jmoore: Inventions got nothing to do with religion.

If that was TRUE, then the muslim inventors would have been given their due recognition in the fields they excelled. But, unfortunately, it isn't TRUE.

golpen:

You don't have to be told that you need to be constructive. Will you like to give us a proof of this you've said?

In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.(Gen 1:1) And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.(Gen 2:7). The Bible verses above imply that there is a creator called God who created man and breath life into man and man became a living being. Therefore man got life from his God and the living gene of God was pass on to man, the creative ability inclusive. This shows that every man existing or have exited under this sun has endowment in him (when I talk of man I mean man and woman) to create things (Fabricate, manufacture, produce and invent). This has nothing to do with your religion, because you are a Muslim today right, and your forefathers were heathen or idol worshipers and it is very correct that you might have inherited some genes from them that is in your traits today. So a Chinese, a European man, a Yoruba man, an Ibo man a Hausa Man has the ability to do anything he wants because it is inherent. This has nothing to do with salvation, it is only the man's religious inclination that will produce at the end where he is going to spent eternity.

novicali: In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.(Gen 1:1) And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.(Gen 2:7). The Bible verses above imply that there is a creator called God who created man and breath life into man and man became a living being. Therefore man got life from his God and the living gene of God was pass on to man, the creative ability inclusive. This shows that every man existing or have exited under this sun has endowment in him (when I talk of man I mean man and woman) to create things (Fabricate, manufacture, produce and invent). This has nothing to do with your religion, because you are a Muslim today right, and your forefathers were heathen or idol worshipers and it is very correct that you might have inherited some genes from them that is in your traits today. So a Chinese, a European man, a Yoruba man, an Ibo man a Hausa Man has the ability to do anything he wants because it is inherent. This has nothing to do with salvation, it is only the man's religious inclination that will produce at the end where he is going to spent eternity.

Heaven knows that you're fumbling. SMH!!!

baba11: No,i am not better than them,infact we are all the same in the sight of our creator no matter where you come from be it white, black.Same for the rich and the poor in the sight of Allah(swt).May Allah forgives us of our shortcomings,shows the right path and may He not use this against us on the day of accountability,amen!!!

Good you have liberated your mind a little and I can see is no longer being construed by religion, since you can identify that we are all equal in the sight of God. That in a sense tells me that you have come to term with the idea that it is not proper for us to identity/inscribe an invention by man to his religion because our religion gives a clear definition of our relationship with God but our invention does not because anybody can come up with a thing no matter how magnificent it may appear but that person is not related with God. Therefore, using the term "Islamic inventions" in a way to glorify Islam is a mistake because the lesser cannot glorify the greater, in essence Islam I suppose is of the Divine and invention are of the mortals, let me leave at this stage because I don't want to go higher. Somehow I was labelled a free thinker on this issue, but I saw the danger of what this kind of things stand for, just like the Muslim beauty pageant of a thing, these things are wrong and there is no way one can align them with what Islam really stand for. Mind you I don't like seeing things from the surface rather digging the latent and that is where the issue is.

baba11: .....It's somebody like you we need in Nigeria,if we can pool our resources intellectually,materially etc together,Nigeria'll be better for us all.If you run,i run and everybody runs away from Nigeria,who'll make it better in the long run,besides,don't wash our dirty linen in the public again,ok.That 'retardant' man,i didn't vote for him so I can't say much about him.Only my vote cannot count!!!For your information,i studied engineering,i spent the exact 5yrs(Bsc),2yrs(ND) we were mearnt to spend,so retract what you said here,i don't agree!!!

Well, I think the more we talk about these ugly things and expose them the better for us. In fact the onus is placed on all good Nigerians to come out and fight against these ills in our country.You are lucky to have spent the normal 5yrs there are people who spent more than that... you can quote me wrong! I didn't run away from Nigeria the truth is that the evil ones in Nigeria that are supported by the religious saboteurs will not allow any good person to come close of course you are there, you know what I am saying!

vedaxcool

Liaraxis, you ALWAYS ignore the topic at hand and try to compare unrelated events, was the thread ever about violence? NO, clearly it was about Muslims inventions, So how did we get here,simply YOUR BLIND FANATICISM you are Learning from SPENCE, as usual push to ask irrelevant question when responded to you to you cry courtesy!

Who brought up the killings in Rwanda?

SO did you, TOTALLY SIDE Stepping THE QUESTION, how did the Hadith of the holy prophet pbuh became part of the op? which YOU nor any of you EVANGELIST by LIES have attempted refuting? I am very sorry that you cannot fathom where to look for the mountain spoked about in the bible, but as simple Human ethics demand if you have no answer to a question, say PASS I understand this might be ADHD! very funny I have only quoted 2 verses in the bible and you are already sermonizing like this!

Your muslim brother asked for me to show an example of how Islam and science conflict, the result was the Hadith that said Adam was 90 feet tall. I don't know why you are going around in circles. If you can't prove it, say you can't and stop playing pretend

vedaxcool

If you can read well, I asked YOU to show me the mountain that was spoken about in the bible and how can a camel ever pass thru the eye of a needle, I am hardly interested in answering your question since i was not the originator of it, the brother has answered u. so because you are positioning yourself as an authority in science, you should be ready to answer questions when asked, I have very right to ask you question, common sense suggest that since i did not ask you the question in view, I am not expected to clear any floor, I know even to your 10th generation can answer the simple question I asked, where is the mountain satan carried Jesus too? how can a camel ever pass thru the eye of a needle?, that he was able to see all the kingdoms in their splendour? I do not expect anything from a Christian whose own co-religionist labels a liar!

The mountain in the Bible has absolutely nothing to do with the discussion. Me quoting Adam was 90 feet tall was in response to a muslim brother asking me to show where Islam contradicts science. FOR YOU TO TAKE A STEP AND ANSWER THE HADITH, you are ignored it and side-step by question. Instead, you ran to the Bible to prove a point. Why is it the Bible you are running to? There are Hindu, Buddist and 1001 other religions; why are you specifically referring to the Bible? Can't Islam stand on it's on without involving the Bible.

Can't you answer the statement by the Hadith without bringing the Bible into it? I am not an authority on science, all I ask if for Islam to prove Adam was 90 feet tall. You failing to prove it and draw in the Bible proves nothing - it proves that you have no answer to my question.

golpen

Funny enough you had to agree with your biology teacher back then in school that your ancestors were apes just because you so much needed to pass biology, but you haven't seen any fossil record yourself and you have not been able to prove it.

The skeletal system of a human and that of an ape is close in resemblance my friend. It is closer than proving that a human being was 90 feet tall

See, muslims are always objective on issues, but it is you who are beclouded with hate that fail to see the objectivity. If the prophet (saw) said Adam (as) was 90 feet tall, then you science must have proven him right ¡y coming up with what they call 'mutation'. But in you hate filled skull, you believe that apes could turn human due to changes, but men couldn't have measured shorter due to the same influence. Think!

Where does hate come in here? Who hates who and which hate statement did I use - CAN YOU PLEASE SHOW ME THE HATE STATEMENT I USED. If you are objective as you claim, you will attempt to prove the Hadith that claimed Adam was 90 feet tall. Instead, you are here crying that I hate muslims . Again, the question still stands, please prove that Adam was 90 feet tall; if you can't - then just say so

vedaxcool

Gen 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare [children] to them, the same [became] mighty men which [were] of old, men of renown.

Num 13:33 And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, [which come] of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.

Deu 2:10 The Emims dwelt therein in times past, a people great, and many, and tall, as the Anakims;
Deu 2:11 Which also were accounted giants, as the Anakims; but the Moabites call them Emims.

Again, you quoting the Bible doesn't prove Adam is 90 feet tall . All it has proven is that you can't answer the question I asked. Why do you have to use the Bible as justification of evidence that Adam was 90 feet tall. Can't you as a muslim use the same Hadith or the Quran to explain the claims it made. Did the Bible ever give you specific on how tall the Giants were? Did they tell you, they were 90 feet tall?

Don't pay too much attention to him, Christians of his calibre always like pointing fingers at others when the remain 4 points back at them. Mr. burden of Proof, where is proof for the above? wait I forgot I have no right to ask any question, yeah right!

Again, you are running off in another direction. The Bible never made claim that Adam was 90 feet tall. So, it's irrelevant to the discussion. The specific the Bible gave was of Goliath i.e. 1 Samuel 17:4 notes that Goliath’s height was measured at “six cubits and one span,” about nine feet, six inches. It didn't give any other specific on Giants. So, keep going around in circles and keep AVOIDING MY QUESTION.

ALL I ASKED WAS FOR SCIENTIFIC PROOF THAT ADAM WAS 90 FEET TALL. If you can't answer, just say you can't. It's that simple - you don't have to get worked up about it.

cloudstar:



The skeletal system of a human and that of an ape is close in resemblance my friend. It is closer than proving that a human being was 90 feet tall



Where does hate come in here? Who hates who and which hate statement did I use - CAN YOU PLEASE SHOW ME THE HATE STATEMENT I USED. If you are objective as you claim, you will attempt to prove the Hadith that claimed Adam was 90 feet tall. Instead, you are here crying that I hate muslims . Again, the question still stands, please prove that Adam was 90 feet tall; if you can't - then just say so

Do I need to proof anything to you? You don't need a proof, you need a pill.

I don't want to laugh at you for saying you agree because the skeletal system of apes and men are almost the same and that is possible, but a mutation in height mustnt have been possible. So that same human being undergoing some sort of changes overtime is impossible? You must be joking. But you haven't answered my question; have you seen a fossil record for yourself to prove your claims?

I'll prove it to you that Adam was 90ft tall on a condition that you can answer these two questions;

1. Do you believe the anakim giants existed according to the bible references you got? If yes, please give us a proof.

2. And if a normal human being could look as though a grasshopper in their (anakim's) sight, then what is their estimated height?

goldpen

Do I need to proof anything to you? You don't need a proof, you need a pill.

So, you have left the HATE allegation and you have now become DOCTOR that issue 'Adam is 90 feet' pills

I don't want to laugh at you for saying you agree because the skeletal system of apes and men are almost the same and that is possible, but a mutation in height mustnt have been possible. So that same human being undergoing some sort of changes overtime is impossible? You must be joking. But you haven't answered my question; have you seen a fossil record for yourself to prove your claims?

Bros, I am asking you for the proof of 'mutation'. We have the skeletal system of what the earliest man looked like and we have that of an ape and we can compare them. Even today, we have the skeletal system of an ape and that of human beings and they are similar in HEIGHT, reproduction and even in diet. So, please provide both PROOF and PILLS for your mutation theory . It's funny how the muslims I have asked this question keeps side-stepping the question and INSTEAD bring the Bible in it. As if the Bible is needed to prove the Hadith and the Quran. Can't the Quran/Hadith exist alone, why do you need the Bible to prove your point; if the Bible never existed, then how will you answer my question. Must you use the Giant references in the Bible to explain the Hadith that claimed Adam was 90 feet tall. Did the Bible claim Adam was 90 feet tall? All you have done like vexacool is side-step the question.

I'll prove it to you that Adam was 90ft tall on a condition that you can answer these two questions;

1. Do you believe the anakim giants existed according to the bible references you got? If yes, please give us a proof.

2. And if a normal human being could look as though a grasshopper in their (anakim's) sight, then what is their estimated height?

Cheap tactic to avoid my question; you can't answer a question with another question. While I can give you my word that I will answer them. You have to do justice by first providing scientific evidence that Adam was 90 feet tall. In summary, provide proof of your "X-men" mutation theory

saly kely

this are not the generation of Adam, but this give u an impression how mankind look like in early years

The existence of a 90 feet tall human being is physiologically impossible, if you will like us to take a scientific approach to it; I will be happy to engage you.

1. This meant that Adam was taller than every living thing i.e. elephants, whales, giraffes, mammoths, dinosaurs etc. So far, there is no proof that humans were the largest living creatures in existence. If you know of any human larger than 80 feet, please refer us to the museum holding their bones so I can refer to it
2. There are quite a number of other physical characteristics that can be discussed using scaling. For example, the cross sectional area of the leg bones obviously scales as the square of the characteristic length while the mass of the body supported by the legs scales as the cube. Since the bone has some ultimate tensile strength in N/m2, there would be some limit to the height of an animal, beyond which it would crumble under its own weight.
3. Allah created Adam, making him 60 cubits tall. This would be a height of 90 feet (27½ metres). No animal body can function at this height. The highest that the heart could pump blood from the feet would be less than 32 feet (9.81 metres); any greater height than this would cause a vacuum lock to develop in the circulation system. In fact the height at which the circulation system breaks down would be considerably less than this due to friction between the blood and the walls of the blood vessels

The above outlined issues are probably only the tip of the iceberg of problems that such a gigantic size would imply for a human being. Unless Muslims can present better arguments based on sound scientific reasoning, the conclusion can only be that Muhammad's claim regarding the size of Adam belongs to the realm of myths and fairy tales.

Even if Muslims like yourelf would want to question and reject the above arguments against Adam having been 90 feet tall because it was a singular miraculous event, or claim that it may have been possible in some unknown way since we do not know all the necessary parameters to make a final scientific judgment, Muhammad's second claim states that the height of human beings has been decreasing continuously. This means there must have been hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of gigantic people which lived and died on this earth. Although one cannot expect to find the skeleton of Adam (or any specific person of history), archaeology can tell us whether human beings in general have changed in size over time. Note carefully that Muhammad's claim does not merely say that there existed some exceptional people that happened to be very tall — the remains of which have sadly never been found. Muhammad's claim clearly means human beings in general or on average have continuously decreased since the time of Adam up to his own time.

If this were true, one would expect to find thousands of remains of gigantic people. These remains would first of all be skeletons, but also include tools they used, weapons, art work, remains of buildings, etc. And these findings should show a definite difference in size of people living 10,000 BC, 3,000 BC, and 500 AD. Since there were not only a few, but many such people, archaeologists should have no problem to present to us plenty of remains of people which were 60 feet, 50 feet, 40 feet, 30 feet and 20 feet tall. Where are they? Are there any such findings at all? Are they in decreasing sequence when ordered according to their age? I am not aware of ANY archaeological support for Muhammad's teaching about the size of human beings over history. To give a very generous bracket, humans have generally remained within the range of 3 to 10 feet. There is, to my knowledge, no evidence that their average was above 10 feet at any time of history.

Out mr cloudstar may become the joke of the century after giving us an assumption of his own imagination rather than scientific facts. Let me get straight to your three claims;

1. Owing to the fact that the archeological world might not be able to proof that man was once the tallest being does not nullify the possibility. In fact, archeologists agree to the fact that some beings might have existed and gone to extinction in this world that they have no record of. So asking them to start looking for the skeleton of Adam who died millions of years ago is almost not logical.

2. It is scientifically proven that your weight is proportional to the cube of scale and that is why in calculating your body mass index an abnormality in the proportion is counted obesity or otherwise. Therefore, even a 1000 feet tall man has a weight proportional to his height and the tensile strength of his bones, so he wouldn't have crumbled on his weight.

3. Where did you get your highest height theory from, uncle cloudstar?

As the scale of an animal increases the body weight and volume increase with the cube of scale. The volume of blood flow required to feed that bulk also increases with the cube of scale. The cross sectional area of the arteries and the veins required to carry that blood flow only increases with the square of scale. This means that there is an area-volume relationship in order to carry out a perfect circulation. Learn please, that there some other factors that will be put in line to aid perfect circulation of a 90ft tall man without a vacuum lock (for your mind)

1. The surface area of the lungs for absorbing oxygen and exhaling carbon dioxide.

2. The surface area of intestines for absorbing food nutrients.

3. The surface area of the skin for dispersing heat and waste.

4. The cross sectional area of the arteries, capillaries and the veins which make up the heart, for the transportation of the blood carrying the oxygen, food nutrients, carbon dioxide et al.

Now let me describe the look of a 90ft tall Adam (as) for you.

He was a 90ft tall man with a bone of tensile strength N/m2 as proportional to the height and standard weight complying with the BMI. He must have had large nostril with enough trapping device , large surface area of lungs, intestines, skin and a sizeable cross sectional area of the every heart tissues just for a 90ft tall man. Please do the maths yourself and keep the answers.

But please before you go, here's a proof of my Xmen mutation theory.

It was still possible even by a means of miracle for sarah to give birth in her 80s and according to my Xmen mutation theory, you don't want to see your granma in a preggie pot belly expecting a baby in her 80s

The average age for females to attain menopause in the 1960s/70 was around 60 years, but now we have a record of early menopause of age 35. How people are open to changes.

And I could talk and talk about some more, but please you may now answer my previous questions as regards the giants in the bible.but while you rack your mind for answers, make I sleep abeg.

golpen

Out mr cloudstar may become the joke of the century after giving us an assumption of his own imagination rather than scientific facts. Let me get straight to your three claims;

You have so far ignored my questions yet you happy to attack my responses

1. Owing to the fact that the archeological world might not be able to proof that man was once the tallest being does not nullify the possibility. In fact, archeologists agree to the fact that some beings might have existed and gone to extinction in this world that they have no record of. So asking them to start looking for the skeleton of Adam who died millions of years ago is almost not logical.

To nullify the possibility would be to present only ONE FIND. [size=14pt]PLEASE REFER TO ONLY ONE ARCHEOLOGICAL FIND OF A HUMAN OVER 50 FEET TALL[/size]

2. It is scientifically proven that your weight is proportional to the cube of scale and that is why in calculating your body mass index an abnormality in the proportion is counted obesity or otherwise. Therefore, even a 1000 feet tall man has a weight proportional to his height and the tensile strength of his bones, so he wouldn't have crumbled on his weight.

Cha, when did body mass index come in the picture, I was talking of the person's height. And here you are again, taken my statement and running off in another direction

3. Where did you get your highest height theory from, uncle cloudstar?

Basic science bros, basic science.

As the scale of an animal increases the body weight and volume increase with the cube of scale. The volume of blood flow required to feed that bulk also increases with the cube of scale. The cross sectional area of the arteries and the veins required to carry that blood flow only increases with the square of scale. This means that there is an area-volume relationship in order to carry out a perfect circulation. Learn please, that there some other factors that will be put in line to aid perfect circulation of a 90ft tall man without a vacuum lock (for your mind)

Really, give me an example of any human that is over 50 feet tall where this has worked

1. The surface area of the lungs for absorbing oxygen and exhaling carbon dioxide.

Irrelevant to the discussion

2. The surface area of intestines for absorbing food nutrients.

Irrelevant to the discussion

3. The surface area of the skin for dispersing heat and waste.

Irrelevant to the discussion

4. The cross sectional area of the arteries, capillaries and the veins which make up the heart, for the transportation of the blood carrying the oxygen, food nutrients, carbon dioxide et al.

Please prove this my giving a practical example

Now let me describe the look of a 90ft tall Adam (as) for you. He was a 90ft tall man with a bone of tensile strength N/m2 as proportional to the height and standard weight complying with the BMI. He must have had large nostril with enough trapping device , large surface area of lungs, intestines, skin and a sizeable cross sectional area of the every heart tissues just for a 90ft tall man. Please do the maths yourself and keep the answers.

Can you provide proof of this imaginary man, perhaps not Adam himself but at least one find of the millions of giants between 90-50 feet tall. THAT IS ALL I HAVE ASKED YOU TO PROVIDE. You haven't been able to so far. You have called me a hateful and have avoided answering my question. Also, the Hadith claim that since Adam, people are shrinking. So far, has anyone shrunk from 7th century Arabia until now. Are people still shrinking. So, humans will generally be growing smaller and smaller abi?

But please before you go, here's a proof of my Xmen mutation theory. It was still possible even by a means of miracle for sarah to give birth in her 80s and according to my Xmen mutation theory, you don't want to see your granma in a preggie pot belly expecting a baby in her 80s

lol, now this is laughable. Again, a muslim leaves his Quran and Hadith and goes to the Bible for his rescue. What has Sarah got to do with Adam being 90 feet tall? So, old age pregnancy is a mutation? Do you actually know the meaning of mutation?

The average age for females to attain menopause in the 1960s/70 was around 60 years, but now we have a record of early menopause of age 35. How people are open to changes.

How does this prove Adam is 90 feet tall. Why can't you just provide evidence instead OF GOING AROUND IN CIRCLES BROS

And I could talk and talk about some more, but please you may now answer my previous questions as regards the giants in the bible.but while you rack your mind for answers, make I sleep abeg.

You haven't even touched my question Bros. So far, you have talked about the imaginary Islamic Adam and told us about his nostrils . Think about it for a second, we have evidence of the dinosaur, the mammoths, the elephants, the giraffes, the whales. Why is your 90 feet Adam an exception? Like always, devoted muslims like yourself put their reasoning in the back-seat when it comes to matters of their faith. You are here trying to prove a 7th century Arabian fairy tale and in the process you are giving me a good laugh and no PROOF in the process.

And the reason your explanation is laughable as well is because well known Islamic theories are totally different from yours. Here is a popular Islamic stand on this subject:

"It is only possible for Adam to be 90 feet tall because during that time, gravity might have not been in play on the earth". The idea here is since there was no gravity or little of it, that explains Adam's growth. Here you are with your own mutation theory. Boy oh boy. From mutation to gravity yet no explanation and no proof.

cloudstar: golpen



You have so far ignored my questions yet you happy to attack my responses

You should have waited to read the remaining.

To nullify the possibility would be to present only ONE FIND. [size=14pt]PLEASE REFER TO ONLY ONE ARCHEOLOGICAL FIND OF A HUMAN OVER 50 FEET TALL[/size]

Rephrase your english or go back to primary school.

Cha, when did body mass index come in the picture, I was talking of the person's height. And here you are again, taken my statement and running off in another direction

You don't seem to know what you're saying again o. What did you say would have made him crumble on himself?

Basic science bros, basic science.

Rubbish science bro, that's rubbish science.

Really, give me an example of any animal that is over 50 feet tall where this has worked

Its my claim, so you give me an analysis of how that would fail.

Irrelevant to the discussion



Irrelevant to the discussion



Irrelevant to the discussion

How is it irrelevant? Please stop joking, they are the measures that would have been taken in order to avoid the VACUUM LOCK you mentioned.

Please prove this my giving a practical example

You got my analysis don't you? If no, then you'll have to go read your ali and simbi again. My claim is that every part responsible for the body activities in this sense is proportional to each other. Debunk it by analysing that it is false, simple!!!

Can you provide proof of this imaginary man, perhaps not Adam himself but at least one find of the millions of giants between 90-50 feet tall. THAT IS ALL I HAVE ASKED YOU TO PROVIDE. You haven't been able to so far. You have called me a hateful and have avoided answering my question.

Can you criticise any of my analysis? You haven't been able to so far. All you do is say my claims are wrong and irrelevant without proving them wrong. Please argue like an intellectual or I'll think you're just keeping yourself in the argument with all this nonsense.

lol, now this is laughable. Again, a muslim leaves his Quran and Hadith and goes to the Bible for his rescue. What has Sarah got to do with Adam being 90 feet tall?

Imagine you don't know anything about islam. The muslims also have the story of Abraham (as) and his two wives with them. Sarah's case is only a proof of my xmen mutation theory that man is prone to.

How does this prove Adam is 90 feet tall. Why can't you just provide evidence instead OF GOING AROUND IN CIRCLES BROS

Its just another of my Xmen mutation theory.

You haven't even touched my question Bros. So far, you have talked about the imaginary Islamic Adam and told us about his nostrils . Think about it for a second, we have evidence of the dinosaur, the mammoths, the elephants, the giraffes, the whales. Why is your 90 feet Adam an exception?

I have given you a proof that a 90ft Adam could have existed and here you can't fault my analysis so you want me to give you a snapped photo of him abi! further as an archeologist first! and mind you, the dinosaur which is the oldest of all you've mentioned here is said to have happened thousands of years ago. Adam died millions of years ago and I've not seen or heard of any record of anything millions ago, found in this time.

But atleast I've attempted your question even though you aren't satisfied. Will you please attempt mine now and stop dodging?

golpen

You should have waited to read the remaining.

I dey still wait for your answer Bros

Rephrase your english or go back to primary school.

Again, side-stepping the question and playing smart. Please prove Adam was 90 feet tall

You don't seem to know what you're saying again o. What did you say would have made him crumble on himself?

Perhaps if you provide the proof that Adam or any human was ever 90 feet tall, my statement will make more sense to you

Rubbish science bro, that's rubbish science.

It is only rubbish when it comes to Islam . It is only in Islam where a human can be 90 feet tall and there is no proof of it

Its my claim, so you give me an analysis of how that would fail.

I would if you could offer a specimen for me to work on . I hope I don't have to wait too long

You got my analysis don't you? If no, then you'll have to go read your ali and simbi again. My claim is that every part responsible for the body activities in this sense is proportional to each other. Debunk it by analysing that it is false, simple!!!

Provide your 90 feet Adam and I would easily debunk it. Or provide any human remains over 50 feet tall and I would debunk it. That is all I have been asking for. Imagine us experimenting or trying to conclude on a subject matter that doesn't exist or that we have no evidence of. How irrational is that! Perhaps that is how you learned Science, I didn't learn science that way.

Can you criticise any of my analysis? You haven't been able to so far. All you do is say my claims are wrong and irrelevant without proving them wrong. Please argue like an intellectual or I'll think you're just keeping yourself in the argument with all this nonsense.

Bros, your theory is just what it is THEORY. It is only theory because you can't apply it to a 90 feet Adam. Will it work on a 6 feet human, of course - why? We have tried it on humans and it works. So, your analysis can claim it can work on your imaginary Adam, until you can provide proof of your Adam or any or human that was ever 90 feet tall, you are groping in the dark

Imagine you don't know anything about islam. The muslims also have the story of Abraham (as) and his two wives with them. Sarah's case is only a proof of my xmen mutation theory that man is prone to.

I fail to see how Sarah's pregancy has anything to do with Adam. I also wonder what Sarah has to do with Adam? . If it's not irrelevant then I don't what is

Its just another of my Xmen mutation theory.

The simple fact id evident - you can't prove Adam was 90 feet tall. Your X-men mutation is a joke and all you have been successful is doing is going around in circles.

I have given you a proof that a 90ft Adam could have existed and here you can't fault my analysis so you want me to give you a snapped photo of him abi! further as an archeologist first! and mind you, the dinosaur which is the oldest of all you've mentioned here is said to have happened thousands of years ago. Adam died millions of years ago and I've not seen or heard of any record of anything millions ago, found in this time.

PROOF! Really. So, your proof basically is to take your word for it . So, Adam is so old and all the people that were 90 feet tall, their abodes, their tools and their entire existence is lost because their existence was millions of years old. Again, you have proven nothing Bros. You can't give one account of any human (NOT A SINGLE ONE) that was over 50 feet. You are here claiming the dinosaurs are thousands of years old - you sure say you go school? Please go read on your dinosaur history and stop making a laughing stock of yourself. If Adam and his likes (90 feet people) are millions of years old. What is the hadith and Quran time-line of the existence of mankind?

But at least I've attempted your question even though you aren't satisfied. Will you please attempt mine now and stop dodging?

Attempt? Are you really serious? All you have said in summary is "I have no evidence of Adam been 90 feet tall". If that is your stand, I will gladly engage you on the Bible scripture you referenced.

cloudstar: golpen



I dey still wait for your answer Bros



Again, side-stepping the question and playing smart. Please prove Adam was 90 feet tall



Perhaps if you provide the proof that Adam or any human was ever 90 feet tall, my statement will make more sense to you



It is only rubbish when it comes to Islam . It is only in Islam where a human can be 90 feet tall and there is no proof of it



I would if you could offer a specimen for me to work on . I hope I don't have to wait too long



Provide your 90 feet Adam and I would easily debunk it. Or provide any human remains over 50 feet tall and I would debunk it. That is all I have been asking for. Imagine us experimenting or trying to conclude on a subject matter that doesn't exist or that we have no evidence of. How irrational is that! Perhaps that is how you learned Science, I didn't learn science that way.



Bros, your theory is just what it is THEORY. It is only theory because you can't apply it to a 90 feet Adam. Will it work on a 6 feet human, of course - why? We have tried it on humans and it works. So, your analysis can claim it can work on your imaginary Adam, until you can provide proof of your Adam or any or human that was ever 90 feet tall, you are groping in the dark



I fail to see how Sarah's pregancy has anything to do with Adam. I also wonder what Sarah has to do with Adam? . If it's not irrelevant then I don't what is



The simple fact id evident - you can't prove Adam was 90 feet tall. Your X-men mutation is a joke and all you have been successful is doing is going around in circles.



PROOF! Really. So, your proof basically is to take your word for it . So, Adam is so old and all the people that were 90 feet tall, their abodes, their tools and their entire existence is lost because their existence was millions of years old. Again, you have proven nothing Bros. You can't give one account of any human (NOT A SINGLE ONE) that was over 50 feet. You are here claiming the dinosaurs are thousands of years old - you sure say you go school? Please go read on your dinosaur history and stop making a laughing stock of yourself. If Adam and his likes (90 feet people) are millions of years old. What is the hadith and Quran time-line of the existence of mankind?



Attempt? Are you really serious? All you have said in summary is "I have no evidence of Adam been 90 feet tall". If that is your stand, I will gladly engage you on the Bible scripture you referenced.

You have kobalised yourself ... Ok ok, I agree I have no evidence Adam was 90ft tall. Please engage me by answering the questions I put forward.

golpen

You have kobalised yourself ... Ok ok, I agree I have no evidence Adam was 90ft tall. Please engage me by answering the questions I put forward.

Anytime, please state the Bible scripture you were referring to.

Gen 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare [children] to them, the same [became] mighty men which [were] of old, men of renown.

Num 13:33 And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, [which come] of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.

Deu 2:10 The Emims dwelt therein in times past, a people great, and many, and tall, as the Anakims;
Deu 2:11 Which also were accounted giants, as the Anakims; but the Moabites call them Emims.

1. where is the scientific evidence for the above?

2. where is the mountain that satan allegedly took Jesus to and showed him all the kingdoms of the world in their splendour?

3. How can a cow ever pass thru the eye of a needle?

vedaxcool: Gen 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare [children] to them, the same [became] mighty men which [were] of old, men of renown.

Num 13:33 And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, [which come] of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.

Deu 2:10 The Emims dwelt therein in times past, a people great, and many, and tall, as the Anakims;
Deu 2:11 Which also were accounted giants, as the Anakims; but the Moabites call them Emims.

1. where is the scientific evidence for the above?

2. where is the mountain that satan allegedly took Jesus to and showed him all the kingdoms of the world in their splendour?

3. How can a cow ever pass thru the eye of a needle?

Bros, please park and sit down. I am engaging golpen, he had the decency to attempt the Adam is 90 feet question and later admitted he couldn't prove it. He is to tell me what he wants me to answer.

Gen 6:4 There were giants in the earth in
those days; and also after that, when the
sons of God came in unto the daughters of
men, and they bare [children] to them, the
same [became] mighty men which [were] of
old, men of renown.

Num 13:33 And there we
saw the giants, the sons
of Anak, [which come] of
the giants: and we were
in our own sight as
grasshoppers, and so we
were in their sight.

Deu 2:10 The Emims dwelt therein in times
past, a people great, and many, and tall, as
the Anakims;

Deu 2:11 Which also were accounted giants,
as the Anakims; but the Moabites call them
Emims.

My questions;

1. Do you believe that the anakims who looked down at average men as though they were grasshoppers, as mentioned above once existed?...

2a. If yes, do you have any fossil or otherwise record of such humans to have lived?

2b. If no, would you say the bible is a lying piece?

3. What would be their measured height if they looked down at average men as a man looks at a grasshopper? According to the bible.

persin don go toilet not fit commot again!

golpen: Gen 6:4 There were giants in the earth in
those days; and also after that, when the
sons of God came in unto the daughters of
men, and they bare [children] to them, the
same [became] mighty men which [were] of
old, men of renown.

Num 13:33 And there we
saw the giants, the sons
of Anak, [which come] of
the giants: and we were
in our own sight as
grasshoppers, and so we
were in their sight.

Deu 2:10 The Emims dwelt therein in times
past, a people great, and many, and tall, as
the Anakims;

Deu 2:11 Which also were accounted giants,
as the Anakims; but the Moabites call them
Emims.

My questions;

1. Do you believe that the anakims who looked down at average men as though they were grasshoppers, as mentioned above once existed?...

2a. If yes, do you have any fossil or otherwise record of such humans to have lived?

2b. If no, would you say the bible is a lying piece?

3. What would be their measured height if they looked down at average men as a man looks at a grasshopper? According to the bible.

Bros, you stated 4 verses; it would be fair if you asked me to address only one since I asked you to address only one Hadith. The verses in Deuteronomy are related so they can be counted as one. So, please state which verse you want me to explain and I will tackle that

vedaxcool:

persin don go toilet not fit commot again!

Bros, please sit and learn how civilized people discuss. Your attention span is that of a 2 year old

cloudstar:

Bros, please sit and learn how civilized people discuss. Your attention span is that of a 2 year old

Bros...You wicked oh!

cloudstar:

Bros, you stated 4 verses; it would be fair if you asked me to address only one since I asked you to address only one Hadith. The verses in Deuteronomy are related so they can be counted as one. So, please state which verse you want me to explain and I will tackle that

Haba bro cloudstar!! this are references nah. I clearly understand what is written and my questions are there. I don't mind you pick any of them, just answer those questions or else you'll make people crest that award I'm about to give you.

No going in circles this time around please, but to make it easier for you, use Num 13:33.

I'm still waiting on you sire, mr cloudstar. I'm just trusting you'll be enough to take up those questions.

golpen:

Haba bro cloudstar!! this are references nah. I clearly understand what is written and my questions are there. I don't mind you pick any of them, just answer those questions or else you'll make people crest that award I'm about to give you.

No going in circles this time around please, but to make it easier for you, use Num 13:33.

Bros, sorry for the late response. To your question(s); lets get started, I will touch on a few of the other Bible verses you mentioned to throw light on what you asked

Numbers 13:33: And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.

Here is the gist: God told Moses to survey the land of Canaan and Moses chose 12 men from the tribes of Israel to go and scout the land. There are several things to note here and I will state them:

Numbers 13:23 = And they came unto the brook of Eshcol, and cut down from thence a branch with one cluster of grapes, and they bare it between two upon a staff; and they brought of the pomegranates, and of the figs.

This simply means that they saw some grapes and the cut it down, the grapes were very large that it took 2 men to carry it upon their staff to be able to transport it . Moving on:

Numbers 13:32 = And they brought up an evil report of the land which they had searched unto the children of Israel, saying, The land, through which we have gone to search it, is a land that eateth up the inhabitants thereof; and all the people that we saw in it are men of a great stature.

Most of the scouts return and said - "The land looks good but the inhabitants are "HUGE" and very very very BIG. Compared to them, we don't have up and we are small. In summary, we look like grass-hopoers". However, only one of the scouts didn't share their report, this is what he said:

Numbers 13:30 = And Caleb stilled the people before Moses, and said, Let us go up at once, and possess it; for we are well able to. overcome it.

So, let's get certain facts out of the way and get some perspective.

1. These giants described in Numbers 13:33 were huge for two reasons. (A). The grapes in their land took two normal people to carry it on their staffs. That means these giants either ate alot or ate very BIG grapes when compared to the grapes we eat must be pretty BIG. (B). These giants were HUGE and by the description of the scouts.
2. The Scouts with an exception of Caleb (later called Joshua) brought back an evil report . We don't know the meaning of what the evil report was. The Bible verse was not definite or specific on what it meant. So, the interpretation of this 'evil report' is subject to several possible presentations, such as: (A). The scouts exaggerated certain parts of their findings for reasons we don't know. Part of these exaggeration was the comparison of been a grass-hopper (B). The evil report could be related to fear which seemed appropriate, they were afraid of people much bigger than them. However, it is surprising why Caleb didn't share their fear
3. The verse (Numbers 13:33) never gave a figure of the Giants height i.e. it never said they were 90 feet tall or if they were 20 feet tall. Again, this is left to personal interpretation. The FACT is simple, we cannot tell how tall these Giants were from the text

MOVING FORWARD:

The Bible gave us an idea how tall these Giants were in other parts of the Bible specifically one you mentioned

Deu 2:10 The Emims dwelt therein in times past, a people great, and many, and tall, as the Anakims;

Deu 2:11 Which also were accounted giants, as the Anakims; but the Moabites call them Emims.

MOST IMPORTANTLY:

Deut 3:11 = For only Og king of Bashan remained of the remnant of giants; behold his bedstead was a bedstead of iron; is it not in Rabbath of the children of Ammon? nine cubits was the length thereof, and four cubits the breadth of it, after the cubit of a man.

Og's bed was about 13.5 feet long by 6 feet wide. At least, he must have been 13 feet tall? I am 6 feet 5 inches and compared to him, I would feel very very very small

HERE COMES ANOTHER GIANT THE BIBLE GAVE HIS HEIGHT

1 Samuel 17:4 notes that Goliath’s height was measured at “six cubits and one span,” about nine feet, six inches

I have demonstrated from the primary verse you provided and shown you that there were Giants in Biblical times. The Bible gave two accounts on how tall some of these giants were. No where do we see they exceeded 50 feet in height.

TO YOUR QUESTIONS

1. Do you believe that the anakims who looked down at average men as though they were grasshoppers, as mentioned above once existed Yes I do
2a. If yes, do you have any fossil or otherwise record of such humans to have lived? Personally no. The Bible gave two accounts of how tall these giants were and described their height. Also, here is a list of some of the tallest people (Giants in some cases) that we know and can prove: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_tallest_people. Here is another case of a Princess Giant that is visible for anyone to visit and see the fossil for yourself if you doubt http://www.burlingtonnews.net/centerindiansc.html. Please research to confirm if I am making it up, this is present right here today in present day Wisconsin of the USA
2b. If no, would you say the bible is a lying piece? I don't see where the Bible is lying from the verses you mentioned. I have demonstrated and displayed with facts and common sense presented in the Bible.
3. What would be their measured height if they looked down at average men as a man looks at a grasshopper? According to the bible The simple answer here is that the text doesn't answer your question. The reason is simple, the Bible never described the heights of these Giants in the book of Numbers. On cases where the it did, it was very clear as in the heights of Goliath and Og. That is a BIG difference when compared to the Hadith claim on Adam being 90 feet tall

So, where does this lead us? In summary:

1. Giants existed in Biblical times (There origin can be another debate altogether)
2. The Bible recorded their heights as in that of Og (his bed) and Goliath. Also, the Bible mentions several Giants and their lineage but never mentioned their height in the book of Numbers

Since I have addressed your questions - I have one more of my own

golpen: I'm still waiting on you sire, mr cloudstar. I'm just trusting you'll be enough to take up those questions.

Sorry for the wait, I have responded. Some of us run companies that work 24/7

Whoa!!! I must confess you really strived so hard to tackle the question and here you gave it a nice try. A nice try I must confess, but don't you think saying you have addressed my questions when you actually haven't rightly, is a way of trying to score cheap points?

But here the verse clearly states;

Numbers 13:33: And there we saw the giants,
the sons of Anak, which come of the giants:
and we were in our own sight as
grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.

Upon all the epistle you have painstakingly written, what can be deduced referring to the heights of the giants which the reporters said they look to them as if they (the reporters) were like grasshoppers, is that the reporters exaggerated their heights.

My question would have been 'why would they exaggerate? But thank God you've given your answer in your previous text that you don't know, but that's a pity. A pity because;

1. No part of the story gives an account of the fact that the scouts actually exaggerated, so I'll take the exaggeration excuse to be a fabrication of your own assumption.

2. Reason for exaggeration, you do not know, so why would you say they exaggerated?

3. The bible gave the account of their height (though not absolute) by giving the measures of the scouts height compared to the giants' - 'like grasshoppers'

4. Saying their's an exaggerated report in the bible is ill of that precious book . It means the bible is not worth referring to as an holy scripture. Imagine there are some worldly cases/places where you won't even dare to exaggerate, not even when you're in the lowest level courts.

5. Just saying to make 5 , the size of the fruits is not a measure of how and why the giants are that huge, but if it really does, a man of og's or goliath's hugeness could manage grape fruits sizeable enough for a warrior scout to carry.

Please make your excuses more tenable. I think this long epistle isn't getting anywhere, but portraying the bible as a scripture of exaggerations which can't be followed hence, calling it a lying piece. Thanks.

cloudstar:

Sorry for the wait, I have responded. Some of us run companies that work 24/7

I don't really have a problem with waiting, only I can't find a fossil record of a grape too big that two grown men had to carry

golpen

Whoa!!! I must confess you really strived so hard to tackle the question and here you gave it a nice try. A nice try I must confess, but don't you think saying you have addressed my questions when you actually haven't rightly, is a way of trying to score cheap points?

My intent had nothing to do with scoring points mate. It was to address your questions

But here the verse clearly states;

Numbers 13:33: And there we saw the giants,
the sons of Anak, which come of the giants:
and we were in our own sight as
grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.

Upon all the epistle you have painstakingly written, what can be deduced referring to the heights of the giants which the reporters said they look to them as if they (the reporters) were like grasshoppers, is that the reporters exaggerated their heights.

If you are an honest debater, you will confirm that no record of their actual height was given in the Book of Numbers. For example, they weren't 60 cubit tall or 90 feet tall. You can cross reference and try and cast shadow of doubt on what was written but you can't deny that no height was specified

My question would have been 'why would they exaggerate? But thank God you've given your answer in your previous text that you don't know, but that's a pity. A pity because;

I gave you a reason, it was an assumption and I called it "fear" and I stated it. Secondly, there is reason to believe they exaggerated because they brought an "evil report"

1. No part of the story gives an account of the fact that the scouts actually exaggerated, so I'll take the exaggeration excuse to be a fabrication of your own assumption.

Nope, it is not. They brought an evil report with an exception of Caleb. What was evil about what they saw? Nothing!.

2. Reason for exaggeration, you do not know, so why would you say they exaggerated?

Please see my answer above

3. The bible gave the account of their height (though not absolute) by giving the measures of the scouts height compared to the giants' - 'like grasshoppers'

No it didn't Bros. The Hadith, gave an exact description of Adams height. The Bible in the book of Numbers you referred to, DIDN'T. The Bible could have easily described this giants like they way it described Og and Goliath but it DIDN'T. So, forcing a statement on the Bible doesn't change anything; it only shows your level of reasoning.

4. Saying their's an exaggerated report in the bible is ill of that precious book . It means the bible is not worth referring to as an holy scripture. Imagine there are some worldly cases/places where you won't even dare to exaggerate, not even when you're in the lowest level courts.

I don't see what makes the Bible ill Bros. I said the accounts of the scouts was exaggerated; I never mentioned the Bible exaggerated; you did

5. Just saying to make 5 , the size of the fruits is not a measure of how and why the giants are that huge, but if it really does, a man of og's or goliath's hugeness could manage grape fruits sizeable enough for a warrior scout to carry.

Again, I drew this conclusion; I never said it was a fact. If you notice, I only state what was confirmed and where things were not definite, I offer plausible reason.

Please make your excuses more tenable. I think this long epistle isn't getting anywhere, but portraying the bible as a scripture of exaggerations which can't be followed hence, calling it a lying piece. Thanks.

Oh it has - you totally ignored my explanation of Og and Goliath as well as the evidence of Giants fossils in our present day - questions that I totally addressed but you that you failed to admit to. All you are seeing is grasshoppers . Perhaps you should take my approach at explaining Adams "mutation". I have been honest with you and did my best to answer your question.

HOWEVER, THE BIBLE HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH ADAM BEEN 90 FEET TALL. AGAIN, WE HAVE A CASE WHERE A MUSLIM IS RELYING ON THE BIBLE TO EXPLAIN THE HADITH. THE GIANTS IN THE BIBLE ARE NOT RELATED TO ADAM - ARE THEY?

So, let us not side-step the issue. Islam can't explain 90 feet Adam and you claiming it's "mutation" is simply LUDACRIS