wesley80:

. The bible describes Healing as . . . . . .

SCRRRRREEEEEEECCCCCCCHHH! Stop right there!

WHO WROTE THE BIBLE!?!!!

Nigerians use church (religion) to cover up hungry, poverty. hence you hear words like God will provide (expressing unwillingness to work), I need a miracle (laziness and quest for easy money). People including politicians use this statements a lot to deceive their people, because that's kind of language average Nigerian understand. Its so annoying when you hear how people in Nigeria reason about issues.

^^^ Obviously another victim of Americas ever increasing Failed Parenting problem. Someone shoulda whipped your backside 2 Sunday School.

wesley80:

^^^ Obviously another victim of Americas ever increasing Failed Parenting problem. Someone shoulda whipped your backside 2 Sunday School.

He probably went to Sunday School and returned home with his brain intact. I can't say such for people like you and most who believe these day light robberies being perpetrated by pastor Chris and others like him.

Lol. That video was personally very embarrassing.

With that said, miracles supposedly do really happen. . . least this is what my parents have told me.

I've never seen any happen with my own eyes, though.


Hrm. . . Western culture is less prone to mysticism and supernatural explanations for things. Nigerian culture, part of daily life (Heck, less the 200 years ago, most southern nigerians were still pagans). Hence the difference in the way Christianity is practiced in both places, I guess.

What actually caught my eye was the ease with which the lady stood up. It was obvious every thing was stage managed, but the lady, either due to incompetence or ADHD, messed it up.

@9ija Man,
What tail swinging / tree climbing specie did u mutate from? In the course of your mutation did u skip the age where u had to wait till u're invited b4 u jumping into a conversation? Why not take a cue from Bkbabe of the Baboon lineage? At least we know their downside is just the foul mouth, they respect hierarchy pretty well for folks that are still learning to interact with humans!

fake fake fraud fraud fake fake fraud fraud

Nigerians grow up and face reality,  forget about fake aasse people like chris oyak,  what they need is your money so they can fly private jets and drive in convoys of phantom

wesley80:

@9ija Man,
What tail swinging / tree climbing specie did u mutate from? In the course of your mutation did u skip the age where u had to wait till u're invited b4 u jumping into a conversation? Why not take a cue from Bkbabe of the Baboon lineage? At least we know their downside is just the foul mouth, they respect hierarchy pretty well for folks that are still learning to interact with humans!

I'm not too surprised that this is how far the vacuum space in you skull, which you may have been mistaking for a brain, can take you. Try again!

smile4kenn:

fake fake fraud fraud fake fake fraud fraud

Nigerians grow up and face reality, for get about fake backside people like chris oyak, what they need is your money so they can fly private jets and drive in convoys of phantom

Abeg tell that your brother above you, Wesley80 that he needs to use the real brains God endowed him with.

BABA OYAKHILOME.
{OJE MARINA FESE GUNGO KI BE MASEJE}
fraud of the highest order.

I watched the video carefully with objectivity and without bias!!

I have three conclusions!

1) If these were fake, there is no way the crowds would keep coming!! Frauds don't last! Surely, those following him are gaining loads from him in some way hence they keep following him! I did a youtube search and found that these crowds follow him everywhere! I saw videos of the Pastor in Canada, UK and a host of other countries with similar crowds and similar occurences!! So it doesn't seem limited to Nigeria!

2)The crowd in the video don 't look like they are hungry! They all look well fed and well dressed! From that I assume they are very well educated middle class folks who are capable to discern for themselves whether or not these are real. They all seemed to get extremely excited after the girl stood up! They probably knew something about the girl that we don't know. They probably knew she was pretty sick and couldn't stand!! If she couldn't stand before and all of a sudden she is jumping, then surely that is supernatural!

3) To those saying poverty and the rest are responsible for this, I think you are just narrowminded and seeking an identity! America, which is and has been the richest and most advanced country in the world is still the epicenter of these kinds of gatherings!!
A pewresearch report confirmed that that 80% of Americans believe in miracles!!
You can check it out on the link!
http://abcnews.go.com/WN/miracles-world-news-question-day/story?id=9908545

So to those insulting others for believing, don't think that not believing in miracles makes you more sophisticated in any way! You are actually just closeminded! One of the key characteristics of intelligence is open mindedness!!

PapaBrowne:

3) To those saying poverty and the rest are responsible for this, I think you are just narrowminded and seeking an identity! America, which is and has been the richest and most advanced country in the world is still the epicenter of these kinds of gatherings!!
A pewresearch report confirmed that that 80% of Americans believe in miracles!!
You can check it out on the link!
http://abcnews.go.com/WN/miracles-world-news-question-day/story?id=9908545

That report doesn't support your hypothesis. Americans might believe in miracles, but it doesn't dominate their daily life or even just spiritual lives. Most of my early years were spent in a white American church. Their approach to religion is quite different. Less focused on the supernatural.

@papabrowne.

i bet u do not live in nigeria

PapaBrowne:

I watched the video carefully with objectivity and without bias!!


3) To those saying poverty and the rest are responsible for this, I think you are just narrowminded and seeking an identity! America, which is and has been the richest and most advanced country in the world is still the epicenter of these kinds of gatherings!!
A pewresearch report confirmed that that 80% of Americans believe in miracles!!
You can check it out on the link!
http://abcnews.go.com/WN/miracles-world-news-question-day/story?id=9908545

So to those insulting others for believing, don't think that not believing in miracles makes you more sophisticated in any way! You are actually just closeminded! One of the key characteristics of intelligence is open mindedness!!

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090212115116AAWjfK1

The vast majority of the members of the National Academy of Science are atheists. And yes, not believing in God is a sign of superior intelligence/sophistication




And, in response to the pew research you quoted, why arent Americans taking their sick to their pastors? Of course Americans, like the rest of the world, believe in miracles, but not just the kind that makes people walk after years of paralysis.

eku_bear:

That report doesn't support your hypothesis. Americans might believe in miracles, but it doesn't dominate their daily life or even just spiritual lives. Most of my early years were spent in a white American church. Their approach to religion is quite different. Less focused on the supernatural.

The white American church you spent your early years at could as well be an exception!! The crowds at the Benny Hinn crusades are they Nigerians??
And who said Miracles dominate the daily lives of Nigerians?? People usually seek miracles when a solution is beyond reach! As such it is natural for more Africans to seek miracles because they have a greater number of situations where solutions are beyond reach! Americans with unsolvable problems do seek miracles same as Nigerians with unsolvable problems.

I have lived in America and I have lived in Europe. Americans believe very well in miracles! Its Europeans that don't care for miracles!

If you spend your time analysing qualitative data, you would naturally become very open minded to various possibilities because you would come across information that is beyond human comprehension!! Miracles are just one of them!

I gave a quote earlier that 'healing is the childrens bread' there's a whole lot more to serving God than miracles. To add to what Papa B said, there r highly educated ppl attending these churches and even folks so rich that some of u yapping here wld be unworthy 2 wipe their feet!. Dont 4get that his Ministry started from a university Campus and mostly appeals to the educated. Pastor Chris packs out the biggest halls in the biggest Cities regardless of continent. Last year, the 02 arena in London was packed out and people had 2 be turned back from the venue. Same in Canada, SA and the States. Just google Night of Bliss London, Canada and USA.

PapaBrowne:

The white American church you spent your early years at could as well be an exception!! The crowds at the Benny Hinn crusades are they Nigerians??
And who said Miracles dominate the daily lives of Nigerians?? People usually seek miracles when a solution is beyond reach! As such it is natural for more Africans to seek miracles because they have a greater number of situations where solutions are beyond reach! Americans with unsolvable problems do seek miracles same as Nigerians with unsolvable problems.

Benny Hinn and pastors like that likely have under 5% of the churchgoing population in the US. The equivalent pastors in Nigeria might have 80 or 90% of the churchgoing population.

Again, I'm not sure your hypothesis is supported. Westerners don't view the church as a universal cure-all, as many Nigerians do.

While the whole world is thinking invention, Nigeria is thinking illusion. Its time to WAKE UP.

eku_bear:

Benny Hinn and pastors like that likely have under 5% of the churchgoing population in the US. The equivalent pastors in Nigeria might have 80 or 90% of the churchgoing population.

Again, I'm not sure your hypothesis is supported. Westerners don't view the church as a universal cure-all, as many Nigerians do.

fstranger3:


http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090212115116AAWjfK1

The vast majority of the members of the National Academy of Science are atheists. And yes, not believing in God is a sign of superior intelligence/sophistication


And, in response to the pew research you quoted, why arent Americans taking their sick to their pastors? Of course Americans, like the rest of the world, believe in miracles, but not just the kind that makes people walk after years of paralysis.

Truly, I'm not a fan of closemindedness! You are asking why Americans aren't taking their sick to pastors But there are numerous videos on the internet with miracle crusades in America! Can't you just do a google search??  I have just watched a video of this same pastor Chris in Canada with loads of Canadians many of whom came to seek healing!!

On the vast majority of scientists being atheists, there is something I call Circular Path theory of knowledge! The deeper you get into certain kinds of knowledge, the less your capacity for rational reasoning! Thats exactly why you find so many scientists as atheists! Also, the field of science is designed to discourage any reasoning beyond the physical! Every scientist is trained in that direction! Then again, what of the percentage of scientists that aren't atheists??

All I know is that miracles happen and I believe in miracles I'm a living witness.

You are basing your conclusions on some youtube videos, when some of us have spent nearly our entire lives here

Look, I have no clue why you keep trying to equate the way Christianity is practiced in Nigeria with the way it is practiced in the US. Two very different cultures, which different origins, backgrounds, etc.

eku_bear:

You are basing your conclusions on some youtube videos, when some of us have spent nearly our entire lives here

Look, I have no clue why you keep trying to equate the way Christianity is practiced in Nigeria with the way it is practiced in the US. Two very different cultures, which different origins, backgrounds, etc.

Don't you think the bolded is contradictory?? Since you've spent your entire life in the U.S what gives you the confident impression on the way Nigeria practices christianity? If even on Niaraland here, there are so many that don't believe in Miracles, isn't that enough proof that its not necessarily the large majority of Nigerians that believe in Miracles?

Don't get me wrong- Nigerians can be very blindly religious and I know that for a fact! Many people are milking millions from the gullibility and desperation of Nigerians! Same goes for the US and many other advanced countries! Fact is anywhere there are more intractible problems, there is bound to be greater need for supernatural solutions! That doesn't in anyway automatically convert every miracle pastor into a fraud!! If the book he lives by(Bible) allows for the belief in miracles and he follows it accordingly, why should he be accused for perpertuating fraud?

Many times, in a bid to feel intelligent, we tend to follow what is politically correct without utilizing our thoughts to arrive at our own conclusions!!

PapaBrowne:

Don't you think the bolded is contradictory?? Since you've spent your entire life in the U.S what gives you the confident impression on the way Nigeria practices christianity?

A fair point. So to fully discloses my background, I've lived here for a little over 21 years now. But for the last 12 years or so, have been attending mostly African churches (with the RCCG being the major one I've attended.)

So I feel that this qualifies me to talk about both styles.

PapaBrowne:

I watched the video carefully with objectivity and without bias!!

I have three conclusions!

1) If these were fake, there is no way the crowds would keep coming!! Frauds don't last! Surely, those following him are gaining loads from him in some way hence they keep following him! I did a youtube search and found that these crowds follow him everywhere! I saw videos of the Pastor in Canada, UK and a host of other countries with similar crowds and similar occurences!! So it doesn't seem limited to Nigeria!

2)The crowd in the video don 't look like they are hungry! They all look well fed and well dressed! From that I assume they are very well educated middle class folks who are capable to discern for themselves whether or not these are real. They all seemed to get extremely excited after the girl stood up! They probably knew something about the girl that we don't know. They probably knew she was pretty sick and couldn't stand!! If she couldn't stand before and all of a sudden she is jumping, then surely that is supernatural!

3) To those saying poverty and the rest are responsible for this, I think you are just narrowminded and seeking an identity! America, which is and has been the richest and most advanced country in the world is still the epicenter of these kinds of gatherings!!
A pewresearch report confirmed that that 80% of Americans believe in miracles!!
You can check it out on the link!
http://abcnews.go.com/WN/miracles-world-news-question-day/story?id=9908545

So to those insulting others for believing, don't think that not believing in miracles makes you more sophisticated in any way! You are actually just closeminded! One of the key characteristics of intelligence is open mindedness!!

1. Maybe those in these crowds are naive, gullible and trusting.
2. Being well dressed in church has absolutely nothing to do with being well-educated. Go to a church in any Black or Latino hood in the U.S. and you'll see sharp, well-dressed, dapper Black and Hispanic people. Yet we know from statistics that those areas tend to have the fewest educated individuals.
3. 80% of Americans believe in these kind of 'miracles'? Or they believe God's son could be resurrected from the dead, a man who speaks with God could part the sea, the son of God could walk on water, etc.? There is a significant difference.
4. It's important to be both open minded and logical.

It is a free world. Any Nigerian have the liberty to trade his/her God given intelligence for gullibility and the rest of us would care less. South Africans have had enough of the stage-managed miracle hour as that fraudulent Church called it in South Africa and consequently had to ban it. http://234next.com/csp/cms/sites/Next/Home/5673158-146/story.csp

well folks, here's my last word on this and I hope u guys take a second and think it over. You cant reason out Faith, it simply doesnt follow logic. The Bible says the wisdom of this world is foolishness to God. U can either choose to live a mundane life or take it a notch higher but take it from me, God is real and so r miracles. I pray u lot get to have an encounter with him some day as I have.

^^^All I can say for the likes of Wesley and PapaBrowne is:WOW!!!

Poverty is a bityych!

^^ Just cos you live in a developed country doesnt make u better off than every one in a third world country.

^^^

He did not say that. Now dont start playing the victim card. It makes mockery of your so called belief in miracles.

^^ No offense, but i know for a fact that you do not live better than my dogg. So if there's any victim here, i think its you.

^^^

I really do hope so.

This pastor is the definition of a "TV Preacher": All greased up and dolled up for the cameras.  Real scumbag.  You can almost see dollar signs in his eyes.    And yes, this style of preaching was borrowed from the US and it is seen all over the country, maybe not as prevalent as in Nigeria but the pentecostal faith-healing prosperity preaching style came of age here in the US.  Just watch PTL TBN or any of the other TV ministries you'll see it in abundance.  Fraudsters like Oyakhilome do a great disservice to the cause and genuine pastors. 

I asked a pastor's wife about the bad publicity such men bring to their faith and she assured me that in the end it didn't matter because the goal is to bring more souls, more converts to the church, more born-agains, that it didn't matter if Creflo Dollar or Benny Hinn or Joyce Meyer* are flying in their private planes or are not genuine deep down or even if they are ultimately exposed and confirmed to be opportunists, the end result of the hundreds of thousands souls saved and people they brought to the church (who in turn will bring more converts) will be their real legacy. That's the way they see it.
http://nakedlaw.avvo.com/2010/06/6-outrageously-wealthy-preachers-under-federal-investigation/


I like the following comment from the YouTube link:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PvjJEPdRnJE?fs=1&hl=en_US

"pastor chris we need you in the hospitals wheres theres no offering n tithe and loads of sick, i think god can work there"

jason123:

Guys, miracles do happen. My life is the evidence!

Hey, Jason!  How do you mean?