Gombs:
How come pastors don't bring wine (alcohol) to people's weddings? Jesus afterall turned water into wine?

But... Bro, that bread and wine is symbolic na. Remember what the Bible said about the man in the book of Hebrews?
Study your Bible

ludot:
Lol...bread and wine is symbolic but tithe is not?

Jesus didn't officiate at the wedding. He attended a wedding reception just as pastors attend wedding receptions today.
And there is nothing wrong with pastors taking alcohol to wedding receptions.

MuttleyLaff:
So much comedy relief

If petra1 denies tithing under compulsion then it is a relief to know people can choose to tithe if they are happy and pleased to want to tithe

I am quite sure petra1 DOESNT believe people are cursed, will be cursed or be under a curse, if they decide not to tithe

Yes, this is simple enough
If petra1 is now claiming to tithe the Abraham way, then he must have tithed properly and in exactly the same manner Abraham did
petra1 must have gone to battle, chased after warlords, launched a counter attack that rescued a foolish relative, his family and recovered all their plundered possessions

petra1, then must have found a living priest-cum-king, whose genelogy is unknown as Abraham did, and gave him tithe.
petra1 must have given the living priest-cum-king, whose genelogy is unknown, a tenth of the spoils of war he went to fight in
and not give a tithe or tenth of any other income or on own wealth just as Abraham did
Lastly, petra1 must have passed over the remainging 90% of the spoils of war he went to fight in, to a type, equivalent or similar king of Sodom

Abraham went to battle only once
and as it is customary, in those times, when battles or wars are won and over,
what belongs by right or custom to the victor is 90% of the war booty
Interestingly, in a manner that cannot be evaded,
the rest, 10% of the spoils of war, as per custom again, mandatorily is to be given to a local ruler.
Abraham found no other local better than Melchizedek to give this tithe, 10% of the spoils of war to

The immediate above, is the circumstances surrounding why, when and how Abraham tithed

Abraham didnt go into battle again, so there was no reason for Abraham to tithe again,
no reason to tithe to Melchizedek or to any other local ruler worthy of the consideration

¹³And behold, the LORD stood above it and said,
"I am the LORD, the God of your father Abraham and the God of Isaac;
the land on which you lie, I will give it to you and to your descendants.
¹⁵“Behold, I am with you and will keep you wherever you go, and will bring you back to this land;
for I will not leave you until I have done what I have promised you.”
- Genesis 28:13 & 15

I could type more, write at length and in depth about this
but wont, because it will go beyond the range of the thread and probably turn out long-winded

So here is the abridged version,
here is a brief summary or general gist of Abraham's tithing and Jacob's vowed tithing
Jacob wasnt on to something, he didnt just have a spontaneous idea to tithe
Jacob, knows about giving 10% being associated with men of war who had gone to battle
So after the dream in Genesis 28:13 & 15, Jacob goes like:
OK God since there will be war and you're going to give back to me and my descendants what has been taken,
I, in line with prevailing principle of war custom,
which mandates giving a tenth of spoils of war, to a local ruler worthy of the consideration
vow to give you, God, the high esteemed Ruler, this 10%, otherwise known as tithe

ludot:


Lol ... the tithe Christians pay dates back to Abraham.

Genesis 14:

18. Melchizedek king of Salem brought out bread and wine. (Now he was the priest of the Most High God.) 19 He blessed Abram, saying, “Blessed be Abram by the Most High God, Creator of heaven and earth. 20 Worthy of praise is the Most High God, who delivered your enemies into your hand.” Abram gave Melchizedek a tenth of everything.

How come pastors don't bring wine and bread to church and give to those that tithe?

petra1:


That's an exceptional incident . Besides he didn't give him wine because of tithes. Tithes only came later

ludot:


The same way Abraham's tithe was an exceptional incident, wasn't it?

Following your logic of tithe was after wine - that means pastors that don't bring wine first deserve no tithe.

Lol...

The list is getting long

1. Symbolic
2. Exceptional

Pro-tithe people make me laugh

petra1:


But he was not a Jew . And the Jewish law wasn’t binding on him .

plainbibletruth:


What is laughable is when some, like you, take portions of the Bible and feel they can use it to support tithing in the church.

That is what is insult to God and stupid .

Whatever the number of types of tithes in Israel or before Israel, the issue today is: DO THEY APPLY TO THE CHURCH TODAY?

Diverting attention away from the CORE issue and now focusing on number of tithes or how they were done smacks of DECEIT.

There is NO priesthood of Melchizedek in the New Testa­ment. What we have in the New Testament is THE PRIESTHOOD OF JESUS CHRIST. Jesus's priesthood SUPERSEDES any and ALL the other Priesthoods prior to it including that of Melchizedek.

The New Testament has prescribed how to further the Gospel; and it [ACCORDING to Abraham's: No where!

pascal558:
read pauls letter to d churches nd stop trying to use canal mind to resolve things of d spirit!

petra1:


Kindly explain

MuttleyLaff:

Watch Freeze being not silent
or neutral in today's Luke 11:42 21st century situations of injustice, unfairness and life devoid of the love of God
Freeze doesnt have a dog in the fight, so is more likely to be truly objective and impartial than OP

paxonel:

That's correct!
Is that why you people are paying tithe in the order of Abraham and not the order of Malachi?
Because prophet Malachi was a Jew

esere826:
Freeze made his point

esere826:
and welcomed debates. Fair enough
One can choose to either ignore him or actually debate the idea with some biblical "logic"

esere826:
What I've found amusing is that a couple of senior christians who I respect have jumped in
and used emotions as a tool in such a "debate"

esere826:
For example, one of the big MOG's dismissed and rebuked Freeze for mentioning beer in relation to tithe.
However, this was so off the context in which Freeze spoke.
Many bible translations do have that verse of the bible mentioning strong drink.
(that he doesnt agree with it does not mean that it does not exist)

Another MOG jumped on the bandwagon and was busy defending the 1st MOG based on emotions with barely any biblical logic.

esere826:
This is same way the catholic church used to behave in ages past.
Their leadership just said anything (even outside of the bible) and expected everyone to fall into line

esere826:
Petra1 tried (I'm not saying he's right or wrong)
I say so because he's a pastor and could have taken the easier route of ignoring or just going straight to Malachi
and threatening its curse for anyone who disagrees with his tithing view -people are scared of this.
He didnt

esere826:
Instead he has attempted to trace the genesis of tithing,
and to distinguish different types.
I might not completely agree with him,
but I appreciate that he is enriching the discussion.

esere826:
As it is written.
..... Study to show yourself approved

petra1:
Are you saying Jacob didn't fulfill it.

petra1:
If you're saying it's not recorded it's different from he didn't do it

petra1:


It's laughable when some who don't study their bibles feel there is a hidden conspiracy about tithing in the church which pastors have been covering up. Daddy freeze claims that the Bible. Command tithes to be uses to drink beer. Firstly that's is insult to God and stupid . But in truth there is a provision under the law to use a tithe for feast and eating .

As much as we are not tithing based on the law. We tithe based on Abrahamic revelation . However the explanation here is to throw light on the misrepresentation by daddy freeze .


THERE WERE THREE DIFFERENT KINDS OF TITHES

There were three different kinds of tithes in the Bible . Daddy freeze dwell on a minor one to rubbish the major one .

The three different types are as follows:

1. THE LEVITICAL TITHE (sacred to God).

Leviticus 27:30
And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land, or of the fruit of the tree, is the Lord's: it is holy unto the Lord

This tithe is used for the work of service in the place of worship and also for the welfare of the workers there.

Numbers 18:21-25
21 And, behold, I have given the Levites all the tithes in Israel for an inheritance in return for their service which they serve, the [menial] service of the Tent of Meeting.


2. THE TITHE OF THE FEAST (Deut. 14:22-27).(daddy freeze beer boozing tithe )
Deuteronomy 14:22-23
Thou shalt truly tithe all the increase of thy seed, that the field bringeth forth year by year. And thou shalt eat before the Lord thy God, in the place which he shall choose to place his name there, the tithe of thy corn, of thy wine, and of thine oil, and the firstlings of thy herds and of thy flocks; that thou mayest learn to fear the Lord thy God always.


3. THE TITHE FOR THE POOR (Deut. 14:28, 29). (Every 3 years)
This is done once in very 3 years . It is shared among the poor . While the main annual tithe still runs .

Deuteronomy 14:28-29
At the end of three years thou shalt bring forth all the tithe of thine increase the same year, and shalt lay it up within thy gates: And the Levite, (because he hath no part nor inheritance with thee,) and the stranger, and the fatherless, and the widow, which are within thy gates, shall come, and shall eat and be satisfied; that the Lord thy God may bless thee in all the work of thine hand which thou doest

The first tithe, the one we trace back to Abra­ham (Gen. 14:18-20), is the sacred tithe, given to the Levites and priests for their service to the temple and the congregation in the Old Testa­ment. This is the tithe we continue to give under the priesthood of Melchizedek in the New Testa­ment. It is the tithe consecrated to God and the furtherance of the gospel and has, therefore, validity for all believers in Christ.

Paul was clear enough .

1 Corinthians 9:13-14
Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar? Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel

Now some may say Paul didn't accept support . That's no big deal . He didn't accept support in Corinth because of their carnality . But he accepted support from some other churches . Same goes for pastors today . Most pastors serve voluntarily. They don't receive support . Over 9% of pastors in Deeper life ,Redeem ,CEC, winners are serving voluntarily. They have their own jobs . In fact one of the criterial by which you are sent out is to first have a good job . Except only few who may be required to serve full time and they may have to resign from their job. To get support from church . Church tithe is used to pay workers , church rent , maintainance , equipment ,projects , generator fuel. Chair hire etc and other expenditures. The pastor is not the owner of church money . Every ministry has structure by which money is handled . A pastor in redeem cannot dip his hand into church account . There are approvals from head quarters for expenditure. Not what bloggers online post who don't even go to church

We are not giving tithes as commanded under the law . Our tithing dates to Abraham before the law came . And that it why the other kinds of tithes were not emphasized . So daddy freeze only dwell on the feast party which is not abrahamic . And antitithers are jumping up that they have a hero (who is not even a Christian )

petra1:
The first tithe, the one we trace back to Abraham

charlsecy:
Under what conditions did Abraham tithe?

savagefinder:
wait ooh.. Lol.. The three types of tithe you mentioned none of them talked about giving money to pastor abi church every month..

If we are doing abrahamic tithing then we should tithe just once in our lives since abraham tithed just once

The children of Israel are direct descendants of Abraham, all of us na gentiles saved by grace and they did practice the mosaic tithes because that was what God gave them to do and if we want to follow our Bible

do we disregard the 10 commandments? Should we then disregard the law of tithing just to favor our Pastors?

Your long epistle didn't answer the question

"where did our Pastors dig up their type of tithe from?"

petra1:


Tithe will always be tithe. Offerings will always be offering

petra1:


Christian giving are not based on the law . It’s based on principles revealed in the Bible

Tithe and offering giving are principles in worshiping God.



Abraham didn’t tithe once . We only had that particular incidence on record . If he could tithe from war booty how much more all his possession as practice



tithes and offering were practiced before mosaic law . Mosaic law was only a reminder of existing principle.



How



What is the question



Read your Bible . Firstly an average pastor has a job is a giver and a tither and he doesn’t depend on church for support . Secondly church money does not belong to the pastor . Only a handful of pastors Who may be adviced to resign from secular job do get allowance like any other church worker and that is paralle to the Bible days . Paul made it clear . That they can receive support and welfare . Support of the Old Testament came from tithes

1 Corinthians 9:13-14
Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar? Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

petra1:
On the condition that he met the high priest

charlsecy:
What goods did he tithe?

petra1:
On the condition that he met the high priest

charlsecy:
What goods did he tithe?

petra1:
Kindly enlighten us

MuttleyLaff:
This is an error because Abraham never met any "high priest"



C'mon now, don't pass the buck, answer charlsecy's question.

You couldn't have already run out of salvo.
Don't be shy, don't feel intimidated...

What goods did Abraham tithe to the ruler cum priest Melchizedek?

Goshen360:


Can people be intelligent enough to spot the huge CONTRADICTIONS in the above and with everything you've been saying in this thread?

Lies are never consistent. You have to lie another lie to cover up a previous lie and it's unfortunate men like you hold the pulpit....smh!

BERNIMOORE:
Goshen360 6 yrs ago, you remember the tithe thread we had with joeagbaje wordtalk snowwy etc, till page 40

Goshen360:


I sure do remember. What about it?

BERNIMOORE:
this issue of tithe was won ON SOCIAL MEDIA, BUT WE DIDNT AGREE ON ''SPEAKING IN TONGUE'' and i will not, so what's about it is that the social media allows everyone to his opinion but we should not be over rigtheous

paxonel:

That's correct!
Is that why you people are paying tithe in the order of Abraham and not the order of Malachi?
Because prophet Malachi was a Jew

Goshen360:


Sure, no wahala....these tithe yahoos ain't giving up, so we shouldn't give up too....