@Defenders of prosperity charlatans

How come in all the years of 'miracles' there has not been one case of amputated limbs been restored ?

I will tell you the answer - because it is too difficult to fake!!!

Everyday more and more stuff comes out which show without a doubt that these prosperity charlatans (Oyaks, Ashimodollar and co) are frauds!!

EarsWide:

@Defenders of prosperity charlatans

How come in all the years of 'miracles' there has not been one case of amputated limbs been restored ?

I will tell you the answer - because it is too difficult to fake!!!

Everyday more and more stuff comes out which show without a doubt that these prosperity charlatans (Oyaks, Ashimodollar and co) are frauds!!

Are you sure? Maybe God simply hates them since neither Jesus, his disciples nor Paul healed any amputees.

Why won't pastors heel amputees? Why won't they make amputated limbs grow back like the victims of the Sierra Leone civil war for example. Am sure if Pastor Chris or any other so called man of god would heel an amputee live on stage (in front of a worldwide audience) then we would have no reason to doubt their magical powers

Mabel and Joagbaje answers please.

Only god can heal amputees!!! Please people, do not blaspheme.
To heal an amputee, you have to use mud/dirt to mold the limbs just like he did in the garden of eden.
Yeshua didn't pass on that skill to d apostles, just the holy ghost. You can't treat a stomnach ache with tylenol and you can't treat a headache with pepto bismol.
Same thing with the holy spirit, it can't be used to treat amputees but it can work every other miracle.
Thats what the bible tells us.

I am approaching this from the point of view of a christian (who believes in God and miracles) but does not believe in the prosperity charlatans who are out to make money from the poor and vulnerable in society.
I wonder at times if these charlatans actually believe in God at all - if they did would, why would they fake miracles ??

You are a very strange Christian that's if you are one
How come you believe in miracles, but fail to believe it can happen thru men of god,
Any Christian who is not ignorant of gods word can bring about miracles

@Azibalua, do you remember this

15 “Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. 16 By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17 Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.

You also have no answer to my original point, do you ? These men of fraud never put visibly disabled (amputees, physical deformities etc) people up on stage for healing. It is always ailments that are not visible(stomach problems, athrithis etc) that they claim they can heal!! Why ??

There is no doubt about it more than 95% of these prosperity preachers are frauds - Oyaks, Ashimodollar, Oyedepo etc.

@prosperity charlatans and their supporters

You have no answer to this, do you ? 

@prosperity charlatans

Still waiting ,

Did anyone watch the British channel 4 special aired last night about these charlatans?

http://www.channel4.com/programmes/derren-brown-the-specials/4od#3182173

@OLAADEGBU

I did but I would have liked him to have tried to expose the charlatans (e.g Benny Hinn, Copeland etc).

In anycase it is a start - I hope there are more of these types of programmes.

I have no doubt that God is still in the business of performing miracles today since Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever, but the way charlatans seem to have highjacked the show is alarming, some do not even use tricks anymore but are becoming weird.  Have you seen this man perform?

[flash=500,400]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yN9Ay4QAtW8?fs=1&hl=en_GB[/flash]

St Matthew chapt24 verses 3-11.
I think this deals pretty well with all the frauds and charlatans that are prosperity and miracle pastors.
I think it also deals with their dumb and fanatical followers too!

Na wa o - where are you prosperity guys. I guess you are still trying to come up with some suitable lie/excuse.

Surely even the most confused prosperity victim must wonder why the charlatans can 'raise' dead people but cannot restore lost limbs ??

Show me where Jesus healed amputated limbs, and I will show you who's doing it.

Joagbaje:

Show me where Jesus healed amputated limbs, and I will show you who's doing it.

So because it isn't recorded that Jesus healed amputated limbs, that means ¹He couldn't/didn't do it and ²it cannot be done? Surely, if Jesus could raise a man from the dead, commanding a limb to stretch forth cannot be beyond His power can it? talk carefully oga.

Furthermore, I thought the bible also says this - John 14:12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater [works] than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

Martian:

Only god can heal amputees!!! Please people, do not blaspheme.
To heal an amputee, you have to use mud/dirt to mold the limbs just like he did in the garden of eden.
Yeshua didn't pass on that skill to d apostles, just the holy ghost. You can't treat a stomnach ache with tylenol and you can't treat a headache with pepto bismol.
Same thing with the holy spirit, it can't be used to treat amputees but it can work every other miracle.
Thats what the bible tells us.

Joagbaje:

Show me where Jesus healed amputated limbs, and I will show you who's doing it.

OK even if not "amputated" what about "withered?

Mark 3:3,5 (and elsewhere)

And he saith unto the man which had the withered hand, Stand forth . . . he saith unto the man, Stretch forth thine hand. And he stretched it out: and his hand was restored whole as the other

And the paralytic?

Mark 2

Some men came, bringing to him a paralytic, carried by four of them. 4Since they could not get him to Jesus because of the crowd, they made an opening in the roof above Jesus and, after digging through it, lowered the mat the paralyzed man was lying on. 5When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralytic, “Son, your sins are forgiven.”

And for Joagbaje: because of people/fraudsters/ok, false teachers like you the way of truth will be maligned even as we see.

2 Peter 2

. . . there shall be false teachers among you, who privately shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. 2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.

@Mr Jo

Only fools and extremely vulnerable people will accept the sort of explanations you put forward.

Did Jesus specifally heal people with cancer - yet your 419 charlatans claim to do it all the time
Did Jesus lengthen a leg that is shorter than the other ? Yet your 419 charlatans claim to do this ?
Jesus did not have an expensive lifestyle - yet your 419 charlatans do.

All of a sudden you want to say because Jesus did not do it - your 419 charlatans cannot do it.

In anycase what about a withered hand (which Jesus healed) -  Why cant your 419 frauds do it ?

@jo

dude, that was a weak response, shame on you.

@ all those who think because a church has a large congregation then it is genuine,

I hope the  video above will shut you up.

I am always amused by the "Why Wont God Heal Amputees" objection by atheists. I suppose that for them to establish that God does not exist, they've imagined that all they need do is pose some challenge for God to come and meet. Mighty presumptuous of atheists, won't you say? To assume that God amounts to no more than a circus dog who is trained to jump through hoops. And so, for them, God must meet their demands or he doesn't exist.

But pray tell, if a skeptic were presented with evidence for a case of something miraculous like the miraculous disappearance of cancer against the diagnoses of qualified doctors, or even the case of some spontaneous regeneration of limbs, would that do anything in the slightest bit to compel belief in God or the supernatural from an atheist? Will it rather not be the case that the atheist would reject the evidence before his very eyes, and seek to attribute it to some natural phenomena? And furthermore, if the requested miracle ever happened, what's to stop the atheist from raising the bar? I mean, what's next, "If God exists, why not heal all amputees and not just this one?" or "If God exists, why not remove all diseases and illnesses--surely he is a good God, and why would he not do so anyway?"; or what about "If God exists, why not remove suffering completely? Is he not capable of doing so?"

Such is the inflexible nature of willful unbelief: the systematic rejection of all inferences to God or Theism turtles all the way down. There is perhaps no gain in entertaining these amusing objections. It is useful to remind these skeptics that ultimately God performs miracles only in so much as they accord with his providential sovereignty over creation, or they glorify him. Deeply dissatisfying answer to a skeptic, but unfortunately you cannot make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

@1Godfather

Why do you suppose I am an atheist ? Is it because I believe upwards of 99% of the prosperity preachers are frauds ?

For your information I believe in God and I am a practising christian - the fact that I dont buy the crap that the prosperity frauds are selling does not make me an atheist. The converse is also true - choosing to believe the fraud perpetrated by 419 charlatans does not make you a good christian.

EarsWide:

@1Godfather

Why do you suppose I am an atheist ? Is it because I believe upwards of 99% of the prosperity preachers are frauds ?

For your information I believe in God and I am a practising christian - the fact that I dont buy the crap that the prosperity frauds are selling does not make me an atheist. The converse is also true - choosing to believe the fraud perpetrated by 419 charlatans does not make you a good christian.

Very sorry. I didn't intend for you to read my post as addressing you specifically, but in any case, since you've ventured this reply, permit me to point out something. If as you say, you are practicing Christian, then I think that your chosen method for "exposing" fraudulent prosperity preachers is self-defeating and counter-productive in the end. Do you know why? Anyone who is not a theist can as well use your very own chosen method to debunk or seemingly "expose" any and all preachers whether they are genuine or not. If the ready performance of those desired miracles is the test of authenticity, you would be unwittingly dismissing all. And what is to stop a skeptic at spontaneous limb regenerations anyway? What if they decide the test of authenticity should be resurrections (not revivifications)? Or how about "calling down fire from heaven"?

who told you they don't heal amputees

anyway I wonder the same thing too but I believe there's someone out there who is doing He must not necessarily be in Nigeria

@1Godfather

The charlatans that need to exposed - need to be exposed. The only concern in exposing charlatans is that christians dont lose their faith - it is a real concern I have.

Atheists on the other hand will not be convinced by us covering up the obvious - their frauds are too glaring.

EarsWide:

@Mr Jo

Only fools and extremely vulnerable people will accept the sort of explanations you put forward.

Did Jesus specifally heal people with cancer - yet your 419 charlatans claim to do it all the time
Did Jesus lengthen a leg that is shorter than the other ? Yet your 419 charlatans claim to do this ?
Jesus did not have an expensive lifestyle - yet your 419 charlatans do.

All of a sudden you want to say because Jesus did not do it - your 419 charlatans cannot do it.

In anycase what about a withered hand (which Jesus healed) -  Why cant your 419 frauds do it ?

Well I don't even intend to be responding to posts of your like. The topic is foolish. And for you information amputees dont need healing. That is not a sickness. You can heal a wound but for a missing hand or leg. What is needed is not healing but what is called a creative miracle. Couple of ministers have been used of God to perform creative miracles of different types Dude. But is it not foolish asking for proof when your unbelieving heart is already programmed to denial of existence of miracles. That's what scriptures call foolish questions.

2 Timothy 2:23
23 But foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes.

[flash=400,300]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpajHwwuzig[/flash]

from image 123


  "Re: Pastor W.F. Kumuyi @ God Embassy's 17th Anniversary in Ukraine
« #20 on: Today at 01:29:57 AM » 

Wow, these are gladdening news, both of pastor adelaja and of the healings. Who says God does not heal amputees. Is that an 'amputated eye' healed in 2011 in europe? even in the grave, Jesus is Lord. Alleluia "

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-647876.0.html

1Godfather:

I am always amused by the "Why Wont God Heal Amputees" objection by atheists. I suppose that for them to establish that God does not exist, they've imagined that all they need do is pose some challenge for God to come and meet. Mighty presumptuous of atheists, won't you say? To assume that God amounts to no more than a circus dog who is trained to jump through hoops. And so, for them, God must meet their demands or he doesn't exist.

Yet believers petition him with requests for him to respond to like maybe a circus dog? (To which he often responds with results no better than statistical chance).

1Godfather:

But pray tell, if a skeptic were presented with evidence for a case of something miraculous like the miraculous disappearance of cancer against the diagnoses of qualified doctors, or even the case of some spontaneous regeneration of limbs, would that do anything in the slightest bit to compel belief in God or the supernatural from an atheist? Will it rather not be the case that the atheist would reject the evidence before his very eyes, and seek to attribute it to some natural phenomena? And furthermore, if the requested miracle ever happened, what's to stop the atheist from raising the bar? I mean, what's next, "If God exists, why not heal all amputees and not just this one?" or "If God exists, why not remove all diseases and illnesses--surely he is a good God, and why would he not do so anyway?"; or what about "If God exists, why not remove suffering completely? Is he not capable of doing so?"

Disappearance of what sort of cancer? Some cancers are known to spontaneously enter into remission. Now if there was good evidence for spontaneous regeneration of limbs in humans which of course would need to be linked to your God, then we would have a case on our hands. But would you be content with not claiming miracles until such an incident occurred?

1Godfather:

Such is the inflexible nature of willful unbelief: the systematic rejection of all inferences to God or Theism turtles all the way down. There is perhaps no gain in entertaining these amusing objections. It is useful to remind these skeptics that ultimately God performs miracles only in so much as they accord with his providential sovereignty over creation, or they glorify him. Deeply dissatisfying answer to a skeptic, but unfortunately you cannot make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

These are serious objections. If God only performs miracles in line with statistical randomness, then how do you tell that he's there doing it? If he will do it depending on what he thinks, then why pray to him for anything?

@Mr Jo

You yourself know that your response was complete crap.

@Mabell

You have just proved my point - the video you have shown could have been faked because the leg has NOT been amputated. It is much more difficult to fake a miracle where the leg has been amputated (you will need incredible photoshop skills to do that).

This video does nothing to address my original question.