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Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 2:43pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Enigma: Those who will get it will get it. Of course!!! It will only be understood by those willing to propagate their version of "truth", no matter what reality presents. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 2:57pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Enigma's militant/evangelical Atheist- any atheist that says "no" when a christian says "YES!!!" or any atheist that dares to speak. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Enigma(m): 3:00pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Mr_Anony: @Enigma, Humanism and atheism are not exactly the same thing but then again all secular humanists are atheists. Humanism is an attempt to make sense of the immorality that results from rejecting God. @ Mr_Anony Something you might find interesting as food for thought. Previously posted here: https://www.nairaland.com/298119/30-keys-being-effective-atheist/2#9514467 Lack of belief in God is substantively different from belief in the non-existence of God thus a dog, a cow, a monkey is as much an "atheist" as the evangelical atheist! (Very good company ; and as a bonus: insist that man is an ape but become angry if called a monkey ) |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 3:13pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Mr_Anony: He thinks he's "neutral" but his god already has a gender. Wild guess, he is a christian. Mr_Anony:There is no need for a manifesto atheism is true because all concepts of gods and the supernatural are man made. There has never been any objective evidence for the existence of any god or God. If you discard all gods but yours and if the discarded ones are as implausible as yours, what makes you think an atheist has to explain why he discarded yours too? You already know the reasons. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 3:29pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Creator_gods Step 1- Pick a god(apart from yours) from the list. Step 2- Read about him/it Step 3- Ask yourself if you believe Step 4- If you do proceed to step 8, if you don't proceed to step 5 Step 5- List the reasons Step 6- Assume atheists have the same reasons Step 7- Apply the reasons to your god (he's on the list too) Step 8- Kill Yourself |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by MrAnony1(m): 3:42pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Martian:Yes I am a christian. I speak in reflection* - I have already weighed the arguments and God makes so much sense to me. There is no need for a manifesto How can a statement be true if it is a non-statement? No statement is true simply because it proclaims another statement false 1 Like |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by logicboy: 3:52pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Mr_Anony: The fact that there is no physical proof of your God makes sense? Or the fact that your God commanded people to take slaves in Leveticus makes sense? Or that women were created from a rib makes sense? Mr_Anony: ?? A statement can be true if it states that a false statement is false. Ode. Philosophy and logic are not for ignorant christians like you |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 3:52pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Mr_Anony: Then let it make sense to you and yours. Atheism is the acknowledgement that there is no fundamental difference betwen yahweh, obatala, zeus and ahura mazda etc. Christianity is the belief that yahweh/jesus aredifferent from the rest. Mr_Anony: but the statement is true if the statement it opposes is baseless and has similarities with other baseless statements i.e lies You say there is a "god", I say prove it, you say its "extraphyscial and can't be explained in physical terms", I say it sounds like the rest of the fairytales, you close your eyes,close your ears, stomp your feet and keep crying about how your God is different but refuse to give a coherent explanantion. I say your god is not different from the other gods you and I both reject.I'm probably right. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by MrAnony1(m): 4:14pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Martian: You look at a mechanism such as the universe and demand that it's originator must be less complex than it is. You and I know very well that I coined the word "extraphysical" to explain that whatever brought forth the universe i.e the physical must be more complex than the universe hence "extraphysical". feel free to attack my poor use of the english language if that is what makes you feel better. It amuses me when you say you do not know if the universe has an origin or not but you seem absolutely certain that if it does, the creator of the physical must be physical as well. I wonder how you came to be convinced of this. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 4:23pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Mr_Anony: Straw man! I didn't demand anything. My stance is that we don't know why the universe exists or the nature of the originator, if there is one. Mr_Anony: I don't need to. You seem to be coming to terms with the fact that you're not coherent. Mr_Anony: Stop pulling straw men out of your a$$. I didn't say anything about any creator. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 4:31pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Mr_Anony: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Creator_gods Step 1- Pick a god(apart from yours) from the list. Step 2- Read about him/it Step 3- Ask yourself if you believe Step 4- If you do proceed to step 8, if you don't proceed to step 5 Step 5- List the reasons Step 6- Assume atheists have the same reasons Step 7- Apply the reasons to your god (he's on the list too) Step 8- Kill Yourself |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by MrAnony1(m): 4:32pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Martian: No my friend, I don't think I attack any strawmen here. By demanding physical proof for a creator to exist, are you not also saying that the creator must be physical? 1 Like |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by MrAnony1(m): 4:37pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Martian: You have posted this twice now (you must really want me to kill myself ). I have read some of them, I could show you why my God is true but first you have to acknowledge that a God must exist and one of the many proclaimed must be true. Else it is futile talking about it. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 4:39pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Mr_Anony: If your creator created physical things, you must be able to provide evidence that can be tested by physical means because that's the only objective way. And I don't know what your extraphysical means no matter what you think. What if I said this universe is one in a chain of universes and that the original universe was started by a physical entity who also had a creator? Would it be different from your arbitrary point of the "causeless cause" a.k.a god? I know I just made it up, but you have deluded yourself into thinking that it's true. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 4:46pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Mr_Anony: Why "a God" and not "gods"? Please, please, pretty please show me why your God is true. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by MrAnony1(m): 4:47pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Martian: Not so my friend, if a man makes a watch, you don't find the watchmaker by fiddling with the watch. You find the watch maker by asking after him. You can start by reading the manual of the watch. Also you don't identify the watchmaker by assuming that he must look like his watch. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by MrAnony1(m): 4:53pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Martian:"God or gods" whatever floats your boat. you seem to be hung on irrelevant detail. If you say there is no God/gods why should I bother telling you about God? If I say human beings do not exist, why should you bother telling me about yourself and why you are martian? People find God by seeking Him truthfully and not by skepticism. That is how it works my friend. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 4:55pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Mr_Anony: Here goes the watchmaker thing. What's next, the 747? why assume the watchmaker is male? what makes you think one watchmaker made it? maybe it was a collective of watchmakers? anyway, we KNOW humans make watches. Mr_Anony: The manual. lmao you're talking about that ridiculous book aren't you? The one with the tower of language confusion/origination.. Mr_Anony: Of course not, but you can recognize a rolex or a movado by checking for some features. Where is your god's trademark? |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 4:58pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Mr_Anony: I'm not hung up on semantics. You refer to your god as "God" but you can't explain the difference between yours and the others. Hence ,God or whatever you call him is just another man made concept of the universe's cause. Mr_Anony: Come back. You're veering off into incoherence again. Mr_Anony: You mean, people find "God" by having faith in the irrational and the supernatural. That is how it works. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by MrAnony1(m): 5:04pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Martian:For instance if I wanted to meet you, I will look for you with the hope that I will find you. I don't start by assuming that you don't exist. Whichever way you swing it, you must find God by first truthfully wanting to know Him. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 5:10pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
First of all, I am being neutral by presenting the list of gods. I am assuming that they all have the same chance of being true, so it's up to you to tell me why the one you pick is the "true" one. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Creator_gods Mr_Anony: You will look for me with hopes that you will find me because. 1) You KNOW humans exist. 2) You can only assume I don't exist if the descriptions given to you do not tally with reality. 3) I'm proving my existence right now. Mr_Anony: Sorry, THE GREAT LEPRECHAUN compelled me to do that. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by MrAnony1(m): 5:28pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Martian:It is beginning to occur to me that no matter how I try to tell it to you, you will just keep jumping around and twisting my words, Enjoy yourself. You are like someone who comes upon an ipad by chance. first you claim that you don't know if it was created or it just appeared. then when someone tells you that Steve Jobs made it, you do not even show the slightest interest in who Steve might be rather you say that whoever made the ipad must look resemble ipad. that my friend is ignorance. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 5:51pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Mr_Anony: lol. I didn't twist your words. All is did was present a list of gods and ask you to tell us why yours is the ture one. Mr_Anony: No fool, ignorance is insisting on straw men arguments when you have no point. You already tried the "coming across a watch" analogy and the creator resembling a watch and this is what i said. Martian: next it's going to be coming across the Dragon Capsule and wondering if Elon Musk exists or if he looks like the capsule. lol |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 5:53pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
hmm, either anony or enigma rightly puts it, it has now digress to "show me your God exiztence" instead of trying to refute the post by frosbel SMH |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 5:56pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
hisblud: hmm, either anony or enigma rightly puts it, it has now digress to "show me your God exiztence" instead of trying to refute the post by frosbel SMH Why bother refuting straw men? all frosbel did was copy paste some christians made up argument about what atheism is. What's new? |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 5:56pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
[b]Some Evangelical atheists paradoxes*https://www.nairaland.com/298119/30-keys-being-effective-atheist/2#9514467 SO funny Enigma |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 6:03pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
hisblud: https://www.nairaland.com/298119/30-keys-being-effective-atheist/2#9514467 You know what's SO funny? This. https://www.nairaland.com/953672/true-suppressions-archaeological-coverups--a-plot You should go watch ancient aliens. Some even believe your god might have been an ancient alien. lol |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by MrAnony1(m): 6:09pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Martian: First of all, I am being neutral by presenting the list of gods. I am assuming that they all have the same chance of being true, so it's up to you to tell me why the one you pick is the "true" one. If there is God and one of the many must be the true God, then consider: None of the adherents of other gods have made such a claim as this: That God came to the earth in the flesh (not in a time before time but in verifiable time), was seen by people who lived at that time, performed many miracles: including healing the sick and bringing the dead to life, He lived a faultless life and preached a message that was way beyond the thinking of the time. In fact christian values are and have been the bedrock of what we know to be good today (imagine for a minute if everyone followed the way of Christ: there will be no evil in the world whatsoever) He died and He rose again (he was seen by both his disciples and those who did not believe) from the dead and was ascended into heaven. His first disciples (and they were many) preached this and died horrible deaths for it (if Christ's resurrection was a conspiracy, one of them surely would have recanted). And no one of that time contested the resurrection of Christ. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by MrAnony1(m): 6:18pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Martian:Here we go again, the brand on a watch doesn't prove that the watch was created, all it proves is that the creator decided to put his brand on it (why is this so difficult for you?) Besides if you already reject that the watch was created, the brand will not convince you. The evidence for creation for any object is order. The universe is far too orderly and far too intelligent to occur randomly. 1 Like |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 6:26pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Mr_Anony: The watchmaker analogy is a common/(not to mention old) argument which has been criticized throughout its history. The way you are using it is particularly abusive, because you are using a complex object that is easily identifiable as being designed(by man particularly) and equivocating it with another complex object(the Universe). After all how many universe factories have you ever heard of? I know several ipad factories in china and in fact the serial number can tell you where and when your ipad was manufactured. You should take a look at the wiki page for the various criticism/rebuttals http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watchmaker_analogy. To your last point answer this. Do you recognize that humans are made of physical material called matter? Do you recognize that ipad are also composed of physical material called matter? Do you recognize that it was one organization of physical matter(human) that caused another organization of physical matter(ipad) to be? If the answer is yes to all then you are in agreement with the Martian. As to your teleological argument, I am afraid that it is a mess of incoherency. You speak of causality as the motivation for necessitating that there be a first cause(not that I agree on this point). Yet, you then proceed to remove the first cause from a time and space. Surely you must understand that the argument from causation necessitates that all steps be within a time/space framework? For example, the meaning/concept behind the word "cause"(along with every other verb) is entirely informed by a framework of time and space. It is not at all clear what you mean when you say "X" caused/es/ing? "Y" outside of time and space. But, of course that is an incoherent statement because I am talking about X as if it were an "event" that took place within time. By your definition it most certainly did(another word that requires time) not. So using words/concepts like cause/effect/event/does/did/actions are entirely inappropriate considering how you defined first cause. The trouble I see with your argument it that you are trying to say A=/=B and yet turning around and talking as if A=B. Essentially, you are saying the first cause is outside time/space and then proceeding to "borrow" concepts from time and space to explain it. That does not make any sense. If A is outside of time and space, then it is entirely inappropriate/incoherent/illogical to use things that exist within time and space to explain it. I believe this is what Martian has been trying to tell you all along. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by Nobody: 6:28pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
Mr_Anony: And you read all these in your religious book. I can also tell you about Muhammad(who's historicity has been confirmed unlike Iesous) and his holy book. Because apart from the bible, there is no other source for this jesus fellow under than the grasping at straws when apologists start looking for any word that resembles "kristos" in ancient historical texts. Mr_Anony: What are these "christian" values people didn't possess until your religion existed? What is the way of christ and what makes it exclusive to christ? Mr_Anony: My book of Bible stories. Mr_Anony: The resurrection only occured in the bible. So it seems the bible is your evidence that your god is real. |
Re: Atheism: The “No-God” Religion by logicboy: 6:36pm On Jun 02, 2012 |
hisblud: https://www.nairaland.com/298119/30-keys-being-effective-atheist/2#9514467 I have debunked your evangelical atheist paradoxes https://www.nairaland.com/953834/debunking-evangelical-atheists-paradoxes |
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