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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating (46758 Views)
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Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by karo93: 1:29am On Apr 14, 2010 |
@bee444 fornication is a decision between loving your self more than God or God more than yourself as (John 14:15) says If you love me, you will keep my commandments. the ball is in your court! |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by bee444: 1:54am On Apr 14, 2010 |
karo93: let me ask you this, what was Jesus's commandments before he left for heaven? Don't confuse Jesus's saying and God's saying, ok. Ask yourself this, why did God gave Moses the ten commandments? Why did Jesus preached love instead of holiness? Pls answer these questions |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by AYODEJI4LOVE(m): 2:44am On Apr 14, 2010 |
bee444: |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by bee444: 4:11am On Apr 14, 2010 |
AYODEJI4LOVE: @AYODEJI4LOVE I believe you're one of those Nigerian Church goers that lack understanding of the Bible but instead believe every words of your pastor without studying the scripture. I would not want to debate or have any argument with you but instead lecture you. I never said we have the right to commit sin nor do I intend to encourage people to fornicate. Pre-marital intimacy or fornication as you would call it, is primarily our genetic mandate to mate and that is reflected in our sexual desire. What we should now do is to separate the biological/evolutionary drivers of fornication from cultural and religion. In the OT, according to Ex 22: 16-17" If a man seduces a virgin who is not engaged, and lies with her, he must pay a dowry for her to be his wife. If her father absolutely refuses to give her to him, he shall pay money equal to the dowry for virgins." Also in Deuteronomy 22: 28-29, it say, "If a man seduces a virgin who is not engaged, and lies with her, he must pay a dowry for her to be his wife. If her father absolutely refuses to give her to him, he shall pay money equal to the dowry for virgins." Now, the Exodus passage above is the only one of the two verses in the bible that directly deals with pre-marital intimacy. Points to note, neither the guy nor the woman in the Exodus verse is rebuked or punished for the sin (compare to deut 22). The man is required to seek marriage immediately after fornicating with the girl(in those days, most girls were called virgins). The Bible makes us to understand that even if the girls father refuses you her hand in married, you're still bound to pay the dowry. After this, every punishment or sin against you is totally non-existence. Deut 22: 28-29 case is different to that of the Exodus 22 in that it involves despoil and not a consensual pre-marital intimacy. In this scenario, the man that commit such crime must take the woman into his wife and a chance to divorce is totally against the law. *The despoil of married woman carries the death penalty. In Deut 20:10, it clearly states that if a man desires a wife, all he has to do is to go out and get a woman and sleeps with her, if she's found pleasing, he has the option to marry her or send her away as long as he fulfils the conditions i.e paying the girl's father. In every case of pre-marital intimacy in the Bible, there is no punishment for the sexual act other than the compensation paid to the father of the girl. There are a lot of repressive teachings going on out there based on repressive Christian traditions of which I believe are done out of ignorance and with no biblical basis. Every book of the NT was specifically written for some sections of the Christians in those days. Some of them still applies to us today and some of them don't. |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by Image123(m): 7:29am On Apr 14, 2010 |
Bee444 Most girls were not called virgins in the OT, most girls were virgins in the OT. |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by karo93: 8:06am On Apr 14, 2010 |
Rom.8.7- and a person becomes an enemy of God when he is controlled by human nature for he does not obey God’s law and in fact cannot obey it. Deut.22.21(GNB) …then they are to take her to the entrance of her father’s house where the men of the city are to stone her to death. She has done a shameful thing by having intercourse before she was married. With this how can someone say it is in our nature so it is not wrong or was this girl not acting according to her nature? |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by smallman1: 3:29pm On Apr 14, 2010 |
Mr.ayo deji, well i think u dnt understand d bible u r just looking 4 wat u can use to justify ur act of fornication.remember willful sinners will not inherit the kingdom of God.read the bible well agaein,check all areas talking of fornication and see that it is totally condemed. all the best.if you want to talk more on this jus call 08081382872. luv, small man. |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by tayore: 4:13pm On Apr 14, 2010 |
Lacrissa, You may or may not be able to get the right counsel here. I am already sick of what some people are posting. If you are really sincere about doing God's will, I know he would grant you your heart's desire some-how. People give advice based on their belief. It is left to you to examine opinions before you begin to accept and apply them. A simple advice is capable of setting you free forever or putting you in eternal Bondage. Beware! |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by bee444: 4:16pm On Apr 14, 2010 |
Image123: You're right bro, but I'd appreciate if you let us know your view on the topic. |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by bee444: 4:29pm On Apr 14, 2010 |
karo93: Stop quoting out of context my lil bro. The Verse you just quoted was actually talking about virgins that lied to their new husband about their virgin status. If a girl was dis-virgin before getting married and refused to let her husband-to-be know of this before the wedding, then such girl would be taken to the city where men would then stone her to death (this is called playing the harlot) The verses before Deut 22:21 talks about what you must do when you sleep with a virgin or someone that is not married. Pls go and study your Bible very well. |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by karo93: 5:01pm On Apr 14, 2010 |
@bee44 Do not let your desire for fornication blind your eyes to the truth. in that verse what was the reason she was to be stoned?- “ She has done a shameful thing by having intercourse before she was married”. so why are you turning the bible up side down? If you want to fornicate you don’t need to drag others into it with you! For all you know heaven may not be that sweet or hell that bad so don’t stress your self and stop twisting the laws of God. |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by Zodiac61(m): 5:05pm On Apr 14, 2010 |
@bee444, you are the one misquoting the bible. There is no mention of 'virgins lying about their virgin status' (a wrong use of words but your meaning is clear). It is quite clear from Deut. 22 that the authors of this book expected all women to be virgins before marriage. Deut 22. 13-24 13 If a man takes a wife and, after lying with her, dislikes her 14 and slanders her and gives her a bad name, saying, "I married this woman, but when I approached her, I did not find proof of her virginity," 15 then the girl's father and mother shall bring proof that she was a virgin to the town elders at the gate. 16 The girl's father will say to the elders, "I gave my daughter in marriage to this man, but he dislikes her. 17 Now he has slandered her and said, 'I did not find your daughter to be a virgin.' But here is the proof of my daughter's virginity." Then her parents shall display the cloth before the elders of the town, 18 and the elders shall take the man and punish him. 19 They shall fine him a hundred shekels of silver [b] and give them to the girl's father, because this man has given an Israelite virgin a bad name. She shall continue to be his wife; he must not divorce her as long as he lives.Stop trying to read things that are not there into the bible. If everybody obeys this part of the bible, most single women in churches up and down the would be taken to the doors of their fathers' houses and stoned to death. Verse 23 makes it clear that a woman could be stoned even if she was raped, because she did not scream out. I wonder how many women would scream out whilst they are being raped for fear of further damage to them. This piece of male misogyny is what some people expect us to believe is the inerrant word of god. Some god ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by bee444: 6:05pm On Apr 14, 2010 |
Zodiac61: I dare not come on this forum and pick up argument with people I don't know personally. I believe you're entitle to your own opinion. Your understanding and perception of the Bible is not the same as mine. I'm not saying you have to be a theologist or a bible scholar before you can digest the bible, but wisdom and intellect is needed here before coming to conclusion. Does these scriptures quoted here sound like my own version of the bible? or what part of the text don't you guys understand? Ex 22: 16-17" If a man seduces a virgin who is not engaged, and lies with her, he must pay a dowry for her to be his wife. If her father absolutely refuses to give her to him, he shall pay money equal to the dowry for virgins." Also in Deuteronomy 22: 28-29, it say, "If a man seduces a virgin who is not engaged, and lies with her forcefully,and they are found out, he must pay a dowry of fifty shekel to her father in order for her to be his wife, he shall not be permitted to divorce her all his life" Now, the Exodus passage above is the only one of the two verses in the bible that directly deals with pre-marital intimacy. Points to note, neither the guy nor the woman in the Exodus verse is rebuked or punished for the sin (compare to deut 22). The man is required to seek marriage immediately after fornicating with the girl(in those days, girls were called virgins). The Bible makes us to understand that even if the girls father refuses you her hand in married, you're still bound to pay the dowry. After this, every punishment or sin against you is totally non-existence. Deut 22: 28-29 case is different to that of the Exodus 22 in that it involves despoil and not a consensual pre-marital intimacy. In this scenario, the man that commit such crime must take the woman into his wife and a chance to divorce is totally against the law. * Only when a man despoil a virgin that is engaged should that man be stoned to death. The woman is also stoned to death if only she did not cry for help when the guy is despoiling her (Deut. 22:23-25) Lets not dwell on this but rather seek a way forward to avoiding a repeat occurrence. What I'm saying here is, If you found yourself fornicating often, then it has to be with the person you're willing to marry. But to be on a more neutral and guiltless state, I'd advise you rather abstain from such until you're married. I would not recommend help from no one, even from your Pastor, but rather ask you to have a personal conversation with God regarding your issue, and let God take it on from there. |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by Maykelly(f): 4:25pm On Apr 15, 2010 |
[size=18pt] Ogaga4Luv link=topic=date=13: ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by Image123(m): 6:39am On Apr 16, 2010 |
Maykelly Is that quote from ogaga or from image123? Abeg, no put me for trouble o |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by SuperT(m): 9:43am On Apr 17, 2010 |
You need go for deliverace. You need to deal with your foundation if you come from polygamous family, and you determine to effect change in your Life. |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by Maykelly(f): 12:26pm On Apr 17, 2010 |
Image123: Fear him Not
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Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by Zodiac61(m): 10:15am On Apr 18, 2010 |
Super T:This is just crazy. What has coming from a polygamous family got to do with anything. Or is this visiting the sins of the father unto the son? |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by Lacrissa: 12:53pm On Apr 18, 2010 |
Super T: What do you mean by deliverance?? ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by Lacrissa: 12:59pm On Apr 18, 2010 |
Gabry: Thanks for understanding exactly where I was coming from, though I'm not saying or encouraging people, "yes it's very right". Some people are just making it seem like it's something extraordinary or out of this world which I bet, they struggle through the same thing. M.Nwankwo I read your post and it does make sense. |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by SleekReek(m): 11:15am On May 13, 2010 |
Thanks for understanding exactly where I was coming from, though I'm not saying or encouraging people, "yes it's very right". Some people are just making it seem like it's something extraordinary or out of this world which I bet, they struggle through the same thing. @Lacrissa, sincerely i want to advice from a balanced perspective.I'm a child of God and married,i did have your struggles before i got married,everyone has what he or she is dealing with in this walk with God.First of all if you believe the word of God,then you definitely know fornication or adultery is wrong.It not only wrong because it's in the bible,but God loves us and wants us free from the consequences of negative actions.Fornication has repercussions,i'm speaking from experience,repercussion yes that God can heal you from,but they are there and very painful to go through.The funny thing is that most times when these repercussions are affecting our lives we don't even know or don't even care, or take it as part of life. I had to sit down and understand this before i stopped,many say deliverance(yes they are spirits that do move a person to always fornicate),but the real deliverance and the most difficult is deliverance of the mind,because behind every action is a perception or a thought,thats where satan works,with words like,"Don't worry ,everyone is doing it","After you do it,just ask 4 forgiveness from God and all is well" but he never tells you the effect of what you are doing,satan has an objective to steal,kill and eventually destroy you,no matter what he speak into your mind this is his objective. I realised i was in bondage,each time i committed it,i will feel bad.Initially i was kidding myself that after all it was with a loved one,then it graduated to so called "loved ones".Then i couldn't keep a stable relationship,marriage began to scare me,i knew this was now a bondage i couldn't stop and marriage was surely not going to stop it,then i would have graduated to adultery.I sat down,took the word of God and began to understand some clear truths, fornication is a bad foundation for any marriage fornication major effect is on my body fornication messes up a sucessful sex life in marriage fornication can lead to unfaithfulness in marriage fornication will cut me off from the blessings of God promsed to a good foundational marriage void of immorality. fornication will not allow me reach my full pontential spiritually with God Why will i allow a 15mins to probably 30 mins of gratification,spoil my future? Why can't i just marry whom i love and have all the intimacy i want with her?If i can't exercise self control now,what makes me believe i can exercise it after marriage?I should be in control but now having intimacy was controlling me,this was not good at all. Repenting of something before God does bring about His forgiveness,but being healed and made whole from your sins takes time.I seriously needed help and i knew it,so i ended every relationship,i took practical steps,stops reading or watching pornographic film,magazines and web sites,instead i spent time reading and listening to the word of God,praying alot and asking that the seeds i had sown would be uprooted and not affect my future.This i did for 1 year,then i met my wife,i explained my issues to her and she understood and she really helped me,for the first time i was in relationship without intimacy,it stayed like that till we married last year.It was a tough process getting healed but it is worth it,marriage is challenging enough than for me to start it on a bad foundation. I want you to take your time,i know and believe you love God,so ask for his help,then He will give you the strenght and wisdom to take the practical step to be happy in this issue. 1 Like |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by Romeo4real(m): 8:00pm On May 13, 2010 |
@ Deepsight - It is no different from hunger or thirst.Whilst intimacy may be a natural innate behaviour, it certainly is not comparable to hunger or thirst. The feeling of Hunger is physiological complex of hormonal interactions with the brain that signals the need to acquire nutrients neccessary for the body's operation and survival. The same with Thirst. The physical act of intimacy is certainly not necessary for survival, and juman beings can live fulfilled lives without intimacy. To prove this point, many people have voluntarily decided to live a life devoid of intimacy, and are quite happy. Also, removing the Testes in men, and Ovaries in women, with a combination of drugs have been shown to totally eradicate the urge for intimacy. Sex is not even necessary for procreation. Many animals do not have any physical contact with the opposite gender and still manage to procreate. And with artificial insemination possible in all mammals, this proves that sex is not necessary for pre creation. Yes, Man being an advanced creature is entitled to deploy discretion in the exercise of his instincts.Really? So why do we have r.apes, molestations and murders? they are all "natural instincts". Why do we have laws? Why do we have societal norms? Why do we have conventions, decorum and courtesy. If we advanced the idea that man is an "advanced" creature,and can be trusted to make the right decision for himself and the greater good of the society in which he exists, why do we have laws which are expressly designed to curb and control our instincts? And in terms of such discretion i can conceive of no higher principle than that which you are already applying: to wit - limiting your se.xual life to one person who you love deeply.I suppose then that you conceive every of of the 6,697,254,041 people on earth will think like you? Any person who attempts to make you feel guilty for this simply has no understanding of existence, creation and nature.So based on your "understanding", human beings should be left to run amok in society beholden to their instincts and innate desires, all in the hope that we can be trusted to "deploy discretion" in the exercise of our instincts. Can you see it makes no sense? The reality is that such persons have been indoctrinated by a bizarre and most unnatural anti-se.x dogma which has its origins in misguided notions of morality deriving from religion and culture.ALL religions advocate abstinence from s.ex, food, and worldly pleasures as a means of reaching a higher plane of understanding and enlightenment, or achieving spiritual growth. I am yet to see any human culture in existence, anywhere in the world that has not restricted, advocated or implemented some form of control over human sexual desires in its societies. The only culture you should be beholden to is the culture of nature.A stupendously misguided statement. I doubt that you gave it much thought before you made it. Examine it.I just have, and i have to conclude it makes no sense at all. |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by yesboss20(m): 3:37pm On Aug 25, 2010 |
It's da nature of man. You simply have to commit your affairs to Jehovah to take absolute control. That's all. |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by 3RNEST(m): 12:25am On Jan 12, 2011 |
>> This thread began, @Sleek Reek - your post is fully noted, i must confuse it's heart touch, rite now i'm kind of applyin similar method but its not workinq, please share with me, höw did u overcome it for one year! Kia na wa, dis 4 abi na 5-nication thinq sef? |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by joshelen(m): 12:42pm On Jan 13, 2011 |
having sex and fornication are two different things. fornication is having sex with the wrong person or at the wrong time, there is something wrong about it. i would not blame you for what you can not control but i will sincerely let you know that God helps those that are ready for Him and He will help you. Paul was in the same condition of doing what one hates, but he prayed and it was solved by God, i have the same testimony, are you ready, you must have to take some difficult steps, Abraham refused to tell the wife about the instruct to kill isaac, it was to avoid anything that will stop him from obeying God. Anyway if the act is with a particular person that is not married, why not get married to him/her, but if it is with different people, marriage might not help. pray for self control and i think you shud see a good pastor, there shud be more details that will help in councelling. |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by itstpia8: 12:47am On Mar 04, 2015 |
Prayer |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by Weah96: 1:14am On Mar 04, 2015 |
Jesus doesn't stop people from sinning. The pope sins every day. The key is to pray for forgiveness and repeat the process all over again. Sleep with a different girl every day, just make sure to pray for Jesus to forgive you. Try not to sleep with two in a row before praying for the first forgiveness. That way you won't need to say two prayers back to back. |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by MipoT: 10:16am On Apr 09, 2016 |
please dont cast an aspersion on my person. That I disagree with u, does not make me dishonest. And why would I state an opinion dishonestly. . .when such an opinion is intended to inform others? [/quote] ![]() Really interesting days ahead |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by MipoT: 10:53am On Apr 09, 2016 |
bee444: |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by theEYe21(f): 11:55am On Apr 09, 2016 |
It's called being human(imperfect and flawed) Lacrissa: |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by theEYe21(f): 11:59am On Apr 09, 2016 |
LIES FROM THE PIT OF HELL!!! ![]() ![]() ![]() EvangOlu: |
Re: I Am A Christian And Love God But I Still Keep Fornicating by theEYe21(f): 12:02pm On Apr 09, 2016 |
Go and read biology, then you would know sex is necessary for human survival. noetic16: |
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