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Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? - Nairaland / General - Nairaland

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Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by dmcdad: 3:52am On Nov 30, 2012
What do you think a lie really is
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by AlterEgoTM: 4:04am On Nov 30, 2012
Iro ni iro n je
Lie na lie undecided
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by dmcdad: 4:06am On Nov 30, 2012
AlterEgo™:
Iro ni iro n je
Lie na lie undecided

Is that what you think? Don't you think there is more to a lie than being a false statement?
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by AlterEgoTM: 4:46am On Nov 30, 2012
dmcdad:

Is that what you think? Don't you think there is more to a lie than being a false statement?
Ok.
Here's what I think: A lie to me, is any statement made, whereby the person making the statement is fully aware that what they are saying is false, erroneous and off the mark, for the singular purpose of deception.

Deception here now bothers on ethical/moral question of motive. That is, the reason for telling a the lie. Which could be for many reasons, ranging from purely deceptive, to cheat, to dupe, to get out of a tricky situation, to achieve a 'greater good' so to say, to avert danger, to implicate someone i.e. false testimony and so on.
In other words, there can be both good and bad reasons to necessitate a lie!

In pure terms, whether the end justifies the means or not, i.e. whether a lie is to told to achieve a good or bad aim (which is subjective), whether the good outweighs the bad or vice-versa, not minding the ulterior motive behind the lie, be it sinister or dextral, irrespective what's to be achieved with the lie, whatever the intention of the liar; A LIE IS A DELIBERATE FALSE STATEMENT!
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by dmcdad: 4:56am On Nov 30, 2012
AlterEgo™:

Ok.
Here's what I think: A lie to me, is any statement made, whereby the person making the statement is fully aware that what they are saying is false, erroneous and off the mark, for the singular purpose of deception.

Deception here now bothers on ethical/moral question of motive. That is, the reason for telling a the lie. Which could be for many reasons, ranging from purely deceptive, to cheat, to dupe, to get out of a tricky situation, to achieve a 'greater good' so to say, to avert danger, to implicate someone i.e. false testimony and so on.
In other words, there can be both good and bad reasons to necessitate a lie!

In pure terms, whether the end justifies the means or not, i.e. whether a lie is to told to achieve a good or bad aim (which is subjective), whether the good outweighs the bad or vice-versa, not minding the ulterior motive behind the lie, be it sinister or dextral, irrespective what's to be achieved with the lie, whatever the intention of the liar; A LIE IS FALSE STATEMENT!

Wow! That's impressive. Let me expose you to the other side of a lie. Don't you think a lie can sometimes be a true statement? Think about this broadly and explore other possibilities...
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by Nobody: 6:41am On Nov 30, 2012
dmcdad:

Wow! That's impressive. Let me expose you to the other side of a lie. Don't you think a lie can sometimes be a true statement? Think about this broadly and explore other possibilities...

Depends. Lies can become truths.. and ignorant ppl can try to be deceptive while in fact they are spouting truth.
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by AlterEgoTM: 6:48am On Nov 30, 2012
dmcdad:

Wow! That's impressive. Let me expose you to the other side of a lie. Don't you think a lie can sometimes be a true statement? Think about this broadly and explore other possibilities...
^^^
Wanna explain that undecided
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by delkuf(m): 6:52am On Nov 30, 2012
A lie is when wht u say is different from the action u carried out
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by dmcdad: 6:57am On Nov 30, 2012
AlterEgo™:

^^^
Wanna explain that undecided

Alright! A lie is a statement, which can be TRUE or FALSE, buh with the intention to decieve. What makes a statement a lie is not the truthfulness or falsefulness of the statement, buh the intention you have in mind for making the statement the way you did. Do you agree?
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by dmcdad: 6:59am On Nov 30, 2012
SniperInADiaper:

Depends. Lies can become truths.. and ignorant ppl can try to be deceptive while in fact they are spouting truth.

That is where a lie comes in..
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by AlterEgoTM: 7:08am On Nov 30, 2012
dmcdad:

Alright! A lie is a statement, which can be TRUE or FALSE, buh with the intention to decieve. What makes a statement a lie is not the truthfulness or falsefulness of the statement, buh the intention you have in mind for making the statement the way you did. Do you agree?
This is still on the borderline of motive.
Whatever the motive is, it still doesn't change the fact of what a lie is, which is a deliberately false statement!
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by Mynd44: 7:19am On Nov 30, 2012
Lie is an alteration of the truth. It is the deviation from the truth is part or full
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by dmcdad: 7:24am On Nov 30, 2012
AlterEgo™:

This is still on the borderline of motive.
Whatever the motive is, it still doesn't change the fact of what a lie is, which is a deliberately false statement!

Nah nah nah... I just want u to understand one thing. The fact that a statement is a lie doesn't necessarily mean the statement must be false. What makes a true statement a lie is the method of presentation.. A true situation might be presented to you in a way as to deceive you buh that doesn't make such situation a false situation. What makes it a lie is your intention for presenting the situation in a way to deceive even though the situation is a true one.
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by AlterEgoTM: 7:37am On Nov 30, 2012
^^^
There's no way around this mate.
Any statement made while deliberately ignoring or sidestepping the truth is a lie!
Whether such is justifiable is subjective and another argument entirely.
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by Mynd44: 7:42am On Nov 30, 2012
AlterEgo™:
^^^
There's no way around this mate.
Any statement made while deliberately ignoring or sidestepping the truth is a lie!
Whether such is justifiable is subjective and another argument entirely.
True. As long as you deviate from the truth, it becomes a lie
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by dmcdad: 7:47am On Nov 30, 2012
Mynd_44:
True. As long as you deviate from the truth, it becomes a lie

This is psychology and not just the mere denotative meaning of a lie... There are certain areas whereby you don't rely on the dictionary meaning to get to the root of such areas. Take temperament for instance, if you take to the dictionary meaning, you'll be misguided buh it goes further and it's also a branch of psychology like eneagram. A lie requires deep thinking while exploring. This was instigated by the great Aristotles...
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by k2039: 7:49am On Nov 30, 2012
Lie is simply not being 100% truthful(not coming out plain and not presenting the case the way it's exactly)

Well Mynd_44,Alterego and sniperinadiaper had succesful trash it out
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by Mynd44: 7:51am On Nov 30, 2012
dmcdad:

This is psychology and not just the mere denotative meaning of a lie... It requires deep thinking while exploring. This was instigated by the great Aristotles...
And from what you posted up there leads to one thing. There is a difference between lying and decieving.

You can be deceived with the truth you know. Deceiving has a lot to do with lying but is not exclusive to lying. You can be deceived with the truth.

Lying on the other hand is any deviation from the truth no matter what the intention behind it is
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by dmcdad: 7:53am On Nov 30, 2012
k2039: Lie is simply not being 100% truthful(not coming out plain and not presenting the case the way it's exactly)

Well Mynd_44,Alterego and sniperinadiaper had succesful trash it out

Does that mean the case is false?
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by dmcdad: 7:55am On Nov 30, 2012
Mynd_44:
And from what you posted up there leads to one thing. There is a difference between lying and decieving.

You can be deceived with the truth you know. Deceiving has a lot to do with lying but is not exclusive to lying. You can be deceived with the truth.

Lying on the other hand is any deviation from the truth no matter what the intention behind it is

My question now is... Does that make the situation false?
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by Mynd44: 7:57am On Nov 30, 2012
Even if you give account of an event and you leave certain parts out, it can be called lying cos those parts can help make a decision. The truth has to be 100% and nothing less
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by Mynd44: 7:59am On Nov 30, 2012
dmcdad:

My question now is... Does that make the situation false?
What situation please?

Lemme get this right
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by k2039: 8:02am On Nov 30, 2012
dmcdad:

Does that mean the case is false?
what case
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by dmcdad: 8:10am On Nov 30, 2012
Deception includes the range of means whereby people may be mislead. The most evident of these is lying. But it also includes withholding information which the person might find of immediate significance, as well as misleading the person into some alternative belief, or reinforcing such a belief. Then there are the more marginal forms of deception, such as evasion, euphemism and exaggeration; and the often unconscious forms of deception (without intention to mislead), such as the subtle changes of subject, the disguises, the gestures leading astray, and silence and inaction. A common temptation is to define a lie as a statement that isn t true. But things are more complicated than this. Telling stories or jokes is not lying, even when falsehoods are involved, at least when the audience knows them for what they are. The same holds for exaggerations that are readily seen to be such. The importance of someone' s intentions has been long recognised by philosophers. St. Augustine argued that a person is to be judged as lying or not lying according to the intention in his own mind, not according to the truth or falsity of the statement.
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by Mynd44: 8:15am On Nov 30, 2012
^^
Telling stories and exaggerating is lying. But the person being lied to might be willing to take it and move on. It does not mean it is not a lie.

That's why lying and deception are different.
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by dmcdad: 8:21am On Nov 30, 2012
Mynd_44: Even if you give account of an event and you leave certain parts out, it can be called lying cos those parts can help make a decision. The truth has to be 100% and nothing less

You don't get it, do you? I'm not saying if a statement deviates 4rm the truth its not a lie. Thats not what I said. Maybe u should review my posts for better understanding. What I am arguing for is a lie is not always a false statement.. Capiché?
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by Mynd44: 8:25am On Nov 30, 2012
dmcdad:

You don't get it, do you? I'm not saying if a statement deviates 4rm the truth its not a lie. Thats not what I said. Maybe u should review my posts for better understanding. What I am arguing for is a lie is not always a false statement.. Capiché?

When the say the bolded, do you mean it in a sense of witholding information(leaving certain parts out) or what exactly?
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by dmcdad: 8:29am On Nov 30, 2012
Mynd_44:

When the say the bolded, do you mean it in a sense of witholding information(leaving certain parts out) or what exactly?

It's not necessarily witholding it buh presenting it in another way. This method of presentation is what makes the statement a lie buh then it doesn't render the statement to be false. Do you catch my drift?
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by Mynd44: 8:33am On Nov 30, 2012
dmcdad:

It's not necessarily witholding it buh presenting it in another way. This method of presentation is what makes the statement a lie buh then it doesn't render the statement to be false. Do you catch my drift?
Well that's true.
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by Nobody: 11:37pm On Nov 30, 2012
Everybody in this thread is a liar.. except Me, Mynd, AlterEgo and K2039 grin grin

I told about 20 lies today. (make that 21 now)
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by Mynd44: 11:47pm On Nov 30, 2012
SniperInADiaper: Everybody in this thread is a liar.. except Me, Mynd, AlterEgo and K2039 grin grin

I told about 20 lies today. (make that 21 now)
huh?
Re: Brain Teaser... What Is A Lie? by Nobody: 1:52am On Dec 01, 2012
Mynd_44:
huh?

I'm on your side.

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