hoopernikao:


Bro, like I told you. Consequences of human actions aren't placed within their limits. Anyway you want to look at it. This is a reality of life. Man only works with what his mind can comprehend but their are more to life than humans mind can comprehend. That is how man was made.

If a man shoots himself is either he dies or he doesn't, it's that simple.

What's there not to comprehend.

GRIMMJOE:
I didn't mention church again, atheist are free thinkers, any atheist that don't know much about a particular religion before making a decision isn't a freethinker, you can be a freethinker without being an atheist.

That's why you'll never see a freethinker commit suicide because they've weighed all possibility, and will refused to be control by their struggle in life instead find strength in it, see life from a different angle, this can only be done by free thinking, not atheism.

You are funny o. You will never see a free thinker commit suicide .

Suicide doesn't have a religion or tribe. At the base of the actions of suicide is the influence of this world. No legislation, rules, human knowledge can satisfy human's desire nor eradicate humans challenge.

At the base of all humans challenges are influences that control us.

So, whenever you point to crimes, sins, personal destruction don't ever clarify by human type or knowledge. If our actions are truly free, crime as small as simple as stealing would have been eradicated by now. Even with the best minds in the world coming together, no legislation or rules or scientific discovery has been able to eradicate this. WHY? Man is subjected to influences and travail in subjection to mortality of the flesh.

Legislation can only punish, persecute, destroy but can never eradicate the crime because no legislation can get to the root of the influence on humanity, only God can.

GRIMMJOE:
If a man shoots himself is either he dies or he doesn't, it's that simple.

What's there not to comprehend.

Does he determine what happened to him afterwards, dies he determine whether he dies or not? His action (shoot the gun) is the only thing he determines still based on influence.

The consequence (from his mind is death) but you just said now that he has options to still live. That means he cant determine his end. He presume his end.

hoopernikao:


You are funny o. You will never see a free thinker commit suicide .

Suicide doesn't have a religion or tribe. At the base of the actions of suicide is the influence of this world. No legislation, rules, human knowledge can satisfy human's desire nor eradicate humans challenge.

At the base of all humans challenges are influences that control us.

So, whenever you point to crimes, sins, personal destruction don't ever clarify by human type or knowledge. If our actions are truly free, crime as small as simple as stealing would have been eradicated by now. Even with the best minds in the world coming together, no legislation or rules or scientific discovery has been able to eradicate this. WHY? Man is subjected to influences and travail in subjection to mortality of the flesh.

Legislation can only punish, persecute, destroy but can never eradicate the crime because no legislation can get to the root of the influence on humanity, only God can.

You think the price of free thinking comes cheap, it's throwing away everything you know and start all over with a open mind, if it was that easy everyone would be a freethinker.

That's why those that have crossed the boundary are longer limited, things like suicide are for people that believe in one fix fallacy.

hoopernikao:

Does he determine what happened to him afterwards, dies he determine whether he dies or not? His action (shoot the gun) is the only thing he determines still based on influence.

The consequence (from his mind is death) but you just said now that he has options to still live. That means he cant determine his end. He presume his end.

Yes he determine what happens to him after wards, suicide won't commit itself.

Thought I should share.

See this
John 8:12
12 Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life

At the bold.

Light of the world is not speaking about sun. Light means illumination, where light is, you see clearly. Hence light of life is a direction. It is an influence.

The word follow is from the word akoloutheo. It means to follow a path. That speaks about influence.

The word walk is from the word peripateo. It simply means to conduct yourself in a particular way. An influenced conduct.

Hence, light as influence, will determine your actions if you choose it.

The phrase shall not walk in darkness implies to be directed in darkness. That means the illustration here uses darkness as direction and influence also.

So light as influence to life, darkness also as influence also.

The choice of man are limited to this. Light is in a person not in freethinking. That light is what makes all things clear to you whether they are pleasant or not, you can see clearly the reasons for things.

The reason I told you that thinking hard doesn't mean living right or knowing the right thing.

What you should always ask yourself is, what is influencing my decision. This is the critical question.

GRIMMJOE:
Thought I should share.

If that post refer to Christianity. Then

You can see the summary of ignorance I have been speaking of in just one post. Many speaks on what they knew nothing about.

1. He assumed firstly that Christianity is about doing good or not. Very poor display of knowledge.

2. He assumed that the ability of being able to do good is the solution to human problem. Another illusion.

3. He assumed that religion is the root of human problems.

Looking at his statement, it's obvious the devil has got him exactly where he wants him to be. In self denial and not being able to see clearly.

It is a very dull submission from him.

hoopernikao:
See this
John 8:12
12 Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life

At the bold.

Light of the world is not speaking about sun. Light means illumination, where light is, you see clearly. Hence light of life is a direction. It is an influence.

The word follow is from the word akoloutheo. It means to follow a path. That speaks about influence.

The word walk is from the word peripateo. It simply means to conduct yourself in a particular way. An influenced conduct.

Hence, light as influence, will determine your actions if you choose it.

The phrase shall not walk in darkness implies to be directed in darkness. That means the illustration here uses darkness as direction and influence also.

So light as influence to life, darkness also as influence also.

The choice of man are limited to this. Light is in a person not in freethinking. That light is what makes all things clear to you whether they are pleasant or not, you can see clearly the reasons for things.

The reason I told you that thinking hard doesn't mean living right or knowing the right thing.

What you should always ask yourself is, what is influencing my decision. This is the critical question.

As you can see you couldn't think for yourself, you had to depend on a book to do it for you.

A man pulling the trigger already know either he dies or he doesn't, you don't need a book to tell you this.

GRIMMJOE:
You think the price of free thinking comes cheap, it's throwing away everything you know and start all over with a open mind, if it was that easy everyone would be a freethinker.

That's why those that have crossed the boundary are longer limited, things like suicide are for people that believe in one fix fallacy.

There is nothing like throwing all away.
Your decision is subjected to influence. Even your thoughts are already influenced before it comes.

hoopernikao:


If that post refer to Christianity. Then

You can see the summary of ignorance I have been speaking of in just one post. Many speaks on what they knew nothing about.

1. He assumed firstly that Christianity is about doing good or not. Very poor display of knowledge.

2. He assumed that the ability of being able to do good is the solution to human problem. Another illusion.

3. He assumed that religion is the root of human problems.

Looking at his statement, it's obvious the devil has got him exactly where he wants him to be. In self denial and not being able to see clearly.

It is a very dull submission from him.

Well I only thought I should share, I cannot defend another mans words.

GRIMMJOE:
As you can see you couldn't think for yourself, you had to depend on a book to do it for you.

A man pulling the trigger already know either he dies or he doesn't, you don't need a book to tell you this.

Do you see your error and closeness of mind?

You have said severally that freethinker read, you research a lot. Now, I used bible to show you a point you called it not thinking for yourself. Do you see that's deception? If I have used another book from freethinker you will hail it.

Your influence comes from other places including book, yet you don't see yourself decieving yourself but a man who uses his own trusted book is deceiving himself.

That is why I told you, that at best the thought of a man thinking is subject to his exposure.

This is why I told you people in your line of thoughts are absolutely not objective.

hoopernikao:


There is nothing like throwing all away.
Your decision is subjected to influence. Even your thoughts are already influenced before it comes.

Yes you get it, just like the man point of view you just rejected is only an influence, but the final decision is still up to you.

GRIMMJOE:
Well I only thought I should share, I cannot defend another mans words.

You don't need to defend him but his writing summarised the momentarily thought of those against religion especially atheist.

hoopernikao:


Do you see your error and closeness of mind?

You have said severally that freethinker read, you research a lot. Now, I used bible to show you a point you called it not thinking for yourself. Do you see that's deception? If I have used another book from freethinker you will hail it.

Your influence comes from other places including book, yet you don't see yourself decieving yourself but a man who uses his own trusted book is deceiving himself.

That is why I told you, that at best the thought of a man thinking is subject to his exposure.

This is why I told you people in your line of thoughts are absolutely not objective.

I can only defend the book I wrote, until then it still remains just a book.

GRIMMJOE:
I can only defend the book I wrote, until then it still remains just a book.

Even the book you with write are compendium of other people that influenced you. Stop these denial.

hoopernikao:


You don't need to defend him but his writing summarised the momentarily thought of those against religion especially atheist.

If you keep looking at things like this, youll never have an open mind.

GRIMMJOE:
Yes you get it, just like the man point of view you just rejected is only an influence, but the final decision is still up to you.

That is choice presented to me. And my choices are limited which I chose from.

hoopernikao:


Even the book you with write are compendium of other people that influenced you. Stop these denial.

I haven't written any book and claim the book is more than a book, till then a book is just a book.

hoopernikao:


That is choice presented to me. And my choices are limited which I chose from.

Maybe you think so because you're not free yet.

A man without a child doesn't need to put himself down after trying several times, look at things from a different angle he can still adopt and choose to be happy, or be sad and bitter for the rest of his life.

But the time will come, he will die, that child will die, and even those mocking the man for being childless will all be dead, only those who are free can see life this way.

hoopernikao:


Rozz, the basis of argument of fairheart is not about denomination but Christ and what the scriptures teachings. It is an old pattern to distract the true discussion when someone start seeking to know what does not address the discussion, same as a man who starts bragging about where he comes from but neglected the true discussion at hand.

I have been called several names on this OP all along because I raised questions that require critical thinking and proper look at the scriptures.

The same people that said they will not respond or argue with me that I am looking for arguments and that I am not open etc as at page ~36 of this OP, are the same arguing here till page 73 of same OP. Giving respond and contending with others. Why?

The issue is, when you start selecting what questions you can be asked to defend in the scriptures, it's either you don't know what you are saying or you are lying with what you are saying.

The simple principle of argument and discussion is that the moment you contribute to an argument, you have already on a side and must be ready to defend your words. So, trying to select the opponents you want is just a game played by children.

---

Like I have told you earlier. Stick to what you know, I don't know your church and I don't need to know, your doctrine is enough for me to know what your church likely stands for, that is what I can judge not your church. Hence don't take eloquency braggado, or cunningness to be same as truth and sincerity especially online.


Along this OP, I know you are trying to find the truth inbetween the two lines of Tri God and Uni God preachers, but sometimes and most times, truth aren't inbetween, truth are revealed at the end of the line that is true. But such end are only attained through unwavering conviction.

He was sounding like a freethinker that's why I asked which church he attends

Rozz:
He was sounding like a freethinker that's why I asked which church he attends

The fairheart boy is not interested in the discussion, all he wants is you!
He tried to be smart because you seems to be in tune with JWs, so to play the the good guy he presented himself as a friend of all so that you can have private conversation with him through DM.

I didn't want to intercept his moves but just to alert him that i'm smarter than that childish move, if he wants Rose he can do that on another level.

I've seen several other threads of yours where that could be done not here where a serious discussion is on!

That's why he became bitter and offended, whenever you say "what Church do you attend?"

Maximus69:


The fairheart boy is not interested in the discussion, all he wants is you!
He tried to be smart because you seems to be in tune with JWs, so to play the the good guy he presented himself as a friend of all so that you can have private conversation with him through DM.

I didn't want to intercept his moves but just to alert him that i'm smarter than that childish move, if he wants Rose he can do that on another level.

I've seen several other threads of yours where that could be done not here where a serious discussion is on!

That's why he became bitter and offended, whenever you say "what Church do you attend?"

haha LMAO,you are so funny,nice move from him though

Rozz:
haha LMAO,you are so funny,nice move from him though

Seriously whenever you have another conversation with him, don't ask that question again. It belongs only to JWs!

Maximus69:


Seriously whenever you have another conversation with him, don't ask that question again. It belongs only to JWs!

I hear you sir, he must be a smooth talker,and also best at his games sha.lol

Rozz:
I hear you sir, he must be a smooth talker,and also best at his games sha.lol

I disagree with the bolded, even during my early twenties i do woo ladies far much older than me for my seniors in school.
He is not smart at all, he should have waited for another opportunity to catch you not in the heat of a serious debate.

That's not smart enough!

Maximus69:


I disagree with the bolded, even during my early twenties i do woo ladies far much older than me for my seniors in school.
He is not smart at all, he should have waited for another opportunity to catch you not in the heat of a serious debate.

That's not smart enough!

You are cracking me up seriously lol, God truly captured your heart after been so adventurous.

Rozz:
You are cracking me up seriously lol, God truly captured your heart after been so adventurous.

That's Jehovah's sheep for you.
Our former lifestyles doesn't matter at all, once we found pure worship we try to keep our lifestyle in check by submitting to God's standard.
That's why we're always serious about pure worship, other forms of worship makes it difficult to believe in the existence of God, but once we're certain we've found God's organization, the next thing is submission.
No rebellious human can come into God's arrangement, they'll be giving excuses for disobeying clear orders!

Maximus69:


The fairheart boy is not interested in the discussion, all he wants is you!
He tried to be smart because you seems to be in tune with JWs, so to play the the good guy he presented himself as a friend of all so that you can have private conversation with him through DM.

I didn't want to intercept his moves but just to alert him that i'm smarter than that childish move, if he wants Rose he can do that on another level.

I've seen several other threads of yours where that could be done not here where a serious discussion is on!

That's why he became bitter and offended, whenever you say "what Church do you attend?"

It is my principle that I do not remain silent in the presence of evil. And that's why I'll reply to you once, and for all.
It's evil of you to say I became bitter and offended. Throughout the entire discussion, there was no time I was angry, offended, or held anything against any of you. I remained engaged, and tried as much as I could to answer your question except for which church I go.

I have seen several my mentions by you, how you said I chose to be fair to seek your acceptance, or picking "fairheart", etc. The way you write and the words you put up here since I left the first comment says a lot about you than who I am. It is obvious you're amateur JW, and still need to do a lot of reading, but not merely that, refrain from thinking you're better than others.

God has been so kind to me intellectually that I will not stoop and drag myself in the mud you are right now. Your opinion doesn't matter to me, but when you feel comfortable saying bad things about other on a faceless forum like this, it shows how untrained, mis-educated, and religious you are. I am not a religious person; I am a spiritual person. I am sure you know the two ain't the same. Religious people are holy in their eyes, i.e the pharisees: they see others as unworthy, couldn't welcome others in their midst, believed they held the key to the Kingdom of God, imposed their religious view, and so on. YOU, not JW as organization, is religious (I needed to point this out for I see you are a picky reader; you pick words instead of doing objective reading).

Spiritual people don't judge, they accept all--which is why I have and I will give any JW opportunity to talk with me. I am not a bitter person at all. I have received far too much education and social training than that. So, I will not stoop and come down to your level to antagonize you. Get more education and talk to elders to teach you how to do constructive discussion and I will be happy to engage you again.

fairheart:


It is my principle that I do not remain silent in the presence of evil. And that's why I'll reply to you once, and for all.
It's evil of you to say I became bitter and offended. Throughout the entire discussion, there was no time I was angry, offended, or held anything against any of you. I remained engaged, and tried as much as I could to answer your question except for which church I go.

I have seen several my mentions by you, how you said I chose to be fair to seek your acceptance, or picking "fairheart", etc. The way you write and the words you put up here since I left the first comment says a lot about you than who I am. It is obvious you're amateur JW, and still need to do a lot of reading, but not merely that, refrain from thinking you're better than others.

God has been so kind to me intellectually that I will not stoop and drag myself in the mud you are right now. Your opinion doesn't matter to me, but when you feel comfortable saying bad things about other on a faceless forum like this, it shows how untrained, mis-educated, and religious you are. I am not a religious person; I am a spiritual person. I am sure you know the two ain't the same. Religious people are holy in their eyes, i.e the pharisees: they see others as unworthy, couldn't welcome others in their midst, believed they held the key to the Kingdom of God, imposed their religious view, and so on. YOU, not JW as organization, is religious (I needed to point this out for I see you are a picky reader; you pick words instead of doing objective reading).

Spiritual people don't judge, they accept all--which is why I have and I will give any JW opportunity to talk with me. I am not a bitter person at all. I have received far too much education and social training than that. So, I will not stoop and come down to your level to antagonize you. Get more education and talk to elders to teach you how to do constructive discussion and I will be happy to engage you again.

Thanks for your time Sir.

So what is the name of your church?

Maximus69:

Thanks for your time Sir.
So what is the name of your church?

Rozz:
where do you belong, which church do you attend

I think that's just the question Rozz has been asking him, but why has he refused to answer?

TATIME:




I think that's just the question Rozz has been asking him, but why has he refused to answer?

He will not answer JWs, i think he will tell Rozz secretly when she's ready for his Direct Message