The problem these people are having is that every aspect of old Benin kingdom was documented by independent European eyewitnesses for centuries, which makes it easier for any serious Benin history researcher to expose their lies.

Their simple mission is to miseducate less informed Nigerians and some Edo people. The reason is simple, European eyewitness accounts of yoruba history only started in 1824. Even at that, they have changed what the Europeans saw and wrote about them, for example, the Europeans met the Alaafin as king of yoruba people, today that position has been changed to the Ooni. They can do as they wish with their history but they should stay out of Benin history.

UGBE634:
Imagine female Obas of Benin, these People will never fail to surprise anyone

Below was the burial of an Oba of Benin as witnessed by the Europeans.


"Among others, there is in the kingdom of Benin an ancient custom, observed to the present day, that when the king dies, the people all assemble in a large field, in the centre of which is a very deep well, wider at the bottom than at the mouth. They cast the body of the dead king into this well, and all his friends and servants gather round, and those who are judged to have been most dear to and favoured by the king (this includes not a few, as all are anxious for the honour) voluntarily go down and keep him company. When they have done so, the people place a great stone over the mouth of the well, and remain by it day and night. On the second day a few deputies remove the stone, and ask those below what they know, and if any of them have already gone to serve the king; and the reply is, No. On the third day the same question is asked, and someone then replies that so-and-so, mentioning a name, has been the first to go, and so-and-so the second. It is considered highly praiseworthy to be the first, and he is spoken of with the greatest admiration by all the people, and considered happy and blessed. After four or five days all these unfortunate people die. When this is apparent to those above, since none reply to their questions, they inform their new king; who causes a great fire to be lit near the well, where numerous animals are roasted. These are given to the people to eat, and he with great ceremony is declared to be the true king, and takes the oath to govern well." - From the account of a 'Voyage from Lisbona to the island of San Thomé south of the Equator, described by a Portuguese pilot, and sent to his magnificence Count Rimondo della Torre, gentleman of Verona, and translated from the Portuguese into Italian', published in Giovanni Battista Ramusio (1550), and retranslated by Blake (1942), i, pp. 150-1. The account was written in about the year 1540, according to Blake, and 'the author may have been one of the scores of Portuguese pilots who at this time were familiar with the navigation from Lisbon to the island of São Thomé'. - From the book Nigerian Perspectives (2nd ed.) by Thomas Hodgkin

4. “No human remains or artifacts of Benin culture were found in six burials excavated at Arun-Oba-Ado”

The source for this conclusion being Frank Willett’s article in the book The African Iron Age, P. L. SHINNIE, (ed.)

Credit: PhysicsMHD

UGBE634:
At what point did it now change to Edo, if it was called Ado by the Binis themselves, what now affected our speech form.

We have already dealt with this few years back. Infact they even created two sites, one for male obas of Benin and another for female Obas of Benin. These guys always come up with these lies, when these lies are exposed, they come back later with modified version of their lies.

Olu317:
Just imaging your interpretation of what Alake said ? Hatred will not kill you Edo lying e warriors.

How is Alake Junior to Oloyo or Oba Bini ? In your falsehood, thought, military might is what makes a bonafide king greater than the other ?

Rather than posting gibberrish in this thread, it is advisable you post information on Pa Idu history,and not bring in views you do not have knowledge on because a king made statement on politics. Go learn and educate yourself .

Can Edo stand without Yoruba Race ? Can Oba Bini openly support disconnect between Yoruba ileife and his Kingdom ?

Seriously,your purpose on Culture Thread is quite questionable because you should this view of your on Politics thread.

I just wonder, reason you have not shed more light on Pa Idu as the pioneer man in your history . Hopefully, let us learn Edo historical information without controversy.

The bolded is an insult to Edo people, let me quickly take you down historical lane.

1. In pre colonial Nigeria, Edo as a stand alone kingdom/empire was the dominant force for centuries in what later become Nigeria.

2. Edo kingdom/empire stood for over 900 years until the British destroyed and forced her into the a creation of theirs....the Western Region of Nigeria.

3. Before this force marriage between the people of old Benin kingdom and yoruba nations, the Oba of Benin had no equal let alone a senior. Who was the Alake historically? The closest yoruba oba that was mentioned in the same book as the oba of Benin was the Alaafin, who the British met on ground as the king of the yoruba people in 1824. In that mention, the Alaafin informed the British that he has requested help from the Oba of Benin to send his military to come and help him the Alaafin to put down his rebellious neighbours.

4. When it became apparent in 1959 that the British was about to exit Nigeria, Oba of Benin and his people began to negotiate with the British to separate from the western region which they were forced into.

5. Awolowo who initially agreed to the separation pre independence, reneged after independence. The Oba of Benin had to pull all strings from both Eastern and northern regions and eventually got his people out of the western region in 1963.

6. The mid West remains the only region/state in Nigeria till date that was democratically created, others Before and after were created by fiat.

7. The Edo people are the ones that have consistently shown that their history have nothing to do with Yoruba history.

8. Finding ourselves in this contraption called Nigeria with so called majority tribes who know very little about good governance and organisational skills have dragged us backward. The old Benin kingdom was known worldwide for her organisational and artistic skills. Today what is Nigeria known for?

9. In the little time we were allowed to govern ourselves, Bendel became number one, many of us old enough still remember the days of up Bendel and Bendel number one with nostalgia.


Yes Edo can do without yoruba, it's yoruba that cannot do without Benin history.

UGBE634:
Minority wey get history wey una dae try to thief we full ground. We ve frustrated your sister out of here. In strength and in weakness, we will frustrate anyone trying to steal the heritage of our fathers. We have the zeal and just about the right numbers to match you guys

Like if any Benin person will even care about you guys if you don't try to steal our civilization and history

The pains the guys are going through must be unimaginable with all their so called majority population, Benin history cannot be discussed alongside theirs in the international community. It's Benin history they are teaching their children in United Kingdom schools

Benin will continue to be over 400 years older than their paperweight fairytales. Documentations of Benin history by the Europeans started late 1400s. The Europeans first step their foot into yoruba land in 1824.

Whilst Benin have over 6000 artefacts across the world to back up her history, they have nothing to back up their lies. Their so called historical fairytales ends here in Nigeria, they are nothing but local champions.

AreaFada2:

Benin City's development was badly thwarted from 1983 until mid 2007. When military governors without ties to Edo and the very poor performing Lucky were in charge. Marwa that performed well is a Lagos boy (early education in SE and SW, like many military kids) despite his Northern origin. Before people quote his example in Lagos.

Before that, Benin was a pivotal political and meeting City in 9ja with Lagos, Ibadan, Enugu, Lagos, Kaduna and Kano. That Benin always had many hotels and bars is due to its history of hosting many guests and travellers. Kaduna Nzeogwu's retirement dream was to have a nice hotel in Benin, according to his friend OBJ and others.

Benin is very strategic in location and a visionary governor can do a lot with it. But most of our people in 9ja care mostly about today. Vision and future are too farfetched. Poverty for some and greed for others are the main reasons.

Obaseki seems to be on the right track with his policies. Hopefully he will put plans in place for continuity.

BanyXchi:
'You can not give what you don't have' coming from a delusi0nal clown

ASAPFERG1 nothing we no go see for this forum loool.

I feel your pains, but the inflicted pains are not intentional but because some of you have refused to stay on your lanes.

UGBE634:
The Benins disagree strongly, this is not what we know, this is not what we are used to, All Ogisos in Benin were local Benin men from the various Ancient Benin communities, we had over 40 Ogisos,none came from Ife, you can come to Benin and interview those normal laymen on the street,at least 70 years and above, we usually had moonlight stories then, none was ever told this Ogiso from Ife story. So it is a formation, a creation of sort, an attempt to subdue the Benin history and covet it for themselves , no one will support your history of Ogisos from Ife, I can bet my life on it, this is not what our fathers told us. This is yoruba writing our history for us. Till date I have still not accepted the coming of Oronmiyan into Benin as full yoruba, when the place was not conquered, the late Oba has a rebuttal to that, it is also written. If you guys were sharing individuals to be kings, why did you not share up to Igboland or Asaba. You people seem to write a lot about Benin trying to steal our civilization because precolonially you had none close to it. If you people were so productive and useful, you would have built other civilizations bigger than Benin but no you guys don't have.

Banyxchi-You are young here, you dont really know how these people dragged us over the years. Discrediting Benin history and civilization. There was a time I complained of it even, and it reduced to an extent

You cannot give what you don't have, the yoruba are trying to claim what they were never able to achieved. This will only intensify as more of them become aware of what Benin represents in world history and black civilisation in the world.

Benin is acclaimed to be the best example of black civilisation, others such as Egypt is tainted and intertwined with Arabic civilisation. So for everyone black man on earth, it's Benin first.

Most people in Benin city who haven't travelled out of Nigeria to places like Europe and America have no idea of the importance of Benin to the world and black race. Yoruba people who had a head start of travelling to the west took advantage and started writing books to claim Benin as yoruba civilisation.

I never knew the importance of Benin history until I left Nigeria, I always thought it was a local history. Unfortunately some Benin people are being miseducated by Yoruba writers. You detect the passion for which some of us outside the country make our contributions. You need to visit the Africa sections of Western museums to fully understand what our ancestors achieved. This is why we feel insulted when their efforts are being undermined by those without history outside fairytales.

Like you said, the stories and lies written by the yoruba and their supporters don't resonate and not in agreement with our oral history and traditions.

Ologbo147:
It is a lie o, Benin city is certainly more than 2,300 km square, it should be around 2,800km square now. it is a process in the next five years Benin city would have expanded into Ekiadolor strongly and eaten her up greatly urbanizing her. With the Plans Obaseki has in place, Benin city would increase to about 4,000 km square strongly in ten years, eaten up Abudu on the eastern flank just the way she has eaten up Idogbo. As the centre gets filled up, there is a continuous sprawl into neighbouring communities, there is no vacuum in nature. I understand your point that we should have made plans for the furthest communities, it is What it is. As he said, Benin city is like lagos now, a town of towns, a wildfire.

Every comedian now is coming to Benin city for shows, the financial strength of Benin city today can only be matched by lagos.

Ologbo is on the southern flank and at most, seven years, Benin city must have eaten Ologbo

You are very current with what is going on, those that understand what Benin City is about turn into is already positioning themselves to take huge advantage. Lagos is the only pointer to a future Benin city in Nigeria. Like I said before, there is no city in the south east has big as Benin City, no city in south south as big as Benin city, only Ibadan is bigger in south west besides Lagos, only Kano is bigger than Benin city in the North. Benin-city is currently the fourth largest city in Nigeria, only Lagos will be able to compete with her in the next 20 years with Obaseki's plans being implemented.

Ekiadolor Road is being done to link up with old Akure Road.

As a result of Obaseki's reforms, Edo Igr have grown from about 3 billion naira under Lucky Igbinedion to abou 40 billion with a projection of 60 billion naira next year, 50% increase in a year. Unfortunately for some indigines, very few actually understand what is going on, all the big guys are already landing from Lagos. The second phase of Benin city reborn (home for elites, mostly second homes for none resident business people) is already sold out with four more on the pipeline in various design stages.

The guy that brought shoperite to Nigeria said his Jara stores in Benin City is the second most profitable stores in Nigeria after Lagos.

Benin city passport office is the second busiest in Nigeria after Lagos according to the interior minister.

Edo state recently worn the best state with independent power project in Nigeria and this is even before 24 hours Ossiomon power get to private individuals, currently most industries and few private individuals are already enjoying 24 hours power supply from Ossiomon power.

Plans are in place in the immediate to complete the Benin city bypass making the inner city a 40 miles radius. The current distance from the centre of the city to the halve that has been completed is 20 miles, you can check this out on Google map, when fully completed, one end to the other will be 40 miles.

Benin city to Lagos is 196.6 miles. There are plans in place to extend inner Benin city to 40 miles, about a fifty the distance from Benin city to Lagos.

More Benin people with the resources will continue to see Benin as first choice irrespective of the number of extra local government areas created in Edo south, Benin city will only grow out into other Edo south towns.

UGBE634:


Look at Esan west, They have just two towns there, Iruekpen and Ekpoma,it is just 512 km square far smaller than Urhonigbe. look at how fairly developed they are, and their populace reside there because it gives them a sense of belonging and it is independent from Benin city, as a result they build their houses there.
Benin-city would never expand into Urhonigbe, Ugo, Okada or Ehor, let's call a spade a spade.what is bad is bad, Let us not sugar coat things. These communities are so far off, it would have been better they develop from their town and then merge with Benin city. Let us analyze these things, Benin city proper is Oredo, Egor,Ikpoba okha, quite alright it has expanded Uhuwonde and Ovia north east. But it has only expanded a bit into them, at most ten percent, it would take a while for Benin city to expand into them fully, maybe 100 years or more,

Benin city proper- 1200 km square
Other towns she has expanded into, at most 1,100 km square of land, that would make her in all her years of expansion cover only about 12 percent of land in these two local government in Edo south

Uhuwonde- 2000 km square
Orhiowmon-2,300km square
Ovia north east- 2300 km square
Ovia south west- 2800 km square

In all of Benin city's glory, she would at most be the size of Ovia north east, in all her years of expansion, there are about 8,500 kilometers untouched land she would not expand into even in 100 years and it is a long time ahead. It would have been better these local government are created and they merge at the centre. Urhobo is about 5000 km square, and they have about 9 local government, look at how developed almost of Urhobo land is, and Benin land with about 8,000 kilometers of land with the exception of Igbanke, Ijaws and some itsekiri communities, are just seven local government area housing these strange communities alongside even.

Edo south aside Benin city is the most "unurban" in the whole of the south south. And these are as a result of lack of local government in these areas that needed it. An Abraka man can stay in his Abraka, and not feel he is missing out anything when he is not in Sapele, the same thing with a man from Ughelli. The same thing with a man from Igueben would not feel he is missing out when he is not in Ekpoma. The importance of a local government for the over 30 years span that it would have been created cannot be underestimated. It would have spiralled development faster, and it would have led to Investment from the populace and building of houses and all.


An Urhonigbe man would not build a house in his place anymore because his mighty town with a ring road is relegated into two wards when it is more than qualified for a local government, and it is called "Igue" which means village in Edo dialect. He will instead build in Benin city, the same with the other towns in Edo south. Some of these towns are so far from Benin- city that it is safe to say I would have died before expansion gets there.

Look at the grace she enjoyed when she was a local government headquarter, just imagine what she would enjoy when she is made a local government. Nobody would want to invest in a two ward town, it is not promising

Okada would not even need Igbinedion's help f she was a separate local government alongside with the school that is there

Oredo is not the only local government area in Edo south, what is holding the rest back. Like I said before Benin city will always be a huge magnet for Benin people and others, irrespective of how many local government areas you create out of Edo south Benin city will continue to be a huge cultural centre for every Benin person and all want to live there if they can afford it. There are numerous Benin diaspora from various local government that can develop their local communities but instead choose Benin City.

I don't know how well you know Benin 30 years ago, Benin city in the last thirty years have almost double in size and this is mostly because numerous Benin people in diaspora have become rich and pouring resources into the centre of their culture. A Benin person who can afford it will rather build a house in Benin city first before there local government, the same doesn't apply to other tribes.

It is Benin city first to the average Benin person irrespective of which local government he or she comes from. Esan, Urhobo, Afemai or Ika don't have such. A Benin person can have a house or multiple houses in Benin city and be satisfied without having any in his local government area. An Esan man will first think of building in his locality before venturing outside. Every Benin person wants to live in Benin city, creation of more local government areas in Edo south won't charge that. Edo south already have local government areas that are overshadowed by Benin city because Benin city is the cultural centre of Edo state.

If most Urhonigbe indigines in diaspora decide to build their houses in Urhonigbe, the place will develop.

Places like Amagba, oka, idogbo, Obagie, etc were all villages about 20 years ago. They are now flourishing towns, mostly because of Edo in diaspora investments in these areas, government is only trying to catch up now. All the Urhonigbe, okada, Ehor, etc in diaspora are the ones expanding developing Benin city into neighbouring villages, if they put similar efforts into their towns, they will be develop. Similar thing is happening in Lagos. If all Igbo that have helped to develop Lagos and Abuja, agree to develop a part of Igbo land, that land will be more develop than Lagos and Abuja even without federal government inputs.

UGBE634:
It was at this period, Ekiti state was later created in the south west, Ekiti state was created in 1996 . Ekiti state would have been agemates with the afemesan state. When you read that write up, you can see that the Otaru was lamenting heavily and fingered Anenih for it. https://guardian.ng/sunday-magazine/otaru-of-auchi-how-we-lost-out-in-the-bid-to-create-afemesan-state/&ved=2ahUKEwjpk5Ot_OL0AhWNxYUKHfaDDmoQFnoECAQQAQ&usg=AOvVaw0LaFfDTyS-rnpL90Yyv0Qu

They did a ballot thing to choose between Esan and Etsako who will get the state capital and The first governor. The lots of the first governor fell on Esan people and the lots of capital fell on Etsako. Me I am fingering this as the reason why the state was not created, Anenih a strong Uromi man would not have allowed the capital of the new state go to Auchi when Uromi was there, and the position of governor was even rotational. He was able to convince them,(Esan traditional rulers to pull out. The Otaru clearly knew who did him wrong. The Oba did not play a major role here.

My focus is on the creation of local government which would have enabled development in several towns aside Benin city that Oba Eredieuwa was against.
Towns like Okada, Iguobazuwa, Ekiadolor, Ugo, Urhonigbe Abudu, Ehor, etc. You cannot compare Okada to any of the five major towns in Esanland , I have been there, they are fairly developed and inhabitable.

But the Oba did not allow the creation of more local government which would have championed development in these towns, because he knew with some form of independence and development, many of them would have charted their own course and history, e.g Okaevbo of Urhonigbe, the Olu-awure of Usen, the Esama of Benin with Okada and others. "Baba iri edo", has become a major slogan in other towns in Benin Kingdom. There is no place in Edo south,aside Benin city that a young promising Bini man can stay to live ,and hustle aside Benin city, which would not have been the case if more local government were created. These are the issues. The Oba of Benin in the early nineties in the bid to protect his interest did us wrong. It is even now that Obaseki has seen the wrong done to us, and is trying to decongest the city and create 14 new mini cities in Edo south and beyond that is at least enough for inhabitation.

In theory the creation of more local government areas and even states are supposed to take more development to the people however in Nigeria these were nothing but a way to share the national resources amongst the elites. How much development has come to the current 776 local government areas in the country, how many of the mushrooms states can survive without federal allocations.

Benin is the 4th largest city in Nigeria. Benin city is like Lagos. Even if Edo south were to have 20 local government areas, chances are all the local government chairmen will be resident in Benin City. How many Edo south local government chairmen past and present have houses in their local government.

Benin City has expanded into atleast 5 of the local government areas in Edo south, with a city like Benin, it can only grow to consume all around her. Benin city has all the trappings of a mega city, like Lagos but have not attracted the kind of federal resources that built Lagos and Kano, but without an international airport, Benin city international passport office is the second busiest in Nigeria behind Lagos. Imagine if Edo was receiving the kind of allocations Rivers, Bayelsa, Akwa Ibom and Delta are receiving.

Benin will only grow more because of Obaseki's policies, with two modular refineries already completed, another two in the pipeline, Ossiomon independent power plant to provide 24 hours power supply to households and businesses being finalised, 1200km of fibre optics broadband Internet around the state, etc. When Benin city finally picked up, even city like warri, Agbor in Delta will loose their populations to Benin City. How many Benin people live in Delta state compared to Deltans living in Benin city.

My point is that with a city like Benin around, all other local government will at best be a country side for quiet living. People will always be attracted to cities like Benin.

The south east have five state and millions of resourceful people but none of their cities is as big as Benin city or Lagos, there are something Benin City have that only few locations in Nigeria have. The richest Igbo people and Nigerians leave in Lagos and the richest Edo south people will continue to leave Benin City which will continue to affect the rapid development of other areas Edo south local government areas except there are deliberate policies by government to open up these areas like what was done by yhe federal government in Abuja.

Finally, creation of more states or local government areas does not automatically means development of these areas, government policies is what developed an area. Lucky Igbinedion could have easily turn okada into developed town if he had the right policies in place. Today Obaseki in working on about 20 cities around Edo south in the state master plan, he didn't wait for this areas to become local government areas first.

AreaFada2:

That's how they play dirty when they cannot logically argue. We are not dragging anything o. But others should stop claiming that we took this and that from them, they first called us this and that name, we took the name for this or that animal, from them.

Very true, as e dey pain dem, e dey sweet us. Oyinbo just can't have enough of Benin. I grew up seeing books on history being written. I often read original manuscripts, edited manuscripts and published books.

So those without such background or any particular history of /interest in seeking true knowledge but are now using ethnic pride to say nonsense online are wasting time. The more jealous neighbours try to undermine us, the more we grow worldwide. 9ja's expiry date is coming ever loser. Soon enough we won't have any reason to argue anything. We already have a history and culture to build on worldwide.

I only come to Nairaland to banter and laugh these days.

In real life, there are very sound and reasonable people from East and West. I have monarchs who are relatives in SW. They know their historical links with Benin. You will be surprised how well they know the links. More than some Benin people even. But these are people of true old royal lineages, educated and well-travelled. Others are also from leading aristocratic families mostly.

Those people who overzealously insult and deride Benin have no status in their land. If they claim they are from Royal families, it's from the likes Oyetola hurriedly created in Osun to set trap for the dancing senator.

I am prepared to visit and take anybody on a tour of those places in SW. Anybody who can talk should be able to show it in action in real life. If not, that person is a mere riff-raff.

You are right, Nairaland is just for a laugh and fun, Benin history is world history. Nigeria definitely have an expiring date, the country cannot continue like this, there is going to be a major restructuring or everyone go their separate way.

AreaFada2

UGBE634

My account was temporarily suspended, but I was able to read your contributions, well done.

The only point I wanted to add is that Edo/Benin have nothing to drag with any other tribes. Our ancestors have left us a great legacy that the rest of the world are now committing resources to study.

The study of Benin kingdom has now been incorporated into the UK secondary schools curriculum to give all black students irrespective of countries of origin a sense of belonging, inclusion and pride in themselves. Benin kingdom is the only kingdom in Nigeria that have enough authentic materials to be studied.

Whilst Benin history is deliberately being undermine by some of our jealous neighbours, the rest of the world see Benin as the leading light for the black race historically. Locally halve baked scholars can continue to write fictions that the word doesn't take notice off.

https://educationblog.oup.com/secondary/diversifying-history-at-ks3

[quote author=RedboneSmith
[/quote]

AreaFada2:

My brother, it's a collective duty we owe our land, ancestors and people. My ancestors and kinsmen went to war for the land routinely, some proudly celebrated across the kingdom till today with statues and all. So, my part today is just a token compared to what my duty would have been if I lived before 1897.

Oh, Britain has don rather well in that aspect. All they need to do now is return our artifacts with a massive compensation to boot. Aside ancient Egyptian history, Benin is the only still existing African (Egypt of today is 95% Arabs that invaded Old Egypt after demise of Roman Empire, dynasty long gone) people's history covered so well in British primary school history already. It gives British-Edo kids quite a sense of pride when teachers ask them to relate Edo culture, their family tree, morning salutations, etc.

The British saw it live from 1553 and were compelled to call the Imperial Capital a City. Our history is too well rooted and documented in European accounts, drawings and even our refusal to sell slaves. Only ignorant people using modern population politics yarn dust.

You are very correct, outside Nigeria, the Europeans can back up Benin history as authentic because of the written accounts of early European visitors to Benin. I believe some of the Benin artefacts will be returned and other remain to continue to serve as our ambassador to the world and a reminder of our glorious history, I believe both the Edo state government and the palace want some to remain, the governor have suggested that replica of those that will be returned will be made and sent back to various museums.

Over 5000 of Benin artefacts across the world are now online, it's called digital Benin.

https://educationblog.oup.com/secondary/diversifying-history-at-ks3

AreaFada2:
Samuk and UGBE634
Giving it to them wotoporiously.

Very happy to see another generation doing what I have been doing here since around the year 2010/2011. Before that I was an onlooker just reading posts. They got bolder with their falsehood especially our SW people and I had to become active.

Thank God I spent time listening to old people back then and I was exposed to history being debated and written growing up.
Yet, I barely know anything about Benin history, never mind outsiders with far less history of their own.

Thanks for sustaining the battle and for your contributions, hopefully another generation will be inspired to take Edo history more seriously. Whilst history is not being taught in Nigeria schools, the United Kingdom have incorporated aspects of Benin history into their secondary school history studies. I believe Benin history is the only Africa history being taught in some secondary schools in the UK.

UGBE634:
certainly that's why the person sponsoring it used an Old man.

There are numerous Edo words in modern Igbo language but most Igbo are only familiar with the four market days.

Some examples:

Ise- amen in benin

Ise- amen in ibo

Okhorkhor = fowl in Benin

Okuko - fowl in Igbo

Okuta = rock in benin

Okute = rock rick in igbo

Oma---good in Ibo

Oma---good in Bini

Ndo---sorry in Igbo

do---sorry in Bini

Ogbe--quarters in Ibo

Ogbe--quarters in Bini

Ugbo - farm Bini

Ugbo - farm ibo

nkịta - dog in Igbo

Ekita - dog in Benin

And many more.

You did something similar with Urhobo and Edo language in a different thread. You can see how old Edo language are embedded into most southern Nigeria languages.

.

UGBE634:
The man pronouncing it is old, there are some pronunciations,if you watch the video, there Is "go slow" in his speech, and he gets surprised about how those family names sounds. That man can not be less than 70

Now imagine asking some of the younger Benin people to read that list, it will probably sound foreign to them.

UGBE634:
The Benin language is deep, it is not what anyone can define, that's why I normally use pidgin for my translation,and many a times I will still feel I have not pushed my point home enough. There has been scenarios where I will understand somethings in my mind, if I cannot really bring it to bare in english or pidgin, I will just leave it so I will not alter the meaning

Did you notice how some of the family greetings in that YouTube videos you shared sound. When you listen to them being read out, you can hear sounds similar to modern Igbo and modern yoruba words. It seems old Benin goes back to the root of most modern southern Nigeria languages. Most of these family greetings can't be properly pronounced by some present day Benin people and most will struggle with some of the meanings and how they were developed. It's probably only unique to Benin in Nigeria. Some of the titles adopted by past Obas of Benin also have uncommon meanings in modern day Benin/Edo language.

UGBE634:
Do you also know the word Oduma means Lion in Benin. cc samuk.

It just goes back to my earlier point of the older kingdoms of Benin and Igala influencing modern day Igbo. Ovie-Udu also means strong hearted or lion heart in Benin. Ovie-udu, udu, Oduma all references lion in Benin. The root du will seem to be from same Benin and Igala source from antiquity because it seems to have similar meaning in both Benin and Igala. I hope our Igbo friend is learning. imagine people that know nothing about Benin history trying to tell it. The Benin themselves are still scratching the surface of their vast history.

Ogamysamo:

pls what does the idu means in igbo cause it is also an igala word which makes me almost ask if the man in question is an igala man

There are historical point of view that believe old Benin people, Igala and Ife people were part of the same people, this is long before the word Igbo or Yoruba existed, long before modern Igbo and yoruba nations were put together. So in time past, Benin and Igala Kingdoms dominated and influenced southern and middle belt Nigeria. This influence resorted in some similarities in language and culture between modern Igbo and Igala on one hand and modern Igbo and Benin on the other hand. This is why the name Idu may appear in both, Benin, Igala and modern Igbo
so it's lack of historical depth that will make a person say Idu (a name that appears in atleast three languages) is purely an Igbo name.

Old Benin empire had relationship with Igala. An aspect of Igala traditions believe that Benin had a dynasty that lasted about 150 years in Igala land. Old Benin rulers were believed to have made pilgrimages to a Benin shrine in Igala land. The war between Oba Esigie and Attah of Igala is well remembered in Benin oral tradition and was writing about by the Portuguese eyewitness who fought on the side of Benin.

UGBE634:
Yes I know I mean origin, where there are two or more families having the same lineage greetings, it shows strongly that they are related. No matter where they are today in the world. The descendants of the Enogie of Ehor and the Oba of Benin both greets Lamogun. I don't need a soothsayer to be told that the present Enogie of Ehor (that is if there is any dynasty in Ehor before now) descended from the Oba's family even if they are both recognized as separate lineages in the 74 Bini lineage.

I am also aware there is a mighty Eriwmin-Idu shrine in Udo. Most persons I have seen with the La-Idu lineage greeting, are from Udo, that shows the Origin is undeniably Udo, Except for the La-ovbieze lineage, which is not really a lineage, as one can be assimilated into the La-ovbieze group when one becomes an Iyase. The others are essentially brothers and if a lineage is not so large, they will even refuse you marrying from them

Just to add:

I saw a presentation by Imaseun Izoduwa that said that the Oba family didn't begin with Lamogun, that it was acquired from the original owners from Igun Street. Imaseun Izoduwa worked with notable Benin historians. I can't remember what the original oba family greeting was and the Oba that changed it. Imaseun Izoduwa have numerous materials on Benin history, you can compare notes with him if you are interested.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LCaxmPdxQU


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOBY3QxokR0

This is deep, hopefully someone will comprehensively research these individuals family history in the future. Just hearing some of the pronunciations was like listening to a language from antiquity.

.

UGBE634:
I consider Ika igbo, I am a realist.

You have to be careful, being a realist doesn't mean one should negate the facts. Ika will be Igbo if they say so themselves. I recently listened to Atiku Abubakar referring to the entire south as being populated by Igbo and yoruba people. Are you Igbo or yoruba? To the average Northerners, a Southeasterner is either Igbo or yoruba. To the average Southeasterner, all Northerners are Hausa, it's this over simplification that gave birth to the WaZoBia fallacy were everything Nigeria is seen from the tripod of Hausa, yoruba and Igbo.

As advanced has the United Kingdom, they never accept one ethnicity. The Scottish, Welsh and Irish guard their cultural heritage jealously, they even maintain separate national sporting teams and Parliaments. This is the way Nigeria should go. Majority of Ika and Ikwerre don't see themselves as Igbo.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3ANmx2mhOU

UGBE634:
I don't think so, there might just have been a pa Idu. He is certainly one of the father's of Binis oldest families. There is a family in Benin that has Laidu as their mode of greeting. I don't know if this helps in anyway

It would be hard to say there was not a pa Idu when about two solid families that might be in their hundreds of thousands greet La-Idu.

This is Edo language greeting 4 on YouTube, on time stamp 9:35, you will see where the man there talked about the family of Ogiefa greeting La-Idu.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LCaxmPdxQU

This is Edo language greeting 5 on youtube, on time stamp 7:45, you will see where the man there talked about the family or descendants of Idu himself greeting La-Idu.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOBY3QxokR0

Hence it would be hard to say there was not an actual Pa Idu when he has descendants everywhere using his name to show that he was once here and alive. These families are majorly from Udo. One of Binis most ancient community.

He must have been the earliest to settle here in Bini that is why they call him our father pa idu. but his descendants are strong uncontested evidence that he was once alive.

There are more to this things than meet the eye, I believe that's why the Igbos call us Ndi-Idu. The eldest family they met on ground as at the time they related strongly with Benin was this pa Idu. cc samuk

I believe most other Bini indigenous lineages were breakaway lineages from him

Ogiefa family palace is in Benin. Benin history is too deep for some of these guys.

Kc3000:


Negative. The Sarduana of Sokoto was killed by Chukwuma Nzeogwu who is a Bini man from Asaba, according to you all.

Lol ndi ara.

By 1875 Ibos were already migrating to Asaba, they eventually overwhelmed the original Asabans who were not Ibo. Chukwuma Nzeogwo was a descendant of Ibo migrants in then mid West Region. They wanted to extend their overbearing attitude and domination to the North by killing Sarduana and Tafawa Balewa. The North and other Nigerians who foresaw the danger of the Igbos fought back and ensure they lost their political and military positions in Nigeria after the war.

Nnamdi Azikiwe: My Genealogy and Nativity

"Thus, in tracing my paternal lineage, I could say that both parents of my father are direct descendants of Eze Chima. As for me, I can trace my paternal ancestry in this wise: I am the first son of Chukwuemeka, who was the third child and first son of Azikiwe, who was the second son of Molokwu, who was the third son of Ozomaocha, who was the second son of Inosi Onira, who was the fourth son of Dei, the second son of Eze Chima, the founder of Onitsha." SOURCE - Nnamdi A zikiwe: My Odyssey, Chapter I (Spectrum Books, 1970) "My Genealogy and Nativity" p4 "I can trace my maternal ancestry thus: I am the first son of Nwanonaku Rachel Chinwe Ogbenyeanu (Aghadiuno)Azikiwe, who was third daughter of Aghadiuno Ajie, the fifth son of Onowu Agbani, first daughter of Obi Udokwu, the son who descended from five Kings of Onitsha. Five of these rulers of Onitsha were direct lineal descendants of Eze Chima, who led his warrior adventurers when they left Benin to establish the Onitsha city state in about 1748 AD." SOURCE - Nnamdi Azikiwe: My Odyssey, Chapter I (Spectrum Books, 1970) "My Genealogy and Nativity" p5 "One day I asked her (grandmother) the meaning of the word 'Onitsha'. She explained that it had historical significance. The terminology meant one who despised another. It is a contraction of two words, Onini to despise, and Ncha meaning others. So that the two words when joined together mean one who despises others. Then I asked her why we despised others. She patted me on the back and told me that it was due to our aristocratic background and tradition. I insisted that she should explain to me the basis of this supercilious social attitude. She told me that we despised others because we descended from the Royal House of Benin and so regarded ourselves as the superiors of other tribes who had no royal blood in their veins....." "I continued to belabor my grandmother to tell me more of the history and origins of the Onitsha people. She narrated that many many years ago, there lived at Idu (Benin) a great Oba who had many children. Due to a power struggle regarding the right of precedence among princes of the blood and other altercations, there was a civil war in Benin. One day, the supporters of one of the princes insulted and assaulted Queen Asije, the mother of of the Oba of Benin, who was accused of having trespassed on their farmland. Enraged at this evidence of indiscipline and lawlessness, the Oba ordered his war chief and brother, Gbunwala Asije to apprehend and punish the insurgents. In the attempt to penalise them, Chima, the ultimate founder of the Onitsha city-state, a prince of the blood in his own right, led the recalcitrants against his Uncle, Gbunwala. This intensified the civil war which rent the kingdom of Benin in two and led to the founding of Onitsha Ado N'Idu....... ..." "As the great trek from Benin progressed, some did not have the stout heart of the pioneer-warrior, and decided to settle at different places, known today as Onitsha -Ugbo, Onitsha-Olona, Onitsha-Mili, Obior, Issele Ukwu, Ossomari, Aboh, etc..." SOURCE - Nnamdi Azikiwe: My Odyssey, Chapter I (Spectrum Books, 1970) "My Genealogy and Nativity"

Below is what Dr Nnamdi Azikiwe said about Ezechima

Nnamdi Azikiwe: My Genealogy and Nativity
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{Last Update August 2, 2022}
"Thus, in tracing my paternal lineage, I could say that both parents of my father are direct descendants of Eze Chima. As for me, I can trace my paternal ancestry in this wise: I am the first son of Chukwuemeka, who was the third child and first son of Azikiwe, who was the second son of Molokwu, who was the third son of Ozomaocha, who was the second son of Inosi Onira, who was the fourth son of Dei, the second son of Eze Chima, the founder of Onitsha." SOURCE - Nnamdi A zikiwe: My Odyssey, Chapter I (Spectrum Books, 1970) "My Genealogy and Nativity" p4 "I can trace my maternal ancestry thus: I am the first son of Nwanonaku Rachel Chinwe Ogbenyeanu (Aghadiuno)Azikiwe, who was third daughter of Aghadiuno Ajie, the fifth son of Onowu Agbani, first daughter of Obi Udokwu, the son who descended from five Kings of Onitsha. Five of these rulers of Onitsha were direct lineal descendants of Eze Chima, who led his warrior adventurers when they left Benin to establish the Onitsha city state in about 1748 AD." SOURCE - Nnamdi Azikiwe: My Odyssey, Chapter I (Spectrum Books, 1970) "My Genealogy and Nativity" p5 "One day I asked her (grandmother) the meaning of the word 'Onitsha'. She explained that it had historical significance. The terminology meant one who despised another. It is a contraction of two words, Onini to despise, and Ncha meaning others. So that the two words when joined together mean one who despises others. Then I asked her why we despised others. She patted me on the back and told me that it was due to our aristocratic background and tradition. I insisted that she should explain to me the basis of this supercilious social attitude. She told me that we despised others because we descended from the Royal House of Benin and so regarded ourselves as the superiors of other tribes who had no royal blood in their veins....." "I continued to belabor my grandmother to tell me more of the history and origins of the Onitsha people. She narrated that many many years ago, there lived at Idu (Benin) a great Oba who had many children. Due to a power struggle regarding the right of precedence among princes of the blood and other altercations, there was a civil war in Benin. One day, the supporters of one of the princes insulted and assaulted Queen Asije, the mother of of the Oba of Benin, who was accused of having trespassed on their farmland. Enraged at this evidence of indiscipline and lawlessness, the Oba ordered his war chief and brother, Gbunwala Asije to apprehend and punish the insurgents. In the attempt to penalise them, Chima, the ultimate founder of the Onitsha city-state, a prince of the blood in his own right, led the recalcitrants against his Uncle, Gbunwala. This intensified the civil war which rent the kingdom of Benin in two and led to the founding of Onitsha Ado N'Idu....... ..." "As the great trek from Benin progressed, some did not have the stout heart of the pioneer-warrior, and decided to settle at different places, known today as Onitsha -Ugbo, Onitsha-Olona, Onitsha-Mili, Obior, Issele Ukwu, Ossomari, Aboh, etc..." SOURCE - Nnamdi Azikiwe: My Odyssey, Chapter I (Spectrum Books, 1970) "My Genealogy and Nativity"

gregyboy:



I was happy to see the screenshot when am financially bouyant enough i would sponser the publication of this old document to the public....

I don't know why the Palace refuse to do so

This is my dream retracing our history deviod fallacy and myth then we can find the missing link to untie the great edo people again

I had it posted on my status were both the igbos, and the edo and other tribe I have in my contact could see the truth

And igbo girl objected with a 1945 document I just laugh

Please share me the link to the book

I don't think I still have the link, it's been years, but a search on the Internet should yield something.

Logicisfree2:

This should open everybody's eyes to the fact that what we are dealing with is south-easterners trying to grab lands outside their domain. This is all it is. These Igbo revisionists are making up all these stories as a prelude to land-grabbing. We know where they are: southeast.
Do you guys still remember when some of these guys said Irabor was an Igbo name ?
@samuk

Infact they were actually after the entire Nigeria, it was Sadauna of Sokoto resistance in the 1950 that partly resulted in him been killed by Igbo military officers after independence. Since they can no longer dominate northern Nigeria, they are now eyeing the south South. Like I said before Edo and Delta are bigger than the entire south east in size.