This is something of a versus thread. It's How To Maintain And Control A Woman vs 20 Wise Marriage Tips From A Man That Was Recently Divorced.


1. Excerpts outlining the persuasions of each OP:

From "How to Maintain and Control a Woman",

Be wise, my brothers be wise, enough of these tears on Nairaland. These days more men come here to complain than women. This is a war we have to win at all costs.

From "20 Wise Tips...",

MEN- THIS IS YOUR CHARGE : Commit to being an EPIC LOVER. There is no greater challenge, and no greater prize. Your woman deserves that from you.

2. Summary of arguments:

From "How to Maintain and Control...",

If you think maintaining a woman is about excess love, showing affection, kindness, forgiveness, religion and all that bullsh*t, you're dead wrong, treat a woman too good, she will find an excuse to leave ( “I was once dumped by a chick who later told her friend, I was 'too nice'.”). But they will stay with an “omo rapala” that mistreats them day after day after day.

From "20 Wise Tips...",

In the end MARRIAGE isn’t about Happily ever after. It’s about work. And a commitment to grow together and a willingness to continually invest in creating something that can endure eternity. Through that work, the happiness will come.

Marriage is life, and it will bring ups and downs. Embracing all of the cycles and learning to learn from and love each experience will bring the strength and perspective to keep building, one brick at a time.

3. Points of agreement or near-agreement:

From "How to Maintain and Control..."

In fact most of the accomplished true control guys have barricaded their hearts a long time ago.

From "20 Wise Tips..."

2) PROTECT YOUR OWN HEART. Just as you committed to being the protector of her heart, you must guard your own with the same vigilance.

4. Points of Conflict:

Pretty much everything else or the essence of everything else.

What I Think.

Relationship is not easy. Simple. It's a fool who thinks it is. It doesn't matter what kind we're talking about, they're all hard. Guy-guy friendships run into trouble same as girl-girl friendships and romantic relationships. It's here I would prefer to start to deal with any particular type of relationship.

True Control guy. He's very dashing. Girls like him. Because he can't be hurt. He's emotionally low-maintenance. At least, the girls think so until they realize how much they want him to care. But he doesn't want to and does his best to kill his natural desire to love. He's attractive but he will never truly be yours.

Wise Tips guy. Well, he's not as dashing a figure. At least, he doesn't seem to be. He's "too nice". He cares about his woman and shows it. And girls dislike him for that until they have to get married. I think we all agree that he's the real man, emphasis on the "real". Problem is, because he's real, he can be hurt and nobody likes a prickly conscience.

Common Misconceptions.

» True Control can be made into Wise Tips.
Don't wake up from this dream if you can do anything about it. The choice to become True Control involves a deliberate decision to destroy one's vulnerability. The woman who'll change this homeboy will make a hefty sacrifice to succeed and it doesn't always pay off because True Control doesn't want relationship, he wants control.

» Wise Tips is Limp Wimp.
I understand why women think this, but they're horribly wrong. You see Wise Tips is not the 180° opposite of True Control. Limp Wimp is. Limp Wimp is a leech. He's a crybaby (not necessarily with tears, he can be a monster with anger issues). He sucks the life out of his woman, leans on her for everything and offers nothing in exchange. Wise Tips is the third category, True Control and Limp Wimp are over-developments of aspects of him.


Conclusion/Summary

Wise Tips is the real deal. He's not playing a game. If he wants you, he comes after you. He is in it for real and if he doesn't know how to look after you, he'll learn. He's committed. True Control is not. True Control is out-of-school fun. He doesn't bother you because he doesn't care. Good luck trying to make him care. You'll lose a lot getting there. May it be worth it for you. Amen.

If you're Wise Tips, what can I say? It's a crazy world today. Pick your women wisely. Little girls aren't what you need. If you fall in love with one, just move out of town and cool off until she gets her head screwed on right. You won't succeed screwing it on for her. Sorry. If you asked me, I'd even say you shouldn't wait on her. But that's just me - I have a natural dislike for damaged goods. It'll take the miracle of Love for me to accept such goods.

If you're True Control, rock on, dude. But do something about old age. I hear it's a bittch to die lonely.

If you're a little girl, have fun. If you ever entrap a Wise Tips, lucky you. Just don't think he was a fool. Wise Tips are like miners. They don't mind the dirt if they think there's value in the depths.

If you're a real woman, I wanna meet you. I want one and y'all too darn scarce!

Our parents didn't have to read through all these '20 ways to know she is the one' or '15 ways to know he's cheating' and yet they got it right. As for me Ishi, I aint reading none of these internet counselling shtuff. No way!! When Mr Right comes, I will use good old intuition

Hi Ishi

Our parents were smarter and less confused. And it wasn't the general practice then to pick or deal with your spouse based on intuition which itself draws upon social norms and mores, personal experience, subjective beliefs and stuff like that.

Abeg, I go with Ishilove. At a time it all gets blurry with everyone dishing out their own 'tested, trusted and tried' tips. When you see the right person you'll know. I stick with walking with my innerwoman. You say our parents dint walk with intuition? And that intuition is cemented on social norms, morals, subjective beliefs, personal experiences and stuff like these? And you think our parents dint work with this? I beg to differ.

Me, I am willing to learn o. If you know that they did, tell me abeg.

Besides, I wasn't offering relationship advice per se. I don't do much of that anymore. I was comparing two views on love and relationship. The views are on the threads I linked here. Anybody can read them.

I can agree about the personal experience part. Our parents mostly got to experience the real deal (marriage) straight up. They dint get to put one foot into the shoe first, to wiggle their toes in it and see if it was a perfect fit or not, and later discard the shoe for another one. If it wasn't a perfect fit they worked at it, their feet firmly planted in the pair. They had patience and were not so choosy. Maybe that's the problem of this new generation. But don't mind me, I'm just blabbing.

The articles we read online are not entirely bad. I believe that a good number of them are cool. and in the midst of all this articles begging for our attention, it's upto the individual to pick those he feels are right and use them.
We can not entirely rely on ancient methods of dealing with relationship issues. For example, ancient methods used in settling issues by a man could involve beating his wife. Is that still relevant now? Of course not. But recent articles teaches ways of handling differences.
That's my take.

Ihedinobi: Me, I am willing to learn o. If you know that they did, tell me abeg.

Besides, I wasn't offering relationship advice per se. I don't do much of that anymore. I was comparing two views on love and relationship. The views are on the threads I linked here. Anybody can read them.

You were comparing two views on love and relationship. I was commenting on relationships, marriages and marriages that last.

ARareGem: ...If it wasn't a perfect fit they worked at it, their feet firmly planted in the pair....

BAM! Now read #2: Summary of Arguments in the op. You'll see that you've just echoed the Wise Tips author. If you read the first paragraph of "What I Think" too, you'll find that I agree too.

The whole point of this thread was to say that love/relationship is work. No shortcuts. Every shortcut ends up winding you.

That's why I said that our parents were smarter and less confused. However, it is wise to note that we are not our parents and we're not living in the eighteenth century. The times we live in are real. We are an inquisitive generation living under a deluge of all kinds of information and misinformation so our intuition is badly screwed up just like our moral compass.

That's why I compare views now. I appeal to logic to promote any view I have. That's what I tried to do here. Hopefully, some confused guy will realize that it's a better idea to be Mr Wise Tips and some confused girl will choose to grow into a real woman. If that happens even in one instance, this effort will have been worth everything that went into it.

ARareGem:

You were comparing two views on love and relationship. I was commenting on relationships, marriages and marriages that last.

Well, the two views were offering different ways to succeed at relationship and marriage. I tried to highlight them.

It's ok if one just wants to wing relationships and marriage now. That's entirely the individual's choice. I just thought to put tjw compare up there jic, you know.

Ishilove: Our parents didn't have to read through all these '20 ways to know she is the one' or '15 ways to know he's cheating' and yet they got it right. As for me Ishi, I aint reading none of these internet counselling shtuff. No way!! When Mr Right comes, I will use good old intuition

Very, very well-said.

Ishilove: Our parents didn't have to read through all these '20 ways to know she is the one' or '15 ways to know he's cheating' and yet they got it right. As for me Ishi, I aint reading none of these internet counselling shtuff. No way!! When Mr Right comes, I will use good old intuition

Word.

Honestly, all these rules make it look as if its a "relationship robot" one operates. Whatever happened to being spontaneous and going with the flow. Funny enough after applying all these rules, you can never be too sure if the relationship would last or lead to something more permanent, neither will it guarantee true happiness.

Seriously, did anyone read the darn op? Abi na d title confuse una? I'm not Dr Phil! Geez! Smdh

Ihedinobi: Hi Ishi

Our parents were smarter and less confused. And it wasn't the general practice then to pick or deal with your spouse based on intuition which itself draws upon social norms and mores, personal experience, subjective beliefs and stuff like that.

You have a point. We are a very confused generation

Ishilove: Our parents didn't have to read through all these '20 ways to know she is the one' or '15 ways to know he's cheating' and yet they got it right. As for me Ishi, I aint reading none of these internet counselling shtuff. No way!! When Mr Right comes, I will use good old intuition

Gbam!

Aha! Another case in point: https://www.nairaland.com/623076/ladies-really

I think it's a li'l funny

Ihedinobi: Hi Ishi

Our parents were smarter and less confused. And it wasn't the general practice then to pick or deal with your spouse based on intuition which itself draws upon social norms and mores, personal experience, subjective beliefs and stuff like that.

Why did I even say the bolded? It was the 19th century generation that last got marriage right. From the nineteen hundreds onward, stats have been horrible so which parents got it right sef?

MzGreat: @OP, there's an atom of truth in what you said cos this stuff has happned to me before and i swore to God it will never happen to me again.
i just still wonder myself that why do so many attractive and seemingly intelligent women go for assholes? These guys treat them poorly, disrespect them, and get away with all kinds of crap. Yet women swoon and get weak in the knees for them, time and time again

nwaiz i feel because while this asshole is dating the girl, he’s not an “asshole.” At least, not in the beginning. He’s charming, fun, and exciting. He makes her feel like a woman. Dating him is like a roller coaster with high peaks and thrills but when the ride dips, the cries come. Now he’s chauvinistic, arrogant, and selfish. He makes her feel like dirt. Now, he’s an asshole.

As a nice guy, you’re probably sitting there, fuming. “Will these girls ever learn?” you’re wondering. “I’m a nice guy; I’d treat them well. Why don’t they like me?” because you’re boring, passive, and uninspiring. You make her feel like an older sister. Dating you is like dating a sniveling subordinate at work who’s always kissing her ass and never exhibiting a backbone. You never have an opinion, you always want to do whatever she wants, and you don’t do anything to keep her on her toes (or make her feel swept off her feet).

and then you say I totally do that! But some girls just don’t know how to appreciate me. I don’t want a girl who needs me to be an arrogant b a s t a r d around her!” Fine, then don’t. But if you want to know the truth, it’s not assholes we girls are after. we after a guy who can drive us wild. Who can take charge, challenge us, and be a Man.

The above is from the afore-linked thread in my penultimate post. My first reaction to it was "she's kinda right". My second was "Get. The. Fucck. Out." And I'm still a bit pissed off.

If you want a gawddamn challenge, stick with your assholes na. That's GUS for real. Maybe someday you'll beat the odds and strike gold. Who the hell knows, right?

In my experience, once a guy falls in.love he gets silly around the girl he's fallen for. It's not a loss of manhood, it's a gain of manhood. He wants to make her happy. That's all that matters to him. Guys all over the world are like that. They'll buy flowers and boxes of chocolate and ask advice of everybody on how to make their woman happy. They forget how to be Mr Magic Stick and Don Bad Boy.

It's just basic. That's how love works. It makes the lover more interested in pleasing the beloved than "challenging" the beloved.

Madame here talks about boring too. Gaddem! Have you ever listened in on pillow talk? That's worse than valium unless you're a girl in a moody period. How about the daily mechanics of married life? Seriously, shut the hell up! Reality is boring to young minds, that's why folk tales and fairy tales exist. You have to romanticise every dad-blamed thing to make it meaningful to kids.

Besides, the good guys are solid. They want to dazzle and romance their lady just as much as the bad boys do too. They sometimes may be clueless how to do it (and falling in love does the craziest things to a man's brain too), but they do learn and knock a girl's socks off given the time of day.

Watch Hitched or whatever Will Smith's movie's name was. When the main character, Professor Love Coach himself, fell in love, he lost all his damn cards.

^^ Oh, and, um, I'll bet that poster never actually dated Wise Tips. She sounded a little like she was talking about Limp Wimp.

*Slaps Ihedinobi* *Punches his stomach*.
I DIDN'T GIVE YOU THOSE LINKS SO THAT YOU CAN BE DOING THIS!! >:-(
Are you believing what these girls are saying? Didn't you ever come across the rule
1. Never believe what a girl says believe what she does ?

All these girls talking and forming like they've got the self control and they know what they want and they don't do all these stuffs are old cargos that have been there and done that and have made their mistakes and learnt and then they come here to talk as if they were born with the knowledge. It's a lie.

I always appreciate a girl that can tell me the hardcore truth like the girl from that thread you quoted. She gave you the truth from a girl's perspective and you rejected it. Many girls on that thread respected posters here admitted to falling for that asshole type and then they learnt their lesson and even one of them explained how it works and yet you reject it? Girls lie, they say one thing and do another and for them to come and admit it and then explain it. It's a nugget of Gold take it.

I know exactly how you feel, i have a guy inside of me; Good Wacky I call him, ready to believe everything you want to believe, ready to believe that there is a girl out there who will accept my love, allow me to spoil her pieces and not let it get to her head. A girl who i can let ou all this romantic energy with and not be scared that things will go awry. Good Wacky even used to say then whenever the subject of cheating came up that for the girl He loves : Even if aphrodite herself came down from the heavens tonight naked, i would never cheat on my babe. Yeah he used to say that.
That was until i met her... The angel who wasn't , then i opened my eyes and i saw it wasn't just me but it's happening everywhere.

When you listen to what a girl says about certain topics you'll never believe that she can do a particular thing but when you actually put her in that position, you see so many things that are. I had to train myself to see behind the smoke screen that they put. I'm not that good at it but i'm always learning.

Good news for you is that there is the middle ground between being a nice guy and being a jerk. You can do those things that keep a girl in line that a jerk does without being an abuser like a jerk. I don't have the words but people like sAGAMITE And 2Sexy do and the former has explained it like a science in some threads. Track it

Ihedinobi:


In my experience, once a guy falls in.love he gets silly around the girl he's fallen for. It's not a loss of manhood, it's a gain of manhood. He wants to make her happy. That's all that matters to him. Guys all over the world are like that. They'll buy flowers and boxes of chocolate and ask advice of everybody on how to make their woman happy. They forget how to be Mr Magic Stick and Don Bad Boy.

It's just basic. That's how love works. It makes the lover more interested in pleasing the beloved than "challenging" the beloved.

Ihedinobi you could have atleast diluted this rubbish na. It's too concentrated

WackyJ1:
Ihedinobi you could have atleast diluted this rubbish na. It's too concentrated

WackyJ1:
Ihedinobi you could have atleast diluted this rubbish na. It's too concentrated

WackyJ1: *Slaps Ihedinobi* *Punches his stomach*.
I DIDN'T GIVE YOU THOSE LINKS SO THAT YOU CAN BE DOING THIS!! >:-(

*Breaks a bottle on his head

Dahell you talkin bout?

Are you believing what these girls are saying? Didn't you ever come across the rule
1. Never believe what a girl says believe what she does ?

I've been working on my natural distrust of women just so I can give a new possible relationship a chance. Ordinarily I don't believe what a woman says (or, in fact, what anyone says). But then that destroys relationships not build them.

All these girls talking and forming like they've got the self control and they know what they want and they don't do all these stuffs are old cargos that have been there and done that and have made their mistakes and learnt and then they come here to talk as if they were born with the knowledge. It's a lie.

Some of them are definitely, but all? That's too sweeping a statement. Only a cynic would generalize like that. Such women are the type I actually "hate" and don't look forward to getting with (although love does have a lot to say about that). But not all. Some are wise without the experience, bro.

I always appreciate a girl that can tell me the hardcore truth like the girl from that thread you quoted. She gave you the truth from a girl's perspective and you rejected it.

And you know it's the truth how? Because it agrees with what you already believe? I think the girl who wrote that was dumb as .... She didn't know what a real man was.

Many girls on that thread respected posters here admitted to falling for that asshole type and then they learnt their lesson and even one of them explained how it works and yet you reject it? Girls lie, they say one thing and do another and for them to come and admit it and then explain it. It's a nugget of Gold take it.

Rejected what? I totally agree that girls fall for assholes. I already said as much in my op. All I did was say that they were despicably dumb to do so. And I tried to explain the different classes of men there are and what sort of female could land them.

I know exactly how you feel, i have a guy inside of me; Good Wacky I call him, ready to believe everything you want to believe, ready to believe that there is a girl out there who will accept my love, allow me to spoil her pieces and not let it get to her head. A girl who i can let ou all this romantic energy with and not be scared that things will go awry.

That's how I feel? I don't know, man. Love has always been a risk. I'm totally at peace with that. If a girl chooses me and sees value in me, I'll pour out all my love on her and build a life with her. If she doesn't I walk.

Good Wacky even used to say then whenever the subject of cheating came up that for the girl He loves : Even if aphrodite herself came down from the heavens tonight naked, i would never cheat on my babe. Yeah he used to say that.
That was until i met her... The angel who wasn't , then i opened my eyes and i saw it wasn't just me but it's happening everywhere.

Perhaps Good Wacky was naive. I can cheat on my girl and I know it but I will not do it. Cheating doesn't just happen, bro, any more than any kind of sex just happens.

When you listen to what a girl says about certain topics you'll never believe that she can do a particular thing but when you actually put her in that position, you see so many things that are. I had to train myself to see behind the smoke screen that they put. I'm not that good at it but i'm always learning.

It's not peculiar to girls. Until you're in a situation you've never experienced talk is easy. But girls stand to lose a lot - at least, they think so - by telling the truth. So even after experience they do lie. I know that. When I decide to believe I do so because of the valie I've placed on the person. I only doubt when certain behaviors are not explained satisfactorily after that.

Good news for you is that there is the middle ground between being a nice guy and being a jerk. You can do those things that keep a girl in line that a jerk does without being an abuser like a jerk. I don't have the words but people like sAGAMITE And 2Sexy do and the former has explained it like a science in some threads. Track it

I already explained in my op how there are three classes of men. The class that I called Wise Tips is the class that I insist is made up of real men. I know the science you mean, or, at least, I think I do. And I disagree. Love is not a game.

In a game, your object is to win something, to take possession of something and that thing either has no choice in the matter or does not want to be captured. It's a little like taking a horse from the wild. That is not Love.

In Love, you want to be given a gift the same as you willingly, without compulsion gave yours. There is no satisfaction otherwise. The guy chases the girl hard not because chasing her can make her love him but because he already believes she loves him and only wants him to assure her that it is safe to let herself go with him.

When a girl says that she fell in love with him because of his persistence I know that the truth is either that they didn't know they had already fallen for him before he started inundating them with his love songs and texts and heaven-knows-what-else OR that they aren't in love with him: they're only on love with having their female ego stroked and don't know it.

So, I don't believe that I need to act the jerk's part to lock down a woman's heart. The jerk tries to act my part to lock down a woman's heart.

WackyJ1:
Ihedinobi you could have atleast diluted this rubbish na. It's too concentrated

Concentrate it how? What makes it rubbish? Why do the assholes and jerks and true control guus buy the occasional flowers and call at all? Is it not to give the impression that they're in love with the girl?

Another take on the matter: https://www.nairaland.com/1249682/why-women-dislike-nice-guys#15124347

MRbrownJAY: @OP
what a pile of nonsense!!!!!

- most nice guys are hideously insecure..... BULLSHIIT
just because you have to force yourself to be nice, does not mean that people who are naturally nice are faking it like you do. here is a clue: treat others as you want to be treated, live right and get tenfold in return!

- most nice guys exude insecurity.......BULLSHIIT
the fact that you automatically believe that being nice means being a fool is one of the reason why you have no idea what you are talking about. being nice means just that, and when there is no reason to be nice anymore then these guys become NOT nice any longer. pls stop associating being nice with being a MUGU....thats two different subjects.

- so many Nice Guys complain about women being horrible...........BULLSHIIT
if a woman is horrible then ALL guys would complain about her being horrible, not only the nice ones, duh!

- Nice Guys go overboard........BULLSHIIT
just because YOU dont do certain things, or dont live by these criterias, shouldnt be a reason to dismiss those who do. women like to be offered flowers FACT! men try to buy women's affection by any mean necessary, FACT! all men have different view of romance and there is no "one set fits all" when it comes to romance, FACT! thinking that nice guys ALWAYS fail in love is your ultimate fail of the day, FACT! being nice doesnt mean being stoopid, the day you realize that is the day you will have a fair chance on understanding the issue, FACT!

a man that worships or puts a woman on a pedestal is a fool, a man that respects a woman and cares for her needs to the best of his capable abilities is a nice guy. just because YOU cannot care for a woman (because of you egotistical BS) does not make your actions better than the nice guy's.
treat people the way YOU want to be treated, and basta!

as for your idea that nice guys are men that "cling to women, and want to be one with them for fear that if she is out of sight, she may disappear or become attracted to someone else" i can only laugh in Swahili and ask myself where do you come up with so much nonsense?!

- A Nice Guy often has trouble with emotional intimacy.........BULLSHIIT, the fact that YOUR insecure self believes that a nice guy is automatically faking (thus afraid that his true self will get busted) is another reason why you are failing in this subject. try to use your brain, remove your low self esteem ego out of the equation, and realize that many men are nice to women simply because that in their NATURE, and they are not faking as you may think.

- Nice Guys are always asking HER to make the decisions........BULLSHIIT
wherever you get your manual on "nice guys" i suggest you go and get a refund. your idea of nice guys is so wrong that only a biatch slap at a 90degrees angle may help you wake up from your nonsense (with all due respect)
some people are not strong or forward like that,and require that others make decision for them...... and there is NOTHING wrong with that.

- Nice Guys rarely speak up when something bothers them,........ BULLSHIIT
some guy are indeed shy, and again there is nothing wrong with that......

- Nice Guys think that they will never meet anyone as special as she is.........BULLSHIIT
there is nothing wrong in showing a woman that you care for her, and if she is special then by all means men need to show that too. men like you have so much crap embedded in their DNA that they have lost the plot on how to treat women properly. if you meet a special woman then SHOW HER THAT SHE IS, end of story!
men should love (the right) women the best they can, as hard as they can, with no boundaries.

- The nice guy -needs- to believe that he is the best person for the object of his desires..... ON THE CONTRARY all men should believe in themselves and believe that they are the best person for any woman. the ones who think that they are not good enough are simply insecure low self esteem being. who cares who could be a good match for a lady IF YOU ARE THE ONE DATING HER?! if these other people were "good match" then THEY would be dating her at that moment, not YOU, duh! only an insecure low self esteem person think the way you do.

- More than loving the woman in his life, a Nice Guy NEEDS her.........BULLSHIIT we ALL need women, and any fool who believes that he doesnt is either extremely gayy or deluded! at the end of the day, no man can be truly happy unless he has a good loving woman by his side to share his happiness!

- Nice Guys go after “hard luck” cases..........BULLSHIIT
most women dont show their true on the first date, and some can hide their true self until you say I DO..... only men with misplaced ego would think that they can ALWAYS tell who a woman truly is. some men are novices and shouldnt be blame for their inexperience (aka being a novice)! some men give EVERY women a chance and shouldnt be blame for being open minded like that! some men want "different" women, and that should only be THEIR choices to make, and certainly shouldnt be blamed for that. just because YOU dont like such woman is all on you, but dont automatically blame men who do.

- Nice Guys don’t like themselves.....THE ICING ON THE CAKE OF ALL BULLSHIIT
so if i understand the OP correctly, a man who is nice to others doesnt love himself, bwaaaaah! men like the OP has issues with women, and thus wants all men to think as low as he does of women. there is nothing wrong with being nice to someone, there isnothing wrong with caring for someone, OP should try it someday, it may do him a lot of good.

Ihedinobi:

Why did I even say the bolded? It was the 19th century generation that last got marriage right. From the nineteen hundreds onward, stats have been horrible so which parents got it right sef?

My parents

^^ Lol. Sure, but then that's one couple in how many again? It was you said, "our parents", no?

erm, is the romance section different from sexuality section? Used to think they were one and the same...

aManFromMars: erm, is the romance section different from sexuality section? Used to think they were one and the same...

Na lie! You know jare! Sexuality subs Romance. Why?

Don't know, man. Always thought they were same and erm, erm, never liked the sexuality section for some strange reason.


Maybe I'll visit the romance section more often, even Uyi dey here sef..

Hmmm... That's cool. I'm just phasing right now sha.