4Him please take heart, you are not the only one dumbfounded at the level of "activities" in church buildings nowadays,

personally I am also tired of the top - down need for conformity to a particular pattern , and standard.

I doubt whether some Christians even know that Peter and the other Apostles were leaving in the affluent period of Roman , yet the didn't seem to displace the rampant , Love of money and accomplishments that have seem to infected most gatherings of so called Christians today.

I would advise the you go to this site and download the audio files by Thomas Nelson about "Church History", there and listen to them . I hope that listening to them would let you understand and put into perspective a little bit of things that have happened in so called Churches Bodies:

http://www.archive.org/details/ChurchHistory


One thing is for sure , the so called pastors , bishops and ministers are showing fruits that any True Christian should be able to know the wolf from the sheep via the help of God,

Can you imagine when a so called Pastor cannot categorically state on TV that Christ was the only way for anybody to be saved, yet people still consider such a person as a man of God,

God please thank you for your mercy, if not a lot of us would have being consumed,


My own prayer is that after all is said and done, that I should not be found wanting by God, and that I don't end up faltering along this journey of life a Christian (Even Paul made it important for christians to realise that we could become cast-aways if care is not taking, )

It has already being said that in the last days even the very elect would be deceived,

So 4Him please take heart and just persever, and pray that God would help you to "separate the nonsense from the substance"

I have also noticed that some people (including me before) tend to regard the so called "christian Books" that they were reading more than the bible they ought to be reading, as a result the focus of a few people had shifted from God to their Pastors,


I can't remember Jesus making yearly prophetic pronouncments , yet you see different Bishops, Pastors, Preachers make different yearly pronouncements (which are sometimes different) and which makes one to ask the question that since God is not the Author of Confusion how come there are disparaging prophetic pronouncements,

I can only pray that God would keep us through the evils of our days and bring us home to him,

SysUser:

I can't remember Jesus making yearly prophetic pronouncments , yet you see different Bishops, Pastors, Preachers make different yearly pronouncements (which are sometimes different) and which makes one to ask the question that since God is not the Author of Confusion how come there are disparaging prophetic pronouncements,

I can only pray that God would keep us through the evils of our days and bring us home to him,

My brother, i get a lot of abuse from people who claim that i only speak to attack or denigrate their church pastors and i just shake my head in wonder.
Why is it so hard to demand that our leaders act like Christ did?
Why do people keep excusing our men of Gawd with words like "no one is perfect" when Christ commanded - BE YE THEREFORE PERFECT EVEN AS MY FATHER IN HEAVEN IS PERFECT?

Jeol Osteen used the words "i dont know" over 40 times in his 2005 interview with Larry King, if Paul had littered his letters in the NT with "i dont know" anytime the early christians asked him a question of fundamental importance where would we be today?

Imagine if Paul was not sure of what he was writing we would have been in trouble today,

I can only hope that those people who use scriptures to enrich themselves would realise that they are responsible for the lives of so many people,

They would be judged the more due to their position of authority,

Personally , I recently got to understand why it is so important to make sure the only source of scriptural interpretation is the Holy Spirit, just like Jesus said He will bring us into all truth. Life have been destroyed because people do what their Pastors, Bishops , Elders do rather than what God said they should do as Christians,

Once bad thing I noticed recently when I was in a situation in which I needed a Blunt and Truthful Counselling from a True christian, was that It was very very difficult getting someone or somewhere from which the counselling could be obtained, despite the almost ubiquitous prevalence of Churches and Online representation by Churches. i was really disappointed that in my time of need and weakness, it was very difficult to find someone I could trust enough to tell the truth and give a Godly counsell.

I have come to the understanding that one must make himself available for the only the Holy Spirit to lead him/her in every situation, since man/men would always fail.

I have also noticed that there are a lot of Christian Buildings , despite that Christ said we should go into the world to preach the good news, I understand that He did not say that we should stay in one place and start real estate developments,

A true christian knows that works of self righteousness cannot bring him/her salvation, yet at the same time a true Christian is expected to bear good fruits, (which sometimes manifest in the form of good works).

@4Him and SysUser:

Jeol Osteen used the words "i don't know" over 40 times in his 2005 interview with Larry King, if Paul had littered his letters in the NT with "i don't know" anytime the early christians asked him a question of fundamental importance where would we be today?

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SysUser (m)
Ibadan
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Re: Important Message For 4him From Sysuser
« #3 on: February 24, 2008, 07:20 PM »

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Imagine if Paul was not sure of what he was writing we would have been in trouble today,

I wonder why jesus was not mentioned here, by either one of you men? I guess that Paul is so important that he over shadows god the son himself!

olabs sometimes it's better to zip it
haba!

@Nwando: Sometimes I miss you, so I just have to nead you, to pry you out of your shell! I deliberately do that sometimes, because I know you will be itching for a fight.

However what I said about "them men" mentioning Paul and at not time Jesus was referenced, is the truth. Check it out. I will not keep my mouth shot, since my intention is to help you and others to see. Hopefully you will discover the truth and your soul and heart will accept it!

olabowale:

@Nwando: Sometimes I miss you, so I just have to nead you, to pry you out of your shell! I deliberately do that sometimes, because I know you will be itching for a fight.

Nwando is a lover not a fighter

@Nwando

Nwando is a lover not a fighter

Are you really a lover

babs787:

@Nwando


Are you really a lover

you tell me
do you know something I don't?

i have no worries with joel osteen saying i dont know 5000 times, my wahala are those who go ahead to talk rubish. if joel says 'i dont know', to me, it's a sign of humility, which many pators in nigeria lack.

my wahala is when a pastor owns a gun . . . to protect who?
when pastors are not humble it hurts.

A Pastor saying 'I don't Know' to fundamental questions of the Christian Faith (including the most important of all: Thye way to salvation) is not a mark of humility. Thats my opinion.

darfur:

i have no worries with joel osteen saying i don't know 5000 times, my wahala are those who go ahead to talk rubish. if joel says 'i don't know', to me, it's a sign of humility, which many pators in nigeria lack.

my wahala is when a pastor owns a gun . . . to protect who?
when pastors are not humble it hurts.

Dont be surprised tomorrow if you here that pastor renounces Jesus. He seems rather on the fence and could sway here or there when subjected to serious fire.

For once, he could have been raw with the truth and not to be economical with truth everytime. Jesus and every other forerunner in Christianity were straight to the heart on their message without mincing words. This man minced words. He probably thinks his diplomacy is what is keeping his congregation.

If he encounters one major adversity, he would learn to confess Jesus openly and boldly without fear or fervor

What's the important msg fo 4him all about? msg

@Nwando

you tell me
do you know something I don't?

I think I know something that you do not know and hope you understand ?

Joel Osteen made an error, albeit a grave error, for which he sincerely apologised and repented of. I think it's unfair to continue to bring it up against him. I believe we as Christians will do more for one another by praying for one another rather than holding up our mistakes for all to see. Yes, people need to be accountable for their actions but what really is our motive when we demand that accountability?

Interesting @liftedone

Ndipe:

Interesting @liftedone

I'm not very sure how to interprete you comment. Can you elaborate?

That if he repented of his sins, then he is forgiven. True.

At times, I think that some of this people who are hesistant in acknowledging their faith in the Divinity of Jesus Christ are afraid of a 'backlash' from the world. Look at the allegations tabled against Creflo dollar, for his denial of the Divinity of Jesus Christ, or John Hagee, who preaches (according to Youtube) that Jesus Christ is not the . . . (Cant repeat the quote). May God have compassion on His True servants with a desire to serve and retain a loyal Heart towards Him.

I was very disappointed at the whole Joel Osteen "I don't know, it's true for me'' thing. But the guy was sorry afterwards. I thought that should bury the matter among Christians. We are too fond of bringing up people's sins.
Creflo Dollar denied the divinity of Christ? I'll have to see where he did that because he's one of the preachers I listen to regularly. I will be really worried if he actually did and was not simply taken out of context.

Keep at the back of your mind, though, that these are the last days; many will depart from the faith; as the love of many will also wax cold. If you read your bible, you won't be too surprised at what is happening in the Church.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creflo_Dollar#Controversy. Unfortunately, there is no footnote to back up the allegation.

Another one for your information.

http://biblelight.net/Creflo-Dollar.htm

Besides, the prosperity messages espoused by some of the preachers can lead one astray. True, May God deliver us from the temptations of Satan in the Name of Jesus Christ, Amen.

I see nothing controversial or blasphemous about those things at all. It's the context in which they were spoken. If you listen to him, you will understand his teachings.