As I said Henry, it's not called the Cape of Storms for nothing.
In this particular rescue, a crewman on the ship had a heart attack, but because the sea was so rough, the Oryx couldn't land. Medical personnel had to be winched down. And the damn thing was already under tow.

ssaengine:


And which jets is NAF able to roll out in the protection of Nigerian lives? Bombing Boko Haram for however many years hasn't changed the fact that Nigeria is utterly defenceless against any conventional air threat.

But that's also non of my business.

there are very big differences between a country engaging life targets with its aircrafts and the one shooting dummy targets for photography sessions, there are big differences between a pilot that have earned series of real kill strips and the one whose greatest achievement was to have been able to turn the craft upside down for a photography session, there are big differences between a pilot whose main worry is on strategizing maneuvers to carry out successful ground support sorties and the one whose main problem is on how to balance a rotor craft on a mountain ledge for photography shots.

We are fighting a war for which we are very well and suitably equipped and we have recorded some of the most unprecedented text book victories that the "unconventional" war against international terrorism would ever see.

Do not pray to learn the lessons that we have learnt, but when you pray, pray that you would one day gain the chance to learn from the experience of the men that have seen the true flames of war.

overhypedsteve:
there are very big differences between a country engaging life targets with its aircrafts and the one shooting dummy targets for photography sessions, there are big differences between a pilot that have earned series of real kill strips and the one whose greatest achievement was to have been able to turn the craft upside down for a photography session, there are big differences between a pilot whose main worry is on strategizing maneuvers to carry out successful ground support sorties and the one whose main problem is on how to balance a rotor craft on a mountain ledge for photography shots.

We are fighting a war for which we are very well and suitably equipped and we have recorded some of the most unprecedented text book victories that the "unconventional" war against international terrorism would ever see.

Do not pray to learn the lessons that we have learnt, but when you pray, pray that you would one day gain the chance to learn from the experience of the men that have seen the true flames of war.

Intelligently crafted rebuttal. I'm impressed, you know your onions.

frumentius:
As I said Henry, it's not called the Cape of Storms for nothing.
In this particular rescue, a crewman on the ship had a heart attack, but because the sea was so rough, the Oryx couldn't land. Medical personnel had to be winched down. And the damn thing was already under tow.

The seas in the Cape are so rough, explains why you need boats that are 50 meters in length as an IPV, the waves would simply break smaller boats.

That's an actual rescue? I thought it was an exercise photo.

overhypedsteve:
there are very big differences between a country engaging life targets with its aircrafts and the one shooting dummy targets for photography sessions, there are big differences between a pilot that have earned series of real kill strips and the one whose greatest achievement was to have been able to turn the craft upside down for a photography session, there are big differences between a pilot whose main worry is on strategizing maneuvers to carry out successful ground support sorties and the one whose main problem is on how to balance a rotor craft on a mountain ledge for photography shots.

We are fighting a war for which we are very well and suitably equipped and we have recorded some of the most unprecedented text book victories that the "unconventional" war against international terrorism would ever see.

Do not pray to learn the lessons that we have learnt, but when you pray, pray that you would one day gain the chance to learn from the experience of the men that have seen the true flames of war.

Dude, we will never face insurgency at your level...

Terror is dealt with at intelligence level. Do you think there is no Jihadists who wants to tear SA apart? A tribalist who thinks he should make his province a separate country? A redneck who wants some land "God gave to him"?... Dude, we have all of those guys here. The reason why they never go big is because they're never given that opportunity.

You on the other hand allowed BH to grow from YouTube dudes to guys who took your NE forcing you to fight a semiconvectional war.

If ever we could be faced with a military problem like your BH (which is unlikely to happen), we would run over them in no time.... Those photo shoots are called Capacity Demonstration because there's no stupid idiot that wants to start a war nearby so that you can see the real war photos.

overhypedsteve:
there are very big differences between a country engaging life targets with its aircrafts and the one shooting dummy targets for photography sessions, there are big differences between a pilot that have earned series of real kill strips and the one whose greatest achievement was to have been able to turn the craft upside down for a photography session, there are big differences between a pilot whose main worry is on strategizing maneuvers to carry out successful ground support sorties and the one whose main problem is on how to balance a rotor craft on a mountain ledge for photography shots.

We are fighting a war for which we are very well and suitably equipped and we have recorded some of the most unprecedented text book victories that the "unconventional" war against international terrorism would ever see.

Do not pray to learn the lessons that we have learnt, but when you pray, pray that you would one day gain the chance to learn from the experience of the men that have seen the true flames of war.

You clearly went ahead and watched a few war movies before giving this reply. Was it to give you that patriotic feeling? Now let me bring you crashing right back down to reality. This topic was about SAAF and NAF....i see you sneakishly trying to talk about war in general. Come eat your NAF medicine 1st.

1. Name one single aspect of flight, targetting, planning that Nigerian pilots are better equipped in than South African pilots. YOU WILL NOT FIND A SINGLE ONE. That is a fact. Accept it. Simple.

2. No. If you train as you fight. There is absolutely zero difference TECHNICALLY (list of items which need to be performed) between dropping ordinance on a target in training or a real target, PARTICULARLY if that target has no heavy ground based anti aircraft systems. There are heaps of videos at Denel Dynamics and especially Overberg Test Range of actual SAAF training excercises (not airshow pics). When A-Darter was going through finals, SAAF officers were here almost monthly....so I am well aware of SAAF capabilites.

3. No...NAF is not well equipped at all to defend it's people. I'll repeat. At ALL. When Boko Haram was driving around in tanks, can you believe it....TANKS...on your own home soil....why were they not taken out within 48 hours? You had the jets, the pilots, the bombs, co-ords. So why weeks and weeks? Months?

Nigerian skies are an open sky for any adversary with decent aircraft and pilots.

Henry240:


The seas in the Cape are so rough, explains why you need boats that are 50 meters in length as an IPV, the waves would simply break smaller boats.

That's an actual rescue? I thought it was an exercise photo.

Yep. Our sea lanes are some of the busiest in the world, on both the Atlantic and the Indian Oceans, so there are rescues all the time.

ActivateKruger:


It's when soldiers are fighting on payday, they refer to that day as COIN.

Thanks

nnamdi1998:
Thanks

COIN actually stands for Counter Insurgency

ssaengine:


You clearly went ahead and watched a few war movies before giving this reply. Was it to give you that patriotic feeling? Now let me bring you crashing right back down to reality. This topic was about SAAF and NAF....i see you sneakishly trying to talk about war in general. Come eat your NAF medicine 1st.

1. Name one single aspect of flight, targetting, planning that Nigerian pilots are better equipped in than South African pilots. YOU WILL NOT FIND A SINGLE ONE. That is a fact. Accept it. Simple.

2. No. If you train as you fight. There is absolutely zero difference TECHNICALLY (list of items which need to be performed) between dropping ordinance on a target in training or a real target, PARTICULARLY if that target has no heavy ground based anti aircraft systems. There are heaps of videos at Denel Dynamics and especially Overberg Test Range of actual SAAF training excercises (not airshow pics). When A-Darter was going through finals, SAAF officers were here almost monthly....so I am well aware of SAAF capabilites.

3. No...NAF is not well equipped at all to defend it's people. I'll repeat. At ALL. When Boko Haram was driving around in tanks, can you believe it....TANKS...on your own home soil....why were they not taken out within 48 hours? You had the jets, the pilots, the bombs, co-ords. So why weeks and weeks? Months?

Nigerian skies are an open sky for any adversary with decent aircraft and pilots.

Here we go again with the bickering and emotional posts and I find my self typing a rebuttal not out of angst but to put certain things in perspective.

1. Except you're part of the NAF HQ, you can't boldly make statements like this without proofs or citing a source. Flight planning and targeting is a broad area where constant adaptations are made to adjust to specific threats being faced by a nation.. This cuts across both rotary and fixed winged assets.. Your statement of "facts" I should say is subjective at best


2. Training and real-life scenarios are two different things especially if you're dealing with a non conventional adversary like the BHT. They source most of their assets through the black markets and there are edge-cases where you most likely do not know what they have in inventory with regards to man pads and the likes. As a pilot, you have to adapt to the new situation.. There are multiple examples where training alone doesn't prepare you for what to expect, a sudden change in dynamics might throw you off your planned trajectory, this is without taking into consideration the possibility of failing equipment as result of being pushed beyond limits. If training and combat situations are one and the same, you wouldn't have cases of the US vets coming back from war zones with PTSD.

3. When BHT was driving around in tanks like you pointed out, there wasn't the political will to tackle the situation. Was it a bad experience? Yes it was.. Did we learn from it? Look at the results and the current status of the conflict, where the BHTs ability to make such attacks have been destroyed. The NAF, NN have over the years stated that they, are equipped adequately for the immediate threats around them. The word "well equiped" is a subjective one which becomes irrelevent if the ratio is outmatched by the adversary. A French vs southafrican conflict for example is a mismatch while the French vs Algeria matchup is an evenly matched situation. Another point to note is that equipments while important are not entirely the only factor which determines how prepared a country is, if it was the Saudis would've won in yemen.

At the bolded, you do not need a sandhurst training nor do you need to be tutored by Napoleon himself to understand these things, it's just common sense. You could have stated your points without being emotional about it, you don't necessarily need to agree with everyone's point of view. Attacking a person's intellect by making snide remarks is childish and doesn't show superiority.

AFSF training in Russia.
Screenshots taken from one of the videos

KDF AML-60 in action in Somalia, with mortar in place.

Looks like a basket has been welded to the rear of the turret for external stowage.

Cameroun navy

nnamdi1998:
what's the meaning of COIN?

Counter-Insurgency (CO-IN) , COIN


ASM Koni II Projet 1159T fregate , Algerian Navy

903- Rais Korso in russia this month for maintenance and maybe upgrade
902 -Rais Kellich , old pic

in service from the 80s

ActivateKruger:

COIN actually stands for Counter Insurgency

Thanks

chkil0:

Counter-Insurgency (CO-IN) , COIN

Thanks

..

nnamdi1998:
what's the meaning of COIN?

counter insurgency

Nicheey:


thanks for the concerns this the Account number Jeremiah Augustine 0044709171Diamond bank it's a friend's own though mine isn't in my possession

You can confirm from your friend.
First name starts from F and ends with I. Success in your exams.

xwolverine:



Here we go again with the bickering and emotional posts and I find my self typing a rebuttal not out of angst but to put certain things in perspective.

1. Except you're part of the NAF HQ, you can't boldly make statements like this without proofs or citing a source. Flight planning and targeting is a broad area where constant adaptations are made to adjust to specific threats being faced by a nation.. This cuts across both rotary and fixed winged assets.. Your statement of "facts" I should say is subjective at best


2. Training and real-life scenarios are two different things especially if you're dealing with a non conventional adversary like the BHT. They source most of their assets through the black markets and there are edge-cases where you most likely do not know what they have in inventory with regards to man pads and the likes. As a pilot, you have to adapt to the new situation.. There are multiple examples where training alone doesn't prepare you for what to expect, a sudden change in dynamics might throw you off your planned trajectory, this is without taking into consideration the possibility of failing equipment as result of being pushed beyond limits. If training and combat situations are one and the same, you wouldn't have cases of the US vets coming back from war zones with PTSD.

3. When BHT was driving around in tanks like you pointed out, there wasn't the political will to tackle the situation. Was it a bad experience? Yes it was.. Did we learn from it? Look at the results and the current status of the conflict, where the BHTs ability to make such attacks have been destroyed. The NAF, NN have over the years stated that they, are equipped adequately for the immediate threats around them. The word "well equiped" is a subjective one which becomes irrelevent if the ratio is outmatched by the adversary. A French vs southafrican conflict for example is a mismatch while the French vs Algeria matchup is an evenly matched situation. Another point to note is that equipments while important are not entirely the only factor which determines how prepared a country is, if it was the Saudis would've won in yemen.

At the bolded, you do not need a sandhurst training nor do you need to be tutored by Napoleon himself to understand these things, it's just common sense. You could have stated your points without being emotional about it, you don't necessarily need to agree with everyone's point of view. Attacking a person's intellect by making snide remarks is childish and doesn't show superiority.

Experience? The Iraqi Airforce and Army had tons of experience fighting Iran... The US boys had zero war experience, but they rolled over Iraq - it's called Operation Desert Storm, go check it out.

Good training surpasses experience.


As for NAF experience, it's nothing more than dropping a handful free fall bombs, no CAS, nothing even Botswana wouldn't do.

....

ActivateKruger:



Experience? The Iraqi Airforce and Army had tons of experience fighting Iran... The US boys had zero war experience, but they rolled over Iraq - it's called Operation Desert Storm, go check it out.

Good training surpasses experience.


As for NAF experience, it's nothing more than dropping a handful free fall bombs, no CAS, nothing even Botswana wouldn't do.

The stupidity of South-Africans continue to defy logic.

When i provide a properly worded response to this comment now, you would be the first to call me a "Nigerian Witch Mother", with other fools from your country in support.

When it comes to Nigeria, I don't usually back down from a confrontation, please use your head.

Henry240:


The stupidity of South-Africans continue to defy logic.

When i provide a properly worded response to this comment now, you would be the first to call me a "Nigerian Witch Mother", with other fools from your country in support.

When it comes to Nigeria, I don't usually back down from a confrontation, please use your head.

So just because your boys dropped a handful free-fall bombs then your experience is undeniable?

Let's have this discussion when you have successfully shot down enemy aircrafts, dodged SAMs, flown your airforce across the world, have aces.

Till then you only have more experience than Botswana

ActivateKruger:



Experience? The Iraqi Airforce and Army had tons of experience fighting Iran... The US boys had zero war experience, but they rolled over Iraq - it's called Operation Desert Storm, go check it out.

Good training surpasses experience.

not a good exemple , you cant compare iraqi army ( under embargo , no modern equipement) against coalition (more than 40 coutries ) +US NATO armies ! what can do experience when us air force destroy everything from the sky ? The coalition flew over 100,000 sorties, dropping 88,500 tons of bombs, and widely destroying military and civilian infrastructure. + Tomahawk ect... The difference was too enormous in terms of equipment and technology ! The experience can make the difference when the two opponents have a close level equipment and capacity .

what can do an experinced ace in an alpha jet against a new rookie in a f22 formation with awacs support ! or a best experienced soldiers in a t72 with no night vision against an appach thats see him in HD in night from faaar !

NA

ActivateKruger:



Experience? The Iraqi Airforce and Army had tons of experience fighting Iran... The US boys had zero war experience, but they rolled over Iraq - it's called Operation Desert Storm, go check it out.

Good training surpasses experience.


As for NAF experience, it's nothing more than dropping a handful free fall bombs, no CAS, nothing even Botswana wouldn't do.

Really? are we going to do this all over?

The US have always had countless experiences since the turn of the century. From the civil wars to the world wars, you can't wave that off just to win an argument.

When Botswana have had to scramble A-jets (not designed for CAS) within short notice, with the pilot getting injured from AA guns in the process, but still manages to complete his mission...when SAAF have participated and won a single war (not against its own people)...when SADF have managed to restore democracy to one nation while supporting with over $10billion....Then we can have this discussion....till then i say the SAAF achievements are nothing even Chad wouldn't do. (anyone can perform excercises)

chkil0:


not a good exemple , you cant compare iraqi army ( under embargo for 30 years no modern equipement) against coalition (more than 40 coutries ) +US NATO armies ! what can do experience when us air force destroy everything from the sky ? The coalition flew over 100,000 sorties, dropping 88,500 tons of bombs, and widely destroying military and civilian infrastructure. + Tomahawk ect... The difference was too enormous in terms of equipment and technology !

What are you talking about?


The Iraqi Airforce was a well oiled with Soviet aircrafts. They fielded :

- MiG-23 Flogger
- MiG-25 Foxbat (no fighter compares in raw power)
- MiG-29 Fulkrum (which the USAF feared)

Then on top they had all the experience, home ground advantage... The better trained Americans rolled over them. Iraq had no reason to loose but their terrible training despite their years of fighting experience.

ActivateKruger:




What are you talking about?


The Iraqi Airforce was a well oiled with Soviet aircrafts. They fielded :

- MiG-23 Flogger
- MiG-25 Foxbat (no fighter compares in raw power)
- MiG-29 Fulkrum (which the USAF feared)

Then on top they had all the experience, home ground advantage... The better trained Americans rolled over them. Iraq had no reason to loose but their terrible training despite their years of fighting experience.

Now you're contradicting yourself, just knock it off already.
I bet you would say the Iraqis have more experience than the Yanks?

Experience is not indeginous it's gained from being involved in actual wars.. A theoretical driver with the best training still needs to understand the driving culture of his/her city...training alone doesn't cut it, if it did the yanks would've kicked some asses in Japan... They needed the A-bomb to end the war.

xwolverine:


Really? are we going to do this all over?

The US have always had countless experiences since the turn of the century. From the civil wars to the world wars, you can't wave that off just to win an argument.

When Botswana have had to scramble A-jets (not designed for CAS) within short notice, with the pilot getting injured from AA guns in the process, but still manages to complete his mission...when SAAF have participated and won a single war (not against its own people)...when SADF have managed to restore democracy to one nation while supporting with over $10billion....Then we can have this discussion....till then i say the SAAF achievements are nothing even Chad wouldn't do. (anyone can perform excercises)

1. Bombed French military installations in Madagascar
2. Bombed Italy in East Africa
3. Bombed Italy in North Africa
4. Bombed Italy in Europe
5. Took Namibia from the Germans
6. Bombed the Koreans
7. Gave CAS to the Americans in Korea
8. Shot down Angolan MiGs
9. Did the largest air assault in African, amongst the largest during the Cold War

You talk about restoring democracy? You can't even restore it in the NE of your own land.

The biggest thing your airforce has ever done was to bomb a Toyota Hulux... Still couldn't bring back the girls even today.

ActivateKruger:




What are you talking about?


The Iraqi Airforce was a well oiled with Soviet aircrafts. They fielded :

- MiG-23 Flogger
- MiG-25 Foxbat (no fighter compares in raw power)
- MiG-29 Fulkrum (which the USAF feared)

Then on top they had all the experience, home ground advantage... The better trained Americans rolled over them. Iraq had no reason to loose but their terrible training despite their years of fighting experience.

ActivateKruger:

Experience? The Iraqi Airforce and Army had tons of experience fighting Iran... The US boys had zero war experience, but they rolled over Iraq - it's called Operation Desert Storm, go check it out.

Good training surpasses experience.


As for NAF experience, it's nothing more than dropping a handful free fall bombs, no CAS, nothing even Botswana wouldn't do.

This is a typical South African brain.

xwolverine:


Now you're contradicting yourself, just knock it off already.
I bet you would say the Iraqis have more experience than the Yanks?

Experience is not indeginous it's gained from being involved in actual wars.. A theoretical driver with the best training still needs to understand the driving culture of his/her city...training alone doesn't cut it, if it did the yanks would've kicked some asses in Japan... They needed the A-bomb to end the war.

It still doesn't change the fact that the SAAF has more experience and better training than the NAF. We shouldn't even be comparing, we're in different leagues.

iblawi:



This is a typical South African brain.

A Nigerian brain brags about bombing a Toyota Hulux owned by Quran smoking wanksters