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WOW on the 2nd 1 i am proud of my Pagan peoples!

@ logic

Have you ever heard the expression correlation does not prove causation?

For someone who calls himself logicboy you are quite fond of indulging in logical fallacies.

Do some reading up will ya?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_causation

debosky: @ logic

Have you ever heard the expression correlation does not prove causation?

For someone who calls himself logicboy you are quite fond of indulging in logical fallacies.

Do some reading up will ya?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_causation

It would do you well to understand what the op is saying.

What correlation was I forcing into causation. Why do christians always try this empty rhetoric nonsense?

Logicboy03:


It would do you well to understand what the op is saying.

What correlation was I forcing into causation. Why do christians always try this empty rhetoric nonsense?

Religion is killing the blackman cannot be interpreted in any other way - religion is the CAUSE of the blackman's 'killing'.

Your 'illustration' is supposed to be 'proof' of this 'killing' is it not?

If the above is not what you are trying to say, then you are either confused or were trying to be facetious with your post. Which is it?

debosky:

Religion is killing the blackman cannot be interpreted in any other way - religion is the CAUSE of the blackman's 'killing'.

Your 'illustration' is supposed to be 'proof' of this 'killing' is it not?

If the above is not what you are trying to say, then you are either confused or were trying to be facetious with your post. Which is it?

All this epistle that you are writing with assumptions and "ifs"......why not just ask what I am saying if you dont understand?

Logicboy03:
All this epistle that you are writing with assumptions and "ifs"......why not just ask what I am saying if you dont understand?

I am saying the only thing you can be saying is what I have surmised - if it's anything different, clearly say so.

debosky:

I am saying the only thing you can be saying is what I have surmised - if it's anything different, clearly say so.

smh. Goodluck with that stubborn stu.pidity

Logicboy03:

smh. Goodluck with that stubborn stu.pidity

Don't run away - I've asked you twice to state what you are saying if I've gotten it wrong, yet you've refused to do so.

Or does logicboy not like to be called up when he starts chatting BS?

debosky:

Don't run away - I've asked you twice to state what you are saying if I've gotten it wrong, yet you've refused to do so.

Or does logicboy not like to be called up when he starts chatting BS?

You didnt ask shyt. Stop lying. You made assumptions about what I said and I calmly told you to ask if you didnt understand.Liar

debosky:
Your 'illustration' is supposed to be 'proof' of this 'killing' is it not?

If the above is not what you are trying to say, then you are either confused or were trying to be facetious with your post. Which is it?

Are those not questions or does logicboy also not understand the use of question marks?

Ok - even if you don't understand the use of question marks - what about the following?

debosky:

I am saying the only thing you can be saying is what I have surmised - if it's anything different, clearly say so.

That's the third time - come out and state what you mean, yet you're running away.

debosky:

Are those not questions or does logicboy also not understand the use of question marks?

Ok - even if you don't understand the use of question marks - what about the following?



That's the third time - come out and state what you mean, yet you're running away.

Finally. Here is what I am saying;

Look at the two pictures on the op. The churches that are predominatly black are ignorant about religion and evolution. Clean and clear.

I wonder what correllation I forced into causation here. If it isnt religion, especially christianity which is the common dnominator in this case, I have no idea how you reason

Logicboy03:
Finally. Here is what I am saying;

Look at the two pictures on the op. The churches that are predominatly black are ignorant about religion and evolution. Clean and clear.

I wonder what correllation I forced into causation here. If it isnt religion, especially christianity which is the common dnominator in this case, I have no idea how you reason

Your thread title says religion is killing the black man - that implies Christianity is the cause of this ignorance - is that what you are trying to say?

All you have shown is a correlation between ignorance, being black and being Christian in this case and nothing more - you've not provided any evidence for your claim that 'religion is killing the black man'.

debosky:

Your thread title says religion is killing the black man - that implies Christianity is the cause of this ignorance - is that what you are trying to say?

All you have shown is a correlation between ignorance, being black and being Christian in this case and nothing more - you've not provided any evidence for your claim that 'religion is killing the black man'.

Not correlation. Causation. The pictures show a direct effect on the religion and type of christian you are with knowledge on evolution/religion

We all know for a fact that christianity breeds ignorance especially on other religions and evolution. What the pictures in the op does is put numbers behind that assertion and it shows that black churches are one of the worst churches on knowledge on religion and evolution.

Logicboy03:
Not correlation. Causation. The pictures show a direct effect on the religion and type of christian you are with knowledge on evolution/religion

We all know for a fact that christianity breeds ignorance especially on other religions and evolution. What the pictures in the op does is put numbers behind that assertion and it shows that black churches are one of the worst churches on knowledge on religion and evolution.

Right - maybe you don't understand what I am saying - all you have shown is correlation between being black and christian and being ignorant. You haven't provided any evidence that being Christian is the cause of being ignorant.

You haven't shown any 'direct effect' in that data as there might be other factors at play which you have not identified.

For all you know, the black people who attend the black protestant churches might simply be poorly educated, and that's the cause of their ignorance not Christianity.

In summary you have established a correlation between being black and christian and being ignorant, but you have not established christianity as cause of the ignorance.

debosky:

Right - maybe you don't understand what I am saying - all you have shown is correlation between being black and christian and being ignorant. You haven't provided any evidence that being Christian is the cause of being ignorant.

You haven't shown any 'direct effect' in that data as there might be other factors at play which you have not identified.

For all you know, the black people who attend the black protestant churches might simply be poorly educated, and that's the cause of their ignorance not Christianity.

In summary you have established a correlation between being black and christian and being ignorant, but you have not established christianity as cause of the ignorance.

Oh.....and the fact that other christians were polled was beans? The other christians with the same poor figures on religious knowledge and evolition?

What explains that the Jews and non-believers do better?

If you have nothing, please eeep quiet

Logicboy03:
Oh.....and the fact that other Christians were polled was beans? The other christians with the same poor figures on religious knowledge and evolition?

It's not beans - but you would be quite foolish to ignore the obvious fact that blacks have lower educational attainment in general compared to other groups in the US, except Hispanics. Your analysis has not controlled for the ethnic make-up or educational attainment of the other church groups.

You may also have a congregation of poorer, less educated black people in those black churches - not the churches causing their poor education.

What explains that the Jews and non-believers do better?

There are a multitude of factors - it could be the general educational attainment of those groups are higher - have you assessed/controlled for that? Where were these non-believers located? In well educated communities or in poor inner city neighbourhoods with poor educational attainment?

Any test of knowledge of a subject matter should, as a minimum, establish the educational attainment of the groups before anything more can be said.

If you want to make definitive claims, you must demonstrate you have controlled for other external factors using a large enough data set - like I said, you need to read up on logical fallacies as you are fond of rushing to poorly thought out conclusions.

its not a new saying that religion is the problem of the black man.

religion hinders every real progress the blackman could have made, makes him complacent and hope for a heavenly city.

the black man's mind will be freed when he learns to let go of religion and then, he will record some success.

debosky:

It's not beans - but you would be quite foolish to ignore the obvious fact that blacks have lower educational attainment in general compared to other groups in the US, except Hispanics. Your analysis has not controlled for the ethnic make-up or educational attainment of the other church groups.

You may also have a congregation of poorer, less educated black people in those black churches - not the churches causing their poor education.



There are a multitude of factors - it could be the general educational attainment of those groups are higher - have you assessed/controlled for that? Where were these non-believers located? In well educated communities or in poor inner city neighbourhoods with poor educational attainment?

Any test of knowledge of a subject matter should, as a minimum, establish the educational attainment of the groups before anything more can be said.

If you want to make definitive claims, you must demonstrate you have controlled for other external factors using a large enough data set - like I said, you need

to read up on logical fallacies as you are fond of rushing to poorly thought out conclusions.

You have shitfed the argument and have added big words to obfuscate the facts. You say that there are a multitude of factors affecting blacks. Well, I picked on one of the major factors- religion. So, I dont know where you are going with this BS


Does christianity as a whole depict ignorance on religious knowledge/evolition? Yes
Do black christians score poorly in evolution and religious knowledge? Yes
Are black christians more religious than the rest of the whole us society? YES



Conclusion- religion (chrisitianity in this case) is killing the black man (with ignorance)


That is the simple argument.

Logicboy03:
You have shitfed the argument and have added big words to obfuscate the facts. You say that there are a multitude of factors affecting blacks. Well, I picked on one of the major factors- religion. So, I dont know where you are going with this BS

I haven't obfuscated anything - the simple fact is that you have demonstrated only correlation and not causation. Simple.

All I have done is highlight other factors which may be the cause, not Christianity.

You have committed the following logical fallacy:

correlation proves causation, is one of several questionable cause logical fallacies by which two events that occur together are taken to have a cause-and-effect relationship

Does christianity as a whole depict ignorance on religious knowledge/evolition? Yes
Do black christians score poorly in evolution and religious knowledge? Yes
Are black christians more religious than the rest of the whole us society? YES

Conclusion- religion (chrisitianity in this case) is killing the black man (with ignorance)

That is the simple argument.

Correction - that is a simplistic argument not a simple one - there are many more factors involved. Heck we don't even know what 'religious' knowledge we are talking about here - it may be knowledge about Shintoism for all we know.

Since, regardless of religious orientation, blacks are less educated than the rest of the population (apart from hispanics) this is most likely to be the root cause of the poor performance, not the fact that these particular blacks are Christians. This can be easily verified if other black groups were assessed about their knowledge of these same subjects.

debosky:

I haven't obfuscated anything - the simple fact is that you have demonstrated only correlation and not causation. Simple.

All I have done is highlight other factors which may be the cause, not Christianity.

You have committed the following logical fallacy:

correlation proves causation, is one of several questionable cause logical fallacies by which two events that occur together are taken to have a cause-and-effect relationship

Do you know the meaning of correlation and causation? Evolution is despised by christianity- that is already a given causation. The study puts numbers to it.

If ou have nothing to say, shut up

debosky:
Correction - that is a simplistic argument not a simple one - there are many more factors involved. [size=18pt]Heck we don't even know what 'religious' knowledge we are talking about here - it may be knowledge about Shintoism for all we know. [/size]

Since, regardless of religious orientation, blacks are less educated than the rest of the population (apart from hispanics) this is most likely to be the root cause of the poor performance, not the fact that these particular blacks are Christians. This can be easily verified if other black groups were assessed about their knowledge of these same subjects.

First off, the bold is a strawman and an argument from ignorance. You dont know what the study was about. I do.
http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Society/2010/0928/In-US-atheists-know-religion-better-than-believers.-Is-that-bad


Blacks are also more religious. Religion being one of the cornerstones of ignorance. Chritianity that is directly a acausal factor in the disbeleif in evolution and ignorance of other religions.

Logicboy03: Do you know the meaning of correlation and causation?

I should be asking you this question since you have demonstrated your lack of understanding right from your initial post.

Evolution is despised by christianity- that is already a given causation. The study puts numbers to it.

Despising evolution is not the same as not understanding evolution - the study does not show that evolution is despised by Christianity, it just shows that some do not understand it.

If ou have nothing to say, shut up

Petty and touchy aren't we?

First off, the bold is a strawman and an argument from ignorance. You dont know what the study was about. I do.
http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Society/2010/0928/In-US-atheists-know-religion-better-than-believers.-Is-that-bad

It was a tongue-in-cheek comment, not a strawman in any sense.

Blacks are also more religious. Religion being one of the cornerstones of ignorance. Chritianity that is directly a acausal factor in the disbeleif in evolution and ignorance of other religions.

Christianity could be a direct causal factor in disbelief in evolution I agree, but ignorance of other religions? That is a wider American inward looking issue rather than a peculiarly Christian one.

However my original point still stands - the poorer performance of blacks is indicative of their general educational deficiencies not their Christianity.

Religion is not one of the cornerstones of ignorance - that some use religion as an excuse for their ignorance is a different matter.

debosky:


Christianity could be a direct causal factor in disbelief in evolution I agree, but ignorance of other religions? That is a wider American inward looking issue rather than a peculiarly Christian one.

However my original point still stands - the poorer performance of blacks is indicative of their general educational deficiencies not their Christianity.

Religion is not one of the cornerstones of ignorance - that some use religion as an excuse for their ignorance is a different matter.

Your problem lies here.


You are too delusional to see that christianity on its own breeds ignorance if someone is not careful. That is a given. Tithing and withcbeating is one of them.

You claim that religion is not a cornerstone of ignorance? Really? The very nature of some holy books are ignorant. Women being created from ribs? Talking snakes? Talking animals?


Go and look at the islam section where christians get slaughtered for their ignorance on islam. Only atheists and a very few christians actually know what is in the Quran and islamic history. I being one of the atheists that used to go to the islam section. I was even lecturing muslims on their history.

Logicboy03:
Your problem lies here.

You are too delusional to see that christianity on its own breeds ignorance if someone is not careful. That is a given. Tithing and withcbeating is one of them.

How is tithing equivalent to ignorance? Ignorance of what? Christianity does not breed ignorance - if not for Christianity, most of the educated folk in Nigeria today (including I suspect your forbears) would never have gone to school. If someone wants to use Christianity as an excuse for ignorance, then that's a separate matter.

You claim that religion is not a cornerstone of ignorance? Really? The very nature of some holy books are ignorant. Women being created from ribs? Talking snakes? Talking animals?

The nature of holy books is that they encourage people to study them so they can learn what they teach therein - that by its very nature is NOT ignorance.

Go and look at the islam section where christians get slaughtered for their ignorance on islam. Only atheists and a very few christians actually know what is in the Quran and islamic history. I being one of the atheists that used to go to the islam section. I was even lecturing muslims on their history.

So what? Atheists have likely been dissatisfied by one religion and moved around, hence they learn about many religions on their way to atheism. They are also obsessed with debunking all the religions.

There is no requirement to learn about each and every religion to demonstrate 'knowledge'.

debosky:

How is tithing equivalent to ignorance? Ignorance of what? Christianity does not breed ignorance - if not for Christianity, most of the educated folk in Nigeria today (including I suspect your forbears) would never have gone to school. If someone wants to use Christianity as an excuse for ignorance, then that's a separate matter.



The nature of holy books is that they encourage people to study them so they can learn what they teach therein - that by its very nature is NOT ignorance.

Do you know when schools actually came to Nigeria? Christians had been in Nigeria since 16th century- they enslaved and colonized our ancestors and only deemed them worthy of education in the 19th century. Better read your history. The first schools in nigeria came in the 19th century. I am talking about proper schools of learning. Slavery was also abolished in the 19th century. Coincidence?


As for the nature of holy books, you are igniorant if you believe any of the following to be true events as written in the holy books;

-Muhammad flew into heaven with a winged horse
-The first woman came from a man's rib
-All the animals (in pairs of males and female) fit in Noahs Ark
- Isrealites were enslaved by Egyptians

debosky:
So what? Atheists have likely been dissatisfied by one religion and moved around, hence they learn about many religions on their way to atheism. They are also obsessed with debunking all the religions.

There is no requirement to learn about each and every religion to demonstrate 'knowledge'.

Quite an ignorant statement in bold there.

Logicboy03:
Do you know when schools actually came to Nigeria? Christians had been in Nigeria since 16th century- they enslaved and colonized our ancestors and only deemed them worthy of education in the 19th century. Better read your history. The first schools in nigeria came in the 19th century. I am talking about proper schools of learning. Slavery was also abolished in the 19th century. Coincidence?

Who brought the schools - was it not the Christians? That's what I was talking about, not the timing. Thanks for the unnecessary history lesson.

As for the nature of holy books, you are igniorant if you believe any of the following to be true events as written in the holy books;

-Muhammad flew into heaven with a winged horse
-The first woman came from a man's rib
-All the animals (in pairs of males and female) fit in Noahs Ark
- Isrealites were enslaved by Egyptians

No you are not ignorant, you simply believe things that are at worst improbable or unverifiable or fantasy.

Quite an ignorant statement in bold there.

Why did you learn about Islam? To adhere to it or to point out its flaws? What do you do in the Islam section? Do you go there to support Islamic teachings or to show people the errors in their belief?

A white man went to a surgeon wanting to become black.
The doctor asks him, "do you understand what this entails, we'll darken your complexion by 70%, reduce your brain mass by 30% and add 3 inches to your pipi. Are you fine with this?".
Our hero nodded rather furiously.
After the operation, doctor shows up, with a rather contrite look and explains, "err, we mixed up your notes... We darkened your skin by 30%, your brain mass was reduced by 70%, and we removed 3 inches from your pipi, rather than add...errmm.. Could you...maybe...forgive us?".
"Si senor", the patient replied

Ah, yes, what does this have to do with anything? Look at hispanic catholics on that list. I wonder how much hate this post can generate though

debosky:

Who brought the schools - was it not the Christians? That's what I was talking about, not the timing. Thanks for the unnecessary history lesson.



No you are not ignorant, you simply believe things that are at worst improbable or unverifiable or fantasy.



Why did you learn about Islam? To adhere to it or to point out its flaws? What do you do in the Islam section? Do you go there to support Islamic teachings or to show people the errors in their belief?

Knockout punch..

dessy002:

Knockout punch..

Cheerleading squad

Logicboy03:

Cheerleading squad

Debosky did debunk your stupidity...proud and belligerent olodo...!!!...

wiegraf: A white man went to a surgeon wanting to become black.
The doctor asks him, "do you understand what this entails, we'll darken your complexion by 70%, reduce your brain mass by 30% and add 3 inches to your pipi. Are you fine with this?".
Our hero nodded rather furiously.
After the operation, doctor shows up, with a rather contrite look and explains, "err, we mixed up your notes... We darkened your skin by 30%, your brain mass was reduced by 70%, and we removed 3 inches from your pipi, rather than add...errmm.. Could you...maybe...forgive us?".
"Si senor", the patient replied

Ah, yes, what does this have to do with anything? Look at hispanic catholics on that list. I wonder how much hate this post can generate though

Are you black or white if I may ask??

ijawkid:

Debosky did debunk your stupidity...proud and belligerent olodo...!!!...

lolz another garbage supporter!