Prelate of the Methodist Church
Nigeria, Chukwuemeka Uche, is
known for his outspokenness. In this
interview with Senior Correspondent,
ARAMIDE OIKELOME, he airs his
views on the postponement of the
general elections, the clamour for
Interim Government and the
capability of the Independent
National Electoral Commission
(INEC) under Attahiru Jega to
conduct free and fair elections.
Excerpts:
Uche
When you look at the nation’s polity
today, especially what the politicians
have made out of it, what are the
things that bother you?
What bothers me now is the
radicalism and immaturity on the
part of Nigerian politicians. They
don’t seem to be matured; they
behave like infants. In fact, if you look
at them in the Houses of Assembly,
political campaigns, there is what we
call in Psychology infantile
aggression. That is what they are
manifesting. These people don’t see
themselves as servants of the people.
They see themselves as masters; and
they see themselves as the owners of
Nigeria.
It will be foolishness on my part to
think that Methodist Church of
Nigeria belongs to me because God
has given me the privilege of being
the number one person and the leader
of the entire people. And I am leading
people that are professionals in
various professions: professors,
journalists, business gurus,
ambassadors, local women and
many counting in millions. I cannot
deceive myself that I am their boss. I
see myself as their servant and I
behave myself as their servant. That
is why we consult before we do
anything; various leaders from
various parts of the country will
gather under a very serene and
cordial atmosphere and we make
sure everybody is carried along.
But, it is also people like them saying
if I don’t rule Nigeria everything will
disintegrate; because some people
are calling for mutiny. Some people
are sponsoring Boko Haram. We now
know that some politicians are
sponsoring them because they are
saying that they may cause confusion
so that the elections do not hold. Why
are they doing so? God will expose
everything at the end of the day.
I am not impressed. They know the
situation was dicey. In fact, the
postponement of the elections was a
prayer answered because most of us
were fasting and praying. If elections
had held at that time, there would
have been bloodshed. I believe that
tempers are cooling down now; and
some people are coming to their
senses.
There is a trend in Nigeria that the
church has become a place where
politicians go to curry favour. Do you
see this as a healthy development?
It is not. I saw some hungry pastors
on television; they want to make
money. You can’t see me in that kind
of thing; you can’t see Okogie; you
can’t see Makinde; you can’t see
Okoh; you can’t see us. Somebody
wanted to address us in our
convention held weeks ago, and there
was a promise that they were going
to pay about 80 per cent of the bill,
which ran into N50 million. And if I
had agreed, they would have come to
my house and dropped the money. I
said: “No. The climate is not
favourable. Don’t come. I don’t want
any party here. Stop that, if we don’t
have money, we will drink garri. After
all, we are going for prayer.” I rejected
it. I knew they were not happy. Those
people are not happy. But, I don’t
care. For me, integrity matters more
than money. I cannot sacrifice my
name for money. My name is of more
value in the presence of God, before
God and before humanity. Now they
are saying that pastors were given N6
billion. I sleep well because it doesn’t
concern me. You can’t trace a kobo
to my pocket. It depends on who is a
pastor. You know now, there is no job
in Nigeria. And people who are
failures, when they move around, it is
easy to go to a bookshop or a
collaring factory, buy collars, buy a
coat and a shirt and wear a chain like
me. And most of them are Regional,
General and all these things. Some of
them answer Rt. Rev. Prof. Dr.
(laughter).
Today, it is like the Christian
Association of Nigeria (CAN) is not
as strong as it used to be. What is the
cause of this?
I used to be a strong supporter of
CAN. I go there no matter who is
leading. Some of us in the mainline
churches are looking down on the
Pentecostals. Pentecostals have
credible men who are leading. Look
at somebody like that of Redeemed
Christian Church of God (RCCG),
Pastor Enoch Adeboye; that of
Covenant Church (University), Bishop
David Oyedepo (of Winners’ Chapel).
There are many people that are
credible there. Why must you look
down on them? And they are
qualified; they are very educated. I
support CAN 100 per cent. I still
attend their meetings and I offer my
suggestions. I give counsel. So, I
don’t support anybody that looks
down on others. You don’t look down
on others and treat people with
ignominy. It is not fair. You shouldn’t
be proud and think that others are
nonentities. No, it shouldn’t be so.
We should adopt the spirit of live and
let live. Everybody has value; all
these appellations and paraphernalia,
attachments and titles are for here.
When you go down the grave, it is no
more. God does not look down on
anybody. God gives value and
maintains that life is sacred. That’s
why He said, “Thou shall not kill.”
Well, we are doing something to bring
everybody to CAN. That is the
essence of the meeting we attended
on Tuesday and all the blocks were
represented. We spoke with one voice
and decided that no Christian youth
should involve in thuggery. Go and
vote, exercise your franchise and go
home; we are not going to kill. You
know, we have suffered a lot.
When we were deliberating, there
were some film clips we watched,
and we were weeping. You see where
a Christian man is brought before his
family and he is slaughtered as a
goat, and dismembered just because
he is a Christian. They are saying the
thing (insurgency) is not religious.
How is it not religious when you are
selective? If you go to Borno State,
the nine local governments affected
are all Christian local governments.
Why?
I don’t want to read their minds;
maybe they don’t want Christians to
cast their votes. That is how I look at
it. Truth is bitter. May be they don’t
want Christians to cast their votes so
that when they come, no Christian
should be voted for. You don’t
advocate that anybody should be
treated badly on the basis of religion.
You hear of somebody who has
stolen money and he now goes to the
public and makes sure he gives salt
and rice and you vote for him. You
mortgage your future and the future of
your children. It is not fair; people are
hungry and I am sorry, it has gone to
every profession.
Do you also agree that clergymen
should not take sides with any
political party?
For me in Methodist Church, we came
up with a decision during our Bishops
Conference some six seven years
back, I think in 2011. We said that
any Methodist minister that wants to
go into partisan politics should first
resign; give us a letter of resignation.
But, if at the end of the day, for
instance, when I was in Enugu as the
Archbishop and when I was in Owerri
as the Bishop; In each of these areas,
government usually approached me.
The governor might say; Your Grace
or Your Eminence or whatever, please
we need a credible minister of God to
be in this Board to be the Chairman of
this Board. I will look round and write
recommendation for a minister and
he will be taken. If you go to the state
governments in the states where I
had served, I have reverend ministers
who are either in the Education Board
or Pilgrims Board or sometimes State
Radio, somebody who will be a
Chaplain. I do recommend them and
they go to serve. But, it is not their
main profession; The only benefit is
that when they go to serve and we
know they are there, we only give
them allowance. That saves the
church some money. But, you cannot
go and carry card and be partisan. If
you do it, that day I will invite you to
my office and force you to resign.
That is our policy. So, when I see…..,
Well, let me not say more.
Okay we have also had about
proposition for Interim Government
and the Independent National
Electoral Commission (INEC)
Chairman, Attahiru Jega, has just
said that he cannot guarantee that
elections will hold as rescheduled. In
case the election is scuttled, will there
be any justification for formation of
Interim Government?
Elections cannot be scuttled. Every
other thing may be sacrosanct; but,
that of governorship or governance is
not. If you look at the Constitution,
there is a provision that where there
is a stalemate, that the incumbent
can continue for six months. That is
what is provided in the Constitution.
So, I don’t think that there will be an
interim administration. People are
gearing for that. I have privileged
information, many months before it
was made public. And at the circle
where we discuss is a mixture of
intellectuals, not only Christians. It
was mentioned and we said it is a
very retrogressive step. We don’t
want interim government because
interim government means that
soldiers will come or police; we don’t
want it. We should pray as I am
praying that election holds on March
28.

But, the problem is that only
conditions will cause a military
intervention. If for instance A wins
and B begins problem, there might be
military intervention. Or B wins and A
says ‘No’; so, it is in their hands. So
they shouldn’t blame them if they
come in. The politicians are to blame
if there is interim government.
Anybody dreaming about that is
building a skyscraper in the sky; and
it can’t stand because it has no
foundation. And I want to tell you that
we are not naive. If we unite as
leaders in Nigeria, Christians,
Muslims that means we have one
mind, we can take away any
government. I don’t know if you are
conversant with what happened in
Egypt. The Egyptians demonstrated
it. So, we can say ‘no’. Nobody has a
monopoly of problems. As I am
sitting now in this place, do you think
that if I issue a paper and say all
Methodists, men, women, young men
come to the street; don’t eat for one
month; and another religion leader
does it and another Islamic leader
does it, there will be commotion?
Even the leaders will run away. If we
are going to Aso Rock or Alausa, they
can have many people and ready to
kill. But at a time, they will run away.
But, the point is that they say that
Nigerians are the happiest people in
the world. They smile and they laugh
and they dance under suffering.
That’s why people have said; that
Nigerians are the happiest people
even when they are dying they are
dancing and singing. So, that is the
problem we have; but we can say
‘no’. We can say ‘Enough is enough’.
We can say it. But, I am not calling for
insurrection. People should allow
votes go on and let vote count and let
there be no manipulation. If it goes
this way, just allow it. If it goes the
other way, just allow it. Whoever
emerges, let him rule. The voice of
the people is the voice of God. When
people elect is God that has elected.
So, we should allow sleeping dogs to
lie. Nigeria is ours.
But, you know, another problem we
have in this country is illiteracy.
Illiteracy to me does not mean that
you did not go to school. Some are
educated illiterates. They are myopic.
They don’t see beyond their nostrils.
If you are bound, you think and act
reasonably. You do not have to hurt
anybody, they must be fundamental
human rights. For instance, when I
move around Lagos, I feel disgraced
and ashamed when I see gentlemen
in their suits walking along the road
and the opposite folk exposing what
they are not supposed to expose.
What is your assessment of the
performance of INEC so far?
For me, when Jega won my heart as
a lover of the Lord in 2011, the
election was adjudged as credible.
Where I was in the polling booth,
those people who thought would win
failed woefully. He conducted an
election in Anambra that is controlled
by APGA. In Ekiti that was controlled
by APC and in Edo under Oshiomhole,
he conducted the elections on a free
and fair basis. What people don’t
know is that Israel has grown to 8.5
million and some of these West
African countries are less than two
million. But, that somebody is
organising elections for this country
that is up to 60-70 million is not
easy. They are doing their best. They
have produced so many cards, but
the problem is distribution. I heard
that some PVCs were stolen. I don’t
know by whom. I heard that there
was double or triple registration. If
they are truthful to themselves, they
should know who the people are.
As for me now, you know, I came
from Enugu on November 6, 2007.
They have assured me and I cannot
go to vote in Enugu. So, I went for a
change. They have done the change
and transferred our TVC and PVC to
Lagos and Lagos is saying we are
going to vote. So, I was very happy. I
heard that because of changes they
are still printing over one million
cards that will come out in the next
one week, because, I knew that mine
and that of my wife will be among the
ones that will be printed. I have the
one I did at Enugu. But, I cannot go
Enugu to vote. But, they assured me
that I must vote. So, if they don’t do
it then, I will go to court and I will
claim N50 trillion and give it to poor
people. I want to vote.
Sir, I want you to address the problem
of the politicians on the infantry
aggression. What is your charge to
them?
Some of this politician do take drugs.
If you look at the way they behave,
they are not normal. They operate
under the influence of drugs. Those
who take drugs are people who have
inferiority complex. In fact, if I have
my way, drug users will be screened
out of politics, because, they will
destroy politics. They have mental
problem. So, nobody that acts under
the influence of drugs should be
allowed into politics because their
mind has been influenced by drug
and that is why you see people
walking about half naked. If not by
the grace of God, it causes madness.
Madness is not by nature, but by drug
and that is why they abuse and fight.
In fact, those who are known to be
taking drugs should be referred for
psychiatric tests. It should be made
compulsory for contestant of any
political party to go for psychiatric
test and ensure that those carrying
out the test on them should not be
influenced with money.
How do you imagine somebody
climbing the fence? Even if the gate is
locked, you go back to your house.
See our honourable lawmakers
climbing fence with agbada and coat
and it was shown to the whole world.
It is a disgrace that our honourable
men becoming dishonourable. Two
wrongs cannot make a right. My
people will say somebody who was
normal went into the stream to swim
and take his bath. He brought down
everything, including his pant and
placed them on a busy road and
when a mad man approached him, he
was not patient enough. So, he ran
out quickly and the mad man was
wearing something. So, who is more
of a mad person?
You see, there is impatience in
everything in this country, impatience
in the family and that is why you see
some men beating up their wives. If
you are a patient man, you will never
raise a hand on a woman, because
women naturally are talkative. If you
are strong emotionally, you will not
hit your wife.
Some within the Christian circle
believe that the way to check threats
of Islamisation of the country is to
have a Christian occupy the
presidency. What is your take on
this?
For me, a Nigerian is a Nigerian.
What determines a vote in this
country is the counting of ballot paper
and scores. Even if you have the
highest number of votes and it is not
up to 25 per cent, you are not
qualified. So, you must have 25 per
cent of votes count. It does not
matter whether you are a Christian or
Muslim. I lived in Kano for two years.
All my security men were Muslims
and do you know another thing that
happened? That is why in India
today, no church has Certificate of
Occupancy. But, go to Kano, I have
Certificate of Occupancy of all
churches.
My driver took them to see their
wives and I give them one-week
leave for tension to calm down. So, I
don’t value you because you are
Christian. You are human being.
Human being created by God,
anybody that goes to preach
intolerance is a wicked person. I am
not going to campaign on the bases
on religion. Let the best candidate
win, whoever is the best and I don’t
know and I don’t need to determine
the best candidate, Nigeria will
determine the best candidate. If they
resolved that the person that come
first wins, let the person be our
leader. You know in a multiple
language, multiple religions, multiple
ethnic society as Nigeria, there must
be tolerance. It is basic for us to live
together. That is why when I
preached on the Armed Forces
Remembrances Day, I said nobody
can Islamise Nigeria and nobody can
Christianise Nigeria. One type of
Sahara something that is called junk
journalism said that they don’t hear
what I said. They took up the
Islamisation and don’t talk about
Christianisation. Now they said that I
was addressing APC. That is absolute
misrepresentation. I remember that
my preaching caused problem
because the presidency doesn’t see
me as somebody that is on its side.
Then the Islamic people; I was
talking Nigeria. I was not siding
anybody. There is no money you can
give me today that will make me to
talk on the area of religions.
How do you think the security
agencies can ensure a safe election?

Let me tell you again, I am not
praising myself, but you know when
there was a crisis in Kano, what
happened when I was Treasurer of
CAN 1991. Then Evangelists Reinhard
Bonnke’s crusade and there was
another one Akanuka. I was a
Revered in Kano then. Do you know
that we got gifts from across West
Africa, WCC and I was the stock
keeper and I was Treasurer in
Bonnke’s crusade? We don’t share
the things on the bases of you are a
Christian or you a Muslim. Because
innocent Nigerians who left their
homes. We went to different places,
then that time they said the Yoruba
Muslims are inferior. So, the Yoruba
Muslim and Christians are together.
We didn’t come to say: Are you are
Yoruba Christians or Muslim? We
shared thing equally. Any Muslim
from Okene, they said is an inferior
Muslim, even among themselves,
then, they said those from Nupe were
inferior Muslims too. I knew I leant
when we had surplus food for
children, we went to IDH, I went to the
Chief Medical Director and give them
food and children that came there
were Muslim and Christians from
Kano even. Whenever we visited
women when they had their
Mothering Sunday, women go to
Tafawa Balewa General Hospital,
Anima Kano General Hospital and
they will buy things. The Medical
Director will allow them to give them
the gifts to everybody. They don’t
come to bed to ask if the person is a
Christian or a Muslim. Some time
they go to Orthopedic Hospital in
Kano. You see people hanging their
legs as result of motorcycle accident;
they don’t ask if they are Muslims or
Christians. We give you gifts because
they are human beings. That is how
Nigeria should be. So, to answer your
question, whoever emerges should be
allowed to take the mantle of the
leadership. That is what I have to
say.
What should be the attitude of
Christians at a time like this when the
society observe the Lenten?
For me, every day is Ash Wednesday;
after all it is commemoration of what
our Lord Jesus Christ suffered. For
me, every day is Christmas and every
day is Valentine. In the positively
sense, Valentine means the church’s
positive love. Because Father
Valentine made a sacrifice to save
humanity, so, when you committed
adultery or fornication, you are not
doing Valentine, but you are being
selfish. So, Ash Wednesday, well this
time calls for serious sober reflection.
It calls for closeness to God more
than before. Ordinarily, by now, I will
be enjoying my tea, fish and egg,
before coming to the office. But, I
have to wait and pray, practice my
faith and be close to Jesus Christ. So,
I believe that God is wonderful.
Because of this elections that was
postponed, now every Christian that
calls himself a genuine Christian is
praying for peaceful, better Nigeria
where tribe and tongue will differ in
brotherhood and sisterhood will
stand. I pray that a time will come
when what is happening in the
western world will be happening all
over Nigeria.
In the west, I have attended a
wedding of a Christian daughter
married in the Mosque. I wore my
agbada, you will not know that I am a
cleric. I have wedded a Muslim girl in
our church. It happened, we give
them marriage certificate and they
are happy, living together in harmony. http://dailyindependentnig.com/2015/03/election-shift-prayer-answered-uche-methodist-prelate/