Ndipe:

I am telling you that during the dotcom boom, it was still possible to borrow money from the bank and invest in stocks. You might not necessarily tell them of your intentions to do so, but then again, even if you were approved for a loan, and you had a collateral, tell me, what would compell them to withdraw your loan request at the 11th hour?

There is no way you can walk into a bank in the West and tell them you need a loan so you can buy shares and the loan will be approved. People can always deceive the bank for any purpose but that is besides the point. In Nigeria, people are not only telling the banks but the banks gladly participate and accept those stocks as collateral.

If I take out a £2000 overdraft so I can invest in the stock market, the banks haven't got a clue what I'm doing it with it. In Nigeria, people are telling bankers that they want to borrow millions of naira to invest in stocks and the loans were approved.

4 Play:

There is no way you can walk into a bank in the West and tell them you need a loan so you can buy shares and the loan will be approved. People can always deceive the bank for any purpose but that is besides the point. In Nigeria, people are not only telling the banks but the banks gladly participate and accept those stocks as collateral.

If I take out a £2000 overdraft so I can invest in the stock market, the banks haven't got a clue what I'm doing it with it. In Nigeria, people are telling bankers that they want to borrow millions of naira to invest in stocks and the loans were approved.

The content in bold refers, it is even more than that. Some banks were actively promoting a scheme where they agree to fund up to 40% of the total amount you want to invest in shares. That 40% is given to you as loan. This is a fact.

For those that have tried to divert attention from the core issue raised in my first post on this topic I will summarize my position.

1. Shares don't come with any guarantees hence it is gambling

2. You do not have any control over the performance of the company you are buying into

3. Companies you buy into do not owe you anything. Put differently you are willingly dashing the money to the company and hoping that the company makes money and provide some to you as dividends

The statements above I believe are simple to understand and basic common sense should help here.

Afam:

The content in bold refers, it is even more than that. Some banks were actively promoting a scheme where they agree to fund up to 40% of the total amount you want to invest in shares. That 40% is given to you as loan. This is a fact.

For those that have tried to divert attention from the core issue raised in my first post on this topic I will summarize my position.

1. Shares don't come with any guarantees hence it is gambling

2. You do not have any control over the performance of the company you are buying into

3. Companies you buy into do not owe you anything. Put differently you are willingly dashing the money to the company and hoping that the company makes money and provide some to you as dividends

The statements above I believe are simple to understand and basic common sense should help here.

I guess u don't understand d difference between gambling and investing. I will be happy to differentiate for you. INVESTING:to spend money on something in the hope of a future return or benefit AND GAMBLING:the practice of playing games of chance or betting in the hope of winning money. from this simple definitions how does investing in shares sound like gambling except u were one of does that went into it with the intention of gambling. No viable business venture comes with a money back guarantee.Try oil exploration, but more companies are still going into the business. In investing u do serious research before u buy any stock so that u buy fundamentally sound companies that will stand the test of time (First Bank has been around for over a 100 years). So if u didn't do ur research ur a gambler. I agree with u that companies u buy their shares owe u no explanation because ur a gambler but to real investors they owe some explanation. That is why investors in cadbury sued the company in regards to the fraud that took place @ the company. That is why we have shareholder associations.

In my opinion gambling and investing are two parallel words that can be compared depending on the scenario.By definition gambling is staking funds or chances into an event in the hope of winning more money while understanding the risk of losing.People who gamble are well aware of their chances of loosing but still go ahead to stake perhaps due to their perception about the game/event or practice or sometimes do it just for the fun.
Investing on the other hand is participating by putting money or resources in a business or enterprise that offers the possiblity of profits,simply put -hoping to get a return or benefit from the outcome whilst at the same time understanding the risk.Relatively, investors usually undertake a research and get proper insight before proceeding to stake their resources on a business.As such one can unconvincingly say investing may be as good as gambling because both action requires you to study the terrain on which you intend to sow your seeds.
So a man that gambles without knowledge of the game does so at his risk=ignorant person that buys stocks without good info on companies.
The intense at which one looses now falls on one's intelligence and hunger (greed).Those that borrowed money to invest are the biggest fools in my books.Its like borrowing money to fund a stake on 9ja achieveing the 7-point agenda.Baban'la foul.

@Goodness07
Even first bank and other reputable companies loose as much as they gain so me think it's fundamental to experience both occurences at some point in one's life.No big deal.

The content in bold refers, it is even more than that. Some banks were actively promoting a scheme where they agree to fund up to 40% of the total amount you want to invest in shares. That 40% is given to you as loan. This is a fact

it was called a margin account just like they do in other countries of the world.

nothing wrong in borrowing to invest because in a normal biz environment, debt plays a vital role in scaling up biz operations. There are so many factors that may trigger borrowings as an individual or as a corporate entity, i aint going to go into that.
Borrowing to invest in equities, borrowing to expand biz operations, borrowing to trade commodities, borrowing to study et al are all risky ventures.

kalokalo is a form of venture u cannot measure, track, or verify outcomes. equity trading definitely isnt one.

Kaestro:

In my opinion gambling and investing are two parallel words that can be compared depending on the scenario.By definition gambling is staking funds or chances into an event in the hope of winning more money while understanding the risk of losing.People who gamble are well aware of their chances of loosing but still go ahead to stake perhaps due to their perception about the game/event or practice or sometimes do it just for the fun.
Investing on the other hand is participating by putting money or resources in a business or enterprise that offers the possiblity of profits,simply put -hoping to get a return or benefit from the outcome whilst at the same time understanding the risk.Relatively, investors usually undertake a research and get proper insight before proceeding to stake their resources on a business.As such one can unconvincingly say investing may be as good as gambling because both action requires you to study the terrain on which you intend to sow your seeds.
So a man that gambles without knowledge of the game does so at his risk=ignorant person that buys stocks without good info on companies.
The intense at which one looses now falls on one's intelligence and hunger (greed).Those that borrowed money to invest are the biggest fools in my books.Its like borrowing money to fund a stake on Nigeria achieveing the 7-point agenda.Baban'la foul.

@Goodness07
Even first bank and other reputable companies loose as much as they gain so me think it's fundamental to experience both occurences at some point in one's life.No big deal.

Thanks for your response. I guess it means I don't have to waste my time explaining the meaning of gambling to the goodness07 guy.

Even going by his own post he has admitted that both gambling and investment are based on risks while hoping to make positive returns.

May be we need to think through issues before attempting to offer "expert" advice.

One would wrongly believe that First bank shares kept increasing inspite of the problems other companies were facing.

I have to agree with afam. Whether you are making an informed decision by researching a company before investing or pulling the lever on a slot machine, fundamentally you are taking a risk with a view to achieve a positive outcome.Some folks forget that you can also make an informed decision when gambling like card counting by proffessionals.

@ topic,

In my case, I held a margin account with a stock broking firm - i.e. I borrowed from the firm and secured it with the stocks I owned (GTB, FBN, Unilever, UBN, Conerstone, Dangote sugar). The ratio was 1:1 meaning I could borrow to the limit of the value of my personal portfolio. Guess what. I borrowed about 80% of the value of my portfolio to finance the purchase of some stocks in the margin account with the hope of making some extra money.

When the bubble burst, what followed was total devastation. The stock broking firm put me under intense pressure to pay down their loan which was running at 22%p.a. I gave them instruction to sell the stocks from my margin account to liquidate the loan. Behold they could not find buyers for some of the stocks (a situation I thought would never arise). To cut a long story short, I ended up selling all the the stocks in my personal portfolio (which had also shrunk) to pay off the loan but it was not sufficient to clean up the balance. Now I owe N1.6m at 22% p.a. They visit and write me letters everyday to pay off the outstanding balance. I've told them to stay away but I know they wont.

To digress a little, I believe a new bubble has formed in the real estate market. I'm hearing that houses bought now for N30m will be worth N50m by next year. These were the kind of stories we heard about some stocks during the boom period. This has left me a little confused because I'm about to buy a house (with another loan) but I don't want to be beaten twice.

I got out of the market (90% holdings) early june when losses were still minimal-not because I saw any ominous sign but out of sheer anger and frustration with my bank. I had requested for a loan equivalent of their stock I had in order for me to possess a beautiful bride.

Despite the best effort of the BM and deputy, the matter stalled at the desk of one big man for a month.I felt betrayed. Anyway, I spat at their face liquidated the whole damn thing along with a fixed asset (painfully) and then became a happy husband again.I lost some good friends along the way but in business like diplomacy, there cant be parmanent friends.

In summary I can say I was saved by my impatience.And predictably the remaining 10% including UBA I bought at N50 have since turned to rubbles.

Thanks for your response. I guess it means I don't have to waste my time explaining the meaning of gambling to the goodness07 guy.

Even going by his own post he has admitted that both gambling and investment are based on risks while hoping to make positive returns.

May be we need to think through issues before attempting to offer "expert" advice.

One would wrongly believe that First bank shares kept increasing inspite of the problems other companies were facing.

appreciation/depreciation in share price isnt a way to measure the value of a company. whilst the market was crashing, UBA, First Bank gave me dividends and bonuses. the share price might only affect the P.E but not the earning capacity of the company. The business is good whilst the share price is low. It has nothing to do with First Bank making me good money
u need tutorials bro

i laff at u people
investment over a medium to long term in fundamentally sound companies can never be called kalo kalo or ill assume u lots are from the bush!

topic,

In my case, I held a margin account with a stock broking firm - i.e. I borrowed from the firm and secured it with the stocks I owned (GTB, FBN, Unilever, UBN, Conerstone, Dangote sugar). The ratio was 1:1 meaning I could borrow to the limit of the value of my personal portfolio. Guess what. I borrowed about 80% of the value of my portfolio to finance the purchase of some stocks in the margin account with the hope of making some extra money.

When the bubble burst, what followed was total devastation. The stock broking firm put me under intense pressure to pay down their loan which was running at 22%p.a. I gave them instruction to sell the stocks from my margin account to liquidate the loan. Behold they could not find buyers for some of the stocks (a situation I thought would never arise). To cut a long story short, I ended up selling all the the stocks in my personal portfolio (which had also shrunk) to pay off the loan but it was not sufficient to clean up the balance. Now I owe N1.6m at 22% p.a. They visit and write me letters everyday to pay off the outstanding balance. I've told them to stay away but I know they wont.

too bad!!! u guys are the people that rushed to the market when some had cleaned the market.
when astute traders on this blog were teaching people how to CICO, RIRO and stuffs like dat to make money around september 2006 to april 2008, where were u? some coys grew like no mans no tmr and people like me cleaned up big time!!
costain, oando, almost all the insurance, AP, etherna oil, alumaco et al. That was the time to borrow to trade. I did it, made money, bailed out when the market became turbulent.  the only stock i have left are the good ones that will not go under even if NSE will be no more
some of those coys didnt even have a visible biz. and thats kalo kalo. imagine alumaco, big treat and co growing exponentially with no figures to back it

the lesson is, dont rush to do things when almost everyone is doing it. That is when its gonna crash.

To digress a little, I believe a new bubble has formed in the real estate market. I'm hearing that houses bought now for N30m will be worth N50m by next year. These were the kind of stories we heard about some stocks during the boom period. This has left me a little confused because I'm about to buy a house (with another loan) but I don't want to be beaten twice.

A property worth 140m in Lekki Phase one was bought by a senior colleague of mine for 90m!
Dont go there!!!
U wanna borrow to buy a property? for what if i may ask? personal use or what? if for personal use, then wait some more. u can get it at a better bargain but if its for any other motive, waka fast or else, yawa go gass!!

tkb417 (m)
Lagos, Nigeria
Posts: 4496

Online

Re: NSE Market Downturn: How Have You Been Affected?
« #11 on: January 12, 2009, 12:57 PM »
presently, I'm down like 56.7%

wetin i go do? na to dey watch and pray.
starcomms, Oceanic, Linkage, Aiico, Costain, IEI and Skye don mess me up

even CICO has failed me and ive now changed tactics to holding till maybe 2020.
at least by then, the monumental losses go don reduce or varnish patapata

in a bid to wrtie off these debts in another way, i don join the ever growing legion of importers aside my 7-7 day job. As for now, I'm on holiday in the stockmarket. ill be back making buys maybe 2012.
for now, babu

how on earth did that happen? satan at work i guess(lol)

The post above was made by the same person that made the one below in a bid to lis his way out of the embarrassing situation he has found himself.

tkb417:

too bad!!! u guys are the people that rushed to the market when some had cleaned the market.
when astute traders on this blog were teaching people how to CICO, RIRO and stuffs like dat to make money around september 2006 to april 2008, where were u? some coys grew like no mans no tmr and people like me cleaned up big time!!
costain, oando, almost all the insurance, AP, etherna oil, alumaco et al. That was the time to borrow to trade. I did it, made money, bailed out when the market became turbulent.  the only stock i have left are the good ones that will not go under even if NSE will be no more
some of those coys didnt even have a visible biz. and thats kalo kalo. imagine alumaco, big treat and co growing exponentially with no figures to back it

U be da judge!

@tkb417
u tend 2 understand wat i am talking abt becos ur an investor. Now i understand wat u wrote abt Afam.

@ Afam
Mister if u want expert advice. U pay for it. The true value of a company has nothing to do with the daily fluctuation of its share price. The share price is just d reflection of investor mood.The true value of a company has to do with the long term growth/survival of the company. So investing has to do with the long term. Now wat do u call somebody that bought the shares of companies like Livestock feeds, Ellah lakes, Lennards and the likes. These companies had either been moribund and their share prices weren't move or were loss making ventures for a long time and yet their equities price moved astronomical during the stock market boom and compare that with someone that invested in the equities of a company like Ashakacem and u now tell me both of them are gamblers rite. Who is more at risk of losing money? If most of u had entered the market with a long term view u would nave seen the current meltdown as an opportunity to buy really sound companies at give away prices. See Companies like, UBA, 1st Bank. Union Bank Ashakaccem, WAPCO, Guinness, Flourmills and the likes. My broda everybody is entitlted to his or her opinion. U don't expect me to accept ur opinion becos u got burnt gambling. i was in the market den, i am in the market now and i will still be in the market for as long as i live.

Afam
u tend not to understand small things
i have been investing in the stockmarket since my nysc days. my first stock was GTB IPO and FYI, all these stocks are still evergreen in my portfolio. from towards the end of FY2006 throughtout 07, people made money investing in all kinds of stocks.
Many Private placements came about, many IPOs, many offers too juicy to be true. Do u know how much stocks like PHB, Oceanic, Intercontinental and co were worth in 06? those were the years people really bought fundamentally good stocks very cheap.

i gained in 3 ways, capital appreciation, bonuses and dividends (were paid by some of these coys). so what are u talking about? when the ununsual started in the market and stocks like afprint, livestock feeds, big treat and co started rising, as a sharp man, i took some loans and cleaned out in the market i repeat. I bought equity assurance for 1.20k and i sold at 5.10k before the market started misbehaving, i once did a 25% CICO on Afprint, Livestock, costain, etherna oil and co within 3 weeks of buying. and as soon as i sell, all i do is to wait for sellers to sell, crash the price to the initial buying price and buy again. all these u can call kalo kalo but with the aid of stuffs like candlesticks, where support and resistance levels can be meausred, u can time entry and exit (trading). the market then made it possible for peeps like me to make plenty dough.
i stopped doing these when the charts stopped working, ( but wetin man go do, i don chop enuff)

buying stocks like firstbank, UBA and co are is a different ball game entirely, those are stocks i buy NOT TO SELL cos those are companies that will give residual income for life barring the 2nd coming of our Lord Jesus Christ

u berra shine ur eye and be wise in 9ja

as for the property thing, thts my personal view. im not into properties but thts what my colleague told me. he said, people should be buying some of these overpriced properties later in the year at good prices. chikena


Goodness07
leave that man jare. The guy no sabi anything!!!

Goodness07:


@ Afam
Mister if u want expert advice. U pay for it. The true value of a company has nothing to do with the daily fluctuation of its share price. The share price is just d reflection of investor mood.The true value of a company has to do with the long term growth/survival  of the company. So investing has to do with the long term. Now wat do u call somebody that bought the shares of companies like Livestock feeds, Ellah lakes, Lennards and the likes. These companies had either been moribund and their share prices weren't move or were loss making ventures for a long time and yet their equities price moved astronomical during the stock market boom and compare that with someone that invested in the equities of a company like Ashakacem and u now tell me both of them are gamblers rite. Who is more at risk of losing money? If most of u had entered the market with a long term view u would nave seen the current meltdown as an opportunity to buy really sound companies at give away prices. See Companies like, UBA, 1st Bank. Union Bank Ashakaccem, WAPCO, Guinness, Flourmills and the likes. My broda everybody is entitlted to his or her opinion. U don't expect me to accept ur opinion becos u got burnt gambling. i was in the market den, i am in the market now and i will still be in the market for as long as i live.

Content in bold refers, I do not want expert advice and certainly not from you.

Since you stated that if I wanted expert advice that I needed to pay for it would it then be ok to conclude that the rubbish you put down above is just what it is - rubbish since no one has paid you for it?

Content in blue refers, sorry I don't do stocks, I have never done stocks and never will. I will allow people like you who claim to be experts and yet you are losing money to be doing it.

I am glad that a lot of Nigerians are beginning to see stocks as gambling and that is the point I am making. There are Nigerians that borrowed heavily to make profits based on nonsense people like you spread everywhere and the reality on ground now is teaching them real lessons.


@tkb417,

With every new reply you give you come across as a complete inconsistent poster so I will not be wasting time on some of these inconsistencies that you have surprisingly not noticed even though you are the one making this contradictory statements.

@tkb417,

With every new reply you give you come across as a complete inconsistent poster so I will not be wasting time on some of these inconsistencies that you have surprisingly not noticed even though you are the one making this contradictory statements.

what a cheap shot!

ur school of tot is buying shares = kalokalo
mine is its not though its risky

so where is the inconsistency?
ill break it down.

i invest long term
i traded short term (made money)
pulled out of trading when i started losing money ( nothing compared to what i made in the past). Move was to preserve cash till market clears. This has nothing to do with investments in sound companies

those are my positions and i can say it anywhere. not ashamed to do so
na u need to clear the dust in ur head

I am glad that a lot of Nigerians are beginning to see stocks as gambling and that is the point I am making

dunderheads like u na.

There are Nigerians that borrowed heavily to make profits based on nonsense people like you spread everywhere and the reality on ground now is teaching them real lessons.

borrowing money to do anything is risky.

@tkb, Goodness and afam
I appeal to you all to sheath the sword.Lets not forget the essence of this thread which is how you have been affected by the downturn certainly not who is right or wrong abt investment principle. A German billionaire committed suicide a few days ago on account of the global financial meltdown.This is supposed to be a healing thread and not a destructive one.

It kind of reminds me of a once popular thread on this forum where a bunch of school leavers felt they were always right and infact could move the market with their prediction.They eventually took their frustration elsewhere only to come back with other usernames.

Let us stop trying to undo ourselves.No one is obliged to accept anybody's point of view. If you were not affected by the market at all fine.You may want to render a word of advice to enable others heal.

It is also wrong to tow the path of denial because people are in pain. Some folks sold houses to finance stock purchase now they have been left with sour taste in their mouth. Many are battling severe depression, hypertension,etc. There have also been serious social consequences.Fortunately I have not heard of any suicide here because such things are not in our nature.

Pennywise:

@tkb, Goodness and afam
I appeal to you all to sheath the sword.Lets not forget the essence of this thread which is how you have been affected by the downturn certainly not who is right or wrong abt investment principle. A German billionaire committed suicide a few days ago on account of the global financial meltdown.This is supposed to be a healing thread and not a destructive one.

@Pennywise,

Thanks for your post.

I don't believe in focusing on individuals, I focus on issues all the time unless I am responding to a direct insult by a forum member.

It is a fact that many people resort to personal attacks when they disagree with other peoples' positions and it is wrong.

I have come to understand that the best way to remedy this situation is to respond in kind to those who cannot finish a sentence without insulting others especially when they cannot defend positions they stick to for whatever reasons.

Check my initial post on this and you will see that I never made reference to anyone.

So, it would be proper to advice those who resort to personal attacks to stop doing that. Asking me to stop will mean denying me my fundamental human right to defend myself whenever I am attacked and I owe no one any apology on this line of thought.

Many thanks once again for your comments.

@Afam
Well done. The fluency, organisation and logic of your posts are always obvious, whether attacking or defending, right or wrong (usually right, lol). Keep it up. Of course you won't mention names. Anyone as oratory as you won't stoop that low. Innuendos and rhetorics would suffice, lol. I'll be observing this increasingly belligerent altercation. Two to One odds but i'll bet on your literary investments, no pun intended to the warring parties.
@Pennywise
Leave them jo. It takes one or two bruised egos to populate a thread. An obvious side effect is that no one knows that Formula One, world's most expensive sport has seen the pullout of several teams including Honda and maybe Red Bull and the closure of two circuits. Hey, this thread was supposed to be about effects of the decline. Boring, instead let three people give each other free tutorials on the merits and demerits of gambling, investment and fighting pens or keyboards in this case.

So, it would be proper to advice those who resort to personal attacks to stop doing that. Asking me to stop will mean denying me my fundamental human right to defend myself whenever I am attacked and I owe no one any apology on this line of thought.

same applies to me. i respond only when attacked directly or indirectly

Pennywise
nothing really is happening. just some differing opinions i think. we all cant be on d same page.
na gode

Afam:

Content in bold refers, I do not want expert advice and certainly not from you.

Since you stated that if I wanted expert advice that I needed to pay for it would it then be ok to conclude that the rubbish you put down above is just what it is - rubbish since no one has paid you for it?

Content in blue refers, sorry I don't do stocks, I have never done stocks and never will. I will allow people like you who claim to be experts and yet you are losing money to be doing it.

I am glad that a lot of Nigerians are beginning to see stocks as gambling and that is the point I am making. There are Nigerians that borrowed heavily to make profits based on nonsense people like you spread everywhere and the reality on ground now is teaching them real lessons.

@tkb417,

With every new reply you give you come across as a complete inconsistent poster so I will not be wasting time on some of these inconsistencies that you have surprisingly not noticed even though you are the one making this contradictory statements.

@Afam
I will not respond to ur post .My continued response to u will only degenerate and ruin the purpose of this thread. Pls i neva offered to give expert  advice like u just said. I would rather u stick to the purpose of this thread and stop making investing look like some orchestrated scam. And please stop taking things said on this forum personal and resorting to using abusive languages. I think i have had my fill wit u. Let me get back to topic of this forum. I had pulled out of the market since june of 2008 and stayed out when i couldn't find undervalued stocks to buy. I only started entering the market again in november. I saw the bubble brewing when prices of some newly listed equities started making fantastic gains immediately without any financial records to back the price movement. Infact i started advising my clients to pullout from the market then and put their funds into FG Bonds. I made some silly investment myself in Transcorp, though i have liquidated @ some significant loss. I made dat investment on the back of the purchase of NITEL and the Port Harcourt Refinery by Transcorp. Now my making some loses will not make me turn around and start saying things that not true about investing because in the not too distant past i made also substantial money from this same stockmarket. It all boils down to every investor reviewing his/her strategy. It is not always a win - win situation in all business venture.

Please nobody should blame any body here. This fall is world over. Even the great names in shares investment have lost money in this period, except the person/firm has no shares in his portfolio at present. There is no expert in this share biz. People claim to be experts when things are going on well. Even the experts have their fingers burnt too. So, gentlemen and ladies , take what has happened in good faith. Do not fear to invest. Cheers.

@Pennywise,

I have to agree with afam. Whether you are making an informed decision by researching a company before investing or pulling the lever on a slot machine, fundamentally you are taking a risk with a view to achieve a positive outcome.Some folks forget that you can also make an informed decision when gambling like card counting by proffessionals.

Going by your logic, every business endeavour is thus kalokalo. Can you share with us what business endeavour that is devoid of risks? I am waiting for your response.

Tayo-D and Goodness07
abeg, let us completely avoid responding to those whos got nothing to say about the topic.

lets share experiences abeg

A close friend and I were having a drink the other day.I have come to know him as stock phobic never having anything good to say abt the capital market and those of us who have been there. At the end of the third bottle he confessed to me that during the boom he had secured a N2m credit to finance the purchase of stocks.And since the terrain is unfamiliar to him, his choices turned out to be awful.He is servicing loan on one hand while his portfolio has shrunk to N375,000.

Tayo-D:

@Pennywise,
Going by your logic, every business endeavour is thus kalokalo.  Can you share with us what business endeavour that is devoid of risks?  I am waiting for your response.

My response? Maybe in a different thread with a relevant title.But why do I think the answer is in the very question you ask?

Goodness07:

I would rather u stick to the purpose of this thread and stop making investing look like some orchestrated scam.

Orchestrated scam? Where did you get that from? Is gambling scam? Do not twist my comments into something else abeg.

@Goodness, Pennywise, Afam and Tkb
Has any of you guys checked the topic of this thread lately? If i were a newbie and i wanted to post something in this thread, reading your verbal warfare or whatever you boys in denial call it would most likely detract me. Please for the sake of the thread, cease and desist.
@Afam
you seem to be the most experienced poster. Not everyone has to agree with you. It's a sign of immaturity when you can't let go. I beg you. Stoop to conquer. Share your experience and move on.

I bought 4000 units of fidelity during the IPO at #8 per share. I'm sure you know what it's worth now. I'll just forget about it now and maybe when i'm about to write my will, i'll recheck and include them. I'll admit i'm loath to invest in stocks now. But then, given the condition of things who would?

Phony200:

@Afam
you seem to be the most experienced poster. Not everyone has to agree with you. It's a sign of immaturity when you can't let go. I beg you. Stoop to conquer. Share your experience and move on.

I am not interested in anyone agreeing with me. I have not stated anything here to show that I am not happy when people disagree with me so I wonder where you are getting this idea from.

This is an open forum and we are all free to air our opinions. Whether people agree with our positions or not is another matter entirely.

What we owe the readers here is to provide information and back them up if necessary. Every single reader has the capacity to make up his/her mind based on what he/she reads on this forum.

You may want to realize that those who are bent on forcing their views on others are usually the first to resort to personal attacks when their positions are challenged even if for good reasons.

I don't know what you mean by letting go. I just responded to a false allegation that I am making it look like stock trading is an orchestrated scam and I pointed out that I never stated so and your response is what you put down above? What do you want? What is your motive because you don't come across as an objective person on this issue.

can we have another poster plss,

tkb417:




i invest long term
i traded short term (made money)
pulled out of trading when i started losing money

U have just stated the three principles important for navigating the stock market but allow me to add two more.

Invest in companies U understand what they do.
Warren Buffet was averse to investing in technology stocks for a long time. "I dont understand what they do" he said.

Invest only what U can afford to lose (that is unless if U are an expert in the stock market).
It is really sad that people had to borrow money to pour into the stock market and I am sorry to hear that it back-fired but that might be one of the reasons why it crashed in the first place.

@tkb

I really sympathize wit those of us dat got into d market @ the wrong time. I made 1 or 2 blunders in terms of equities i purchased (Transcorp). I purchased this equity based on the business it was supposed to have gotten involved in at dat time (Oil Exploration, Tourism,NITEL and Oil refining). Boy was i wrong, no sooning the government changed everything came crashing. They started losing everything. I lost abt 70 -80% of the funds i invested in that equity when i bailed out. My guy na now i go take this investing rule of thumb serious a company must have at least 5 yr financial record b4 that company should be considered as an investment. Checkout Transcorp now infact dem don lose their only serious money spinner NITEL.