Mindlog:


Not facing challenges only within the school system but developing the mind to navigate the realities of the outside world.

For example, I work in a psychiatric hospital and my experiential learning back in school has a very strong correlation at my workplace which is real life in a very raw form.

So my spending all those years in school has not been a disadvantage to me nor has it disconnected me from realities of life, that it is way beyond the superficial.

I would dispute this @bolded. What could you have possibly learnt in school that would be applicable in a psychiatric hospital? Or perhaps you are speaking of academic activities that you learnt in a higher institution; like medical school for example. That is different, because it teaches you a profession just as you would have learnt if you had followed your father around (assuming that he was a psychiatrist as well).

By 'school' I meant earlier levels, like primary and secondary schools which only teach you how to pass examinations according to standards set by the school system itself. I'll bet you didn't learn anything in those early schools that are useful in psychiatry.

Kuns84:
That boy looks quite young as well.. I'd say he's around 18 while the girl is 14.. if they'd waited another 5 years maybe this wouldn't have caused so much uproar.

Say no to child marriage.

With a full bearded face? Naaaaaaaaaah

Because they can,because girls are generally not valued except for reproduction,housekeeping and child rearing purposes.

Why should children mature fast? Whats the rush? Where are they running to? What is the advantage of this quick maturity?

How can a child so young know what she wants? By the time she hits her late teen or 20s she's trapped with children and most times a man over 8 times her age and society will frown on her and make her life hell if she wants better.

For the young boys,what do they know? Forced to care for a girl? As they mature,society makes it permissible for them to sow their wild oats and marry more women while not extending same courtesy to the young wife.

The sick thing about it is that these children are impressionable,easily controlled, they know nothing ,their minds easily malleable ,practically walking puppets to serve these men plus the increased possibility of death at childbirth.

How will you not mature fast if at 13 you're having babies,sexing and running a home? What sort of children can you raise? A full blown adult has challenges raising children,what will a child teach a fellow child?

Research has shown that the pruning of brain neural circuits is almost completed at about age 25. This is about rational thinking,decision making,impulsively etc
This studying is still ongoing.

There's news now of some of them killing their spouses, running away etc.If we actually take a census,what would they really say?Would they do same if they were given a choice?

My real question is why are they soo scared about waiting for them to grow up and decide for themselves?

What is it about educating the female child that scares people?

Is Buhari marrying off his 13 year old? Why is he educating his daughters and marrying them off when they're adults?

Why don't you set an example and start with your own daughter not getting an education so she can be more 'mature?

RisenPhoenix1:


I would dispute this @bolded. What could you have possibly learnt in school that would be applicable in a psychiatric hospital? Or perhaps you are speaking of academic activities that you learnt in a higher institution; like medical school for example. That is different, because it teaches you a profession just as you would have learnt if you had followed your father around (assuming that he was a psychiatrist as well).

By 'school' I meant earlier levels, like primary and secondary schools which only teach you how to pass examinations according to standards set by the school system itself. I'll bet you didn't learn anything in those early schools that are useful in psychiatry.

You can't certify to practice as a psychiatrist (which I am not) just because your father is one and you follow him around.

Mindlog:


You can't certify to practice as a psychiatrist (which I am not) just because your father is one and you follow him around.

Yes, in today's world, because now we have regulations, paper certifications and what-not. But it was precisely the method successfully used in earlier times. And please don't tell me to compare the medical knowledge then and now, because medical improvements have not come as a result of certification, but because man naturally advances in knowledge. I would like to believe that we would have been at exactly the same level of medical advance today even without all the mandatory certifications. Those were only to impose restrictions and increase revenue for the regulatory bodies.

mariahAngel:


With a full bearded face? Naaaaaaaaaah

You clearly didn't grow up with boys around.. some grow beards by 17.Forget it. That dude is a youngin.

Kuns84:


You clearly didn't grow up with boys around.. some grow beards by 17.Forget it. That dude is a youngin.

Dude, I have three brothers, two of them are quite hairy, yet they didn't grow their beards that thick in their teenage years.
Even the one with the arab kind of beards...

mariahAngel:


Dude, I have three brothers, two of them are quite hairy, yet they didn't grow their beards that thick in their teenage years.
Even the one with the arab kind of beards...

That's your own brothers. Doesn't apply to all men.

RisenPhoenix1:


Yes, in today's world, because now we have regulations, paper certifications and what-not. But it was precisely the method successfully used in earlier times. And please don't tell me to compare the medical knowledge then and now, because medical improvements have not come as a result of certification, but because man naturally advances in knowledge. I would like to believe that we would have been at exactly the same level of medical advance today even without all the mandatory certifications. Those were only to impose restrictions and increase revenue for the regulatory bodies.

Since we are focused on mental health, competency needs to be central in all who are to provide professional intervention and need to be grounded in knowledge to what appertains to the field. The main focus of certification is to sieve, so that those who pass through will be deemed professionally able to carry out certain tasks.

Mindlog:



Since we are focused on mental health, competency needs to be central in all who are to provide professional intervention and need to be grounded in knowledge to what appertains to the field. The main focus of certification is to sieve, so that those who pass through will be deemed professionally able to carry out certain tasks.

Certification is not essential for sieving. Professionalism was ensured in the past by vouching and approving only the best and brightest. From thence, they had to maintain a reputation.

But all of this is not relevant to the thread. The fact remains that professional competence does not in any way equate to emotional or mental maturity as is required for the maintenance of a marital relationship...unless of course, the prospective spouse is mentally ill.

RisenPhoenix1:


Certification is not essential for sieving. Professionalism was ensured in the past by vouching and approving only the best and brightest. From thence, they had to maintain a reputation.

But all of this is not relevant to the thread. The fact remains that professional competence does not in any way equate to emotional or mental maturity as is required for the maintenance of a marital relationship...unless of course, the prospective spouse is mentally ill.

Focusing on the thread and your assertion that spending time in school correlates to mental immaturity as it is not evidenced based. That a girl who gets married and become a mother at 16 is more mentally adjusted to deal with life issues than a lady who goes through school and starts her own family at 27?

What edge does an adolescent mother have over an adult lady when it comes to nurturing a child?

Can we say one of the goals of child marriage is the desire to have a wife who is in a mental space where she has been conditioned to obey unquestioningly because of the tilt in balance?

Mindlog:


Focusing on the thread and your assertion that spending time in school correlates to mental immaturity as it is not evidenced based. That a girl who gets married and become a mother at 16 is more mentally adjusted to deal with life issues than a lady who goes through school and starts her own family at 27?

What edge does an adolescent mother have over an adult lady when it comes to nurturing a child?

Can we say one of the goals of child marriage is the desire to have a wife who is in a mental space where she has been conditioned to obey unquestioningly because of the tilt in balance?

I wouldn't say that a girl who gets married at 16 is more mentally adjusted to deal with the issues than one who goes through school and gets married at 27, yet I can't say that she's less adjusted either. It depends on the individual as well as her early training and exposure. If a 16 year old has been brought up with the knowledge of how to raise a family, she would absolutely have the mental acuity and know how to do so. Whereas, a 27 year old who has spent all her life in learning professional competence and little else, may not be able to sustain a healthy marital relationship for long; especially if she has engaged in multiple sexual partnerships during the course of her professional training.

No. I believe that possibly a goal of what you term child marriage, is to mitigate the effects of sexual promiscuity which occurs as a natural result of restricting sexually mature teenagers with raging hormones, from having an officially sanctioned outlet for their sexual urges. I don't believe that it has anything to do with obedience conditioning or all the rest of that mythical conspiracy drivel.

RisenPhoenix1:


I wouldn't say that a girl who gets married at 16 is more mentally adjusted to deal with the issues than one who goes through school and gets married at 27, yet I can't say that she's less adjusted either. It depends on the individual as well as her early training and exposure. If a 16 year old has been brought up with the knowledge of how to raise a family, she would absolutely have the mental acuity and know how to do so. Whereas, a 27 year old who has spent all her life in learning professional competence and little else, may not be able to sustain a healthy marital relationship for long; especially if she has engaged in multiple sexual partnerships during the course of her professional training.

No. I believe that possibly a goal of what you term child marriage, is to mitigate the effects of sexual promiscuity which occurs as a natural result of restricting sexually mature teenagers with raging hormones, from having an officially sanctioned outlet for their sexual urges. I don't believe that it has anything to do with obedience conditioning or all the rest of that mythical conspiracy drivel.

A girl going through the school system does not stop her family from empowering her with the knowledge of what marriage entails, she does not need to be out of school to know that.

IGBO PEOPLE DO IT MORE .

Mindlog:


A girl going through the school system does not stop her family from empowering her with the knowledge of what marriage entails, she does not need to be out of school to know that.

That may or may not be so, but you must admit that actually engaging in hands on home activities with the mother 24/7 will better equip a young lady in the art of home building. Again, I am not recommending this approach as a guideline for whether females should or should not go to schools. I am merely trying to explain why women in the North for example, tend to attain mental maturity much faster, and applying the broad principle of 18 being the standard for mental or emotional maturity may not be applicable across the whole world. It was actually set with western women as the standard, and we should not just blindly adhere to whatever standards they impose upon us.

Men have very fragile egos and a lot of pride so they prefer a younger and more easily controlled/easily bullied wife to older and mature ones that can stand up to them and question their decisions.

If not for the legal age limit of 18yrs for girls in many countries men everywhere will be marrying 12, 13, 14 year old girls left and right.

It's not limited to the north, anywhere men can marry younger and easily controlled, naive girls, they do it. Muslims in the north can hide under the cover of Islam to follow their natural Male prefence to sleep with very young girls.

Saccharine:
Because they can,because girls are generally not valued except for reproduction,housekeeping and child rearing purposes.

Why should children mature fast? Whats the rush? Where are they running to? What is the advantage of this quick maturity?

How can a child so young know what she wants? By the time she hits her late teen or 20s she's trapped with children and most times a man over 8 times her age and society will frown on her and make her life hell if she wants better.

For the young boys,what do they know? Forced to care for a girl? As they mature,society makes it permissible for them to sow their wild oats and marry more women while not extending same courtesy to the young wife.

The sick thing about it is that these children are impressionable,easily controlled, they know nothing ,their minds easily malleable ,practically walking puppets to serve these men plus the increased possibility of death at childbirth.

How will you not mature fast if at 13 you're having babies,sexing and running a home? What sort of children can you raise? A full blown adult has challenges raising children,what will a child teach a fellow child?

Research has shown that the pruning of brain neural circuits is almost completed at about age 25. This is about rational thinking,decision making,impulsively etc
This studying is still ongoing.

There's news now of some of them killing their spouses, running away etc.If we actually take a census,what would they really say?Would they do same if they were given a choice?

My real question is why are they soo scared about waiting for them to grow up and decide for themselves?

What is it about educating the female child that scares people?

Is Buhari marrying off his 13 year old? Why is he educating his daughters and marrying them off when they're adults?

Why don't you set an example and start with your own daughter not getting an education so she can be more 'mature?

My dear God bless you for this post. Many men really have no regard for female rights or anything that emancipates and helps women so they can never see how child marriage is harmful to the girls involved.

You are very smart by the way, I dont know if anyone told you that recently

RisenPhoenix1:


That may or may not be so, but you must admit that actually engaging in hands on home activities with the mother 24/7 will better equip a young lady in the art of home building. Again, I am not recommending this approach as a guideline for whether females should or should not go to schools. I am merely trying to explain why women in the North for example, tend to attain mental maturity much faster, and applying the broad principle of 18 being the standard for mental or emotional maturity may not be applicable across the whole world. It was actually set with western women as the standard, and we should not just blindly adhere to whatever standards they impose upon us.

Below is an excerpt of a 2017 interview, where the former Emir of Kano, Sanusi said those. How are you able to adduce that such girls are in a better mental frame than their peers who continued schooling?

Why do you think Vesico Vaginal Fistula is more prevalent in Northern Nigeria, does it make the girls stronger mentally?

.

Mindlog:


Below is an excerpt of a 2017 interview, where the former Emir of Kano, Sanusi said those. How are you able to adduce that such girls are in a better mental frame than their peers who continued schooling?

Why do you think Vesico Vaginal Fistula is more prevalent in Northern Nigeria, does it make the girls stronger mentally?

He didn't refer to mental maturity. He spoke of their being given into abusive marriages, which happens worldwide. Marriage, whether contracted at a younger, or older age, tends to have its disadvantages...especially where it involves abuse to the women. Do you believe that women who wait to marry at 27 years of age do not face abuse? Also, bring divorced and left with nothing is a legal issue, not an age related one. Perhaps better laws can be promulgated to ensure alimony etc. Increasing the minimum age of marriage will not improve that, and may even create more problems than it solves. In any case, you are still going after girls who are removed from schools. My premise concerns those who have never been to school in the first place, and their readiness for marriage. Emir Sanusi would do better to concentrate on taking the teeming boy alimajirai off the streets before he turns his attention to female education.

And there is no statistical evidence that VVF has any correlation with age of marriage or age at first child bearing, or that it is more prevalent in the North. The factor that most has a bearing on VVF is the quality of medical care accessible, which admittedly, is of a lower standard in the North. If Medical care available to the women was improved, VVF would decrease all over Nigeria.

RisenPhoenix1:


He didn't refer to mental maturity. He spoke of their being given into abusive marriages, which happens worldwide. Marriage, whether contracted at a younger, or older age, tends to have its disadvantages...especially where it involves abuse to the women. Do you believe that women who wait to marry at 27 years of age do not face abuse? Also, bring divorced and left with nothing is a legal issue, not an age related one. Perhaps better laws can be promulgated to ensure alimony etc. Increasing the minimum age of marriage will not improve that, and may even create more problems than it solves. In any case, you are still going after girls who are removed from schools. My premise concerns those who have never been to school in the first place, and their readiness for marriage. Emir Sanusi would do better to concentrate on taking the teeming boy alimajirai off the streets before he turns his attention to female education.

And there is no statistical evidence that VVF has any correlation with age of marriage or age at first child bearing, or that it is more prevalent in the North. The factor that most has a bearing on VVF is the quality of medical care accessible, which admittedly, is of a lower standard in the North. If Medical care available to the women was improved, VVF would decrease all over Nigeria.

You know very well that he referred that those girls were not psychologically matured enough, reason the decision-making of who or when to marry is not in their hands.

Between a 17 year old mother of 2 who dropped out of school to marry and a 27 year old mother of 2 who achieved professionalism through higher education, should their husbands no longer be in the picture and both left with nothing. Who between the 2 has a higher chance of better navigating the waters of post-marriage in terms of provision for their children, access to quality education etc?

As for VVF, the attached provides an insight. You can google search the texts to read full text.

A lot of things happen.
These things cause me to view life as an absurdity.

RisenPhoenix1:


I would dispute this @bolded. What could you have possibly learnt in school that would be applicable in a psychiatric hospital? Or perhaps you are speaking of academic activities that you learnt in a higher institution; like medical school for example. That is different, because it teaches you a profession just as you would have learnt if you had followed your father around (assuming that he was a psychiatrist as well).

By 'school' I meant earlier levels, like primary and secondary schools which only teach you how to pass examinations according to standards set by the school system itself. I'll bet you didn't learn anything in those early schools that are useful in psychiatry.

How could he have learnt anything in the tertiary level if he had not learnt anything in the pre-tertiary level??

Mindlog:


You know very well that he referred that those girls were not psychologically matured enough, reason the decision-making of who or when to marry is not in their hands.

There is no evidence whatsoever that girls become matured in their 18th birthday. If you have any such evidence, please present it. This beating about the bush is becoming excessive.

Mindlog:


Between a 17 year old mother of 2 who dropped out of school to marry and a 27 year old mother of 2 who achieved professionalism through higher education, should their husbands no longer be in the picture and both left with nothing. Who between the 2 has a higher chance of better navigating the waters of post-marriage in terms of provision for their children, access to quality education etc?

Again, irrelevant. People cannot be forced to go to school. If they choose not to go to school for whatever reason, there is no mental or psychological factor that prevents them from marrying at the time they attain sexual maturity, if they have already undergone the training necessary to run a home. Perhaps it is this mental preparation for a 'post marriage' situation that elevates divorce rates. Laws can be promulgated to ensure financial sufficiency for women who have no alternative means of livelihood, or even polygamy (already widely practised in the North) can be a viable alternative. And while you have seemingly proffered one half baked solution for the issue of the self sufficiency of older mass divorcees, you have still not proffered any as to how sexual promiscuity and its attendant ills can be cured in the younger men and women. How many sexual partners would a 27 year old have had before getting married? How many STDs? How many abortions?

Mindlog:


As for VVF, the attached provides an insight. You can google search the texts to read full text.

You are linking the wrong study. Small stature, poverty level, standard of medical care may or may not be age associated. Most people who want to link VVF to early marriage tend to dishonestly conclude (mostly in the title) that small stature etc must all have been due to early marriage; which is totally untrue. Read the study below. It found that in North Eastern Nigeria, over 76% of VVF cases in this study were over the age of 20 years.

https://www.ajol.info/index.php/ebomed/article/view/52633#:~:text=The%20data%20was%20analyzed%20using,20-24%20years%20age%20group.

There are a number of such studies. A mere declaration that VVF is caused by age related factors is dishonest. Find any study that VVF with age of marriage and you'll find little to no correlation at all.

RisenPhoenix1:


There is no evidence whatsoever that girls become matured in their 18th birthday. If you have any such evidence, please present it. This beating about the bush is becoming excessive.



Again, irrelevant. People cannot be forced to go to school. If they choose not to go to school for whatever reason, there is no mental or psychological factor that prevents them from marrying at the time they attain sexual maturity, if they have already undergone the training necessary to run a home. Perhaps it is this mental preparation for a 'post marriage' situation that elevates divorce rates. Laws can be promulgated to ensure financial sufficiency for women who have no alternative means of livelihood, or even polygamy (already widely practised in the North) can be a viable alternative. And while you have seemingly proffered one half baked solution for the issue of the self sufficiency of older mass divorcees, you have still not proffered any as to how sexual promiscuity and its attendant ills can be cured in the younger men and women. How many sexual partners would a 27 year old have had before getting married? How many STDs? How many abortions?



You are linking the wrong study. Small stature, poverty level, standard of medical care may or may not be age associated. Most people who want to link VVF to early marriage tend to dishonestly conclude (mostly in the title) that small stature etc must all have been due to early marriage; which is totally untrue. Read the study below. It found that in North Eastern Nigeria, over 76% of VVF cases in this study were over the age of 20 years.

https://www.ajol.info/index.php/ebomed/article/view/52633#:~:text=The%20data%20was%20analyzed%20using,20-24%20years%20age%20group.

There are a number of such studies. A mere declaration that VVF is caused by age related factors is dishonest. Find any study that VVF with age of marriage and you'll find little to no correlation at all.

If early marriage is intended to curb sexual promiscuity in the raging hormones of the adolescent girl, what helps the adolescent boy to curb his?

In all, there is a widely evidenced fact that a girl empowered through formal education has a higher chance of having a livelihood and not have her life centred around the provision from the husband.

The focus should be on human capital development, let the girl child be empowered to aspire. Them going to school to become nurses, teachers, doctors, lawyers etc do not in any way diminish their identity. Even daughters of Northern elites do get the education before marriage, am yet to read where the daughters of Atiku, Buhari etc got married off when they were adolescents, I guess Zahra Buhari-Indimi who got married after her university education or her sister, Halima Buhari-Sheriff who is a lawyer are less mentally matured because they didn't get married as adolescents.

Girl education to the possible highest level has benefitted my family thus my advocacy.

Nigeriabiafra80:
She is Just a Child!!!
She need Education, Parental care and guidance NOT Marriage.
This unequal relationship will only damage her future and perpetually force her and the kids she will give birth,
As a little girl that didn’t pass through childhood and adulthood while jumping into parenthood is a disaster and it gives the male folk the autocratic power to control them at will

She is a kid and Need pencil ✏️ and Papers Not ‘Sex’ from Adults. - @Hope For Nigeria.

I heard Prophet Mohammed SAW did the same thing. It's part of their religion.

Mindlog:


If early marriage is intended to curb sexual promiscuity in the raging hormones of the adolescent girl, what helps the adolescent boy to curb his?

Early marriage is not recommended only for females. I do not understand why you insist on making this a gender thing. A male who has received the training to make an income should absolutely marry as soon as he can as well.

Mindlog:

In all, there is a widely evidenced fact that a girl empowered through formal education has a higher chance of having a livelihood and not have her life centred around the provision from the husband.

If her husband has a livelihood, she may not need one. I am an economist and I can give you a hundred and one reasons how forcing every woman in the workforce will have a detrimental effect on society, but I'll spare you. This is not to say that there are no professions where women cannot be accommodated, predominantly those involving working with children.

Mindlog:

The focus should be on human capital development, let the girl child be empowered to aspire. Them going to school to become nurses, teachers, doctors, lawyers etc do not in any way diminish their identity. Even daughters of Northern elites do get the education before marriage, am yet to read where the daughters of Atiku, Buhari etc got married off when they were adolescents, I guess Zahra Buhari-Indimi who got married after her university education or her sister, Halima Buhari-Sheriff who is a lawyer are less mentally matured because they didn't get married as adolescents.

Girl education to the possible highest level has benefitted my family thus my advocacy.

This is not about identity. You seem to have lost the thread of the argument. Let me recap in summary form:

The question was why there is a lot of child marriage in the north. My response was that because they are mentally ready to do so at an age that would be considered children in other places where they are made to spend more time in school, thereby hindering their mental preparation for marriage. Those who already do not go to school, do not face that constraint. In no way did I advocate that female children be prevented from going to school when there is an opportunity to do so. However, I pointed out that I do not believe that marriage should be age restricted for those who are already not in school, or unlikely to have the means to continue with schooling to a reasonable profession.

Now that I've outlined what the discussion is about, I'm sure it will be clear to you that your argument in this comment is irrelevant. You seem to be chasing a thread of thought that is far from what I'm proposing. Clearly, the elite are able to put their children in the best schools and make them continue their education to a reasonable profession, therefore they do not fall within my proposition...those who do not have access to good schools. In any case, even the people you mentioned have no use for their degrees nor can you show me how their degrees empower them in any way.


And in any case, marriage does not mean the end of education. It is very possible to continue ones education while married. I got married while doing my PG to a lady in 200L. She not only completed her degree, she is presently more qualified academically than I am. Rather than advocate for late marriages; an immorally inclined advocacy that is doomed to failure; I would advice rather that you advocate for continuing education institutions to cater for women especially, after marriage.

It's not just northern Nigeria. Many regions marry young, especially in East and North Africa, the Far East, India/Pakistan, etc. Even in the US and the EU, 13 or 14 year olds; especially women; can and do marry with parental or public authority consent. Maturity can come at any time. It depends on the individual. One thing is true, I noticed that females in the North tend to mature emotionally much faster than those in the South. It's the same with rural Vs urban differences in maturity. It's because we force females to remain mentally immature by keeping them in schools that encourage immaturity.

EU Law states that
‘In all Member States, the minimum age required for marriage coincides with the age of majority and is set at 18 years – with the exception of Scotland, where the age of marriage is 16 years, which is also the age of majority’

https://www.ohchr.org/sites/default/files/Documents/Issues/Women/WRGS/HumanitarianSettings/EuropeanUnionFundamentalRightsAgency.docx#:~:text=In%20all%20Member%20States%2C%20the,also%20the%20age%20of%20majority.

In the US, it’s legal but that’s only with special judicial approval.