of any midfielder in the league. 15goals and 13assist in 27 league games in 2010. Bring your albino stats

Ibeme:


I've always said you don't know how to watch football.

I don't argue with results and the result speaks for itself which is that City collected 28 points from the 10 games Lampard started.

By the time Pellegrini drafted him into the team in September, they were already far behind Chelsea yet Lampard kept them in the hunt. They expected his loan to finish that December so they had to prioritise their main players not short term loan and that is where they started dropping points.

At the bolded, when did you ever know Lampard to hold onto ball instead of passing quickly. I have told you, you don't know how to watch football, which is why you gravitate toward those who dance makossa on the ball unnecessarily. That same foolishness is what made you think Hazard is one of footballs greats to the point you lot were not far from comparing him with Messi and Ronaldo, when I have already told you 6 years ago that even KDB is better.

I have told you time without number that an AM job is to act quickly to exploit gaps not to control possession. Anywhere you like to check in this world, possession is controlled by the DM and CM. So definitely, there must be computer error in your brain if you are watching City expecting Lampard to hold ball instead of Fernandinho and Toure behind him. He did exactly what he came there to do which is make the difference at the right end of the pitch.

Are you the only one who does not know that Lampard began to play as a CM in the later years of his career?
He played CM for Chelsea for years until he left. Partnering either Ramires or Mikel.

https://www.transfermarkt.com/frank-lampard/leistungsdatendetails/spieler/3163/plus/1?saison=&verein=281&liga=&wettbewerb=GB1&pos=&trainer_id=


Lampard scored 4 goals as a sub and 2 while starting. Now tell us, if going by your narrative, was Lampard more important as a sub or as a starter?

If Lampard was that good at that age to guarantee league win, why did he not win it for Chelsea that season that we were topping the league until Liverpool, and then Manchester City came to overtake us to win the league?


Like I said earlier, any manager starting Lampard in his team at that time, and hoping to win league with him is not only sick, but delusional.

thorrvik55:

He plays deeper for City than for Belgium, leave formation.

He plays as an AM most times but likes to drop deeper to dictate the tempo of the game

where will kdb play AM in Belgium when they play two AMs in Hazard and Mertens?

Go and check again. He plays CM for both teams with much freedom. He used to play as RAM or Cam for Belgium until he started to play CM for Manchester City, then Martinez came to Belgium and gave him the same role and started the 3-4-3/3-4-2-1.

thorrvik55:


No one here is saying Ramos is not good..

The crux of the matter is some here like raumdueter believe Ramos should be named among the greatest centrebacks because of the Champions league goals he scored (not even for his defensive contributions)...

I'm not sure anyone said he should be named among the greatest. People actually said he was a useless defender which is trash. Big trash. Ramos is very good. Lets leave analysis for another day.

Greatihex:

Are you the only one who does not know that Lampard began to play as a CM in the later years of his career?
He played CM for Chelsea for years until he left. Partnering either Ramires or Mikel.

https://www.transfermarkt.com/frank-lampard/leistungsdatendetails/spieler/3163/plus/1?saison=&verein=281&liga=&wettbewerb=GB1&pos=&trainer_id=


Lampard scored 4 goals as a sub and 2 while starting. Now tell us, if going by your narrative, was Lampard more important as a sub or as a starter?

If Lampard was that good at that age to guarantee league win, why did he not win it for Chelsea that season that we were topping the league until Liverpool, and then Manchester City came to overtake us to win the league?


Like I said earlier, any manager starting Lampard in his team at that time, and hoping to win league with him is not only sick, but delusional.

I don't need you to tell me where Lampard played in his last years at Chelsea.

It is Chelsea's own stüpidity to push him deep prematurely for the useless shiny new toy of Oscar and yet Lampard was still outproducing Oscar and making key differences where it matters.

City allowed him the freedom to make the difference where he does it best, even in the last knockings of his career and he rewarded them with results.

What Lampard did in Chelsea, even as a DM was go on scoring runs to secure UCL qualification when needed and topping the Chelsea scoring charts in the process. Despite having the most impotent striker upfront, his goals were crucial to securing UCL qualification. You can check his scoring run under Benitez including the goals against Aston Villa that secured us qualification.

Take that Lampard despite another 2 years in his legs and put him infront of Fernandinho and Toure instead of dropping him in with the useless Mikel and Ramires, and what you get is 28 points from 10 starts.

Imagine trying to discredit Lampard saying his replacement with Fabregas is what won the league, when Lampard has been carrying Chelsea above their level for the last 2 years with the useless Torres and useless Ramires, Oscar and snail Mikel in midfield. If not for Lampard contribution that period of 2012 to 2014, na 7th or 8th position for sure pass. The introduction of Matic to knock out those 2 useless midfielders and the introduction of Costa to knockout the Spanish Eunuch were key pieces of development to winning the league, so stop creating story that removing Lampard for Fabregas was what won the league.

Leyqute:


LooL. This is exactly what I said. Surprised Henderson is being considered for PFL when KDB is there.

Henderson has been outstanding this season tbh

Ibeme:


Good and succinct summary. Sometimes being a great player includes intangibles such as personality, scoring goals when unexpected etc. He does that. But he is not a great defender by any stretch of imagination.

Exactly...
He's a leader,
His winning mentality is top notch,
And he's got balls of steel
That's what makes him a great player...
Defensively he can be error prone and reckless but he's such an All-rounder that he makes up for his defensive flaws....

Leyqute:


LooL. This is exactly what I said. Surprised Henderson is being considered for PFL when KDB is there.

Liverpool guys run the media. That is why Henderson is in conversation. If Henderson wins so 3 Liverpool guys win the best player award when they havent even won the league just once

nihilistjnr:


KDB imo is just more well rounded as a midfielder than Lampard was.

He seems faster, bigger, stronger, and can run for longer than Lampard.

I do think KDB is probably thr best box-to-box midfielder in the history of the game.

He can give you a bit of everything, and that's why I feel hes better than Lampard for me.

I will still take a Peak Gerrard over KDB..
Also KDB ain't no box to box midfielder...

raumdeuter:


Liverpool guys run the media. That is why Henderson is in conversation. If Henderson wins so 3 Liverpool guys win the best player award when they havent even won the league just once

Suarez,salah and Van djik...
Which players were more impressive than these players individually the seasons they won?

Swissh:

I don't have your time so I will just drop this.

I don't have time too. Let me quickly drop this

thorrvik55:
Even dat one dey used to Swissh on/off, it is a Chelsea ex-player dat would never affiliate himself with anything Arsenal he'll want to use to drag a Chelsea great..

Shey Arsenal sef no get midfielders??

What goes around comes around o, Na Lampard (Chelsea's legend) dem dry drag for ground like this, wow!

Frank Lampard has scored, what a penalty!

kendrick93:
Exactly...
He's a leader,
His winning mentality is top notch,
And he's got balls of steel
That's what makes him a great player...
Defensively he can be error prone and reckless but he's such an All-rounder that he makes up for his defensive flaws....

There is nothing you need a defender to do that Ramos cannot, He is fearless, he gets stuck in, he doesnt run away from contests, he knows when to take the card and he is a winner.

You think its easy to play in Madrid defence where Marcelo and Carvajal are upfront with Kroos and Modric shadow marking

Its not the type of easy job that VVD does at Liverpool, where Matip, Wijnaldum and Henderson would have done the donkey work and he just cleansup. In Madrid there is no community defending, defenders have to engage, and face a lot of 1 vs 1

Go and see what became of WPOTY Canavaro when he landed in Madrid and had to cover 40yards by himself

One season of Terry under AVB he became a joke the thing Ramos has been playign every season. I hope VVD goes to Madrid very soon and we see his traffic warden tactics work in 3 vs 3 situations

kendrick93:
Suarez,salah and Van djik...
Which players were more impressive than these players individually the seasons they won?

What was the reason for VVD winning? Suarez and Salah broke the goal scoring record. Tell why Henderson is even in conversation for the award this season

kendrick93:
I will still take a Peak Gerrard over KDB..
Also KDB ain't no box to box midfielder...

You support Liverpool? I don't know why a reasonable person would pick Gerrard over KDB.....peak Gerrard kor, cowbell Steven niii

nitrogen:
You support Liverpool? I don't know why a reasonable person would pick Gerrard over KDB.....peak Gerrard kor, cowbell Steven niii

You know everything in Liverpool to him is superior, that is why VVD is greater than all EPL defenders ever, Even Gerrard

raumdeuter:


There is nothing you need a defender to do that Ramos cannot, He is fearless, he gets stuck in, he doesnt run away from contests, he knows when to take the card and he is a winner.

You think its easy to play in Madrid defence where Marcelo and Carvajal are upfront with Kroos and Modric shadow marking

Its not the type of easy job that VVD does at Liverpool, where Matip, Wijnaldum and Henderson would have done the donkey work and he just cleansup. In Madrid there is no community defending, defenders have to engage, and face a lot of 1 vs 1

Go and see what became of WPOTY Canavaro when he landed in Madrid and had to cover 40yards by himself

Liverpool play a very high line, infact this season klopp even tweaked the system to more higher line.... And Van djik is still excelling, he has faced lots of one on ones too...... It's nonsense to imply he Doesn't face 1 on 1.
There's nothing defensively that Van djik doesn't Excell in which is why he's currently the Best CB in the world

Ibeme:


Good and succinct summary. Sometimes being a great player includes intangibles such as personality, scoring goals when unexpected etc. He does that. But he is not a great defender by any stretch of imagination.

This is totally false. He plays in Madrid a system that doesnt play in low blocks, I have seen Ramos play in a protected system and he even did better than Terry and co

Let us see VVD in Madrid where no one does donkey work for him and he has to engage attackers every minute, not the one he will be pointing and giving orders

The same impeccable Canavaro in Juventus and Azzuri became a joke when he entered the Madrid system. That is what Ramos has been facing for the past 15yrs of his career

Ibeme:




I don't need you to tell me where Lampard played in his last years at Chelsea.

It is Chelsea's own stüpidity to push him deep prematurely for the useless shiny new toy of Oscar and yet Lampard was still outproducing Oscar and making key differences where it matters.

City allowed him the freedom to make the difference where he does it best, even in the last knockings of his career and he rewarded them with results.

What Lampard did in Chelsea, even as a DM was go on scoring runs to secure UCL qualification when needed and topping the Chelsea scoring charts in the process. Despite having the most impotent striker upfront, his goals were crucial to securing UCL qualification. You can check his scoring run under Benitez including the goals against Aston Villa that secured us qualification.

Take that Lampard despite another 2 years in his legs and put him infront of Fernandinho and Toure instead of dropping him in with the useless Mikel and Ramires, and what you get is 28 points from 10 starts.

Imagine trying to discredit Lampard saying his replacement with Fabregas is what won the league, when Lampard has been carrying Chelsea above their level for the last 2 years with the useless Torres and useless Ramires, Oscar and snail Mikel in midfield. If not for Lampard contribution that period of 2012 to 2014, na 7th or 8th position for sure pass. The introduction of Matic to knock out those 2 useless midfielders and the introduction of Costa to knockout the Spanish Eunuch were key pieces of development to winning the league, so stop creating story that removing Lampard for Fabregas was what won the league .

I was only giving you a taste of your own medicine, since you like to make bogus conclusions.
So, whether you like it or not, Chelsea won the league after they chased Lampard away and Manchester City could not win again after they got Lampard.

Now, tell us, how many points did Lampard’s goal get from the 10 starts?

Greatihex:
where will kdb play AM in Belgium when they play two AMs in Hazard and Mertens?

Go and check again. He plays CM for both teams with much freedom. He used to play as RAM or Cam for Belgium until he started to play CM for Manchester City, then Martinez came to Belgium and gave him the same role and started the 3-4-3/3-4-2-1.

If u followed the last World cup or Belgium games, u would notice Belgium always used two CM's (Dembele/Witsel at the worldcup) as the duo in front of the defence. Debruyne was given a free role in midfield and he was not playing CM for Belgium.


In the 3-4-3/ 3-4-2-1, there are two CM's and then KDB sits in front of them with the license to move higher up or drop deeper and dictate play.

raumdeuter:


What was the reason for VVD winning? Suarez and Salah broke the goal scoring record. Tell why Henderson is even in conversation for the award this season

Maybe his fellow professional football players who all voted him know more than you do .....
Just maybe

nitrogen:


You support Liverpool? I don't know why a reasonable person would pick Gerrard over KDB.....peak Gerrard kor, cowbell Steven niii

Reasonable ko...
Ask any professional player and see their answers....
Or Were you a kid when Stevie was around?

kendrick93:
Liverpool play a very high line, infact this season klopp even tweaked the system to more higher line.... And Van djik is still excelling, he has faced lots of one on ones too...... It's nonsense to imply he Doesn't face 1 on 1.
There's nothing defensively that Van djik doesn't Excell in which is why he's currently the Best CB in the world

Liverpool have 3 hardworking midfielders that do the work and the ball hardly gets to the defence which is why VVD is only able to mop up

Can you compare the defensive work of Wijnaldum and Henderson to what Kroos and Modric will do? or the defensive work of Robertson to Marcelo

VVD is known to hide from engaging attckers which will not be possible when you have to go 3 vs 3 or 2vs 2

Pep like Klopp play a high line but his defenders face more 1 vs 1 because his midfielders dont put in the type of Defensive work Gini and Henderson does

kendrick93:
Maybe his fellow professional football players who all voted him know more than you do .....
Just maybe

Ballot paper awards

raumdeuter:

This is totally false. He plays in Madrid a system that doesnt play in low blocks, I have seen Ramos play in a protected system and he even did better than Terry and co

Let us see VVD in Madrid where no one does donkey work for him and he has to engage attackers every minute, not the one he will be pointing and giving orders

The same impeccable Canavaro in Juventus and Azzuri became a joke when he entered the Madrid system. That is what Ramos has been facing for the past 15yrs of his career

I've been waiting for someone to say this. Ramos for the last decade or so has played in a Madrid that goes gung-ho from the get-go. Usually with Both fullbacks attacking. He's always having to cover large areas of space by himself.
Anyone using Card stats to discredit him is simply being mischievous.

raumdeuter:


Liverpool have 3 hardworking midfielders that do the work and the ball hardly gets to the defence which is why VVD is only able to mop up

Can you compare the defensive work of Wijnaldum and Henderson to what Kroos and Modric will do? or the defensive work of Robertson to Marcelo

VVD is known to hide from engaging attckers which will not be possible when you have to go 3 vs 3 or 2vs 2

Pep like Klopp play a high line but his defenders face more 1 vs 1 because his midfielders dont put in the type of Defensive work Gini and Henderson does

Where were this three hardworking midfielders before VVD joined?
How come they couldn't protect matip, skrtel, sakho, Lovren from having the one of worst defences in the league for consecutive seasons...
Or does this three hardworking midfielders shine only when VVd is around??

Unlimited22:

I've been waiting for someone to say this. Ramos for the last decade or so has played in a Madrid that goes gung-ho from the get-go. Usually with Both fullbacks attacking. He's always having to cover large areas of space by himself.
Anyone using Card stats to discredit him is simply being mischievous.

When Madrid plays, Carvajal is in opponent box, Marcelo is in opponent box, Kroos has no defensive bone in his body and just escort attackers,

Most times its Ramos, Varane and Casemiro. He is even lucky now that they have Casemiro, before it used to be Khedira and Alonso

Go and watch how Madrid turned Canavaro into a basket just after he was named best player in the world, People think because you can play community defence you suddenly become great

Look at whenever Man City is under attack how its usually 2 vs 3 with every defender answering his papa name, That is what Ramos has been facing for 15yrs.

Greatihex:
I was only giving you a taste of your own medicine, since you like to make bogus conclusions.
So, whether you like it or not, Chelsea won the league after they chased Lampard away and Manchester City could not win again after they got Lampard.

Now, tell us, how many points did Lampard’s goal get from the 10 starts?

Lampard was starting against small clubs and regular customers...... Even without Lampard, they will trash those clubs.

kendrick93:
Where were this three hardworking midfielders before VVD joined?
How come they couldn't protect matip, skrtel, sakho, Lovren from having the one of worst defences in the league for consecutive seasons...
Or does this three hardworking midfielders shine only when VVd is around??

Fabinho hasnt joined, Robertson hasnt been discovered, Gini and Henderson were still finding their feet, Salah hasnt been discovered

Rather it was Moreno, Clyne, Can etc

kendrick93:
Reasonable ko...
Ask any professional player and see their answers....
Or Were you a kid when Stevie was around?

Pls which year was that

Lets know more about the peak Gerrard

Greatihex:
I was only giving you a taste of your own medicine, since you like to make bogus conclusions.
So, whether you like it or not, Chelsea won the league after they chased Lampard away and Manchester City could not win again after they got Lampard.

Now, tell us, how many points did Lampard’s goal get from the 10 starts?

Check assists and all round contribution also.

Last he was seen before he popped his hamstring against Spurs, he had already assisted twice in 28 minutes before his hamstring popped on the way to a 4-1 trashing of Spurs

After missing 2 games with injury, Pellegrini declined to return him to starting line up thinking his loan will expire soon, and that's when Chelsea accelerated away from City in the title race.

Unlimited22:

I've been waiting for someone to say this. Ramos for the last decade or so has played in a Madrid that goes gung-ho from the get-go. Usually with Both fullbacks attacking. He's always having to cover large areas of space by himself.
Anyone using Card stats to discredit him is simply being mischievous.

So Trent alenxander arnold and Robertson don't attack

You guys are joking.....

What is the highest assist Carvajal and Marcelo ever produce in a season?