CONFUSED !!!
I got this material while trying to answer the January 2008 Biblical Quiz. I became confused. Please can any one help?

Story of The Resurrection
A. At what time in the morning did the women visit the tomb?- At the rising of the sun (Mark 16:2) vs. when it was yet dark (John 20:1)
B. Who came?- Mary Magdalene alone (John 20:1) vs. Mary Magdalene and the other Mary (Matt. 28:1) vs. Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James and Salome (Mark 16:1) vs. Mary Magdalene, Joanna, Mary the mother of James and other women (Luke 24:10)
C. Was the tomb opened or closed when they arrived? - Open (Luke 24:2) vs. closed (Matt 28:1-2)
D. Whom did they see at the tomb?- The angel (Matt. 28:2) vs. a young man (Mark 16:5) vs. two men (Luke 24:4) vs. two angels (John 20:11-12)
E. Were these men or angels inside or outside the tomb? -Outside (Matt. 28.2) vs. inside (Mark 16:5, Luke 24:3-4, John 20:11-12).
F. Were they standing or sitting? - Standing (Luke 24:4) vs. sitting (Matt. 28:2, Mark 16:5, John 20:12).
G. Did Mary Magdalene know Jesus when he first appeared to her?-Yes, she did (Matt. 28:9) vs. no she did not (John 20:14).

Please see more on the attached document

Hallo @Alphazee,

Alphazee:

CONFUSED !!!
I got this material while trying to answer the January 2008 Biblical Quiz.

Lol, glad to know that you had attempted the Quiz as well. Interesting, wasn't it? Be encouraged to send in your entries in time for the next one - who knows, you might be the lucky winner to either bless yourself or someone else!

Alphazee:

I became confused. Please can any one help?

Aww. . . it happenz. But no need to be consfused, really. The one thing you should understand is that, on the surface, they are bound to very quickly rattle your nerves - unless you try and challenge yourself to study the texts and events for yourself and the light will illuminate your heart.

I especially enjoy such confusion contests . . because they challenge me to go back and study the Bible! The more I take up the challenge, the more I see the wisdom of Scripture - and often times, it removes us from entertaining spurious and frivolous "questions", because often times the enquirers are not seeking honest answers.

It may take anyone several entries to clarify all the points raised - but I often love to say to some people who email me: "You may find 50 million contradictions in the Bible if you dare to - afterall, it's a collection of only 66 books! But the love of God in my life cannot be contradicted by any man's confusion!"

Anyhow, let me give you an example of how the seeming "contradictions" all fit perfectly when you carefully follow the events of that resurrection morning.

#1.

Alphazee:

Story of The Resurrection
A. At what time in the morning did the women visit the tomb?- At the rising of the sun (Mark 16:2) vs. when it was yet dark (John 20:1)

Hint: could it be possible that there is a difference between the sets of people who came at "rising of the sun" and those who arrived while it was "yet dark"?

Look at the texts again:

Mark 16:2
And very early in the morning the first day of the week,
they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun.

John 20:1
The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early,
when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone
taken away from the sepulchre.


~ John 20:1 - while it was "yet dark", it was MARY
~ Mark 16:2 - at the "rising of the sun", there were several women (they)

These are small issues that many people miss out and then assume to read into the text what it didn't say! Look again at the part in that quote precisely as they stated it:

[list]#1.

Alphazee:

Story of The Resurrection
A. At what time in the morning did the women visit the tomb?- At the rising of the sun (Mark 16:2) vs. when it was yet dark (John 20:1)

[/list]

By confusing the whole picture, they make it seem as if Mark 16:2 and John 20:1 were both speaking of WOMEN at the same instance! Nope, rather we see that:

~ when MARY went to the sepulchre, it was "yet dark"
~ but when the women got to the sepulchre, it the sun was beginning to rise!

Read the text carefully, and you see that the small things we often take for granted are the very things that people will use to rattle your nerve. I could point out the same mishap in the rest of the quotes; but I hope you get the gist?

All in all, may God bless you in your faith in His blessed Son, Jesus Christ. He truly loves you.

1.
Quote from: Alphazee on Today at 02:14:22 PM
Story of The Resurrection
A. At what time in the morning did the women visit the tomb?- At the rising of the sun (Mark 16:2) vs. when it was yet dark (John 20:1)

Hint: could it be possible that there is a difference between the sets of people who came at "rising of the sun" and those who arrived while it was "yet dark"?

Look at the texts again:

Mark 16:2
And very early in the morning the first day of the week,
they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun.

John 20:1
The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early,
when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone
taken away from the sepulchre.


~ John 20:1 - while it was "yet dark", it was MARY
~ Mark 16:2 - at the "rising of the sun", there were several women (they)

These are small issues that many people miss out and then assume to read into the text what it didn't say! Look again at the part in that quote precisely as they stated it:


#1.
Quote from: Alphazee on Today at 02:14:22 PM
Story of The Resurrection
A. At what time in the morning did the women visit the tomb?- At the rising of the sun (Mark 16:2) vs. when it was yet dark (John 20:1)

By confusing the whole picture, they make it seem as if Mark 16:2 and John 20:1 were both speaking of WOMEN at the same instance! Nope, rather we see that:

~ when MARY went to the sepulchre, it was "yet dark"
~ but when the women got to the sepulchre, it the sun was beginning to rise!

Read the text carefully, and you see that the small things we often take for granted are the very things that people will use to rattle your nerve. I could point out the same mishap in the rest of the quotes; but I hope you get the gist?

All in all, may God bless you in your faith in His blessed Son, Jesus Christ. He truly loves you.

I hope this will put the case at rest except

Rem Olabowale!

@dafidixone,

dafidixone:

I hope this will put the case at rest except

Rem Olabowale!

Lol, it actually doesn't put the case to rest - I consider all the questions quite legitimate, and I do hope to sit down and carefully point out where the "confusion" lies in each case, as well as show the chronology of events on that morning.

One thing the poster should realize is that there are clearly different phases of times and people in each epoch that are mentioned by the four Evangelists. One example has been given already - there is a clear difference between MARY (one person) and the WOMEN (several persons) - but we should not forget that they arrived at the sepulchre at different times [(a) "rising of the sun" and (b) "when it was yet dark". The same thing to observe in the epochs/times and sets/groups of people mentioned in each case - it is a sequence of events, and not a static position like a stilled clip of a movie!

I'd like to look at each case carefully when I have the time to devote to that study.

Shalom.

Lol, it actually doesn't put the case to rest - I consider all the questions quite legitimate, and I do hope to sit down and carefully point out where the "confusion" lies in each case, as well as show the chronology of events on that morning.

One thing the poster should realize is that there are clearly different phases of times and people in each epoch that are mentioned by the four Evangelists. One example has been given already - there is a clear difference between MARY (one person) and the WOMEN (several persons) - but we should not forget that they arrived at the sepulchre at different times [(a) "rising of the sun" and (b) "when it was yet dark". The same thing to observe in the epochs/times and sets/groups of people mentioned in each case - it is a sequence of events, and not a static position like a stilled clip of a movie!

I'd like to look at each case carefully when I have the time to devote to that study.

Shalom.

May God inspire you from above in Jesus name. Amen.

Amen, bros. . . amen! And your blessings ever be full in Jesus' Name!!

Good job Pilgrim and Dafidixone. Good job with the quizzes as well. Remain the blessings that you are

@Alphazee,
let me just give a brief summary to your questions before I go off to school. Perhaps pilgrim would give an explanation of the chronology of the ressurection events later on.

Alphazee:

A. At what time in the morning did the women visit the tomb?- At the rising of the sun (Mark 16:2) vs. when it was yet dark (John 20:1)

Pilgrim has already put forth a detailed explanation for the seeming contradiction. The explanation I had in mind was simply this: are we talking about when they left or when they arrived? In my NIV version the verb for departure in John 20:1 is rendered as 'went'. Likewise in Matthew and Luke (which can both be easily reconciled) NIV records the event as "went". However, Mark  which talked about when "they were on their way" is the one which mentions "after sunrise". So it is very plausible that they women left at dawn, when it was still dark and the sun rose while they were on their way.

B. Who came?- Mary Magdalene alone (John 20:1) vs. Mary Magdalene and the other Mary (Matt. 28:1) vs. Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James and Salome (Mark 16:1) vs. Mary Magdalene, Joanna, Mary the mother of James and other women (Luke 24:10)

Careful there!   John NEVER said Mary Magdalene was alone. True, John, focussed on Mary (simply because she was the first to see the ressurected Lord) the verse actually gives clues as to the fact that she was probably not alone. In verse 2 she says to Peter "they have taken away the Lord out of the tomb, and WE do not know where they have laid him" Note that she said WE there, not I (contrary to verse 18 where she says I), implying that she went with others but did not enter the tomb and left the others there.
So, while some of the accounts mention Mary or mention Mary and a few others, the simple answer is that the women came and that included at least Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of Jesus, Salome, Joanna and probably with a few others.

C. Was the tomb opened or closed when they arrived? - Open (Luke 24:2) vs. closed (Matt 28:1-2)

Again, careful! Matthew never said that the tomb was closed when the women arrived. Rather, it was closed when the angels arrived. Matthew alone recorded an event that happened while the women were on their way and by the time the women got there, Matthew 28: 2-4 had already taken place. This can easily be gleaned from the other accounts.

D. Whom did they see at the tomb?- The angel (Matt. 28:2) vs. a young man (Mark 16:5) vs. two men (Luke 24:4) vs. two angels (John 20:11-12)

I'm happy you didn't use the word "only" here. They saw two angels. All through the bible we do see angels appear to people sometimes as men. There is no confusion there. Likewise, Mark and Matthew focussed on one of the angels, they never said there was ONLY ONE angel. The fact that there were two was clarified by Luke and John.

E. Were these men or angels inside or outside the tomb? -Outside (Matt. 28.2) vs. inside (Mark 16:5, Luke 24:3-4, John 20:11-12).

This is really inconsequential. They could be outside one minute and go inside the next. However, like I explained earlier, Matt. 28:2-4 talks about a different thing than the rest, it talks about the arrival of the angels and the encounter the guards had with them, after this, they went inside as is obvious from the other accounts.

F. Were they standing or sitting? - Standing (Luke 24:4) vs. sitting (Matt. 28:2, Mark 16:5, John 20:12).

Again, no offence but this is really of no consequence. There are two easy explanations that come to mind. First, Luke didn't say 'standing', it says 'stood'. There's a difference. Stood as a verb could imply that they were sitting and then stood.
However, the explanation I'm more in agreement with simply has to do with the Greek word "epihistemi" that was translated as "stood before". It can also easily be translated as "to appear before". It is the same word used in Acts 12:7, NASB rendered it there as "suddenly appeared", NIV as "appeared". So you see, quite easily, that account can be rendered as "appeared to" them. This is more obvious when you consider that the angels DID NOT appear to Peter and John in John 20 when they looked into the tomb, even though the "appeared to" Mary when she looked moments later.

G. Did Mary Magdalene know Jesus when he first appeared to her?-Yes, she did (Matt. 28:9) vs. no she did not (John 20:14).

Again, careful. Was Mary Magdalene with the other women when the other women left the tomb? A lot of things had happened between Matt. 28:1 and Matt. 28:9. Verse 9 did not specifically mention Mary, it only mentions "the women". Are Matthew and John referring to the very same events?
From John 20: 1-2, we can infer that she left the others at the tomb and went to inform the disciples.
Furthermore, John 20:18 where Mary said I rather than WE let's us know that she was not with other women when the Lord appeared to her.
Beyond that, shortly before Mary saw Jesus, she was crying (see John 20:11 and 15) - on the other hand, shortly before the women saw Jesus (see Matt. 28:8 ) they were "filled with joy". In fact, one can assume that it was because she was weeping that she did not initially recognize Jesus.
Yet again, the women "hurried away from" (Matt. 28:8 ) the tomb after they saw the angels whearas Mary "stood (or remained) outside the tomb" (John 20:11) - the contrast could not be clearer.
Thus, obviously, Matthew and John aren't referring to the exact same events. Mary was most likely NOT with the women when the women saw the Lord in Matthew 28. And the event in John happened before the event in Matt. 28, as can be inferred from Mk. 16:9.

Hope that helped. Please try not to find out about the bible from skeptic and atheist websites and do try to engage in careful study yourself. Like Pilgrim said, see those 'seeming discrepancies' as challenges that you can take to the Lord in study and prayer. Cheers

Hope that helped. Please try not to find out about the bible from skeptic and atheist websites and do try to engage in careful study yourself. Like Pilgrim said, see those 'seeming discrepancies' as challenges that you can take to the Lord in study and prayer. Cheers

Annointing of God on you will never run dry in Jesus name.
Shallom!

@ricadelide,

Thank you for not waiting to share your thoughts. The soul you feed today will account to your heavenly reward in many folds. Great entry!


- - - - - - - - -

@dafidixone,

dafidixone:

Annointing of God on you will never run dry in Jesus name.
Shallom!

Amen O! Amen!


_{PS. I've sent "it" to your e-box!}

@poster

You need to know that God is not the author of confusion.

I didnt read your post thoroughly but if you are confused go to God. study the word and pray. There you will find answers to all lifes problems.

God bless

Thank you all for trying to clarify some of the issues that got me confused. But there are still some more,

Was Jesus peaceable?
• John 14:27 "Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you."
• Acts 10:36 "The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ."
• Luke 2:14 " . . . on earth peace, good will toward men."
vs.
• Matthew 10:34 "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man's foes shall be they of his own household."
• Luke 22:36 "Then said he unto them, . . . he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one."

Was Jesus trustworthy?
• John 8:14 "Though I bear record of myself, yet my record is true."
vs.
• John 5:31 "If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true."
"Record" and "witness" in the above verses are the same Greek word (martyria).

Are we punished for our parents' sins?
• Exodus 20:5 "For I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation." (Repeated in Deuteronomy 5:9)
• Exodus 34:6-7 " . . . The Lord God, merciful and gracious, . . . that will by no means clear the guilty; visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children, unto the third and to the fourth generation."
• I Corinthians 15:22 "For as in Adam all die, . . ."
vs.
• Ezekiel 18:20 "The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father."
• Deuteronomy 24:16 "The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin."

Is God good or evil?
• Psalm 145:9 "The Lord is good to all."
• Deuteronomy 32:4 "a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he."
vs.
• Isaiah 45:7 "I make peace and create evil. I the Lord do all these things." See "Out of Context" for more on Isaiah 45:7.
• Lamentations 3:38 "Out of the mouth of the most High proceedeth not evil and good?"
• Jeremiah 18:11 "Thus saith the Lord; Behold, I frame evil against you, and devise a device against you."
• Ezekiel 20:25,26 "I gave them also statutes that were not good, and judgments whereby they should not live. And I polluted them in their own gifts, in that they caused to pass through the fire all that openeth the womb, that I might make them desolate, to the end that they might know that I am the Lord."

Should we kill?
• Exodus 20:13 "Thou shalt not kill."
• Leviticus 24:17 "And he that killeth any man shall surely be put to death."
vs.
• Exodus 32:27 "Thus sayeth the Lord God of Israel, Put every man his sword by his side, . . . and slay every man his brother, . . . companion, . . . neighbor."
• I Samuel 6:19 " . . . and the people lamented because the Lord had smitten many of the people with a great slaughter."
• I Samuel 15:2,3,7,8 "Thus saith the Lord . . . Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass. . . . And Saul smote the Amalekites . . . and utterly destroyed all the people with the edge of the sword."
• Numbers 15:36 "And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the Lord commanded Moses."
• Hosea 13:16 "they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with children shall be ripped up."
For a discussion of the defense that the Commandments prohibit only murder, see "Murder, He Wrote", chapter 27 (Losing Faith In Faith: From Preacher To Atheist).
Should we tell lies?
• Exodus 20:16 "Thou shalt not bear false witness."
• Proverbs 12:22 "Lying lips are an abomination to the Lord."
vs.
• I Kings 22:23 "The Lord hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the Lord hath spoken evil concerning thee."
• II Thessalonians 2:11 "And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie."
Also, compare Joshua 2:4-6 with James 2:25.
Should we steal?
• Exodus 20:15 "Thou shalt not steal."
• Leviticus 19:13 "Thou shalt not defraud thy neighbor, neither rob him."
vs.
• Exodus 3:22 "And ye shall spoil the Egyptians."
• Exodus 12:35-36 "And they spoiled [plundered, NRSV] the Egyptians."
• Luke 19:29-34 "[Jesus] sent two of his disciples, Saying, Go ye into the village . . . ye shall find a colt tied, whereon yet never man sat: loose him, and bring him hither. And if any man ask you, Why do ye loose him? thus shall ye say unto him, Because the Lord hath need of him. . . . And as they were loosing the colt, the owners thereof said unto them, Why loose ye the colt? And they said, The Lord hath need of him."
I was taught as a child that when you take something without asking for it, that is stealing.
Shall we keep the sabbath?
• Exodus 20:8 "Remember the sabbath day to keep it holy."
• Exodus 31:15 "Whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death."
• Numbers 15:32,36 "And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day. . . . And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the Lord commanded Moses."
vs.
• Isaiah 1:13 "The new moons and sabbaths, the calling of assemblies, I cannot away with; it is iniquity."
• John 5:16 "And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day."
• Colossians 2:16 "Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holy-day, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days."
Shall we make graven images?
• Exodus 20:4 "Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven . . . earth . . . water."
• Leviticus 26:1 "Ye shall make ye no idols nor graven image, neither rear you up a standing image, neither shall ye set up any image of stone."
• Deuteronomy 27:15 "Cursed be the man that maketh any graven or molten image."
vs.
• Exodus 25:18 "And thou shalt make two cherubims of gold, of beaten work shalt thou make them."
• I Kings 7:15,16,23,25 "For he [Solomon] cast two pillars of brass . . . and two chapiters of molten brass . . . And he made a molten sea . . . it stood upon twelve oxen . . . [and so on]"

Are we saved through works?
• Ephesians 2:8,9 "For by grace are ye saved through faith . . . not of works."
• Romans 3:20,28 "Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight."
• Galatians 2:16 "Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ."
vs.
• James 2:24 "Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only."
• Matthew 19:16-21 "And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? And he [Jesus] said unto him . . . keep the commandments. . . . The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet? Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven."
The common defense here is that "we are saved by faith and works." But Paul said "not of works."

Should good works be seen?
• Matthew 5:16 "Let your light so shine before men that they may see your good works."
• I Peter 2:12 "Having your conversation honest among the Gentiles: that . . . they may by your good works, which they shall behold, glorify God in the day of visitation."
vs.
• Matthew 6:1-4 "Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them . . . that thine alms may be in secret."
• Matthew 23:3,5 "Do not ye after their [Pharisees'] works. . . . all their works they do for to be seen of men."

Should we own slaves?
• Leviticus 25:45-46 "Moreover of the children of the strangers that do sojourn among you, of them shall ye buy, . . . and they shall be your possession . . . they shall be your bondmen forever."
• Genesis 9:25 "And he [Noah] said, Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren."
• Exodus 21:2,7 "If thou buy an Hebrew servant, six years he shall serve: and in the seventh he shall go out free for nothing. . . . And if a man sell his daughter to be a maidservant, she shall not go out as the manservants do."
• Joel 3:8 "And I will sell your sons and your daughters into the hand of the children of Judah, and they shall sell them to the Sabeans, to a people far off: for the Lord hath spoken it."
• Luke 12:47,48 [Jesus speaking] "And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes."
• Colossians 3:22 "Servants, obey in all things your masters."
vs.
• Isaiah 58:6 "Undo the heavy burdens . . . let the oppressed go free, . . . break every yoke."
• Matthew 23:10 "Neither be ye called Masters: for one is your Master, even Christ."
Pro-slavery bible verses were cited by many churches in the South during the Civil War, and were used by some theologians in the Dutch Reformed Church to justify apartheid in South Africa. There are more pro-slavery verses than cited here.

Does God change his mind?
• Malachi 3:6 "For I am the Lord; I change not."
• Numbers 23:19 "God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent."
• Ezekiel 24:14 "I the Lord have spoken it: it shall come to pass, and I will do it; I will not go back, neither will I spare, neither will I repent."
• James 1:17 " . . . the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning."
vs.
• Exodus 32:14 "And the Lord repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people."
• Genesis 6:6,7 "And it repented the Lord that he had made man on the earth . . . And the Lord said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth . . . for it repenteth me that I have made him."
• Jonah 3:10 ". . . and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not."
See also II Kings 20:1-7, Numbers 16:20-35, Numbers 16:44-50.
See Genesis 18:23-33, where Abraham gets God to change his mind about the minimum number of righteous people in Sodom required to avoid destruction, bargaining down from fifty to ten. (An omniscient God must have known that he was playing with Abraham's hopes for mercy--he destroyed the city anyway.)

Does God tempt people?
• James 1:13 "Let no man say . . . I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man."
vs.
• Genesis 22:1 "And it came to pass after these things, that God did tempt Abraham."
Is God peaceable?
• Romans 15:33 "The God of peace."
• Isaiah 2:4 ". . . and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more."
vs.
• Exodus 15:3 "The Lord is a man of war."
• Joel 3:9-10 "Prepare war, wake up the mighty men, let all the men of war draw near; let them come up: Beat your plowshares into swords, and your pruninghooks into spears: let the weak say, I am strong."

@Alphazee,

Alphazee:

Thank you all for trying to clarify some of the issues that got me confused. But there are still some more,

We know there's still more - considering the fact it only shows now that you were never interested in seeking answers.

All the same, here's something to think over: (https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-109269.0.html#msg1902832).

Shalom.