Genius100:

No, we do not have a good system in place. How can a system that has no certification program for teachers be good? How can a system that does not have a standardized method of evaluating pupils until they take SSCE or whatever be good? The educational system in the US is constantly be retooled and re-evaluated and you are sitting here telling us we have a good system. Common!!!!!

You are actually wrong there!!!

a)  Our Education system does have a certification program for teachers

b) Our Education system has a standardized method of evaluating pupils, even before the SSCE


That is why I say again, we do have a good system, we just have a system that is plagued with corruption and lack for so long that it has been left to deteriorate as a result.

I again tried to explain what the problem is earlier by pointing people's attention to the Judiciary system in Nigeria. We have a great system-- we have the right laws and legal framework. Problem is corruption has infiltrated all aspects and so we do not get the best benefits from using it that we ought to. To solve the problem, we simply have to solve the problem of corruption and lack of implementation, and boom, we have a functioning and quality judicial system again.

Kobojunkie:


You are actually wrong there!!!

a)  Our Education system does have a certification program for teachers

b) Our Education system has a standardized method of evaluating pupils, even before the SSCE


That is why I say again, we do have a good system, we just have a system that is plagued with corruption and lack for so long that it has been left to deteriorate as a result.

I again tried to explain what the problem is earlier by pointing people's attention to the Judiciary system in Nigeria. We have a great system-- we have the right laws and legal framework. Problem is corruption [/b]has infiltrated all aspects and so we do not get the best benefits from using it that we ought to. To solve the problem, we simply have to solve the problem of corruption and lack of implementation, and boom, we have a functioning and quality judicial system again.

[b]No we do not! Corruption is a problem, but not the only problem!

We still have draconian decrees as part of our bouquet of laws

We still run the judiciary where it takes years to get a judgement talk-less of the fairness of the judgement.

We still have a large number of prison inmates awaiting trial

Our judicial systems still depends on an inept and debilitated, as well as, corrupt police force 

When was the last time you heard of Nigerian police informing you of your rights when arresting you.

Do you think the proliferation of law enforcement agencies is a sign that things are well? in Lagos I saw all sorts of colours?(Black, Blue, Yellow, Red, Green, even Pink) Check any road turn in Lagos tomorrow and see if you won't find at least  four traffic officers in different Colours, doing the work of one Traffic Light!

It use to be unbelievable stories, of Police fighting the Army. Last I heard it was Civil Defense fighting the Police to show that their boss is above traffic laws.

These are problems of poor system design and role duplication, not just corruption.

Kobojunkie:

Again, the system we have is fine . . . but LIKE every other sector, we need to fix CORRUPTION, Lack of Trained Staff . . . These are the issues that Continue to diminish the QUALITY of our education system.

Kobojunkie,you goofed on this one stop running around in cycles you can't win all the arguments, You have clearly identified the problems as highlighted above, However Buhari doesn't know there's a problem in that sector. Stop trying fruiltlessly to defend him. He obviously has no vision for that sector nay Nigeria

lolatom:

Kobojunkie,you goofed on this one stop running around in cycles you can't win all the arguments, You have clearly identified the problems as highlighted above, However Buhari doesn't know there's a problem in that sector. Stop trying fruiltlessly to defend him. He obviously has no vision for that sector nay Nigeria

I am sorry but where did @Kobojunkie claim to be speaking on behalf of Buhari at any point? I don't even know what the man really said in that to even claim to understand his point, if any. I am neither his campaign manager nor his spokesperson so please stick to what I say as what I say, and just that.

I simply responded to the @Posters claim that there is a problem with the System. I have made myself clear that the problem is NOT with Education system but a problem that infects our system -- be it education, judicial etc . You, however, cannot say the same of our health system, which one can easily claim is non-existent -- that I consider a systemic problem.

KenGali:


No we do not! Corruption is a problem, but not the only problem!

We still have draconian decrees as part of our bouquet of laws

We still run the judiciary where it takes years to get a judgement talk-less of the fairness of the judgement.

We still have a large number of prison inmates awaiting trial

Our judicial systems still depends on an inept and debilitated, as well as, corrupt police force 

When was the last time you heard of Nigerian police informing you of your rights when arresting you.

Do you think the proliferation of law enforcement agencies is a sign that things are well? in Lagos I saw all sorts of colours?(Black, Blue, Yellow, Red, Green, even Pink) Check any road turn in Lagos tomorrow and see if you won't find at least  four traffic officers in different Colours, doing the work of one Traffic Light!

It use to be unbelievable stories, of Police fighting the Army. Last I heard it was Civil Defense fighting the Police to show that their boss is above traffic laws.

These are problems of poor system design and role duplication, not just corruption.   

May I suggest you re-read the post you pretend to have responded to, spend sometime reviewing what you have up there to understand how the problem, as I stated is not the system itself but the other issues we deal with still.

Buhari is right. There is nothing wrong with the system. Its the nonentities within the system that are making it dysfunctional.

There's nothing wrong with the system or the syllabus. The times table we learnt in Primary 2 is what UK students are still struggling with till age 15. The same system helped those of us who moved abroad to be ahead of our peers. A comparison of Private and Public education in Nigeria should let one know the problem is not the system. A privately educated Nigerian secodary student can hold his own anywhere in the world (except China!)

buhari is right

No one should be shocked at Buhari. The man claimed to have once been a cattle rearer, it obviously hasn't been washed out of his system. What a disgrace!
Everything about the man is low quality anti-educational stuff, just look at the almajiri hoards at his rallies, not just that, but several of his followers are on trial for violent acts (including bombing).

A simple test to prove the success or failure of our education system is to provide an earnest reply to the following:

[list]
[li]What are the clear-cut goals (if any) of the various steps of our education system?[/li]
[li]How do they key into our cultures and traditions?[/li]
[li]How does our educational system enhance our developmental status?[/li]
[/list]

The three basic questions above show our system of education to be a stark failure. We could even go much further and ask why Nigeria does not seem to be producing geniuses, a failure which is resounding beyond measure.
According to empirical findings, geniuses should make up 2.2% of the population. Nigeria, with a population of 140million should have 3,080,000 geniuses (yeah, thats a cool 3million). Where are they? And why has the education failed to identify and nuture them?

Our education system is a failure, and so is Buhari.

Kobojunkie:


May I suggest you re-read the post you pretend to have responded to, spend sometime reviewing what you have up there to understand how the problem, as I stated is not the system itself but the other issues we deal with still.

I do not really get how you go on about vague points you did not make out in your post. Let me break it down for you.

Your post basically has three main points
1. That our Education System is good; And the Judicial System as an analogy of the educational system is also good
2. That the problem is  corruption
3. That the effect of Corruption prevents us from getting the expected benefits from the system

My response to you is
1. No, that our systems are not good, and specifically the Judicial system (I have already concluded about the Educational system in my earlier post)
2. That yes Corruption is one of the problems, but is not the only one nor the root problem.
3. That the out put of the system as shown in the features I stated are more due to a Poorly Designed System than corruption, this is evidenced by the unrestrained Role Repetition in law enforcement.

KenGali:

I do not really get how you go on about vague points you did not make out in your post. Let me break it down for you.

Your post basically has three main points
1. That our Education System is good; And the Judicial System as an analogy of the educational system is also good

I did not say anywhere that our judicial system is analogous to our education system. The problems that plague Education in Nigeria however are similar to those found in Judicial and even our Government.

KenGali:

2. That the problem is corruption

Didn’t post this either . . . . . I believe I gave a list – did not state that it is just a problem of corruption.

KenGali:

3. That the effect of Corruption prevents us from getting the expected benefits from the system

The effect of corruption, among other things . . . . You have to revisit the posts as I did make sure to give a list or add ETC. at the end to indicate a list

These are extracts from your post

Kobojunkie:

I did not say anywhere that our judicial system is analogous to our education system.

Maybe you do not know it, by these statements below your are making an analogy, I do believe they have similar problems but its not merely corruption

Kobojunkie:

The problems that plague Education in Nigeria however are similar to those found in Judicial and even our Government.

Kobojunkie:

I again tried to explain what the problem is earlier by pointing people's attention to the Judiciary system in Nigeria. We have a great system-- we have the right laws and legal framework.

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Kobojunkie:

I believe I gave a list – did not state that it is just a problem of corruption.

The effect of corruption, among other things . . . .
You have to revisit the posts as[b] I did make sure to give a list or add ETC. at the end to indicate a list[/b]

No, you did not give a list, you pointed at Corruption and Lack, which you further expantiated to mean "Lack of Implementation" which is still vague.

By induction based on the similarity of your "Lack of Implementation" to Buhari's (Given that the topic is discussing BUhari's view and not necessarily if you support him ), Your Lack of Implementation refers to Anti-corruption activities

You went further to even give us the Magic Solution to the problem hinged on Corruption again: note your choice of word Boom: meaning your solution excludes other interferences. Hence you had no room for any ETC or etc. as you claim.

Check your statements below

Kobojunkie:


Problem is corruption has infiltrated all aspects and so we do not get the best benefits from using it that we ought to.

To solve the problem, we simply have to solve the problem of corruption and lack of implementation, and boom, we have a functioning and quality judicial system again.

Am not really interested in detailed analysis of your statements, but it will do us good if you can openly change your mind when you feel the need, its allowed! instead of pointing to points you never made and the habit of being vague when pushed.

Sigh . . . . . 

I gave a list of possibles --- Corruption, lack of staff training, implementation. . .  Please READ MY DARN POSTS WELL. THEY ARE THERE.

1.

Kobojunkie:

Sigh!!! We have a good system in place .  . . . but it is plagued by corruption, lack of implementation etc.  Does this help you?

2.

Kobojunkie:

the problem of corruption and lack of implementation

3.

Again, the system we have is fine . . . but LIKE every other sector, [b]we need to fix CORRUPTION, Lack of Trained Staff . . . T[/b]hese are the issues that Continue to diminish the QUALITY of our education system.

ETC <---- list

KenGali:

Maybe you do not know it, by these statements below your are making an analogy, I do believe they have similar problems but its not merely corruption

No, I did not post anywhere that the Education system is similar to the Judicial system. What I instead compared are the PROBLEMS that plague both sectors in Nigeria oooo!!!

well, there clearly is one thing wrong with our tertiary institutions - some lecturers advance by a system of patronage rather than ability - which is why the 1st dr is a clear dunce, for want of a better word

I was one of the first set of the 6 3 3 4 system and the evaluation was hell, we had to do mock exams organised by the state government while in JSS 3 just before our Junior Waec, that was meant to be used to determine where we will be placed in Senior Secondary School. The mock exam had so many questions and you have to be very very fast, the Junior Waec was very standard, the problem is not the educational system, the problem is the implementation.

A

Kobojunkie:

No, I did not post anywhere that the Education system is similar to the Judicial system. What I instead compared are the PROBLEMS that plague both sectors in Nigeria oooo!!!  

And you stated that those problems are similar; why are you going in circles? You do not need to state that the education system is exactly like the the judicial system to make make an analogy! . You compared a common feature of the two, their problems!

–noun, plural -gies.  
1. a similarity between like features of two things, on which a comparison may be based: the analogy between the heart and a pump.
2. similarity or comparability: I see no analogy between your problem and mine.
3. Biology . an analogous relationship.
4. Linguistics .
a. the process by which words or phrases are created or re-formed according to existing patterns in the language, as when shoon  was re-formed as shoes,  when -ize  is added to nouns like winter  to form verbs, or when a child says foots  for feet.
b. a form resulting from such a process.
5. Logic . a form of reasoning in which one thing is inferred to be similar to another thing in a certain respect, on the basis of the known similarity between the things in other respects.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/analogy

B

Kobojunkie:

Sigh . . . . .  

I gave a list of possibles --- Corruption, lack of staff training, implementation. . .  Please READ MY DARN POSTS WELL. THEY ARE THERE.

1.
Quote from: Kobojunkie on Yesterday at 09:39:39 PM
Sigh!!! We have a good system in place .  . . . but it is plagued by corruption,[b] lack of implementation [/b]etc.  Does this help you?
2.
Quote from: Kobojunkie on Today at 01:39:37 AM
the problem of corruption and lack of implementation

3.
Quote
Again, the system we have is fine . . . but LIKE every other sector, we need to fix CORRUPTION, Lack of Trained Staff . . . These are the issues that Continue to diminish the QUALITY of our education system.

ETC <---- list

You just love going in circles,
I can see you are carefully refering to an earlier post of yours, rather than the one I responded to, so lets examine that post on its merits.


If the lack of trained teachers you mentioned above is not singularly due to your famous corruption, then you have a systematic problem! A problem that has to do with the actual design of your system, the opportunities it offer its teachers!

If you go backwards an claim the Lack of Trained Teachers is singularly due to corruption as Buhari is doing, than you have locked yourself in that myopic view we have all been condemning!

The second item you mentioned is Lack of Implementation. Let me point out that your system is not just what you proposed in paper as a policy, it is what you actually established on the ground. Ask engineers, there is a difference between proposed design drawings and AS-BUILT drawings.

Even our paper proposals for the systems are hardly world class as you claim!  

And finally, I find it very funny that your etc. includes every other thing other than System problems. Most of those other things you are referring to fall under System design problems, this includes resourcing as well. If you wish to refer to "structure" thats different idea altogether.

see me see wahala. . . . well, now you know that I was not making a comparison of the two systems --- I was instead comparing the problems

And now you also know that I meant there are a list of things plaguing each sector, though similar for both,and not just the one I chose to focus on in the particular post you responded to there. Are you happy now? Or will you continue to take me in circles thinking I am the one doing it instead? 

I no Blame them when dem spoil this nation send dem pikin go abroad to school, come dey yan rubbish, what the Bleep , does this man knows.and he want to be president, Nigeria has the worst eductional system upon our endowness.such a shame

Everyone has been pointing fingers at corruption. What an easy excuse for laziness! Has anybody wondered why the telecom sector in Nigeria is thriving despite the heavy corruption. Humans are corrupt everywhere but it should not be an excuse for poor performance. It is like saying the devil is the problem with Nigeria. What are the standards for measuring corruption?

The point is we know there is corruption BUT while fighting corruption, we can make policies and implement brilliant strategies to make things work. We should not dump everything on the table of corruption and fold our arms afterwards.

@efisher, Do you think with your nose? Is Nitel or Mtel among them

Negative publicity seems to be all that sells in the world of today. Why give a phrase when you can finish the entire sentence the man said. Whatever, Opinions voiced out are better that cowardly opinions not voiced out or even seen to assume body language.

It may not be untrue that Buhari said that and I would aggree with him that all we need is the implementation of our education policy but the link on this topic is false, the only issue raised by weekly trust (not daily trust today) is @Jonathan Shuns Presidentail debate see:
http://weekly.dailytrust.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=5606:jonathan-shuns-presidential-debate&catid=41:news&Itemid=30

^^^ The link is not wrong. The video of the debate is available online.

At least, the man showed up for the debate. That makes him better than cowards shying away from debates. Some were looking for EXPO, but Buhari was confident enough to show up without Expo and he did well. If all Nigerian students will emulate Buhari, Ribadu, and Shekarau and enter into exams with confidence and without Expo whatever problem we have with education in Nigeria will be 50% solved.

There are problems in education in Nigeria, but those problems are only side-effects of our societal problems. The system we have, though not perfect would be okay if the society was better. The problem with education in Nigeria is the disdain that Nigerians have for knowledge and learning. People are reconised not on what they know but by how much they have. This has reduced interest in knowledge and learning in Nigeria. These days people go to school to acquire certificates. Parents pay to get good grades for students. Teachers now help student to pass exams. Teaching jobs are indiginised leaving our children at the mercy of area boys and babes. Money meant for infrastructure in the Education sector ends up in private pockets.

These are not problems with the system, these are more of societal problems which must be addressed and the surest way to address them is to make sure that the only way to achieve success in Nigeria is through hard work and honest living. Until that happens whatever system you have 6-3-3-4, 9-3-4, 3-3-3-3, 6-6-6, British system, American system, Chinese system, Indian system will all fail.

Fix the society and the systems will flourish.

To me both the system,the structure and institutions are dysfunctional.There is need for total overhauling of the Nigerian educational system.Even the 6-3-3-4 system is not perfect.Our people spend longer years in school,a situation where an average Nigerian fresh graduate is between 26-28 yrs is not good for our nation.Our system does not give room for modification and innovation.The employers of labour now wants young workers and graduates,how is our system responding to that?

OMG, What are my reading here;that there is no problem with the education system just because your pet project Buhari goofed . Kobo , for your sheer folly, i think you need the koboko lash you prescribed earlier to whip some uprightness into you and it applies also for the rest. i can fathom if it was GEJ that made that statement, all hell would have being loosed by now with all manner of name calling . This presidential debate just revealed that the jury on nairaland are just as biased as they claim others to be. am watching your comments. the next time i hear you accuse other people of being clueless, dumb and biased i will remind you of this . You think corruption is our only problem then why is Malaysia equally corrupt doing better and equally growing. corruption is being fueled by the decay in the system. if you fight corruption, you need to also fight the decay already left as a souvenir over the decades. so if you say there is no problem other than corruption then it is a pity people with such mindset don't deserve being listened to or heard out.

Ribadu said Nigerians were not corrupt but the system due to past bad leadership and governance (not only corruption but includes the high handedness of previous leaders) made us to lose our morals and you all called for his head just because Buhari said otherwise that Nigerians lack discipline . Now Buhari is saying the education system has no problem at all and you all come out to say Hurray ! being double faced is a big shame .

Thank you jmaine, maybe people need someone to wake them up from their Buhari dream. It has so be-clouded their thinking that they no longer can see the obvious. No need for double standards. They goofed one way or the other.

The whole idea was for us to be able to project four years ahead with their line of thinking. If we want further decline in Education and Infrastructure, we can go ahead and follow the man who has no vision in those areas.

There is no problem with the system, it is the people that have issues, my school moved from its location more than 6 times, yet, we still had a good secondary school education because our teachers were dedicated.