@Seyibrown: « #115 on: July 30, 2010, 11:04 AM »

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If you are only born into sin, and not with ORIGINAL SIN FROM ADAM AND EVE, why did Yahweh curse women with labor pain, etc and men with eating from the sweat of his brow? If Adam and Eve sinned, why are christian men and women receiving part of the curse, if only they were born into sin and not with sin? It does not make sense for Jesus to come to save you if you were just born into sin, but not with sin. Seyi, you got yourself into a pickle.

Everything was good when Adam and Eve were created. Adam was not originally created to 'eat from the sweat of his brow', and Eve was not originally created to have 'multiplied pain in childbirth'. The curses were only added to them after they were created and they became nature to humans(Adam and eve's offspring).]/quote]Seyi, Seyi, Seyi o. What are you saying here? Are you insinuating that Adam and Eve were not of Human nature when they were created? What were they at first and when did they come to Human nature? The human created was Adam. Then his mate, Eve.They were created human from the get go. From their very conception, all the way to before, during and after instruction not to approach the "Tree" and leaving the Paradise where they lived, till their death outside the Paradise which took place on earth. Seyi, you need to come to my side of the religious divide.

Nobody is born a sinner (Matthew 18 v 1-6)
1 At that time the disciples came to Jesus and said, “Who then is greatest in the kingdom of heaven?”
2 And He called a child to Himself and set him before them,
3 and said, “Truly I say to you, unless you are converted and become like children, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven.
4 “Whoever then humbles himself as this child, he is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.
5 “And whoever receives one such child in My name receives Me;
6 but whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to stumble, it would be better for him to have a heavy millstone hung around his neck, and to be drowned in the depth of the sea).

Our upbringing(family) and society shape us (Proverbs 22 v 6 : Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it).

Jesus came to save us because of the failure of our ancestors and society to us and their inability to redeem us (Isaiah 59 v 16 : And he saw that there was no man, and wondered that there was no intercessor: therefore his arm brought salvation unto him; and his righteousness, it sustained him).

Seyi how did Isaiah creep into this presentation? Jesus was not the speaker. His name was not mentioned. Now, let me ask you; was the first child that was sinless the one that Jesus pointed out to his companions? Of course not, I say to you. Children who died long time before Jesus will not go to Hell fire because they never met Jesus. Just imagine the children of those who survived the flood with Noah. If one of their children died say at 2 years old, would she/he be destined to hell? Of course not, yet he/she knew no Jesus. So Jesus is not important to those who died before him; be they youths or adults. These people were under the instructions of the Prophet/Messenger who they lived under his time. Not Jesus.

« #116 on: July 30, 2010, 11:19 AM »
Previous post continued. . . . .

God saw the wickedness on earth long ago and decided to send Jesus. See Isaiah 59 vs 1 - 21 below

1 Behold, the LORD’S hand is not so short That it cannot save; Nor is His ear so dull That it cannot hear.
2 But your iniquities have made a separation between you and your God, And your sins have hidden His face from you so that He does not hear.
3 For your hands are defiled with blood And your fingers with iniquity; Your lips have spoken falsehood, Your tongue mutters wickedness.
4 No one sues righteously and no one pleads honestly. They trust in confusion and speak lies; They conceive mischief and bring forth iniquity.
5 They hatch adders’ eggs and weave the spider’s web; He who eats of their eggs dies, And from that which is crushed a snake breaks forth.
6 Their webs will not become clothing, Nor will they cover themselves with their works; Their works are works of iniquity, And an act of violence is in their hands.
7 Their feet run to evil, And they hasten to shed innocent blood; Their thoughts are thoughts of iniquity, Devastation and destruction are in their highways.
8 They do not know the way of peace, And there is no justice in their tracks; They have made their paths crooked, Whoever treads on them does not know peace.
9 Therefore justice is far from us, And righteousness does not overtake us; We hope for light, but behold, darkness, For brightness, but we walk in gloom.
10 We grope along the wall like blind men, We grope like those who have no eyes; We stumble at midday as in the twilight, Among those who are vigorous we are like dead men.
11 All of us growl like bears, And moan sadly like doves; We hope for justice, but there is none, For salvation, but it is far from us.
12 For our transgressions are multiplied before You, And our sins testify against us; For our transgressions are with us, And we know our iniquities:
13 Transgressing and denying the LORD, And turning away from our God, Speaking oppression and revolt, Conceiving in and uttering from the heart lying words.
14 Justice is turned back, And righteousness stands far away; For truth has stumbled in the street, And uprightness cannot enter.
15 Yes, truth is lacking; And he who turns aside from evil makes himself a prey. Now the LORD saw, And it was displeasing in His sight that there was no justice.
16 And He saw that there was no man, And was astonished that there was no one to intercede; Then His own arm brought salvation to Him, And His righteousness upheld Him.
17 He put on righteousness like a breastplate, And a helmet of salvation on His head; And He put on garments of vengeance for clothing And wrapped Himself with zeal as a mantle.
18 According to their deeds, so He will repay, Wrath to His adversaries, recompense to His enemies; To the coastlands He will make recompense.
19 So they will fear the name of the LORD from the west And His glory from the rising of the sun, For He will come like a rushing stream Which the wind of the LORD drives.
20 “A Redeemer will come to Zion, And to those who turn from transgression in Jacob,” declares the LORD.
21 “As for Me, this is My covenant with them,” says the LORD: “My Spirit which is upon you, and My words which I have put in your mouth shall not depart from your mouth, nor from the mouth of your offspring, nor from the mouth of your offspring’s offspring,” says the LORD, “from now and forever.”

I cannot just imagine living in this world without God's peace!

When I read the like of the bolded, I ask; is the Christian God unaware of the quality of what He created and therefore caught flatfooted and surprised of the deeds of man? Allah the Almighty says in Chapter 2 verse 30 of the Quran, to the Angels about the creation of man, Adam, "I know (Everything) while you do not know". If your God is not full in knowledge, as I conclude in your writing, then know that you have a real Creator you are ignoring, Allah the Knower of All things; all before they happen. He allows it to happen.

« #117 on: July 30, 2010, 11:35 AM »
Previous post continued. . . .

Wickedness is multiplied; Crimes are being committed against law-abiding people and their is no justice; Many are being oppressed and most times the justice system of this world does not give them justice.

Who gives justice to a 4 year old who is repeatedly being despoiled by an adult who should know better? Who heals the hurt of victims of despoils and murders(and their families) whose perpetrators are let back into society when they are still a danger? Who gives justice people who are being abducted, dismembered and sold for body parts? Who gives justice to the people whose government daily robs them of their rights? Who gives true healing to the broken-hearted? It is only God! He sent Jesus to make it easier for us to access the love, protection, peace and provision that is available from him.

Again, I cannot see myself living in this world without the peace and love of God. I have tasted the Lord and seen that he is good!

You said if there is no law against an action, the said action is not a sin therefore. You are right. Jesus did not pass the law. The Ultimate law Giver, God Almighty is the One you should depend on therefore. If you had lived in the time of Moses, all the way just before Jesus said he was a Servant sent by God to the Children of Israel, being a Child of Israel, Moses would have been the leader Messenger that you would have followed. Considering that Jesus even said he was under the laws of Moses by not abolishing it, even the least of its jots, if you do otherwise, you will be destined to be the least in the Kingdom. The least in the kingdom is hell fire. In all of this, Jesus was not important to those who died before him. It just happened that a prophet/Messenger came after him. Based on Jesus he described the said entity as Another Comforter. Read the qualification of that Another Comforter. It is the period of this Another Comforter that you and I are under and it will extend to end of time.



@vedaxcool (m): « #118 on: July 30, 2010, 12:23 PM »

Previous post continued. . . .

Wickedness is multiplied; Crimes are being committed against law-abiding people and their is no justice; Many are being oppressed and most times the justice system of this world does not give them justice.

Who gives justice to a 4 year old who is repeatedly being despoiled by an adult who should know better? Who heals the hurt of victims of despoils and murders(and their families) whose perpetrators are let back into society when they are still a danger? Who gives justice people who are being abducted, dismembered and sold for body parts? Who gives justice to the people whose government daily robs them of their rights? Who gives true healing to the broken-hearted? It is only God! He sent Jesus to make it easier for us to access the love, protection, peace and provision that is available from him.

Again, I cannot see myself living in this world without the peace and love of God. I have tasted the Lord and seen that he is good!


Too bad after all the trouble you went through you only succeded in mystifying the question at hand. Huh

From what we understand from your christian teachings we come to note that you people claim that Jesus died for your sins! and they go further and claim that Adam sin is the cause of his children sinning and yet you go further and claim that Jesus died to neutralize that sin, the question remains why are people still sinning?

As for me I understand that people sin because they have free will to do what they like, that is inherently the cause of why people sin to achieve their desire when getting it legitimately becomes untenable. In the Qur'an Adam begged God for forgiveness and God forgave him. If the world is bad it is because people have decided to do whatever it takes to get what they want.

My Allah give you strength and count the effort here as good deed by you. Amin.



@Image123 (m): « #121 on: July 30, 2010, 01:56 PM »

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Also the reason you said Jesus came to save you. For us in Islam, we do not need the death of anyone to receive Mercy of Allah. This is the better arrangement than you who needs the blood of a dead person.
Please do remind me, what do islam followers believe that cleanses sin, or gives mercy from God?

Your sincere supplication to Allah seeking mercy from Him against your sins. How do you know youre forgiven? When what you used to do of sin does not appeal to you. Let me give you an example. A person who used to indulge in illicit sex sort Mercy and Forgiveness from Allah. After this, he or she came to a situation that the same illicit sex can happen, very easily, quickly. This person almost jump to the chance, then realized the it is unIslamic. God commanded against it. He/she never took the bait. Now the person is been shown sign that his/her seeking forgiveness has been accepted because the same sin that you used to be easy to commit and e excited by it, is now shunned.



@aletheia:« #122 on: Yesterday at 12:01:01 AM »
^^^
profession of faith, going on hajj, fasting during ramadan, giving alms, praying five times a day but even with all these their quran says all muslims will go to hell, including their prophet.

Ode ido. Liar like baal. Where is this written in the Quran, darn Keferi? Keferi goes to hell. Mumin goes to paradise. Jannah is meant for Muslims, Muminu. Hellfire, Jahannam is created for your type, keferi tio le nu idi e. I hope you speak or understand yoruba; if not Go to a yoruba person as say a Muslim says you are a keferi and you cant nu idi e. Opuro ara e. You think Allah will admit Christians to Jannah and Mumin to Jahannam? Your head must not be screwed on straight.



@Precap2: « #124 on: Yesterday at 09:55:55 PM »

There is only one name under heaven by which a man's sins can be forgiven him and that name is Jesus. sin cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven So unless your a christian or become one real soon I will not be seeing you there in spit of all the false teachings that are taught. How can anyone claim to believe in Christ yet call his followers infidels, how can anyone justify murderer of innocent women and children in order to push their religions territorial power? that contains forms of jealousy, hatred, vengeance, strife, theft, and idolatry! none being the fruits of the spirit.

The Book of Timothy contains the word Infidel. The Quran does not contain it. If you know where it is on the pages of Arabic Quran, show me. False teaching: Jesus said he is a servant sent by God. Jesus also said the Lord of his listeners and his Lord is but One God. Jesus shouted that his God's name is Eloi. Others say that Jesus is Lord and God. Whose teaching is false here; Jesus's or that of others? Christianity is now pushing its territorial power to Subsahara Africa, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. The Missionaries are saying Jesus is sweet and Muhammad (AS) is sour when they offer sweets. Jealousy, hatred, vengeance, strife, theft, and idolatry are commanded against in Quran and warned against in hadiths. Check the Bible and the action of the Christians; When you worship the father, the son and the holy spirit, is there a bigger idolatry than that, except hinduism?

« #125 on: Today at 05:47:10 PM »

Quote from: aletheia on Yesterday at 12:01:01 AM
^^^
profession of faith, going on hajj, fasting during ramadan, giving alms, praying five times a day but even with all these their quran says all muslims will go to hell, including their prophet.

How come? After all the stress? No hope then? Terrifying to say the least.
Jesus can help a lot of dudes if they can just come off their mental traps.

Precap2 is suckered in too by the lies of the liar Aletheia. Is Jannah not created for muslims and Jahannam created for others? Surah Kahf: Verse 107. Allah talks about Muslims and Paradise. In the same Surah verse 100, 102, 106 speaks about the others going to Hellfire, with the reason for it. Part of the reason is making fun of the message and the messenger; as Aletheia and gang have been doing. This is just one area of the Quran. The issues of paradise and hellfire are many in the Quran. Paradise is not meant for anyone, except the Muslims. And there are people among them, Messenger(s)/Prophet(s) and their companions and people who truly lost their lives for the pleasure of God may not even stand for Judgement. Hellfire s meant for disbelievers.



@aletheia (m): « #126 on: Today at 07:21:45 PM »

Quote from: precap2 on Today at 05:47:10 PM
How come? After all the stress? No hope then? Terrifying to say the least.
Jesus can help a lot of dudes if they can just come off their mental traps.

Holla!
Quote from: Image123 on Yesterday at 04:25:26 PM
^That's expensive and unreliable then. Maybe that's why some try to take a shortcut by blowing up themselves, quite inefficient imo.Are you kidding?
No kidding. It's recorded in their Qur'an and Hadiths. That is the terror that lurks in the hearts of people like nopuqeater and vedaxcool: that perhaps at the end of the day, they will not escape Hell despite their best efforts. They are without hope of salvation while rejecting the Only One who can save them from Hell - Jesus.
Quote from: Sura 19.71, 72
19.71 There is not one of you but shall approach i[/b]t. That is a fixed ordinance of thy Lord. 19.72 [b]Then We shall rescue those who kept from evil, and leave the evil-doers crouching there.

[/quote]From the above, there is no inkling that Allah says Muslim will enter and or get punished in the Fire of Hell. Allah says all mankind will come or approach hell. WHich means you will either see it at least or feel that it is there, near you. All mankind; Man and genie. Below is the verses from 58 through 75 to give you the bigger and clearer picture, if you have a mind that can think:

Verse 58: Sahih International
Those were the ones upon whom Allah bestowed favor from among the prophets of the descendants of Adam and of those We carried [in the ship] with Noah, and of the descendants of Abraham and Israel, and of those whom We guided and chose. When the verses of the Most Merciful were recited to them, they fell in prostration and weeping.

19:59 Sahih International
But there came after them successors who neglected prayer and pursued desires; so they are going to meet evil -

19:60 Sahih International
Except those who repent, believe and do righteousness; for those will enter Paradise and will not be wronged at all.

19:61 Sahih International
[Therein are] gardens of perpetual residence which the Most Merciful has promised His servants in the unseen. Indeed, His promise has ever been coming.

19:62 Sahih International
They will not hear therein any ill speech - only [greetings of] peace - and they will have their provision therein, morning and afternoon.

19:63 Sahih International
That is Paradise, which We give as inheritance to those of Our servants who were fearing of Allah .

19:64 Sahih International
[Gabriel said], "And we [angels] descend not except by the order of your Lord. To Him belongs that before us and that behind us and what is in between. And never is your Lord forgetful -

19:65 Sahih International
Lord of the heavens and the earth and whatever is between them - so worship Him and have patience for His worship. Do you know of any similarity to Him?"

19:66 Sahih International
And the disbeliever says, "When I have died, am I going to be brought forth alive?"

19:67 Sahih International
Does man not remember that We created him before, while he was nothing?

19:68 Sahih International
So by your Lord, We will surely gather them and the devils; then We will bring them to be present around Hell upon their knees.

19:69 Sahih International
Then We will surely extract from every sect those of them who were worst against the Most Merciful in insolence.

19:70 Sahih International
Then, surely it is We who are most knowing of those most worthy of burning therein.

19:71 Sahih International
And there is none of you except he will come to it. This is upon your Lord an inevitability decreed.

19:72 Sahih International
Then We will save those who feared Allah and leave the wrongdoers within it, on their knees.

19:73 Sahih International
And when Our verses are recited to them as clear evidences, those who disbelieve say to those who believe, "Which of [our] two parties is best in position and best in association?"

19:74 Sahih International
And how many a generation have We destroyed before them who were better in possessions and [outward] appearance?

19:75 Sahih International
Say, "Whoever is in error - let the Most Merciful extend for him an extension [in wealth and time] until, when they see that which they were promised - either punishment [in this world] or the Hour [of resurrection] - they will come to know who is worst in position and weaker in soldiers."

Verse 58 spoke about the reconstitution of mankind after the flood of Noah. The ensuing story went about the bloodlines of Abraham who became messengers and Prophets, as per the mercy of Allah on Ibrahim (AS). Then Allah spoke about Believers and disbelievers. We see how Allah mentions the disbelievers in the company of the devil; Satan (Shaytan). The diebelievers here are the non muslims, for sure. Is it not clear that Allah says He will bring disbelievers into it, while saving believers away from it, though they come to it, and to into it? Can you people read and think at the same time?



@seyibrown (f): « #127 on: Today at 07:29:52 PM »

Quote
From what we understand from your christian teachings we come to note that you people claim that Jesus died for your sins! and they go further and claim that Adam sin is the cause of his children sinning and yet you go further and claim that Jesus died to neutralize that sin, the question remains why are people still sinning?

Someone pays the debt you owed, commands you not to get into any more debt telling you what the consequences will be for going into debt again; you think going on a spending spree on your credit card knowing can't pay back is the best thing to do? It is not the best thing to do but you still have the freewill to choose to remain a free man or a debtor.

And what do you mean by 'neutralize that sin'? That is the funniest thing I have ever read!

[quote]

No one pays your death but the Wealthy, or you live within your means. The Wealthy here is Allah Who owns everything? Living within your means is to not over spend in the first place. And if you did, then correct yourself to pay down your death. Allah is the One you go to. Declare your bankrupsy to Him. Jesus did not have enough for himself, how can he have anything for anyone? He is a human and his limits are humanely. Now, go to the Chairman of the Board if you need to have your debt written off. Allah is the One Who Owns the Throne of all. He is above His throne and you cant escape from Him, Oluwaseyi. Se o ti gbo? Mo ti so fun e nsin yin. Ma ku si keferi o. Iya gidi niyen o. To say you have a lord against your Creator is a fool's gold syndrome.

Yeah. By means of our Adam sin spread to all mankind. And that why we die and are imperfect. Imperfection is why there are stillborn, diseases, etc.

Guy you really are 2 plates of nepuq before coming to your computer. What a long writing with no point in particular. Haba!

Holla moi!

@ nopuqeater

No one pays your death but the Wealthy, or you live within your means. The Wealthy here is Allah Who owns everything? Living within your means is to not over spend in the first place. And if you did, then correct yourself to pay down your death. Allah is the One you go to. Declare your bankrupsy to Him. Jesus did not have enough for himself, how can he have anything for anyone? He is a human and his limits are humanely. Now, go to the Chairman of the Board if you need to have your debt written off. Allah is the One Who Owns the Throne of all. He is above His throne and you cant escape from Him, Oluwaseyi. Se o ti gbo? Mo ti so fun e nsin yin. Ma ku si keferi o. Iya gidi niyen o. To say you have a lord against your Creator is a fool's gold syndrome.

Thanks for your concern as regards my fate in the afterlife. I am happy and content with the salvation of God through Jesus Christ. I pray that God shows you how concerned he is about your fate in the afterlife too and leads you to salvation. God bless you. Amen!

Una never tire for this thread?

and when I call Precap2 a lying rug he will be bent out of shape. my responses to the long posts by the kiriyo keferis are in tradition of the Bible. After all the Bible said two things, according to you: Love your God with all your heart and your neighbors like yourself (OT) and there are 3 gods and jesus being one of them died on the cross and his spilled blood is what covers you from hell (NT). So if the whole Bible is summed up by the two, my writng couldnt be that long for you to read.

@nopuqeater:

nopuqeater:

@aletheia:« #122 on: Yesterday at 12:01:01 AM »
^^^Ode ido. Liar like baal. Where is this written in the Quran, darn Keferi? Keferi goes to hell. Mumin goes to paradise. Jannah is meant for Muslims, Muminu. Hellfire, Jahannam is created for your type, keferi tio le nu idi e. I hope you speak or understand yoruba; if not Go to a yoruba person as say a Muslim says you are a keferi and you cant nu idi e. Opuro ara e. You think Allah will admit Christians to Jannah and Mumin to Jahannam? Your head must not be screwed on straight.

Such a long post! And yet for all the words, ramblingly incoherent. Like I pointed out earlier; that Muslims on this forum are so quick to hurl insults at those who disagree with them only shows the kind of spirit that animates them. As Aldous Huxley once said: "A fanatic is a man who consciously over compensates a secret doubt."

Do you think only Muslims read the qur'an and hadiths and so you can come here and pull the wool over our eyes. Here is what your qur'an says about the fate of all Muslims! The problem is that the qur'an was beaten into you while you were young in a language not Yoruba; without you undertaking the necessity of studying it to understand what the Arabic words actually mean! Indeed you are like those Jesus described as:

(KJV) Matthew 6:7. But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.

You think you will be heard for your vain repetitions of the shahada.

According to surah 19:70-72, everyone will enter into hell, including Muslims:
Then We shall pluck forth from every party whichever of them was the most hardened in disdain of the All-merciful; then We shall know very well those most deserving to burn there. Not one of you there is, but he shall go down to it; that for thy Lord is a thing decreed, determined. Then We shall deliver those that were godfearing; and the evildoers We shall leave there, hobbling on their knees.

A host of translations, hadiths and commentaries show that Muslims understood the passage to mean that all of them will enter hell.
Here is how Muslims render the word wurood in S. 19:71.

1. Muslim Translations of the qur'an

    There is not one of you but shall approach it… Pickthall
    Not one of you but will pass over it… Y. Ali
    And there is not one of you but shall pass over it… Daryabadi
    There is not a single one of you, who shall not pass over it… F. Malik
    There is not one of you but will pass over it (Hell)… Hilali-Khan
    And there is not one of you but shall come to it… M.M Ali
    And every one of you will come within sight of it… Asad
    And there is not one of you but shall come to it… Shakir
    And there is not one of you but will come to it… Sher Ali
    And there is none of you except he will come to it… SAHEEH INTERNATIONAL
    there is not one of you but he will be led up to it… T.B. Irving
    Every single one of you must see it… Khalifa
    There is none among you, (O those condemned to Hell!), but shall reach there (- the Hell)… Amatul & ‘Abdul Manan ‘Omar
    It is the inevitable decree of your Lord that every one of you will be taken to hell. Muhammad Sarwar

2. The Quran’s Use of Wurood

In several places the Quran uses different forms of the word wurood in the same context of people entering hell.

He will go before his people on the Day of Judgment, and lead them into the Fire (fa awradahumu alnnara) (as cattle are led to water): But woeful indeed will be the place to which they are led! S. 11:98 Y. Ali

But the sinners will we drive unto (wirdan) Hell, like flocks driven to the watering. S. 19:86 Rodwell

Verily, ye, and what ye worship beside God, shall be fuel for hell: ye shall go down into it (waridoona). S. 21:98 Rodwell

The only possible meaning in these contexts is that evildoers will actually enter into hell itself. Interestingly, 19:86 appears in the same surah just some fifteen verses after 19:71. Since these contexts are virtually identical to 19:71 it therefore follows to reason that the meaning will be the same as well, especially when some fifteen verses later the same word is used in connection with sinners literally entering hell.
Furthermore, the verse right after 19:71 supports the view that people will literally enter hell:

"And there is not one of you but will come to it. This is an absolute decree of thy Lord. And WE shall save the righteous, and shall leave the wrongdoers therein, on their knees."

The statement that Allah will deliver the righteous and leave the wrongdoer in hell presumes that the righteous are in there as well.

Hence, the usage of the term wurood within the Quran in contexts similar to 19:71, as well as the immediate context of the passage itself, conclusively point in the direction of all people, including all Muslims, having to enter into hell for a short while.

3. SAHIH AL-BUKHARI
. . .Anas then said, "Muhammad talked to us saying, 'On the Day of Resurrection THE PEOPLE will surge with each other like waves, and then they will come to Adam and say, 'Please intercede for us with your Lord.'…
. . . Then it will be said, 'O Muhammad, raise your head and speak, for you will be listened to; and ask, for your will be granted (your request); and intercede, for your intercession will be accepted.' I will say, 'O Lord, my followers! My followers!' And then it will be said, 'Go and take out of Hell (Fire) all those who have faith in their hearts, equal to the weight of a barley grain.'
[It goes on and on in the same vein]
. . .Then Allah will say, 'By my Power, and my Majesty, and by My Supremacy, and by My Greatness, I will take out of Hell (Fire) whoever said: 'None has the right to be worshipped except Allah.'" (Volume 9, Book 93, Number 601)
^^Who are the followers of Muhammad, if not people like nopuqeater!

nopuqeater:

and when I call Precap2 a lying rug he will be bent out of shape. my responses to the long posts by the kiriyo keferis are in tradition of the Bible. After all the Bible said two things, according to you: Love your God with all your heart and your neighbors like yourself (OT) and there are 3 gods and jesus being one of them died on the cross and his spilled blood is what covers you from hell (NT). So if the whole Bible is summed up by the two, my writng couldnt be that long for you to read.

I told you calling someone a liar because he's not dining with Muhammad is wrong, but I won't say it again. If that is your best manners, then enjoy.

But let me tell you something, Christians are a special breed, they're not ordinary and most of the things we talk will sound so esoteric to you because you walk according to the flesh. JESUS is the Son of the Most High God, Jesus is also God and deserves our praise and worship. You can't rule it out. See what he said himself, Mark ch 16:17-18

17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; IN MY NAME shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18 they shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

Did you see that? Not in the name of Muhammad could such things happen, it's in the Name of Jesus Christ. Do you need more to know how Jesus and our Father are the same? Read what follow, Matthew 28:19

19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.

This is the Word of God. So you baptize in the Name of The Father and of The Son and of The Holy spirit. It's not in the invention of any man. It's God Himself speaking.

Come to Jesus Christ today and have a new and beautiful life.

Holla!

precap2:

Guy you really ate 2 plates of nepuq before coming to your computer. What a long writing with no point in particular. Haba!

Holla moi!

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Then i laugh in ridiculous pidgin.

There is not one of you but shall approach it… Pickthall
Not one of you but will pass over it… Y. Ali
And there is not one of you but shall pass over it… Daryabadi
There is not a single one of you, who shall not pass over it… F. Malik
There is not one of you but will pass over it (Hell)… Hilali-Khan
And there is not one of you but shall come to it… M.M Ali

In all this versions you have quoted where does it indicate that all muslims shall enter hell they all indicate coming within rage og it it is just like passing over an ocean would one say that you have entered the ocean? guess not

3. SAHIH AL-BUKHARI
. . .Anas then said, "Muhammad talked to us saying, 'On the Day of Resurrection THE PEOPLE will surge with each other like waves, and then they will come to Adam and say, 'Please intercede for us with your Lord.'…
. . . Then it will be said, 'O Muhammad, raise your head and speak, for you will be listened to; and ask, for your will be granted (your request); and intercede, for your intercession will be accepted.' I will say, 'O Lord, my followers! My followers!' And then it will be said, 'Go and take out of Hell (Fire) all those who have faith in their hearts, equal to the weight of a barley grain.'
[It goes on and on in the same vein]
. . .Then Allah will say, 'By my Power, and my Majesty, and by My Supremacy, and by My Greatness, I will take out of Hell (Fire) whoever said: 'None has the right to be worshipped except Allah.'" (Volume 9, Book 93, Number 601)

Now we should all ask why are you quoting the hadiths from the middle,notice the dots indicating he ignored the first part of the hadith only trying to quote the part that suit what he is saying, all this hadiths indicate that Unrepentant muslims shall go to hell that is bad muslims shall go to hell and after serving punishment there they will be forgiven as Allah wills, if there is any reason that we call people like alethia Liars it is because they engage in misquoting, half quoting etc in order to win a point just like Paul said: " If through my falsehood God's truthfulness abounds to His glory, why am I still being condemned as a sinner." (Romans 3:7), thereby disregarding and contradicting his own book where we read: "A faithful witness does not lie, but a false witness breathes out lies." (Proverbs 14:5). what a pity the devil is not the only Liar.

More on the hell stuff

Book 031, Number 6090:



Umm Mubashshir reported that she heard Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) as saying in presence of Hafsa: God willing, the people of the Tree would never enter the fire of Hell one amongst those who owed allegiance under that. She said: Allah's Messenger, why not? He scolded her. Hafsa said: And there is none amongst you but shall have to pass over that (narrow Bridge). Thereupon Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) said: Allah, the Exalted and Glorious, has said: We would rescue those persons who are God-conscious and we would leave the tyrants to their fate there (xix. 72).

In conclusion, we have examined the different opinions surrounding this topic and we have demonstrated that the strongest opinion is that waariduha in the verse refers to crossing over hell on the sirat

vedaxcool:

There is not one of you but shall approach it… Pickthall
Not one of you but will pass over it… Y. Ali
And there is not one of you but shall pass over it… Daryabadi
There is not a single one of you, who shall not pass over it… F. Malik
There is not one of you but will pass over it (Hell)… Hilali-Khan
And there is not one of you but shall come to it… M.M Ali

In all this versions you have quoted where does it indicate that all muslims shall enter hell they all indicate coming within rage og it it is just like passing over an ocean would one say that you have entered the ocean? guess not

3. SAHIH AL-BUKHARI
. . .Anas then said, "Muhammad talked to us saying, 'On the Day of Resurrection THE PEOPLE will surge with each other like waves, and then they will come to Adam and say, 'Please intercede for us with your Lord.'…
. . . Then it will be said, 'O Muhammad, raise your head and speak, for you will be listened to; and ask, for your will be granted (your request); and intercede, for your intercession will be accepted.' I will say, 'O Lord, my followers! My followers!' And then it will be said, 'Go and take out of Hell (Fire) all those who have faith in their hearts, equal to the weight of a barley grain.'
[It goes on and on in the same vein]
. . .Then Allah will say, 'By my Power, and my Majesty, and by My Supremacy, and by My Greatness, I will take out of Hell (Fire) whoever said: 'None has the right to be worshipped except Allah.'" (Volume 9, Book 93, Number 601)

Now we should all ask why are you quoting the hadiths from the middle,notice the dots indicating he ignored the first part of the hadith only trying to quote the part that suit what he is saying, all this hadiths indicate that Unrepentant muslims shall go to hell that is bad muslims shall go to hell and after serving punishment there they will be forgiven as Allah wills, if there is any reason that we call people like alethia Liars it is because they engage in misquoting, half quoting etc in order to win a point just like Paul said: " If through my falsehood God's truthfulness abounds to His glory, why am I still being condemned as a sinner." (Romans 3:7), thereby disregarding and contradicting his own book where we read: "A faithful witness does not lie, but a false witness breathes out lies." (Proverbs 14:5). what a pity the devil is not the only Liar.

^^^Since you claim to be telling the truth, why don't you post the full hadith here for all of us to see that you are the one lying. That's all you would have done to prove me a liar or doesn't the hadith say what I posted. In any case, the reference is there for any sincere truth seeker to look it up and confirm it.
Didn't you see the part where I put "[It goes on and on in the same vein]" indicating that it was a rather repetitious hadith.
In any case doesn't the hadith either in it's entirety or in part show your prophet interceding for the muslims (his followers) who are in hell? You are just caviling and splitting hairs here! How right when Jesus described some people as straining at a gnat while swallowing a whole camel!

Your false prophet can not save you. If you are genuinely seeking to know God then He will show Himself to you for He says:
Jeremiah 29:13
And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart
Come to Jesus the Messiah (Yeshua Ha'Mashiach) now and He will save you from your sins! For there is no name given under Heaven by which men shall be saved except the name of Jesus!

aletheia:

^^^Since you claim to be telling the truth, why don't you post the full hadith here for all of us to see that you are the one lying. That's all you would have done to prove me a liar or doesn't the hadith say what I posted. In any case, the reference is there for any sincere truth seeker to look it up and confirm it.
Didn't you see the part where I put "[It goes on and on in the same vein]" indicating that it was a rather repetitious hadith.
In any case doesn't the hadith either in it's entirety or in part show your prophet interceding for the muslims (his followers) who are in hell? You are just caviling and splitting hairs here! How right when Jesus described some people as straining at a gnat while swallowing a whole camel!

Your false prophet can not save you. If you are genuinely seeking to know God then He will show Himself to you for He says:
Jeremiah 29:13
And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart
Come to Jesus the Messiah (Yeshua Ha'Mashiach) now and He will save you from your sins! For there is no name given under Heaven by which men shall be saved except the name of Jesus!

Liar! Liar!! Liar!!!
Tell the Truth!

Volume 9, Book 93, Number 601:

Narrated Ma'bad bin Hilal Al'Anzi:

We, i.e., some people from Basra gathered and went to Anas bin Malik, and we went in company with Thabit Al-Bunnani so that he might ask him about the Hadith of Intercession on our behalf. Behold, Anas was in his palace, and our arrival coincided with his Duha prayer. We asked permission to enter and he admitted us while he was sitting on his bed. We said to Thabit, "Do not ask him about anything else first but the Hadith of Intercession." He said, "O Abu Hamza! There are your brethren from Basra coming to ask you about the Hadith of Intercession." Anas then said, "Muhammad talked to us saying, 'On the Day of Resurrection the people will surge with each other like waves, and then they will come to Adam and say, 'Please intercede for us with your Lord.' He will say, 'I am not fit for that but you'd better go to Abraham as he is the Khalil of the Beneficent.' They will go to Abraham and he will say, 'I am not fit for that, but you'd better go to Moses as he is the one to whom Allah spoke directly.' So they will go to Moses and he will say, 'I am not fit for that, but you'd better go to Jesus as he is a soul created by Allah and His Word.' (Be: And it was) they will go to Jesus and he will say, 'I am not fit for that, but you'd better go to Muhammad.'

They would come to me and I would say, 'I am for that.' Then I will ask for my Lord's permission, and it will be given, and then He will inspire me to praise Him with such praises as I do not know now. So I will praise Him with those praises and will fall down, prostrate before Him. Then it will be said, 'O Muhammad, raise your head and speak, for you will be listened to; and ask, for your will be granted (your request); and intercede, for your intercession will be accepted.' I will say, 'O Lord, my followers! My followers!' And then it will be said, 'Go and take out of Hell (Fire) all those who have faith in their hearts, equal to the weight of a barley grain.' I will go and do so and return to praise Him with the same praises, and fall down (prostrate) before Him. Then it will be said, 'O Muhammad, raise your head and speak, for you will be listened to, and ask, for you will be granted (your request); and intercede, for your intercession will be accepted.' I will say, 'O Lord, my followers! My followers!' It will be said, 'Go and take out of it all those who have faith in their hearts equal to the weight of a small ant or a mustard seed.' I will go and do so and return to praise Him with the same praises, and fall down in prostration before Him. It will be said, 'O, Muhammad, raise your head and speak, for you will be listened to, and ask, for you will be granted (your request); and intercede, for your intercession will be accepted.' I will say, 'O Lord, my followers!' Then He will say, 'Go and take out (all those) in whose hearts there is faith even to the lightest, lightest mustard seed. (Take them) out of the Fire.' I will go and do so."'

When we left Anas, I said to some of my companions, "Let's pass by Al-Hasan who is hiding himself in the house of Abi Khalifa and request him to tell us what Anas bin Malik has told us." So we went to him and we greeted him and he admitted us. We said to him, "O Abu Said! We came to you from your brother Anas Bin Malik and he related to us a Hadith about the intercession the like of which I have never heard." He said, "What is that?" Then we told him of the Hadith and said, "He stopped at this point (of the Hadith)." He said, "What then?" We said, "He did not add anything to that." He said, Anas related the Hadith to me twenty years ago when he was a young fellow. I don't know whether he forgot or if he did not like to let you depend on what he might have said." We said, "O Abu Said ! Let us know that." He smiled and said, "Man was created hasty. I did not mention that, but that I wanted to inform you of it.

Anas told me the same as he told you and said that the Prophet added, 'I then return for a fourth time and praise Him similarly and prostrate before Him me the same as he 'O Muhammad, raise your head and speak, for you will be listened to; and ask, for you will be granted (your request): and intercede, for your intercession will be accepted .' I will say, 'O Lord, allow me to intercede for whoever said, 'None has the right to be worshiped except Allah.' Then Allah will say, 'By my Power, and my Majesty, and by My Supremacy, and by My Greatness, I will take out of Hell (Fire) whoever said: 'None has the right to be worshipped except Allah.' ''
From the Above you will note that the hadith talks of Muslims with little faith not those with strong faith as you will observe that it says those with"faith in their hearts, equal to the weight of a barley grain." and agin"who have faith in their hearts equal to the weight of a small ant or a mustard seed.'" etc it says those , once again aliar'thia your lies are almost at par with the devil's lies.

Up to the real character.
Who's driving someone insane here

Holla moi!

As for those that claim that Jesus came to die for their sins( may be they love sinning) here are some food for thought
1. Jesus prayed to God to make this cup pass over him, in other words God save me
2. God heard his prayer, in other word God accepted his prayer because God hears all the time, the "heard" is metaphorical for acceptance.
3. Jesus before giving up the ghost shouted My God my God why have thou Forsaken me, this only goes to show that he was an unwilling to die for your sins.
4. If Jesus were God, then couldn't this be read, "Myself, myself why hast thou forsaken me?

@vedaxcool:
So quick to throw out insults. Thank you for posting the full hadith. Please note the bolded words in your post.

vedaxcool:

Liar! Liar!! Liar!!!
Tell the Truth!

Volume 9, Book 93, Number 601:

    Narrated Ma'bad bin Hilal Al'Anzi:

    We, i.e., some people from Basra gathered and went to Anas bin Malik, and we went in company with Thabit Al-Bunnani so that he might ask him about the Hadith of Intercession on our behalf. Behold, Anas was in his palace, and our arrival coincided with his Duha prayer. We asked permission to enter and he admitted us while he was sitting on his bed. We said to Thabit, "Do not ask him about anything else first but the Hadith of Intercession." He said, "O Abu Hamza! There are your brethren from Basra coming to ask you about the Hadith of Intercession." Anas then said, "Muhammad talked to us saying, 'On the Day of Resurrection the people will surge with each other like waves, and then they will come to Adam and say, 'Please intercede for us with your Lord.' He will say, 'I am not fit for that but you'd better go to Abraham as he is the Khalil of the Beneficent.' They will go to Abraham and he will say, 'I am not fit for that, but you'd better go to Moses as he is the one to whom Allah spoke directly.' So they will go to Moses and he will say, 'I am not fit for that, but you'd better go to Jesus as he is a soul created by Allah and His Word.' (Be: And it was) they will go to Jesus and he will say, 'I am not fit for that, but you'd better go to Muhammad.'

    They would come to me and I would say, 'I am for that.' Then I will ask for my Lord's permission, and it will be given, and then He will inspire me to praise Him with such praises as I do not know now. So I will praise Him with those praises and will fall down, prostrate before Him. Then it will be said, 'O Muhammad, raise your head and speak, for you will be listened to; and ask, for your will be granted (your request); and intercede, for your intercession will be accepted.' I will say, 'O Lord, my followers! My followers!' And then it will be said, 'Go and take out of Hell (Fire) all those who have faith in their hearts, equal to the weight of a barley grain.' I will go and do so and return to praise Him with the same praises, and fall down (prostrate) before Him. Then it will be said, 'O Muhammad, raise your head and speak, for you will be listened to, and ask, for you will be granted (your request); and intercede, for your intercession will be accepted.' I will say, 'O Lord, my followers! My followers!' It will be said, 'Go and take out of it all those who have faith in their hearts equal to the weight of a small ant or a mustard seed.' I will go and do so and return to praise Him with the same praises, and fall down in prostration before Him. It will be said, 'O, Muhammad, raise your head and speak, for you will be listened to, and ask, for you will be granted (your request); and intercede, for your intercession will be accepted.' I will say, 'O Lord, my followers!' Then He will say, 'Go and take out (all those) in whose hearts there is faith even to the lightest, lightest mustard seed. (Take them) out of the Fire.' I will go and do so."'

    When we left Anas, I said to some of my companions, "Let's pass by Al-Hasan who is hiding himself in the house of Abi Khalifa and request him to tell us what Anas bin Malik has told us." So we went to him and we greeted him and he admitted us. We said to him, "O Abu Said! We came to you from your brother Anas Bin Malik and he related to us a Hadith about the intercession the like of which I have never heard." He said, "What is that?" Then we told him of the Hadith and said, "He stopped at this point (of the Hadith)." He said, "What then?" We said, "He did not add anything to that." He said, Anas related the Hadith to me twenty years ago when he was a young fellow. I don't know whether he forgot or if he did not like to let you depend on what he might have said." We said, "O Abu Said ! Let us know that." He smiled and said, "Man was created hasty. I did not mention that, but that I wanted to inform you of it.

    Anas told me the same as he told you and said that the Prophet added, 'I then return for a fourth time and praise Him similarly and prostrate before Him me the same as he 'O Muhammad, raise your head and speak, for you will be listened to; and ask, for you will be granted (your request): and intercede, for your intercession will be accepted .' I will say, 'O Lord, allow me to intercede for whoever said, 'None has the right to be worshiped except Allah.' Then Allah will say, 'By my Power, and my Majesty, and by My Supremacy, and by My Greatness, I will take out of Hell (Fire) whoever said: 'None has the right to be worshipped except Allah.' ''

^^^
Four times your prophet reiterates that his followers (Muslims) will need to be removed from the Fire.

vedaxcool:

From the Above you will note that the hadith talks of Muslims with little faith not those with strong faith as you will observe that it says those with"faith in their hearts, equal to the weight of a barley grain." and agin"who have faith in their hearts equal to the weight of a small ant or a mustard seed.'" etc it says those , once again aliar'thia your lies are almost at par with the devil's lies.

Story don change. I thought you said no Muslim will enter hell, only that they will pass near it. Having confronted you with irrefutable evidence from your hadiths, you begin to hedge.

vedaxcool:

In all this versions you have quoted where does it indicate that all muslims shall enter hell they all indicate coming within rage og it it is just like passing over an ocean would one say that you have entered the ocean? guess not

Please come to Jesus of Nazareth; the Only One who can truly intercede for you and save you from righteous Judgement in Hell for your sins. The Shahada, Hajj, Zakat, Salat and Siyam will not save you, they are but like filthy menstrual rags in the sight of the Holy God. Muhammad cannot intercede for you for even he is dead and buried in the grave. Only the One who is alive, (as even you Muslims attest), Yeshua Ha'Mashiach (Jesus Christ) can do so. May God bless you as you consider these words.

ALIAR-TEARS, IT IS A PITY THAT YOUR LIES  are only second the devil's deceit as i have explained the Hadith, refers to bad Muslims, as Nonpugeter has written and I concur and express in my writings you are a great Liar one who engages in Misquoting people I cannot blame u as Paul has sanctioned you Lies in his words If through my falsehood God's truthfulness abounds to His glory, why am I still being condemned as a sinner." (Romans 3:7),so go on lieing as it is a christain virturewe to engage in such and as for accepting your religion count me out as the authors of the Bible crafted failed prophecies which I shall quote

1-  Genesis, Chapter No. 4, Verse No. 12, it says… ‘God told Cain: you will never be able to settle you will be a wanderer.’ Few Verses later on Genesis, Chapter No.4, Verse No.17, says…‘Cain built up a city’ – unfulfilled prophecy.

2-  If you read Jeremiah, Chapter No.36, Verse No.30,  it says that…‘Jehoiachin the father of Jehoiachin… no one will be able to sit on his throne - The throne of David, no one will be able to sit after Jehoiachin.’ If you read later on, II Kings, Chapter No 24, Verse No 6, it says that… ‘Jehoiachin after he died, later on Jehoiachin sat on the throne’ - Unfulfilled prophecy.

3-  One is sufficient to prove it is not the word of God - I can give plenty. If you read Ezekiel, Chapter No 26, it says that…‘Nebuchader, he will destroyed Tyre.’ We come to know that Alexander the great, was the person who destroyed Tyre - Unfulfilled prophecy.

4-  Isaiah, Chapter No. 7, Verse No 14, says, prophesying of…‘The coming of a person who will be born to a virgin - his name shall be Emmanuel.’ They say… the Christians - it refers to Jesus Christ peace be upon him. Born to a virgin - the Hebrew word there is ‘amla’, which means not ‘a virgin’- ‘a young lady.’ The word for ‘virgin’ in Hebrew is, ‘baitula’, which is not there. Even if you agree - we are using concordance - we agree… ‘Virgin’… ‘Virgin’ - No problem. It says… ‘He will be called Immanuel.’ No where in the Bible is Jesus Christ peace be upon him, is called as Immanuel - Unfulfilled prophecy.

Before stuffing Bible in my throat go and ask your failing bible why it fails and like I indicated in one of my thread why did Jesus shout My God My God why have thou forsaken, if wisdom still abides in your head why would your suppose savior accused his master or himself (myself myself why have I forsaken me,  if Jesus WAS god?) of forsaking him when he knows what his mission entails and then die in Islam that is unbelief, keep you forsaking religion to yourself,were Jesus (How false your bible is) called non Jews dog,in the incidence where he said to the women why cast the bread of the children to the dogs or was it pigs, Anyway one cannot blame you as religion if not done with reason can be a brain wash to people like you.

vedaxcool:

ALIAR-TEARS, IT IS A PITY THAT YOUR LIES  are only second the devil's deciet as i have explained the Hadith refers to bad Muslims as Nonpugeter has written and I concur and express in my writting you are a great Liar one who engages in Misquoting people I cannpt blame u as Paul has sanctioned you Lies in his words If through my falsehood God's truthfulness abounds to His glory, why am I still being condemned as a sinner." (Romans 3:7),so go on lieing as it is a christain virturewe to engage in such and as for accepting your religion count me out as the authors of the Bible crafted failed prophecies which I shall quote

Have you lost interest in literature? Or is this the best you can do? How can you read something and cut out a part that is rhetorical just to prove a useless point? Here is Roma 3: 7 & 8, and I'll not offer any explanation until you say what you understand there:

7 For if the truth of God hath more abounded through my lie unto his glory; why yet am I also judged as a sinner?
8 and not rather, (as we be slanderously reported, and as some affirm that we say,) Let us do evil, that good may come? whose damnation is just.

ALIAR-TEARS, IT IS A PITY THAT YOUR LIES are only second the devil's deceit as i have explained the Hadith, refers to bad Muslims, as Nonpugeter has written and I concur and express in my writings you are a great Liar one who engages in Misquoting people I cannot blame u as Paul has sanctioned you Lies in his words If through my falsehood God's truthfulness abounds to His glory, why am I still being condemned as a sinner." (Romans 3:7),so go on lieing as it is a christain virturewe to engage in such and as for accepting your religion count me out as the authors of the Bible crafted failed prophecies which I shall quote

1- Genesis, Chapter No. 4, Verse No. 12, it says… ‘God told Cain: you will never be able to settle you will be a wanderer.’ Few Verses later on Genesis, Chapter No.4, Verse No.17, says…‘Cain built up a city’ – unfulfilled prophecy.

2- If you read Jeremiah, Chapter No.36, Verse No.30, it says that…‘Jehoiachin the father of Jehoiachin… no one will be able to sit on his throne - The throne of David, no one will be able to sit after Jehoiachin.’ If you read later on, II Kings, Chapter No 24, Verse No 6, it says that… ‘Jehoiachin after he died, later on Jehoiachin sat on the throne’ - Unfulfilled prophecy.

3- One is sufficient to prove it is not the word of God - I can give plenty. If you read Ezekiel, Chapter No 26, it says that…‘Nebuchader, he will destroyed Tyre.’ We come to know that Alexander the great, was the person who destroyed Tyre - Unfulfilled prophecy.

4- Isaiah, Chapter No. 7, Verse No 14, says, prophesying of…‘The coming of a person who will be born to a virgin - his name shall be Emmanuel.’ They say… the Christians - it refers to Jesus Christ peace be upon him. Born to a virgin - the Hebrew word there is ‘amla’, which means not ‘a virgin’- ‘a young lady.’ The word for ‘virgin’ in Hebrew is, ‘baitula’, which is not there. Even if you agree - we are using concordance - we agree… ‘Virgin’… ‘Virgin’ - No problem. It says… ‘He will be called Immanuel.’ No where in the Bible is Jesus Christ peace be upon him, is called as Immanuel - Unfulfilled prophecy.

Before stuffing Bible in my throat go and ask your failing bible why it fails and like I indicated in one of my thread why did Jesus shout My God My God why have thou forsaken, if wisdom still abides in your head why would your suppose savior accused his master or himself (myself myself why have I forsaken me, if Jesus WAS god?) of forsaking him when he knows what his mission entails and then die in Islam that is unbelief, keep you forsaking religion to yourself,were Jesus (How false your bible is) called non Jews dog,in the incidence where he said to the women why cast the bread of the children to the dogs or was it pigs, Anyway one cannot blame you as religion if not done with reason can be a brain wash to people like you.


A word is enough for the wise

no Muslim will enter hell, only that they will pass near it.

What's the point of just passing near without getting the full gist firsthand. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Then i laugh like a local dog.

vedaxcool:

ALIAR-TEARS, IT IS A PITY THAT YOUR LIES are only second the devil's deceit as i have explained the Hadith, refers to bad Muslims, as Nonpugeter has written and I concur. . .

^^^Oh, so you concede that there are bad Muslims who will enter Hell.

But you initially said this:

vedaxcool:

In all this versions you have quoted where does it indicate that all muslims shall enter hell they all indicate coming within rage og it it is just like passing over an ocean would one say that you have entered the ocean? guess not

Implying that Muslims will only actually come near or pass by the Fire.
And now you agree that bad Muslims go to Hell.

So that raises the question: Who is the good Muslim that goes to Heaven without entering Hell? Even you vedaxcool can not answer that question for you have no way of knowing before the Day of Judgment whether you have done enough good deeds to qualify as a "good" Muslim.
Even Muhammad the "best" Muslim in his own words says on the Day of Judgment he will be in Hell!

Volume 1, Book 12, Number 770:
Narrated Abu Huraira:

The people said, "O Allah's Apostle! Shall we see our Lord on the Day of Resurrection?" He replied, "Do you have any doubt in seeing the full moon on a clear (not cloudy) night?" They replied, "No, O Allah's Apostle!" He said, "Do you have any doubt in seeing the sun when there are no clouds?" They replied in the negative. He said, "You will see Allah (your Lord) in the same way. On the Day of Resurrection, people will be gathered and He will order the people to follow what they used to worship. So some of them will follow the sun, some will follow the moon, and some will follow other deities; and only this nation (Muslims) will be left with its hypocrites. Allah will come to them and say, 'I am Your Lord.' They will say, 'We shall stay in this place till our Lord comes to us and when our Lord will come, we will recognize Him. Then Allah will come to them again and say, 'I am your Lord.' They will say, 'You are our Lord.' Allah will call them, and As-Sirat (a bridge) will be laid across Hell and I (Muhammad) shall be the first amongst the Apostles to cross it with my followers. Nobody except the Apostles will then be able to speak and they will be saying then, 'O Allah! Save us. O Allah Save us.'

There will be hooks like the thorns of Sa'dan in Hell. Have you seen the thorns of Sa'dan?" The people said, "Yes." He said, "These hooks will be like the thorns of Sa'dan but nobody except Allah knows their greatness in size and these will entangle the people according to their deeds; some of them will fall and stay in Hell forever; others will receive punishment (torn into small pieces) and will get out of Hell, till when Allah intends mercy on whomever He likes amongst the people of Hell, He will order the angels to take out of Hell those who worshipped none but Him alone. The angels will take them out by recognizing them from the traces of prostrations, for Allah has forbidden the (Hell) fire to eat away those traces. So they will come out of the Fire, it will eat away from the whole of the human body except the marks of the prostrations. At that time they will come out of the Fire as mere skeletons.. . .

#1. This Hadith says that Muhammad is not in heaven right now but he is waiting for the 'Day of Judgment' to go into heaven and he will be the first to cross the bridge to go to heaven as we read this
#2. Hadith Volume 1, Book 8, Number 345 also says that while Muhammad was in this world he ascended into heaven and saw many prophets and other Bible characters like Adam, Moses, Jesus and Abraham.

Questions that vedaxcool, et al should give us answers to:
#1. If your prophet saw the paradise while he was still alive and on this earth why he should wait to go to heaven after his death?
#2. Where is your prophet right now and why he is waiting for the 'Day of Judgment?
#3. Why could he not reach heaven while he saw many ancient prophets and the first human of this planet earth - Adam who lived many thousands of years before him.
#4. All are in heaven but your prophet says, he will reach heaven on the Day of Judgment, why?

It is written:
Romans 3:23. For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God
Romans 6:23. For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

We shall stay in this place till our Lord comes to us and when our Lord will come, we will recognize Him.There will be hooks like the thorns of Sa'dan in Hell. Have you seen the thorns of Sa'dan? Allah intends mercy on whomever He likes amongst the people of Hell. At that time they will come out of the Fire as mere skeletons. . . .

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha diths.

aletheia:


And now you agree that bad Muslims go to Hell.

So that raises the question: Who is the good Muslim that goes to Heaven without entering Hell? Even you vedaxcool can not . . . (Precap2 add: cannot enter into heaven )

Only the suicide bombers will go to heaven, otherwise how would they get their virgins? There are no virgins in hell fire.

aletheia:


#2. Hadith Volume 1, Book 8, Number 345 also says that while Muhammad was in this world he ascended into heaven and saw many prophets and other Bible characters like Adam, Moses, Jesus and Abraham.

Questions that vedaxcool, et al should give us answers to:

Muhammad was one smart guy, but what baffles me is why after he saw Jesus who would save him from hell, he still decided to take a whole lot of people with him into that same hell. Why? Is that the quality of a benevolent leader? Mysterium iniquitatis

As for questions for vodaxcool and the ilks, forget matter, they never fit swallow akamu na to swallow fufu go come easy pass for them.

Holla moi!

Original what?? Sin.
Hey guys irrespective of what ever you dont give this original bulshi.t again. Even if adam started this original sin, i thought this fools says that jesus ended it. dont give me this crap again, original bulsh.it.
and if think your great grand father is thief, adultery, fornicator,lier,cheater,, , to warrant you having original nonsence, didnt thesama book says it only last for four generation or contractory i never inherit any sin?

@vedaxcool: I asked you and your cohort in an earlier post some questions which you seem to be avoiding answers to. For the benefit of doubt and in order not to derail this thread, I have opened another thread here, where you can give me the answers I seek. No waffling. Convince us of why Islam is the best. I await your answers.

^^^^Your questions have been answered. Just like every sommunity, we have our bad eggs, too. After al we are humans behaving humanly. But you were trying to tell us though that the messenger will go to hell to be punished saying by it that no one will go unpunished among the brand of islam that Muhammad (AS) brought, since event the chairman, Muhammad will be punished by the Lord Who sent hm as His servant in the first place!

Go to the thread. I hae answered it as best as I can. Allah is the One Who answers best.

@Precap2: « #150 on: Yesterday at 09:43:11 PM »

Quote from: aletheia on Yesterday at 07:34:29 PM

And now you agree that bad Muslims go to Hell.

So that raises the question: Who is the good Muslim that goes to Heaven without entering Hell? Even you vedaxcool can not . . . (Precap2 add: cannot enter into heaven Grin)

Only the suicide bombers will go to heaven, otherwise how would they get their virgins? There are no virgins in hell fire.

Quote from: aletheia on Yesterday at 07:34:29 PM

#2. Hadith Volume 1, Book 8, Number 345 also says that while Muhammad was in this world he ascended into heaven and saw many prophets and other Bible characters like Adam, Moses, Jesus and Abraham.

Questions that vedaxcool, et al should give us answers to:


Muhammad was one smart guy, but what baffles me is why after he saw Jesus who would save him from hell, he still decided to take a whole lot of people with him into that same hell. Why? Is that the quality of a benevolent leader? Mysterium iniquitatis Shocked

As for questions for vodaxcool and the ilks, forget matter, they never fit swallow akamu na to swallow fufu go come easy pass for them.

Holla moi!

You are true to west coast gangster rap eazle my chezle mindset; You are one cool gangster. But you are liar. If Muhammad saw Jesus and still not follow christianity, we can deduce many thngs from the chanced meeting:

Jesus agreed with Muhammad is the obvious choice. It proves what we have been saying all along; Muhammad is the natural successor to Jesus in the offices of comforter, prophethood, mesengership.

Jesus was not in the position to tell Muhammad what to do or say since Jesus did not have the authority to, but God Allah (Eloi) does have the Authority.

If Jesus disagrees with Muhammad, Jesus was overwhelmed because other prophet and messengers that Muhammad saw are on the side of Muhammad. Afterall, no one of them says a human being is God.

At least you can under stand these simple explanatons.

Only the suicide bombers will go to heaven, otherwise how would they get their virgins? There are no virgins in hell fire.

In christianity only those who partook in the Inquisition and crusades will make it to Heaven, in their book that is what qualifies you to be in heaven,

God loves you, God is the most forgiving and most merciful. Christianity claims God did not forgive the actions of Adam for millenniums , while Islam teaches Adam was forgiven the same moment Adam repented, and that death is a natural cycle , not a prolonged curse from our Loving God .

vedaxcool:

In christianity only those who partook in the Inquisition and crusades will make it to Heaven, in their book that is what qualifies you to be in heaven,

^Please show us where that is written in the Bible or be revealed to the world as a liar.

I asked you some questions above, only for you to avoid answering them. Goes to show, you don't even know the religion you are professing. At least your compatriot nopuqeater tried, only to entangle himself in contradictions.

Deuteronomy 3:3-7 God ordered Moses’ army to “utterly destroy” 60 cities, killing all the women and children within!

Deuteronomy 7:12 God ordered the Israelites to kill all the people of seven nations. He even adds, “show no mercy unto them”.

Deuteronomy 20:16 God orders that we kill everything that breathes in the cities that he gives us for an inheritance

Now this are just a few of the bunker verses that the crusaders used to justify their cruelty and evil, unless again you will say you people use the old testament is for aestethic reasons, so we will say they were following biblical injuctions and ways and hence they they doing "Good" by the old testament.


"Take all the heads of the people
and hang them up before the Lord
against the sun.” -- Numbers 25:4


", They shall fall by the sword:
their infants shall be dashed in
pieces, and their women with child
(pregnant) shall be ripped up!"
direct quote from YHWH -- Hosea 13:16

Their children shall be dashed
to pieces before their eyes!
There houses spoiled, and their
wives raped, Dash the young men
to pieces, have no pity on the
fruit of the womb, the children
shall not be spared"
-- Isa 13:16-18


This are just some of the verses inquisitors and crusaders got their "good" advice and historical "goodness" to learn from, hence they are following the footsteps of their godfathers.

^Thought as much, you spiritual descendant of Amalek. You couldn't find a single supporting verse from the Injeel (the one you say Christians corrupted). Some of the verses quoted above, you wrested out of context. The context and explanation of the others you will find in Genesis 6:4, Number 13:33, Deut 2:20-21, Deut 3:11; not that it will make any sense to you seeing as there is a dullness over your understanding.

This is written in the OT.
Genesis 9:5-6. And surely your blood of your lives will I require; at the hand of every beast will I require it, and at the hand of man; at the hand of every man's brother will I require the life of man. Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man.
And this is written in the NT.
Matthew 26:52. Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.
Romans 12:19. Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.