Scholar8200:
Alright.


And that favour was , among other things, described not as passive permission but active enabling by the same Strong's concordance:
{That's the focus here. Note the word,"especially"}

◄ 5485. charis ►


Strong's Exhaustive Concordance

grace, favor:

From chairo; graciousness (as gratifying), of manner or act (abstract or concrete; literal, figurative or spiritual; [size=13pt]especially the divine influence upon the heart, and its reflection in the life;[/size] including gratitude) -- acceptable, benefit, favour, gift, grace(- ious), joy, liberality, pleasure, thank(-s, -worthy)

http://biblehub.com/strongs/greek/5485.htm
[size=38pt]Yes acceptable but not without taking away that which is offensive to the Giver![/size]

The simple question,
How does ANY of this mean Grace is not unmerited favor?
I have been waiting for scriptural proof that 'grace is not unmerited favor', but NOTHING you have adduced save your own baseless claims and headline shows this.

You can build all your arguments without going against 'grace is unmerited favor' statement because all you are saying does not in ANY way nullify this statement.

Next time you set to demolish words of wisdom, quips,quote,statement,definition and so forth, you had better be sure;
1. You understand the phrase
2. You know the phrase is WRONG
3. You know what is RIGHT


Once again, regardless of all your cliches and mishmash of scriptures and arguments, grace is unmerited favor. Those words are so profound and concise, they can't possibly be distilled further. Get a life apart from kicking against the goads

vooks:

The simple question,
How does ANY of this mean Grace is not unmerited favor?
I have been waiting for scriptural proof that 'grace is not unmerited favor', but NOTHING you have adduced save your own baseless claims and headline shows this.

You can build all your arguments without going against 'grace is unmerited favor' statement because all you are saying does not in ANY way nullify this statement.

Next time you set to demolish words of wisdom, quips,quote,statement,definition and so forth, you had better be sure;
1. You understand the phrase
2. You know the phrase is WRONG
3. You know what is RIGHT


Once again, regardless of all your cliches and mishmash of scriptures and arguments, grace is unmerited favor. Those words are so profound and concise, they can't possibly be distilled further. Get a life apart from kicking against the goads

Your opinion is noted.

Scholar8200:
Your opinion is noted.

On top of noting my opinion,
How does any of what you did or the definition you gave of grace demonstrate that grace is not unmerited favor?

Yes, you might have been told to come to Jesus just the way you are, correct. But you dont remain just the way you are after coming to Him else you never truly came! Or you came and left.

17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
2 Corinth 5:17

Scholar8200:
Yes, you might have been told to come to Jesus just the way you are, correct. But you dont remain just the way you are after coming to Him else you never truly came! Or you came and left.

17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
2 Corinth 5:17

How does this make Grace is not unmerited favor!?

vooks:

How does any of what you did or the definition you gave of grace demonstrate that grace is not unmerited favor?

The focus of this thread is to correct the notion that grace is no more than forgiveness(what people actually mean this days when they say Grace is unmerited favour). Sure, we can never earn/merit grace however, we have a role to play in receiving and abiding therein by faith.

While there are that will welcome Strong's definition of Grace as Favour, many are apt to deliberately over look the emphasis on Divine Influence and a result it should have in the life we live.

Strong's Exhaustive Concordance

grace, favor:

From chairo; graciousness (as gratifying), of manner or act (abstract or concrete; literal, figurative or spiritual; especially the divine influence upon the heart, and its reflection in the life; including gratitude) -- acceptable, benefit, favour, gift, grace(- ious), joy, liberality, pleasure, thank(-s, -worthy)

http://biblehub.com/strongs/greek/5485.htm

Scholar8200:
The focus of this thread is to correct the notion that grace is no more than forgiveness(what people actually mean this days when they say Grace is unmerited favour). Sure, we can never earn/merit grace however, we have a role to play in receiving and abiding therein by faith.

While there are that will welcome Strong's definition of Grace as Favour, many are apt to deliberately over look the emphasis on Divine Influence and a result it should have in the life we live.

Question is, do their 'notion' subtract anything from the FACT that Grace is Unmerited Favor?

You concede Grace is Unmerited
You also concede Grace is favor
Why is Grace not Unmerited Favor?

vooks:


Question is, do their 'notion' subtract anything from the FACT that Grace is Unmerited Favor?

You concede Grace is Unmerited
You also concede Grace is favor
Why is Grace not Unmerited Favor?

But the false notion that emphasizes one aspect and despises the other aspect has to be corrected!That's the purpose here.

There is this hymn that some saints sang at a meeting," It Pays to Serve Jesus". After the singing, the speaker came up to say," It Costs to serve Jesus". Point? There are perspectives that must be balanced!

Scholar8200:
But the false notion that emphasizes one aspect and despises the other aspect has to be corrected!That's the purpose here.

You are certainly free to correct all the notions you can afford to,real or imagined, but the question is, is grace anything other than Unmerited Favor?

There is this hymn that some saints sang at a meeting," It Pays to Serve Jesus". After the singing, the speaker came up to say," It Costs to serve Jesus". Point? There are perspectives that must be balanced!

Perspectives notwithstanding, Grace is Unmerited Favor, and you have conceded as much. This makes you a contradiction because you claim Grace is NOT Unmerited Favor, while at the same time conceding Grace is just that!

In your case, that would be like saying 'it does not pay to serve Christ' because you are 'balancing' 'it costs to serve Christ'!

Scholar8200:
Many describe grace as unmerited favour but I am yet to find this definition impliedly or expressedly stated in the Bible!(IF YOU HAVE PLS SHOW US)

I fear this definition of grace being unmerited favour laid the foundation of people seeing it as God's ticket enabling us travel the broad way and enter through the strait gate!


To others, Grace is forgiveness of sins nothing more! Yes it includes but is not limited to forgiveness

If that was the case then why was Jesus being a task master when after forgiving the woman caught in adultery He told her to go and sin no more? Were His Words not Spirit and Life by which the woman was to be empowered for victory after forgiveness?

Why didnt He say," daughter, I know you are weak;any time you commit adultery just remind the Father of today and ask Him for forgiveness!!!


Grace is illustrated in:

1. God strengthening our hands such that we are enabled to break a bow of steel; Psalm 18:34
2. Enabling us to walk on water while we set our minds on Him (faith)
3. God Dwelling in us and walking in us
4. God working in us that which is well pleasing in His sight
5. Grace is God asking Moses to divide the red sea by stretching out his rod and when Moses complies God sent forth a blast to do the dividing
etc
6. Grace is God transforming a raving terrorist-like Saul and making him an apostle whose heart was so saturated with love that he wished God would banish him to hell if only that will lead to the salvation of his main persecutors - the Jews!

What then is Grace? Grace transcends forgiveness to an entitlement to partake of the Divine nature (2 Peter 1:3,4)

Grace is God's power working in us that which is well pleasing in His sight through our faith enabling us to live soberly, righteously and godly in this present world. It is defined as the Spirit quickening us such that, inspite of human frailty, we are empowered to live in holiness!

Romans 8:11

3 according as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:

4 whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

2Peter 1:3,4

But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
Romans 8:11

The quickening here is not resurrection or healing but the work of the Spirit Who also mortifies the carnal nature vs 13.

While we are not saved by works but faith, Grace that comes in through faith manifests itself by works hence the Epistles commence with the revelation of salvation and ends with practical works of faith expected from those who profess faith lest they be deceived!


Besides, unlike the I-serve-you-you-bless-me mindset prevalent today, true service to God is only possible by His Grace tantamount to His Power and he that serves by this Provision does not pray or approach God with an air of entitlement but retains humility!

28 Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear
Hebrews 12:28





Now let's consider facts about Grace.

Facts about Grace:
1. Grace can be received in vain by the receiver; 2 Corinth 6:1

2. Frustrated by the receiver; Galatians 2:21

3. Fallen from by he that once received it? Galatians 5:4

4. Turned to lasciviousness and an occasion to serve the flesh if careful heed is not taken; Jude 4

5. Grace works in tandem with our wills and willingness? Meaning grace will only enable to the degree to which we want to go 1 Corinth 15:10

6. Grace only becomes effectual in our lives when we believe on Him Romans 5:2 hence the need to hold fast and continue in the faith.

7. Actions that contradict the grace received by faith we possess are evidences that we are no longer in the faith 2 Corinth 13:5 no matter what affirmations, emotions and feelings we experience.

8. Grace goes beyond forgiveness of sins to empowerment to live victorious lives Titus 2:11-13 and that if this aspect of grace is missing, we may profess grace but we deceive ourselves and turn God's grace into lasciviousness !

9. Sequel to (8.), if we have no earnest hunger and thirst after righteousness and purity, and only rejoice in the forgiveness aspect of grace then we have a form of godliness while denying the power thereof: a recipe for becoming reprobates in the long run like the Church in Sardis Revelation 3:1-5!

10. He that truly received grace will hunger for more John 1:16; absence of this means the person has reverted back to what he was before encountering grace 2 Peter 1:9-11

11. Grace is provided as a free Gift never to be withdrawn; however each individual must access this grace by faith and since faith is not permanent till we get to Heaven, we must take heed and be watchful lest we draw back or fall from faith!

Grace is more than just "unmerited favor" infact the term "unmerited favor" is over-simplifying grace. Now going back to Jer 31:31 God talked about a new convenant and that was when the first convenant was still effective that is the law of Moses. In a bid to establish this new convenant God sent His son Jesus Christ to die for us thereby bringing "grace", that is to say the law was brought to us through Moses and "Grace" through Jesus Christ. Wouldn't want to go into so much details cause a lot can be said about grace and it cannot be exhausted, but as for people seeing grace as a license to commit sin that's wrong because it is written in Rom 6:1-3 that as Christ died we died with Him and have become dead to sin and also resurrected with Him. And in verse 6 it tells us that our old man was crucified with Him so that the body of sin might be destroyed and hence no longer slaves to sin.
Again you can't talk about grace without talking about faith cause its written in Rom 4:16 "it is of Faith that it might be by Grace, to the end that the promise might be guaranteed to all seed..." Also in Rom 5:1-2 we find out that it is Faith that gives us access to Grace
Well I just recommend the book of Romans for a better insight into grace it inexhaustible

Pls guys stop attacking the OP just enlighten him, no one knows it all, besides he didn't derail so much just dat the examples may be a little out of place

ElCount:
Grace is more than just "unmerited favor" infact the term "unmerited favor" is over-simplifying grace. Now going back to Jer 31:31 God talked about a new convenant and that was when the first convenant was still effective that is the law of Moses. In a bid to establish this new convenant God sent His son Jesus Christ to die for us thereby bringing "grace", that is to say the law was brought to us through Moses and "Grace" through Jesus Christ. Wouldn't want to go into so much details cause a lot can be said about grace and it cannot be exhausted, but as for people seeing grace as a license to commit sin that's wrong because it is written in Rom 6:1-3 that as Christ died we died with Him and have become dead to sin and also resurrected with Him. And in verse 6 it tells us that our old man was crucified with Him so that the body of sin might be destroyed and hence no longer slaves to sin.
Again you can't talk about grace without talking about faith cause its written in Rom 4:16 "it is of Faith that it might be by Grace, to the end that the promise might be guaranteed to all seed..." Also in Rom 5:1-2 we find out that it is Faith that gives us access to Grace
Well I just recommend the book of Romans for a better insight into grace it inexhaustible

Words and phrases may not cover entire theology but that does not make them WRONG.
The phrase 'Grace is Unmerited Favor' is 120% accurate,just as as is a Muslim quip that Jesus was a prophet. We know He is more than a prophet, but He is still a prophet! Similarly, if there is more T Grace than Unmerited Favor, Grace remains Unmerited Favor plus that 'more'

Saying Grace is NOT unmerited favor means either Grace is Merited,it is not Favor or is neither. Attacking such a profound and accurate truth senselessly in the name of Correcting misconceptions and notions' is lack of wisdom.

The MOST distinguishing aspect of Grace is that it is unearned,free,nobody I entitled to it, and there is NOTHING you can do to qualify for it; the Grace is what qualifies you! The SECOND distinguishing aspect of Grace is that it is God who accepts man. Mary was said to be Highly favored' and some confused religionists pray to her for this. But Jesus said more blessed is he who does the will of God, and the will of God is to believe in Him. All these means UNMERITED FAVOR is lethally accurate

ElCount:
Pls guys stop attacking the OP just enlighten him, no one knows it all, besides he didn't derail so much just dat the examples may be a little out of place

The OP is busy 'attacking' others who he feels are IGNORANT. Nobody is attacking him, we are simply showing him the error of attacking a truthful statement in the name of Correcting and balancing misconceptions and notions'

vooks:


The OP is busy 'attacking' others who he feels are IGNORANT. Nobody is attacking him, we are simply showing him the error of attacking a truthful statement in the name of Correcting and balancing misconceptions and notions'

Anyway I pity the OP.

Very confused christian!

promisechuks:

Anyway I pity the OP.

Very confused christian!

how about you pity ursef first for being a blind follower of joseph prince? Remove d log in ur eyes before attempting to help d op. Vooks isnt against the op's theology but against d misleading caption which suggests dat grace is earned. Grace is an unmeritted favor and much more.
Make sure u experience d true grace because d type joseph prince talks whereby you can still live in and enjoy d pleasures of sin is fake.

ElCount:
Grace is more than just "unmerited favor" infact the term "unmerited favor" is over-simplifying grace.

Very Good!!! This summarises the thread and its purpose!!! Stay Blessed.

Now going back to Jer 31:31 God talked about a new convenant and that was when the first convenant was still effective that is the law of Moses. In a bid to establish this new convenant God sent His son Jesus Christ to die for us thereby bringing "grace", that is to say the law was brought to us through Moses and "Grace" through Jesus Christ. Wouldn't want to go into so much details cause a lot can be said about grace and it cannot be exhausted, but as for people seeing grace as a license to commit sin that's wrong because it is written in Rom 6:1-3 that as Christ died we died with Him and have become dead to sin and also resurrected with Him. And in verse 6 it tells us that our old man was crucified with Him so that the body of sin might be destroyed and hence no longer slaves to sin.
Again you can't talk about grace without talking about faith cause its written in Rom 4:16 "it is of Faith that it might be by Grace, to the end that the promise might be guaranteed to all seed..." Also in Rom 5:1-2 we find out that it is Faith that gives us access to Grace
Well I just recommend the book of Romans for a better insight into grace it inexhaustible

Indeed, NO ONE merits Grace but they only gain an entrance therein who repent and believe. They only continue therein who watch, hold fast and overcome! They only enter into its final end who endure to the end!

As per the highlighted, it is for such that this thread was opened! Those whose understanding of Unmerited favour is that which needs no appropriation and is just an act of forgiveness! And afterwards calls forth no labouring to enter into that rest but a passive sauntering on the broad way claiming unmerited favour, not as what the Bible reveals it is, but as a waiver to be presented at the narrow gate!

promisechuks:

Anyway I pity the OP.

Very confused christian!

He is not confused. He raises some salient but ignored aspects of our faith. He is a wise man and a great teacher. Where he erred is in the misleading header of his post saying 'Grace is NOT Unmerited Favor!' He clearly believes Grace is unmerited favor so he contradicts himself but he goes on to give some powerful words of wisdom. That's all

Scholar8200:
Very Good!!! This summarises the thread and its purpose!!! Stay Blessed.




Indeed, NO ONE merits Grace but they only gain an entrance therein who repent and believe. They only continue therein who watch, hold fast and overcome! They only enter into its final end who endure to the end!

As per the highlighted, it is for such that this thread was opened! Those whose understanding of Unmerited favour is that which needs no appropriation and is just an act of forgiveness! And afterwards calls forth no labouring to enter into that rest but a passive sauntering on the broad way claiming unmerited favour, not as what the Bible reveals it is, but as a waiver to be presented at the narrow gate!

You are dangerous tottering on the brink of a works salvation.

Some quick questions;
1. Have you sinned today?

vooks:


You are dangerous tottering on the brink of a works salvation.

This is where I stand:

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
Ephesians 2:8-10

We are saved by faith NOT works. However, a proof of that faith is a life of good works else that faith is a hoax.

14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

James 2:14,17,26

The work here referred to is what Paul described as the work of faith:

3 remembering without ceasing your work of faith, and labour of love, and patience of hope in our Lord Jesus Christ
1 Thessalonians 1:3

In another place he says faith worketh by love! Galatians 5:6b

In fact, Grace purifies us and makes us zealous of good works (Titus 2:11-14) hence he who truly receives Grace will have these evidences except he is a reprobate:

vooks:


Words and phrases may not cover entire theology but that does not make them WRONG.
The phrase 'Grace is Unmerited Favor' is 120% accurate,just as as is a Muslim quip that Jesus was a prophet. We know He is more than a prophet, but He is still a prophet! Similarly, if there is more T Grace than Unmerited Favor, Grace remains Unmerited Favor plus that 'more'

Saying Grace is NOT unmerited favor means either Grace is Merited,it is not Favor or is neither. Attacking such a profound and accurate truth senselessly in the name of Correcting misconceptions and notions' is lack of wisdom.

The MOST distinguishing aspect of Grace is that it is unearned,free,nobody I entitled to it, and there is NOTHING you can do to qualify for it; the Grace is what qualifies you! The SECOND distinguishing aspect of Grace is that it is God who accepts man. Mary was said to be Highly favored' and some confused religionists pray to her for this. But Jesus said more blessed is he who does the will of God, and the will of God is to believe in Him. All these means UNMERITED FAVOR is lethally accurate

Not in doubt about grace being unmerited favor, but defining it as that alone over-simplifies it, that's what am saying

ElCount:
Not in doubt about grace being unmerited favor, but defining it as that alone over-simplifies it, that's what am saying

'Over-simplifies' is a figment of your bias. Jesus Christ is several things including 'holy child'. You can't pick needless fights with any of His his offices because it does not cover something else. For instance the phrase 'Lamb of God' does not cover His deity. Does the phrase 'over-simplify' Jesus?

Similarly, Grace is Unmerited Favor is complete and it communicates whatever it does succinctly. It is just a phrase, a profound one. If you have a better definition you would do well to give us.

If there is a misconception of what Grace entails, it certainly is due to ignorance, and not due to Grace is Unmerited Favor. This is why fighting the truth communicated by the phrase in the name of correcting this ignorance is unwise.

Scholar8200:
This is where I stand:
We are saved by faith NOT works. However, a proof of that faith is a life of good works else that faith is a hoax

The work here referred to is what Paul described as the work of faith:

In another place he says faith worketh by love! Galatians 5:6b

In fact, Grace purifies us and makes us zealous of good works (Titus 2:11-14) hence he who truly receives Grace will have these evidences except he is a reprobate:

Have you sinned today Scholar8200?

vooks:

'Over-simplifies' is a figment of your bias. Jesus Christ is several things including 'holy child'. You can't pick needless fights with any of His his offices because it does not cover something else. For instance the phrase 'Lamb of God' does not cover His deity. Does the phrase 'over-simplify' Jesus?

Similarly, Grace is Unmerited Favor is complete and it communicates whatever it does succinctly. It is just a phrase, a profound one. If you have a better definition you would do well to give us.

If there is a misconception of what Grace entails, it certainly is due to ignorance, and not due to Grace is Unmerited Favor. This is why fighting the truth communicated by the phrase in the name of correcting this ignorance is unwise.

You misunderstand me, I am not being bias. Anyone who says grace is NOT unmerited favor is wrong (the OP needs to correct the title of the thread).
What am saying is that in a bid to define Grace and you JUST say Grace is unmerited favor and you END there seems to over-simplify it because Grace is more than JUST unmerited favor.
You gave an example with Jesus. Jesus is indeed the Lamb of God but He is not only the Lamb of God. Defining Him as that ALONE means that you re not truly acknowledging His Grandeur, Greatness, etc in its TOTALITY. That's what I mean with regards to Grace.
Read my first post

vooks:



Have you sinned today Scholar8200?

No, I cant recall the Spirit or my conscience bearing witness to the contrary.

vooks:



Have you sinned today Scholar8200?

Leave the pharisee christian!

The guy hasn't known that the topic of this thread that he started is a kind of blasphemy and can take him in an express way to hell, because when grace is not unmerited, it is merit. Forget about the way his beating round the bush.


That's how they go around preaching contradiction but I thank for the wave of the pure gospel going round the world.

Just see how contradicting these statements are;

1. Grace is not an unmerited favour, but it is freely given.

2. No works can merit the gift of eternal life but you have to live rightly to gain eternal life and make heaven.

3. Jesus was condemned for our sins, but after accepting the lordship of christ you can be condemned of your sins; then what is the essence of christ's condemnation over sin?

4. Living above the law(grace) means to live more rightly than he that is under the law; yet the pharisee-christian cannot keep the 10 commandment and 630+ laws and do extra as a person who really lives above law by right living.

5. After accepting the gift of eternal life, you have to maintain it with your right living; please whose righteousness can maintain what his righteousness couldn't earn?

6. The law was not abolished but we are not under the law; please can law(moses) and grace(jesus) co-exist together?

7. Jesus; "whosoever that shall believe in me shall not perish." Then they say; if you only believe without doing the right thing you cannot be saved, let alone going to heaven but eternal life is a free gift and unmerited favour that is based on faith."

8. jesus was punished for the sins of the whole world, but sinners can be punished for their sins in this day of salvation.

9. When you are saved and do something bad, you are unsaved, but all our sins have being forgiven; so now God is a joker? So God can play injustice by punishing us for the sins he punished jesus for?

10: col 2"....ALL our sins where forgiven" but the all there doesn't include all the sins of our entire life, but all your sins till the day of your salvation; please, can there be all without a complete past, present and future? Is ALL = past - present - future?

11. By his stripes we WERE healed of our diseases(past, present and future) but by his death we are only forgiven of our past and not present and future till we ask for forgiveness.

12. There is no more condemnation to them that believe in christ, but the holyspirit convicts and tells us we are going to hell because of our bad we did; so the holyspirit is responsible for the condemnation of a believer. But at the same time the devil is the accuser of the brethen; please in this statement, what is the difference between the devil and the holyspirit?


I think I should stop here.

Leave the pharisee christian!

The guy hasn't known that the topic of this thread that he started is a kind of blasphemy and can take him in an express way to hell, because when grace is not unmerited, it is merit. Forget about the way his beating round the bush.


That's how they go around preaching contradiction but I thank for the wave of the pure gospel going round the world.

Just see how contradicting these statements are;

1. Grace is not an unmerited favour, but it is freely given.

2. No works can merit the gift of eternal life but you have to live rightly to gain eternal life and make heaven.

3. Jesus was condemned for our sins, but after accepting the lordship of christ you can be condemned of your sins; then what is the essence of christ's condemnation over sin?

4. Living above the law(grace) means to live more rightly than he that is under the law; yet the pharisee-christian cannot keep the 10 commandment and 630+ laws and do extra as a person who really lives above law by right living.

5. After accepting the gift of eternal life, you have to maintain it with your right living; please whose righteousness can maintain what his righteousness couldn't earn?

6. The law was not abolished but we are not under the law; please can law(moses) and grace(jesus) co-exist together?

7. Jesus; "whosoever that shall believe in me shall not perish." Then they say; if you only believe without doing the right thing you cannot be saved, let alone going to heaven but eternal life is a free gift and unmerited favour that is based on faith."

8. jesus was punished for the sins of the whole world, but sinners can be punished for their sins in this day of salvation.

9. When you are saved and do something bad, you are unsaved, but all our sins have being forgiven; so now God is a joker? So God can play injustice by punishing us for the sins he punished jesus for?

10: col 2"....ALL our sins where forgiven" but the all there doesn't include all the sins of our entire life, but all your sins till the day of your salvation; please, can there be all without a complete past, present and future? Is ALL = past - present - future?

11. By his stripes we WERE healed of our diseases(past, present and future) but by his death we are only forgiven of our past and not present and future till we ask for forgiveness.

12. There is no more condemnation to them that believe in christ, but the holyspirit convicts and tells us we are going to hell because of our bad we did; so the holyspirit is responsible for the condemnation of a believer. But at the same time the devil is the accuser of the brethen; please in this statement, what is the difference between the devil and the holyspirit?


I think I should stop here.

ElCount:
You misunderstand me, I am not being bias. Anyone who says grace is NOT unmerited favor is wrong (the OP needs to correct the title of the thread).
What am saying is that in a bid to define Grace and you JUST say Grace is unmerited favor and you END there seems to over-simplify it because Grace is more than JUST unmerited favor.
You gave an example with Jesus. Jesus is indeed the Lamb of God but He is not only the Lamb of God. Defining Him as that ALONE means that you re not truly acknowledging His Grandeur, Greatness, etc in its TOTALITY. That's what I mean with regards to Grace.
Read my first post

Okay.
Since, it is over-simplified and more than just an unmerited favour.

Please, I challenge you to bring up your meaning of grace, for us to know whether it is more than unmerited favour.

Please I will appreciate you if you do.

oyeludef:
how about you pity ursef first for being a blind follower of joseph prince? Remove d log in ur eyes before attempting to help d op. Vooks isnt against the op's theology but against d misleading caption which suggests dat grace is earned. Grace is an unmeritted favor and much more.
Make sure u experience d true grace because d type joseph prince talks whereby you can still live in and enjoy d pleasures of sin is fake.

While you are freaking on the grace, the message of the cross, please note that I am not a follower of prince, I live my life by the 100% faith I have in christ alone.

Secondly, prince doesn't preach enjoyment in sin, he preaches righteous consciousness rather than the gospel of condemnation and sin-conciousness that the devil is being armed with while condemning the church right from our church pulpits.

Please why changing the OP?

promisechuks:

Okay.
Since, it is over-simplified and more than just an unmerited favour.

Please, I challenge you to bring up your meaning of grace, for us to know whether it is more than unmerited favour.

Please I will appreciate you if you do.

look mehn, I can't give you a particular definition of Grace even though I can try just as I cannot give a particular definition of who Jesus is that's why he has so many names. But let me ask you this, if u define Grace as just unmerited favor and nothing else, how then do you account for Grace being the new convenant God said he will establish with us in Jer 31:31. Like I said previously the book of Romans can help, I can't keep going on in this merry-go-round of an argument
. I don't think its getting us anywhere

Scholar8200:

No, I cant recall the Spirit or my conscience bearing witness to the contrary.

When last do you recall Spirit or your conscience bearing witness to your sinning?

ElCount:
You misunderstand me, I am not being bias. Anyone who says grace is NOT unmerited favor is wrong (the OP needs to correct the title of the thread).
What am saying is that in a bid to define Grace and you JUST say Grace is unmerited favor and you END there seems to over-simplify it because Grace is more than JUST unmerited favor.
You gave an example with Jesus. Jesus is indeed the Lamb of God but He is not only the Lamb of God. Defining Him as that ALONE means that you re not truly acknowledging His Grandeur, Greatness, etc in its TOTALITY. That's what I mean with regards to Grace.
Read my first post

Who said you 'end there'?
When Jesus is called lamb of God, it does not 'just END there', that's specific for that purpose. In short, if the phrase does not encompass all there is to Grace, this does not automatically translate in the phrase being wrong, nor does it 'over-simplify' nothing. Point is you are barking at the wrong tree