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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Politics / Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption (2602 Views)
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Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by Beaf: 9:34pm On Jan 13, 2012 |
This is a post from another thread. I believe it is worthy of discussion, especially in the current time. Like I have said, Nigeria's problem is chaos, not corruption. https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-845380.0.html |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by blacksta(m): 9:39pm On Jan 13, 2012 |
OK we have heard. Can we class chaos as a subset of corruption |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by nduchucks: 9:46pm On Jan 13, 2012 |
Beaf, stop the foolishness. Is the chaos not caused by corruption? olodo |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by sheyguy: 9:52pm On Jan 13, 2012 |
Oga beaf, caos is caused by corruption, pple only join and increase the entropy of chaos when corruption starts obstructing their goals. |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by Beaf: 9:55pm On Jan 13, 2012 |
ndu_chucks: How can chaos be caused by corruption? Corruption is caused by lawlessness and lawlessness is caused by a lack of order, which is chaos. Comprende? Fighting corruption without battling its root cause is a waste of time. Fix the Nigerian system and you would have fixed corruption, underdevelopment and the various fuckries around us that have sadly become normal to the average Nigerian; from loudspeakers in churches to soldiers beating people up in the streets, pen theft etc. |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by Nobody: 9:55pm On Jan 13, 2012 |
Beaf, d right word is not 'Chaos' but 'impunity'. It is our culture of impunity that has gotten into ds mess. It is wat's fueling corruption. |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by sheyguy: 10:10pm On Jan 13, 2012 |
Beaf: lawlessness is fuelled by corruption of security and judiciary system, and by extension those who monitor and maintain order at all level including the govt. |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by lanrefront1(m): 10:10pm On Jan 13, 2012 |
Please, I'm pleading with everyone, please do not make any comment on this thread. Ignore it. Infact ignore every thread opened by this attention seeking pshycophant. That is the only way to deal with him. Stop adding fuel to the Fire called Beaf. All u guys who rush and follow him from thread to thread, pls allow this stupid BEAF fire to die out. You are the one giving him power, 1 Like |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by asorocker: 10:24pm On Jan 13, 2012 |
The problem of Nigeria preceded Goodluck Ebele Jonathan , Please Dont be deceived , Aguiyi Ironsi was once accused of being the problem of Nigeria and was sacrificed yet the Unitary system he promulgated has been the sing song of the Northern Cabal that assasinated him. if Jonathan is sacrificed the Problem will still be there . Nigerians should look deeper and they will see the problem of the Country. 1 Like |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by Beaf: 10:41pm On Jan 13, 2012 |
Xavier.: Impunity is a good word indeed. sheyguy: I am afraid that Nigeria problems have nothing to do with the security or judicial systems. We totally lack a framework of existence, therefore anything goes in Nigeria and thats the very definition of chaos. As an example, when last did you hear of food inspectors in Nigeria? Does that have anything to do with security or judicial systems or is it that our existence is so chaotic that in some cases, we are barely human and more animal? It is the same thing that exhibits itself in every strata of our society (even NL). Here are two sets of pics; one is from a rural area in Jamaica (a country thats much poorer than us), the other is from an urban area in Nigeria. Compare: [size=13pt]Nigerian pic set[/size] [size=13pt]Jamaican pic set[/size] Health worker checks the meat in the slaughterhouse. Butcher cuts the meat |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by Nobody: 10:47pm On Jan 13, 2012 |
Beaf: No matter how you want to slice and dice this like the beef above, Beaf, YOU ARE WRONG ON THIS ONE. Corruption is why the Food Inspector (that you suddenly desire in your life) will turn a blind eye to the health disaster staring him in the face after pocketing a couple Dollars. Stop wasting our time and tell your Oga that the fight has moved on and that the angst in the Land now is about the N1Billion food and N500million newspapers he feels he deserves while the rest have to make do with $2/day!!!! |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by Beaf: 11:17pm On Jan 13, 2012 |
kingoflag: This is empty. There is corruption everywhere in the World, but their systems work. There is corruption in Jamaica, but they will not eat food slaughtered in the manner that is common in Nigeria, talkless of the way it is sold (in their markets, every piece of meat has a stamp that proves its healthy). The market I depicted shows chaos in all its gory details. It is everywhere in Nigeria. Nigeria is chaotic, because it has no foundation, so anything goes. No matter how you patch and plaster such a system, it will still spring a leak. We need to either hammer out an enduring framework of existence based on or keep screaming into the wind. That is what Jamaica has that we lack and it shows in everything from the way they have found a way to write their patois as a language totally distinct off English, to the way they have made reggae known Worldwide. Population? 3 million! |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by Nobody: 11:44pm On Jan 13, 2012 |
Beaf: Arguing with you is a waste of time. Its not that you're un-intelligent or uninformed. . . the problem is that you're getting paid to post all kinds of illogical drivel and as such you have to earn your pay just to show your masters that you are working. Convincing should only be left for the un-informed. Thus, I won't even attempt to ask you why someone, who is supposedly not an Im*becile, would deviate from the matter at hand -----an issue which he himself brung up---- to start talking about patois and Reggae music. Do you, man. I'm out. |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by Beaf: 11:46pm On Jan 13, 2012 |
^ Empty as usual. Ok, run along. More intelligent folk are out there. |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by sheyguy: 1:12am On Jan 14, 2012 |
Beaf, i still find ur argument lacking. 9ja markets might look rough but that is nothing close to chaos, our markets r like that largely because of its spacing. The transaction r still the same. As for standard inspection and certification lacking in our system, it is corruption. If some had not triggered the chain of corruption which eventually gives rise to chaos by doing the wrong thing, there would be no chaos. |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by Beaf: 1:27am On Jan 14, 2012 |
sheyguy: Our markets are like that because, anything goes in Nigeria; the markets are surely not so out of corruption, rather it is through chaos. And anything goes in Nigeria, because we are chaotic. The fact that you do no see anything wrong in the situation of the markets only puts clothes on my argument. The average Nigerian cannot see that life could be better organised and existence more humane. Just as our markets where we obtain food to sustain our souls are like a cesspit, so it is that there are sights one would never behold in other countries (see attached pic). The country lacks a foundational framework of existence. So, its like a huge unweildy building, balancing on thin legs, and each time the wind blows we have to add new legs in the direction of the current wind; when the direction changes, the building begins to tip the other way and we have to find bricks or mud to shore it up. Its a never ending cycle of patching leaks, propping up, repainting, rewiring etc, all depending on whichever way the wind blows, cos there is no durable foundation. You wouldn't find this sort of picture in an ordered society. This is not corruption, it is chaos:
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Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by Nobody: 5:45am On Jan 14, 2012 |
Beaf: How do you sleep at night with all the blood of the gullible and innocent dripping through your fingers? |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by ziga: 6:55am On Jan 14, 2012 |
Beaf: These things happen not because we do not have laws. But because the people who should prevent the chaos have been corrupted. Chaos and corruption go hand in hand, however, you need to remove the corruption to cure the chaos. And not the other way round. Let our laws be enforced, and not pushed aside by exchange of ghana must go bags and we will get rid of the chaos. |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by Nobody: 7:36am On Jan 14, 2012 |
our real problem is hypocrites like beaf who will DEFEND ANYTHING from a useless govt |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by norrisman: 8:21am On Jan 14, 2012 |
@ Beaf I agree with what you have posted and it makes a lot of sense but do you know why most people will not agree with you? Because you usually defend the indefensible. I understand you have a job selling the ideas of your boss to Nigerians but there are sometimes when you have to take a step back and objectively analyse situations and view it from the eyes of the ordianry man. |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by Beaf: 9:01am On Jan 14, 2012 |
norrisman: The fact that I support GEJ does not mean I work for him, those who scream that do so because I am much smarter than them and they can only "win" an argument by playing dirty. I will continue to hold any views I am convinced off so far as they are correct, regardless of what anyone on the other side of the political divide thinks. Telling disgusting lies to swamp an opponent is all part of the chaos in Nigeria. |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by PapaBrowne(m): 9:19am On Jan 14, 2012 |
Sometimes we just run our mouths without practicalizing scenarios. To all those saying to fight corruption and not correct the system, lets practicalize scenarios for a moment. Mr President decides that from today, he will begin to fight corruption. So he employs a very strong hand in the EFCC and orders that they stop at nothing to halt corruption in every facet of society. The EFCC boss orders his boys to go to every nook and cranny of society and fish out corruption. Mr A is an EFFC officer(Lets call him Musa). He earns N70,000 a month. He has a family of six. Pays rent 2 years in advance, school fees for 6 children and has an extended family in Kaduna he gives stipends to. His salary finishes on the first week of the month. On the third week of the month, His Oga sends him on an errand to investigate a LG chairman somewhere in Delta State over funds misappropraition running into hundreds of millions. He gets there and is offered a bribe of N5 million to say everything is alright. He is a honest man, but he has bills to pay, so he accepts the bribe. Now the President and the EFCC boss have done their best. But along the chain of command, realities begin to set in. The enforcers of the law meet with a willingly chaotic society. They would do their best, but as long as the structure is rotten, their best will end up like that of Ribadu! Fighting here and there with no change in sight. If we fix the system, the likelihood for corruption would be much less. If for instance the LG chairman in question was made accountable to his constituency rather than to his Governor, it is we the people that would deal with the corruption and not wait for Abuja to do it for us. A good example of fixing the system is the passage of the passage of the FOI bill. The bill would allow us to know exactly what and what our Governments are doing at any given time. However, since that bill was passed the people have failed to use it to their benefit. I haven't heard of a single Nigerian that has gone to any Government office to demand information that would make government accountable. Not even our media houses or Civil Society Organisations. We just keep complaining well as the tools to fight corruption have already been placed in our hands. But no, we ourselves are even more corrupt than the government itself, so we can't be bother. We just love to run our mouths!! |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by Beaf: 9:27am On Jan 14, 2012 |
^ Well illustrated. ziga: I do not agree that you need to remove corruption to heal the chaos. The reason why there are no laws, or existing laws are openly flouted by the majority is that nobody feels they belong or have a stake in Nigeria. If we all had a stake, we would rise and fight anybody attempting to destroy the system; that is what happens abroad, in countries where there is order. It is impossible to imagine a policeman openly demanding a bribe on a New York street. The people would rise against that event. In Nigeria, we stopped fighting during the military regimes, because it was an ill-advised cause of action that would have reaped a few slaps and murderously aimed kicks at best. We can only learn that there once used to be food inspectors in our markets from our parents and grand parents, these things ended during the military times. It is the trauma of military rule, witnessing parents being frog-jumped in public, being demeaned and slapped into line on a daily basis that has led to the present grind where we couldn't care less and a big man can slap a poor man in the street as easily as he could say "good morning." Chaos has torn up our social fabric; it is the lack of belonging that results that causes people to kill, steal, rap'e and pillage; because the mantra in any chaotic environment is, every man for himself. The way we can heal society is by creating a new contract of what it means to be Nigerian, what is expected of a Nigerian and what the country owes to every Nigerin, rich, poor, young, old, female and male. |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by 1025: 9:40am On Jan 14, 2012 |
our information minister said, ghana removed fuel subsidy but the people are not in the streets. this same minister led a protest against the removal of fuel subsidy in 1986 as a students'union leader though he is telling us today that he was sponsored to do so. if he was sponsored to fight against the govt of nigeria, he is a traitor and could be jailed. if he was sponsored, he betrayed and deceived those he was ruling then and deserve death. ruben abati badluck's spokesman wrote a book against fule subsidy removal only in 2009 and today, we know his position. when hypocrites like these are the advisers to badluck, we will not expect anything less than what we are seeing today. no where in the world will you see real peace without justice. pdp is a national disgrace full of ex-convicts and pending jail birds. in ghana, they have steady electricity that will restrict the use of fuel to car owners only unlike in nigeria where even students have generators. those who grind peper insider the markets use fuel. jonathan and sambo will eat food of N1b and buy a dinning set worth of N300m, tell me, how much will remain from the money they will get from the removal of fuel subsidy? it is a shame that jonathan is even doing this without telling nigerians how long they will wait to begin to see his imaginary changes. let jonathan come out with a written document indicating his time line and then brief us on the progress so far with the road map on electricity which he presented to us in 2010. some of us can be fools but all of us are not fools. you claimed to organise a very free and fair election that gulped over N100B yet courts are removing most govs and house members. even the court kept you, what about the 2007 that brought u and yar adua? the election was upheld by the court. why not if you appoint and discharge judges at will? a real change is needed in the governance of this jungle called nigeria. a president whose wife is a criminal has no moral standard to fight crime because charity begins at home. |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by Nobody: 10:13am On Jan 14, 2012 |
PapaBrowne: you lot have the same problem gej has - no crediility. NO ONE IN NAIRALAND can trust the utterances of any of you, as you have shown , time and again, that you are nothing more than paid agents of the gej administration, who will use any means , fair or foul, to promote their policies, no matter how bizarre, unrealistic, foul. spin and spell, lazy phucks, parasites, etal now that all that has failed, we are treated to a long winded epistle on chaos , not corruption the reason why people can listen to sanusi is not because of his grammer, but because people have trust in him. he could have played the intercontinental bank line and raised the minimum deposit in the banks - gej style. he chose to take on the rot in the system instead, even in the face of brutal opposition. he has a huge bank account of trust i suggest you lot take a three month vacation, after which we MAY have forgotten your sordid, shameful disgraceful role in this affair, then you can attempt to cloak yourselves in the garb of patriots without looking like the opportunistic hypocrites you are. waiting for arguejunkie |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by jamace(m): 10:34am On Jan 14, 2012 |
Corruption = cause Chaos = Effect So, which should be tackled first, corruption which is the cause or chaos which is the effect? |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by jmaine: 12:12pm On Jan 14, 2012 |
Nigeria's problem is a delicate twist of many wrongs . . .and those wrongs, is further fueled by the high level of tokenism we practice . . . .i support the notion that, the high endemic corruption in our system is not the root cause of our problems, but an after effect . . .and also the root cause is not chaos . . .chaos and corruption fuel each other, hence are evil twins . . Nigeria was destroyed by Extreme Ethnotribal sentiments, which gave rise to nepotism . . . .Nepotism destroyed the structural foundation for building an organized society, where values,competence and abilities were eroded . . . . Nepotism nurtured corruption . . .and corruption exploded cos it was condoned by all in a bid to fight only for the interest of their[b] ethnotribal regions[/b] . . .and since there was no organization in the system . . .Chaos set in . . .further fueling the corruption . . To fight corruption . . . the chaos from the system must be arrested . . .then corruption would be very visible to identify and curtail . . Below is a post i made before the presidential election . .and it chose to address the concerns of this thread . . . jmaine: |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by PapaBrowne(m): 12:14pm On Jan 14, 2012 |
jamace: Nope. Chaos= Cause Corruption= Effect Tackle the cause, and the effect would begin to vanish. Question: Why don't bank workers steal the millions they count everyday. Answer: The [b]system [/b]doesn't permit them to do so no matter how hard they try. It surely isn't because the Bank managers are fighting corruption. Fix the structural system. Corruption vanishes automatically. |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by Waynita(f): 12:41pm On Jan 14, 2012 |
jmaine: More like it |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by norrisman: 1:25pm On Jan 14, 2012 |
What you guys are arguing about is no different from the Egg and Chicken question; Which one came first? |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by jmaine: 1:37pm On Jan 14, 2012 |
norrisman: It's not as simple as you think and like i said earleir . . .Our challenges is a delicate twist of many wrongs, mainly fueled by the origin of our Ethnotribal divide . . . For solution to come to Nigeria now . . . The Chaos in the system must be tackled . .only then, can we adequately isolate corruption and deal with it . . .as afar as the chaos persist . . .tackling corruption is as good as dead because the chaotic system acts as a mask, shielding the ugly face of corruption . How can you fight a problem/disease that evades adequate and precise diagnosis |
Re: Nigeria's Problem Is Chaos, Not Corruption by Nobody: 4:28pm On Jan 14, 2012 |
nigerias problem is chaos and corruption https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-845517.0.html#msg9959688 Some members of the Federal Executive Council are irked by the role played by the Minister of Petroleum Resources, Mrs. Diezani Alison-Madueke, in the removal of fuel subsidy by the Federal Government on Jan 1, 2012. It was learnt that the announcement of the removal of the subsidy on New Year’s Day came as a shock to many FEC members, who were anticipating the removal in April 2012 as announced by the Group Managing Director of the Nigerian National Petroleum Corporation last December. A source close to the Presidency said that even the Minister of Finance, Dr. Ngozi Okonjo-Iweala, who had been consistently criticised by the public as the person behind the hurried removal of the subsidy, didn’t know that the subsidy was going to be removed in January.
The source said, “It was the Minister of Petroleum Resources that instructed the Petroleum Products Pricing Regulatory Agency to announce the total removal of the subsidy on Jan 1, 2012.”
when you have corrupt loose cannon like ms madueke, under whom brief case companies and jeweller oil lifters flourish is there any doubt that there will be chaos and impunity? When contacted, the Group Public Affairs Manager of the NPPC, Mr. Levi Ajuonuma, said that he did not have time “for that nonsense (alleged role of the petroleum minister). The subsidy has been removed and it has been removed.” beaf, over to you. perhaps you and papa browne can spin and spell this madness in the FEC |
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