^^^^Nice video
An example of visionary leadership at work here even though the means (colonialism) were unethical by todays standards.
This guy Sir George Taubman Goldie did wonders in Nigeria when he came in 1877. Remember Mr Biggs of today and its parent company UAC, yeah thats right this guy started it and at some point stiffled local business men in other to run British monopoly.

Today, Mr Biggs, UBA, Unilever etc are still top companies in this country eve after indigenization policy, my point is without vision a person/country cannot achieve much it doesn't matter how much school or resources we have, this guys showed it and are still reaping the fruits today. Again, Nigeria can complain about lack of military strength or whatever but remember in our very own eyes China is recolonizing Africa with small and large businesses. Lets start with West Africa.

The UK has been independent for several hundred years. They've had more TIME to direct their affairs. That is a major reason they have solved some of their most pressing social problems.

But, as a reading of the link below shows, they similarly experienced several decades of extreme poverty and public corruption before they got to where they are today.

People died of hunger in the streets, and froze to death in their homes, while edifices like Buckingham Palace, Wembley Stadium, and the Houses of Parliament were being constructed with public funds. The rich lived very lavishly. The poor majority lived a wretched, miserable existence.  It took several decades of agitation for these problems to be addressed.

Nigeria is only 50 years old. I'm sure in time, we will solve our own social problems as well.


The old London of poverty, deprivation and corruption:

http://www.portcities.org.uk/london/server/show/ConNarrative.78/Social-conditions-in-the-19thcentury-port.html

Jen33:

The UK has been independent for several hundred years. They've had more TIME to direct their affairs. That is a major reason they have solved some of their most pressing social problems.

But, as a reading of the link below shows, they similarly experienced several decades of extreme poverty and public corruption before they got to where they are today.

People died of hunger in the streets, and froze to death in their homes, while edifices like Buckingham Palace, Wembley Stadium, and the Houses of Parliament were being constructed with public funds. The rich lived very lavishly. The poor majority lived a wretched, miserable existence.  It took several decades of agitation for these problems to be addressed.

Nigeria is only 50 years old. I'm sure in time, we will solve our own social problems as well.


The old London of poverty, deprivation and corruption:

http://www.portcities.org.uk/london/server/show/ConNarrative.78/Social-conditions-in-the-19thcentury-port.html

I was enjoying your post until i came across the bolded. I hate it when Nigerians attribute the state of the nation to the age of the country. I may be wrong but is Nigeria not older than Singapore?

Please do not mention any of these ''Asian Tigers''. They received special funding, investment, trade concessions, and market access to the west that African countries can only dream of.

These were deliberately applied by the western powers in their bid to erect in Asia capitalist bulwarks against communism after WW2.

This applies to every last one of the Asian ''Tigers''. Those places were poorer, more corrupt and more tyrannical than anywhere in Africa before western policy transformed the region.

But is 50 years not enough to achieve something meaningful? With all the resources that we have at our disposal.

I'd say we HAVE achieved something meaningful in the last 50 years. Put aside the garbage you read elsewhere - our standard of living has improved DRASTICALLY from the days of colonialism. Infant mortality rates have been halved, malnutrition rates have been cut by at least 2/3rds. We have electricity, no matter how intermittent. We have at least 50 times more kilometres of roads than we did before independence. The majority of our people are literate. We have some of the best educated people in the world who identify themselves as Nigerians. We have the largest middle class on the African continent. We produce steel, computers, and have recently begun manufacturing cars and buses. From zero universities in 1960 we now have 100. We actually have a future, as much of the groundwork has been laid, especially via the mass education promoted by post-colonial Nigerian governments.

At independence, 93% of the country was illiterate, (that figure is 25% today) and most walked around barefoot. Cars were only for the super rich. The thriving metropolis we have today - Lagos, Port Harcourt, Abuja, Calabar, Kaduna etc were all either non existent or were just sleepy provincial towns with a handful of tarred roads and limited commerce.

So we have come a long way.

That is no mean feat for a nation that's just 50. While we can complain about the speed of progress, we cannot honestly claim we have achieved ''nothing'' since independence.

Jen33:

Please do not mention any of these ''Asian Tigers''. They received special funding, investment, trade concessions, and market access to the west that African countries can only dream of.

These were deliberately applied by the western powers in their bid to erect in Asia capitalist bulwarks against communism after WW2.

This applies to every last one of the Asian ''Tigers''. Those places were poorer, more corrupt and more tyrannical than anywhere in Africa before western policy transformed the region.

Everything should be based on context, even with the concessions, are all Asian countries successful? No. Do you know how much aid that has be channeled to Africa? Considering our size what has being achieved?
Every country or leader must have a vision plan that goes beyond his tenure. For example, in this country students keep failing exams, no one has come to say "Our vision and goal in 2020 is to reduce the rate to 10% and make Nigeria a major destination of IT development". All backed up with a plan of action. A sad example is the Malaysia palm oil story, today they are 2nd in the world, and they got seeds to start from Nigeria.
Nobody is doubting our achievements in the past 50 years but it is good we learn from others to be better

Jen33:

I'd say we HAVE achieved something meaningful in the last 50 years. Put aside the garbage you read elsewhere - our standard of living has improved DRASTICALLY from the days of colonialism. Infant mortality rates have been halved, malnutrition rates have been cut by at least 2/3rds. We have electricity, no matter how intermittent. We have at least 50 times more kilometres of roads than we did before independence. The majority of our people are literate. We have some of the best educated people in the world who identify themselves as Nigerians. We have the largest middle class on the African continent. We produce steel, computers, and have recently begun manufacturing cars and buses. From zero universities in 1960 we now have 100. We actually have a future, as much of the groundwork has been laid.

That is no mean feat for a nation that's just 50. While we can complain about the speed of progress, we cannot honestly claim we have achieved ''nothing'' since independence.

Pls for the betterment of this nation let's feeding ourselves lies. This is ridiculous.

afam4ever, so you would swap your grandparents or great-grandparents mud hut for your Lagos or Enugu flat?

You would swap your current enlightenment, literacy, and qualifications for your grandparents' illiteracy and destitution? You're welcome to return to 1950s Nigeria. Tell me, did your grandparents see a lightbulb before independence? If they were like 99.5% of Nigerians the answer would be an emphatic NO. Why? Because the British did not actually construct a national grid such as we have today. Electricity was restricted to the GRAs were the British lived.


You're welcome to return to THAT Nigeria. Just don't think of dragging the rest of us back with you!

Jen33:

afam4ever, so you would swap your grandparents or great-grandparents mud hut for your Lagos flat?

You would swap your current enlightenment, literacy, and qualifications for your grandparents' illiteracy and destitution? You're welcome to return to 1950s Nigeria. Tell me, did your grandparents see a lightbulb before independence? If they were like 99.5% of Nigerians the answer would be an emphatic NO.

So, this is what you classify as achievement? Na waoo.

Absolutely. Again, if you disagree, why not throw your degree in the bin, return to your village, build a mud hut, walk around barefoot, tap your evening palm wine, and live the ''good life'' of colonial Nigeria? Then you will be rid of the ''horrors'' of bad roads, power failure, crime, inflation, unemployment, etc, the problems of modern Nigeria. You really are free to return to colonial Nigerian conditions even now, so why don't you?? Since ''things were better then'', why not return to that era, as exemplified by your village conditons

All these things you call achievement applies to every country of the world. People don't walk about buck naked like they used to cannot be credited to the industrial prowess of any countries. That's just a natural course.

@Jen33, WHILE yes, u re correct, on the Uk history, and and i want to agree with u on that,

but in this age and time, 50years is along time to develop, as a nation, gone re those days of the 17th century and all of that,

u wanna ask ur self how old is DubaI UAE, she gained her independence from britain in 1971, its left for u to do the math to figure how old she is,

Dubai is a force to reckon with now, one of the most beautiful cities in the world, pls correct me if i am wrong,

God bless Nigeria

dayo1401 said:

u wanna ask your self how old is DubaI UAE, she gained her independence from britain in 1971, its left for u to do the math to figure how old she is,

Dubai is a force to reckon with now, one of the most beautiful cities in the world, pls correct me if i am wrong,

God bless Nigeria

Dubai? Dubai's population is 2 million!

If we had a ''Dubai'' in Nigeria, people like you would be the first to attack it as a ''wasteful venture''. A ''playground for the rich''.

Just look at the criticism Abuja has been subjected to!

am talkin about the whole UAE, which is about 4.5million, i just mentioned Dubai has an example,
and yes, every country has its major city, check out london and england, what u find in london, u can neva find in any other city in england,

my focus here is the way she used her resources, from just 1971 to date, thats what am sayin

afam4ever said:

All these things you call achievement applies to every country of the world. People don't walk about buck unclothed like they used to. That's just a natural course.

Absolute nonsense. Nigerians should NOT have been walking around ''buck unclothed'' in the 1950s. Nigerians should not have had ZERO universities in the 1950s. Nigerian literacy rate should NOT have been 7% in the 1950s.

It was not the ''natural course of the world'' at the time for nations to be in that condition. That we have MOVED from that condition is due to the concentrated efforts of successive Nigerian regimes which have embraced education, modernity, and development. Something the British did not do in their 100 years in charge.

@ jen 33, apparently we have moved forward, thats obvious

question is, with the amount of resources we have, are we near where we should be?,

answer No

Dayo1401 said:

am talkin about the whole UAE, which is about 4.5million, i just mentioned Dubai has an example,
and yes, every country has its major city, check out london and england,  what u find in london, u can neva find in any other city in england,

my focus here is the way she used her resources, from just 1971 to date, thats what am saying

Ol boy, UAE is a major oil producer. She has only 4.5 million people. She has larger oil reserves than Nigeria and exports more oil than Nigeria. Here are the figures:

Nigeria (POP 150 MILLION): Barrels of oil per day: 2,211,000

UAE: (POP 4.5 MILLION) Barrels of oil per day: 2,798,000


https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2173rank.html

And you're wondering why Nigeria is not like UAE or Dubai?

Some of you guys really make me laugh.

So who's fault is it that Nigeria exports less oil.

Dayo1401:

@ jen 33, apparently we have moved forward, thats obvious

question is, with the amount of resources we have, are we near where we should be?,

answer No

To be honest, we are exactly where we are supposed to be. It is the same with every nation. You guys need to understand that it is not just about having bucketloads of natural resources. You also need to develop the social cohesion, the institutions, the political systems, manouvre the various rivalries including religious and ethnic rivalries into forming a cohesive national unit that works in a single direction. To do all these takes several decades. Some would say centuries. Owing to the complexity of our nation, it would take longer to establish these factors than say, a country where everyone is Arab, or French, or English.

So we are exactly where we are supposed to be at this stage of our national evolution.

afam4ever said:

So who's fault is it that Nigeria exports less oil.

Probably the 'fault' of NATURE:


UAE oil reserves: 98 billion barrels

Nigeria oil reserves: 34 billion barrels.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oil_reserves

Jen33:

Dayo1401:

To be honest, we are exactly where we are supposed to be. It is the same with every nation. You guys need to understand that it is not just about having bucketloads of natural resources. You also need to develop the social cohesion, the institutions, the political systems, manouvre the various rivalries including religious and ethnic rivalries into forming a cohesive national unit that works in a single direction. To do all these takes several decades. Some would say centuries. Owing to the complexity of our nation, it would take longer to establish these factors than say, a country where everyone is Arab, or French, or English.

So we are exactly where we are supposed to be at this stage of our national evolution.

I dont agree, we are not where we are supposed to be. Nigeria can not evolve or develop economically until it frees itself from the artificial contraption created by the british, this contraption does not allow for nigeria to succed as one entity. Nigeria was created to serve the interests of colonial powers and it is still serving those interests not the interests of the various people within it. The only beneficiaries of nigeria in its current state are the ruling elite and the foreign multinationals and international financial institutions therefore i dont know how you can say we are where we are supposed to be.

cap28 said:

I dont agree, we are not where we are supposed to be.  Nigeria can not evolve or develop economically until it frees itself from the artificial contraption created by the british, this contraption does not allow for nigeria to succed as one entity.  Nigeria was created to serve the interests of colonial powers and it is still serving those interests not the interests of the various people within it.  The only beneficiaries of nigeria in its current state are the ruling elite and the foreign multinationals and international financial institutions therefore i dont know how you can say we are where we are supposed to be.

You misread me. We are where we are supposed to be as a nation called Nigeria created by the British from numerous  groups of disparate ethnic and religious entities. We are still at the period where we are working out our intra-relationships as a new nation. It is not impossible for Nigeria to free itself from neo-colonial domination. The nation does not have to split up in order to progress. Splitting up might make progress a bit faster, but staying united can also get us where we want to be. Just might take a bit longer.

cap28:

I dont agree, we are not where we are supposed to be. Nigeria can not evolve or develop economically until it frees itself from the artificial contraption created by the british, this contraption does not allow for nigeria to succed as one entity. Nigeria was created to serve the interests of colonial powers and it is still serving those interests not the interests of the various people within it. The only beneficiaries of nigeria in its current state are the ruling elite and the foreign multinationals and international financial institutions therefore i dont know how you can say we are where we are supposed to be.

On the contrary I think Jen33 makes a solid point. It's kind of simplistic, academic even, to blame it all on Western powers, colonialism, etc., but remember that we have the inherent problem of multi-ethnicity, which in itself needs to be resolved. Development is not a switch that anybody can just flip with rhetoric; you still have deep-seated angst among the various ethnic groups in Nigeria, all of whom consider themselves to be potential nations in their own right, at least they were, pre-colonization. That's why power sharing remains a major issue in Nigeria and similar nations such as DRC, and even South Africa.

Without a sort of Balance of Power between the various dominant blocs in heterogenous nations like Nigeria, there can't be any meaninful progress beyond where we are now. In my opinion, when I travel around Africa, even the much-vaunted Ghana, I can easily see how much progress has been made in Nigeria, in terms of education, healthcare, industrialization, even infrastructure, compared to many of our fellow countries. Africa is on the way up right now, and it will happen faster than any of us think.

The British are rich for one main reason: Theft

All the centuries they have plundered the globe from Africa, Asia to North America, they are living off their ill-gotten wealth. That is the only reason why the UK is such a rich country.

Remember the old adage, that there is no sunset on the British empire. I think that should answer that question.

Jen33:

cap28 said:

You misread me. We are where we are supposed to be as a nation called Nigeria created by the British from numerous  groups of disparate ethnic and religious entities. We are still at the period where we are working out our intra-relationships as a new nation. It is not impossible for Nigeria to free itself from neo-colonial domination. The nation does not have to split up in order to progress. Splitting up might make progress a bit faster, but staying united can also get us where we want to be. Just might take a bit longer.

I think its disingenous to say that nigeria is at a period where we are working out our intra relationships - how?
Isnt this the same nigeria that has been ruled by the north for 43 years out of its  50 years of supposed independence?

Isnt this the same nigeria where a terrible civil war was fought which claimed the lives of over 3 million people from one ethnic group?

Isnt this the same nigeria in which equitable allocation of our natural resources is yet to be acheived hence the uprisings in the niger delta?

Isnt this the same nigeria in which religious clashes between christians and muslims continue in the middle belt as we speak?

On the contrary i would say that splitting up is indeed the only way that the current ethnic groups within nigeria will ever acheive economic and political self determination,  unfortunately this is not the willl or the agenda of our elites and britain, the british have succeeded in co-opting our elite and as long as that ellite continue to remain at the helm of affairs the people of nigeria will never acheive any form of economic or political progress.

EzeUche, do you know I once visited the British museum in Covent Garden, London, and once in, I headed straight to their display of the Benin Bronzes. I met a Nigerian who worked in the underground vaults of the museum, and he said there were 20 times more Benin treasure locked away in the vaults than were on display there. Some had never been displayed since they were looted from Benin by the British in 1897.

The British museum is an amazing place. If you want to see the extent of British plunder in all corners of the world, from China to Africa, and from India to South America, you need look no further than the British museum in Covent Garden.

Jen33:

EzeUche, do you know I once visited the British museum in Covent Garden, London, and once in, I headed straight to their display of the Benin Bronzes. I met a Nigerian who worked in the underground vaults of the museum, and he said there were 20 times more Benin treasure locked away in the vaults than were on display there. Some had never been displayed since they were looted from Benin by the British in 1897.

The British museum is an amazing place. If you want to see the extent of British plunder in all corners of the world, from China to Africa, and from India to South America, you need look no further than the British museum in Covent Garden.

This is exactly my point! No one wants to mention how the British plundered the globe and took advantage of people who did not have superior weapons. Let us not mention the ill gotten wealth that they got from colonialism. And even after colonialism, they forced their colonies to pay them back the expenses they accrued during colonialism.

It is a vicious cycle.

Africans need to wake and search for the truth. If you go to Benin City, most of the Benin Bronzes that you see in that city is only replicas while the real ones are in London. That doesn't even make any sense.

The West in general has benefited from the plunder of Africa, Asia and the Americas.

EzeUche_:

The British are rich for one main reason: Theft

All the centuries they have plundered the globe from Africa, Asia to North America, they are living off their ill-gotten wealth. That is the only reason why the UK is such a rich country.

I wouldn't call it theft, but 'conquest', don't forget where you're from.

There are countries like Spain who have ransacked more times than Britain, but where are they now. The people of Britain are just an experienced set of people who's island had been prey to other people like the Romans and Vikings for thousands of years. No other country had experience in battle, conquest, and failure like the British did, so by the time they got their heads into something they were good at (the sea) there was no stopping them.

The truth is the British had been slaves longer than they had bee enslavers.

EzeUche_:

Remember the old adage, that there is no sunset on the British empire. I think that should answer that question.

Well, there is now!

ezeagu:

I wouldn't call it theft, but 'conquest', don't forget where you're from.

There are countries like Spain who have ransacked more times than Britain, but where are they now. The people of Britain are just an experienced set of people who's island had been prey to other people like the Romans and Vikings for thousands of years. No other country had experience in battle, conquest, and failure like the British did, so by the time they got their heads into something they were good at (the sea) there was no stopping them.

The truth is the British had been slaves longer than they had bee enslavers.

Well, there is now!

Conquest or vanquishment is still another word for stealing.

The british were slaves to whom exactly.

cap28 said:

I think its disingenous to say that nigeria is at a period where we are working out our intra relationships - how?
Isnt this the same nigeria that has been ruled by the north for 43 years out of its  50 years of supposed independence?

Well, is the north ruling now? In many ways, their power has become increasingly neutralized, or rather, brought to  a more even keel with the other regions.

Isnt this the same nigeria where a terrible civil war was fought which claimed the lives of over 3 million people from one ethnic group?

This can be seen as the price of nationhood, for which Nigeria will not be the first or the last to experience it. The USA and Britain have fought civil wars in their formative years as well. France experienced a bloody revolution. Under Stalin, an estimated 30 million Russians were brutally murdered. Many of the nations you look at and admire today have been through some very serious crises in the past. Nations tend to learn from these experiences. I believe the civil war sensitized Nigerians to the need for greater conflict resolution, which I believe has stood us in good stead today. In the past, incidents like Boko Haram would have been enough to trigger a coup, or even civil war.

Isnt this the same nigeria in which equitable allocation of our natural resources is yet to be acheived hence the uprisings in the niger delta?

Yes, and today there is an amnesty program, and there is major infrastructural development work going on in the area. The region now has 13% derivation, and a member of that region is now the president. If that is not progress, what is?

Isnt this the same nigeria in which religious clashes between christians and muslims continue in the middle belt as we speak?

Yes, but what about the other 99% of the country where people of various ethnicities and religions live in peace?

Do they not count??

AjanleKoko:

On the contrary I think Jen33 makes a solid point. It's kind of simplistic, academic even, to blame it all on Western powers, colonialism, etc., but remember that we have the inherent problem of multi-ethnicity, which in itself needs to be resolved. Development is not a switch that anybody can just flip with rhetoric; you still have deep-seated angst among the various ethnic groups in Nigeria, all of whom consider themselves to be potential nations in their own right, at least they were, pre-colonization. That's why power sharing remains a major issue in Nigeria and similar nations such as DRC, and even South Africa.

Without a sort of Balance of Power between the various dominant blocs in heterogenous nations like Nigeria, there can't be any meaninful progress beyond where we are now. In my opinion, when I travel around Africa, even the much-vaunted Ghana, I can easily see how much progress has been made in Nigeria, in terms of education, healthcare, industrialization, even infrastructure, compared to many of our fellow countries. Africa is on the way up right now, and it will happen faster than any of us think.

why would you say that its simplistic to blame britain for our woes when our current situation to date can be traced quite easily back to the colonial era ?

Lets go back to the partition of africa or berlin conference of 1885 which was where many of the problems that we are experiencing today originated  - was any african leader present at this conference in berlin?  what say did africans have in the carving up and lumping together of different ethnic groups by the european colonialists ?  

How about Lugard's amalgamation of the northern and southern protectorates - did any of us have any say in this? were we consulted beforehand?

Multiethnicity was not a problem until we were lumped together and forced to live under one system of govt, that was when it became a problem.  Why were africans with differing ethnic and cultural differences expected to live successfully under one system of govt when europeans themselves had been incapable of doing the same themselves?

You can not have a balance of power in a country like nigeria where there are so many different groups competing for political and economic dominance as well as control over natural resources, it just can not happen without those various groups clashing and eventually going to war with each other.

Progress is relative, perhaps in comparison to other african nations nigeria may have made greater progress but if you look at the various ethnic groups which make up nigeria in isolation and relate our "progress" to our land, natural resources and manpower i dont think we have progressed as far as we like to think.