Welcome, Guest: Register On Nairaland / LOGIN! / Trending / Recent / NewStats: 3,200,242 members, 7,974,158 topics. Date: Sunday, 13 October 2024 at 05:19 PM |
Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning (2724 Views)
The CallED, The SanctifiED And The PreservED - An Exposition On Jude Verse One. / COME LET US REASON TOGETHER –SPIRITUAL UPGRADE AND UPDATE. / Come Now Let Us Reason Together (2) (3) (4)
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by truthislight: 6:27pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
Goshen360: but will such ^^^ pepetual sinners inherit God's kingdom? Corinthians or no corinthian? |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by moredendisc: 6:47pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
okeyxyz: Goshen360: I was posting after the above (i.e. "My brother, this your teaching is VERY VERY DANGEROUS) but retracted before submitting Only decided to re-posting seeing that Goshen360 had done a follow to "My brother, this your teaching is VERY VERY DANGEROUS" It becomes obvious where okeyxyz is coming from when reading, carefully okeyxyz's post Okeyxyz's post is almost right, the exceptions to almost right, are one or two wrongs where bible translations (e.g. 1 John 3:9 KJV) have mistakes and were mistranslated Until when all "Thou Shall Not . . . " are taken away & God stops issuing it, there will always be the opportunity or chance to sin. The new found Christian freedom is actually similar to be taken back to Eden and back to Eve It is a case of back to square one and a similar setting to "All things are lawful, but not all things are profitable. All things are lawful, but not all things edify" and like with Eve, now "You are left to your own senses to use this new found freedom as you please. You can either use it wisely to your own profit or foolishly to your own loss and sorrows," It is important to bear in mind that the law "Thou Shall Not . . . " (i.e. aase - word which proceeded from God, the King's mouth) was before sin & that sin is disobedience and this beautifully stated verse"The sting of death is sin, and the power of sin is the law" - 1 Corinthians 15:56 Disobeying the law (i.e. word(s) proceeding from God's mouth) leads to getting stung with or by a sharply-pointed object called sin, and the poison or venom in the sting/sin has a strength or power of killing (i.e. the end product of sin is death) It is important to understand 1)What "practicing sin" (i.e. committing sin regularly or breaking laws regularly) means, 2)What is sin or what sin means The understanding(s) will clarify whether or not "It is impossible for Of course, Christians are capable of sinning. God knows this and His expectation is that they stop from continually sinning gradually and eventually albeit via/with grace If or when Christians do sin, then Hebrews 4:16 is available. "It is impossible for you to sin" is an error and has 1 John 3:9 KJV to blame for that, it should had being translated correctly as: "Those who have been born into God's family do not make a practice of sinning, because God's life is in them. So they can't keep on sinning, because they are children of God." No one wants to admit having bad kids, all like to believe their kids are good and butter wont melt in their mouths etc etc and that such good kids are prone to or occasionally do bad things, so it doesn't necessarily mean they are BAD children. They are Remorse or repentance after bad act(s) is the ticket back into loving warm and welcoming hands Christians have Grace to assist or stop them continuing doing bad things "but they are not sins for it is impossible for god to sin" is an error too - Eve can testify to this The serpent spun a similar line like that to Eve too saying ". . . you shall be as gods", after which Eve was then left to her senses; the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. We always had and have grace, grace was in Eden back then and so is now. Birds do not struggle to fly, they fly gracefully. Christians too should not be struggling with/at anything but be abound with grace The grace factor is presented again for Christians to live life effortlessly and when/if Christians do slip, then Hebrews 4:16 states: "Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need" 2 Likes |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by Goshen360(m): 7:00pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
^ Hey, 1,000,000,000,000,000 LIKES for you! OmG, moredendisc, Take my HUG ooooooooooooooooooooooooooo. Our brother Okeyxyz is going near error and we must attempt to reason scriptures with him in the Spirit of Truth and brotherhood. |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by moredendisc: 7:09pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
Goshen360: ^ Bro. It was just a little "good Samaritank" situation there, trust Okeyxyz means well however "As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another" - Proverbs 27:17 NIV We all on the same moving train |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by Nobody: 7:15pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
moredendisc: I second Goshen's comment, this is a beautiful piece, very edifying and liberating. I came from a legalistic holiness so called church , but had no joy in obedience because of round the clock emphasis on sin and countless dos and donts. We all know sin is horribly bad, but the sooner we focus on our freedom to obey and the power of GOD available to help us overcome the better, God is not watching us for every little mistake or slip as I thought , he is yearning for us to overcome and become more like his SON daily. Thank you very much again for this beautiful scriptural exegesis . |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by Nobody: 7:26pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
moredendisc: thank you for the words of encouragement! |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by okeyxyz(m): 8:30pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
Boomark: #This was an occasion of John trying to guide christians who were not well grounded in gospel. John simply rephrased the words of paul that "All things are lawful but not all things are profitable...". He called it sin instead of "unprofitable" because they were still "babes", not yet mature in the gospel and still have a conscience of sin/law, therefore needed to take the gospel one step at a time. But we can see from verse 18 that he goes on to reassert that anyone born of god CANNOT SIN... I said it before that a christian is set completely free from the law. Therefore, nothing you do can take away your christianity, but it dosen't mean that you will get away from reckless behaviour. If you choose to rob a bank tomorrow, it is not sin, but know that your run the risk of being caught and...#ALUU4. But your christianity remains intact. For anyone that believes, NOTHING can take away your righteousness. |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by Nobody: 8:34pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
okeyxyz: How different are you from the Taliban thinking that you are above secular law? |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by okeyxyz(m): 8:40pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
i.chuka: My point is that sin is the act of trying to still keep the laws and commandments because they still dwell in your conscience, you have not fully excised yourself from the law. But for any christian is has achieved this, then it is impossible for him to sin. Take me for instance: I don't need marriage as a certificate to have s.ex with a woman, because what we call marriage today was a definition according to the law, though trying to imitate god but only in "shadows"...So when I break that law, I have not sinned because that law is dead to me. |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by wordthots: 8:49pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
okeyxyz: About 1john 3:9 I believe the bible was talking about our new nature at the new birth. The recreated spirit cannot sin. But this doesn't mean christians can't sin(it just means sin cannot proceed out of your spirit)...as long as the spirit isn't given the first place the soul and body will lead a christian to sin hence the term carnal christian. The correct order is Spirit- Soul- Body, a reverse in this order will always lead a believer to a struggle with sin. As long as we walk in the spirit sin cannot have dominion over us, but the minute we do otherwise, we fall into sin. The beauty of the new birth is the fact that we have a new nature and we do not consciously decide to sin or practice sin, that's what 1john 3:9 is talking about. Under the new covenant we have liberty but this should never be confused for license. Like Bro Goshen said it is possible for a Christian to sin but we should never go on sinning. Its true that we are accepted by God not based on our performance but based on christs finished work, but sin is never to be endorsed. We have Gods nature now therefore if we walk in the spirit we would live above sin. Godbless |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by okeyxyz(m): 9:11pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
Goshen360:#If we are in grace, then We are unable to sin because sin(The Law) no longer has a place in our hearts. This was the emphasis of Paul: 1 What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase? 2 May it never be! How shall we who died to sin still live in it?...(Romans 6:1-... ) How can we continue to sin when we are dead to sin? It is impossible!! It is no longer by effort that we are unable to sin but that sin no longer dwells in our conscience such that those things we used to regard as sin as defined by the law are no longer sin because the law is no longer valid.
Fornication means impure se.x, s.ex not done in the proper manner. The corinthian man tooks his father's wife, a woman legally married to another man, and without the man's consent, therefore was offensive both in a secular and spiritual perspective. But sex between two mutally consenting, unmarried adults CANNOT be sin. It is a gift, it is your nature to be enjoyed, your body demands it, etc. |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by okeyxyz(m): 9:37pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
Goshen360: Jude was talking about people who used the liberty of the gospel as excuse to indulge in their abuse of proper sense and wisdom. This is not what I am advocating. Yes, we are free from sin does not mean we can disregard propriety. There is still reward and punishment for the choices you make, Therefore Work out your salvation in fear and trembling..., There is a proper way to do everything under the sun, likewise there is an improper way and each has it's results whether for good or for bad. The important thing is that you are now responsible for your choices. There is moral s.ex which is s.ex between two consenting male and female..., of which taking another man's wife is not, neither is homo/bi-se.xuality, bestiality, etc.
I believe i have addressed this in my previous reply to you, through pauls teachings in romans 6:1-... |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by okeyxyz(m): 9:39pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
plappville: Yup!! Keep watching |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by Boomark(m): 9:56pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
i.chuka: |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by truthislight: 10:21pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
okeyxyz: wonderful! You are a pastor of which church your "GRACE" is very large. Lol "christianity" indeed! lol. |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by truthislight: 10:35pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
okeyxyz: "Hallelujah! some body" all say >>> "GRACE!" this is great. This is the greatest sermon i have heard on NL this year. lol. No wonder we have the "broad way" so this is the life you people live? Interesting. please give me more. very "edifying" |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by truthislight: 10:40pm On Feb 02, 2013 |
okeyxyz: " I love this pastor". Please "minister to me" "you are really in the spirit(ghost)" "the ghost is flowing through you" Goshen360: ^^^ |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by plappville(f): 12:05am On Feb 03, 2013 |
truthislight: Hahahahaha...... you mouth close? You go fear gospel for NL....freedom to fornicate etc... am sure our unmarried brethren will be enjoying this thread...God have merci!!! 1 Like |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by plappville(f): 12:12am On Feb 03, 2013 |
okeyxyz: Yes i will be watching.... You and Obadiah777 have turn The scripture to make it have a different meaning entirely wetin remain again? If what you are saying is correct, then you are not far from the unbelieve. Matired man and woman can have intima.cy it is not sin, one can steal etc....is this a freedom from Christ? I tell you, your church go full wel wel no be small... |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by truthislight: 1:07am On Feb 03, 2013 |
plappville: ma sis, no be small "ministration" way i dong receive for this thread o! "Am in the spirit(ghost) right now" |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by christemmbassey(m): 2:06am On Feb 03, 2013 |
@all, when bro Okeyxyz responded to my earlier post as abstract, i said, tnx for explaining my post in other words",and i was fully aware of that part that refered to intimacy, the problem of okeyxyz is that he brought food for adults and expected babies to also eat hence this constipation. Now james 1:25 says - "But who so looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he not being a forgetful hearer, but the doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed" (KJV). again 1john1:7 says - "but if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another......",(KJV) with all these, many instead of looking at the perfect law of liberty(the gospel/grace) and work in the light(Gods word that set men free), they choose to look at their churches/pastors, work in the words of men and according to their feelings, no wonder they shouted, ' blue murder' at okeyxyz's post. There bible says - "for we are his WORKMANSHIP, (re)created (bracket, mine) in Christ Jesus unto GOOD works which God hath befor ordained that we should work in them".(eph2:10, KJV) now if we continue to look at this perfect law of liberty, walk in this light and agree/accept with God that we are his workmanship and that he created us in Christ unto GOOD WORKS, how can we commit sin? When John said the christian can not commit sin, he was not refering to lazx/ignorant/baby christians. Christians commit sin because of the standalone milk that pastors feed them. I was like that, but was freed when i started studying the scripture and stoped the follow-follow christianity, free from sin, fear, manipulation, bitterness, intimidation, tithe, first fruits, harvest, sowing of seeds, deliverance, assignments, selfishness, suspecting/blaming satan for my carelessness/ignorance, eternal torments etc etc etc. Bro lazy christians are in trouble. |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by MrAnony1(m): 8:55am On Feb 03, 2013 |
Hmm, I might be wrong but I am still seeing a HUGE amount of error here all in the name of "grace" and "spiritual maturity". Some of what I am seeing on this thread is really disturbing. If Jesus tarries, I will be back to comment later but for now make I go church first I dey come. 1 Like |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by MrAnony1(m): 11:27am On Feb 04, 2013 |
okeyxyz:Hmmm..........ok just to be clear that we are on the same page, I'll give a parable to illustrate what I know grace to be. The Redemption of The Niger-Delta Militants Once upon a time in Nigeria, a group of people rebelled against the Federal Government they were called the Niger-Delta militants. By taking to arms, they became enemies of the state.(Colosians 1:21) During the time when they were enemies of the state, certain laws such as curfews and restriction of movement were made to keep them in check with the penalty of arrest or even death in some cases. (Galatians 3:23) After a while, the Government granted amnesty to the militants and reconciled them to the Federal republic of Nigeria.(Romans 5:10) The militants accepted this amnesty by renouncing their crimes, surrendering their arms and turning away from their rebellion.(Acts 3:19) The restrictions that were placed upon them were promptly lifted. They were therefore freed from the bondage that comes with rebellion and walked into the freedom that comes with amnesty (Romans 6:14) Having renounced their militancy, they became law abiding citizens of the Federal Republic of Nigeria (Romans 6:18) Now that they had been forgiven by the Government, does it mean that militancy that used to be sin is no longer sin? Does amnesty mean that they are still free to take up arms if they choose to? Absolutely not. (Romans 6:15) I hope the above serves for us as a good illustration of what it means to not be under Grace and not the Law. I have prayerfully thought of how best to pass this message across and this is what God laid in my heart. There is a world of difference between freedom and anarchy. If anyone doesn't quite understand what I laid out above or doesn't quite agree with it, please feel free to point out the parts where you find it troublesome. I'll conclude with this; For when you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness. What fruit did you have then in the things of which you are now ashamed? For the end of those things is death. But now having been set free from sin, and having become slaves of God, you have your fruit to holiness, and the end, everlasting life. For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. Romans 6:20-23 The Message bible renders verse 23 beautifully Work hard for sin your whole life and your pension is death. But God's gift is real life, eternal life, delivered by Jesus, our Master. For further research, please take out time to prayerfully study Romans 6. 1 Like |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by Nobody: 11:45am On Feb 04, 2013 |
Mr_Anony: spot on ! |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by debosky(m): 2:10pm On Feb 04, 2013 |
@ Anony I agree with your parable, but not completely. While yes, in essence, we've been saved by a unilateral 'amnesty' that God has provided, we need to be careful when defining what the 'sin'/'offence' was in the first place. In your example it is clear that being a militant is against the 'law' - amnesty or no amnesty. However, there are other 'laws' or OT practices which we would not deem 'sin' today - e.g. working on the sabbath, not giving first fruits, or wearing clothes with two fabrics and the like. I agree - we are freed from the mindset of 'do this, don't do that' and become 'sons' - who by nature know what they should do and do it naturally, not out of rules compliance. The sometimes tricky aspect is defining what we should now 'know' by our very nature - here is where rightly dividing the word of truth (in this case the law) becomes vital. 3 Likes |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by Candour(m): 3:44pm On Feb 04, 2013 |
Mr_Anony: 1000,000 likes.kudos Mr Anony.I wish you more of God's wisdom my brother. @okeyxyz, i was alarmed when i read through all your posts.....brother,you're proposing anarchy in the guise of grace.you said you're free to steal as long as you're not caught as stealing belongs to the law and no longer binding on you.Fornication too is not sin as long as you didn't carry another man's wife.What is your interpretation of love for your neighbour if you wont think twice about stealing from him? I keep hoping i misunderstood you and would be glad to hear you say so. Our problem in christianity isn't Boko Haram or secret cults but DANGEROUSLY FALSE DOCTRINES may God help us 3 Likes |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by Goshen360(m): 3:49pm On Feb 04, 2013 |
Candour: ....and I return to you another 1,000,000,000,000 LIKES in respect of the highlighted |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by anukulapo: 10:24pm On Feb 06, 2013 |
moredendisc: @GOSHEN Do you agree with moredendisc's view/modification of 1 John 3:9? It sure makes sense to me but are we allowed to do such personally especially as it is not from any known and generally acceptable bible translation? |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by Goshen360(m): 6:02am On Feb 07, 2013 |
anukulapo: That's not moredendisc's modification o. Read other bible translations - that's where he got it from. I agree with the translation especially when the same context of 1 John says "IF ANY MAN SIN...", is an indication that a Christian can sin but Christians dont go on sinning thinking because we have an advocate with the Father, that's abuse of the Grace of God. |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by MrAnony1(m): 6:40am On Feb 07, 2013 |
debosky: @ AnonyHmm, I'll come to this hopefully over the weekend, kinda busy these days |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by anukulapo: 9:18am On Feb 07, 2013 |
Goshen360: E be like say old age don come o. How come I no see am for my bible until I check am this time after asking you. Goshen360: E be like say old age don come o. How come I no see am for my bible until I check am this time after asking you. |
Re: Come, Let Us Reason Together - A Call To "Sanctified" Christian Reasoning by Goshen360(m): 3:18pm On Feb 07, 2013 |
^ I don tell you say make you |
The Bible Is The Word Of God / What Exactly Is God Trying To Teach Humans From The Story Of Job? / Shameful: How Prophet Muhammad Acquired Jewish Sex Wife Saffiyah
(Go Up)
Sections: politics (1) business autos (1) jobs (1) career education (1) romance computers phones travel sports fashion health religion celebs tv-movies music-radio literature webmasters programming techmarket Links: (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) (9) (10) Nairaland - Copyright © 2005 - 2024 Oluwaseun Osewa. All rights reserved. See How To Advertise. 163 |