Some apologist say God made us willful beings here on earth to see if we will willingly worship him, but what does that make us? Test subjects, yes, to God we all are test subjects in his lab. This fact is proven in John 9 when it was made clear that it pleased God to make a man blind from birth only so he could prove his miraculous ability, wasting the better part of the man’s existence.

The whole creation thing has never being about us, it has always being about God getting worshiped. It seemed the heavenly worship in Rev 4 is not enough because the highest honor would be to get creatures to worship him willingly and those who don’t will be bathed with fire, forever. This is also why the devil is the greatest enemy of God, because he wants the same thing God wants, willing worship, Isa. 14 v 14 NLT – I’d say we give none of them. Revelation 4 v 11 says God made us for God’s own pleasure - worship, it’s all personal for God, no gain for us except for eternal life, and eternal life to do what? You guessed it, to worship God. So it is all a lie that there is a God who loves us more than anything and would do anything for us. obviously, he doesn’t care about us and he in fact isn’t doing anything for us, since he doesn’t interfere in our affairs neither does it seem write to him to correct natural mistakes, his own mistake actually (if he made matter), and stop deformation in affected babies. So rather than say God doesn’t interfere in our affairs, why not just say God doesn’t care about our affairs, all he cares about is willing mind that will worship him.

It is obvious that God does not want the best for us, what he wants is the best from us. What about dying for us, his test subjects, isn’t that a great offer? No researcher will ever take the place of their test subjects in an experiment, except of course if the result of the experiment is already determined and if there is some personal gain in it. God understands that if we all perish, at least according to his theory of sin, there will be no creature to willingly worship him, so he took a giant leap, incarnated himself as a harmless and loving savior of humanity when he is in fact saving himself. He made salvation so simple: worship me and live, only so you can worship me forever or reject me and languish forever, in a lake of fire. That doesn’t seem like we have much of a choice, and both will end up the same bad way anyway, you either spend your whole existence worshiping a God and nothing more, or spend it having a compulsory swim in a lake of fire – no personal gain, no personal satisfaction for all involved, it’s all about God. But then, it’s a good thing that God doesn’t exist, that’s great comfort, because as an atheist, I can’t imagine swimming compulsorily nor drowning in a lake of fire, is God kidding me? It’s the most grisly, gruesome evil I can imagine, as if the evil we experience daily in this world is not enough and the irony is, it was well thought out, carefully designed, perfectly built and finely tuned by a God who loved us and gave himself for us. Isn’t it clear now that God doesn’t love us but himself?

Like feeding and caring for a rat only so you could test solutions on him, and not caring if the solution kills him or not, as long as you get the answer you are looking for, so it is with God, as long as we willingly worship God, we will live in his little paradise and when we don’t, we get flung into the lake of fire – why? Because as a test subject, when we don’t give the result he expects, we have failed the test and that means he is done with us and he doesn’t care about us anymore, so the best place he think would be nice for us, his creations, is a lake of fire, where there is no repentance or second chance, how forgiving and slow to anger is this God! Once again, it’s a good thing there are no Gods or devils, angels or demons, heaven or hell, river of life or lake of fire. I see we are still nicer than God since we don’t throw expendable lab rats in not even lakes of water, not to imagine lake of fire. Its one thing that we are simply test subject to the Christian God, it’s another thing that we are expendable and liable to experience his worst punishment, which he took his time to design.

That doesn’t sound like we have a loving and caring heavenly father neither does it sound like a reason to be happy about the existence of a God, nor is it a source of comfort to why we have to live through this painful and meaningless existence, as Solomon called it, which ends in death, another painful experience.

Sometimes you sound rebellious, not atheist. The good Lord awaits your return with open arms, thou Prodigal son.

^^^ you can’t disprove something you don’t have proof of. I can’t disprove leprechauns, or Bloody Mary, or ghosts, or Smurfs, or anything that I don’t first have proof of. You can only disprove something by showing how the proof of it is not valid. So to disprove God, you have to use present proofs.

Hope you understand the logic!

^^^Hmmm...having difficulties convincing your brethren that you are Atheist? Don't worry some people can't come to terms with the fact that I am Christian

striktlymi: ^^^Hmmm...having difficulties convincing your brethren that you are Atheist? Don't worry some people can't come to terms with the fact that I am Christian

glad you understand my plight now address the op

ooman I must give it to you, you sure know how to bring about a comic relief when everywhere seem boring...Lol!!!

ooman: Some apologist

I hope you don't take me for an apologist?

ooman:
say God made us willful beings here on earth to see if we will willingly worship him, but what does that make us? Test subjects, yes, to God we all are test subjects in his lab.

Well ooman, the free will God gave is not just meant for him to see whether or not we will worship him willingly. God made us in his own image and likeness and as such, it is expedient that he allow us make our own decisions, which includes whether we want to know him, love him and worship him or not.

It takes sheer brute and strength to force someone to worship you but an act of love and respect for an individual to allow another decide to worship him or not. One does not make another a test subject simply by allowing the individual make his own decisions.

On the contrary, one becomes a test subject for the very reason that the individual is not permitted to choose. Take a 'lab rat' for example. That's a typical test subject that is not allowed to choose freedom or captivity. If the lab rat had been given the freedom of choice, I bet it won't be in a cage.

Now to the ish with blind Bartimaeus...

ooman:
This fact is proven in John 9 when it was made clear that it pleased God to make a man blind from birth only so he could prove his miraculous ability, wasting the better part of the man’s existence.

John 9:3
Good News Translation (GNT)
3 Jesus answered, “His blindness has nothing to do with his sins or his parents' sins. He is blind so that God's power might be seen at work in him. 4 As long as it is day, we must do the work of him who sent me; night is coming when no one can work. 5 While I am in the world, I am the light for the world.”

When it is said that God is pleased that a man is born blind, the simple meaning is that God is aware that the child will be blind and allowed that to happen. You some times argue against intelligent design because of this same reason...how can there be an intelligent designer with the many imperfections we have in nature?...

There lies your answer ooman...some of the imperfections are allowed to be by him. Now, what the designer does with his designs is entirely up to him. A fashion designer has the freedom of being creative...he can decide to make a shirt with sleeves and another without sleeves...

Can it be said that because one shirt is made without sleeves then the designer is making a test subject out of that shirt? Why not say that the one with sleeves is actually the test subject? The ish we are having is that man has set a standard for himself, such that when some things do not meet such standards, we tag it generally as bad.

But the truth is that, the beauty of God's creation lies deep within our souls and not the flesh...the flesh ultimately dies but the spirit lives on. To you, Bartimaeus is blind but to God Bartemaeus can see because the spirit can never be blind when one is with God.

ooman:
The whole creation thing has never being about us, it has always being about God getting worshiped.

Really? God only cared about our worship of him and decided to go through the troubles of given man free will? I don't think so. It does not make much sense for me to want worship at all costs and allow the creatures I can force to worship me by taking away their free will go about disobeying my every law.

ooman:
It seemed the heavenly worship in Rev 4 is not enough because the highest honor would be to get creatures to worship him willingly

You forget that the heavenly worship God gets is done by his creatures who decided to worship him willingly. Refer to the battle between the armies of God and that of Lucifer. Lucifer prefers not to worship and he was not forced out of this decision. Those who remained with God were not forced too, they decided to worship him of their own free will.

ooman:
and those who don’t will be bathed with fire, forever.

This is really funny...do you disobey the laws of Nigeria and expect to get away with it if the Government own up to their duties? Would it be wrong to sentence a man to jail for breaking the law? I really do not see how it is wrong to punish one who is disobedient to constituted authorities.

ooman:
This is also why the devil is the greatest enemy of God, because he wants the same thing God wants, willing worship, Isa. 14 v 14 NLT – I’d say we give none of them.

The Devil is not God's greatest enemy because of just worship...it is about winning the souls of Men. The Devil has promised to take his dismissal from the heavenly court on humans and that is why the war he started ages ago rages on to this day.

ooman:
Revelation 4 v 11 says God made us for God’s own pleasure - worship, it’s all personal for God, no gain for us except for eternal life, and eternal life to do what? You guessed it, to worship God. So it is all a lie that there is a God who loves us more than anything and would do anything for us. obviously, he doesn’t care about us and he in fact isn’t doing anything for us, since he doesn’t interfere in our affairs

Everything is all about worship and he came down, assumed the flesh of man, allowed himself to be killed because he does not love us? That to me does not sound like a God who wants only worship and who lack care.

ooman:
neither does it seem write to him to correct natural mistakes, his own mistake actually (if he made matter), and stop deformation in affected babies. So rather than say God doesn’t interfere in our affairs, why not just say God doesn’t care about our affairs, all he cares about is willing mind that will worship him.

A glass cup is left on a ball and I had the opportunity of taking it down but decide to leave it to see what will happen...the glass cup fell and shatters on the ground and I scream: ohhhh my mistake? Will that qualify as a mistake? I don't think so. When God allows something he can correct happen, that indeed is no mistake.

ooman:
It is obvious that God does not want the best for us, what he wants is the best from us. What about dying for us, his test subjects, isn’t that a great offer? No researcher will ever take the place of their test subjects in an experiment, except of course if the result of the experiment is already determined and if there is some personal gain in it. God understands that if we all perish, at least according to his theory of sin, there will be no creature to willingly worship him, so he took a giant leap, incarnated himself as a harmless and loving savior of humanity when he is in fact saving himself. He made salvation so simple: worship me and live, only so you can worship me forever or reject me and languish forever, in a lake of fire. That doesn’t seem like we have much of a choice, and both will end up the same bad way anyway, you either spend your whole existence worshiping a God and nothing more, or spend it having a compulsory swim in a lake of fire – no personal gain, no personal satisfaction for all involved, it’s all about God. But then, it’s a good thing that God doesn’t exist, that’s great comfort, because as an atheist, I can’t imagine swimming compulsorily nor drowning in a lake of fire, is God kidding me? It’s the most grisly, gruesome evil I can imagine, as if the evil we experience daily in this world is not enough and the irony is, it was well thought out, carefully designed, perfectly built and finely tuned by a God who loved us and gave himself for us. Isn’t it clear now that God doesn’t love us but himself?

Obasanjo wants Nigerians to vote for him...

Obasanjo decides to give up his wealth and affluence because he needs these votes...

Obasanjo has the choice of rigging the election and be president anyways...

Obasanjo will still have a hard time getting votes even when he becomes poor for the people...

Obasanjo decides to become poor instead because he wants people to vote for him in order to become president...

Does that sum up what you just told us? What wonderful logic!

ooman:
Like feeding and caring for a rat only so you could test solutions on him, and not caring if the solution kills him or not, as long as you get the answer you are looking for, so it is with God, as long as we willingly worship God, we will live in his little paradise and when we don’t, we get flung into the lake of fire – why? Because as a test subject, when we don’t give the result he expects, we have failed the test and that means he is done with us and he doesn’t care about us anymore, so the best place he think would be nice for us, his creations, is a lake of fire, where there is no repentance or second chance, how forgiving and slow to anger is this God! Once again, it’s a good thing there are no Gods or devils, angels or demons, heaven or hell, river of life or lake of fire. I see we are still nicer than God since we don’t throw expendable lab rats in not even lakes of water, not to imagine lake of fire. Its one thing that we are simply test subject to the Christian God, it’s another thing that we are expendable and liable to experience his worst punishment, which he took his time to design.

Refer to my comments above...

ooman:
That doesn’t sound like we have a loving and caring heavenly father neither does it sound like a reason to be happy about the existence of a God, nor is it a source of comfort to why we have to live through this painful and meaningless existence, as Solomon called it, which ends in death, another painful experience.

Refer to my comments above...

Excuses offered for lack of answeres

striktlymi: ooman I must give it to you, you sure know how to bring about a comic relief when everywhere seem boring...Lol!!!

striktlymi: I hope you don't take me for an apologist?

why not, according to Mat 28v19-20 you must preach the gospel, and another place in NT says you must defend your faith but run away when you are loosing - my emphasis added

striktlymi: Well ooman, the free will God gave is not just meant for him to see whether or not we will worship him willingly. God made us in his own image and likeness and as such, it is expedient that he allow us make our own decisions, which includes whether we want to know him, love him and worship him or not.

the decision that he already knows right? then we are not making a decision, we are only following his set path. except if he doesnt know them, then we are really making a decision.

striktlymi: It takes sheer brute and strength to force someone to worship you but an act of love and respect for an individual to allow another decide to worship him or not. One does not make another a test subject simply by allowing the individual make his own decisions.

YES, one does test someone by waiting for which decision he might take. stop denying logic again. How can you say the bolded. You put two options before someone, you might want to test the person to see which options he might go for, probably to blackmail the person. This is exactly what god did for man, when he told Adam he shouldnt eat of the centered sweet fascinating fruit. He was testing him only so he could blackmail him and hold him hostage of worship forever.

striktlymi: On the contrary, one becomes a test subject for the very reason that the individual is not permitted to choose. Take a 'lab rat' for example. That's a typical test subject that is not allowed to choose freedom or captivity. If the lab rat had been given the freedom of choice, I bet it won't be in a cage.

but such is not the case with god. remember he directs the affair of man according to Isa. 41v4 NLT. So, just like the lab rat, we dont have much options too.

striktlymi: Now to the ish with blind Bartimaeus...


John 9:3
Good News Translation (GNT)
3 Jesus answered, “His blindness has nothing to do with his sins or his parents' sins. He is blind so that God's power might be seen at work in him. 4 As long as it is day, we must do the work of him who sent me; night is coming when no one can work. 5 While I am in the world, I am the light for the world.”

When it is said that God is pleased that a man is born blind, the simple meaning is that God is aware that the child will be blind and allowed that to happen. You some times argue against intelligent design because of this same reason...how can there be an intelligent designer with the many imperfections we have in nature?...

There lies your answer ooman...some of the imperfections are allowed to be by him. Now, what the designer does with his designs is entirely up to him. A fashion designer has the freedom of being creative...he can decide to make a shirt with sleeves and another without sleeves...

then your god must be really evil and at such, he is not worthy of worship. How could he allow death and diseases always, how could he allow bacterial resistance to our drugs, nullifying oyr efforts? how does that sound like a loving father to you?

striktlymi: Can it be said that because one shirt is made without sleeves then the designer is making a test subject out of that shirt? Why not say that the one with sleeves is actually the test subject? The ish we are having is that man has set a standard for himself, such that when some things do not meet such standards, we tag it generally as bad.

why not? what if the designer is really making a test and see how the market accepts one design or the other.

i set no standard. The only thing that baffles me is how a loving god loves horror movie so much, loves to see children die of hunger and diseases when in the bible, he helped as many, what is happening now. why are many African children dieing of hunger, why cant jesus feed them with 12 loafs of bread anymore?

striktlymi: But the truth is that, the beauty of God's creation lies deep within our souls and not the flesh...the flesh ultimately dies but the spirit lives on. To you, Bartimaeus is blind but to God Bartemaeus can see because the spirit can never be blind when one is with God.

there is no evidence for that

SENTIMENTS- is what the above is

striktlymi: Really? God only cared about our worship of him and decided to go through the troubles of given man free will? I don't think so. It does not make much sense for me to want worship at all costs and allow the creatures I can force to worship me by taking away their free will go about disobeying my every law.

did you read my opening speech - that "willing" worship is what god wants now, he's probably tired of angels, which is why he threatens us with hell.

striktlymi: You forget that the heavenly worship God gets is done by his creatures who decided to worship him willingly. Refer to the battle between the armies of God and that of Lucifer. Lucifer prefers not to worship and he was not forced out of this decision. Those who remained with God were not forced too, they decided to worship him of their own free will.

except that was what they were created to do, angels dont have option of worshiping god or not, they either worship him or get flung to hell, like the devil was or have you suddenly forgotten that? and we are victims of the same evil, silly xtian god!

striktlymi: This is really funny...do you disobey the laws of Nigeria and expect to get away with it if the Government own up to their duties? Would it be wrong to sentence a man to jail for breaking the law? I really do not see how it is wrong to punish one who is disobedient to constituted authorities.

you want to compare jail term with billions and trillions of years of eternity of infinity in lake of fire that god has decided to punish people just because of mistakes they make in 80 or 100 years they live "willingly"? Pls stop denying obvious fact here that god's punishment is too cruel.!

striktlymi: The Devil is not God's greatest enemy because of just worship...it is about winning the souls of Men. The Devil has promised to take his dismissal from the heavenly court on humans and that is why the war he started ages ago rages on to this day.

yea, winning the soul of men for what exactly? isnt it for worship like satanist do this days? na wa for you ooo!

striktlymi: Everything is all about worship and he came down, assumed the flesh of man, allowed himself to be killed because he does not love us? That to me does not sound like a God who wants only worship and who lack care.

did you read this?

ooman: It is obvious that God does not want the best for us, what he wants is the best from us. What about dying for us, his test subjects, isn’t that a great offer? No researcher will ever take the place of their test subjects in an experiment, except of course if the result of the experiment is already determined and if there is some personal gain in it. God understands that if we all perish, at least according to his theory of sin, there will be no creature to willingly worship him, so he took a giant leap, incarnated himself as a harmless and loving savior of humanity when he is in fact saving himself. He made salvation so simple: worship me and live, only so you can worship me forever or reject me and languish forever, in a lake of fire. That doesn’t seem like we have much of a choice, and both will end up the same bad way anyway, you either spend your whole existence worshiping a God and nothing more, or spend it having a compulsory swim in a lake of fire – no personal gain, no personal satisfaction for all involved, it’s all about God. But then, it’s a good thing that God doesn’t exist, that’s great comfort, because as an atheist, I can’t imagine swimming compulsorily nor drowning in a lake of fire, is God kidding me? It’s the most grisly, gruesome evil I can imagine, as if the evil we experience daily in this world is not enough and the irony is, it was well thought out, carefully designed, perfectly built and finely tuned by a God who loved us and gave himself for us. Isn’t it clear now that God doesn’t love us but himself?

na wa for you ooo!!

striktlymi: A glass cup is left on a ball and I had the opportunity of taking it down but decide to leave it to see what will happen...the glass cup fell and shatters on the ground and I scream: ohhhh my mistake? Will that qualify as a mistake? I don't think so. When God allows something he can correct happen, that indeed is no mistake.

so god can really help the situations around but decided to keep watching as everything falls into sh1t your god must really love horror movies then.

he watch as over 300 African children dies of hunger, HIV and malaria daily

as the black death killed millions of europeans in the middle ages.

what sort of a god does that The xtian god is indeed not worthy of our worship.

striktlymi: Obasanjo wants Nigerians to vote for him...

Obasanjo decides to give up his wealth and affluence because he needs these votes...

Obasanjo has the choice of rigging the election and be president anyways...

Obasanjo will still have a hard time getting votes even when he becomes poor for the people...

Obasanjo decides to become poor instead because he wants people to vote for him in order to become president...

Does that sum up what you just told us? What wonderful logic!

such dumb logic and analogy. how many times will i tell you to stop taking man for god in your analogies. man is not perfect, god is, man exists, god does not.

and how does this apply to what you quoted?

striktlymi: Refer to my comments above...



Refer to my comments above...

excuses for lack of answers

striktlymi: ooman I must give it to you, you sure know how to bring about a comic relief when everywhere seem boring...Lol!!!



I hope you don't take me for an apologist?



Well ooman, the free will God gave is not just meant for him to see whether or not we will worship him willingly. God made us in his own image and likeness and as such, it is expedient that he allow us make our own decisions, which includes whether we want to know him, love him and worship him or not.

It takes sheer brute and strength to force someone to worship you but an act of love and respect for an individual to allow another decide to worship him or not. One does not make another a test subject simply by allowing the individual make his own decisions.

On the contrary, one becomes a test subject for the very reason that the individual is not permitted to choose. Take a 'lab rat' for example. That's a typical test subject that is not allowed to choose freedom or captivity. If the lab rat had been given the freedom of choice, I bet it won't be in a cage.

Now to the ish with blind Bartimaeus...



John 9:3
Good News Translation (GNT)
3 Jesus answered, “His blindness has nothing to do with his sins or his parents' sins. He is blind so that God's power might be seen at work in him. 4 As long as it is day, we must do the work of him who sent me; night is coming when no one can work. 5 While I am in the world, I am the light for the world.”

When it is said that God is pleased that a man is born blind, the simple meaning is that God is aware that the child will be blind and allowed that to happen. You some times argue against intelligent design because of this same reason...how can there be an intelligent designer with the many imperfections we have in nature?...

There lies your answer ooman...some of the imperfections are allowed to be by him. Now, what the designer does with his designs is entirely up to him. A fashion designer has the freedom of being creative...he can decide to make a shirt with sleeves and another without sleeves...

Can it be said that because one shirt is made without sleeves then the designer is making a test subject out of that shirt? Why not say that the one with sleeves is actually the test subject? The ish we are having is that man has set a standard for himself, such that when some things do not meet such standards, we tag it generally as bad.

But the truth is that, the beauty of God's creation lies deep within our souls and not the flesh...the flesh ultimately dies but the spirit lives on. To you, Bartimaeus is blind but to God Bartemaeus can see because the spirit can never be blind when one is with God.



Really? God only cared about our worship of him and decided to go through the troubles of given man free will? I don't think so. It does not make much sense for me to want worship at all costs and allow the creatures I can force to worship me by taking away their free will go about disobeying my every law.



You forget that the heavenly worship God gets is done by his creatures who decided to worship him willingly. Refer to the battle between the armies of God and that of Lucifer. Lucifer prefers not to worship and he was not forced out of this decision. Those who remained with God were not forced too, they decided to worship him of their own free will.



This is really funny...do you disobey the laws of Nigeria and expect to get away with it if the Government own up to their duties? Would it be wrong to sentence a man to jail for breaking the law? I really do not see how it is wrong to punish one who is disobedient to constituted authorities.



The Devil is not God's greatest enemy because of just worship...it is about winning the souls of Men. The Devil has promised to take his dismissal from the heavenly court on humans and that is why the war he started ages ago rages on to this day.



Everything is all about worship and he came down, assumed the flesh of man, allowed himself to be killed because he does not love us? That to me does not sound like a God who wants only worship and who lack care.



A glass cup is left on a ball and I had the opportunity of taking it down but decide to leave it to see what will happen...the glass cup fell and shatters on the ground and I scream: ohhhh my mistake? Will that qualify as a mistake? I don't think so. When God allows something he can correct happen, that indeed is no mistake.



Obasanjo wants Nigerians to vote for him...

Obasanjo decides to give up his wealth and affluence because he needs these votes...

Obasanjo has the choice of rigging the election and be president anyways...

Obasanjo will still have a hard time getting votes even when he becomes poor for the people...

Obasanjo decides to become poor instead because he wants people to vote for him in order to become president...

Does that sum up what you just told us? What wonderful logic!



Refer to my comments above...



Refer to my comments above...

couldnt read through the long epistle but i got the idea.Yahweh gave us freewill and its up to us whether we worship him or not.he's not forcing us to but if we dont,he'd make sure we suffer here on earth and still burn in a fiery fire.

Delafruita:
couldnt read through the long epistle but i got the idea.Yahweh gave us freewill and its up to us whether we worship him or not.he's not forcing us to but if we dont,he'd make sure we suffer here on earth and still burn in a fiery fire.

Good day Dela,

That's not exactly true...since you didn't read through the post, my first inclination is to pretend as if I didn't see this but what da heck...

When someomeone commits murder and he is sentenced to death or life in prison, do we say that the judge is unjust?

DOnt expect any love from our Pagan Gods. They do not love us as do the xtian and muslim Gods. Our Gods are Spiritual Forces above such base human emotions and temptations.

PAGAN 9JA:
DOnt expect any love from our Pagan Gods. They do not love us as do the xtian and muslim Gods. Our Gods are Spiritual Forces above such base human emotions and temptations.

LWKMD!!!

striktlymi:

Good day Dela,

That's not exactly true...since you didn't read through the post, my first inclination is to pretend as if I didn't see this but what da heck...

When someomeone commits murder and he is sentenced to death or life in prison, do we say that the judge is unjust?

you want to compare jail term with billions and trillions of years of eternity of infinity in lake of fire that god has decided to punish people just because of mistakes they make in 80 or 100 years they live "willingly"? Pls stop denying obvious fact here that god's punishment is too cruel.!

ooman:

you want to compare jail term with billions and trillions of years of eternity of infinity in lake of fire that god has decided to punish people just because of mistakes they make in 80 or 100 years they live "willingly"? Pls stop denying obvious fact here that god's punishment is too cruel.!

You want to compare the flesh and the spirit? Punishments meted on the flesh is different from that given to the spirit.

striktlymi:

You want to compare the flesh and the spirit? Punishments meted on the flesh is different from that given to the spirit.

seriously now you know the spirit is different from the flesh?? what about those times that you use analogy of man in place of god?? na wa for you ooo

striktlymi:

You want to compare the flesh and the spirit? Punishments meted on the flesh is different from that given to the spirit.

so you seriously think eternal damnation is just you must be a boko haram member

ooman: Excuses offered for lack of answeres
why not, according to Mat 28v19-20 you must preach the gospel, and another place in NT says you must defend your faith but run away when you are loosing - my emphasis added

I don't consider myself an apologist! I am not smart enough to be one!

ooman:
the decision that he already knows right? then we are not making a decision, we are only following his set path. except if he doesnt know them, then we are really making a decision.

The above has been thrashed before. Refer to the discuss in https://www.nairaland.com/1254148/why-idea-god-fraud/6#15236954

ooman:
YES, one does test someone by waiting for which decision he might take. stop denying logic again.

You have started with this baseless accusations again. You know full well that being a test-subject (as used by you) is very different from testing someone. Need I explain the difference to you?

ooman: How can you say the bolded. You put two options before someone, you might want to test the person to see which options he might go for, probably to blackmail the person. This is exactly what god did for man, when he told Adam he shouldnt eat of the centered sweet fascinating fruit. He was testing him only so he could blackmail him and hold him hostage of worship forever.

You really amaze me by this line of thought...are you saying that it is wrong for a Father to have his own stuff because he has children around? God did the responsible thing by keeping the tree separate in order to avoid a mix-up somewhere.

If a dad asks his children not to mess around with his stuff, he actually means that and when the kids decide to be naughty, do we then say that the Father is wrong to have gotten some things for himself?

ooman:
but such is not the case with god. remember he directs the affair of man according to Isa. 41v4 NLT. So, just like the lab rat, we dont have much options too.

Directing the affairs of man is just like saying without God there won't be man. That is, God is a prerequisite for the existence of man. It does not mean that God decides for man.

ooman:
then your god must be really evil and at such, he is not worthy of worship. How could he allow death and diseases always, how could he allow bacterial resistance to our drugs, nullifying oyr efforts? how does that sound like a loving father to you?

If you must know, death, diseases etc are a consequence for sin. Man chose to sin and in effect chose the path to sickness, death and the likes...if man had not sinned, all these wouldn't have happened.

Do we say that a man who chooses the path of lawlessness does not necessarily choose the path to the jail house or gallows?

ooman:
why not? what if the designer is really making a test and see how the market accepts one design or the other.

The point is still the same...different designs does not necessarily imply a deformity.

ooman:
i set no standard. The only thing that baffles me is how a loving god loves horror movie so much, loves to see children die of hunger and diseases when in the bible, he helped as many, what is happening now. why are many African children dieing of hunger, why cant jesus feed them with 12 loafs of bread anymore?

God has given man more than enough resources for everyone to get by. There are more than enough to feed every man, woman and child in the world but sadly, these resources have been hijacked by a few. The ish we have in terms of starvation etc is not that God has not provided but that man is being inhuman to man.

ooman:
there is no evidence for that

SENTIMENTS- is what the above is

You make me laugh!

ooman:
did you read my opening speech - that "willing" worship is what god wants now, he's probably tired of angels, which is why he threatens us with hell.

The Angels worship him willingly!

ooman:
except that was what they were created to do, angels dont have option of worshiping god or not,

If there is no option then Lucifer would have remained an Angel.

ooman:
they either worship him or get flung to hell, like the devil was or have you suddenly forgotten that? and we are victims of the same evil, silly xtian god!

It is amazing how we are quick to say things we won't tolerate as humans. A president will never accept a coup d'état or even espionage will merit someone the hang man's noose...a captain of a ship will not accept any form of mutiny...thinking of it alone may earn you death but when it comes to God, the story is different. Hypocrisy is what I call it.

Lucifer mutinied against God and got a just punishment for his actions!

ooman:
you want to compare jail term with billions and trillions of years of eternity of infinity in lake of fire that god has decided to punish people just because of mistakes they make in 80 or 100 years they live "willingly"? Pls stop denying obvious fact here that god's punishment is too cruel.!

You want to compare punishment meted against the flesh with that given to the spirit?

ooman:
yea, winning the soul of men for what exactly? isnt it for worship like satanist do this days? na wa for you ooo!

If a president wants service, you want respect from your kids when they come, I want to dominate my computer, another person wants to ride his horse the way he sees fit, why then do we complain when God wants worship from his creatures? Do you ask a horse if you can ride before you ride it? But God wants us to choose whether to worship him or not.

ooman:
did you read this?

na wa for you ooo!!

so god can really help the situations around but decided to keep watching as everything falls into sh1t your god must really love horror movies then.

Do you have principles? If you do, you would know the essence of not breaking those principles at will. God has designed it such that man will be self sufficient...need I repeat this again? Abeg refer to my previous comment.

ooman:
he watch as over 300 African children dies of hunger, HIV and malaria daily

as the black death killed millions of europeans in the middle ages.

what sort of a god does that The xtian god is indeed not worthy of our worship.

Refer to my earlier comment!

ooman:
such dumb logic and analogy. how many times will i tell you to stop taking man for god in your analogies. man is not perfect, god is, man exists, god does not.

and how does this apply to what you quoted?

I am glad you know that that the logic you presented was dumb!

ooman:

seriously now you know the spirit is different from the flesh?? what about those times that you use analogy of man in place of god?? na wa for you ooo

You only believe in the known, hence the need to use what you can relate with to explain that which you can't understand.

striktlymi:

I don't consider myself an apologist! I am not smart enough to be one!

if you are not an apologist, then, why are you replying critics. You dont need a ccertificate to be aan apologist, you are one already. or dont you know what it means to be an apologist anymore? na wa oo!

striktlymi: The above has been thrashed before. Refer to the discuss in https://www.nairaland.com/1254148/why-idea-god-fraud/6#15236954

in your dreams. all the did was prevaricate.

striktlymi: You have started with this baseless accusations again. You know full well that being a test-subject (as used by you) is very different from testing someone. Need I explain the difference to you?

what "baseless" accusations?

what I have there usa fact.

striktlymi: You really amaze me by this line of thought...are you saying that it is wrong for a Father to have his own stuff because he has children around? God did the responsible thing by keeping the tree separate in order to avoid a mix-up somewhere.

ha ha now you really amaze me with this pathetically dumb reply. why cant god put that totally unnecessary tree on a volcanic island in polynesia or somewhere in the middle of sahara desert where no man inhabits in the beginning.

do you really have to make your self dumb just to make an already dumb god sound wise??

striktlymi: If. a dad asks his children not to mess around with his stuff, he actually means that and when the kids decide to be naughty, do we then say that the Father is wrong to have gotten some things for himself?

A wise dad wont put his next presentation where his two years old can tear it or scribble on it. that is exactly what god did. how silly and stu.pid

striktlymi: Directing the affairs of man is just like saying without God there won't be man. That is, God is a prerequisite for the existence of man. It does not mean that God decides for man.

you obviously have problems understanding english language.

you know, you are really annoying when you deny the obvious. next time ignore what you cant answer.

when someone directs, what does hhe do? he controls. the opinions of his subjects do mot matter. he is the boss, his decision is final and that iis exactly what god does according to isaiah, which is wwhy we lack freewill if god exist.

striktlymi: If you must know, death, diseases etc are a consequence for sin. Man chose to sin and in effect chose the path to sickness, death and the likes...if man had not sinned, all these wouldn't have happened.

man didnt choose to sin because god already knows man would sin which man must or god's foreknowledge is false and god becomes fallible.

what am struggling to understand is how the eating of a fruit affect the amount of rrain that falls for example which leads to flood tthat kills man or how ut turned lion to aa catnivore or changed man's physiology to this present one overnight.

striktlymi: Do we say that a man who chooses the path of lawlessness does not necessarily choose the path to the jail house or gallows?

how exactly did man "choose " lawlessness by eating a fascinating fruit?

striktlymi: The point is still the same...different designs does not necessarily imply a deformity.

except if it is inherent on the designs to fail, or loose suddenly as life dies or fails suddenly

striktlymi: God has given man more than enough resources for everyone to get by. There are more than enough to feed every man, woman and child in the world but sadly, these resources have been hijacked by a few. The ish we have in terms of starvation etc is not that God has not provided but that man is being inhuman to man.

so god put man in mercy of man and see how everything goes? good plan

striktlymi: You make me laugh!

you just did

striktlymi: The Angels worship him willingly!

ir they get flung to hell. they have no option. they are slaves of worship because god is aa tyrant and a dictator.

striktlymi: If there is no option then Lucifer would have remained an Angel.

what exactly is he now, a man or a cow

striktlymi: Itis amazing how we are quick to say things we won't tolerate as humans. A president will never accept a coup d'état or even espionage will merit someone the hang man's noose...a captain of a ship will not accept any form of mutiny...thinking of it alone may earn you death but when it comes to God, the story is different. Hypocrisy is what I call it.

so you really think that etetnity of lake of fire. is just? then you must also think god is just right for killing lit's wife

striktlymi: Lucifer mutinied against God and got a just punishment for his actions!

immediate eternal damnation without second thought or second chance, you call that just?

striktlymi: You want to compare punishment meted against the flesh with that given to the spirit?

lame failed excuse. the fact is that the pubishment is etetnal and that is unjust. even man offer parole to those condemned to life imprisonment.

striktlymi: If a president wants service, you want respect from your kids when they come, I want to dominate my computer, another person wants to ride his horse the way he sees fit, why then do we complain when God wants worship from his creatures? Do you ask a horse if you can ride before you ride it? But God wants us to choose whether to worship him or not.

if god wants my money, I can give him the little i can afford, but I cant give the beggar my life and time
that is too much. a president could also ask that all his country men start worshipping him and we ll see how that goes. everything other thing can be given, never my life in worship.

striktlymi: Do you have principles? If you do, you would know the essence of not breaking those principles at will. God has designed it such that man will be self sufficient...need I repeat this again? Abeg refer to my previous comment.

and who says its just about man? what about the processes we have absolutely no control over like earthquake and mutations in embryos. abeg commot for here

striktlymi: Refer to my earlier comment!

absolutely useless and uunrelated earlier comment uh?

striktlymi: I am glad you know that that the logic you presented was dumb!

am glad you agree your logic and analogy was dumb but why use it when you know it was dumb?

ooman:

if you are not an apologist, then, why are you replying critics. You dont need a ccertificate to be aan apologist, you are one already. or dont you know what it means to be an apologist anymore? na wa oo!

...for sports really! It's kinda dull being on sabbatical without having a 'past time'

ooman:
in your dreams. all the did was prevaricate.

what "baseless" accusations?

what I have there usa fact.

Empty!!!

ooman:
ha ha now you really amaze me with this pathetically dumb reply. why cant god put that totally unnecessary tree on a volcanic island in polynesia or somewhere in the middle of sahara desert where no man inhabits in the beginning.

do you really have to make your self dumb just to make an already dumb god sound wise??

If you want your car not to be stolen by armed robbers, I guess in your view, it would be wise to lock your car in a tilt? Or it would be foolish for a parent to keep his belongings inside the home just because the Children would still have access to it?

ooman:
A wise dad wont put his next presentation where his two years old can tear it or scribble on it. that is exactly what god did. how silly and stu.pid

A two year old would do something without fear of repercussions from the parent because he is not up-to the age of reason but here are two adults who are capable of thinking for themselves...the analogy with the two-year old does not hold water.

ooman:
you obviously have problems understanding english language.

Grammar no be my language

ooman:
you know, you are really annoying when you deny the obvious. next time ignore what you cant answer.

Another empty accusation!

ooman:
when someone directs, what does hhe do? he controls. the opinions of his subjects do mot matter. he is the boss, his decision is final and that iis exactly what god does according to isaiah, which is wwhy we lack freewill if god exist.

Here are definitions for direct...please get your looking glass and read carefully:

di·rect [dih-rekt, dahy-]
verb (used with object)
1. to manage or guide by advice, helpful information, instruction, etc.: He directed the company through a difficult time.
2. to regulate the course of; control: History is directed by a small number of great men and women.
3. to administer; manage; supervise: She directs the affairs of the estate.
4. to give authoritative instructions to; command; order or ordain: I directed him to leave the room.
5. to serve as a director in the production or performance of (a musical work, play, motion picture, etc.).

The fact that you want it to mean only the bold does not mean that is the only usage it holds for everyone.

ooman:
man didnt choose to sin because god already knows man would sin which man must or god's foreknowledge is false and god becomes fallible.

Thrashed already!

ooman:
what am struggling to understand is how the eating of a fruit affect the amount of rrain that falls for example which leads to flood tthat kills man or how ut turned lion to aa catnivore or changed man's physiology to this present one overnight.

Irrelevant to the present discourse...if you want to discuss this then you would have to open another thread. Stop derailing your thread

ooman:
how exactly did man "choose " lawlessness by eating a fascinating fruit?

How exactly does a man who takes what does not belong to him choose a jail term?

ooman:
except if it is inherent on the designs to fail, or loose suddenly as life dies or fails suddenly

Have you heard of the term: "Garbage in and garbage out"? If you give a computer crap, it gives you back a sh*t load of crap! This has nothing to do with the design really but how we put what has been designed to use. The design is created to follow certain laws and one of such laws is: DO NOT SIN!!!

ooman:
so god put man in mercy of man and see how everything goes? good plan

God gave man all that he needs for sustenance but man decided to put man at the mercy of man, not God.

ooman:
you just did

ir they get flung to hell. they have no option. they are slaves of worship because god is aa tyrant and a dictator.

Are you saying that the fact that a sailor who will be killed when he commits mutiny does not have a choice?

ooman:
what exactly is he now, a man or a cow

In the event that you fail to understand what I mean by Angel, then let the following be your guide:

an·gel [eyn-juhl]
noun
1. one of a class of spiritual beings; a celestial attendant of God. In medieval angelology, angels constituted the lowest of the nine celestial orders (seraphim, cherubim, thrones, dominations or dominions, virtues, powers, principalities or princedoms, archangels, and angels).
2. a conventional representation of such a being, in human form, with wings, usually in white robes.
3. a messenger, especially of God.
4. a person who performs a mission of God or acts as if sent by God: an angel of mercy.
5. a person having qualities generally attributed to an angel, as beauty, purity, or kindliness.

Lucifer was an Angel but as it stands now, we really cannot describe him with such a title...the best we can call him is 'fallen Angel'...hope you don't need me to show you the difference between Angel and 'fallen Angel'?

ooman:
so you really think that etetnity of lake of fire. is just? then you must also think god is just right for killing lit's wife

Only if you can show me that the punishment meted against the flesh and the spirit should be the same!

ooman:
immediate eternal damnation without second thought or second chance, you call that just?

No one is given immediate Eternal punishment without a chance to prove him/herself.

ooman:
lame failed excuse. the fact is that the pubishment is etetnal and that is unjust. even man offer parole to those condemned to life imprisonment.

Spirit and the flesh are not the same! Note that not every sin merits Eternal damnation...just like not every crime committed merits the gas chamber.

ooman:
if god wants my money, I can give him the little i can afford, but I cant give the beggar my life and time
that is too much. a president could also ask that all his country men start worshipping him and we ll see how that goes. everything other thing can be given, never my life in worship.

God does not need your money...and it is inherent in man to want worship. Go through history and see for yourself.

ooman:
and who says its just about man? what about the processes we have absolutely no control over like earthquake and mutations in embryos. abeg commot for here

Sin brought imperfections as I have earlier said...

ooman:
absolutely useless and uunrelated earlier comment uh?
am glad you agree your logic and analogy was dumb but why use it when you know it was dumb?

Empty!!!

@poster, Always qualify your references to "God" with "the christian God" or "the Jewish God". Most of what you are typing is related to accounts about God given by THOSE specific groups.

Rossikk: @poster, Always qualify your references to "God" with "the christian God" or "the Jewish God". Most of what you are typing is related to accounts about God given by THOSE specific groups.

...that would mean the OP believes in deities which would render his beliefs as an Atheist invalid! Atheism is really not compatible with your beliefs...

Rossikk: @poster, Always qualify your references to "God" with "the christian God" or "the Jewish God". Most of what you are typing is related to accounts about God given by THOSE specific groups.

sorry. Will do just that.

ooman:

sorry. Will do just that.

..so you do believe in deities! Gooda! Gooda!!

striktlymi:

...that would mean the OP believes in deities which would render his beliefs as an Atheist invalid! Atheism is really not compatible with your beliefs...

to prove something wrong you must use available proofs. I only use available proof of the xtian god to show why he doesnt exist, that doesnt mean i believe he exist.

ooman:

to prove something wrong you must use available proofs. I only use available proof of the xtian god to show why he doesnt exist, that doesnt mean i believe he exist.

**In the voice of master LB** EPIC FAIL!!!

striktlymi:

..so you do believe in deities! Gooda! Gooda!!

nope

ooman:

nope

You are a deist...you are!

striktlymi:

**In the voice of master LB** EPIC FAIL!!!

that only displays your lack of unbderstanding of basic matters

striktlymi:

You are a deist...you are!

stopping force stup.dity on me. Am not a believer :p

ooman:

stopping force stup.dity on me. Am not a believer :p

...sure you are not but for the pagan gods

striktlymi:


...sure you are not but for the pagan gods

you know, the pagan gods are better than yahweh

ooman:

you know, the pagan gods are better than yahweh

I am glad you finally admitted to your belief in deities