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Is The Church Perfect by dimelo: 2:03pm On May 31, 2020
happy Sunday,

for weeks now we've been having this kind of silent argument in my family(church), and the pastor always preach perfection, that we can be perfect, if we say we worship the Almighty God then we ought to be perfect to worship him.

On the other hand I don't think we can be perfect, though we are working towards perfection but my belief is that outright perfection can only be attained when we get to heaven.

saying that we are perfect here on earth in my opinion can push us to becoming too righteous, which ends up with us becoming self righteous and that is a sin in itself.

bottom line is I think that we lost perfection after Adam ate the apple, and now our only window to actual perfection is when we make it to heaven.

so please guys if you understand the bible, I'd like you to clarify me and some of the viewers too who I believe are struggling with grasping the understanding of perfection.
Re: Is The Church Perfect by dimelo: 2:08pm On May 31, 2020
cc
Righteousness89 Chatinent Premiumwriter Edededdy Kpakpandon Omooba77 Journeytoel Olaadegbu
Re: Is The Church Perfect by Righteousness89(m): 2:29pm On May 31, 2020
To Examine this Matter we need to Consult the Bible

Matthew 5:48
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Luke 6:36
Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful.

1peter 1:15-16
15 But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;
16 Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy


All these are Expected of us as People of GOD ALMIGHTY, but it's not what we can do by our Power or by our Experience..

All we need to Do is to Follow The MASTER, JESUS CHRIST by Surrendering to Him. As We Follow HIM , HE will Make Us And Perfect all that Concerns Us.

Matthew 4:19
And he saith unto them, Follow me, and I will make you fishers of men.

1 Like

Re: Is The Church Perfect by JourneytoEL(f): 2:30pm On May 31, 2020
you are right. the earthly church is not perfect, we can only strive to be perfect. But the heavenly fellowship is perfect

1 Like

Re: Is The Church Perfect by Nobody: 2:32pm On May 31, 2020
Righteousness89:
To Examine this Matter we need to Consult the Bible

Matthew 5:48
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Luke 6:36
Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful.

1peter 1:15-16
15 But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;
16 Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy


All these are Expected of us as People of GOD ALMIGHTY, but it's not what we can do by our Power or by our Experience..

All we need to Do is to Follow The MASTER, JESUS CHRIST by Surrendering to Him. As We Follow HIM , HE will Make Us And Perfect all that Concerns Us.

Matthew 4:19
And he saith unto them, Follow me, and I will make you fishers of men.
Re: Is The Church Perfect by dimelo: 3:07pm On May 31, 2020
Righteousness89:
To Examine this Matter we need to Consult the Bible

Matthew 5:48
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Luke 6:36
Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful.

1peter 1:15-16
15 But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;
16 Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy


All these are Expected of us as People of GOD ALMIGHTY, but it's not what we can do by our Power or by our Experience..

All we need to Do is to Follow The MASTER, JESUS CHRIST by Surrendering to Him. As We Follow HIM , HE will Make Us And Perfect all that Concerns Us.

Matthew 4:19
And he saith unto them, Follow me, and I will make you fishers of men.

you see that Matthew 5:48 there, okay wait
let me ask from another angle here.
Jesus Christ who is our template, was he perfect from birth to death ?

just need more clarification
Re: Is The Church Perfect by dimelo: 3:09pm On May 31, 2020
JourneytoEL:
you are right. the earthly church is not perfect, we can only strive to be perfect. But the heavenly fellowship is perfect

thanks for your input journeytoel
Re: Is The Church Perfect by Righteousness89(m): 3:10pm On May 31, 2020
dimelo:


you see that Matthew 5:48 there, okay wait
let me ask from another angle here.
Jesus Christ who is our template, was he perfect from birth to death ?

just need more clarification

JESUS CHRIST is our Perfect Example!

He knew no sin!

Even in Birth, he was Born without Sexual intercourse!

HE is our Perfect Example of Perfection!

That's why Only HIM has the Ability to Make us Perfect

1 Like

Re: Is The Church Perfect by Nobody: 3:35pm On May 31, 2020
Righteousness89:
To Examine this Matter we need to Consult the Bible

Matthew 5:48
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Luke 6:36
Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful.

1peter 1:15-16
15 But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;
16 Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy


All these are Expected of us as People of GOD ALMIGHTY, but it's not what we can do by our Power or by our Experience..

All we need to Do is to Follow The MASTER, JESUS CHRIST by Surrendering to Him. As We Follow HIM , HE will Make Us And Perfect all that Concerns Us.

Matthew 4:19
And he saith unto them, Follow me, and I will make you fishers of men.

We can not be perfect,only our God is perfect.
Those verse you quoted simply tell us to imitate the lifestyle of God so that we can be perfect.
Daniel imitated the lifestyle of God and it made him look like he is perfect

1 Like

Re: Is The Church Perfect by Kobojunkie: 3:45pm On May 31, 2020
dimelo:
for weeks now we've been having this kind of silent argument in my family(church), and the pastor always preach perfection, that we can be perfect, if we say we worship the Almighty God then we ought to be perfect to worship him.

On the other hand I don't think we can be perfect, though we are working towards perfection but my belief is that outright perfection can only be attained when we get to heaven.
@Op, first you need to understand what it means to be perfect as Christ commanded it of us. It has nothing to do with the church you attend by the way, but your personal commitment to Jesus Christ, the new covenant Himself!
Yes, Christ is the one who commands you to be perfect, even as the Father in Heaven is perfect. The context in which He makes that command explains it to you.
Matthew 5 vs 43-48 (ERV)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
43. “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor[k] and hate your enemy.’
44. But I tell you, love your enemies. Pray for those who treat you badly.
45. If you do this, you will be children who are truly like your Father in heaven. He lets the sun rise for all people, whether they are good or bad. He sends rain to those who do right and to those who do wrong.
46. If you love only those who love you, why should you get a reward for that? Even the tax collectors do that.
46. And if you are nice only to your friends, you are no better than anyone else. Even the people who don’t know God are nice to their friends.
48. What I am saying is that you must be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.
Christ has called on His followers to love their neighbors -- not just friends but enemies as well -- just as Father Himself loves them all. Is this too hard for you to do?
Re: Is The Church Perfect by OLAADEGBU(m): 4:00pm On May 31, 2020
dimelo:
happy Sunday,

for weeks now we've been having this kind of silent argument in my family(church), and the pastor always preach perfection, that we can be perfect, if we say we worship the Almighty God then we ought to be perfect to worship him.

On the other hand I don't think we can be perfect, though we are working towards perfection but my belief is that outright perfection can only be attained when we get to heaven.

saying that we are perfect here on earth in my opinion can push us to becoming too righteous, which ends up with us becoming self righteous and that is a sin in itself.

bottom line is I think that we lost perfection after Adam ate the apple, and now our only window to actual perfection is when we make it to heaven.

so please guys if you understand the bible, I'd like you to clarify me and some of the viewers too who I believe are struggling with grasping the understanding of perfection.

Perfection is demanded in spirit not in knowledge. It is true that no one can be perfect in knowledge except God equally no one can be righteous or perfect in their own right except by faith in the death and resurrection in the One who was Perfect. When we take advantage of the finished work of Christ on the Cross by repenting and trusting in Christ then we can by faith become righteous and perfect in spirit and this will invariably reflect on our words and deeds. Blessed Sunday. smiley
Re: Is The Church Perfect by Righteousness89(m): 4:07pm On May 31, 2020
PRE4:


We can not be perfect,only our God is perfect.
Those verse you quoted simply tell us to imitate the lifestyle of God so that we can be perfect.
Daniel imitated the lifestyle of God and it made him look like he is perfect

Bro, Don't say you cannot be perfect! Saying that , you are indirectly calling God a liar..

Imitating GOD does not make us. You don't imitate , you Follow!

What we say is that we cannot be perfect by our power or self..

As we Follow the Master, JESUS, he perfects us

1 Like

Re: Is The Church Perfect by Kobojunkie: 4:11pm On May 31, 2020
PRE4:
We can not be perfect,only our God is perfect.
So Jesus was in error when He called for you to be perfect? Is that what you are saying here?
PRE4:
Those verse you quoted simply tell us to imitate the lifestyle of God so that we can be perfect.
Daniel imitated the lifestyle of God and it made him look like he is perfect
Imitate the lifestyle of God? If you read the context of the commandment that Jesus gave you, you would first understand what it means to be perfect, and what Christ commands you to "imitate" of the character of God. Read below to understand what you are called to do as a follower of Christ.
Matthew 5 vs 43-48 (ERV)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
43. “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor[k] and hate your enemy.’
44. But I tell you, love your enemies. Pray for those who treat you badly.
45. If you do this, you will be children who are truly like your Father in heaven. He lets the sun rise for all people, whether they are good or bad. He sends rain to those who do right and to those who do wrong.
46. If you love only those who love you, why should you get a reward for that? Even the tax collectors do that.
46. And if you are nice only to your friends, you are no better than anyone else. Even the people who don’t know God are nice to their friends.
48. What I am saying is that you must be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.
Christ has called His followers to Love their neighbor - not just those who you like but your enemies as well. Jesus said if you love me, you will OBEY my commandments. Are you seriously unwilling to be perfect as He has called for you to be? undecided
Re: Is The Church Perfect by Nobody: 4:12pm On May 31, 2020
Righteousness89:


Bro, Don't say you cannot be perfect! Saying that , you are indirectly calling God a liar..

Imitating GOD does not make us. You don't imitate , you Follow!

What we say is that we cannot be perfect by our power or self..

As we Follow the Master, JESUS, he perfects us


Okay i get
Re: Is The Church Perfect by Nobody: 4:13pm On May 31, 2020
Kobojunkie:
So Jesus was in error when He called for you to be perfect? Is that what you are saying here?

Imitate the lifestyle of God? If you read the context of the commandment that Jesus gave you, you would first understand what it means to be perfect, and what Christ commands you to "imitate" of the character of God. Read below to understand what you are called to do as a follower of Christ.

Christ has called His followers to Love their neighbor - not just those who you like but your enemies as well. Jesus said if you love me, you will OBEY my commandments. Are you seriously unwilling to be perfect as He has called for you to be? undecided

I understand better now
Re: Is The Church Perfect by Kobojunkie: 5:31pm On May 31, 2020
PRE4:
I understand better now
I am glad! Please, be perfect and teach others to be perfect for Jesus Christ commanded it of us!
If more Christians would know of and obey this, imagine what a better world this would be.
Re: Is The Church Perfect by Kobojunkie: 8:27am On Jun 01, 2020
JourneytoEL:
you are right. the earthly church is not perfect, we can only strive to be perfect. But the heavenly fellowship is perfect
The commandments that Jesus gave, He gave to us as individuals. So a church cannot be said to be perfect, but He did call each of us to perfection.
Re: Is The Church Perfect by JourneytoEL(f): 11:30am On Jun 01, 2020
Kobojunkie:
The commandments that Jesus gave, He gave to us as individuals. So a church cannot be said to be perfect, but He did call each of us to perfection.
you are right. more Grace

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