Stats: 3,190,265 members, 7,940,031 topics. Date: Wednesday, 04 September 2024 at 03:54 PM |
Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Trinitarian Disrespect For God (7973 Views)
A TRINITARIAN Should Explain This Scripture .... / Put Your Hard Questions For Trinitarian Theologians Enigma , Goshen & Company / Poll : Are You A Trinitarian Or ONE GOD Believer - All Welcome To Vote (2) (3) (4)
(1) (2) (3) ... (6) (7) (8) (9) (10) (11) (Reply) (Go Down)
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by Boomark(m): 6:58pm On Jun 26, 2013 |
shdemidemi: of course |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by shdemidemi(m): 7:06pm On Jun 26, 2013 |
Boomark: Good, you might slightly disagree with this next one. I am not sure but lets see how it goes cos you would definitely see characteristics of the image(CHRIST). Genesis 3:8 “And they heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day:…” Now what’s the key word there to establish whether He’s in human form? Walking Do you agree? |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by Boomark(m): 7:46pm On Jun 26, 2013 |
shdemidemi: No. There are other things created which are not humans that also Walk. Besides, God is not a man(human). I hope you are also considering that man is made in the image of God. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by shdemidemi(m): 7:52pm On Jun 26, 2013 |
Boomark: I take it that you don't agree with that.. no problems at all. We have defined appeared as visibly seen. ACTS 7 2 And he said, Men, brethren, and fathers, hearken; The God of glory [b]appeared[/b]unto our father Abraham, when he was in Mesopotamia, before he dwelt in Charran, 3 And said unto him, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and come into the land which I shall shew thee. By your definition of appeared as visibly seen, who was visibly seen here? |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by shdemidemi(m): 7:55pm On Jun 26, 2013 |
Genesis 17 King James Version (KJV) 17 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the Lord [b]appeared [/b]to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by Boomark(m): 9:10pm On Jun 26, 2013 |
shdemidemi: You are holding unto the word "appear." anybody can appear and disappear. Acts 3:13 New International Version (NIV) 13 [b]The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, the God of our fathers, has glorified his servant Jesus. You handed him over to be killed, and you disowned him before Pilate, though he had decided to let him go. It is still our invisible God whom no one can see His face and live. Exodus 24:9-11 New International Version (NIV) 9 Moses and Aaron, Nadab and Abihu, and the seventy elders of Israel went up 10 and saw the God of Israel. Under his feet was something like a pavement made of lapis lazuli, as bright blue as the sky. 11 But God did not raise his hand against these leaders of the Israelites; they saw God, and they ate and drank. What man cannot see is His face. He appeared to Moses and told him that no one can see His face and live. So He allowed Moses see His back. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by Boomark(m): 9:14pm On Jun 26, 2013 |
shdemidemi: It could be: Appearing as a flame of fire or pillar of cloud. All is appearance. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by w3live(m): 10:23pm On Jun 26, 2013 |
Trinitarians always try to force trinitarian concepts into verses of the bible. It's so pathetic. Trinity has no basis in scripture. The bible was completed in the first century (circa 98) of our common era (c.e), however, the trinity doctrine had it's origins when Roman emperor Constantine convened a council of church bishops in the city of Nicaea to 'define' God and Christ in the year 325 c.e. (as if the bible was not clear on who God and Christ were) Constantine asked the bishops to come to a unanimous accord, but his request was in vain. He then proposed that the council adopt the ambiguous notion that Jesus was "of one substance" (homoousios) with the Father. This unbiblical Greek philosophical term laid the foundation for the Trinity doctrine as later set forth in the church creeds. This first council of Nicaea paved the way for the Trinity doctrine. 56 years later,that is in the year 381 c.e., the First Council of Constantinople gave rise to what is called the Nicene Creed which is the basis for the Trinity doctrine. And so by the end of the fourth century, the Trinity had essentially taken the form it has today. Finally, a quote from the book 'Catechism of the Catholic Church.': "In order to articulate the dogma of the Trinity, the [Catholic] Church had to develop her own terminology with the help of certain notions of philosophical origin." What a shame. Relying on human philosophy rather than on God's Word, the bible, which Jesus clearly stated is the only source of Christian truth. (John 17:17) 2 Likes |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by shdemidemi(m): 10:31pm On Jun 26, 2013 |
Boomark: when he appeared by the burning bush, we were told. when He sent angels we were told, this time, He was 'visible seen'(according to our definition). |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by Nobody: 10:35pm On Jun 26, 2013 |
w3live: Trinitarians always try to force trinitarian concepts into verses of the bible. It's so pathetic. Well said. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by shdemidemi(m): 10:35pm On Jun 26, 2013 |
Boomark: anybody can appear and disappear ![]() When he appears you see an image and not the full godhead. Jacob said- 30 And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: for I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by shdemidemi(m): 10:37pm On Jun 26, 2013 |
w3live: Trinitarians always try to force trinitarian concepts into verses of the bible. It's so pathetic. Like I say to people who go online to validate what they think, they will always find. Why don't you take it on yourself to check without prejudice. The scripture remains our only guide to all truth. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by Nobody: 10:39pm On Jun 26, 2013 |
shdemidemi: You need a re-education on scripture. How can we take you seriously when you preach that we do not need to repent from our sins as gentiles. 2 Likes |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by shdemidemi(m): 10:54pm On Jun 26, 2013 |
frosbel: My friend, go get familiar with the doctrinal book of Romans. Learn what sin nature is, new man ad old man, inner man and the flesh. Then come back and tell me where repentance come in. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by Boomark(m): 11:00pm On Jun 26, 2013 |
shdemidemi: You cannot say how He looks or His form when He appeared to Abraham. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by shdemidemi(m): 11:44pm On Jun 26, 2013 |
Boomark:you are right, the bible did not tell us how He looked. But, we were told He appeared. From our definition of appear, it is impossible to appear without been seen visibly. You and I know who the image of the invisible God is, don't we? |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by ijawkid(m): 2:08am On Jun 27, 2013 |
shdemidemi: are you not also an image of the invisible God ![]() my problem is i still dont know where you are heading to... it is obvious that no one,i repeatno one has seen the 1 God who is the Father... are you insisting ,Yahweh himself,Jesus,all the prophets and the apostles lied,.... the person abraham saw was Gods representative(an angel)..... john 6:46 New International Version (©2011) No one has seen the Father [/b]except the one who is from God; only he has seen the Father. GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995) [b]I'm saying that no one has seen the Father. Only the one who is from God has seen the Father. those who said they saw God face to face saw Gods representatives..... CHIKENAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 1 Like |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by ijawkid(m): 2:18am On Jun 27, 2013 |
shdemidemi: no one can see God and live,neither has any man seen God,,.... God has servants including his son whom he sends to represent him.,,,, i repeat and the scriptures repeat,no man has seen God at anytime.... |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by Boomark(m): 7:42am On Jun 27, 2013 |
shdemidemi: Christ is the image of the invisible God. We have not even discussed what being the image of God actually means cos man was also made in the image of God. Check out all men-the tall, short, dwarf, handsome, ugly, white, black etc. Are all these what "image" of God means. Christ was not different from other men when he was on earth(ie when he appeared in the flesh). Appear means to be seen. He was seen as a flame of fire, pillar of cloud, His back was seen, etc. all these things were visible. For one that appear in different forms, you can only identify him by his true face. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by Boomark(m): 8:07am On Jun 27, 2013 |
shdemidemi: Angels can appear and disappear. You still haven't known what Godhead meant, i thought i have shown you. So that your statement above is wrong. seeing God face to face does not mean seeing His face. 2 Beloved, now we are children of God, and it has not appeared as yet what we shall be. We know that, when He appears, we shall be like Him, because we shall see Him just as He is (1 John 3:2). Seeing Jesus(God's image) cannot translate as seeing God. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by shdemidemi(m): 9:59am On Jun 27, 2013 |
Boomark: 26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: God is not a man, but He said, let us make man in our image. He is the same God that calleth those things which be not as though they were. He is making something that is not him as if it is him, that is different from Christ being a visible image of God. Christ was not made to be an image, He is actually the visible image. Like we said earlier, your visible image is what you see in the mirror, your child on the other hand is another entity that is close to your visible image. When He was seen as a flame, pillar of cloud and all, we were told. Like you said, His back was seen. Think it through, if his back was seen, there is surely a visible image to the full deity called God. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by shdemidemi(m): 10:04am On Jun 27, 2013 |
Boomark: Jacob did not wrestle with the air, He actually wrestled with someone visible. He said, he saw God. What I want you to get is that, if the son steps out of the Godhead, He is not entirely God any more. The full glory of the father, the son and the Holy Spirit as one is what man has not seen. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by Boomark(m): 3:03am On Jun 28, 2013 |
shdemidemi: You did not explain how man is no longer the image of God or how he is. So you are now saying that the isrealites did not know that the God that appeared to them is Jesus? So God showed moses Jesus' back instead of His own as He agreed with moses? ![]() Acts 3:13 The God of Abraham and of Isaac and of Jacob, the God of our forefathers, has glorified His servant, Jesus, whom you, for your part, delivered up.... So Abraham did not know that the one he was relating with, whom he called his God is Jesus(the image of God) instead of the Father? Mal 2:10 Is it not one Father that all of us have? Is it not one God that has created us? Why do you deal treacherously with one another,...? Mt 23:9 Moreover, do not call anyone your father on earth, for one is your Father, the heavenly one. Deuteronomy 18:15-22 15"The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from among you, from your countrymen, you shall listen to him. 16 This is according to all that you asked of the Lord your God in Horeb on the day of the assembly, saying, 'Let me not hear again the voice of the Lord my God, let me not see this great fire anymore, or I will die.' 17The Lord said to me, 'They have spoken well. 18I will raise up a prophet from among their countrymen like you, and I will put My words in his mouth, and he shall speak to them all that I command him. 19It shall come about that whoever will not listen to My words which he shall speak in My name, I Myself will require it of him. How did these people know that they have a Father since God did not tell them that "we are two here o"-my voice and my image(Jesus). You have to address these things before we proceed. Remember we are not arguing. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by Boomark(m): 3:08am On Jun 28, 2013 |
shdemidemi: Please what is Godhead and how is Jesus IN the Godhead? Use scriptures. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by shdemidemi(m): 5:04am On Jun 28, 2013 |
Boomark: I actually did explain that man is man and at his best he can only be a man. God is God, He is not a man. God made man in their image ( not in the term of flesh but spirit). Remember one thing, the bible does not tell us everything but it tells us what we need to know, so at any point where the bible does not say, let's try not to infer. The question is, does Christ have the same image as He had as a man in Bethlehem? We were not told but the closest thing we know about that is in 2 cor 16 Consequently, from now on we estimate and regard no one from a [purely] human point of view [in terms of natural standards of value]. [No] even though we once did estimate Christ from a human viewpoint and as a man, yet now [we have such knowledge of Him that] we know Him no longer [in terms of the flesh]. Boomark: Abraham knew nothing about Jesus at that time. He knew God as God(elohim) Boomark: There are no three gods, there is one God the father, the son and Holy Ghost. The prophet that came after Moses was Joshua and many more came after Joshua. Most of the things said by prophets, they themselves did not understand, they don't have to. Example of this is in Daniel 12 8 Although I heard, I did not understand. Then I said, “My lord, what shall be the end of these things?” 9 And he said, “Go your way, Daniel, for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by shdemidemi(m): 5:33am On Jun 28, 2013 |
Boomark: Godhead is the divine nature and attributes of God. Within the Godhead, we have an invisible God with an image and a Spirit. We can have another proof from Ephesians 1 7 In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace 8 which He made to abound toward us in all wisdom and prudence, 9 having made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His good pleasure which He purposed in Himself, 10 that in the dispensation of the fullness of the times He might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven and which are on earth—in Him. 11 In Him also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestined according to the purpose of Him who works all things according to the counsel of His will, 12 that we who first trusted in Christ should be to the praise of His glory. As we both know that Elohim(God) is not a singular word, we come across a word there 'counsel'. Counsel is the interchange of opinions as to future procedure; consultation; deliberation. Jesus as a major role to play in the Godhead. He is the image and the word of the invisible God, Jesus can step out of the godhead to perform the will of God just like He did when He came to become flesh. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by Boomark(m): 9:21pm On Jun 28, 2013 |
shdemidemi: Was Christ no longer the image of God as a Man just because i said God also made man in his own image? to cut the whole thing short, the image of God is the nature of God not picture. Acts 3:13 The God of Abraham and of Isaac and of Jacob, the God of our forefathers, has glorified His servant, Jesus, whom you, for your part, delivered up.... Mal 2:10 Is it not one Father that all of us have? Is it not one God that has created us? Why do you deal treacherously with one another,...? Who is the God of the isrealites and of Abraham? There are no three gods, there is one God the father, the son and Holy Ghost. The prophet that came after Moses was Joshua and many more came after Joshua. There are no 3 Gods? so the Father is not God, the son is not God and the spirit is not God? 3 different persons who are independently called Gods will give us 3 Gods. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by Nobody: 9:23pm On Jun 28, 2013 |
^^^ The guys are just adding more confusion to the sorry state of affairs in the church , and unwittingly preventing millions from entering the kingdom of GOD by their 'chaotic' theories. Tell a Muslim that you believe in 3 gods who are 1 , and they will call you a polytheist which is not far from the truth, an atheist will laugh you to scorn. GOD is ONE. "Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You shut the door of the kingdom of heaven in people's faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will you let those enter who are trying to." - Matthew 23:13 |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by shdemidemi(m): 9:36pm On Jun 28, 2013 |
Boomark:where did you get that from? lets ponder on this verse and the word counsel, In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace 8 which He made to abound toward us in all wisdom and prudence, 9 having made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His good pleasure which He purposed in Himself, 10 that in the dispensation of the fullness of the times He might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven and which are on earth—in Him. 11 In Him also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestined according to the purpose of Him who works all things according to the counsel of His will, 12 that we who first trusted in Christ should be to the praise of His glory. As we both know that Elohim(God) is not a singular word, we come across a word there 'counsel'. Counsel is the interchange of opinions as to future procedure; consultation; deliberation. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by Boomark(m): 10:23pm On Jun 28, 2013 |
I want to do this one separate cos you are now now making reference to joshua and others instead of Jesus. Deuteronomy 18:15-22 15[b]"The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from among you, from your countrymen, you shall listen to him[/b]. 16 This is according to all that you asked of the Lord your God in Horeb on the day of the assembly, saying, 'Let me not hear again the voice of the Lord my God, let me not see this great fire anymore, or I will die.' 17The Lord said to me, 'They have spoken well. 18 I will raise up a prophet from among their countrymen like you, and I will put My words in his mouth, and he shall speak to them all that I command him. 19It shall come about that whoever will not listen to My words which he shall speak in My name, I Myself will require it of him. Hebrews 1:1-2 1 Long ago, at many times and in many ways, God spoke to our fathers by the prophets, 2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed the heir of all things, through whom also he created the world. John 6:14 English Standard Version (ESV) 14 When the people saw the sign that he had done, they said, “This is indeed the Prophet who is to come into the world!” Acts 3:22-26 English Standard Version (ESV) 22 Moses said, ‘The Lord God will raise up for you a prophet like me from your brothers. You shall listen to him in whatever he tells you. 23 And it shall be that every soul who does not listen to that prophet shall be destroyed from the people.’ 24 And all the prophets who have spoken, from Samuel and those who came after him, also proclaimed these days. 25 You are the sons of the prophets and of the covenant that God made with your fathers, saying to Abraham, ‘And in your offspring shall all the families of the earth be blessed.’ 26 God, having raised up his servant, sent him to you first, to bless you by turning every one of you from your wickedness.” Acts 7:37-39 Amplified Bible (AMP) 37 It was this [very] Moses who said to the children of Israel, God will raise up for you a Prophet from among your brethren as He raised me up. 38 This is he who in the assembly in the wilderness (desert) was the go-between for the Angel who spoke to him on Mount Sinai and our forefathers, and he received living oracles (words that still live) to be handed down to us. 39 [And yet] our forefathers determined not to be subject to him [refusing to listen to or obey him]; but thrusting him aside they rejected him, and in their hearts yearned for and turned back to Egypt. This is Stephen reminding those who would not want to listen what moses said about Jesus whom our God is using to speak to us. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by Boomark(m): 10:59pm On Jun 28, 2013 |
shdemidemi: coun·sel [koun-suhl] Show IPA noun, plural coun·sel for 3, verb, coun·seled, coun·sel·ing or ( especially British ) coun·selled, coun·sel·ling. noun 1. advice; opinion or instruction given in directing the judgment or conduct of another. 2. interchange of opinions as to future procedure; consultation; deliberation. New International Version In him we were also chosen, having been predestined according to the plan of him who works out everything in conformity with the purpose of his will, New American Standard Bible also we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to His purpose who works all things after the counsel of His will, King James Bible In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: Holman Christian Standard Bible We have also received an inheritance in Him, predestined according to the purpose of the One who works out everything in agreement with the decision of His will, International Standard Version In the Messiah we were also chosen when we were predestined according to the purpose of the one who does everything that he wills to do, A will is what somebody wants to happen at a particular time. When you are still deliberating on who to assign your 2 plots of land, it is not yet a will until you make a final decision. Then at the appointed time, your will will instruct(decide, advice, show etc) who gets the 2 plots of land. So God is not reconsidering/deliberating on His will. |
Re: Trinitarian Disrespect For God by Boomark(m): 11:19pm On Jun 28, 2013 |
Hebrews 1:3 New International Version (©2011) The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven. New Living Translation (©2007) The Son radiates God's own glory and expresses the very character of God, and he sustains everything by the mighty power of his command. When he had cleansed us from our sins, he sat down in the place of honor at the right hand of the majestic God in heaven. English Standard Version (©2001) He is the radiance of the glory of God and the exact imprint of his nature, and he upholds the universe by the word of his power. After making purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, New American Standard Bible (©1995) And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power. When He had made purification of sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.) Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high; International Standard Version (©2012) He is the reflection of God's glory and the exact likeness of his being, and he holds everything together by his powerful word. After he had provided a cleansing from sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Highest Majesty NET Bible (©2006) The Son is the radiance of his glory and the representation of his essence, and he sustains all things by his powerful word, and so when he had accomplished cleansing for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high. Aramaic Bible in Plain English (©2010) For he is The Brilliance of his glory, The Image of his Being, and upholds all things by the power of his word; and he in his Essential Being has accomplished the purification of our sins, and he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high. GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995) His Son is the reflection of God's glory and the exact likeness of God's being. He holds everything together through his powerful words. After he had cleansed people from their sins, he received the highest position, the one next to the Father in heaven. King James 2000 Bible (©2003) Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high; American King James Version Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high: Image is God's nature |
(1) (2) (3) ... (6) (7) (8) (9) (10) (11) (Reply)
Why Is The Catholic Church Bible Different From Others? / Wapgospel.com - Download Gospel Musics; Hymns, Acapella E.t.c / Was Mary,mother Of Jesus Crucified?
(Go Up)
Sections: politics (1) business autos (1) jobs (1) career education (1) romance computers phones travel sports fashion health religion celebs tv-movies music-radio literature webmasters programming techmarket Links: (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) (9) (10) Nairaland - Copyright © 2005 - 2024 Oluwaseun Osewa. All rights reserved. See How To Advertise. 170 |