The British Prime Minister the Rt Hon Gordon Brown MP today set out the United Kingdom Government's views on immigration in a speech in west London. The Government describes the UK immigration system as being tough but fair.

This is the first major speech by the British Prime Minister since February 2008. Mr Brown feels that it is important that, if possible, British rather than migrant workers help to fill skill gaps.

Key sections of Gordon Brown's speech:

* Migrants should obey the law, be able to speak English and make a contribution to British society.

* Removal of more occupations from the in-demand list. This will make it more difficult for employers to obtain Tier 2 visas. Employers will need to advertise to show that they cannot find workers from the resident labour market to fill the vacancies. Employers already have to do this much of the time.

* It is claimed that current measures had reduced the number of positions available for migrant workers by 30,000 and that reducing the in-demand list further will result in fewer migrant workers being able to gain entry to the UK.

* There will be a review of student visas to try and prevent students working illegally in the UK. It should be noted that in general students can, anyway, work part-time during term time and full time during their holidays.

Gordon Brown said:

'Immigration is not an issue for fringe parties nor a taboo subject - it is a question at the heart of our politics, a question about what it means to be British; about the values we hold dear and the responsibilities we expect of those coming into our country; about how we secure the skills we need to compete in the global economy; about how we preserve and strengthen our communities.'

It has been shown that immigration is good for the UK economy. Skilled workers are still needed in a number of occupations to deal with skills shortages. It should be noted that there is competition around the World for skilled workers. Any immigration system must make it possible for employers to attract the best available talent from around the World.


http://www.workpermit.com/news/2009-11-12/uk/uk-prime-minister-makes-major-speech-on-uk-immigration.htm

interesting!

We have all heard this before. Immigration is now the focal point of the upcoming elections.

hmmm, no mentin of how much money they make from illegal immigrants who pay more taxes than anyone,

He forgot to mention that one, more money in UK kitties due to immigrants

don't mind them they'll always politicise immigration to gain votes!! all their noise on PBS has achieved very little the problem in this country is that they like money toooooo much, hisss. they want immigrants money but they don't want to give anything to get this money from the immigrants

Labour know exactly what they are doing.

If these guys had their way, they'd leave the gates open to any and everyone.

thameamead:


hmmm, no mentin of how much money they make from illegal immigrants who pay more taxes than anyone,

Can you explain to me how illegal immigrants pay tax or pay more than anyone for that matter

@AngieFan
illegals work with fake or false NI''s. inland revenue knows which national insurance no's are real and fake. once they can't find or recognise the number on their system, they put them on emergency tax and write to them all the time to ask for their real no's, people placed on emergency tax pay more taxes,

according to inland revenue, they have over 750,000 unregconised NI's on their system and over £80M in unclaimed tax from those unrecognised NI's last yr, i do not have a link to this informatn but u can always goggle it or find more informatn - strangers into citizen's website,

please not all illegal immigrants are paying tax number one.

second (please i'm not refering to nigerians here as i have somalians and some eastern europeans in mind) a lot of british tax payers are getting fed up of paying for people both british and non-british sitting at home pumping out kids and getting benefits. i know this is not a nice comment to make and everyone's situation is different but come on now - we all complain about how much tax we all pay but after watching some ITV programme about people living on the breadline but they all had flat screen TV's and computers i thought to myself these people are not poor and then one idiot had the audacity to say the level of poverty on the estates was like a 3rd world country - i was like WTF - i don't know how many people in my village back home that have 42 inch LCD TVs and laptops,

anyway I think this government have really messed up the immigration system - i mean how the hell can someone be in a country illegally and still claim child benefit for their kids - that is just confusing.

anyway b4 someone starts labelling me a member of the BNP let me go from here.

but a note - some of these hospitals have bills of over the £1million from people who have come for treatment (from all over the world) and fled without paying - now when i can't get an appointment at my GP and i'm having to wait for a hosiptal appointment for something serious cos of costs I DO GET ANNOYED - but then again the NHS should manage their budgets a whole lot better than they do now.

It's high time the government sorted this out - they don't even know how many people are in the country illegally.

To those saying illegals pay tax, HOW MUCH tax do they even pay? Is it tax on making 8 pounds per hour ? How much does that amount to? Does that pay for the NHS and other services they sponge off the legal people working in the UK?

Labour screwed up big time - opened the gates wide and had no control, now they need to set things right or the BNP will gain more ground in labour's core vote.

The current high rates of migration are unsustainable - they've allowed far too many people in, and without counting people leaving, they have NO IDEA what proportion of the close to 2million visas issued yearly into the UK return to their countries.

While no major changes have been made, the border controls have been re-initiated and they will begin counting people in and out of the country. Till immigration is properly controlled, the legal immigrants within the country will continue to be given a hard time.

debosky:

It's high time the government sorted this out - they don't even know how many people are in the country illegally.

To those saying illegals pay tax, HOW MUCH tax do they even pay? Is it tax on making 8 pounds per hour ? How much does that amount to? Does that pay for the NHS and other services they sponge off the legal people working in the UK?

Labour screwed up big time - opened the gates wide and had no control, now they need to set things right or the BNP will gain more ground in labour's core vote.

The current high rates of migration are unsustainable - they've allowed far too many people in, and without counting people leaving, they have NO IDEA what proportion of the close to 2million visas issued yearly into the UK return to their countries.

While no major changes have been made, the border controls have been re-initiated and they will begin counting people in and out of the country. Till immigration is properly controlled, the legal immigrants within the country will continue to be given a hard time.

THANK YOU at least some one talking sense

UK immigration is in a mess yes we agree but each time this Labour government are making immigration "tougher" it does not affect endless asylum seekers from failed states like Somalia, Afganistan, Iraq or Zimbabwe but legal immigrants on tier 1, 2 or 4. This obviously make no sense how many of these legal migrants claim benefits?, they are not even entitled to it yet this stupid Labour government keep moving goalpost all the time against legal migrants. thank God for ppl like HSMP forum who instituted a legal action against them (Home Office) a lot of ppl who migrated legally could have end up being deported while scumbags from Somalia, Zimbabwe, Afganistan and some God forsaken places are handed exceptional leave to remain like sweets, these same set of ppl are the ones who has got NOTHING to offer UK they claim benefits on virtually everything yet BNP sympathizers on Daily mail will be ranting the word IMMIGRANTS are stealing our jobs when their govt should rather send these bogus asylum seekers back to where they belong, very sickening

thameamead:


@AngieFan
illegals work with fake or false NI''s. inland revenue knows which national insurance no's are real and fake. once they can't find or recognise the number on their system, they put them on emergency tax and write to them all the time to ask for their real no's, people placed on emergency tax pay more taxes,

according to inland revenue, they have over 750,000 unregconised NI's on their system and over £80M in unclaimed tax from those unrecognised NI's last yr, i do not have a link to this informatn but u can always goggle it or find more informatn - strangers into citizen's website,

You are aware that one has to earn a certain amount before they start paying tax aren't you? Most illegal immigrants probably have several different jobs under different IDs which more often than not fall under the threshold of about £5000 a year and so they don't pay tax. Your claim that they pay more tax than anyone is incorrect.

If I were in charge I would seek out those illegal parasites and have them on the first boat leaving the British shores. I see no reason why they should get an easy ride when they have broken the law.

tunnytox:

UK immigration is in a mess yes we agree but each time this Labour government are making immigration "tougher"[b] it does not affect endless asylum seekers from failed states like Somalia, Afganistan, Iraq or Zimbabwe [/b]but legal immigrants on tier 1, 2 or 4. This obviously make no sense how many of these legal migrants claim benefits?, they are not even entitled to it yet this stupid Labour government keep moving goalpost all the time against legal migrants. thank God for ppl like HSMP forum who instituted a legal action against them (Home Office) a lot of ppl who migrated legally could have end up being deported while scumbags from Somalia, Zimbabwe, Afganistan and some God forsaken places are handed exceptional leave to remain like sweets, these same set of ppl are the ones who has got NOTHING to offer UK they claim benefits on virtually everything yet BNP sympathizers on Daily mail will be ranting the word IMMIGRANTS are stealing our jobs when their govt should rather send these bogus asylum seekers back to where they belong, very sickening

Erm. . .this is not true - Labour is increasing the rate of processing asylum seekers and is tightening illegal immigration through checks at Calais and at Heathrow, turning back illegals at a very high rate.

It is inevitable that the goal posts will move a bit as it gets tougher in the British economy - the key is ensuring that things are not made unduly difficult for legal immigrants.

Legal immigrants ARE a part of the problem unfortunately due to the nefarious practices of certain companies especially Indian companies, who brought nearly 30,000 people to the UK to work in IT as part of intra-company transfers in one year ALONE, virtually driving thousands of Brits out of a job only to be replaced by much cheaper imports. This is not including the nearly 4bn being removed from the UK economy annualy through remittances.

The people you call 'scumbags' are only able to cheat the system because the govt. has left loopholes - the govt. needs to tighten up to prevent them from being utilised, and that is a true failure of the government.

Note that barely 10% of immigration is from asylum seekers, most of it comes from 'legal immigrants' and it is causing a significant impact - you cannot add 200,000 people annually to the UK and expect no negative impact.

debosky:

Erm. . .this is not true - Labour is increasing the rate of processing asylum seekers and is tightening illegal immigration through checks at Calais and at Heathrow, turning back illegals at a very high rate.

It is inevitable that the goal posts will move a bit as it gets tougher in the British economy - the key is ensuring that things are not made unduly difficult for legal immigrants.

Legal immigrants ARE a part of the problem unfortunately due to the nefarious practices of certain companies especially Indian companies, who brought nearly 30,000 people to the UK to work in IT as part of intra-company transfers in one year ALONE, virtually driving thousands of Brits out of a job only to be replaced by much cheaper imports. This is not including the nearly 4bn being removed from the UK economy annualy through remittances.

The people you call 'scumbags' are only able to cheat the system because the govt. has left loopholes - the govt. needs to tighten up to prevent them from being utilised, and that is a true failure of the government.

Note that barely 10% of immigration is from asylum seekers, most of it comes from 'legal immigrants' and it is causing a significant impact - you cannot add 200,000 people annually to the UK and expect no negative impact.

firstly moving a goal post in the middle of the match could not be acceptable in any situation because it will not only be illegal it could be morally wrong. When the HSMP rule was changed in Dec 2006 it affected nearly 40,000 migrants who came in based on a particular set of rules which the Home Office feel they can alter with reckless abandon, these set of ppl were eventually justified by the high court ruling of April 2008.

secondly legal migrants ARE not part of the problems, for every legislations there are loopholes, using these loopholes to your own advantage is NOT illegal but being smart if Indians decided to use these loopholes to their own advantage who is to blame?

Thirdly, I will like to get source for your statistical claims that only 10% of immigration is from asylum otherwise this claim hold no water as far as I'm concerned. In Manchester for example every part of moss side up to Fallowfield now have more somalis than any other foreign nationals this was never the case years ago.

Finally give me 200,000 legal migrants who play by the rule and contribute briliantly well to the economy anyday rather than 20,000 asylum seekers with 6 children each not ready to work and have very little or no skills and can barely communicate in English, each year canada takes in up to 200,000 migrants most of whom are skilled migrants so this shows that managed migration works well for any country that is very selective of which type of migrants they accept.

tunnytox:

firstly moving a goal post in the middle of the match could not be acceptable in any situation because it will not only be illegal it could be morally wrong. When the HSMP rule was changed in Dec 2006 it affected nearly 40,000 migrants who came in based on a particular set of rules which the Home Office feel they can alter with reckless abandon, these set of ppl were eventually justified by the high court ruling of April 2008.

I am not in support of changing rules 'mid match' as it were, but it will happen and we need to be aware of it.

secondly legal migrants ARE not part of the problems, for every legislations there are loopholes, using these loopholes to your own advantage is NOT illegal but being smart if Indians decided to use these loopholes to their own advantage who is to blame?

It is abuse of the system if instead of benefiting the UK economy it drives out Brits from employment instead of filling skill shortages as envisaged. It is such abuse that leads to the moving goalposts that you alluded to above. By being 'smart' as you say, it creates enmity due to denial of opportunity to Brits due to these sharp practices, which inevitably lead to the tightening of the regulations.

Thirdly, I will like to get source for your statistical claims that only 10% of immigration is from asylum otherwise this claim hold no water as far as I'm concerned. In Manchester for example every part of moss side up to Fallowfield now have more somalis than any other foreign nationals this was never the case years ago.

Gladly:

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitecontent/newsarticles/2009/august/immigration-asylum-stats-release?area=Controllingmigration

Barely 6,000 asylum claims are made per quarter, leading to about 24,000 per year, while net migration into the UK is about 120,000.

Asylum seekers do cause issues and I am not denying that, especially in low income communities where they take up a sizeable portion of scarce social housing and other services.

Finally give me 200,000 legal migrants who play by the rule and contribute briliantly well to the economy anyday rather than 20,000 asylum seekers with 6 children each not ready to work and have very little or no skills and can barely communicate in English, each year canada takes in up to 200,000 migrants most of whom are skilled migrants so this shows that managed migration works well for any country that is very selective of which type of migrants they accept.

The 200,000 legal migrants also bring in their own family members, many of whom do not work and often claim 'benefits', be it in the form of actual pay outs from the government or through using the NHS, schools and other community facilities.

In addition, they rapidly change the social make up of communities, which the locals find uncomfortable, not because they are racist, but because since 1997, the rate of increase has been TOO FAST. Something needs to be done to reduce the influx to manageable levels.

Canada's case is completely different and I can say so from experience - their population is merely 30m, while they are seeking to actively INCREASE the population by 1% annually. In addition, they have a massive land mass more than 10 times the size of the UK and are entirely made up of immigrants save for the First Nations/ Indians.

This is completely at variance with an OVERCROWDED United Kingdom with much smaller landmass and a population of 61m, with no intent to INCREASE the population through immigration. The dynamics of Canada are completely at odds with those of the UK.

Please note those salient differences.

@debosky
I must say your write up is brilliant but definitely we'll always have different opinions on several issues;
firstly, statistically you cannot compare the level of asylum claims which is around 24,000 with net migration because there's very little correlation betwen them. the best figures to compare that with will be the number of visas issued to tier 1 and tier 2 migrants who will ultimately SETTLED in the UK. Net migration figure usually consists of student visas, working holiday makers and other short term visas for people who ultimately will leave or come back to the UK at some point.

secondly, playing smart has always apply to several aspects of life which includes immigration, in taxation for instance while tax evasion is a criminal offence tax avoidance which involves using tax loopholes to avoid tax is legal. If govt is disatisfied with the fact that too many ppl are using these loopholes thay are supposed to tightened it and make it more difficult but ensure they are fair by NOT implenting new rules retrospectively. ultimately there's nothing bad in 'tightening' immigration but to ensure the tightening mechanisim achieve the desired results rather than using it to score political points

let me say emphatically that i have nothing against the asylum seekers BUT all the popularity being gained by the BNP today are due to them, yes legal migrants too take some benefits like the NHS but at least they are paying National insurance and MOST of the earn reasonably high incomes which will ultimately boost the economy.
I have met some few asylum seekers who keep having children because they know that govt will pay for their childminding exps e.tc. they are the set of migrants who will in most cases rely on Housing benefits, council tax benefits and income support NOT the legal migrants on either tier 1 or tier 2.

On your claim that these set of ppl are taking British jobs, i want to say that this simply is not the case most British jobs which are claimed to have been taken by migrants are actaully taken by cheap eu workers from Poland and other east european countries not tier 1 or 2 migrants most of whom already had job offers. Also, most of these cries about British jobs being taken are from some set of Bristish ppl who simply made themselves uncompetitive either by refusing to acquire new skills or fail to move with current trends in this competitive economy. The fact remains that whether you are British or not its your duty to make yourself competitive and be attractive to employers

What i really don't understand is why someone from Zimbabwe, Somalia or Afganistan could not make their asylum case in nearer countries but choosed the UK its because the Uk govt are SOFT yes SOFT on asylum seekers but always  pick on soft targets like legal migrants to achieve polital targets. In most cases a large percentage of these so called asylum seekers are bogus anyway because i cannot understand someone who is running away from war in Congo, somalia or Iraq have money to pay ppl traffickers let alone get a passport? a lot of them has been in europe for a long term without no papers are now using the asylum claims

Finally on your statement that Canada has more land mass than the UK, yes you may be right but how many of these land space are habitable? at the end the fact remains that a well planned and adequately implemented immigration policies is good for any economy but where failure is due to politicians fault (like UK) it is wrong to vent their anger on the wrong set of ppl.

responses need to be kept brief and straight to the point. one catches a migrain simply by staring at some write ups here.

@ tunnytox

I accept the figures aren't foolproof, but nevertheless, those are the current figures as supplied by the ukba and must be taken as authoritative. Since it is difficult to determine who has 'ultimately settled' and who remains, some guess must be made in this regard. Note that this is an ANNUAL number, meaning even if some leave, another set replace them, meaning on average, the UK population is rising by that net migration figure. In any case, most analysts feel illegal immigration is well under control now.

I agree fully that people can use the system to their advantage, but even at that when situations get desperate, the government will get desperate as well and will also 'bend' rules as much as it can to ensure it achieves it's goals of tightening immigration.


Granted most people on tier 1 and tier 2 are contributing, but some get bogus job offers, get a visa and enter the country and disappear into the system, some bring over family members who then take on jobs that are NOT restricted, and this can possibly take away jobs from Brits. The sheer number is overwhelming.

In addition, you cannot add the population of Birmingham every 5 years and it will not cause pressures on housing, GPs, schools and the like - the problem is not only about 'benefits' but the adequacy of social services.


It's not that simple to say the Brits are unskilled - until recently employers in the UK can bring in agency workers to do the same job as full employees on much lower pay, which immigrants are willing to collect. If someone else can do the same job as you for 30% less pay, who will the employer take? This is one example of how immigration potentially undercuts wages of British people. If a job is given to someone outside the EU, even without advertising the job in the UK, how is that fair? That is one of the things being corrected.


I think the UK being 'soft' is a misconception - there are FAR MORE illegals in France, Spain and Italy than in the UK and will always be since they are closer and more accessible by lnd. The perception that the UK is soft is not true - that is an impression created by politicians to have one over their opponents. Number of applications have dropped since peaking in 2002, and the government is processing them faster than ever.


Again, there isn't much comparison - a country that is sparsely populated and NEEDS people is completely different from the UK that is bordering on being overpopulated. UK needs to manage immigration, but at much lower levels than have occurred in the past 10 years. Whether legal or illegal, the population's perception is important and it is inevitable that politicians will respond to that perception.