salvation101:
Jesus is God. Co equal, co eternal with the Father.. When God said in the beginning, "let us make man in our image and after our likeness" notice the plurality, who was He speaking with?

Isaiah 6:8 Also I heard the voice of the Lord, saying, Whom shall I send, and who will go for us? Then said I, Here am I; send me.
The ''us'' who is it referring to? That the individual is among those address as ''us'' made him God? Please do well to read this thread from 0-16 it will do you a lot of good. Many of the scriptures you are citing have been discussed over and over again.

Something for you to ponder Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
Isolate the word ''God'', Lord and ''Christ''
God(Jehovah) made the other(Jesus) Lord. That Jehovah made use of the word ''us'' is it restricted to Jesus alone? Were the angels not created already before God said this? Does this make the angels too God?

achorladey:

Isaiah 6:8 Also I heard the voice of the Lord, saying, Whom shall I send, and who will go for us? Then said I, Here am I; send me.
The ''us'' who is it referring to? That the individual is among those address as ''us'' made him God? Please do well to read this thread from 0-16 it will do you a lot of good. Many of the scriptures you are citing have been discussed over and over again.

Something for you to ponder Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
Isolate the word ''God'', Lord and ''Christ''
God(Jehovah) made the other(Jesus) Lord. That Jehovah made use of the word ''us'' is it restricted to Jesus alone? Were the angels not created already before God said this? Does this make the angels too God?

the us there refers to the Godhead.. The father, son and Holy Spirit...
God said let us make man in our image.. Now in whose image was man made? That should answer ur question to who the "us" are

I love it when we contextualize. Now, what is the context of Genesis 1:2 and what is the context of John 20:17? 1 Corinthians 8:6; 1 Timothy 2:5; 1 Peter 1:3. Kindly explain the contexts of all these verses to me.

salvation101:
correct. But not Jesus alone cos in Gen 1:2 we could see that the Spirit of God was also involved in creation..
Now back to ur initial questions, Jesus didn't lie but probably u misunderstood him.. The book was written by John but u can also see that he already started the book by declaring Jesus (the word) as God.. Jesus name is Emmanuel (God with us)..

Paul saying God is the Head of Christ should also not be taken out of context.. He also likened Christ as the head of the church.. The church was also referred to as the body of Christ, this simply means Jesus and the His church is one.

what is the context of the Godhead?

salvation101:
the us there refers to the Godhead.. The father, son and Holy Spirit...
God said let us make man in our image.. Now in whose image was man made? That should answer ur question to who the "us" are

salvation101:
the us there refers to the Godhead.. The father, son and Holy Spirit...
God said let us make man in our image.. Now in whose image was man made? That should answer ur question to who the "us" are

In whose image were the angels made? Answer the remaining question questions relating to that same post.

[quote author=lovingJehovah post=63068408] The Bible verse that you read said that it was Jesus himself who made the statement that before Abraham he had been living. It wasn't "they" who were right, because "they" did not make that statement. Therefore, Jesus had no reason to correct someone else for a point that he himself made.
You, in turn, have become one of Jesus blasphemers by your statement above. Why didn't you read that chapter before lying against Jesus? John 10:34-36 clearly details Jesus explanation of verse 31 and he corrected their thoughts. Jesus clearly said the reason why they accused him verse 36 "...Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, ‘I am God’s Son’?"
But, here you are telling the whole world a different story.

Jesus said he and his Father are one and the Jews took up stone to stone him. Jesus didnt rebuke them because they were right. Jesus did not debunk the statement he only reinforce it by saying he is the Son of God. more like saying the son of God and God are one.

Why?
You should do proper research concerning what you defend. Now, here is a brief one. In a bid to keep control of his religiously divided empire, the hellenistic emperor of Rome, Constantine, who splurged on bacchanal, ecstatic orgies and following the line of his predecessors in killing true Christians that defiantly refuse to embrace paganism, arranged for a gathering called the Council of Nicaea in 325 CE, and that was the birth of the trinity doctrine in Christianity. Who were the attendees? Pagans! Wolves in sheep clothing, Pharisees etc. No true Christian would ever accept an invitation of that sort, and do you know why? The answer is in 2 Corinthians 6:14 Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness?.
Jesus met Constantine's progenitor and told him the words in John 18:37 "... Everyone on the side of truth listens to me.” Would a true Christian be yoked in a gathering with groups of pagans who persecuted and killed them to listen and negotiate his belief? No! Jesus referred to the Romans as the disgusting thing Matthew 24:15. You would not expect a Pagan to legalize true Christianity for you, would you? Did you know Jesus died in 33 CE while apostle John completed his last book of the Bible around 96 CE? He possible died sometime afterwards. Did you know the council of Nicaea in 325 was approximately three generations after the last apostle died ( 229 years)? Did you know that after Constantine legalized Christianity in Rome, true Christians continued to be persecuted because their beliefs didn't agree with the resolution of the Council of Nicaea in 325 CE?. Why would persecution continue even after then? The answer is the adjective "true". True Christians never accepted or dared to blend false doctrines into their faith even if it would cost them comfort or even their own lives. Colossians 2:8 See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the elemental spiritual forces of this world rather than on Christ.

I didnt ask for these, just show me example of pagan trinity simple

How does this explain 3 in one God? Is there a mention of "God' in this verse? No! What is the name of the holy spirit in which it says to baptise? Referring to Acts 1:5 could water be synonymous with the holy spirit? What is the difference between the Holy Spirit and the holy ghost (spirit and ghost)? How can you reconcile that verse to Jesus teachings in John 17:3 and Luke 11:13?
Jesus clearly told us who his father is and who he is as the son. About the holy spirit, he never taught that it is a God, but a good gift. It is God's active force and not God itself. It has never been a person but a force with which Jehovah accomplishes. Acts 1:8; 2 Peter 1:20, 21; Galatians 5:22, 23; Luke 1:35; Micah 3:8

The Bible provides many ways to help us understand that the Holy Spirit is truly a person—that is, He is a personal being, rather than an impersonal thing. First, every pronoun used in reference to the Spirit is “he” not “it.” The original Greek language of the New Testament is explicit in confirming the person of the Holy Spirit. The word for “Spirit” (pneuma) is neuter and would naturally take neuter pronouns to have grammatical agreement. Yet, in many cases, masculine pronouns are found (e.g., John 15:26; 16:13-14). Grammatically, there is no other way to understand the pronouns of the New Testament related to the Holy Spirit—He is referred to as a “He,” as a person.

Matthew 28:19 teaches us to baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. This is a collective reference to one Triune God. Also, we are not to grieve the Holy Spirit (Ephesians 4:30). The Spirit can be sinned against (Isaiah 63:10) and lied to (Acts 5:3). We are to obey Him (Acts 10:19–21) and honor Him (Psalm 51:11).

The personhood of the Holy Spirit is also affirmed by His many works. He was personally involved in creation (Genesis 1:2), empowers God’s people (Zechariah 4:6), guides (Romans 8:14), comforts (John 14:26), convicts (John 16:, teaches (John 16:13), restrains sin (Isaiah 59:19), and gives commands (Acts 8:29). Each of these works requires the involvement of a person rather than a mere force, thing, or idea.

The Holy Spirit’s attributes also point to His personality. The Holy Spirit has life (Romans 8:2), has a will (1 Corinthians 12:11), is omniscient (1 Corinthians 2:10–11), is eternal (Hebrews 9:14), and is omnipresent (Psalm 139:7). A mere force could not possess all of these attributes, but the Holy Spirit does.

And the personhood of the Holy Spirit is affirmed by His role as the third Person of the Godhead. Only a being who is equal to God (Matthew 28:19) and possesses the attributes of omniscience, omnipresence, and eternality could be defined as God.

In Acts 5:3–4, Peter referred to the Holy Spirit as God, stating, “Ananias, how is it that Satan has so filled your heart that you have lied to the Holy Spirit and have kept for yourself some of the money you received for the land? Didn’t it belong to you before it was sold? And after it was sold, wasn’t the money at your disposal? What made you think of doing such a thing? You have not lied just to human beings but to God.” Paul likewise referred to the Holy Spirit as God in 2 Corinthians 3:17–18, stating, “Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. And we all, who with unveiled faces contemplate the Lord’s glory, are being transformed into his image with ever-increasing glory, which comes from the Lord, who is the Spirit.”

The Holy Spirit is a person, as Scripture makes clear. As such, He is to be revered as God and serves in perfect unity with Father and Son to lead us in our spiritual lives.

How about Jesus as a spirit? When he said the words in your famous Bible verse "I and the father are one" was he a spirit or a man? How do you explain Revelation 1:1 The revelation from Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants what must soon take place...? Remember Jesus was no longer a man at the time this book was written. he was already in heaven as a spirit at Jehovah's right hand.
The husband is a human and so is the wife. Jehovah is a spirit and so is his son, Jesus.
We do not put Jesus down. He is our king and saviour. As he told us in John 17:3, there is ONE TRUE GOD and he is the son of that one. He said it! We are grateful to the father for sending us his beloved son to save us from the wrath of sin and death. No one is putting him down but you. Lying against him and believing that you are exonerating him is insidious. You may think that you mean well, but you have deviated from the course of true worship.

you cleverly avoided the fact.
Jesus is not just a Spirit he is God as the father.


New International Version
The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.


King James 2000 Bible
Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

American Standard Version
who being the effulgence of his glory, and the very image of his substance, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had made purification of sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;


New World Translation
He is the reflection of God’s glory+ and the exact representation of his very being,+ and he sustains all things by the word of his power. And after he had made a purification for our sins


these verses shows that the son is the exact replica of the Father. meaning all that the Father is, Jesus is also.

if the Father is Almighty, then the Son is Almighty.
if the Father wasnt created then the son wasnt created.
it means Jesus is 100% what the Father is.

is this possible if Jesus wasnt God himself?

cause if Jesus is not 100% like the father then you cant say he is God express image or exact image.

Tell the truth about the word of God just as it is written. You cannot claim to love someone by lying against him or making him a liar. Calling Jesus God is committing the same blasphemy that the Pharisees committed that finally led to his death. So, stop attempting to kill Jesus for a second time by blaspheming. Just tell the truth written in the Bible and not making Jesus a liar. Here are his words in John 17:3; John 5:30; John 14:28; John 10:29; John 20:17.
So are Jesus and the father spirits. They are both spirits as you and your father are humans.
Did you know that your heresy is exposed in the emboldened above? Where in the Bible is it recorded that he was made lower than God? I really want to see it.
Hebrews 2:9 But we see Jesus who was made...
No offence intended, Let me ask you, do you know what a passive verb is?

someone who was made lower than Angels is not lower than God? you are not making sense


passive verb are verb used to express passed actions.

Jesus is still a Man in heaven

Jesus is a man
by Matt Slick

One of the lesser-known biblical doctrines concerns Jesus as a man right now. Many do not know that right now in heaven Jesus is a man though in a glorified body. Some object to this and cite various reasons (answered at the end of this paper) for denying His present humanity. They are in error. Following is a biblical demonstration that Jesus is still both divine and human in nature:

It is biblically correct to say that Jesus is a man right now in heaven--though a glorified man . But, it would be wrong to say He was only a man. He is both divine and human in nature at the same time (Col. 2:9); He is both God and man right now.

Furthermore, Jesus' humanity now is important for two reasons. First, this is what the Bible teaches. Second, as a man, Jesus is a priest forever after the order of Melchizedek. As a priest He forever intercedes for us.

"where Jesus has entered as a forerunner for us, having become a high priest forever according to the order of Melchizedek." (Heb. 6:20).
"Hence, also, He is able to save forever those who draw near to God through Him, since He always lives to make intercession for them." (Heb. 7:25).
In order to be a priest, Jesus has to be a man. A spirit cannot be a priest after the order of Melchizedek; and if Jesus is not a man now, He could not hold His priesthood, and He could not be forever interceding for us. Therefore, to deny Jesus' present humanity is to deny His priesthood and His intercession on our behalf. Without His intercession, we are lost.

Jesus died
There is no dispute that Jesus died on the cross--except for some non-Christian religions and various atheistic groups who deny the biblical record. Nevertheless, the scriptures teach us that Jesus died.
"For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus." (1 Thess. 4:14).
Jesus rose from the dead physically
The bible teaches us that Jesus rose from the dead. Unfortunately, some Christians are not aware that Jesus actually rose from the dead in the same body in which He died though it was a glorified body. We see that Jesus prophesied the resurrection of His physical body in John 2:19-21 and fulfilled this in other verses:
"Jesus answered and said to them, "Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up." 20 The Jews therefore said, "It took forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?" 21 But He was speaking of the temple of His body." (John 2:19-21).
"See My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself; touch Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have." (Luke 24:39).
"When therefore it was evening, on that day, the first day of the week, and when the doors were shut where the disciples were, for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood in their midst, and said to them, "Peace be with you." 20 And when He had said this, He showed them both His hands and His side. The disciples therefore rejoiced when they saw the Lord." (John 20:19-20).
"Then He *said to Thomas, "Reach here your finger, and see My hands; and reach here your hand, and put it into My side; and be not unbelieving, but believing." (John 20:27).
"and if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is vain, your faith also is vain." (1 Cor. 15:14).
Merely asserting that Jesus rose is not enough. It must be stated that Jesus rose physically lest the very words of Christ be denied.
After Jesus' crucifixion and resurrection
Jesus appeared to various people to demonstrate that He had risen physically. In these verses we see that Jesus said He would raise the temple of His body. This He did, and the body He rose in was the same one He died in since it retained the physical wounds of His crucifixion--He still had holes in His hands and side!
I would like to note here that if anyone denies the resurrection of Christ, his faith is in vain; and he is not a true Christian. It is not enough to say that Jesus rose. You must acknowledge that He rose physically. A "spirit" resurrection is not a resurrection of the body; and without the resurrection of the body of Christ, death has not been conquered, and our faith would be in vain.
Jesus' resurrected body was a glorified body
Jesus rose from the dead physically in the same body in which He died. But, what kind of a body was this physical body in which He rose? Was it subject to death again? Would it grow tired or grow old? The Bible tells us about the resurrected body of which all Christians will receive in the future.
"But someone will say, "How are the dead raised? And with what kind of body do they come? . . . 40 There are also heavenly bodies and earthly bodies, but the glory of the heavenly is one, and the glory of the earthly is another. 41 There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars; for star differs from star in glory. 42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown a perishable body, it is raised an imperishable body; 43 it is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory; it is sown in weakness, it is raised in power; 44 it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body. 45 So also it is written, "The first man, Adam, became a living soul." The last Adam became a life-giving spirit. 46 However, the spiritual is not first, but the natural; then the spiritual. 47 The first man is from the earth, earthly; the second man is from heaven. 48 As is the earthly, so also are those who are earthly; and as is the heavenly, so also are those who are heavenly. 49 And just as we have borne the image of the earthly, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly." (1 Cor. 15:35, 40-49).
These verses tell us that something happens to the body that is raised from the dead. Notice that verse 44 says that "it is sown a natural body. It is raised a spiritual body." The same body that is sown (dies) is raised. The natural body is the body with which we are born. The natural body dies and is raised from the dead. But, when it is raised, it is changed into a spiritual body. The resurrected body is different from the natural body in its abilities and qualities as Jesus demonstrated; however, and this is vitally important, it is the same body as before--only "improved," "glorified," "spiritualized," etc. We see this in the fact that Jesus retained the wounds of His crucifixion as evidenced by the holes in His hands and side (John 20:27), yet He was able to simply appear in a room with the disciples without entering through the door (John 20:19-20). He was raised in the same body He died in though it had been glorified.
Jesus is a man in a glorified body.
We have already seen that Jesus was raised from the dead in the same body in which He died, but that body is a resurrected body. However, some people believe that at Jesus' ascension, He was somehow changed, and His physical body was no longer needed. But, this is not what the Bible teaches. There is no place where it states that Jesus stopped being a man. If anything, the New Testament says He is still a man.
"For in Him all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form," (Col. 2:9).
"For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus." (1 Tim. 2:5).
We see here that Jesus is called a man. Like Col. 2:9 above, this verse uses the present tense ("is". It clearly states that Jesus is a man.
"And when I saw Him, I fell at His feet as a dead man. And He laid His right hand upon me, saying, “Do not be afraid; I am the first and the last, 18 and the living One; and I was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore, and I have the keys of death and of Hades." (Rev. 1:17-18).
Notice that in Col. 2:9 it speaks in the present tense ("dwells". Colossians was written well after Jesus' ascension into heaven, yet Paul tells us that Jesus is in bodily form. What body would that be? Why, it would be the same body in which He was raised. To clarify that Jesus is a man, read the next verse. In Rev. 1:17-18, Jesus is in heaven, and John the Apostle falls at Jesus' feet; and Jesus laid His right hand on him. Clearly, from these verses we can see that Jesus is in bodily form as a man.
Objections Answered
Flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God. Some argue that the Bible says that flesh and blood cannot go to heaven as is stated in 1 Cor. 15:50, "Now I say this, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable."
The term "flesh and blood" is a phrase used to designate the natural state even the carnal state of man.
"And Jesus answered and said to him, "Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven." (Matt. 16:17).
"to reveal His Son in me, that I might preach Him among the Gentiles, I did not immediately consult with flesh and blood," (Gal. 1:16).
"For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places." (Eph. 6:12).
"Since then the children share in flesh and blood, He Himself likewise also partook of the same, that through death He might render powerless him who had the power of death, that is, the devil," (Heb. 2:14).
After the resurrection, Jesus said, "See My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself; touch Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have." (Luke 24:39). Jesus specifically stated that He had flesh and bones--not flesh and blood. This may seem like a word game, but it is not. Every word is inspired in the Bible, and Jesus chose His words for a reason. Remember, Jesus' blood was drained out of His body on the cross. It is His shed blood that cleanses us of our sins: "but if we walk in the light as He Himself is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin." (1 John 1:7). Jesus was the sacrifice, and His blood cleanses us. Therefore, flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God, but flesh and bones can.
The last Adam became a life-giving spirit. 1 Cor. 15:45 says, "The first man, Adam, became a living soul. The last Adam became a life-giving spirit." This verse is not saying that Jesus is without a body, but that He is a life-giving spirit. That is, as the last Adam, He is the one who gives life to people (John 10:27-28). Furthermore, it is designating that Jesus' resurrected body is equipped to be in both the physical realm and the spiritual.

lovingJehovah:
There has never been a dispute about it. The clarification is what Jesus made at John 17:3 that there is an ONLY TRUE GOD". The only one referred to as ALmighty God.
Let me ask you, does Jesus have a God?

So how many 'mighty God' do you have

lovingJehovah:
I love it when we contextualize. Now, what is the context of Genesis 1:2 and what is the context of John 20:17? 1 Corinthians 8:6; 1 Timothy 2:5; 1 Peter 1:3. Kindly explain the contexts of all these verses to me.

In Genesis 1:2, it was mentioned that the Spirit of God (or Holy Spirit) was moving on the face of the waters before God then said "let there be light" in d next verse..
To understand john 20:17, u av to read philipians 2 where it was clearly spelled out that Jesus left his glory above to put on the flesh of man. He had an equal glory with God wch he willingly left for the purpose to die for humanity. His glory was restored after he Resurrected and ascended.. He took back his Godship.. He is God that became man for just about 33 years cos he has been from the beginning.
1cor 8:6 here Paul put God and Jesus on the same level by saying all things came from God the Father through Jesus. That is just the order within the Godhead, Jesus also referred to himself as the door and no one can come to the father except through him. It in no way reduces his Godship, simply shows that there is order within the God head.

1tim2:5 is saying exactly the same thing 1cor 8:6..Jesus is from everlasting.. Paul here referred to him as a man dis buttresses the fact that he had to become a man to mediate between God and man. He wasn't a man at the beginning, He is usually referred to as the Son of God but eventually gave up his glory to become the Son of man. God in this context as used by paul referred to the father

1peter 1:2 shows the crystal clear relationship between the God head in the work of man's redemption.. It was the father that chose, the spirit sanctified and Jesus qualifies through his blood

lovingJehovah:
would you be like to hear the Bible's viewpoint? How about John 20:17 when Jesus himself says that he has a God? Would you call Jesus a liar?

1 Corinthians 11:3 Says that God is the head of Jesus. Would you define the head as co-equal? Is your head co-equal with your body?

headship does not denote superiority of nature

lovingJehovah:
We have not come to combat 3 yet. Why are you sounding so aggressive? You should be able to defend what you put out in a civilised manner, not by aggression.

""You should be able to defend what you put out in a civilised manner, not by aggression""

There's nothing to defend.

All u need is to start reading.

achorladey:

In whose image were the angels made? Answer the remaining question questions relating to that same post.

where is it written that Angels were created in God's image?

achorladey:

In whose image were the angels made? Answer the remaining question questions relating to that same post.

there is no record in scriptures as to how the angels were made but we know the angels were created to be servants.. The Bible calls them ministering spirits..
Adam was created to rule not serve. He was given dominion

achorladey:

The devine light that Jesus is not the son of God? Do you think calling Jesus son of God constitute part of the corruption contained in the Bible. I am tempted to ask who is Adam in relation to God? Is it right to view individuals and those that have worked and walked with God the way God sees them? Do you feel Christians demean God by saying he has a son?

God cannot create a son for himsef nah

PrecisionFx:



God cannot create a son for himsef nah

Says PrecisionFX bah? I know you can hold the hand of your own God back, not that of mine.

salvation101:
there is no record in scriptures as to how the angels were made but we know the angels were created to be servants.. The Bible calls them ministering spirits..
Adam was created to rule not serve. He was given dominion

The same angels were called sons of God abi? Are you not a ministering servant just like the angels? The image described by various Bible writers about the angels depict what image they carry?

harbjar:
..i am forced to accept your perception though i know 99.9% of xtains dont see that word "begets" as break out from
But over and above that So why does God need a son....

God did not need a Son, He needed a perfect sacrifice because without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sin. So He came down as a man (Jesus, also the Son) who was without sin who died, was buried, presented His blood in heaven and resurrected. Thereby reconciling God and man. God did not need a son but He needed a sacrifice in order to have many children.

joshnes:
God did not need a Son, He needed a perfect sacrifice because without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sin. So He came down as a man (Jesus, also the Son) who was without sin who died, was buried, presented His blood in heaven and resurrected. Thereby reconciling God and man. God did not need a son but He needed a sacrifice in order to have many children.

I don't think you need to explain that God does not need a son to harbjar, the simple explanation of God creating things is summarised in Revelation 4:11 Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure(will) they are and were created.
Harbjar believes Allah has purpose of doing things, he should not be asking does Allah need a son. If Allah creates something and calls it a son will you change it and insist that Allah can never have a son.

achorladey:

Says PrecisionFX bah? I know you can hold the hand of your own God back, not that of mine.

.

Speak English Sir.

achorladey:

I don't think you need to explain that God does not need a son to harbjar, the simple explanation of God creating things is summarised in Revelation 4:11 Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure(will) they are and were created.
Harbjar believes Allah has purpose of doing things, he should not be asking does Allah need a son. If Allah creates something and calls it a son will you change it and insist that Allah can never have a son.

haha, let me see where we will get to with harbjar first. By the way wonderful answer.

achorladey:

Isaiah 6:8 Also I heard the voice of the Lord, saying, Whom shall I send, and who will go for us? Then said I, Here am I; send me.
The ''us'' who is it referring to? That the individual is among those address as ''us'' made him God? Please do well to read this thread from 0-16 it will do you a lot of good. Many of the scriptures you are citing have been discussed over and over again.

Something for you to ponder Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
Isolate the word ''God'', Lord and ''Christ''
God(Jehovah) made the other(Jesus) Lord. That Jehovah made use of the word ''us'' is it restricted to Jesus alone? Were the angels not created already before God said this? Does this make the angels too God?

Jesus never said 'here am i, choose me.

This Jesus is God or not is getting borderline funny, you will hear "Jesus is God but He is not the Almighty God". How many "Gods" are there? 1Tim 3:16. There is one God. He is Jehovah, Jesus, Yahweh and all.

In the beginning was the word (Jesus ), and the word (jesus)was with God ( yahweh the father) , and the word (jesus) was God (he shared in the kingship and Glory of God as a son, clarifies he is not an angel ).
Jesus said I go to the father because he is greater than me.
Jesus prayed to the father.
Jesus was the raised up from the dead by the father.
Jesus sits at the right hand of the father.
Hope this clarify it all. That is scriptural interpretation not theological extrapolations .

achorladey:

The same angels were called sons of God abi? Are you not a ministering servant just like the angels? The image described by various Bible writers about the angels depict what image they carry?

Angels are called ministering Spirits not Ministering Servants Angels are called sons of God not begotten sons.

joshnes:
God did not need a Son, He needed a perfect sacrifice because without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sin. So He came down as a man (Jesus, also the Son) who was without sin who died, was buried, presented His blood in heaven and resurrected. Thereby reconciling God and man. God did not need a son but He needed a sacrifice in order to have many children.

You see this idea of human sacrifice before God can forgive is the most ridiculous thing ever to have existed in a religious doctrine... Unfortunately its the foundation of Christianity itself...
So you mean the creator of the universe needs a blood of human to be shed before he could forgive the sins of humans..
Which father kills his Son to forgive the sins of those who offended him... Its illogical in every Angle
This doctrines never existed in the old Testament, jesus didn't even preach it too....
That was the soul idea of the prodigal son parable he preached which you know very well..
A son misbehaved (sin) and when he realized his mistake and went back and his Father was glad to receive him... No penalty was paid, nothing.. Just forgiveness.. Thats God... No need for a human blood to be forgiven, Jesus himself shared this as a lesson to you but nah!! you guys re quick to leave his teachings but follow paul..
Then you claim to follow Jesus Christ but in turn its Paul who never met jesus that u re following ....
I dare you to quote me a verse in a Old Testament that supports this idea of original sin and human death neeeded for forgiveness or where jesus himself preached that...
M sure you will end up quoting paul here not jesus words

achorladey:

The same angels were called sons of God abi? Are you not a ministering servant just like the angels? The image described by various Bible writers about the angels depict what image they carry?

nope am not a servant but a son. Jesus said he nolonger calls us servants. The servanthood of a new testament saint is not to God but to fellow men. He has given us His spirit of adoption wherefore we can call him father.. The Bible said the angels are ministering spirits sent to minister to the heirs of salvation. We are not on the same level as dem. As a matter of fact, the Bible said we shall judge them

achorladey:

I don't think you need to explain that God does not need a son to harbjar, the simple explanation of God creating things is summarised in Revelation 4:11 Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure(will) they are and were created.
Harbjar believes Allah has purpose of doing things, he should not be asking does Allah need a son. If Allah creates something and calls it a son will you change it and insist that Allah can never have a son.

Lol... You see the reason why we humans need sons is the fact that we die and we need someone to carry on with our progeny and continue so that our bloodline wont die... So sons are there to succeed their fathers
If you believe God is eternal and never to die.... Then why should he need a need, religion shouldn't always be about faith, it has to be logical
So lets reason... Will jesus continue to be the son eternally.. No chance of him of taking of his father someday �
Question your faith and when you see loopholes, know you re not on the right path

harbjar:

Lol... You see the reason why we humans need sons is the fact that we die and we need someone to carry on with our progeny and continue so that our bloodline wont die... So sons are there to succeed their fathers
If you believe God is eternal and never to die.... Then why should he need a need, religion shouldn't always be about faith, it has to be logical
So lets reason... Will jesus continue to be the son eternally.. No chance of him of taking of his father someday �
Question your faith and when you see loopholes, know you re not on the right path

Christianity isn't about logic but about faith... The Bible said you can never by wisdom search out God and that y science is still lagging... God is revealed not researched..
Wen God called Adam a son or the angels, does it also mean God was going to die?

Talking about questioning ur religion, av u also questioned why allah would ask Mohammed to snatch the wife of his servant? or y u av to pray in direction of the son like ur god uses solar energy? Or y u can only pray to him in arabic

PrecisionFx:

.
Speak English Sir.

Na Swahili be the post you read and respond to?

PrecisionFx:



Jesus never said 'here am i, choose me.

The post you respond to is not meant for you. Your response to the post goes way of the mark. Ponder over it again

harbjar:

Lol... You see the reason why we humans need sons is the fact that we die and we need someone to carry on with our progeny and continue so that our bloodline wont die... So sons are there to succeed their fathers
If you believe God is eternal and never to die.... Then why should he need a need, religion shouldn't always be about faith, it has to be logical
So lets reason... Will jesus continue to be the son eternally.. No chance of him of taking of his father someday �
Question your faith and when you see loopholes, know you re not on the right path

I don't think you need to explain that God does not need a son to harbjar, the simple explanation of God creating things is summarised in Revelation 4:11 Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure(will) they are and were created.
Harbjar believes Allah has purpose of doing things, he should not be asking does Allah need a son. If Allah creates something and calls it a son will you change it and insist that Allah can never have a son.
Please respond to these if you can.

harbjar:

Lol... You see the reason why we humans need sons is the fact that we die and we need someone to carry on with our progeny and continue so that our bloodline wont die... So sons are there to succeed their fathers
If you believe God is eternal and never to die.... Then why should he need a need, religion shouldn't always be about faith, it has to be logical
So lets reason... Will jesus continue to be the son eternally.. No chance of him of taking of his father someday �
Question your faith and when you see loopholes, know you re not on the right path

The devine light that Jesus is not the son of God? Do you think calling Jesus son of God constitute part of the corruption contained in the Bible. I am tempted to ask who is Adam in relation to God? Is it right to view individuals and those that have worked and walked with God the way God sees them? Do you feel Christians demean God by saying he has a son? Response please?