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| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by mukina2: 10:25pm On Jul 16, 2006 |
davidylan: so because of all this people who you described you wont leave Islam alone well bro keep on it will never end. if america is so powerful why avnt bin laden been found if isreal is soo powerful why cant they wipe iran off the earth as for the nigerians they kill eachother so blame both parties not one that convert is mad aw can he expect to live freely in an Islamic state? suicide bombers are being motivated by the people hu use power over Islam its cowardly yes but they dont av weapons to make the war fear ,so they use wat they av |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by Nobody: 10:34pm On Jul 16, 2006 |
mukina2: You have in the usual islamofacist fashion rambled through with great ambiguity, no clarity of thought. No one wishes NOT to leave islam alone, we are only tired of one religion holding the whole world to ransom. How nice it would be if we did not have the likes of Osama bin Laden, Sadam Hussein, Ahmedinajad and the trouble some folks in Syria, palestine, lebanon e.t.c to contend with. Truth, most non-muslims do not care what religion their next door neighbour practices, just let us sleep with our two eyes closed! And why should Isreal wipe Iran off the map? They do not speak the same language of hatred as Ahmedinajad. Since Salman Rushdie is mad for excercising his "free will" and thus SHOULD NOT live freely in an islamic state, why must intolerant muslims choose predominant European and American nations as Home? Who are those using "power over islam" and who are those who are at war with Islam? The last i checked the Islamists have provoked every single war against them. It might interest you to note that majority of Americans would rather have their brothers, uncles, fathers here at home than in some Islamic desert. But if that is the price to pay to avoid Sept 11, Jul7, India, Madrid, Nairobi e.t.c, so be it! |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by mukina2: 10:43pm On Jul 16, 2006 |
well watever eveyone is entitled to his or her views keep urs i keep mine but dont lash out at others who view things differntly we only know wats goin on untop and never wats goin on underneath where the leaders meet |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by Shagari2(m): 10:51pm On Jul 16, 2006 |
davidylan: True |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by GL(f): 2:49am On Jul 17, 2006 |
TayoD, I share your concerns about muslims here killing christians. As much as we may like to pretend it isn't so, the rest of the world is bcoming increasingly scared of Arabs and Islam. They don't seem to have any respect for human life. People who can strap bombs on the bodies of their own kids, who can kill their kids for apostasy, who can kill themselves in other to get a few enemies dead. These are dangerous people. They've got the bigger, oil rich lands in the region. Yet, they want that small strip that belongs to Israel. Israel is ready to live in peace with Palestine. They withdrew from Gaza even when many people didn't want them to. They withdrew from Lebanon also. These countries are the ones who reneged on the deal. Israel has always shown a commendable commitment to releasing any Israeli hostage. They've swapped prisoners for them several times. I think their neighbors were just taking them for granted. The truth is that the Arabs HATE Israel in a fearful way. They can give anything to see that country annihilated. Many of these Islamic/Arab govts rank destroying Israel higher than protecting their citizens. Lebanon and Palestine are showing us just that. Arabs/Muslims generally have more freedom in Western countries than in their countries. |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by MrBean(m): 3:08pm On Jul 17, 2006 |
My view on this issue is 3 part. 1. Personal view on the crisis 2. The crisis / middle east as it relates to Bible prophecy 1. I personally think hezbollah went overboard when they staged an incursion into the sovereign state of Israel killing and abducting their soldiers. Under those circumstances, Israel reserves the right to defend itself by whatever means it deems fit, Howvever i do not support killing innocent civilians. 2. Concerning bible prophecy and the middle east, we know from the bible, that the world will end in the middle east. One of the signs of the end as depicted in the bible is the restoration of the nation of israel. Israel was conquered by the Babylonians in 605 B.C. , next by the Persians, and next by the Greeks. Israel was finally overrun by the Romans in 70 A.D. and scattered into every nation on the earth. God's "fig tree" entered the dormant season. Since then, the nation of Israel remained scattered into the nations and dormant as a nation for almost two thousand years. No other nation in history has survived being conquered and taken from their homeland and been able to maintain their identity as a nation. But God promised them that their national identity would be preserved. In fact He said, as long as there is a sun and moon, "there will not cease to be a nation of Israel before me", (Jeremiah 31:35-36 ). Not only did God promise to preserve the scattered Jewish nation, but He would regather them back to the land of Israel. In fact, the most prolific prophecy in all the Bible is the one that says that the Jewish people would be gathered back to their land in the end times. Jeremiah 16 is one of these. It says, "Therefore behold, days are coming," declares the LORD, "when it will no longer be said, 'As the LORD lives, who brought up the sons of Israel out of the land of Egypt, 'but, 'As the LORD lives, who brought up the sons of Israel from the land of the north and from all the countries where He had banished them.' For I will restore them to their own land which I gave to their fathers" (Jer. 16:14-15). It is only in recent history that prophecies like this one are beginning to be fulfilled. This was fulfilled in 1947 when Israel was restored as a state by the UN. All the people fighting and pointing at Israel as occupying palestinian lands should review the history very well. Bible also talks about gathering the nations of the world led by the kings of the east (probably Russia and China) to battle against Israel in the valley called Armageddon(Zechariah 14:2). (note all this happens after the rapture of the church) Bible also speaks about redemption for israel in this trying times. Revelation 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse, and He who sat on it is called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and wages war. Revelation 19:12 His eyes are a flame of fire, and on His head are many diadems; and He has a name written on Him which no one knows except Himself. Revelation 19:13 He is clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.[/color][color=#990000] The Word of God is Jesus Christ. In Isaiah, we find the following prophecy about the return of Christ Isaiah 63:1 Who is this who comes from Edom, With garments of glowing colors from Bozrah, This One who is majestic in His apparel, Marching in the greatness of His strength? "It is I who speak in righteousness, mighty to save." Isaiah 63:2 Why is Your apparel red, And Your garments like the one who treads in the wine press? Isaiah 63:3 I have trodden the wine trough alone, And from the peoples there was no man with Me. I also trod them in My anger And trampled them in My wrath; And their lifeblood is sprinkled on My garments, And I stained all My raiment.[/color] Christ is depicted with clothes stained red with blood. It is the final battle in which He overcomes the forces of evil in order for the Kingdom of God to be established on this earth. The "beast" and all his human followers are defeated in this Battle of Armageddon. [color=#990000]Revelation 19:16 And on His robe and on His thigh He has a name written, "KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS." Revelation 19:19 And I saw the beast and the kings of the earth and their armies assembled to make war against Him who sat on the horse and against His army. The army we understand from the bible are the raptured saints. PEACE will only be returned to the middle east by the prince of peace when he returns to Jerusalem. For those who think the world is about to end just because there is war in the middle east, don't alarm yourselves. If you are a christian, you will undersatnd that bible says there will be a breif period of peace in the middle east and the world over and then suddenly destruction comes. This breif period of peace is when you should be worried about the rapture, because it preceeds the rapture. Bible says we (Christians) are not in the dark so as the day overtake us a s a theif in the night. If Jesus is coming tommorow, I dare say I WILL KNOW. (to be concluded later) |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by belloti(m): 3:44pm On Jul 17, 2006 |
Davidylan or whatever, Its so obvious what your reply will be. Israel is killing innocent people similar to what you claim to happen in the Northern Nigeria. But i guess the lives of innocent muslims does not matter to anyone like you. Terrorism is bad but i cant seem to find a better word to describe Israel action in Lebanon. |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by Nobody: 3:53pm On Jul 17, 2006 |
belloti: You like all muslims here prefer to over look the fact that Hamas and Hizbollah started the present conflict by attacking defenceless Isreali citizens unprovoked. Patience has its limits, you cannot sit back and forever let others constantly verbally ad physically assault you. Isreal has had enough, the same Lebanese were warned time and again to let their military protect Lebanon's northern border with Isreal which is being used with impunity by hizbollah intent on wiping out the state of Isreal. What have been ur comments on the Iranian president's comments to wipe out Isreal from the map? As usual, hypocritical silence! and when Isreal hits back in self defence we all start blowing hot air. Since you knew terrorism was bad what have you done or said to Hamas refusal to accept the state of Isreal, its constant suicide attacks and hizbollah's sending of rockets to Isreali cities? Where were you when the soldiers were captured initially? |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by dearzi(f): 4:50pm On Jul 17, 2006 |
@ Mukina2 Can you please explain what you meant by this statement "that convert is mad aw can he expect to live freely in an Islamic state?" What makes the dude mad? that he thought about living freely? or that he converted? which? So if Allah never promised to save, why bother praying to him if y'all aren't going to get answers or salvation anyway? please educate me. |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by tianshie(m): 6:52pm On Jul 17, 2006 |
Israel lives with hostile neighbours and must constantly guard its rear.It does not help that the prevailing religion in the middle east is one that encourages the peaceful resolution of conflict on mars.And mars only. Hezbollah has been a thorn in the side of Israel nay the world since its inception in 1982.It introduced the medieval practice of suicide attacks to the region.It operates with the tacit approval of the lebanese government which has refused to crack down on it. I am sure every country in the world has a contigency plan for dealing with a hostile neighbour,this plan almost always includes war. Hezbollah precipitated this conflict by abducting israeli soldiers on ISRAELI TERRITORY. I believe Israel is right in using this opportunity to stamp out hezbollah once and for all. Any country in its shoes would do the same. |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by xkape(m): 8:26pm On Jul 17, 2006 |
Israel is terrorising the Arab nations for political reasons. They are killing innocent arab children. Christians should not support this because this is anathema to what Christ preached. It may be fulfilling prophecy but prophecy only tells of what will happen, it doesnt cause it to happen or justify the means by which it happens. American christians especially have dissapointed the world by turning this middle-east thing into a neo-crusade and voting that slowpoke Bush Having said this, the real truth is, Israel is doing what they are doing to survive, it is the law of nature to do what u can to ensure u r not annihilated. I am not saying this is right but we have all at one time had to stump on other people to get our way The Arabs on the other hand are acting on pure unadulterated hate. The kind of hate that has not been seen before in any group in the world. The kind of hate that would make u blow ur children up, the kind of of hate that would make someone in Kano not affected in anyway by events in palestine to bury his neighbour in a well in protest (and i am speaking from experience, so nobody should even try to defend them  )A peaceful solution could have been found to the ME crisis for decades now just like the two Koreas, like Japan vs China, East blck West Block Europe, White vs Black in South Africa, Spain and the Basque, Nothern Ireland etc etc but there is one factor perculiar to the middle east. A factor that brainwashes children from an early age to hate other people becos they pray different, a factor that causes educated Nigerians to defend murderous activities blindly, a factor that caused people to rejoice on the streets when 9/11 happened. I wonder what this factor is. |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by OldGlory1(m): 8:38pm On Jul 17, 2006 |
xkape Israel is simply defending itself. These Arab children are the terrorist of the future. I say take care of Hamas and Hezbollah, so these kids will learn to refrain from terrorist activity. I think that the only way out is "Show of Force". That is the only language the Arabs understand. I say pound Lebanon,Syria,Iran,Afghanistan,Palestine with 500LB bombs until the return the soldiers and agree to end the continued terrorism toward Israel and the world. Tianshie On this topic you are exactly right. Israel has a duty to it's citizens, to defend it's borders and defeat terrorism whenever it rears it's ugly head. |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by mukina2: 9:31pm On Jul 17, 2006 |
dearzi: i said so cuz aw does he expect to live freely in a 100 percent Islamic sharia law governed state. he'll be regarded as an infedel pls ask davidylan the second part of ur question cuz he said so not me |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by dearzi(f): 4:05am On Jul 18, 2006 |
@Mukina2 What makes him mad? can't he live where he chooses? what's Islam's grieviance with a man for choosing Christ? no offense, but isn't there something wrong there? As for Allah saving, i thought you were agreeing that the guy was only praying, and there wasn't any merit to Allah saving--my bad! but did he really promise to save y'all? |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by ajia23(m): 10:01am On Jul 18, 2006 |
Mrlawng This is a contradiction 1 . I personally think hezbollah went overboard when they staged an incursion into the sovereign state of Israel killing and abducting their soldiers. Under those circumstances, Israel reserves the right to defend itself by whatever means it deems fit, Howvever i do not support killing innocent civilians. If you believe Israel should use any means it deems fit, then killing innocent Lebanese may very well serve to punish the government for not disarming Hizbollah. Now wouldn't that be furthering Israel's cause? It is either you edit the whatever means to become whatever decent means, or you make an ellision of not supporting the killing of innocent civilians. Davidylan How does the Lebanese government disarm Hizbollah when 70% of the Lebanese armed forces are Shia? And the Government is Sunni? Please explain how a Shia military will turn the barrel at their own shia militant brothers whom a lot of them actually consider to be heroes? Get real. What most of you are saying is that because Chadian rebels come into Nigeria, kill Nigerian people and soldiers, rob them, the Nigerian government should invade Chad, blow up her airports, and target rebel strongholds while killing civilians. Then justify this by saying we warned the Chadian Gov to disarm their rebels and they refused, so we had to punish that gov. It doesn't make sense, however, it may make sense if we consider it from the Israeli point of view that as long as it is surrounded by Arabs, it will never go to bed with two eyes closed, so it needs to destroy all the Arabs surrounding it. Israel is terrorising the Arab nations for political reasons. Xkape True talk. It may be a biblical prophecy, but that prophecy did not justify all the atrocities by the Israeli State against the Arabs. But what you said concerning peace in the region is not so accurate. The year 1994, a peace accord was reached for the first time. Israel made some concessions. The Arabs also made some concessions. Each side was truly satisfied that there had been a truly balanced and productive agreement. Then Yitzhak Rabin, the then Israeli PM was assasinated under the watchful eye of the strongest and most effective security force and intelligent service in the world-The Mossard. Events later showed that the assasin was part of a grandiose plan by hardline Israeli to prevent peace from being reached in that region. The point of this illustration is that on both sides there are hardliners who want total destruction of the other. The most important factor in achieving peace is the third factor which has not helped at all since the election of Bush, the International community. In all disptes between peoples, when the international community takes a Unified ad just position, those disputes are always resolved. But when the international community takes a biased or divided position, then the hardliners always win. So, it is not a question of a factor resident in the middleeast which methinks is a veiled reference to Islam. I hope I am wrong. Old glory Are you a christian? Because if you ARE, this certainly is a radical departure from the normal peaceful disposition of christians. 500 pounds bombs should be dropped huh? How would you like those bombs to be dropped where you are? Real people are suffering. This is not merely about statistics, but you would prefer a show of force isn't it? I pray God does not listen to that your wish even on yourself. I pray you never have to experience what it feels like being under the siege that all people in the middle east have to bear everyday be they Israeli or Arab. |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by xkape(m): 10:55am On Jul 18, 2006 |
@ ajia23 You seem to have a level head on the issue However, I have always found this baffling, why dont muslims ever outrightly condemn thier brethren? Only a very few ever do (and these ones i know of are my relatives) There is always justification and rationalization of terrorist acts as the only means left to them to fight. I personally dont see hamaz or al-queda more terrifying than a stealth bomber dropping mega-death on ur house but al-queda bases what they do strictly on Religious grounds and other practitioners of the religion dont come out to condemn them and defend the religion of peace. The condemnation is in word only, and it is an open secret that the sponsors of terrorist cells all over the world include the government of Saudi Arabi, Egypt, Syria,Indonesia, Nigeria, Lybia etc. They all condemn with thier mouths but support with thier pockets If you think all this is far fetched , I heard of a group linked with alqueda that had a cell in Ibadan (i havent been there for some time now so i dont know how far). They were recruiting "students" for studies in the ME. I met one of the students who talked of the kind of brain washing they were getting. They were being systematically being filled with hate for all things western and by extension Christians and Jews. There was an incident in Ibadan last year whre a group went on a demontration to enforce secondary school students to wear the Hijab, three school girls where killed in this episode, and this group and others were behind it. Of course it was hushed up in the press as always but I and many others were witnesses So the issue runs a bit deeper than mossad and the hardliners in isreal or even that freak-show of a religious bigot called Bush and rambling preachers like Rod Parsley. The issue is one of instutionalised hate that the whole world should stop denying |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by belloti(m): 11:18am On Jul 18, 2006 |
ajia23: I just cant believe the level of hypocrisy going on here. Cant we all see what exactly is happenning? How can any sensible person support the demolition of civilian buildings and killing innocent civilians? |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by mukina2: 11:44am On Jul 18, 2006 |
dearzi: he cant chosse there he lives cuz thats a 100% islamic state and its governed by sharia law av told you to pls ask davidylan fimmy said allah pls save us davidylan misquoted him when someone prays and believes in his or her God In the case of islam you believe in the five pillars. you practice wat you preach tell me aw ur prayers wont be answered? |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by Reverend(m): 11:49am On Jul 18, 2006 |
What is the use in praying when it is religion that has caused this problem from the beginning! |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by mukina2: 11:55am On Jul 18, 2006 |
the blame is not on religions but on few persons hu want to try to cry don others religion |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by Reverend(m): 12:19pm On Jul 18, 2006 |
It is not a few people, it is the majority. We just like to think that it is the minority. That is the mistake we always make. We have misjudged just how many religious fanatics there are in this World. When you see the Arabs demonstarting, it is never just a few! It is always thousands! Religion is the root of all evil! Divide and rule is the game, Without religion there would surely be peace on earth! |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by mukina2: 12:30pm On Jul 18, 2006 |
@reverend so u are artheist? |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by Reverend(m): 12:39pm On Jul 18, 2006 |
No! Religion and the different factions are manmade and have nothing to do with God. Religion was made by man to control the people, to divide and manipulate the masses. All in the name of God and business! |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by mukina2: 12:48pm On Jul 18, 2006 |
ok at are you a christian,muslim,jeww.sikh,ba'hai and so on |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by retro(f): 12:55pm On Jul 18, 2006 |
Reverend: *Touches . . . * |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by Reverend(m): 12:58pm On Jul 18, 2006 |
I am a human being! |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by zebudaya(m): 1:00pm On Jul 18, 2006 |
where's Ajisafe? cant wait for you to join the discussion buddy.  |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by retro(f): 1:12pm On Jul 18, 2006 |
Reverend: Hahahahahaha. You're not a Christian/Muslim but a human being! Hahaha! I thought you were an alien!! |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by Rottweiler(m): 1:35pm On Jul 18, 2006 |
Israel as a free nation has the right to defend itself against any act of terrorism or external aggression. If neigbouring islamic states continue to allow extremists control their affairs, they should as well brace up for war. Organisations like Hezbullah, Al Queda, PLO, etc can only get recognition from its people when there is chaos. They in conjunction with some Arab countries like Iran and Syria will continue to make peace illusive. |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by Nobody: 2:40pm On Jul 18, 2006 |
@ Ajia23 DavidylanUtter rubbish! No sense! So because Hizbollah is Shia and the Lebanese Govt Sunni it is perfectly okay for them to continue to use Lebanon as a base to attack Isreal without provocation? So you sat down and in your right mind think that your explanation is rational reason for the whole world to ignore Hizbollah's atrocities simply because they are from a different muslim sect? (I thot Mukina2 told us ALL muslims were in unity!) So if we have a muslim rebel movement in Cameroun constantly shelling Nigeria, it is perfectly okay for Nigeria to keep quiet since the christian govt in Cameroun cannot disarm the rebels? Sometimes muslims make irrational statements to defend the atrocious behaviour of a radical majority. @ mukina2 fimmy said allah please save usIt is clear you have at best a very shallow understanding of your religion. Fimmy said "Allah save us", no where in the quran did Allah promise to save anybody. Not even Mohammed at the end was sure he would go to 72 virgins and rivers of beer in paradise. On what basis then is Fimmy's prayer? Belief in God is rooted in a promise from that God that He would do what he has promised, how can you ask God for something He did not promise you? If your statement makes sense, then why was mohammed scared of dying? Was he not the prophet? belloti:Dear, muslims are the greatest hypocrites. When Isreal bombards its enemies, it makes headline news and everyone suddenly begins to talk about "innocent civilians". Where were these same people when Hizbollah and Hamas began their ill-motivated attacks on defenceless Isreali soldiers? Where you all sleeping when Ahmedinajad of Iran threatened Isreal TWICE to wipe them off the map? So Isreali citizens killed by daily suicide attacks are not classified as "innocent civilians"? mukina2:Dear, the blame is squarely on the muslim religion. For all those suicide bombers, alqaeda, hizbollah, hamas, al-zarqawi, taliban, sunni, shia militias have all carried out their atrocities in the name of RELIGION! Sorry, stop laying the blame at the feet of "a few persons", we now know these acts are approved by the vast majority! Iran and Syria are well known sponsors of Hizbollah, how else do you justify a militia movement gaining access to 13,000 katyusha rockets and other Iranian long range missiles? And with Hamas at the head of Palestinian govt, is that also the actions of "a few" trying to use religion as a smokescreen? |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by dearzi(f): 5:09pm On Jul 18, 2006 |
Mukina2 Sweetheart, please, write so we can understand, cuz i'm having a hard time following your "aws" and "dons" please. No offense meant, i'd just like to be able to read without thinking twice what a word that short means. Thank you. @Reverend I think for once i agree with you, on the issue of religion. It's just a way of controlling man. It's man's way of making sense of who God is, doesn't make it right. |
| Re: Your Views On Israel And Palestine by tianshie(m): 5:52pm On Jul 18, 2006 |
I don't think if Buddhism was the prevalent religion in the middle east we would have chaos of this magnitude. I say put the blame squarely at the calloused feet of islam. @ all those trying to link this with some fuzzy tenuous prophecy: During the second world war,Hitler's propaganda machine on one side and the american equivalent on the other tried to interpret Nostradamus's prophecy to each side's advantage.My point is the mind will always see whatever it wants to see,it's a little peurile and mawkish to blithely attach events to any prophecy for that matter. If I wanted and if I were diligent enough I could link nairaland to bible prophecy. It's disgusting to witness adherents of pseudo-fatalism in action. |
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