grafikii: But those enemies of mine who did
not want me to be king over them--
bring them here and kill them in front
of me.'" Luke 19:27

tiarabubu: I think the unfortunate statements made by some leading Islamic Clerics lend credence to such question as asked by the OP. Statements such as;

"The purest joy in Islam is to kill and be killed for Allah".

"In order to achieve the victory of Islam in the world, we need to provoke repeated crises, restore value to the idea of death and martyrdom. If Iran has to vanish, that is not important. The important thing is to engulf the world in crises"

Ayatollah Khomeini



Also, passages such as;

The tradition has been narrated on the authority of 'Abdullah b. Qais. He heard it from his father who, while facing the enemy, reported that the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said: [size=13pt]Surely, the gates of Paradise are under the shadows of the swords[/size]. A man in a shabby condition got up and said; Abu Musa, did you hear the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) say this? He said: Yes. (The narrator said): He returned to his friends and said: I greet you (a farewell greeting). Then he broke the sheath of his sword, threw it away, advanced with his (naked) sword towards the enemy and fought (them) with it until he was slain. Sahih Muslim Book 020, Number 4681





Sahih al-Bukhari ,

Narrated Abu Huraira: I heard Allah's Apostle saying, "The example of a Mujahid in Allah's Cause—and Allah knows better who really strives in His Cause—is like a person who fasts and prays continuously. Allah [size=16pt]guarantees[/size] that He will admit the Mujahid in His Cause into Paradise if he is killed, otherwise He will return him to his home safely with rewards and war booty." Volume 4, Book 52, Number 46


Bukhari (4.52.220) goes as follows:

Allah's Apostle said, "I have been sent with the shortest expressions bearing the widest meanings, and I have been made victorious with terror (cast in the hearts of the enemy), and while I was sleeping, the keys of the treasures of the world were brought to me and put in my hand."


Some might therefore argue that suicide is a legitimate strategy in pursuance of the cause. This can be seen in groups like the Taliban, BH etc. Its a tough situation.

The tradition has been narrated on the authority of 'Abdullah b. Qais. He heard it from his father who, while facing the enemy, reported that the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said: Surely, the gates of Paradise are under the shadows of the swords. A man in a shabby condition got up and said; Abu Musa, did you hear the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) say this? He said: Yes. (The narrator said): He returned to his friends and said: I greet you (a farewell greeting). Then he broke the sheath of his sword, threw it away, advanced with his (Unclad) sword towards the enemy and fought (them) with it until he was slain. Sahih Muslim Book 020, Number 4681

Narrated Abu Huraira:

I heard Allah's Apostle saying, "The example of a Mujahid in Allah's Cause-- and Allah knows better who really strives in His Cause----is like a person who fasts and prays continuously. Allah guarantees that He will admit the Mujahid in His Cause into Paradise if he is killed, otherwise He will return him to his home safely with rewards and war booty."

Narrated Abu Huraira:

Allah's Apostle said, "I have been sent with the shortest expressions bearing the widest meanings, and I have been made victorious with terror (cast in the hearts of the enemy), and while I was sleeping, the keys of the treasures of the world were brought to me and put in my hand." Abu Huraira added: Allah's Apostle has left the world and now you, people, are bringing out those treasures (i.e. the Prophet did not benefit by them).

tbaba1234: ue

Not True..
i. A kuffar does NOT mean all non- muslims . It means to bury, reject and deny the truth when it comes to you. A non-muslim who is presented with Islam in its pure form and rejects it, is a kaffir. One who rejects.

ii. "Allah forbids you not, with regard to those who fight you not for your faith, nor drive you out of your homes, from dealing kindly and justly with them: For Allah loves those who are just" (60:

Now to address the lies:


i.

There is NO reference like Sahih Muslim 20:4381,,,ro The deceit here is disgusting, trying to paint the prophet as a violent man.

THe Qoute is :

..Allah's Apostle in one of his military expeditions against the enemy, waited till the sun declined and then he got up amongst the people saying, "O people! Do not wish to meet the enemy, and ask Allah for safety, but when you face the enemy, be patient, and remember that Paradise is under the shades of swords."

Then he said, "O Allah, the Revealer of the Holy Book, and the Mover of the clouds and the Defeater of the clans, defeat them, and grant us victory over them."(Bukhari, Volume 4, Book 52, Number 266l)

This narration makes it abundantly clear that the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) taught his followers to hate violence and never desire conflict with the enemy. However, in the event of a battle, the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) encouraged his companions to be patient and informed them of the reward promised by God to those who die fighting oppression and injustice.


Please be honest at least when you Quote

Another one



Full transcript:

And the Prophet (peace be upon him) said, "I have been ordered to fight the people until they testify that there is no deity worthy of worship other than Allah and that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, establish the prayer, and pay zakat, and if they do this, then their blood and money shall be protected from me, except by an Islamic right, and their account will be with Allah.

There is a huge difference between two words. Killing (qatl) is one-directional, whereas fighting (qital) implies mutuality, i.e., that there are two sides fighting each other.

The word here is people not non-believers.

This narration lists some of the pillars of Islam that Muslims must adhere to. The fighting being ordained here refers to the enforcement of laws and regulations within an Islamic state. Just as modern governments enforce their legal policies, so to does the Islamic state. These legal policies refer to Muslims paying their Zakat (charity tax) and abiding by the laws in an Islamic state. Those who understood the sayings of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) the best, were his companions, and we can examine their application of the sayings of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) to derive a better understanding.

cold:
Quran (2:191-193) - "And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution [of Muslims] is worse than slaughter [of non-believers]... but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for Allah."

tbaba1234:

^None of what you have written below suggest suicide but people slain in combat... As a muslim, i do believe that a person slain fighting a war against injustice or oppression will make paradise. That does not mean he should take his own life. The early muslims fought wars against enemies who were fighting back. They were not commiting suicide.

Now lets address your Qoutes

Quote 1:

We get the whole speech of the prophet in bukhari, as regards the paradise under the 'shade of swords:

.Allah's Apostle in one of his military expeditions against the enemy, waited till the sun declined and then he got up amongst the people saying, "O people! Do not wish to meet the enemy, and ask Allah for safety, but when you face the enemy, be patient, and remember that Paradise is under the shades of swords."

Then he said, "O Allah, the Revealer of the Holy Book, and the Mover of the clouds and the Defeater of the clans, defeat them, and grant us victory over them."(Bukhari, Volume 4, Book 52, Number 266l)

What does that sound like to a rational thinking person. It makes it abundantly clear that the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) taught his followers to hate violence and never desire conflict with the enemy. However, in the event of a battle, the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) encouraged his companions to be patient and informed them of the reward promised by God to those who die fighting oppression and injustice.

Quote 2:

This is obviously talking of one killed in a battle.. This has nothing to do with suicide/ a suicide mission. There are rules to battles in Islam which I already addressed earlier.

Narrated By 'Abdullah : During some of the Ghazawat of the Prophet a woman was found killed. Allah's Apostle disapproved the killing of women and children. (Saheeh Muslim Book 019, Hadith Number 4319).[

Then Abu Bakr, the first caliph based on the prophetic teaching advised a military commander, Yazid, "I advise you ten things| Do not kill women or children or an aged, infirm person. Do not cut down fruit-bearing trees. Do not destroy an inhabited place. Do not slaughter sheep or camels except for food. Do not burn bees and do not scatter them. Do not steal from the booty, and do not be cowardly." Maliks Muwatta Book 021, Hadith Number 010.

Quote 3:

The word used here is ru'b which refers to fright and anxiety. To understand better lets examine a similar narration.

[i]The Prophet (peace be upon him) said: "I was given victory through Ru`b (fear and anxiety): the enemy becomes filled with Ru`b (fear and anxiety) even though they are the distance of a month's journey away from me." (Ahmad #20337)

This simply means that the enemies of Islam and those who hated the prophet, were overcome by fear and anxiety as He gained power. It has nothing to do with suicide.

TroGunn: 1) Does Islam approve of killing people for any reasons?
2) Please what are these justified reasons for killing, if true?
3) Which is considered more serious sin - making cartoons or videos mocking the Prophet or suicide bombing?
4) Is it ok for muslims to protest and attack people who mock the Prophet?
5) Any particular reasons why muslims don't protest or do jihad against suicide and other attacks on muslims/non-muslims by the so-called misguided islamists, being as you all say such attacks misrepresent and insult Islam?

Kafir (Arabic: كافر‎ kāfir, plural كفّار kuffār) is an Arabic term used in a Islamic doctrinal sense, usually translated as "unbeliever," "disbeliever," or "infidel."

Kuffar is the plural of the word Kafir. It means 'unbelievers'. (NOTE: NOT DISBELIEVERS!) http://www.islamic-dictionary.com/index.php?word=kuffar

What are non-muslims if not unbelievers?


the Qur'an contains numerous verses in which more detailed definitions are provided the kafir is referred to as:

Odious: "(Such) as dispute about the signs of God, without any authority that hath reached them. Grievous and odious (is such conduct) in the sight of God and of the Believers." [40: 35]
Mocked: "But on this Day the Believers will laugh at the Unbelievers." [83: 34]
Punished: "But ye have indeed rejected (Him), and soon will come the inevitable (punishment)!" [25: 77]
Terrorized: "I will instill terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers." [8: 12]
Destroyed: "Of the wrong-doers the last was remnant was cut off. Praise be to God, the Cherisher of the Worlds." [6: 45]
Slain: "Seize them and slay them wherever ye get them: in their case we have provided you with a clear argument against them." [4: 91]
Crucified: "The punishment of those who wage war against God and His Apostle, and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution, or crucifixion, or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides." [5: 33]
Evil: "Say thou: 'Yea, and ye shall then be humiliated (on account of your evil)." [37: 18]
Cursed: "They shall have a curse on them: wherever they are found." [33: 61]
www.wikipedia.org

Your explanations are better made to Boko Haram, Taliban, Sunni Bombers in Pakistan etc and your Muslim brothers who use suicide bombing. They have learned Sheiks and Mullahs who obviously disagree with you.

http://www.longwarjournal.org/threat-matrix/archives/2012/12/taliban_spurn_islamic_clerics.php

tbaba1234:

There are a number of things to clear here:

1. People who kill themselves have committed a huge sin that could earn them the fire... suicide is forbidden. People try to go round the rules looking for justification to push their agenda, but it is clear from the Quran and the sayings of the Prophet (Peace and blessings be upon him)

Nor kill (or destroy) yourselves: for verily God hath been to you Most Merciful! If any do that in rancor and injustice, soon shall We cast them into the Fire: And easy it is for God. Chapter 4 Verse 29 - 30

Narrated Jundab the Prophet said, "A man was inflicted with wounds and he committed suicide, and so Allah said: My slave has caused death on himself hurriedly, so I forbid Paradise for him." (Bukhari Volume 2, Book 23, Number 445)
What Prophet Mohammed that did alot of unjust killings by slaying the Jews in Medina to Mecca?Go and study your history very well.And please explain the concept of Jihad and the 72 Virgin things for us so that those of us that do not know can be better enligthened

Narrated Thabit bin Ad-Dahhak:"And if somebody commits suicide with anything in this world, he will be tortured with that very thing on the Day of Resurrection. (Bukhari Volume 8, Book 73, Number 73)

2. The issue of '72 virgins' is not taken seriously by muslims. It come from a narration that is considered weak or fabricated with no chain of narration. Inspite of this, It has become popular amongst non-muslims who use it as a weapon to attack Islam.

3. Jihad means to struggle against an opposing force. It does not necessarily have to be physical. To work really hard to pass an exam is a jihad, To fight against injustice with or without arms is a Jihad. It is a very broad term and should not be restricted to armed conflict.

Li2musty: Hey guys let me tell u somtin jihaad means wen u fighting for religion and den u died das d meaning of jihaad oooo not to go n kill people and kill urself in d name of jihaad........

TroGunn: 1) Does Islam approve of killing people for any reasons?
2) Please what are these justified reasons for killing, if true?
3) Which is considered more serious sin - making cartoons or videos mocking the Prophet or suicide bombing?
4) Is it ok for muslims to protest and attack people who mock the Prophet?
5) Any particular reasons why muslims don't protest or do jihad against suicide and other attacks on muslims/non-muslims by the so-called misguided islamists, being as you all say such attacks misrepresent and insult Islam?

الملكي فوق الله: Amazing how people can read the same passage and decipher it completely differently to suit their own means as to what makes "them" comfortable

Giving your Life in an Act Of "War" or Your "Perceived" war, is not a suicide.

Suicide Bombing is a term that was implanted by Anti Islamic Media to try and "Cowardize" their "Heroic" act.

An American goes to Iraq, and Loses his Life in "War"

The entire nation celebrates him as a "War Hero".

A Saudi Loses his Life in the Battle Against Islamic Oppression by Zionist and The Western World..

And Suddenly the Label "Suicide" is attached to it, Suddenly a "Cowardice" Connotation is Attached to it.

...A Warrior is a Warrior.

Whether Good or Evil...

A Warrior is Still a Warrior

Geewan:

You can do yourself a lot of good by answering these questions below first.
1) Does Christianity approve of killing people for any reasons? Or are you telling no christian has ever killed?
2) Please what are these justified reasons for killing, if true?
3) Which is considered more serious sin - Genocide, blasphemy or deceit? Hiroshima & Nagasaki were not attacked by a muslim country.
To your 4th question, why do you have to mock a prophet? What happened to the Judge not in Matthew 7:1 and Luke 6:37?
5) Any particular reasons why christians don't protest when some misguided christians represent christianity in bad light since this is regarded as insult to christianity?

Geewan:

You can do yourself a lot of good by answering these questions below first.
1) Does Christianity approve of killing people for any reasons? Or are you telling no christian has ever killed?
2) Please what are these justified reasons for killing, if true?
3) Which is considered more serious sin - Genocide, blasphemy or deceit? Hiroshima & Nagasaki were not attacked by a muslim country.
To your 4th question, why do you have to mock a prophet? What happened to the Judge not in Matthew 7:1 and Luke 6:37?
5) Any particular reasons why christians don't protest when some misguided christians represent christianity in bad light since this is regarded as insult to christianity?

Geewan: @TroGunn and bongila

How am i derailing the thread?
Your successfully answering these questions will go a long way in providing answers to the questions you seek since I believe answers to all these questions have been given earlier.

And if you truly believe suicide is allowed in Islam why are you people still alive. Are there no muslims where you leave?

folafola: One thing Islam does not believe in is freedom of religion. If Islam takes over America, or any other country, there wouldn't be a choice of religion. The Quran states: "If anyone desires a religion other than Islam, never will it be accepted of him; and in the hereafter he will be in the ranks of those who have lost." (Surah 3:85) Many of the teachings of Islam are incompatible with progress and contradict common sense. Neither are they compatible with human rights or civil rights. Here are a few examples of the teachings of Islam:

1. Men are superior to Women. (Sura 2:228)
2. Women have half the rights of men:
a-In court witness (Sura 2:282)
b-In inheritance (Sura 4:11)
3. A man may beat his wife. (Surah 4:34)
4. A man may marry up to four wives at a time (polygamy). (Sura 4:3)
5. Muslims must fight until their opponents submit to Islam. (Sura 9:5)
6. A Muslim must not take a Jew or Christian for a friend. (Surah 5:54)
7. A Muslim apostate must be killed. (Surah 9:12)
8. Stealing is punished by amputation of hands. (Surah 5:41)
9. Adultery is punished by public flogging. (Surah 24:2)
10. No separation between church and state. (Surah 2:193)
11. No opposition parties allowed. (Surah 4:59)

maclatunji:

Create another thread for your questions. I hid some other posts because they would take us away from the theme of this thread. You can post the link of your new thread here and the answers can be posted there.

Thank you.

tbaba1234:

Are you debating Arabic with me? That would be fun... hehe.. People use it interchangebly but it is used very specifically in the Qur'an. You should not bring up something, you know nothing about..

Let's go to lanes lexicon, a classical arabic dictionary and a common reference for those who study the Quran:

He veiled, concealed, hid, or covered, the thing: (S, A,*
Mgh,* Mqb, ; or he covered the thing so as to
detroy it: (Az, TA and &C* .' , aor. [and
inf. n.] as above, he corered it; covered it /

http://www.studyquran.org/LaneLexicon/Volume7/00000148.pdf

You can not cover something, you have not been given.. This is the root of the word, like a farmer who buries a seed.... You bury/cover/deny the truth when it presented to you.

You will see many translations but the most appropriate one in light of the meaning of the word is disbeliever or rejecter. An unbeliever might have nothing to cover or deny if he is not exposed to the truth.

It is simple really.





I do not know of any main stream cleric that supports suicide bombings, but they are some on the fringes that promote it to fulfill their agendas and use their influences to get recruits.

Just as it is difficult to get through to some of you, christians, it is diffiult to get through to people like that.

From your link you see:

It will build on the October pronouncement by the Grand Mufti of Saudi Arabia, Sheikh Abdulaziz bin Abdullah Al al-Sheikh, that explicitly condemned suicide bombings. Although an official gathering of Afghan religious scholars this summer determined that suicide attacks "have no legitimate foundation in Islam," its declaration, like other similar pronouncements in the past, has clearly been ignored by the Taliban and allied militant groups.

Read more: http://www.longwarjournal.org/threat-matrix/archives/2012/12/taliban_spurn_islamic_clerics.php#ixzz2HQh3yLXf

If they don't listen to those people, who will they listen to? Has Boko Haram not attempted to kill muslim leaders that speak up against them?