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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Culture / How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation (39842 Views)
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Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by BabaRamota1980: 4:22pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
Good job minorityopinion. Good job bro! 1 Like |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by TAO11(f): 4:24pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
Hellraiser77:Do you mind convincing me on why we must disregard that screenshot of the conclusion of historical scholarship and trust you instead?? Thank you. Also, the understanding that the “east” in the Portuguese account is of a religious significance in relation to Ife, rather than literal, is according to historical scholarship. I cited all the sources in that same comment. Read the comment again, but this time more slowly. Regarding Ife’s supremacy, it is sufficient to quote from Suzanne P. Blier’s “Art and Risk in Ancient Yoruba”. She noted rightly that: “During the era of Ife’s greatest historic power, the twelfth to the fifteenth centuries C.E., its influence spanned eastward to the Niger River and westward to what is today Southern Togo.” I guess Benin Kingdom is outside of the above geographical delineation. Lol. Moreover, in 1897 Captain Roupell collected accounts from Benin Kingdom which says that Benin’s first king [Eweka (I)] is a Yoruba man from Ife. — Roupell’s Official cited in H.L. Roth, 1903, p.7. Furthermore, a c.1300 ‘bronze’ figure of the Ooni of Ife was excavated from the palace of Benin Kingdom. See attached. The attached screenshot is from Professor Suzanne P. Blier’s “Art in Ancient Ife”. Like I have educated you before, the Igbos and their western neighbors, the Binis did have engagements. You just have to read. Similarly, the Yoruba also engaged their Easter neighbors, the Binis. Wars are natural part of human history. You didn’t know that. 3 Likes 1 Share
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Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by OfoIgbo: 4:32pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
BabaRamota1980: Well, once you can prove that the whiteman visited Nri pre 1850, then I will show you a DIRECT proof of Eze Nri pre 1850. However, I can supply you with an indirect proof of Eze Nri. According to the writings of Captain John Adams in 1823, below are two paragraphs ‘A class Igbos called Breeche, and whom many erroneously considered to be a distinct nation, masters of slave ship have always had a strong aversion to purchase because the impression made on their minds by their degraded situation was rendered more galling and permanent from the exalted rank which they occupied in their own country and which was thought to have very unfavourable influence on their ship-mate and country men in misfortune”. “Breche” in the Heebo language signifies gentlemen or the oldest son of one, and who is not allowed to perform in his own country any manual office. He inherits, at his fathers’ death, all his slaves and had the absolute control over the wives and children whom he has left behind him. Before attaining the age of manhood his forehead is scarified and the skin brought down from the hair to the eyebrows so as to form a line of indurated skin from one temple to the other. This peculiar mark is distinctive of his rank.” The two above paragraphs describe the Mgburu-ichi (BREECHE). They are a part of the Ikenga cult, along with the Ozo title holders, and were all spiritually headed by the Eze Nri himself, and not by any other individual. 2 Likes |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by TAO11(f): 4:34pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
OfoIgbo: OfoIgbo:Lol. Adam Knobler simply summarized the conclusion of historical scholarship who have done all the ground work from the beginning till date. And I did name all of those scholars whose conclusions Adam Knobler simply echoed, yet not one of them identify the Ogane as an Igbo king. Please make sure to always read the very comments you spend time responding to. It helps a lot in making you look less dumb. I may not further engage you or any other Igbo dreamer if you all continue to fail to mention one scholar who identified the Ogane as an Igbo king. 3 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by TAO11(f): 4:37pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
Hellraiser77:Established evidence by who?? Of course I understand why you feel the way I’m making you feel. 2 Likes |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by OfoIgbo: 4:39pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
MinorityOpinion: Your revisionism will not work. Read and weep We present the kingships/kingdoms in a chronological order of age from 900AD to date, along with authorities who studied them: 1st Nri kingdom 900AD (date established by carbon -14) by Northcote Thomas (1913), MDW Jeffreys (1934) and Prof. M.A. OnwuejKogwu (1974 and 1981) 2nd Kanuri Kingdom: about 900AD by Abdullahi Smith (1971), Smith (1971) and Onwuejeogwu (2000) 3rd Kano kingdom 950AD by J. Hunwick (1971), R.A. Adeleye (1971) and Onwuejeogwu (2000) 4th Agbor kingship 950AD by Chief Iduwe (1985) 5th Daura Kingdom 950AD by J. Hunwick (1971), Dr. R.A. Adeleye (1971) and Onwuejeogwu (2000) 6th Ife Kingdom (Yoruba) 1045AD by Dr. R. Smith (1969) F. Willet (1960) and Johnson (1921) 7th Ijebu Ode Kingdom 1080AD by Dr. R. Smith 1969, Prof. E.A. Ayandele (1992) and Johnson (1921) 8th Old Oyo Kingdom 1145AD by Dr. R. Smith (1969) Dr. P.M Williams (1967) Johnson (1921) 9th Benin Kingdom 1140AD by Chief Egharevba (1934 and (1968) and Dr. R.E. Brandbury (1957) 10th Ubulu-Ukwu Kingship 1280AD by Mr. E.A. Ikemefuna and Obi Anene (1985) 11th Owa Kingship (Off-shoot of Nri) 1280AD by Obi Efeizomor II (1994) 12th Igala Kingdom 1450AD by Dr. J.S. Boston (1962) 13th Ogwashi-Ukwu Kingship (Offshoot of Nri) 1500AD by Mr. Ben Nwabua (1998) 14th Aro Kingdom 1650AD by Prof. Kenneth Dike and Prof. J. Ekejiuba (1990) 15th Onitsha Kingship 1750AD by R.N. Henderson (1972) Prof Ikenna Nzimiro (1972) 1 Like |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by Nobody: 4:39pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
TAO11: Mehh you are good! The ogane can't be Nri priest that is all I know Pls kindly read this article maybe you devote more time to it than me https://books.google.com.ng/books?id=bZD-1kObnMQC&pg=PA137&lpg=PA137&dq=who%27s+ogane+in+East+of+Benin&source=bl&ots=zgdspky12X&sig=ACfU3U2mJapTScrZM0Y84LqXPlaeQsSjBw&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiS7Mj27prrAhXJ6aQKHaBACEsQ6AEwEXoECAYQAQ#v=onepage&q=who's%20ogane%20in%20East%20of%20Benin&f=false 1 Like |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by OfoIgbo: 4:41pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
MinorityOpinion: Stop lying. They mentioned a staff, which is the Ofo and other ancient royal paraphanelia the Eze Nris will normally issue to some kings. |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by Nobody: 4:42pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
OfoIgbo:Nonsense copy and paste with no reference! The researcher that carbon dated igbo arts said the readings were false so no debate 2 Likes |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by Nobody: 4:43pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
OfoIgbo: What are you saying? Read something my friend |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by BabaRamota1980: 4:44pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
TAO11: Great job TAO11. God bless you. I think metaphysical once threw a challenge to tease Edo witches that their oghene was from Iboland. Metaphysical was throwing the descendants of slaves in Edo between a rock and a hard place with the tease, in other words compressing them to accept one between Yoruba and yanminri for the origin of their foreign ruler. Omoibo has taken that tease to be historical fact and latched his destiny to it. Bloody cannibals want to claim oghene is Nri. Mmtchew, Baba lo ma pa yanminri! 3 Likes |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by BabaRamota1980: 4:49pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
OfoIgbo: Hey, i already told you dont roll shytte back. Why is yours established by carbon dating but others are verifiable in human history? Where is Nri in human history? Find it. No carbon dating. Thats assumption. 3 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by OfoIgbo: 4:52pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
TAO11: What level of low intelligence is this? In his summary, all of a sudden EAST turned to WEST. Doesn't this immediately tell you that he was only looking into Yoruba revisionist writings? State one Nri historical scholarship that he examined. Don't think I am the sort of person you can bamboozle with quack findings, by intellectually incompetent individuals. Knobler has to also mention a likely KINGDOM TO THE EAST and why he failed to consider its claim. The simple answer being that he only consumed what revisionists have been writing 3 Likes |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by Nobody: 4:53pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
OfoIgbo: This is what I'm reading 2 Likes
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Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by OfoIgbo: 4:56pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
BabaRamota1980: Unfortunately for you, Yorubaland is not to the EAST OF BENIN. Your revisionism won't work. Knobler is about to go down. A more worthy research effort will be done to obliterate his work 1 Like |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by OfoIgbo: 4:58pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
BabaRamota1980: That means Nri's claim is more scientifically verifiable. Yours are just tales by the moonlight. I am still waiting for you lot to try and claim the Nri 4 market days. 3 Likes |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by OfoIgbo: 5:01pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
MinorityOpinion: I hope this is not from Knobler because his findings are already suspect. I need to read things from intellectuals that actually consulted with ALL sides of the argument. Anything from Knobler or Wikipedia will not be accepted. |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by TAO11(f): 5:02pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
OfoIgbo:Like I had said, always make sure to read the very things you spend time responding to. It helps a lot in making you look less dumb. All scholars in historical scholarship (whom I listed, and whose conclusions Adam Knobler simply echoed) identify the Ogane as the Ooni of Ife. Yet, your counter-argument is that: Well, in the future somebody will identify the Ogane as an Igbo king. Interesting. 2 Likes 2 Shares |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by TAO11(f): 5:12pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
OfoIgbo:Lol. The following is the part of my comment which you pretended not to see. Read below and kill your fears: Despite the description of “east” in this account, I am still unaware of any historian (past or present) who identified this monarch as an Igbo king. See the link below for the full comment itself: https://www.nairaland.com/6048841/how-unveil-promote-ancient-igbo/10#92795761 Again Knobler (2016) in the attachment below simply alluded to and echoed what was already established by ethnographic/historical scholarship. See the attached once more for a refreshing read. 1 Like 1 Share
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Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by OfoIgbo: 5:19pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
TAO11: I don't think you have a full understanding of what a brilliant research entails. Even if one million researchers performed their individual researches on one topic, but still failed to investigate every variable, those one million research works will be found wanting. If none of the researches fail to showcase its unbiased professionalism, and activities to cover all grounds rather than just concentrating on one angle to reach a pre-determined conclusion, and totally ignoring the word (EAST) and failing to make any efforts towards getting to the real truth and fact; then all that research is only fit for one place: THE TRASH BIN |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by BabaRamota1980: 5:19pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
OfoIgbo: How does the record of breeche in 1823 have anything to do with Nri or Aro? You are the one linking it, thr author did not. I said your neighbors must know you had something called Nri and Arobif indeed this was true. Is there anything in Ijaw, in Benin, in Igala that mention Nri or Aro? 1 Like |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by TAO11(f): 5:25pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
OfoIgbo:First of all historical scholarship did not ignore the word “east” as I have repeatedly demonstrated. See here again. But guess what, I perfectly get your point. In other words, the body of historical scholarship in the whole wide world conspired to mArGiNaLiZe ndi-Igbo by identifying the Ogane as the Ooni of Ife. Noted! This persecution-complex thingy again. What a pity!? LegendHero and BabaRamota1980 comman carry your customers here oo. Hehehe. 3 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by BabaRamota1980: 5:28pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
OfoIgbo: Prior 1850 the history of Negro Africa was vetifiable by oral and conquest, not by science. Show us oral and conquest of Nri and Aro in the kingdoms that share your area with you - Bini, Efik, Ijaw, Igala. No backdating and carbon dating, pure African method for validating history. Tell us who Nri was and Aro in the oral history in Bini, in Efik, in Ijaw and in Igala. If your neighbors have zero account of you as a kingdom then igbo remains enwe eze. 2 Likes |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by OfoIgbo: 5:37pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
BabaRamota1980: The author doesn't have to link it, after all, you did not ask the author that question. I was the person you asked that question, so I answered you. By the way, please people read and weep. Knobler my ass “If, as has been suggested, Nri theocratic sway could be identified with the culture whose material symbols Shaw recovered in his Igbo-Ukwu excavations, then that factor must be dated to between the 9th and 11th century A.D. or indeed earlier. In that case, Nri influence would be much older than the political and military hegemony centered around Benin and Idah. It may indeed have contributed something to their rise. There are suggestions of this in the tradition, found not only amongst the Nri but also amongst the Bini and the Igala that Nri ritual priests had important parts to play in ceremonies connected with the coronation of the Oba of Benin and the Attah of Igala. Both Jeffreys and Lawton, administrative officers, unearthed evidence to this effect. Thus, it would appear, Nri activities linked much of Igbo-land with the West Niger region up to Benin, and with the region occupied by the Igala and perhaps it also linked Igboland with Idoma land. Many of these links survived, at least, until the 1930s and may still be there in form of the activities of Nri and related traditional medicine man.” 2 Likes |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by LegendHero(m): 5:39pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
TAO11: This OfoIgbo don suffer today. He will cry to the mods soon to close down the thread. He is obviously Pazienza, I have dealt with him before to the extent that he had to beg the mod to close down the thread he created. 3 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by BabaRamota1980: 5:40pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
TAO11: There is no record of portuguese or dutch explorers and traders setting foot in Oyo but they recorded what they heard from kingdoms on the coast and in fact many times they sent gifts from the coast to be delivered to the king in Oyo. From Dahomey and Hausas they heard about Ife and Oyo. From Borgu and from Bini they were told about Kings in interior Yorubaland. Lander and Clapperton confirmed everything told about Oyo. Nri and Aro has only been told by yanminri, nobody else. Igbo enwe eze, untill we get proof of Nri and Aro as an ancient kingdom. 3 Likes |
Re: How To Unveil And Promote Ancient Igbo Civilisation by OfoIgbo: 5:44pm On Aug 14, 2020 |
“If, as has been suggested, Nri theocratic sway could be identified with the culture whose material symbols Shaw recovered in his Igbo-Ukwu excavations, then that factor must be dated to between the 9th and 11th century A.D. or indeed earlier. In that case, Nri influence would be much older than the political and military hegemony centered around Benin and Idah. It may indeed have contributed something to their rise. There are suggestions of this in the tradition, found not only amongst the Nri but also amongst the Bini and the Igala that Nri ritual priests had important parts to play in ceremonies connected with the coronation of the Oba of Benin and the Attah of Igala. Both Jeffreys and Lawton, administrative officers, unearthed evidence to this effect. Thus, it would appear, Nri activities linked much of Igbo-land with the West Niger region up to Benin, and with the region occupied by the Igala and perhaps it also linked Igboland with Idoma land. Many of these links survived, at least, until the 1930s and may still be there in form of the activities of Nri and related traditional medicine man.” Afigbo 1987 With the above, Afigbo has shown himself to be superior to Knobler, the white man. Trust an Igbo man to show excellent scholarly mien Please bear in mind that the researcher that wrote the above was not aware of the Portuguese exploration of Benin in the 1400s Yoruba attempt to change EAST to WEST will be pulled down MinorityOpinion, TAO11 and the other. Oya food don land Hellraiser77 nwannem nwoke, I got them by their shriveled balls now. They will have to counter Jeffreys, Lawton and Prof. Afigbo, The KINGDOM TO THE EAST is gradually and unstoppably showing its hands 3 Likes |
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