Albaqir, abeg if you have any other educative evolutionary videos and articles please share it and don't let these cavemen turn this thread into caves.

tintingz:
Albaqir, abeg if you have any other educative evolutionary videos and articles please share it and don't let these cavemen turn this thread into caves.

Many to share bro. More to come in sha Allah.

AlBaqir:


Sorry bro if you are disappointed. This thread and many other threads of the sane genre are opened for people to learn, contribute and argue in a polite manner. However, some of us are customers of each other. We know each other well well. Some doesn't have any good thing to contribute other than derailing thread, abusing, cursing, calling names etc without rationality. Sometimes if you tried to reason with them and force them to obey rules of mature dialogue, they will never yield. Hence, the only way you can keep them off the loop is to reply them in kind.

Personally, I have once opened a thread on the way forward to mature dialogue: www.nairaland.com/2211625/islamic-approach-dialogue-advice-muslims

And I have pleaded time and again that people should try and compose themselves and follow the rules especially as established in the book of Allah, and the Sunnah of His Prophet. But trust me, "omo ilè niwon. Bo gbewon sori bedi won a jabo".

Welcome to Islam section where sectarianism and fanaticism prevail over sensibility, rationality, good mannerism.

I had once opined you would be very good in acting, the way you script your lies are very creative. By the way, who started the name calling?! the funny thing again is the fact that you agree that you indulge in irrational cacophony, making you no different from the supposed irrational and "omo ile" group of people. Imagine, you claim someone is mad, and then you eventually join him in the madness?! Subhanallah! Very intelligent of you innit?!

As to your rebuttal on yellow shoes, apparently, most of you do not read your books, not to mention that this can also be found on another Shi'a SITE. I quite find the yellow shoes odd, if not that these religious men have read this narration, I wonder what would make any man put on a yellow shoe (well yellow snickers can still fly), perhaps, those religious men are "fashionistas" right?...You would reject anything as long as you are trying to come off as what you are not.

AlBaqir:
^^^
Mr sino,
# Your case is sorry, Mr sino. I have once given you hadith where our Aimmah say it loud and clear that any hadith that contradict the general principles of the Quran or devoid of common sense/intellectual thinking is definitely not from them (even if the chain is Sahih). Do you want me to quote it again perhaps your glasses malfunction then? Shia do not hell-bent as you guys claiming all their ahadith are authentic and accurate. There are loads of fake ahadith in Shi'i books of ahadith. This is one area you fanatics never want to agree with when it comes to your fabricated Bukhari and Muslim.

You mentioned above how you reject narrations, I would have gone back to describe how all your great scholars of the past believed all these narrations as the absolute truth including the yellow shoe "theory", I guess they were "cavemen", and you modern guys are better informed, intelligent and wiser than them...

But let's test your hadith rejection principle...

"The following tradition is recorded in the book Ikmal al-Din wa Itmam al- Ni’ma of Shaykh al-Saduq with a chain that ends at the companion of the Prophet, Jabir bin ‘Abdillah al-Ansari who asked the Prophet (saw) as follows: ‘will the Shi’a benefit from the Qa’im (as) during his concealment?’ He replied: ‘Indeed! By the One who charged me with the office of Prophethood, they will benefit from him and be enlightened by his light and guardianship during his concealment just as mankind benefits from the sun even when the clouds have enveloped it’" (Bihar al-Anwar, volume 52, chapter 20, page number 92)

So Mr. AlBaqir, is the above narration accepted or rejected?! Remember the rules...

1. Does it contradict the general principle of the Qur'an?!
2. Is it devoid of common sense/intellectual thinking?!

Note:
1. The Qaim is said to be in hiding for over 1200 years, there is no where in the Qur'an that we should take guidance from an Imam in hiding, not to mention that the concept of Imamah is not in the Qur'an, references to these 12 personalities is not in the Qur'an, and the general principle in the Qur'an is that only Allah (SWT) guides, and He (SWT) sent Prophets and messengers to guide the people, and again, no where are those who Allah (SWT) send are said to be guiding people from "behind the clouds". Even Jesus Christ (AS) who Allah (SWT) clearly mentions and took alive to the other side, is not said to be guiding anyone, not even his disciples he left, in fact, Jesus (AS) informed them of the coming of another messenger who would guide mankind.

2. Common sense and thinking logically, dictates that it is quite impossible for any human to be alive for that long, it is scientifically impossible, and not to mention the impossibility of receiving guidance from an unseen individual of which his location is unknown. Perhaps we may argue that with the sophistication of technology, perhaps the hiding Imam, may send broadcasts on social media once or twice, so as to keep guiding the misguided Shi'a, but there happens to be nothing from this Imam for over 1200 years, or do you have anything from him?...So one would seriously wonder, what is the function of this Imam in hiding?! How do you get guidance from this unseen individual? Does this make sense?!

tintingz:
Albaqir, abeg if you have any other educative evolutionary videos and articles please share it and don't let these cavemen turn this thread into caves.

The Search for Scientific Adam.
This is a blockbusting documentary which actually displayed years of scientific research trying to find our common ancestor, Adam. Both Bible and Quran say Adam and Eve were all men's parent. What were the physical description of Adam? While some ahadith insinuated that he was 60 cubic tall etc, the belief of both Jewish, Christians and Muslims is that Adam was a white man. Being "white," and probably "all prophets" set a kind of racial discrimination unfortunately within the religions. Some ahadith says "black descendants" of Adam are destined for hell fire while "white descendants" are for Paradise, some ahadith even discriminated to the point that blacks are not to married or being married to etc. Many scholars built developed their ideas and opinion for example, that before any black enters Jannah, his "blackness" will be changed to "white" because being black is a defect.

While Quran remind us of our common ancestor and by the way abolished racism, it also affirmed that no one is superior to other except in spirituality of Fearing God.

Researchers found out Adam was actually a black man from Africa.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqi04boBwmc&fulldescription=1&client=mv-google&gl=US&hl=en

AlBaqir:


The Search for Scientific Adam.
This is a blockbusting documentary which actually displayed years of scientific research trying to find our common ancestor, Adam. Both Bible and Quran say Adam and Eve were all men's parent. What were the physical description of Adam? While some ahadith insinuated that he was 60 cubic tall etc, the belief of both Jewish, Christians and Muslims is that Adam was a white man. Being "white," and probably "all prophets" set a kind of racial discrimination unfortunately within the religions. Some ahadith says "black descendants" of Adam are destined for hell fire while "white descendants" are for Paradise, some ahadith even discriminated to the point that blacks are not to married or being married to etc. Many scholars built developed their ideas and opinion for example, that before any black enters Jannah, his "blackness" will be changed to "white" because being black is a defect.

While Quran remind us of our common ancestor and by the way abolished racism, it also affirmed that no one is superior to other except in spirituality of Fearing God.

Researchers found out Adam was actually a black man from Africa.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqi04boBwmc&fulldescription=1&client=mv-google&gl=US&hl=en

Thanks bro, I've watched the video long before.

Thanks for the reminder, it really explained a lot.

tintingz:
Thanks bro, I've watched the video long before.

Thanks for the reminder, it really explained a lot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bRGk6dqPbFE

I think you should watch this seminar presentation if possible. I think it is very useful. It is a presentation by a Christian biologist about why Christianity and evolution are compatible.

I believe the same arguments can be used for Islam.

AlBaqir:



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bRGk6dqPbFE

I think you should watch this seminar presentation if possible. I think it is very useful. It is a presentation by a Christian biologist about why Christianity and evolution are compatible.

I believe the same arguments can be used for Islam.

OK, thanks. Will watch it when am less busy.

tintingz:
OK, thanks. Will watch it when am less busy.

You are most welcome brother. Have you ever consider this:

According to Sunnism, Prophet Adam (alaih salam) and his immediate descendants were 1,080 inches tall. The tallest man alive today, Sultan Kosen (from Turkey) is 99 inches tall. This change in height happened within 8000 years.

This is what one can call super-evolution. There has never been anything like it in all history. Besides, 8000 years is too short for the kind of genetic mutations required for such changes.

Besides, due to the extremely slow mutation rates in humans, if truly Prophet Adam was 1,080 inches tall 8000 years ago, we all today would also be 1,080 inches tall.

Mutation rates are extremely slow and usually happen over hundreds of thousands of years, sometimes even millions of years
It is interesting that Sunnis reject the scientific theory of evolution, but accept an evolution model that is based on unrealistic mutation rates.

Empiree, Rilwaynee001, lanrexlan

AlBaqir:


You are most welcome brother. Have you ever consider this:

According to Sunnism, Prophet Adam (alaih salam) and his immediate descendants were 1,080 inches tall. The tallest man alive today, Sultan Kosen (from Turkey) is 99 inches tall. This change in height happened within 8000 years.

This is what one can call super-evolution. There has never been anything like it in all history. Besides, 8000 years is too short for the kind of genetic mutations required for such changes.

Besides, due to the extremely slow mutation rates in humans, if truly Prophet Adam was 1,080 inches tall 8000 years ago, we all today would also be 1,080 inches tall.

Mutation rates are extremely slow and usually happen over hundreds of thousands of years, sometimes even millions of years
It is interesting that Sunnis reject the scientific theory of evolution, but accept an evolution model that is based on unrealistic mutation rates.

Lol, I've come across that Hadiths before.

The tallest humans a.k.a giants ever existed on earth never reach 200 inches tall talk less of 1,080 inches tall

The only place they existed are in fantasy, folklore, fairytale books.

If indeed Adam was 1,080 inches tall then there should be humans tall as Gulliver among us.

AlBaqir:


You are most welcome brother. Have you ever consider this:

According to Sunnism, Prophet Adam (alaih salam) and his immediate descendants were 1,080 inches tall. The tallest man alive today, Sultan Kosen (from Turkey) is 99 inches tall. This change in height happened within 8000 years.

This is what one can call super-evolution. There has never been anything like it in all history. Besides, 8000 years is too short for the kind of genetic mutations required for such changes.

Besides, due to the extremely slow mutation rates in humans, if truly Prophet Adam was 1,080 inches tall 8000 years ago, we all today would also be 1,080 inches tall.

Mutation rates are extremely slow and usually happen over hundreds of thousands of years, sometimes even millions of years
It is interesting that Sunnis reject the scientific theory of evolution, but accept an evolution model that is based on unrealistic mutation rates.

Empiree, Rilwaynee001, lanrexlan

Hadith about height of Adam and later generations explained

نشرت بواسطة: Waqar Akbar Cheema 10:47 PM في 60 , adam , bukhari , cubits , decreasing , Hadith , Height , sixty , stature 7 تعليقات
بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم الحمد لله وحده و الصلاة و السلام على من لا نبي بعده و على آله و أصحابه أجمعين
Here is a brief response to two objections on hadith for allegedly contradicting historical and related information; i.e. Adam's height of 60 cubits and about relation between the height of successive human generations.

Some have raised questions about hadith description of Adam’s height and statement about the height of his progeny.

The hadith goes as:

عن أبي هريرة رضي الله عنه، عن النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم، قال: " خلق الله آدم وطوله ستون ذراعا، ثم قال: اذهب فسلم على أولئك من الملائكة، فاستمع ما يحيونك، تحيتك وتحية ذريتك، فقال السلام عليكم، فقالوا: السلام عليك ورحمة الله ، فزادوه: ورحمة الله، فكل من يدخل الجنة على صورة آدم، فلم يزل الخلق ينقص حتى الآن "


The Prophet said, "Allah created Adam, making him 60 cubits tall. When He created him, He said to him, "Go and greet that group of angels, and listen to their reply, for it will be your greeting (salutation) and the greeting (salutations of your offspring." So, Adam said (to the angels), As-Salamu Alaikum (i.e. Peace be upon you). The angels said, "As-salamu Alaika wa Rahmatu-l-lahi" (i.e. Peace and Allah's Mercy be upon you). Thus the angels added to Adam's salutation the expression, 'Wa Rahmatu-l-lahi,' Any person who will enter Paradise will resemble Adam (in appearance and figure). People have been decreasing in stature since Adam's creation.(Sahih Bukhari, Book 55 Hadith 543)

Two points are important here:

1. Adam’s height

2. Relation between the heights of successive human generations

It is said that historic information contends against both these assertions.

We deal the two briefly below;

1. Height of Adam:

The height of Adam was sixty cubits according to this hadith but other hadith reports clarify that it was so in the heavens.

عن أبي هريرة رضي الله عنه، قال: قال رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم: «إن أول زمرة يدخلون الجنة على صورة القمر ليلة البدر، ثم الذين يلونهم على أشد كوكب دري في السماء إضاءة، لا يبولون ولا يتغوطون، ولا يتفلون ولا يمتخطون، أمشاطهم الذهب، ورشحهم المسك، ومجامرهم الألوة الأنجوج، عود الطيب وأزواجهم الحور العين، على خلق رجل واحد، على صورة أبيهم آدم، ستون ذراعا في السماء

Allah's Apostle said, "The first group of people who will enter Paradise, will be glittering like the full moon and those who will follow them, will glitter like the most brilliant star in the sky. They will not urinate, relieve nature, spit, or have any nasal secretions. Their combs will be of gold, and their sweat will smell like musk. The aloes-wood will be used in their centers. Their wives will be houris. All of them will look alike and will resemble their father Adam (in statute), sixty cubits tall in the heavens."

(Sahih Bukhari, Book 55 Hadith 544) Commonly used translation misses the translation of the last two words in the original- highlighted in red in Arabic above. See Ustadha Aisha Bewley’s translation, Hadith 3149 HERE

Scholars like Imam Abu al-‘Abbas al-Qurtubi [1] and lately Shaykh Anwar Shah al-Kashmiri [2] have said that it means the inmates of Paradise will have the height of their father Adam who was sixty cubits in the heavens.

This clarifies the first point that Adam’s height was 60 cubits in the Paradise according to this hadith and it does not say anything about his height after he landed on this planet. More on it follows under the next point.

2. Relation between the heights of successive human generations

The hadith also has the following statement towards its end;

فكل من يدخل الجنة على صورة آدم، فلم يزل الخلق ينقص حتى الآن
Normally it is translated as;


“Any person who will enter Paradise will resemble Adam (in appearance and figure). People have been decreasing in stature since Adam's creation.”

It is said that “ancient records or the fossil beds” do not support any such assertion. While that may be true we need to see if the hadith has been understood the right way in the first place?

Some scholars actually contend that it does not even mean this in the first place. Commenting on the highlighted phrase, one of the greatest scholars of our day, Mufti Taqi Usmani states:

ليس معناه أن قامات الناس لم تزل تنقص في كل قرن، بل المراد أن الجسم الإنسان لم يزل ناقصاً بعده. ويؤخذ هذا مما قدمناه عن شيخ مشايخنا الكشميري رحمه الله أن ستين ذراعاً إنما كانت مقدار قامة آدم عليه السلام في الجنّة، فلما نزل عنها عاد إلى القصر، ولم يزل أبناؤه يولدون بقرب من هذه القامة إلى يومنا الآن، وإنما يرجعون إلى أصل قامتهم حينما يعودون إلى الجنّة. فقوله عليه السلام: "لم يزل ينقص": معناه: أنه لم يزل يولد ناقصاً، والله سبحانه وتعالى أعلم

“It does not mean the height of people has not ceased decreasing with every generation, rather it means the human body has not ceased to be imperfect thereafter. This is taken from what has reached us from the teacher of our teachers (Anwar Shah) al-Kashmiri, may Allah have mercy on him, that sixty hands was the height of Adam in the Paradise and when he fell from it he became short and to this day of ours his children have not ceased to be on almost the same (short) height. And they will return to their original height when they go back to Paradise. So the saying of Prophet (May peace be upon him), "they have not stopped being short" means that have they not stopped being born imperfect i.e. on the same short height. Allah the Perfect and Almighty knows best!” [3]

Simply put in the Paradise Adam’s height was 60 cubits however on Earth it was reduced from its original perfect height and it continues that way to this day. However, when humans will eventually return to Paradise they will attain the same height.

This not only gives the plain and unproblematic interpretation of the last phrase it also tells us that Adam’s height seized to be 60 cubits after his landing on the Earth.

Indeed Allah knows the best!

-- by Waqar Akbar Cheema


________________________________________
[1] Al-Qurtubi, Abu al-Abbas, al-Mufhim lima Ashkala fi Talkhis Kitab Muslim, 23/45
[2] Al-Kashmiri, Anwar Shah, Fayd al-Bari, Vol.6 p.5
[3] Usmani, Muhammad Taqi, Takmila Fath al-Mulhim, Vol.6, p.158

It is instructive to note that the author of the above article falls back on scholars in the religion, not just being extremely arrogant and claiming to be more intelligent and rational. Well, as the Yorubas would say, “imo loladinni, ogbon ori o gbe” loosely translated to “Islam is a religion of knowledge, not personal opinion/intellect”.

Sino is being blocked I think

^^^ sino, please try again later. What you posted is from letmeturnthetable.com

# The guy basically ignores the commentaries of the hadith by his own scholars, especially Ibn Hajar in Fath al-Bari.
He was 1080 inches tall in heaven, and retained the same height on earth. There are plenty of reports about this in Tarikh Tabari.


# Anyway, if the population translations are wrong, why do they agree with what is in Fath al-Bari which is regarded as the Sunni best commentary of Sahih Bukhari?

# https://islamqa.info/en/20612
This Wahhabi website ^also affirms the popular understanding of the hadith.

AlBaqir:
^^^ sino, please try again later. What you posted is from letmeturnthetable.com

# The guy basically ignores the commentaries of the hadith by his own scholars, especially Ibn Hajar in Fath al-Bari.
He was 1080 inches tall in heaven, and retained the same height on earth. There are plenty of reports about this in Tarikh Tabari.


# Anyway, if the population translations are wrong, why do they agree with what is in Fath al-Bari which is regarded as the Sunni best commentary of Sahih Bukhari?

# https://islamqa.info/en/20612
This Wahhabi website ^also affirms the popular understanding of the hadith.

Lol, you should have also ask him if Eve and their children were also giants.

Was Adam created in God's image, 60 cubit tall? - Dr. Adnan Ibrahim

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=XRYNY1Uyf-E

tintingz, Empiree, lanrexlan, Rilwaynee001

AlBaqir:
^^^ sino, please try again later. What you posted is from letmeturnthetable.com

# The guy basically ignores the commentaries of the hadith by his own scholars, especially Ibn Hajar in Fath al-Bari.
He was 1080 inches tall in heaven, and retained the same height on earth. There are plenty of reports about this in Tarikh Tabari.


# Anyway, if the population translations are wrong, why do they agree with what is in Fath al-Bari which is regarded as the Sunni best commentary of Sahih Bukhari?

# https://islamqa.info/en/20612
This Wahhabi website ^also affirms the popular understanding of the hadith.

The author quoted scholars, are they Shi'as or Sunnis?! By the way, I'm sure you do not know the affiliations of the author. Ibn Hajar (rahimahullah) was indeed a respectable scholar, he was not infallible like your Imams who said wearing yellow shoes "strengthen your pen!s", his statement was basically his own understanding, it is not binding, since the narration clearly states that this height was in heaven, and didn't say that the height was also the same on earth! In fact, the two narrations clearly were talking about heaven/paradise and not earth...Hence, the translation and understanding of the scholars presented by the author, appears to be more accurate.

Secondly, Islamqa made their own argument as expressed in the following quote:

"The Muslim is obliged to believe in every idea for which there is evidence in the Qur’aan or saheeh Sunnah from the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). Imam al-Shaafa’i (may Allaah have mercy on him) said: “I believe in Allaah and in that which came from Allaah in the sense meant by Allaah. I believe in the Messenger of Allaah and in what came from the Messenger of Allaah in the sense meant by the Messenger of Allaah.” See al-Irshaad Sharh Lam’at al-I’tiqaad, p. 89."

To simply put, we believe in the authentic words of Allah (SWT) and that of the Prophet (SAW) as the absolute truth, the way Allah (SWT) and the Prophet (SAW) meant them, if we are able to understand them, and explain them, all well and good, and we also believe, as long as it has been established to be authentic, even if we cannot explain or understand them.

An example is the statement of Allah (SWT) that He created the heavens and the earth in six days. This is quite difficult to explain, when science is saying that a planet takes 1 - 10 million years to form. We can say that only Allah (SWT) knows what he meant by six days, we cannot reject such statement, because we do not understand, or because science is saying that it is quite impossible! It is even more dangerous to base your rejection on science, because tomorrow, science may say, due to new research and findings, it is "possible" that the earth was formed in less than what was previously stated and another debate ensues...

Empiree:
Sino is being blocked I think

I thought the anti-spam bot had repented from banning ni o!

^

Lol, it is unrepentant robot

Evolutionary Bird
www.bbc.com/earth/story/20150512-bird-grows-face-of-dinosaur?ocid=fbert

IBOs - TRACING THEIR "ORIGIN"

http://www.vanguardngr.com/2017/02/
jewishigbo-relationship-jewish-scientists-storm-nnewi-
conduct-dna-test/

# These people are being boasting for years now that their origin is from Israel. White skin Israel? Nnah mehn.

Africans are the most genetically diverse group on the earth. More than 70% of all genetic differences are in black Africans while the rest of humanity share the remaining 30% or less.

From a genetic point of view, there is conclusive evidence that Africans are by far, far, far, far older than all other races. So, it is not possible that black Africans evolved from white Israelis (when the white skin evolved just about 7000 years ago and black Africans have existed for about 300,000 years)

At best, the DNA results will prove that the ancestors of Igbos interbred with white Israelites in the recent past. But, given their geographical location, that is very unlikely.

So, they will be terribly disappointed when the results come out.

# tintingz, lanrexlan, Empiree, Rilwayne001

Any IBO on Islam section?

SCIENCE AND RELIGION

"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." So said Albert Einstein.

# Quran talks about human originating from one source.

# And it further says variations in color and tongue is for the purpose of knowing each other.

# Allah however concludes that the best in His sight are the pious.

* Surah al-Hujurat: 13

Basically, this is faith based evidence which might be proven philosophically. However, science has done a fantastic job verifying technologically, this:

# All man originate from a man.

# All other forms of skin colors originated from black African skin.

How will you feel if a Chinese for example trace his root back to your family e.g in Ijebu @ Empiree

tintingz nko?

AlBaqir:
SCIENCE AND RELIGION

"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." So said Albert Einstein.

# Quran talks about human originating from one source.

# And it further says variations in color and tongue is for the purpose of knowing each other.

# Allah however concludes that the best in His sight are the pious.

* Surah al-Hujurat: 13

Basically, this is faith based evidence which might be proven philosophically. However, science has done a fantastic job verifying technologically, this:

# All man originate from a man.

# All other forms of skin colors originated from black African skin.

How will you feel if a Chinese for example trace his root back to your family e.g in Ijebu @ Empiree

tintingz nko?

Well said bro.

Empiree na ijebu man?

AlBaqir:
IBOs - TRACING THEIR "ORIGIN"

http://www.vanguardngr.com/2017/02/
jewishigbo-relationship-jewish-scientists-storm-nnewi-
conduct-dna-test/

# These people are being boasting for years now that their origin is from Israel. White skin Israel? Nnah mehn.

Africans are the most genetically diverse group on the earth. More than 70% of all genetic differences are in black Africans while the rest of humanity share the remaining 30% or less.

From a genetic point of view, there is conclusive evidence that Africans are by far, far, far, far older than all other races. So, it is not possible that black Africans evolved from white Israelis (when the white skin evolved just about 7000 years ago and black Africans have existed for about 300,000 years)

At best, the DNA results will prove that the ancestors of Igbos interbred with white Israelites in the recent past. But, given their geographical location, that is very unlikely.

So, they will be terribly disappointed when the results come out.

# tintingz, lanrexlan, Empiree, Rilwayne001

Any IBO on Islam section?

Inferiority complex is doing many igbos, they think their ancestors were Jewish, they don't believe in African root. We're waiting for the result of the ongoing DNA test.

And don't be surprised too if the Jews return their result with


"Yea, you guys evolved from us. Your DNAS matched ours" just to give them free pass and use them for manual labor. They will help build Israel''s bridges and tunnels like blacks did for America and will be treated like 3rd class "citizens".

They will regret their unholy attachment if this were to happen.

AlBaqir:
SCIENCE AND RELIGION

"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." So said Albert Einstein.

# Quran talks about human originating from one source.

# And it further says variations in color and tongue is for the purpose of knowing each other.

# Allah however concludes that the best in His sight are the pious.

* Surah al-Hujurat: 13

Basically, this is faith based evidence which might be proven philosophically. However, science has done a fantastic job verifying technologically, this:

# All man originate from a man.

# All other forms of skin colors originated from black African skin.

How will you feel if a Chinese for example trace his root back to your family e.g in Ijebu @ Empiree

tintingz nko?

@Bold, Science or Geneticists as well as Evolutionists do not claim that humans as we know it came from just 2 people or “one man”i.e Adam (and Eve) , as stated in the Qur’an and Bible, in fact, it is said to be highly unlikely, not to mention the fact that there were other humans during the periods of these scientific Adam (y-chromosomal Adam) and Eve (Mitochondrial Eve) and it is even stated that these two probably did not live together nor mate together!Source This is indeed contrary to what can be found in the Qur’an. Another discrepancy is the years in which some of these ancestral humans were said to have lived, while a report suggests about 135,000 years ago, another report states over 500,000 years ago Source, not to mention the discovery of another human (although primitive), over 2 million years ago Source, these reports would be in conflict with what is known in the religious circles, except you want to state that Allah (SWT) had created other humans before Adam and Eve (remember, these two were not primitive)…This would have to be substantiated from the Qur’an clearly. Also, the Qur’an states clearly that the creation of Adam and Eve was not here on earth, therefore I wonder how you want to reconcile these divergent views…The pertinent questions that needs answers are, when did Allah (SWT) created Adam (AS)? And when was he on earth with Eve? Do you have the answers AlBaqir?! Or you believe what science says, that modern humans evolved from primitive humans (more than 2) here on this earth?!

sino:


@Bold, Science or Geneticists as well as Evolutionists do not claim that humans as we know it came from just 2 people or “one man”i.e Adam (and Eve) , as stated in the Qur’an and Bible, in fact, it is said to be highly unlikely, not to mention the fact that there were other humans during the periods of these scientific Adam (y-chromosomal Adam) and Eve (Mitochondrial Eve) and it is even stated that these two probably did not live together nor mate together!Source This is indeed contrary to what can be found in the Qur’an. Another discrepancy is the years in which some of these ancestral humans were said to have lived, while a report suggests about 135,000 years ago, another report states over 500,000 years ago Source, not to mention the discovery of another human (although primitive), over 2 million years ago Source, these reports would be in conflict with what is known in the religious circles, except you want to state that Allah (SWT) had created other humans before Adam and Eve (remember, these two were not primitive)…This would have to be substantiated from the Qur’an clearly. Also, the Qur’an states clearly that the creation of Adam and Eve was not here on earth, therefore I wonder how you want to reconcile these divergent views…The pertinent questions that needs answers are, when did Allah (SWT) created Adam (AS)? And when was he on earth with Eve? Do you have the answers AlBaqir?! Or you believe what science says, that modern humans evolved from primitive humans (more than 2) here on this earth?!

As a researcher and a logical person I believe in pre-Adamite because the question will be "How did Cain got a wife"?

Even in Christian beliefs there is still a debate who Cain married to, his sister? Because according to bible Cain went to another land(Land of Nod) after killing his brother. Are people already existing in this land? some christians believe Cain got a wife in the Land of Nods.

There are still questions religion need to answer.

And don't think I will buy the fairytale story of twin sisters born with Adam sons.

.

tintingz:
As a researcher and a logical person I believe in pre-Adamite because the question will be "How did Cain got a wife"?

Even in Christian beliefs there is still a debate who Cain married to, his sister? Because according to bible Cain went to another land(Land of Nod) after killing his brother. Are people already existing in this land? some christians believe Cain got a wife in the Land of Nods.

There are still questions religion need to answer.

And don't think I will buy the fairytale story of twin sisters born with Adam sons.

Is it not possible that after the birth of the male children, Adam and Eve gave birth to female children?! I do not doubt the fact that there was life on earth before Adam (AS), what the Qur'an says is that Allah (SWT) created Adam and Eve for the earth and created them perfect, and all things on earth and in the heavens were created subservient to Man! When the Qur'an is silent on some issues, or there are no authentic information from the narrations, it clearly means the knowledge about such things are not necessary for our salvation. For example, asking how Adam and Eve populated the world, what suffices is that we are descendants of these two, and that can be proven clearly from the Qur'an.

Islam clearly identifies that the first man and woman were Adam and Eve, and Allah (SWT) created them. In fact Allah (SWT) stated clearly he created Adam from the soil, and from all references, it did not happen on this earth. So evolution, in terms of origin of man, does not correlate with Islam.

I was expecting AlBaqir, to come up with some theories, but I guess he is still doing some further research...

Anyway, below is a video of a Professor interviewed on the Deen Show, The first 6 minutes thereabout explains some of my objections on this thread, and my opinions with regards to science and Islam.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSHXuZgbeRQ&t=1538s

Allah (SWT) says:

"Do ye not see that Allah has subjected to your (use) all things in the heavens and on earth, and has made his bounties flow to you in exceeding measure, (both) seen and unseen? Yet there are among men those who dispute about Allah, without knowledge and without guidance, and without a Book to enlighten them!" (Qur'an 31: 20)

sino:


Is it not possible that after the birth of the male children, Adam and Eve gave birth to female children?! I do not doubt the fact that there was life on earth before Adam (AS), what the Qur'an says is that Allah (SWT) created Adam and Eve for the earth and created them perfect, and all things on earth and in the heavens were created subservient to Man! When the Qur'an is silent on some issues, or there are no authentic information from the narrations, it clearly means the knowledge about such things are not necessary for our salvation. For example, asking how Adam and Eve populated the world, what suffices is that we are descendants of these two, and that can be proven clearly from the Qur'an.

Islam clearly identifies that the first man and woman were Adam and Eve, and Allah (SWT) created them. In fact Allah (SWT) stated clearly he created Adam from the soil, and from all references, it did not happen on this earth. So evolution, in terms of origin of man, does not correlate with Islam.

I was expecting AlBaqir, to come up with some theories, but I guess he is still doing some further research...

Anyway, below is a video of a Professor interviewed on the Deen Show, The first 6 minutes thereabout explains some of my objections on this thread, and my opinions with regards to science and Islam.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSHXuZgbeRQ&t=1538s

Allah (SWT) says:

"Do ye not see that Allah has subjected to your (use) all things in the heavens and on earth, and has made his bounties flow to you in exceeding measure, (both) seen and unseen? Yet there are among men those who dispute about Allah, without knowledge and without guidance, and without a Book to enlighten them!" (Qur'an 31: 20)

You're dodging the question.

Why didn't the Quran mention who Cain married to?Where does it mention any female children? Why didn't the Quran clear the gap once and for all. The bible gave more details but it fails to answer the question and even cause confusion and debate among bible followers.

The thing is it is a Jewish story(book).

You know the Quran is silent about some things but when science gave answers to some things you reject it because it doesn't flow with your ideology.

I thought you make fun of science being an assumption study.

What a confused, illogical individual.

tintingz:
You're dodging the question.

Why didn't the Quran mention who Cain married to?Where does it mention any female children? Why didn't the Quran clear the gap once and for all. The bible gave more details but it fails to answer the question and even cause confusion and debate among bible followers.

The thing is it is a Jewish story(book).

You know the Quran is silent about some things but when science gave answers to some things you reject it because it doesn't flow with your ideology.

I thought you make fun of science being an assumption study.

What a confused, illogical individual.

If the question about who Cain married, is the question, then I have already answered that in my previous post.

You didn't watch the video, and you still don't get it!

Qur'an is silent on irrelevant issues! What would it benefit you to know who the children of Adam (AS) married?! Does the information help you in being a better Muslim?! The Qur'an is a Book of guidance! There are scientific facts, and historical facts in it, but it is not a book of science or history, it is meant to guide you to your creator! If you want every details to be in the Qur'an, do you know how big that would be and how complicated it would have been to the people 1400 years ago?!

The Professor in the video did talk about facts in the Qur'an, which is quite impossible to know by the Arabs or anyone in the world 1400 years ago, that is something to reflect on and suffices as reasons to believe.

I do not place scientific assumptions above clear Qur'anic verses and authentic narrations, not everything in scientific journals are scientific facts or true, I have written papers were in my discussion proposed ideas (theories) that were possible cause for a divergent result from what was reported by other scientist, of course such theories would have to be tested, and the results may lead to another theory, or hypotheses, these are the research gaps that further the cause of research. Furthermore, some scientific research that has to do with evolution, origin of man etc. are basically ideas of the proponents, based on no real evidences, except for few observable natural phenomena, which may be very wrong. If you had a good background in science, and understood the scientific method properly, you wouldn't be arguing this with me! There is a difference between theories and facts...

Note, I never made fun of science, I only made fun of you guys for believing in the assumptions of scientists (e.g. Yawning is for cooling the brain), and claiming them to be facts, and the trying to correlate evolution with Islam...

sino:

If the question about who Cain married, is the question, then I have already answered that in my previous post.

You didn't watch the video, and you still don't get it!

Qur'an is silent on irrelevant issues! What would it benefit you to know who the children of Adam (AS) married?! Does the information help you in being a better Muslim?! The Qur'an is a Book of guidance! There are scientific facts, and historical facts in it, but it is not a book of science or history, it is meant to guide you to your creator! If you want every details to be in the Qur'an, do you know how big that would be and how complicated it would have been to the people 1400 years ago?!

The Professor in the video did talk about facts in the Qur'an, which is quite impossible to know by the Arabs or anyone in the world 1400 years ago, that is something to reflect on and suffices as reasons to believe.

I do not place scientific assumptions above clear Qur'anic verses and authentic narrations, not everything in scientific journals are scientific facts or true, I have written papers were in my discussion proposed ideas (theories) that were possible cause for a divergent result from what was reported by other scientist, of course such theories would have to be tested, and the results may lead to another theory, or hypotheses, these are the research gaps that further the cause of research. Furthermore, some scientific research that has to do with evolution, origin of man etc. are basically ideas of the proponents, based on no real evidences, except for few observable natural phenomena, which may be very wrong. If you had a good background in science, and understood the scientific method properly, you wouldn't be arguing this with me! There is a difference between theories and facts...

Note, I never made fun of science, I only made fun of you guys for believing in the assumptions of scientists (e.g. Yawning is for cooling the brain), and claiming them to be facts, and the trying to correlate evolution with Islam...

Bla bla bla, so Cain marriage is an irrelevant issue? I will never live in ignorance anymore. Many religious people don't even ask this question, they don't even know answers to the question, all we read are assumptions.

You've already failed an argument if you say(Cain marriage is irrelevant). Cain marriage is very important when it comes to how people came to be not only about Adam and Eve.

There are different assumptions of how he got a wife, some said cain fought Abel to marry his sister, some said Cain went to the land of Nod near Eden to marry which raise the question "are people already existing in the land".? The Quran nor the bible didn't clear this, where Cain got a wife.

You claim that evolution theories are assumptions that the long duration of years for humans to evolve is impossible but you accepted that Adam, Eve and their children procreates within some few years. The thing is there are no evidence to the former.

Science is all about questioning, observing, discoveries experiments. There are evidence of hairy early humans, there are evidence of signs and symbols on walls by early humans, there are evidence of dinosaurs, there are evidence of astroids etc. The ones you called assumptions are observations and science are still doing research and experiments, and they are making progress.

The question you haven't answer is who did Cain marry and how many children did Adam had?

..

^^Really you have time for this guy. Discussing with him is a waste of time.