doyin13:

Me I need a hug ooo. . . .a snug Bostonian one

awwww . . . here you go Doyin. . . a nice big hug complete with a kiss . Plus if you give me your address, I'll mail you a rainbow sprinkled muffin with a cherry on top

plus permit me to sneak this in, you are waaayy to smart & real to be an atheist Doyin . If anything those philosophy classes annoyed me more than anything, infact I was more sure that God existed in-spite of all that confucious-nism. The only thing dem sabi do na ask question upon question, discuss, "theoritize", ponder, reflect, wonder, and then conclude with more questions
I hated every philosophy class I attended, becos it was an endless annoying cycle of theories, philosophies that never reached any real conclusion - what a way to live life!

I left after each class saying "na una sabi, jus leave me alone with my God, bible and Jesus. I'm all set."

i should never blame the goat for eating the grass in the bush;neither should i blame a dog for biting a criminal.if i blame u 4 the philosophical statements u've made ,then i think i will be making a mistake.First this shows that u dont believe in Jesus.this is very bad;that u can come out on internet to speak against God,THE CONSUMING FIRE shows the point u've reached in your sins and tresspasses.i have personally asked Jesus into my life and oh, i need to tell u the joy that filled my soul.i became so confident and felt like i should serve the LORD for ever.you know so much history yet it seems u dont know the end of atheists,BAD END.some of them die confessing that the greatest mistake they ever made was refusing to believe in Jesus.i pray u dont end that way.if u think i am lying,go check the pages of history that u 'KNOW SO MUCH'.some were on the dying bed and their cries was that of salvation from the pangs of hell.REMEMBER U CANT FIGHT GOD AND WIN.bros go to the same history books and find out the fate of 'THE SINNER IN THE HAND OF AN ANGRY GOD'

Abeg,i suggest every wise,time-conscious person abandon this thread for Mr sun god.Nothing you say to him is gonna make any difference,so what's the point?
@sun god
Keep up the war bro I hope you find the utmost fulfillment and joy from it.I sympathize with you over the poor treatment you've received as a result of your beliefs.As for calling God insane,wow.You will eat your words someday when you realize how wrong you are.
And i agree with JeSoul.You do need a hug.Here,accept one.A kiss too Love is all that matters in the end.And God is love.I pray you find a whole lot of it.
and,i also think you're either therationa or t-paine.which is it?

hns:

i should never blame the goat for eating the grass in the bush;neither should i blame a dog for biting a criminal.if i blame u for the philosophical statements u've made ,then i think i will be making a mistake.First this shows that u don't believe in Jesus.this is very bad;that u can come out on internet to speak against God,THE CONSUMING FIRE shows the point u've reached in your sins and tresspasses.i have personally asked Jesus into my life and oh, i need to tell u the joy that filled my soul.i became so confident and felt like i should serve the LORD for ever.you know so much history yet it seems u don't know the end of atheists,BAD END.some of them die confessing that the greatest mistake they ever made was refusing to believe in Jesus.i pray u don't end that way.if u think i am lying,go check the pages of history that u 'KNOW SO MUCH'.some were on the dying bed and their cries was that of salvation from the pangs of hell.REMEMBER You CANT FIGHT GOD AND WIN.bros go to the same history books and find out the fate of 'THE SINNER IN THE HAND OF AN ANGRY GOD'

lulz, always hearsay with these people. lmao what history book did you see that in exactly? Last line of defense always threats about hell, so much for your loving god eh?

Cassiel:

Abeg,i suggest every wise,time-conscious person abandon this thread for Mr sun god.Nothing you say to him is going to make any difference,so what's the point?
[/i]

I think the thread is interesting, always nice seeing Christians attempt to defend their beliefs when there is no logical basis for it. Of course in the end, they always resort to calling those who dont believe in "God" fools. Of course the proverbs your quoting were written by a man who had over a 1000 wives and concubines, and the psalms were written by a man who killed his friend so he could get his wife.

Its simple, inconsistencies are stated attempt to defend them, if you cant then say so and admit your bible is wrong. Afterall it claims to be the "word of God" and the word of God is perfect no?

Sun God:

This is still not an issue. bob Marley existed. Plain simple. The biographies may be diverse and controversial but no body on this planet would argue that bob Marley never existed. Jesus is another story entirely.

Its a plain Hoax!

Here you are just making an assumption. If no body on this planet should argue that bob Marley never existed, then on body on this planet should argue that Jesus never existed.  What makes Jesus story different from bob's story in terms of wheather they existed.
Have you ever seen bob Marley personally?  The answer no. (Yet you believed he existed.)
Have you ever seen Jesus personally? The answer is no. (But you refuse to believe HE existed.)
Have you ever seen any evidence IE works that bob did when he was alive?  The answer is yes, you hear his music and you are told that the music was made by bob. (Yet you believe he existed)
Have you ever seen any evidence ie works that Jesus did when He was on earth?. The answer is yes, you hear his quotes -- the beatitude-- and you are told that words were said by Jesus. (But you refuse to believe HE existed)

So the question of bob and Jesus are not entirely different. The same evidences that convinced you of bob's existence are also present in the case of Jesus. But in His case you refused to accept. Therefore accept that fact that it is a question of choice on your own part for you cannot convincingly prove that either party ever existed; neither can you convincingly prove otherwise. In this case we employ our commonsense and our intuition because intellectual logic will lead us now where.
In any issue, there are as many reasons for it as there are as many reasons against it. Therefore reasoning that is not guided by the intuitive perception will lead us only in a circle. In your case you let mare choice guide your reasoning, and this is not a refined way to arive at a conclusion

Sun God:

No eye witness accounts that can be verified

No historical records that make sense

Convoluted stories that are side splitters

Widely unimaginable things that christians said he did

The list is endless abeg!

Anyway, thumbs up for a respectful and brain stimulating debate. I appreciate it. thats what rationals do. Ask questions and query them till they get it right!

You can also attribute all you said above to bob Marley's case, yet you chose to believe that he existed.

(No eye witness accounts that can be verified)
can you verify any of the witness accounts of bob Marley's life? Please do so

(No historical records that make sense)
the same can be applied to bob. Infact there is controversy about his actual date of birth which was supposedly recorded.

(Convoluted stories that are side splitters)
the same can be applied to the different biographes of bob

(Widely unimaginable things that christians said he did)
the same can be applied to bob. Some of his biographers claimed he did so many "unimaginable things" ie he could tell the future; he was a prophet; he could lead palms; he fought the devil.

(The list is endless abeg!)
abeg so is the list of things attributed to bob, Hitler, ID amin, and the every figure in history.

(Anyway, thumbs up for a respectful and brain stimulating debate. I appreciate it. thats what rationals do. Ask questions and query them till they get it right!)
Thanks. I also respect you for your obvious intelligence. But I have to warn you that the intellect should only be used as a tool. In any issue, there are as many good reasons for it as much as there good reasons against it. A very inteligent person can give many reasons to prove that you don't exsist and can mislead logic-slaves/intellectual slaves into questioning their own exsistance. Eventhough this sounds laughable but it has happend. We chose to accept any line of reasoning based on many things. Some people, by mare choice, other by predisposition but the advanced person chooses his line of argument by his intuition and commonsense.
Thats why people go to school to learn to be a judge -- to learn to use their commonsense to guide their decision and not remain a slave to reasoning and logic. Suffice to say that the truth in any issue should not be wanting in logic. Everything could be logical, depending on the way you look at it.

justcool:

Here you are just making an assumption. If no body on this planet should argue that bob Marley never existed, then on body on this planet should argue that Jesus never existed. What makes Jesus story different from bob's story in terms of wheather they existed.
Have you ever seen bob Marley personally? The answer no. (Yet you believed he existed.)
Have you ever seen Jesus personally? The answer is no. (But you refuse to believe HE existed.)
Have you ever seen any evidence IE works that bob did when he was alive? The answer is yes, you hear his music and you are told that the music was made by bob. (Yet you believe he existed)
Have you ever seen any evidence ie works that Jesus did when He was on earth?. The answer is yes, you hear his quoates -- the beatitude-- and you are told that words were said by Jesus. (But you refuse to believe HE existed)

So the question of bob and Jesus are not entirely different. The same evidences that convinced you of bob's existence are also present in the case of Jesus. But in His case you refused to accept. Therefore accept that fact that it is a question of choice on your own part for you cannot convincingly prove that either party ever existed nor otherwise. In this case we employ our common seance and our intuition because intellectual logic will lead us now where.
In any issue, there are as many reasons for it as there are as many reasons against it. Therefore reasoning that is not guided by the intuitive perception will lead us only in a circle. In your case you let mare choice guide your reasoning, and this is not a refined way to arive at a conclusion

You can also attribute all you said above to bob Marley's case, yet you chose to believe that he existed.

(No eye witness accounts that can be verified)
can you verify any of the witness accounts of bob Marley's life? Please do so

(No historical records that make sense)
the same can be applied to bob. Infact there is controversy about his actual date of birth which was supposedly recorded.

(Convoluted stories that are side splitters)
the same can be applied to the different biographes of bob

(Widely unimaginable things that christians said he did)
the same can be applied to bob. Some of his biographers claimed he did so many "unimaginable things" ie he could tell the future; he was a prophet; he could lead palms; he fought the devil.

(The list is endless abeg!)
abeg so is the list of things attributed to bob, Hitler, ID amin, and the every figure in history.

(Anyway, thumbs up for a respectful and brain stimulating debate. I appreciate it. thats what rationals do. Ask questions and query them till they get it right!)
Thanks. I also respect you for your obvious intelligence. But I have to warn you that the intellect should only be used as a tool. For any issue, there are as many good reasons for it as much as there good reasons against it. We chose to accept any line of reasoning based on many thing. Some people, by mare choice, other by predisposition but the advanced person chooses his line of argument by his intuition and commonsense.
Thats why people go to school to learn to be a judge -- to learn to use their commonsense to guide their decision and not remain a slave to reasoning and logic. Suffice to say that the truth in any issue should not be wanting in logic, but logic. Everything could be logical, depending on the way you look at it.

Let me put it in a very simple way.

1. Bob marleys children are still existing

2. His grandchildren are still existing

3. I may not have witnessed bob marley live but he is always on Mtv and my mom did attend one of his concerts in england in the 60's or 70's and has a back stage picture to prove it.

Now what i am saying is that from all this rich source of knowledge, it is very very easy for bob marleys name to still ring a bell for centuries to come because there is proof physically.

4. Now i am not disputing that that various biographies of bob marley wont be re edited and redracted over the coming years but it doesnt change some salient facts about bob marley that all men would agree on. e.g

His awards are there for history to see

his schools are still there

his former band mates and children of the band mates

His siblings and so many things which you can point to and say bob marley existed

But jesus doesnt offer any of those proofs.

He was neither recorded as any special being and roman laws then were very meticulous to record all events.

the birth, miracles, apostles, cruxificion, ressurection, ascention and what have you have no basis for believing any of it because it is wasnt there in the first place.

Even if you take jesus out of the picture, the stories of the multitude he fed and preached to would have some way attracted attention that one of them out of the thousands could actually be traced through his geneology.

But till today, not one, not a single one of the thousands and thousands of people he came across can actually be verified.

Even the gospels have been discovered not to be the works of the original disciples because the dates contradict themselves.

My friend proof means tracing history till your fed up and you give up. Till date, nothing has been offered as a sign of proof of his existence, Why then should i believe such psychobabble?

Sun God:

Let me put it in a very simple way.

1. Bob marleys children are still existing

2. His grandchildren are still existing

3. I may not have witnessed bob marley live but he is always on Mtv and my mom did attend one of his concerts in england in the 60's or 70's and has a back stage picture to prove it.

Now what i am saying is that from all this rich source of knowledge, it is very very easy for bob marleys name to still ring a bell for centuries to come because there is proof physically.

4. Now i am not disputing that that various biographies of bob marley wont be re edited and redracted over the coming years but it doesnt change some salient facts about bob marley that all men would agree on. e.g

His awards are there for history to see

his schools are still there

his former band mates and children of the band mates

His siblings and so many things which you can point to and say bob marley existed

But jesus doesnt offer any of those proofs.

He was neither recorded as any special being and roman laws then were very meticulous to record all events.

the birth, miracles, apostles, cruxificion, ressurection, ascention and what have you have no basis for believing any of it because it is wasnt there in the first place.

Even if you take jesus out of the picture, the stories of the multitude he fed and preached to would have some way attracted attention that one of them out of the thousands could actually be traced through his geneology.

But till today, not one, not a single one of the thousands and thousands of people he came across can actually be verified.

Even the gospels have been discovered not to be the works of the original disciples because the dates contradict themselves.

My friend proof means tracing history till your fed up and you give up. Till date, nothing has been offered as a sign of proof of his existence, Why then should i believe such psychobabble?

LOL
1.) Jesus didn't have kids
2.) There couldn't be any grand children since He didn't have kids.
3.) You did not see Jesus personally but He is talked about ten times more than Bob Marley on TV. About your mom attending bobs concert, there has been countless testimonies of people who claim to remember seeing Jesus in their past lives. Also countless Christians today claim to have seen Jesus or claim to see Him on regular basses. And they have miracles which they claim as their prof. About backstage picture, cameras didn't exist the time of Jesus. Ever hared of shroud(the burail cloth of a crucified man discovered) which bears the imprint of the crucified man, some historians believe that the man was Jesus and that is a much an evidence as a picture.
4.) About bob's award. Jesus has a million times more awards than bob today. Every Christian church is supposedly built in His honnor, in other words the churches are his awards and they are physically present today.

About bobs school. -- Parts of the temple in Jerusalem where Jesus once taught still stand s today. Jews, His tribe/people, are still present today.

About bob's former bandmates. -- Jesus live thousands of years ago. It is impossible for any of his associates or his mates to still be alive today.

About bob's siblings. -- Jesus lived thousands of years ago and it is hardly possible to trace his siblings linage to this day. Please can you trace yourself to your ancestors that lived two thousand years ago. Moreover today Jews still exist and since Jesus was Jew, every Jew today could be considered His sibling.

(But Jesus doesn't offer any of those proofs) this statement is Very wrong and very arguable and completely unprovable.

(He was neither recorded as any special being and roman laws then were very meticulous to record all events.) Were Romans that meticulous, even today with all our technological advancement birth records are sometimes missing or recorded wrongly. According to my mother, my birth record is wrong because I was born on a different day that was recorded in my birth certificate. A friend of mine here in America, mistakenly in his birth record it is stated that he was born in Connecticut. So if in the future historians want to trace his existence, they will not find any record of his birth in California where he was actually born. Does this mean he never existed. My grandfathers birth was not recorded any where, infact he doesn't know where he was born, neither does he know his age. Does this mean that my grandfather never existed? Show me in the roman records where the birth of Brutus, Cassius, Casca who allegedly stabbed Caesar was recorded.

(Even if you take jesus out of the picture, the stories of the multitude he fed and preached to would have some way attracted attention that one of them out of the thousands could actually be traced through his geneology.)
Cicero, the great roman orator who live approximately at the time of Jesus spoke to many groups and crowds. Can you trace any body today back to any of the people that listened to Cicero?

(Even the gospels have been discovered not to be the works of the original disciples because the dates contradict themselves.)
still this is not a prof that Jesus never existed. Jesus didn't write the gospel. The gospel and Jesus are two different things. Historians today argue that some of the works attributed to shakespear were not actually written by Shakespeare. There are facts which point to the fact shakespears famous book --Julius Caesar-- was a compilation from many authors. Does this mean that shakespear never existed?

My friend just cool, lol, I cant but help laughing. This particular post is really funny and the only way to answer it back is being comical too:

1.) Jesus didn't have kids
2.) There couldn't be any grand children since He didn't have kids.

What a shame! And up till this moment i was actually thinking that dan brown was right when he said jesus screwed mary magdelene and had a child somewhere in france, lol

To be frank, this doesnt prove anything concrete to show he existed

3.) You did not see Jesus personally but He is talked about ten times more than Bob Marley on TV

Alot of people talk about father christmas, super man, vampires etc everyday but we know they are imaginary folks or creatures. Jesus fits perfectly into this club. As for bob, go to jamaica and see his house, ask his neighbours about him and so on and so forth. Physical evidence is the ultimate evidence.

Touch

see

smell

hear

taste

feel? ( now your sub conscious is taking over you)  So when people feel jesus, it makes atheists laugh. Its just wishful thinking and clinging unto hope.

But as for bob, there are people who can testify that they have touched, smelt, heared, tasted ( Ok maybe the girls he conquered at night or kissed) and seen him one way or the other.

About your mom attending bobs concert, there has been countless testimonies of people who claim to remember seeing Jesus in their past lives. Also countless Christians today claim to have seen Jesus or claim to see Him on regular basses. And they have miracles which they claim as their prof

I have 2 words for all these people who said they have seen him someway:

Demented Hallucinations

Have you seen any of those miracles up close and personal before? Have any of these pastors miraculously cure an amputee? Or does god cure everyone else but hate amputees?, Please just cool, Dont let this people get 2 you. They are all nut jobs.

Ever hared of shroud(the burail cloth of a crucified man discovered) which bears the imprint of the crucified man, some historians believe that the man was Jesus and that is a much an evidence as a picture.

I will beg you not to even engage me in this matter or any other athiests because you would be literally torn to shreds. This spoof of the century, the shroud!!!, Gimme a break, I dont even want to go there right now!

4.) About bob's award. Jesus has a million times more awards than bob today. Every Christian church is supposedly built in His honnor, in other words the churches are his awards and they are physically present today

Arhhh! Zeus, spiderman, bugs bunny, the devil have all got awards too. Jesus is no exception from this infamous imaginary club. As for bob, i can show you a list of were u can see must of his awards and a museum dedicated to him. There is no comparison between them.

If you say jesus's awards are the churches, what about the various Santa Grottos dedicated to father christmas during christ mas or temples of Zeus that are scattered all over europe? Does that mean Santa Claus exists?

About bobs school. -- Parts of the temple in Jerusalem where Jesus once taught still stand s today. Jews, His tribe/people, are still present today.

That can be easily fabricated. It doesnt prove anything. Its just like saying jesus was igbo and the igbo tribes men are still there so therefore jesus exists??, Its not plausible

About bob's former bandmates. -- Jesus live thousands of years ago. It is impossible for any of his associates or his mates to still be alive today.

Thats funny, there is proof to show that a certain herod lived, a certain census was organized by governor quinius of syria at that time and caesar lived, Pontius Pilate even Caphais and Anaias. These  are re occuring famous names in the bible that christians try to associate jesus with. But the main actor has no proof of existence? His father joseph, mother mary, his disciples?? totally devoid of any congent and reasonable proof

About bob's siblings. -- Jesus lived thousands of years ago and it is hardly possible to trace his siblings linage to this day. Please can you trace yourself to your ancestors that lived two thousand years ago. Moreover today Jews still exist and since Jesus was Jew, every Jew today could be considered His sibling.

For someone that important according to the bible, his existence should have been a fait accompli for all the world to know by now. You are at this moment really questioning the veracity of gods logic. Why would god, use his son as a sacrificial lamb to die and disappear without leaving a trace of evidence for future generations to see? If he is really that omniscent, wont he have noticed that in the nearest future some skeptics like me would really love to play the role of the doubting thomas and see some proof of existence?

It really makes no sense really. He neither wrote a book, wrote a scroll, did anything unique to differentiate him, ahhh! its not worth it. The truth just cool about this jesus nonsense is that it is really a badly plagiarized version of ancient pre-christian pagan worship. The similarities are so congent that its almost weepfully shameful for christians to stoop so low and draw inferences from them to make christianity up.

The reason i make fun of it arbitrarily is because i find it hard to adjust to the fact that christian leaders conviently refuse to teach its converts about so many things and its defects and they only pick the ones that sound right and politically correct for the time being to feed their converts.

the moment someone begins to fit the clues in the christianity jig saw puzzles, they begin to get frightened and attack the person so hard from exposing their falsitudes.

for example, since i posted this thread, even though you claim your not that religious or affilated to anyone, you have been the only one addressing issues and confronting them with rational answers which would force me to work on my own research to reply you.

Now where are the so called christians?

you see because the pastors dont equip them to know everything, they are only forced to accept that false denial and fail to think reasonably.  That is why anytime you ask me a question about jesus, i have a thousand and one comical responses to them which would continue to expose more debates about his existence

Anyway as for cicero, if you need to know anything about his date of birth, what is philosophy was or blah blah blah, check wikipedia, its all there with concrete proofs and even his hand written works.


Cicero and Jesus are 2 extremes. One has proof, the other is an apparition.

Talking of apparitions, can you imagine the bullshit of a story by christians when they say jesus , elijah and moses were talking together in a ghost like form and people actually believe that crap, jeez, christians would believe any nonsense

Sun God:




There is no difference between a mad man i see on the road that arbitrarily insults and curses people and god because they both share the same thing!

THEY ARE BOTH INSANE!

Dear Sun god,
Be careful with the kind of comment you make about the person called Jehovah God. Do not allow people's comment to draw you into a personal battle with God. Be wise.

@ sunGod

Abeg SunGod he don do jare

I was just wondering why 4him has decided to ignore this trend. Your response would have brought more fanfare to the trend.

May kelly:


                                         Specially made for - sun god.

Take Note


Psalm 92:6 ,
The [color=#990000]senseless man does not know, fools do not understand,

[b]Psalm 94:8 ,
Take heed, you senseless ones among the people; you fools, when will you become wise?


Proverbs 12:15 ,
The way of a fool seems right to him, but a wise man listens to advice.

Proverbs 1:22 ,
"? How long will mockers delight in mockery and fools hate knowledge?

Proverbs 10:23 ,
A fool finds pleasure in evil conduct, but a man of understanding delights in wisdom. [/color]

[quote][/quote]

@may kelly

Incase you didnt get what i wrote in the other thread for you, i'll past it here for you too:


It goes goes to show how silly you and your god are for writing such sexist passages and trust me to make fun of such buffonery



It took me a while to know what i was going to say to you, until i realised that since we are on the subject of quoting damaging passages from the bible, i just realised that the bible does not give you may kelly any right to talk any how to a man because you are less inferior and beneath man in everything:

Every man who prays or prophesies with his head covered dishonors his head. And every woman who prays or prophesies with her head uncovered dishonors her head—it is just as though her head were shaved. If a woman does not cover her head, she should have her hair cut off; and if it is a disgrace for a woman to have her hair cut off or shaved off, she should cover her head. A man ought not to cover his head, since he is the image and glory of God; but the woman is the glory of man. For man did not come from woman, but woman from man; neither was man created for woman, but woman for man. For this reason, and because of the angels, the woman ought to have a sign of authority on her head. (I Corinthians 11:3-10)

One, i would only believe god exists this moment if you accept that i am superior to you and you have no right to talk shit since Man was not created for woman but woman for man.

If you dont believe that and you want to keep on rambling, i just have to advise you to shut the hell up when your talking to a man. Dont you have any respect for men?

To prove what i am saying:

we find this in 1 Corinthians chapter 14:

As in all the congregations of the saints, women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church.

So why the Bleep are your speaking about biblical things when god told you and the other female pastoresses to shut the hell up?

The fact that you ramble all day long about idiotic bible passages nauseates the shit out of me when you god told you to SHUT UP AND BE SILENT TO MAN

1 Timothy chapter 2:

Let a woman learn in silence with all submissiveness. I permit no woman to teach or to have authority over men; she is to keep silent.

SILENCE, SILENCE AND MORE SILENCE, Are you deaf? Why are you disobeying god who told you to SHUT THE FUCKING HELL UP and allow Men To talk.

Look i wont hear any of your ramblings again until you purge your self from your disobedience and stuborness to man.

god has told you to be silent and submissive. Why then do you engage in a fruitfless war of words when the bible specifically tells you to be silent and not preach?

You better go to church and pray that god does not rain that woe that rightfully belongs to you for disobeying his words.

Your fucking under me and thats the way i want it endorsed by your god!

Sun God:

Alot of people talk about father christmas, super man, vampires etc everyday but we know they are imaginary folks or creatures. Jesus fits perfectly into this club. As for bob, go to jamaica and see his house, ask his neighbours about him and so on and so forth. Physical evidence is the ultimate evidence.

May I bring it to your knowledge that father Christmas -- Santa clause-- actually existed.  Although today we attribute so many things to him in other to entertain kids but the fact remains that Santa clause once lived in Europe. He used to send presents to kids on Christmas. I am glad that you mentioned father Christmas, Jesus today could be likened to father Christmas. Both have so many impossible things attributed to them but it doesn't mean that they never existed. To say that they never existed is like throwing away the bath with the child. After bathing a child, you keep the child and throw away the bath water. Likewise after considering the issue, you should separate the myth from that actual man. You don't discard everything because of some myths associated with it. The History channel today presented a program about Pontus Pilate. I am happy that in your last post you acknowledged that he existed. His birth was recorded, everything about him was recorded and comfirms his recorded dealings in the bible. The bible said he was the roman governor of Judea -- history comfired it. Here we see a person in the life of Christ completely confirmed by history.

Sun God:

If you say jesus's awards are the chuabout the various Santa Grottos dedicated to father christmas during christ mas or temples of Zeus that are scattered all over europe? Does that mean Santa Claus exists?

Yes Santa Claus(saint Nicolas) once existed! Santa means saint in spanish, and claus is an abrivation of Nicolas. I leave you to do the research yourself. Also remember, I never claimed to have convincing evidence based on historical records and archaeological excavations that Jesus existed. My argument is that you cannot prove otherwise either. Therefore it boils down to using your commonsense or your intuitive perception. There as as much logical facts to support that He existed as much as there are to support that He never existed. I have said earlier that in issues like this, mare logical reasoning will not lead us any where. Therefore accept that your conclusion on this issue is completely your choice. You chose to believe the logic that Jesus never existed. The Christian chose to accept it. Since neither of you can show any concrete prof, neither of you have the right to mock the other. In court they use the slogan: "beyond any reasonable doubt." This is the measure for the court. Now apply the same to this issue. His existence has been proved beyond any reasonable doubt of the Christians. Therefore they are not fools to accept His existence. His existence has not been proved beyond any reasonable doubt of you (sun-god). Therefore he has chosses reject His existence. Every individual (likewise every Jury or judge) has the right to decide what is a reasonable doubt to him/her and what is not. That's why people re-apeal their cases to different courts and judges. But every individual is responsible for what he accepts to believe and what he refuses to believe.

Sun God:

It really makes no sense really. He neither wrote a book, wrote a scroll, did anything unique to differentiate him, ahhh! its not worth it. The truth just cool about this jesus nonsense is that it is really a badly plagiarized version of ancient pre-christian pagan worship. The similarities are so congent that its almost weepfully shameful for christians to stoop so low and draw inferences from them to make christianity up.

Obviously their is similarity in between the Jesus story and the ancient mythology. But this does not mean that Jesus never existed. Peharps, the early Christians, in their quest to win pagan converts, introduced so many things that the pagans would respect and fear to the personality of Jesus who was already dead at that time. The ancient Romans claimed that Julius ceaser's father was a lion (myth), this made the superstitious Romans to fear and respect Caesar. Such superstitious people will not accept a God or a son of God born by a human father; hence, in other to win the Romans and in other to place Jesus higher than Caesar in the hearts of Romans, the early Christians started the notion that Jesus didn't have a human father. Of course you and I know that this is impossible. But it doesn't mean that Jesus never existed.
Also it is understandable that the early Christians had a hard time telling people that they(the Christians) denied Jesus and allowed the son of their God to be crucified. Thus they had a hard time facing their own cowardice and betrayal. In their quest to hide their cowardice/betrayal  and win converts they invented the idea that it was Gods plan that Jesus should be crucified.

All these fantasies attributed to Jesus does not mean that Jesus never existed. Up till today people still attach fantastic ideas to their gods. Go and tell any Rastafarian that emperor Haily Selassie of Ethiopia(Rastas believe he is God) is dead. They will laugh at you and tell you that he cannot die. They claim that as a child Haily Selassie painted a picture of a bird which imediately became alive and flew off the page. They circulated such rumors even while Halie Selassie was still alive and despite the fact that Halie Selassie made so many speeches telling people that he was not God yet the rasters refused to listen. Poor angry black sons of slaves were too disgusted with whites and their god that they(the rasters) invented their own god and atrributed it to the person of Halie Selassie (a powerful black king), who they can relate to and whose image would easily win black converts. Perhaps a similar thing happend with the early Christians.

Beyond all these fantasies there is, was, and will ever remain the savior called Jesus, who is of Devine origin. He didn't save the world by His death (such thing are fantasies invented by men) He saves by His words which is the PURE TRUTH. My dear sun god Search for the true Jesus. Don't base your judgement of Him only on the bible, a book written by man. I personally found the true Jesus in a book called In The Light of Truth: The Grail Message by ABD-RU-SHIN. I advise you to read this book.

@just cool

Thanks for the reply and although i would have loved to thrash these issues out with you tonight, i apologize i might not be opportuned because of some work i have to finish tonight. So what about a rain check. Probably tomorrow and i'll get back at you.

One thing though, i admire your frank candour and approach to rational arguments and this is what probably sets you apart from the rest of them on this thread.

Hopefully i will give u a shout out and reply tomorrow .

K, Later!

@Sungod, thank you. We True followers of JESUS CHRIST we do not reply evil talk with evil but rather with good talk; OUR HOLY BIBLE TAUGHT US. "MAY GOD BLESS YOU FOR ALL YOU SAID TO ME"

wow! may kelly beaten at her own game, sungod you are really inspiring, nothing beats a well constructed argument backed with biblical facts.

"Your fucking under me and thats the way i want it endorsed by your god" , pure genius

Sun lord is using logic backed with proofs. Christians should be more tolerant and use logic to counter his arguments. After all, every body likes to be on the right track.

ziontrain: Fellow Nairalanders,

Why do you bother engaging with losers in unprofitable arguments. Abeg ignore this Sun god and let him rot in hell if that is what he wants. No use trying to convince a cynic. When he dies he will find out albeit too late that Jesus really exists. Let him talk all the trash he wants to talk here. Answering him is like giving him recognition. I think he should just be ignored.

If you believe in in this, you should believe in Islam. This is exactly what Islam says.

justcool:

May I bring it to your knowledge that father Christmas -- Santa clause-- actually existed.  Although today we attribute so many things to him in other to entertain kids but the fact remains that Santa clause once lived in Europe. He used to send presents to kids on Christmas. I am glad that you mentioned father Christmas, Jesus today could be likened to father Christmas. Both have so many impossible things attributed to them but it doesn't mean that they never existed. To say that they never existed is like throwing away the bath with the child. After bathing a child, you keep the child and throw away the bath water. Likewise after considering the issue, you should separate the myth from that actual man. You don't discard everything because of some myths associated with it. The History channel today presented a program about Pontus Pilate. I am happy that in your last post you acknowledged that he existed. His birth was recorded, everything about him was recorded and comfirms his recorded dealings in the bible. The bible said he was the roman governor of Judea -- history comfired it. Here we see a person in the life of Christ completely confirmed by history.




Yes Santa Claus(saint Nicolas) once existed! Santa means saint in spanish, and claus is an abrivation of Nicolas. I leave you to do the research yourself. Also remember, I never claimed to have convincing evidence based on historical records and archaeological excavations that Jesus existed. My argument is that you cannot prove otherwise either. Therefore it boils down to using your commonsense or your intuitive perception. There as as much logical facts to support that He existed as much as there are to support that He never existed. I have said earlier that in issues like this, mare logical reasoning will not lead us any where. Therefore accept that your conclusion on this issue is completely your choice. You chose to believe the logic that Jesus never existed. The Christian chose to accept it. Since neither of you can show any concrete prof, neither of you have the right to mock the other. In court they use the slogan: "beyond any reasonable doubt." This is the measure for the court. Now apply the same to this issue. His existence has been proved beyond any reasonable doubt of the Christians. Therefore they are not fools to accept His existence. His existence has not been proved beyond any reasonable doubt of you (sun-god). Therefore he has chosses reject His existence. Every individual (likewise every Jury or judge) has the right to decide what is a reasonable doubt to him/her and what is not. That's why people re-apeal their cases to different courts and judges. But every individual is responsible for what he accepts to believe and what he refuses to believe.



Obviously their is similarity in between the Jesus story and the ancient mythology. But this does not mean that Jesus never existed. Peharps, the early Christians, in their quest to win pagan converts, introduced so many things that the pagans would respect and fear to the personality of Jesus who was already dead at that time. The ancient Romans claimed that Julius ceaser's father was a lion (myth), this made the superstitious Romans to fear and respect Caesar. Such superstitious people will not accept a God or a son of God born by a human father; hence, in other to win the Romans and in other to place Jesus higher than Caesar in the hearts of Romans, the early Christians started the notion that Jesus didn't have a human father. Of course you and I know that this is impossible. But it doesn't mean that Jesus never existed.
Also it is understandable that the early Christians had a hard time telling people that they(the Christians) denied Jesus and allowed the son of their God to be crucified. Thus they had a hard time facing their own cowardice and betrayal. In their quest to hide their cowardice/betrayal  and win converts they invented the idea that it was Gods plan that Jesus should be crucified.

All these fantasies attributed to Jesus does not mean that Jesus never existed. Up till today people still attach fantastic ideas to their gods. Go and tell any Rastafarian that emperor Haily Selassie of Ethiopia(Rastas believe he is God) is dead. They will laugh at you and tell you that he cannot die. They claim that as a child Haily Selassie painted a picture of a bird which imediately became alive and flew off the page. They circulated such rumors even while Halie Selassie was still alive and despite the fact that Halie Selassie made so many speeches telling people that he was not God yet the rasters refused to listen. Poor angry black sons of slaves were too disgusted with whites and their god that they(the rasters) invented their own god and atrributed it to the person of Halie Selassie (a powerful black king), who they can relate to and whose image would easily win black converts. Perhaps a similar thing happend with the early Christians.

Beyond all these fantasies there is, was, and will ever remain the savior called Jesus, who is of Devine origin. He didn't save the world by His death (such thing are fantasies invented by men) He saves by His words which is the PURE TRUTH. My dear sun god Search for the true Jesus. Don't base your judgement of Him only on the bible, a book written by man. I personally found the true Jesus in a book called In The Light of Truth: The Grail Message by ABD-RU-SHIN. I advise you to read this book.