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Pastor Adeboye: If You Are Afraid Of Death At 70, Check Your Salvation / Your Attitude To Sin Determines Your Salvation/Perfection, Not Activities / If You Believe You Can Lose Your Salvation, Then You Have Called God A Liar (2) (3) (4)
Can You Lose Your Salvation? by Nobody: 9:40pm On Apr 20, 2021 |
Some factions of Christianity believe that you can lose your salvation, while some believe otherwise. What exactly is the true fact? Once you are saved, is that all? Can you never lose your salvation? If no, what exactly makes one lose their salvation? |
Re: Can You Lose Your Salvation? by livingchrist: 10:49pm On Apr 20, 2021 |
No a Christian cannot lose his salvation except maybe he depart from faith but from the scriptures it seems a true Christian cannot depart from faith. Since a Christian became saved by faith in Christ, he must continue in that same faith till the end to remain saved, this is called perseverance and also God keeps the Christian this too is called preservation. But, on the other hand one might assume to be saved but he or she is not saved, that is why scripture said examine yourself whether you are in Christ, and those in Christ are encouraged to move on to maturity. What could make a supposed christian lose his faith? It is false teachings or wrong doctrines that is why scripture seriously warned against it. So in all, we are to remain in the faith of Jesus rooted and built up in and not be content with shallowness. Peter ask belivers to add other qualities to their faith, such as goodness, charity, virtue etc, these other qualities help the Christian faith to be strong and productive. Shallom 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: Can You Lose Your Salvation? by Kobojunkiee: 10:54pm On Apr 20, 2021 |
Nana264:Salvation which is defined in the Gospel of John as requiring that one * believe Jesus Christ is who He says He is * be baptized(water) * Eat of the flesh and drink the blood of Jesus Christ (the Covenant agreement between God and man) ...cannot be lost. Salvation received by this way is not from sin, but instead from the condemnation of sin (Death) also known as the wages of sin, the judgement placed on mankind from after the fall of the first man, comes with a guarantee of eternal life, opposite of Death(perish in the grave). For you see, previously condemned to die(perish in the grave), those who are saved by Jesus Christ are gifted with eternal life(grace) in place of the Death. Given as Jesus Christ came, not to condemn, but to save those who are condemned to die, there is really no way provided for having the eternal life revoked. However, the gift of eternal life does not come with a guarantee that it will be spent in Heaven, since Hell is another option for where one can also spend eternal life. 1 Like |
Re: Can You Lose Your Salvation? by Ihedinobi3: 7:41am On Apr 21, 2021 |
Nana264: Hi there. First of all, I don't think there are factions in Christianity. 11 For I have been informed concerning you, my brethren, by Chloe’s people, that there are quarrels among you. 12 Now I mean this, that each one of you is saying, “I am of Paul,” and “I of Apollos,” and “I of Cephas,” and “I of Christ.” 13 Has Christ been divided? Paul was not crucified for you, was he? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul? 1Co 1:11 — 1Co 1:13 (NASB) Obviously, there is only one Jesus Christ that the Bible talks about and He is the One who died for us all. That Jesus Christ is the Man Who is also God. There is no one else like that. So, how can there be factions? It is true that no two Christians, however mature they may be, always agree on everything, but this does not mean that all positions held by all Christians are equally legitimate. Some positions will be wrong and others right. Because Christians are not perfect, they won't get every single thing right, but it is still every Christian's responsibility to seek out and find and hold on to the truth in all things (1 Thessalonians 5:21). The question then is what is true, not what different factions believe. The answer to that is whatever the Bible says. So, what does the Bible say regarding the permanence of the salvation of believers? It says, first, that as long as anyone continues to believe in Jesus Christ (that is, as long as anyone believes that Jesus is God Who became Man and died for our sins and rose from the dead for our Salvation), that person is saved. 16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. John 3:16 (NKJV) 14 We have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original conviction firmly to the very end. Hebrews 3:14 (NIV) That is, only those who continue to believe until the end of their earthly lives are saved. Second, the choice to believe the Gospel or not is wholly and entirely ours. We believe because we choose to believe. Nobody can deny us of the right or the power to believe. 13 for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure. Philippians 2:13 (NKJV) That is, God guarantees to every human being both the right and the ability to make his or her own choices. We have the power to will (that is, the spiritual ability to identify and select from among options available to us) and to perform (that is, the ability to act out or demonstrate our choices) because God gives it to each of us and guarantees it to us. Not even Satan can prevent us from making any choice we want to make. He can try to persuade us to make a given choice by threatening or seducing us, but in the end, we are the only ones who can choose for ourselves what we want to have. Therefore, our salvation is entirely ours to have or give up. Nobody can take it away from us if we want to keep it. That is the first level of security. Third, when we choose to believe, we are baptized by the Holy Spirit into Jesus Christ so that we become one with Him (that is, so that He recognizes us as His own), and we are baptized with the Holy Spirit so that we have Him living inside us to help us walk with God as we should. 13 For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free—and have all been made to drink into one Spirit. 1 Corinthians 12:13 (NKJV) 9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. Romans 8:9 (NKJV) This is the one baptism that Ephesians 4:5 speaks of, that Peter clarifies in 1 Peter 3:21, and that John the Baptist prophesied when he said that Jesus would baptize with the Holy Spirit. What this means is that when we believe, we become the Lord Jesus's responsibility to protect and defend from Satanic attacks and we receive divine help inside of us that is able to defend our salvation as long as we are willing until we come to the end of our earthly lives. 4 You are of God, little children, and have overcome them, because He who is in you is greater than he who is in the world. 1 John 4:4 (NKJV) This is the second level of security that we have. The first makes it clear that no one can strip us of our salvation. Only we may give it up if we please. This second makes it clear that we will always have Heaven's support to defend our salvation even against mounting satanic pressure. In other words, our salvation in Jesus Christ is not at all easy to lose. Fourth though, it is not impossible to lose our salvation. Not only does the Bible tell us that we should be careful to guard our salvation, it warns us that others have lost and will yet lose it too. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God. 2Th 2:3 — 2Th 2:4 (NKJV) The above is a prophecy of the apostasy that will happen during the Tribulation before the return of Jesus Christ to resurrect the Church and establish His rule over the earth. 10 for Demas has forsaken me, having loved this present world, and has departed for Thessalonica—Crescens for Galatia, Titus for Dalmatia. 2 Timothy 4:10 (NKJV) The above is one example of a believer who gave up his faith because of his love of the world. 11 This is a faithful saying: For if we died with Him, We shall also live with Him. 12 If we endure, We shall also reign with Him. If we deny Him, He also will deny us. 13 If we are faithless, He remains faithful; He cannot deny Himself. 2Ti 2:11 — 2Ti 2:13 (NKJV) The above is a warning that it matters what we choose to do. If we decide to stop believing (that is, we deny Him and become faithless), the Lord Jesus is not obliged to continue to defend us or to save us in the end. In other words, we are not going to be saved against our will. We choose whether we will be saved or not. Our choices matter. In short, we can lose our salvation, and throughout the history of the world, many believers have lost theirs by giving up their faith for different reasons. This is why we are warned to guard our salvation diligently. 12 Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling Philippians 2:12 (NKJV) 1 Moreover, brethren, I do not want you to be unaware that all our fathers were under the cloud, all passed through the sea, 2 all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea, 3 all ate the same spiritual food, 4 and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them, and that Rock was Christ. 5 But with most of them God was not well pleased, for their bodies were scattered in the wilderness. 6 Now these things became our examples, to the intent that we should not lust after evil things as they also lusted. 7 And do not become idolaters as were some of them. As it is written, “The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play.” 8 Nor let us commit sexual immorality, as some of them did, and in one day twenty-three thousand fell; 9 nor let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed by serpents; 10 nor complain, as some of them also complained, and were destroyed by the destroyer. 11 Now all these things happened to them as examples, and they were written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the ages have come. 12 Therefore let him who thinks he stands take heed lest he fall. 1Co 10:1 — 1Co 10:12 (NKJV) These warnings are to be taken most seriously. This is precisely why the teaching that believers cannot lose their salvation is so wicked. All false teaching is evil and able to do damage to the spiritual health of believers, but few indeed of those are as wicked as the teaching that believers cannot fall away again in this world. It leads many of us into a false sense of security that eventually costs them their salvation. There is nothing worse than that. People who teach such things risk a very terrible response from the Lord as a result. Fifth, on the question of the how, the Bible teaches that we can stop believing for different reasons. We can fall away through growing sinfulness and an unwillingness to give up our sinning in the midst of divine discipline. 12 Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; 13 but exhort one another daily, while it is called “Today,” lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. Heb 3:12 — Heb 3:13 (NKJV) Now, because this is one of the most abused truths of the Bible, it is important that we take care to understand that sin itself does not cost us our salvation. Everyone sins all the time (James 3:2; 1 John 1:8-10). It doesn't matter what our spiritual attainment, we all sin regardless. If we end up with the Lord in eternity, it is not because we stopped sinning in this world. It is because we continued to believe the Gospel until the end of our earthly lives. But sin does have an impact on our salvation in an indirect way. Sin opposes faith since it comes from an attitude of rebellion. We all have a sin nature in our bodies. That is, our bodies are bodies of sin (Romans 7:18-24). This does not change just because we become believers in Jesus Christ. Rather, it becomes a fight for us instead, a fight between our bodies and the Spirit in us (Galatians 5:17; James 4:5 in Greek). We have to constantly choose to walk in the Spirit and not in the desires of our bodies. If we choose to walk in the desires of our bodies, we end up feeding the rebelliousness of our bodies against God (Romans 8:5-8 ). Since God responds to all sin with divine discipline (Hebrews 12:4-11), sinning egregiously without confessing and repenting will bring increasing levels of discipline from the Lord upon us until we either repent or are killed by the Lord (that is, the sin unto death spoken of in 1 John 5:16-17; 1 Corinthians 5:5; 11:30). The increasing discipline can make the sinning believer bitter against the Lord so much so that he decides to stop believing in Him. If that happens, then he stops being a believer and has lost his salvation. This is how sin can cost us our salvation. As I said, it is important to keep in mind that sin does not directly cost us our salvation, so even a believer who continues to sin without repenting and confessing to the Lord can end up killed by the Lord through discipline and yet be with the Lord in eternity. The most visible example of this in the Bible is King Saul, but it is also obvious that if the man in 1 Corinthians 5 had not repented, he too would have died and been with the Lord in spite of his sin of sexual immorality. So, one way we can lose our salvation is through sinning recklessly and then rebelling against divine discipline by throwing our faith away. Another way is by getting offended at the trials and tribulations of this world. The Lord Jesus warns us of this in Matthew 24 and we see that in 2 Thessalonians 2, so very many believers will stop believing because of the difficulties of the Tribulation. So then, how can we secure our salvation and not fall away? 1 For I want you to know what a great conflict I have for you and those in Laodicea, and for as many as have not seen my face in the flesh, 2 that their hearts may be encouraged, being knit together in love, and attaining to all riches of the full assurance of understanding, to the knowledge of the mystery of God, both of the Father and of Christ, 3 in whom are hidden all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge. 4 Now this I say lest anyone should deceive you with persuasive words. 5 For though I am absent in the flesh, yet I am with you in spirit, rejoicing to see your good order and the steadfastness of your faith in Christ. 6 As you therefore have received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk in Him, 7 rooted and built up in Him and established in the faith, as you have been taught, abounding in it with thanksgiving. Col 2:1 — Col 2:7 (NKJV) 11 And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers, 12 for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ, 13 till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ; 14 that we should no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting, 15 but, speaking the truth in love, may grow up in all things into Him who is the head—Christ— 16 from whom the whole body, joined and knit together by what every joint supplies, according to the effective working by which every part does its share, causes growth of the body for the edifying of itself in love. Eph 4:11 — Eph 4:16 (NKJV) The above speaks of growing to have a full knowledge of Jesus Christ. This is what spiritual maturity is and what spiritual growth (see the link) is about. When we hear and believe the Gospel, we have accepted a new way of thinking and living. In order to become better at thinking and living like that, we need to learn everything that the Gospel is really saying. The Gospel that we hear--that is, that God put on human flesh and died for our sins as the Man Jesus Christ and rose again from the dead for our justification with the Father--is only a seed. There is a vast world of truth only hinted at by that statement. If we don't explore it, we remain ignorant of very much indeed. That ignorance is what makes us susceptible to apostasy. The Bible likens believing the Gospel initially to being born as a baby. Babies cannot defend themselves effectively. So, Peter urges us through the Spirit to grow from babyhood into manhood (1 Peter 2:2-3) so that we can fight this fight of ours effectively. If we don't grow, it remains a real struggle to keep our faith in Jesus Christ. We will continue to have lies thrown at us by Satan and the world-system that he designed and built around us. Those lies may not be recognizable to us as lies if we have not learned the truth. If we do not grow, we will remain spiritually weak and thus very limited in ability to resist the cravings of our own flesh. That means that we remain significantly crippled by our body's strong desire to sin. It is only as we develop spiritually that our ability to resist the untiring pressure of our bodies to sin against God grows too. How do we grow spiritually? As you will find in the link I referred you to, it takes reading the Bible to know what it says, listening to spiritually qualified pastor-teachers who can explain it clearly to you, actively applying what you learn to your own life, and helping others to do the same. As we do these things, we secure our salvation and grow less and less likely to apostatize from the faith. Cheers. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: Can You Lose Your Salvation? by Nobody: 5:44am On Apr 22, 2021 |
Ihedinobi3: I meant factions as in denominations. |
Re: Can You Lose Your Salvation? by haddeylium(m): 8:30am On Apr 22, 2021 |
The short answer is YES! Checkout inspired warning of the disciples Jude to early Christains congregation that have similar question.. Jude 5- I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not. That's why Jude employed them regarding the salvation to put up a hard fight for the faith they have in common(Jude 3) So a person’s final salvation is not determined at the moment that he begins to put faith in Jesus He who endures to the end will be saved(Matt 24:13) (compare with Heb 10:26,27) |
Re: Can You Lose Your Salvation? by Ihedinobi3: 8:59am On Apr 22, 2021 |
Nana264: I know what you meant. I was saying in response that denominations and other groupings really mean nothing. There are only two possibilities: 1. That a given Christian or Christian group holds biblical positions; or 2. That a given Christian or Christian group holds false positions. No Christian or Christian group is perfect, so we will get some things wrong sometimes, but that does not mean that we may form legitimate denominations. That is meaningless. Either a teaching is biblical or it isn't. If it isn't, it is false. If it is, it is true. Every Christian should be striving to get to the truth and hold firmly to it. 1 Like 1 Share |
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