Empiree:
This is rather silly. First, check his genealogy. Second, how is learning language an issue?. Maybe you need to ask how and why some nigerians speak Mandarin since they are chinese?.



This is old christian evangelist argument, bro. You should have known better now. Problem you have is lack of GENEALOGICAL & HISTORICAL & LEXICAL ENQUIRIES which your christian scholars failed to exercise but they have now done their homework after muslims enlightened them. So they no longer bring this alleged "contradiction" against Quran. As opposed to the New Testament, the Qur'an has copious mention of Mary, starting from her birth, to her seclusion, the annunciation and her giving birth to Jesus. While the Qur'an has lots of things to say regarding the childhood of Mary, the New Testament contains nothing of the sort. It practically sheds no light on the life of Mary before she became pregnant. This information that christians dont have i their text was part of their misunderstanding. Therefore, I would advise you to please read Quran and study root of Mary from birth to the time she gave birth to Jesus. This will give you a clue why Quran says “Sister Of Aaron”. I have no time to post ot type all that here. Read here for more information

Your link did not explain anything. It was just dancing around the question and its conclusion is you can't determine without considering this n that.
That still does not answer the question how the sister of Moses is the mom of Jesus. Also amram is the father of Aaron not imran. This is another mistake.

Am still waiting for your response on Aaron;s dad

fortran12:


Your link did not explain anything. It was just dancing around the question and its conclusion is you can't determine without considering this n that.
That still does not answer the question how the sister of Moses is the mom of Jesus. Also amram is the father of Aaron not imran. This is another mistake.

this is because you either did not read or you read it but you have no understanding. The link quiet explained genealogy, history and lexicon enquires that your biblical theory doesn't have.

The link also brilliantly explained towards the end how Mary was linked to Harun by virtue of righteousness. Here is another link to work on

fortran12:


Let me easily destroy your response. How can the father , originator of the Arabs learn Arabic when he is supposed to be their founder. That is a fallacy. Am sure you understand.

I may have to reread your original post on this bcuz I am missing your point

Empiree:
this is because you either did not read or you read it but you have no understanding. The link quiet explained genealogy, history and lexicon enquires that your biblical theory doesn't have.

The link also brilliantly explained towards the end how Mary was linked to Harun by virtue of righteousness. Here is another link to work on

What righteousness is that. Who told u Aaron was righteous, show me the text or reference. I read the text you sent and in the end it says Allah knows best - this is usually used whn an argument has no conclusion.
How can the Qur'an that came 600 years after the bible even thousands of years after Aaron say it has genealogy the bible omitted. Where did it get the info from. The origin of Mary is with the Jews and the Bible so where the Qur'an got its info from is baffling. It's clearing trying to wriggle its way out of the issue. Also Amram is Aarons dad not imran.

fortran12:


What righteousness is that. Who told u Aaron was righteous, show me the text or reference. I read the text you sent and in the end it says Allah knows best - this is usually used whn an argument has no conclusion.
How can the Qur'an that came 600 years after the bible even thousands of years after Aaron say it has genealogy the bible omitted. Where did it get the info from. The origin of Mary is with the Jews and the Bible so where the Qur'an got its info from is baffling. It's clearing trying to wriggle its way out of the issue. Also Amram is Aarons dad not imran.

that Qur'an came 600yrs late it's not evidence. So get over that. And I am just curious which Bible you taking about?. Show me proof that Jesus wrote the Bible. Thank you

As for Allah Knows Best is humble statement that Muslim abide by. It is called adhab "etiquette". It doesn't mean inconclusive of any argument or debate. No one has absolute knowledge except God. You can not deny this.

Again, go back to the chapter of Qur'an where discriptions if birth of Mary was given until she had Jesus. As for Aaron, Bonnie is known to talk and undermine God's chosen one and righteous people. So I am not surprised what you said about him.

Empiree:
that Qur'an came 600yrs late it's not evidence. So get over that. And I am just curious which Bible you taking about?. Show me proof that Jesus wrote the Bible. Thank you

As for Allah Knows Best is humble statement that Muslim abide by. It is called adhab "etiquette". It doesn't mean inconclusive of any argument or debate. No one has absolute knowledge except God. You can not deny this.

Again, go back to the chapter of Qur'an where discriptions if birth of Mary was given until she had Jesus. As for Aaron, Bonnie is known to talk and undermine God's chosen one and righteous people. So I am not surprised what you said about him.

No one said Jesus wrote the bible, The bible is a book of books and they were already compiled before the quran came along. Why shuld we believe what the quran said about Mary when the book of her people say otherwise. The quran copied all these from religious text available to mohammed in that time. Mary the mother of Jesus has nothing to do with Aaron , her genealogy is in the book of Luke. You still have not addresses how Ishmael who is supposed to be the father of the Arabs learnt arabic at a young age and how Amram who is the father of Moses , Aaron and Miriam became Imran in the quran.

fortran12:


No one said Jesus wrote the bible, The bible is a book of books and they were already compiled before the quran came along.

Bro, all your arguments are already destroyed by this honest statement of yours. In the time of Jesus, only he has the authority to either have "Bible" (let's assume it was his Book) written down and or compiled. No one else had this authority. Therefore, Bible is null and void regardless of who wrote and compiled it. You can agree those who wrote it were not prophets and messangers. In that case, you have no case

Why shuld we believe what the quran said about Mary when the book of her people say otherwise.

Kindly give us New Testament account of the birth of Mary?. Only then i can reason with you. Remeber i posted earlier that your Bible has no record of this. So you can't just dismiss Quran account by just telling us your book says otherwise.

The quran copied all these from religious text available to mohammed in that time.

where was the bible copied from since Jesus didnt write it?

Mary the mother of Jesus has nothing to do with Aaron , her genealogy is in the book of Luke. You still have not addresses how Ishmael who is supposed to be the father of the Arabs learnt arabic at a young age and how Amram who is the father of Moses , Aaron and Miriam became Imran in the quran.

If Mary has nothing to do with Jesus, why did Bible say "Jesus the son of David" (Matthew 1:1-17) when in fact, generations lapsed in btw?. You said her genealogy is in the book of Luke, pardon?. Who was Luke?. Was Luke authorized to write this?. Where did Luke gathered informations and stories in his book?. Luke himself confessed that stories in his book were hearsays


Even as they delivered them unto us, which from the beginning were eyewitnesses, and ministers of the word; Luke 1:2


So how am i to trust hearsays he documented?. Obviously this is not revelation but itan/aroba i:e the book of Luke is fable and fictitious

Empiree:
Bro, all your arguments are already destroyed by this honest statement of yours. In the time of Jesus, only he has the authority to either have "Bible" (let's assume it was his Book) written down and or compiled. No one else had this authority. Therefore, Bible is null and void regardless of who wrote and compiled it. You can agree those who wrote it were not prophets and messangers. In that case, you have no case



Kindly give us New Testament account of the birth of Mary?. Only then i can reason with you. Remeber i posted earlier that your Bible has no record of this. So you can't just dismiss Quran account by just telling us your book says otherwise.



where was the bible copied from since Jesus didnt write it?



If Mary has nothing to do with Jesus, why did Bible say "Jesus the son of David" (Matthew 1:1-17) when in fact, generations lapsed in btw?. You said her genealogy is in the book of Luke, pardon?. Who was Luke?. Was Luke authorized to write this?. Where did Luke gathered informations and stories in his book?. Luke himself confessed that stories in his book were hearsays


Even as they delivered them unto us, which from the beginning were eyewitnesses, and ministers of the word; Luke 1:2


So how am i to trust hearsays he documented?. Obviously this is not revelation but itan/aroba i:e the book of Luke is fable and fictitious

LOL. am really surprised. The Bible is a book of books talking about the messiah and his life and message. The Jewish prophets wrote down prophecies about Jesus and how he fulfilled all was written in the new testament. The way muslims think is a prophet must have a book etc, sorry , Jesus was not a prophet, he was the predicted messiah talked about in Genesis and the whole bible is about him.

The bible is about Jesus so what do I need to do with how Mary was given birth to her lineage is in the book of Luke so you can trace and see where she is from. Since she was a Jew and an important one that mohammed had to steal her character and insert it into his "revelation" show me any Jewish text contradicting her lineage that Luke presented.
Luke was a disciple of Jesus am sure you think there were only 12.
Luke did not say he wrote hear-say, if you read well it says he wrote things fulfilled amongst them and also things from eye witnesses (the 12 apostles). Unlike mohammed who had no witnesses for anything, only him saw the "angel" only him traveled on a flying donkey, no one saw anythin save mohammed.

Mary is not associated with Aaron not even with lineage, with Jesus you can trace from (his earthly custodian )Joseph is David etc.so saying son of David still makes sense, and also according to the prophecy, God told David that his kingdom will know no end, and this was fulfilled in Jesus who can be traced to David hence son of David in fulfillment of the prophecy.
So try again.

Also Amram is Aaron's father not Imran (mistake) from the quran.

fortran12:


LOL. am really surprised. The Bible is a book of books talking about the messiah and his life and message. The Jewish prophets wrote down prophecies about Jesus and how he fulfilled all was written in the new testament.

So how come your book is missing history background of Mary if your is "book of books"?

The way muslims think is a prophet must have a book etc, sorry , Jesus was not a prophet, he was the predicted messiah talked about in Genesis and the whole bible is about him.

it seems you don't read your Bible. Read this and tell me what Jesus is called?.


"The crowds answered, "This is Jesus, the prophet from Nazareth in Galilee." Mathew 21:11


You don't know your Bible

fortran12:


The bible is about Jesus so what do I need to do with how Mary was given birth to her lineage is in the book of Luke so you can trace and see where she is from. Since she was a Jew and an important one that mohammed had to steal her character and insert it into his "revelation" show me any Jewish text contradicting her lineage that Luke presented.

since you can not confidently present biblical evidence for the lineage of Mary, then you have no reason to refute Qur'an's claim

fortran12:



Luke was a disciple of Jesus am sure you think there were only 12.

Like was Jesus disciple? So you are really full like this. What do follow follow for your pastor.

Not even Paul was disciple of Jesus talkless of Luke. Matthew, Mark, Luke and John and Paul were not disciples of Jesus.

Empiree:
So how come your book is missing history background of Mary if your is "book of books"?



it seems you don't read your Bible. Read this and tell me what Jesus is called?.


"The crowds answered, "This is Jesus, the prophet from Nazareth in Galilee." Mathew 21:11


You don't know your Bible

What did Jesus and his disciples call him, the crowd did not know better , if they saw him as their messiah why did part of them agree he be crucified. In the Bible there are several voices speaking, but the one that matters is who is the person making the claim. Just as when jesus was on the cross and made some statemant, some people said he was calling for Elias, but was that true? no. they were wrong , always check the speaker before you think its in the bible so its God speaking.

Empiree:
Like was Jesus disciple? So you are really full like this. What do follow follow for your pastor.

Not even Paul was disciple of Jesus talkless of Luke. Matthew, Mark, Luke and John and Paul were not disciples of Jesus.

What is your source? Luke was a disciple (follower) of Jesus, he not was among the original 12, as they were the inner one but may have been part of the 70.

“Of the apostles, therefore, John and Matthew first instil faith into us; whilst of apostolic men, Luke and Mark renew it afterwards.” - Tertullian

So even though he was not part of the 12, that does not disprove his claims, he was mentioned to have close ties with other followers of Jesus in the Bible.

Empiree:
So how come your book is missing history background of Mary if your is "book of books"?



it seems you don't read your Bible. Read this and tell me what Jesus is called?.


"The crowds answered, "This is Jesus, the prophet from Nazareth in Galilee." Mathew 21:11


You don't know your Bible

You claim we shld accept the quran's claim about Mary, but what is her business with an arabian merchant in mecca, there is no relationship. The Jews have her biography, why should the Bible contain it when I mentioned that the reason for the Bible is Jesus. From the beginning, its Jesus not Mary. The bible is not a book of history people, but that of Jesus, the lineage of Mary and Joseph were added to show Jesus came all the way from Adam and not to grant Mary of Joseph special status.

Empiree:
since you can not confidently present biblical evidence for the lineage of Mary, then you have no reason to refute Qur'an's claim

Also her lineage is in the book of Luke chapter 3. Show me a Jewish document countering the claim of Luke of disproving the stories in is book

fortran12:


What did Jesus and his disciples call him, the crowd did not know better , if they saw him as their messiah why did part of them agree he be crucified. In the Bible there are several voices speaking, but the one that matters is who is the person making the claim. Just as when jesus was on the cross and made some statemant, some people said he was calling for Elias, but was that true? no. they were wrong , always check the speaker before you think its in the bible so its God speaking.

@bold just collapsed you claim that Bible is word of God. You just messed up. You have just proved to the world that Bible is not word of God. In John 1:21, christians believe Jesus was the prophet mentioned in the passage. Yes or no?. If answer is yes, then you contradict yourself.

Actually, your statement @bold is a proof that Bible is not of God but compilation of hearsays.

fortran12:

What is your source? Luke was a disciple (follower) of Jesus, he not was among the original 12, as they were the inner one but may have been part of the 70.

“Of the apostles, therefore, John and Matthew first instil faith into us; whilst of apostolic men, Luke and Mark renew it afterwards.” - Tertullian

So even though he was not part of the 12, that does not disprove his claims, he was mentioned to have close ties with other followers of Jesus in the Bible.

Guy, be sensible. Luke said he gospel was hearsays from EYEWITNESSES which means he didnt hear directly from Jesus which means he was not disciple. You mentioned Tertullian. Was Tertullian alive in the time of Jesus?. From his profile shows he came centuries after Jesus.

fortran12:



You claim we shld accept the quran's claim about Mary, but what is her business with an arabian merchant in mecca, there is no relationship. The Jews have her biography, why should the Bible contain it when I mentioned that the reason for the Bible is Jesus. From the beginning, its Jesus not Mary. The bible is not a book of history people, but that of Jesus, the lineage of Mary and Joseph were added to show Jesus came all the way from Adam and not to grant Mary of Joseph special status.

In that case, what's your business as nigerian (perhaps) with Jewish man (Jesus)?

fortran12:



You claim we shld accept the quran's claim about Mary, but what is her business with an arabian merchant in mecca, there is no relationship. The Jews have her biography, why should the Bible contain it when I mentioned that the reason for the Bible is Jesus. From the beginning, its Jesus not Mary. The bible is not a book of history people, but that of Jesus, the lineage of Mary and Joseph were added to show Jesus came all the way from Adam and not to grant Mary of Joseph special status.

In that case, what's your business as African (perhaps) with Jewish man (Jesus)?.

fortran12:


Also her lineage is in the book of Luke chapter 3. Show me a Jewish document countering the claim of Luke of disproving the stories in is book

But Luke said he documented hearsays. How is his account relevant?

Empiree:
But Luke said he documented hearsays. How is his account relevant?

That is not the complete truth. its half truth and therefore a lie

Empiree:
In that case, what's your business as African (perhaps) with Jewish man (Jesus)?.

I am not making false claims na, but mohammed is claiming things that no one can verify, things that contradict the historical record her Jewish people wrote concerning her.

Empiree:
Guy, be sensible. Luke said he gospel was hearsays from EYEWITNESSES which means he didnt hear directly from Jesus which means he was not disciple. You mentioned Tertullian. Was Tertullian alive in the time of Jesus?. From his profile shows he came centuries after Jesus.

That is not all he claimed, he mentioned eye witnesses and who were these eye witnesses? weren't they the close 12 apostles to Jesus?, I only quoted Tertullian to show Luke was a disciple , I did not say Tertullian was alive at the time of Jesus.

Empiree:
@bold just collapsed you claim that Bible is word of God. You just messed up. You have just proved to the world that Bible is not word of God. In John 1:21, christians believe Jesus was the prophet mentioned in the passage. Yes or no?. If answer is yes, then you contradict yourself.

Actually, your statement @bold is a proof that Bible is not of God but compilation of hearsays.

You do not understand what the bible is, God is not the only one speaking in the Bible, it contains stories of people who interacted with God, revelations of things to come, history of the Jewish people all leading to Jesus. The Bible is not a rule book that contains God speaking all through.
When people say the Bible is God's word, what they mean is it contains the massage of salvation to mankind from God not God speaking literally in all the verses and books

There were no Christians at the time of Jesus, the portion you mentioned was talking about is John.
The main thing is what did Jesus call himself? Why was he crucified? He was killed because of the claim he made about himself; him being the son of God and making himself equal to God.

fortran12:


You do not understand what the bible is, God is not the only one speaking in the Bible, it contains stories of people who interacted with God, revelations of things to come, history of the Jewish people all leading to Jesus. The Bible is not a rule book that contains God speaking all through.
When people say the Bible is God's word, what they mean is it contains the massage of salvation to mankind from God not God speaking literally in all the verses and books

There were no Christians at the time of Jesus, the portion you mentioned was talking about is John.
The main thing is what did Jesus call himself? Why was he crucified? He was killed because of the claim he made about himself; him being the son of God and making himself equal to God.

For a prophet (Muhammad) to have claimed that he brought a religion (that would in the long run become the fastest growing religion in the world);
The bible prophesied lots of things; some of which you guys believed has already been fulfilled; others, you're still waiting.
If @bolded is true, do you think, at the slightest probability that the bible never predicted/prophesies the coming of Muhammad?

Good morning

you just shot yourself in the foot throughout this post. Let me highlight for future readers

fortran12:


You do not understand what the bible is, God is not the only one speaking in the Bible, it contains stories of people who interacted with God, revelations of things to come, history of the Jewish people all leading to Jesus. The Bible is not a rule book that contains God speaking all through.
When people say the Bible is God's word, what they mean is it contains the massage of salvation to mankind from God not God speaking literally in all the verses and books

There were no Christians at the time of Jesus, the portion you mentioned was talking about is John.
The main thing is what did Jesus call himself? Why was he crucified? He was killed because of the claim he made about himself; him being the son of God and making himself equal to God.

For fact that you said God is not the only one speaking, bro, thank you. You spoke the truth. There bunch of people including a voice that came from heaven as recorded in Matthew 3:17 Is that voice of God or who.

Second highlight you said Christianity did not exist in the time of Jesus. Woooow... bravo bros for speaking the truth. Implication is that Christianity is counterfeit religion attributed to Jesus not what Jesus preached. So when muslim argued that christianity came much after Jesus had left the earth they are very correct. Christianity came from Rome not Jesus.

Third highlight, my question to you is, those who killed Jesus, are they gonna enter Heaven or Hell?

fortran12:


That is not all he claimed, he mentioned eye witnesses and who were these eye witnesses? weren't they the close 12 apostles to Jesus?, I only quoted Tertullian to show Luke was a disciple , I did not say Tertullian was alive at the time of Jesus.

Why did you reject reports of others who said Luke was not Jesus disciple?. His Gospel was written long after Jesus.

fortran12:

That is not the complete truth. its half truth and therefore a lie

Half truth?. But Luke confessed himself:


Many have undertaken to draw up an account of the things that have been fulfilled among us, just as they were handed down to us by those who from the first were eyewitnesses and servants of the word. Luke 1-2

who handed him stories that he called Gospel attributed to Jesus?

Empiree:
you just shot yourself in the foot throughout this post. Let me highlight for future readers
For fact that you said God is not the only one speaking, bro, thank you. You spoke the truth. There bunch of people including a voice that came from heaven as recorded in Matthew 3:17 Is that voice of God or who.

Second highlight you said Christianity did not exist in the time of Jesus. Woooow... bravo bros for speaking the truth. Implication is that Christianity is counterfeit religion attributed to Jesus not what Jesus preached. So when muslim argued that christianity came much after Jesus had left the earth they are very correct. Christianity came from Rome not Jesus.

Third highlight, my question to you is, those who killed Jesus, are they gonna enter Heaven or Hell?

The responses you give, am sorry I am amazed.
Read the bible and find out who it was. When I mention its not only God speaking, do you think I meant it literally only? Read in between the lines. It means it contains stories about things that God said and his interactions with other people. David spoke in the bible, the devil was mentioned speaking about job to God, angels spoke there too. So go figure. You pick irrelevant points that a lay man will understand and you tell me about how high you rate yourself. So much for your high rating.


Don't be a bush fellow, Christianity is the religion of the followers of Jesus. The disciples were the first Christians. Show me where the disciples contradicted Jesus. And show me proof Christianity came from Rome and not Jesus disciples. If it did why is Mohammed all of a sudden trying to write Jesus and his disciples into his book?
Jesus told them to spread his message and baptize people. Again points a lay man will comprehend and you claim knowledge.

What did Jesus say on the cross about those who killed him, go read about it. Contrast with Mohammed who preached his message by killing the people he was supposed to preach to.

Harbioye:


For a prophet (Muhammad) to have claimed that he brought a religion (that would in the long run become the fastest growing religion in the world);
The bible prophesied lots of things; some of which you guys believed has already been fulfilled; others, you're still waiting.
If @bolded is true, do you think, at the slightest probability that the bible never predicted/prophesies the coming of Muhammad?

Good morning

The bible never mentioned Mohammed or prophesied about him. It's a lie that Islam is the fastest growing. They only populate by birth. There are several Muslims who have renounced the faith but will not make it public for fear of persecution. There are several people like that in Iran, who only after they have fled the country change their religion from Islam.

Empiree:
this is because you either did not read or you read it but you have no understanding. The link quiet explained genealogy, history and lexicon enquires that your biblical theory doesn't have.

The link also brilliantly explained towards the end how Mary was linked to Harun by virtue of righteousness. Here is another link to work on

Please come and explain how Ishmael the father of the Arabs learnt Arabic at a young age. Who did he learn from. Is he not supposed to be the founder of the Arab race?

Also how is Mary the sister of Aaron and why did the Qur'an misspell the name of Aaron's father. It's Amram not imran

fortran12:

The bible never mentioned Mohammed or prophesied about him.

Thought you said the bible contains revelations of things to come!?
The bible prophesied lots of stuffs; some of which you guys believed have come to pass.
Considering how big Islam is, the bible couldn't have missed that.

It's a lie that Islam is the fastest growing. They only populate by birth.

I'll be glad if you can provide a statistics that back your claim. If you can't, I'll rely on the one provided by the media.

There are several Muslims who have renounced the faith but will not make it public for fear of persecution. There are several people like that in Iran, who only after they have fled the country change their religion from Islam.

It's actually in both ways.
Several people have changed religion in recent years