Henry240:


The NN used to be well ahead, but for sometime now, they have become invisible like we are "seeing a ghost movie". They need to up their game.


We need those JF-17s since like yesterday, and if we can get Tucanos to replace those Alpha jets, that would simply go along way in improving general effectiveness of air operations.


The Alpha jets simply need to go!!

Honestly,there's nothing i desire more than to see those alpha jets retired.And to think we are getting the tucano,is simply DAY DREAMNG.Just watch as Naf will quietly transform those super mushag,into a potent coin asset.with the kind of affection NAF has shown to those grand pa A-jets,they MIGHT not retire(remember innoson just got in the show).


If u put my anticipation for the j17 thunders on a scale of hundred it will weigh 1000.
Won't mind traveling all d way to makurdi to see those babies when they arrive.

pacretus:
Honestly,there's nothing i desire more than to see those alpha jets retired.And to think we are getting the tucano,is simply DAY DREAMNG.Just watch as Naf will quietly transform those super mushag,into a potent coin asset.with the kind of affection NAF has shown to those grand pa A-jets,they MIGHT not retire(remember innoson just got in the show).


If u put my anticipation for the j17 thunders on a scale of hundred it will weigh 1000.
Won't mind traveling all d way to makurdi to see those babies when they arrive.

Exactly what I was thinking.

I still don't get how the Nigerian armed forces plan operations.

An ISR surveys and identifies an area of interest with militants

NAF sends air sorties based on actionable intelligence to take out these positions.

BUT.....

How about the follow up??

Shouldn't this be a tri-service operation?

Shouldn't the navy and army cordoned off the area before hand?

Shouldn't special operations teams be dropped into the area to attack residual forces that were not killed in the initial sorties.

Shouldn't those special operations teams also not be canvassing for intelligence for financiers and HVTs.

Hence shouldn't the DSS be involved in this operation as well

It really baffles me how these operations are planned

Henry240:
-Nigerian MI-24V Attack Helicopter


- Nigerian Pilots, I don't think i've seen a Nigerian pilot that is above 40 years of age. NAF pilots should rank as some of the youngest in the world.

Henry240:


The Jihadists were just dragging the bodies of the dead pilots on the ground. I mean the high level of barbarism in Syria is beyond astonishing.


President-S didn't work apparently.

the video i saw showed one body being dragged but saw a crew ID of a female who was on board

This is why i love the MI-35, the Helicopter provides for 2 additional MG stations. The way Nigerian Air Force maximises this ability is beautiful.



Nigerian Air Force MI-24V with window gunner

pacretus:
Honestly,there's nothing i desire more than to see those alpha jets retired.And to think we are getting the tucano,is simply DAY DREAMNG.Just watch as Naf will quietly transform those super mushag,into a potent coin asset.with the kind of affection NAF has shown to those grand pa A-jets,they MIGHT not retire(remember innoson just got in the show).


If u put my anticipation for the j17 thunders on a scale of hundred it will weigh 1000.
Won't mind traveling all d way to makurdi to see those babies when they arrive.

I don't know if we are getting the Tucano, the report only states the U.S is considering selling the NAF 12 units of Super Tucano. So, they (U.S) could still cancel the order and we are left with nothing.


Those Grand-Pa Alphas sure can fly fast though, i spotted one again this morning flying fast towards the west of the city. The Innoson deal is only for a replacement of parts, so i don't think it changes anything. The Alphas have now been in service for 38 years, they need to go.


Lmao, I trust the NAF to release photos when the birds do finally come in.

kenya army Vickers Mk3 tank

rugged7:
I still don't get how the Nigerian armed forces plan operations.

An ISR surveys and identifies an area of interest with militants

NAF sends air sorties based on actionable intelligence to take out these positions.

BUT.....

How about the follow up??

Shouldn't this be a tri-service operation?

Shouldn't the navy and army cordoned off the area before hand?

Shouldn't special operations teams be dropped into the area to attack residual forces that were not killed in the initial sorties.

Shouldn't those special operations teams also not be canvassing for intelligence for financiers and HVTs.

Hence shouldn't the DSS be involved in this operation as well

It really baffles me how these operations are planned

There was a follow-up. While the Air Force did their thing, the Army and SBS came in and swept the place. The area has bee cordoned off. Let me look for photos.

these people are back with their Trojan horse
CAS HOLDS TALK WITH US GOVT DELEGATION ON ACQUISITION OF SUPER TUCCANO AIRCRAFT
CAS, Air Mshl Abubakar and HQ NAF Branch Chiefs during the meeting with US delegation on the acquisition of Super Tucano by the NAF.

So what happens if the Nigerian govenement decides to take a decision that's not in favor of the US?

Henry240:


I don't know if we are getting the Tucano, the report only states the U.S is considering selling the NAF 12 units of Super Tucano. So, they (U.S) could still cancel the order and we are left with nothing.


Those Grand-Pa Alphas sure can fly fast though, i spotted one again this morning flying fast towards the west of the city. The Innoson deal is only for a replacement of parts, so i don't think it changes anything. The Alphas have now been in service for 38 years, they need to go.


Lmao, I trust the NAF to release photos when the birds do finally come in.

Mr Henry it does appear the NAF is listening to your comments I received a tweet from the NAF showing the CAS with Senior American Airforce office stating they are currently in one on one talks about the procurement of the Tuscanoes

jakeporeshenko:
these people are back with their Trojan horse
CAS HOLDS TALK WITH US GOVT DELEGATION ON ACQUISITION OF SUPER TUCCANO AIRCRAFT
CAS, Air Mshl Abubakar and HQ NAF Branch Chiefs during the meeting with US delegation on the acquisition of Super Tucano by the NAF.

So what happens if the Nigerian govenement decides to take a decision that's not in favor of the US?

The risk management for the US is that they will sell bare bone Tucanoes (maybe fitted with only canons) and we will have to buy the other good stuff and retrofit. They will not block retrofitted offensive gear from other countries.
The reason the US does this sometimes is not because they hate us but because we are currently classified amongst countries where democratic institution development is still a little poor and there are human rights criteria for Leahy law compliance.

I am sure that only the dastardliness of Boko Haram has even "qualified" us for the Tucanoes at the current time and YES we may not be permitted to use it in the ND or in the SE.
The US looks at Nigeria with matured , neutral , regional stability eyes and some of the decisions they take are influenced by CIVIL SERVANTS in the State Department instead of Politicians.

For people blaming Obama and Clinton, you need to be less amateurish about how power is structured in the US.
Nigeria needs to keep and pay lobbyists and PR firms in the US if we want to get good things out of Washington.

It is just a fact we have to live with.

Adminisher:


The risk management for the US is that they will sell bare bone Tucanoes (maybe fitted with only canons) and we will have to buy the other good stuff and retrofit. They will not block retrofitted offensive gear from other countries.
The reason the US does this sometimes is not because they hate us but because we are currently classified amongst countries where democratic institution development is still a little poor and there are human rights criteria for Leahy law compliance.

I am sure that only the dastardliness of Boko Haram has even "qualified" us for the Tucanoes at the current time and YES we may not be permitted to use it in the ND or in the SE.
The US looks at Nigeria with matured , neutral , regional stability eyes and some of the decisions they take are influenced by CIVIL SERVANTS in the State Department instead of Politicians.

For people blaming Obama and Clinton, you need to be less amateurish about how power is structured in the US.
Nigeria needs to keep and pay lobbyists and PR firms in the US if we want to get good things out of Washington.

It is just a fact we have to live with.

"permitted" ? because they sell a plane to us so they'll tell us how and when we can use them? I believe its all about political will power and how interested they are in the matter, the US sells very potent platforms to countries with far worse human right standards than Nigeria.

personally i believe if they are not ready to give us an advanced version they should keep their turbo prop plane.

jakeporeshenko:
these people are back with their Trojan horse
CAS HOLDS TALK WITH US GOVT DELEGATION ON ACQUISITION OF SUPER TUCCANO AIRCRAFT
CAS, Air Mshl Abubakar and HQ NAF Branch Chiefs during the meeting with US delegation on the acquisition of Super Tucano by the NAF.

So what happens if the Nigerian govenement decides to take a decision that's not in favor of the US?

We might be getting the tuccanoes afterall.How this will happen will be an interesting drama.and it will render my conclusions on America's dealings with Nigeria Inconclusive.

Only these birds will force Naf to put the A-jets where they belong.(in the museum).

jakeporeshenko:


"permitted" ? because they sell a plane to us so they'll tell us how and when we can use them? I believe its all about political will power and how interested they are in the matter, the US sells very potent platforms to countries with far worse human right standards than Nigeria.

personally i believe if they are not ready to give us an advanced version they should keep their turbo prop plane.

I think we will get what Afghanistan got. Boko Haram is worse than Taleban and ISIS and armed Fulani Herdsmen militants are classified by some US agencies as more deadly than BH. If they don't include PGM capability, we can get it through Elbit although there will bevery few instances we need to use PGMs .

Super Tucanoes tick a lot of boxes for Nigeria - methodical border patrol, internal security, some limited ISR, data link relay, basic training after Super Mushak, ..even search and rescue and UAV research observation.
They carry super accurate canons and good machine guns, dumb rockets and PGMs can be rigged in.
This is Nigeria

jakeporeshenko:


"permitted" ? because they sell a plane to us so they'll tell us how and when we can use them? I believe its all about political will power and how interested they are in the matter, the US sells very potent platforms to countries with far worse human right standards than Nigeria.

personally i believe if they are not ready to give us an advanced version they should keep their turbo prop plane.

I disagree on the Alpha Jet.
We should extend their operation another ten years, get some PGM capability and buy more from German Air force stocks. We have developed world leading core competency on this Aircraft and many European Airforces are still using them. It is the only fast mission time COIN aircraft we have now and wearn have mastered quick accurate targeting with data coming from ISR aircraft. How many African countries do you think can do this now?.
Super Tucanoes can do its own ISR and attack on its own but the aircraft is slower and the weapons on board lighter.

You people have started this america ass kissing again...
Americans that sell weapons to terrorists in syria and terror states like saudi arabia
Yet balk @ selling to nigeria
When will Nigerians learn that america is not their friend
They will hold all these meetings and NOTHING will happen

Adminisher:


I disagree on the Alpha Jet.
We should extend their operation another ten years, get some PGM capability and buy more from German Air force stocks. We have developed world leading core competency on this Aircraft and many European Airforces are still using them. It is the only fast mission time COIN aircraft we have now and wearn have mastered quick accurate targeting with data coming from ISR aircraft. How many African countries do you think can do this now?.
Super Tucanoes can do its own ISR and attack on its own but the aircraft is slower and the weapons on board lighter.

pacretus:
We might be getting the tuccanoes afterall.How this will happen will be an interesting drama.and it will render my conclusions on America's dealings with Nigeria Inconclusive.

Only these birds will force Naf to put the A-jets where they belong.(in the museum).

It should be useful for AFIT students.

Adminisher:


I disagree on the Alpha Jet.
We should extend their operation another ten years, get some PGM capability and buy more from German Air force stocks. We have developed world leading core competency on this Aircraft and many European Airforces are still using them. It is the only fast mission time COIN aircraft we have now and wearn have mastered quick accurate targeting with data coming from ISR aircraft. How many African countries do you think can do this now?.
Super Tucanoes can do its own ISR and attack on its own but the aircraft is slower and the weapons on board lighter.

what!!!extend what!?!
c'mon man...I would protest naked on the street if this advice is followed

jakeporeshenko:
these people are back with their Trojan horse
CAS HOLDS TALK WITH US GOVT DELEGATION ON ACQUISITION OF SUPER TUCCANO AIRCRAFT
CAS, Air Mshl Abubakar and HQ NAF Branch Chiefs during the meeting with US delegation on the acquisition of Super Tucano by the NAF.

So what happens if the Nigerian govenement decides to take a decision that's not in favor of the US?

Only problem been, the US Air Force does not and cannot influence the sale of the Super-Tucano to Nigeria.

Odunayaw:
what!!!extend what!?!
c'mon man...I would protest naked on the street if this advice is followed

what da ***.o men! U not gonna do that right ?.
I min how u go fill wen ur blockos starts oscillating wit kids everywhere staring.?.i'm sure GRAND PA..will slowly but surely be retired.LOL

LTGEN:

Mr Henry it does appear the NAF is listening to your comments I received a tweet from the NAF showing the CAS with Senior American Airforce office stating they are currently in one on one talks about the procurement of the Tuscanoes

Yeah, as i was just saying, i don't see how the U.S air force would influence the sale of Tucanos to Nigeria. In my opinion, we aren't talking to the right people. Anyway, I'd love to be enlightened though.

jakeporeshenko:


"permitted" ? because they sell a plane to us so they'll tell us how and when we can use them? I believe its all about political will power and how interested they are in the matter, the US sells very potent platforms to countries with far worse human right standards than Nigeria.

personally i believe if they are not ready to give us an advanced version they should keep their turbo prop plane.

We are going to get the same variant Afghanistan got.

Adminisher:


I think we will get what Afghanistan got. Boko Haram is worse than Taleban and ISIS and armed Fulani Herdsmen militants are classified by some US agencies as more deadly than BH. If they don't include PGM capability, we can get it through Elbit although there will bevery few instances we need to use PGMs .

Super Tucanoes tick a lot of boxes for Nigeria - methodical border patrol, internal security, some limited ISR, data link relay, basic training after Super Mushak, ..even search and rescue and UAV research observation.
They carry super accurate canons and good machine guns, dumb rockets and PGMs can be rigged in.
This is Nigeria

I do agree, if we get the Tucano, it would be the same version Afganistan uses. However it is simply not true to say Boko-Haram is more deadly than ISIS or Taliban. ISIS militants are a cordinated fighting force, with former Generals in their ranks. They are armed with Anti-Tank, Anti-Air missiles. The Tucanos for Afghanistan can deliver PGMs.

Adminisher:


I disagree on the Alpha Jet.
We should extend their operation another ten years, get some PGM capability and buy more from German Air force stocks. We have developed world leading core competency on this Aircraft and many European Airforces are still using them. It is the only fast mission time COIN aircraft we have now and wearn have mastered quick accurate targeting with data coming from ISR aircraft. How many African countries do you think can do this now?.
Super Tucanoes can do its own ISR and attack on its own but the aircraft is slower and the weapons on board lighter.

I completely disagree. It's the same argument with keeping the AK-47. There are the L-15 and M-346 that can replace the Alpha jet. Those planes are not needed.


They should instead be transferred to a display team, try bring in additional money for the Air force.

pacretus:
what da ***.o men! U not gonna do that right ?.
I min how u go fill wen ur blockos starts oscillating wit kids everywhere staring.?.i'm sure GRAND PA..will slowly but surely be retired.LOL

I agree, the Alpha jets have to go today. Almost 40 years in NAF service, that's enough.

Nigerian Army Commandos

pacretus:
what da ***.o men! U not gonna do that right ?.
I min how u go fill wen ur blockos starts oscillating wit kids everywhere staring.?.i'm sure GRAND PA..will slowly but surely be retired.LOL

lol...was joking bruh
but those jets are older than some Nigerian universities

Henry240:


Yeah, as i was just saying, i don't see how the U.S air force would influence the sale of Tucanos to Nigeria. In my opinion, we aren't talking to the right people. Anyway, I'd love to be enlightened though.

The US Military as per the Constitution stays Strictly Neutral on POLITICAL ISSUES so the presence of a team of USAAF Senior officers indicates the level of seriousness attached to this process,it also indicates the waivers concerning the Leahy act might of been partially achieved. America does not send a one Star General on Junkets, if the State Dept said no He wouldn't be here.
As a General he would of come to communicate the Military concerns if the procurement goes through namely Logistics for spares, training of Pilots, Nigeria's needs I.e. how many Planes.He is not authorized to discuss anything political because that is not his territory.
Just like any other country America has it's own interests, likewise Nigeria it appears there interests are converging.By all accounts these are very Good planes, if Nigeria can get them they should emotions aside .Nigeria needs more birds in the Sky, needs to police it's borders effectively.
The Alpha Jets will be phased out as the Economy gets better,a lot is going to happen it is just going to take time.
Lastly the Taliban controls huge swaths of the South notably Kandahar , Boko Haram even by independent observers control barely a sliver of 1~2LGA which if pursued will run to Niger or Cameroon , there really is no Military comparisons.

Henry240:


Hence i said it's armour can be upgraded. We have been experimenting with Dyneema, here in Nigeria. Dyneema is able to stop AA rounds. There's also the option of using ceramic armour when it's available.


We have mostly engaged non-state actors in the past 30 years, engagements for the foreseeable future would continue with this trend. For state actors, we've both defeated Chad and Cameroun.

That's why in my initial reply I said it was "too light".

Adding armour will reduce the mobility of the vehicle.

Non-state actors in Africa I think you'll agree with me that I modern times are well armed. Unlike the days when rebels were only armed with weapons they could carry.

The rebels in Mali caused France to deploy fighters, IFVs, armoured cars, artillery etc

Henry240:
Nigerian Army Commandos

Those A4 sized badges!

Henry240:


I do agree, if we get the Tucano, it would be the same version Afganistan uses. However it is simply not true to say Boko-Haram is more deadly than ISIS or Taliban. ISIS militants are a cordinated fighting force, with former Generals in their ranks. They are armed with Anti-Tank, Anti-Air missiles. The Tucanos for Afghanistan can deliver PGMs.

By deadly I'm sure they aren't referring to capabilities.

Also I'm sceptical about the sources of information used on the Nigerian side.

Henry240:
-Nigerian MI-24V Attack Helicopter


- Nigerian Pilots, I don't think i've seen a Nigerian pilot that is above 40 years of age. NAF pilots should rank as some of the youngest in the world.

Shouldn't that be a bit worrying?