@ Docs in the House,
I've always known that doctors are the most occupationally-harassed.
The populace, as evidenced by their posts here, just reek of one of the maladies afflicting the nation - misinformation & mediocrity. What is the difference between the basic salary of a newly- employed graduate & a fresh doc? They fail to realise that it is the call-duty allowance that account for the difference in the Total monthly Emolument of the docs & non-docs, which on a normal day does not even commesurate with the level of suffering & stress!

People talk as if this problem started 2wks ago. They talk as if the government is responsible. Is there any other negotiative tactics that they the government understand? The strike- action self, do they respond well? While the government is showcasing her irresponsibility, dishonesty, given to proving how much power it wields, manipulative attitudes & poli-tricky nature, people are busy spewing absurds out of sheer contempt & envy for the perceived better-living docs, having forgotten that the only well-to-do docs are the Private Practitioners.
Go to the Teaching Hospitals, GHs & FMCs to see for yourselves that the Admin Staffs are even living better off than the docs!
Have you forgotten the proverbial whip used to beat the 1st wife is awaiting the potential oncoming 'nth' wife? Siddon there dey take delight in the acrimony against the embittered docs while your own is just around the corner.
It will shock all of una.

@ Blink182,
What kind of battle or deals have you had with docs to warrant such level of animosity? Even at that, can't you still deliver logical & fair judgement as against that emotional-laden gaffes you posted?

@ Niyitogun,
I hope you are my doc from UCH. Are you?
It's your guy, Shemeh(Oosa)

sleek29:

Is it bad for the police & military to ask for 200k monthly since they face bullets, bombs on a daily basis, they are spoilt brats, if the pay aint enough get anoda job!

shallow brained bab.oon

Hmmmm;d slow pokes welldone wv ur posts.I av ds analysis for u.those of u who said that u can graduates doctors evryday.u thnk we r so full of ourselves.A gud lot of u r jst against us just because u had it difficult getting admission into the universities to study medicine and ended up studyn other courses.This is for ur perusal:
Can we talk? Yes? About doctors strike? Yes?

Thank you, let’s get straight into it.

Using the data provided by the Nigerian Medical Association (NMA) as at January 2012, Nigeria has produced 42,575 doctors since independence with those on the register currently at 22,000.

The implication of this number is that 20,575 doctors are either dead, out of Nigeria (in search of greener pasture), or basically involved in other fields or endeavours.

With 22,000 doctors throughout the federation, we are talking about 14.5 doctors per 100,000 population using 152million as our population index (reflect on that please). With Lagos population at about 17.5million, we have about 4.5doctors per 100,000 population using the sacked 788.

A total of 12,821 doctors are in Private practice (PP) from the 22,000 registered, this leaves us with 9,179 doctors that are working with the Government throughout the Federation.

As seen from the calculation below, we have 6,138 doctors in the various Federal hospitals leaving 3,041 doctors to be shared by the 36states plus Abuja.

LUTH has 800

UCH has 1,051

UNIPORT has 602

NSUKKA has 587

ABU Zaria has 440

UNIMAID has 312

UNILORIN has 217

UniBen has 302

Uthman Dan Fodio, Sokoto has 76

Federal Medical Centres has 1,532

OAU has 219

Total = 6,138

A total of 3,041 are been shared by the 36 state governments being the remainder after those in other services are deducted.

The simple calculation takes us to the 788, deducting the sacked 788 doctors gives us 2,253 doctors for the 36 states. It translates roughly to an average of 61 doctors per state and FCT.

I’m really sorry (for those who detest mathematics) to have put you through these jargons, but the real question is: Where did Lagos state government get the 373 doctors it employed if we have an average of 61 doctors. More info to cme....

Even tho' am nt a fan of pdp gvt;I dare say the situation was better managed by OGD(ex guvnor of ogun state) whn the health system was shut down on account of the agitation for conmess in ogun state ,tax issues etc.Today the state is better for it as the health situation in the state has improved with no doc intimidated,harrased/sacked.
I repeat FaSHoLA is wrng on this.They refuse to pay CoNMESS but can afford to employ locum doctors @ outrageous rates so as to keep the propaganda alive.The rates is well known to doctors nd nt meant for public consumption buh for those of u who have relatives dt are docs u can find out.Gadaffi did it,so ds acn gvt can too.If u thnk its a lie .Go find out.Its when u av peeps dieing in d hands of charlatans who are overworking themselves cos of this goodies that ur gvt has decided to waste that u'l all shut ur leaking mouths!!!!
Anyways thhe nurses are beginning to feel the heat so expect smthn from them soon maybe u'l sack all the nurses then we knw dt d health sector in lagos state wld get its final burial!!

Not holding brief for the doctors. Nigeria is presently a state "tailored to administrate and not to produce". This is why those who produce services like soldiers, doctors, teachers etc are paid far less than political administrators. Its very funny that an average senator (not the president) in nigeria earns more than twice what President Obama earns and more than four times what the British PM earns annually respectively. Bringing it to Lagos, how much do LCDA bosses earn. This is way beyond just the doctors; we live in a country where outside the private sector, the laziest people physically in terms of work done and intellectually are paid more! The doctors had a moral duty to meet the health needs of Lagosians during the strike period just as the LASG had its own moral duty to honour an agreement it entered!!!

@allycat don't worry, its all working for your good.

Thanks iconic s, I can't believe what I was doing to myself. Since the strike started I have left my house on 4 occasions only and yet just climbing the stairs makes me breathless. If not for the strike/ sack I would still have been forcing myself to go to work because we were short staffed. As you said it is all working for my good.
I just watched channels news and they confirmed what I said I saw in LASUTH on Thursday, despite all the propaganda about new doctors covering the emergencies the place looked like a ghost town. They filmed the medical and surgical emergencies on Friday and saw no doctors, nil, nada, zero. If half the sacked docs are from LASUTH I would expect half the new docs to be sent to LASUTH. 150 doctors there will at least get the emergencies up and running that is more than the 10 or so are usually on duty there at any given time. They would be able to give first aid and maybe then refer to LUTH or FMC Ebutte Metta.

@allycat Pathetic!!! Was told Gov. Fashola flew his dad abroad for medical attention, if true, its saddening. Statistic so far is that even if they are ready to employ, qualified doctors are scarce. At the end its the people that will be on the receiving side not the officials.

Laalamed: My advice for doctors is to accept as their lots.they should for job elsewhere.doctors should insist on standard operating procedures.for example,a doctor cannot see more than 20patients a day,rate of 30minutes per patient.how a doctor be seeing 50 to 100 patients per day.that is absurd.also,there is minimal investigation for to confirm diagnosis or monitor treatment.doctors nationwide should insist on standard,then govt will know they are wrong.also,doctors should not strike again,there must be another way.if there is no standardi,doctors should refer the patients.

that is exactly the problem... you can't limit the number of patients to be seen,if patient 21 turns out to be a surgical emergency, will you turn such a person back because you have reached your quota for the day?

Dnt want † be on either side. But the truth i̶̲̥̅̊s̶̲̥̅̊ both the govt and the docs have got some thinking † D̶̲̥̅̊Ơ̴̴̴̴̴̴͡.
Fø̲̣̣я̅, those talking abt docs spending ‎​S̶̲̥̅Ơ̴̴̴̴̴̴͡ and ‎​S̶̲̥̅Ơ̴̴̴̴̴̴͡ number ☀̤̣̈̇f years in schl and working long hours, i'l like † say that this i̶̲̥̅̊s̶̲̥̅̊ not limited † docs alone. People with other careers, working in other sectors go thru that τ̅☺☺. I am a graduate ☀̤̣̈̇f accounting from a polytechnic. If U̶̲̥̅̊ go † a polytechnic, U̶̲̥̅̊ spend nothing less than 5 yrs in schl, datz minus strike and all.
Presently i work in a bank. The earliest time i Gε̲̣̣̣τ̲̅ home i̶̲̥̅̊s̶̲̥̅̊ 10pm. The present bank am working with ηọ̥W̶̲̥̅̊, av been there for over 4 years ηọ̥W̶̲̥̅̊ and no single kobo (i mean ȋ̝̊̅†̥) has been added † my sal. In short, the last payment i received ηọ̥W̶̲̥̅̊, some amount was deducted from my sal again. Not † mention d salary i̶̲̥̅̊s̶̲̥̅̊ even very ridiculous if anyone hears d amount considering d discrimination ☀̤̣̈̇f HND holders in d sector. Buh can i go on strike?
I think the docs are doing this coz they believe they have a bargaining chip † make use ☀̤̣̈̇f. Unfortunately, lives ☀̤̣̈̇f people shld not be used as bargaining chips. At the same time, like someone pointed out, d docs didn't jst wake up one day and decided † go on strike. The govt shld av done sometin b4 ȋ̝̊̅†̥ got † this point.
‎​S̶̲̥̅Ơ̴̴̴̴̴̴͡ like i said before, both parties have some thinking † D̶̲̥̅̊Ơ̴̴̴̴̴̴͡.

onyxo76: i agree with people surviving on 50k a month but surely not in lagos... i don't see how practical it is if you pay rent, transport yourself and feed the family on 50k/month, not that its not possible but am sure they probably will live in a hut or something...maybe in a rural settlement in ekiti or someplace else it may be possible but surely not lagos.

D̶̲̥̅̊Ơ̴̴̴̴̴̴͡ your findings. Ȋ̝̊̅†̥'s ‎​S̶̲̥̅Ơ̴̴̴̴̴̴͡ ‎​S̶̲̥̅Ơ̴̴̴̴̴̴͡ true. Family people self.

The sooner people start addressing the real problem in the society, then we would start moving forward in this country. Tame the tentacles of a maximum ruler before it gets out of hand. A man who used armed policemen to disperse innocent protesters at Lekki toll gate, or are the meeting of these doctors etc. Instead of looking for all avenues to deal with this matter, he sacks almost 1000 doctors. Today it is the turn of the doctors, tomorrow, who knows.

Just heard the locum doctors are paid 20k for 8hours and 30k for a night call. . . .
Hmmm....not sure if the doctors would have gone on strike in the first place if they paid them at these rates.
One then begins to wonder why the goverment is playing hardball. Obviously they realise the work doctors do is worth a lot more than they currently pay.
Just read on a blog about Fashola's father being flown abroad for treatment, this is exactly why they can afford to toy with the lives of Lagosians by playing hard with doctors. Unfortunately the very people who should be applying pressure on the government to resolve this crisis.
Eko o ni baje.

Dr u can limit them.i can remember that dr akinbami,consultant in Chew ,uch instructed that emergencies should not be accepted but refer cos ward is filled up.in standard practice there is limit to what doctors can do.but consultants are d problems,they could not tell d truth.also,call duty should be regulated.in uk and usa ,residents work for about 60hrs per week including call,any extra duty is extramoney.admin staff are living large and doctors are suffering.yeye call.NMA should rise and do right things

onyxo76: that is exactly the problem... you can't limit the number of patients to be seen,if patient 21 turns out to be a surgical emergency, will you turn such a person back because you have reached your quota for the day?

Laalamed: Dr u can limit them.i can remember that dr akinbami,consultant in Chew ,uch instructed that emergencies should not be accepted but refer cos ward is filled up.in standard practice there is limit to what doctors can do.but consultants are d problems,they could not tell d truth.also,call duty should be regulated.in uk and usa ,residents work for about 60hrs per week including call,any extra duty is extramoney.admin staff are living large and doctors are suffering.yeye call.NMA should rise and do right things

in uch? refer to where? uch is a tertiary centre... i wonder where else they can refer to?

Laalamed: Dr u can limit them.i can remember that dr akinbami,consultant in Chew ,uch instructed that emergencies should not be accepted but refer cos ward is filled up.in standard practice there is limit to what doctors can do.but consultants are d problems,they could not tell d truth.also,call duty should be regulated.in uk and usa ,residents work for about 60hrs per week including call,any extra duty is extramoney.admin staff are living large and doctors are suffering.yeye call.NMA should rise and do right things

I agree with you there. . .

I don’t know the full coverage of the CONMESS thing that the government is now reneging on, but my hope is that it takes into consideration the issues you raise.

The fact is that Doctors also have the right to a proper work-life balance, in spite of their much vaunted obligations to ‘save lives’. Where they are not able to have this balance, due to peculiar conditions they may find themselves working in, attempts should be made as much as possible to adequately compensate them. If other professionals feel that they too are not adequately compensated, they also should be making representations to the government through their unions for better conditions of work.

To be frank, it is in poor taste to bemoan the agitation of Doctors, only asking to be treated with a little bit more respect . . .

In the UK, those in NHS training posts (the equivalence of Resident Doctors in Nigeria) are bound by what is called the European Working Time Directive (EWTD) that requires them to work not more than 48 hours in a week. This was fought for and won by the British Medical Association, which by the way performs pretty much the same role that the NMA performs.

Hospitals get around this EWTD by additionally employing extra Doctors, willing to take up non-training posts (usually desperate overseas Doctors) to fill up the slots left as a result of the restricted working hours. These restrictions also create opportunities for locum agencies that are not bound by the EWTD to sign up Doctors already employed by the NHS, but willing to work more hours (above the EWTD) as locums. Some junior Doctors working out of hours or doing locums in places like London have been able to earn an extra £1.2 - 1.5k every month (up to 18k per annum) on top of their salaries . . . which by the way was already way higher than the average salary earned by everybody else (except perhaps investment bankers working in the ‘city’)!

There is no getting around the fact that to get a functional health service, ALL health practitioners need to be adequately compensated. Nurses in the UK are able to achieve a reasonable income by doing extra shifts in their places of work and also doing ‘agency work’ . . . similar to the locums that Doctors do for their out of hour and weekend jobs.

To be honest, if Doctors here in the UK were paid the same kind of comparatively demeaning compensation that our colleagues in Nigeria are paid, I am sure that there would have been some sort of industrial action or temporary downing of tools! But the people who make the rules here are smart enough to recognise the role health professionals play in the proper functioning of their countries, so remunerate them commensurately. A lot of Doctors and GP’s in the UK earn way more than the legislators and the ministers here (MP’s)!

One can however understand the frustration of the general public, but I think that the anger from it, is misdirected. The public should not be venting its displeasures against overworked Doctors, who are only asking for the government to fulfil its pledges to pay them a wage somewhat more reflective of the work the Doctors put in. The rage should be against the politicians who have been squandering the common wealth of all Nigerians and still have the state of mind to pay themselves obscene wages for doing absolutely nothing . . . !

I learnt early in my career never to take official accommodation, it's a useless trap which can be used as a tool for blackmail. It's even worse when you are a senior personnel. This isn't the first time Lagos state has kicked out doctors from their accommodation and it won't be the last.

beneli:

I agree with you there. . .

I don’t know the full coverage of the CONMESS thing that the government is now reneging on, but my hope is that it takes into consideration the issues you raise.

The fact is that Doctors also have the right to a proper work-life balance, in spite of their much vaunted obligations to ‘save lives’. Where they are not able to have this balance, due to peculiar conditions they may find themselves working in, attempts should be made as much as possible to adequately compensate them. If other professionals feel that they too are not adequately compensated, they also should be making representations to the government through their unions for better conditions of work.

To be frank, it is in poor taste to bemoan the agitation of Doctors, only asking to be treated with a little bit more respect . . .

In the UK, those in NHS training posts (the equivalence of Resident Doctors in Nigeria) are bound by what is called the European Working Time Directive (EWTD) that requires them to work not more than 48 hours in a week. This was fought for and won by the British Medical Association, which by the way performs pretty much the same role that the NMA performs.

Hospitals get around this EWTD by additionally employing extra Doctors, willing to take up non-training posts (usually desperate overseas Doctors) to fill up the slots left as a result of the restricted working hours. These restrictions also create opportunities for locum agencies that are not bound by the EWTD to sign up Doctors already employed by the NHS, but willing to work more hours (above the EWTD) as locums. Some junior Doctors working out of hours or doing locums in places like London have been able to earn an extra £1.2 - 1.5k every month (up to 18k per annum) on top of their salaries . . . which by the way was already way higher than the average salary earned by everybody else (except perhaps investment bankers working in the ‘city’)!

There is no getting around the fact that to get a functional health service, ALL health practitioners need to be adequately compensated. Nurses in the UK are able to achieve a reasonable income by doing extra shifts in their places of work and also doing ‘agency work’ . . . similar to the locums that Doctors do for their out of hour and weekend jobs.

To be honest, if Doctors here in the UK were paid the same kind of comparatively demeaning compensation that our colleagues in Nigeria are paid, I am sure that there would have been some sort of industrial action or temporary downing of tools! But the people who make the rules here are smart enough to recognise the role health professionals play in the proper functioning of their countries, so remunerate them commensurately. A lot of Doctors and GP’s in the UK earn way more than the legislators and the ministers here (MP’s)!

One can however understand the frustration of the general public, but I think that the anger from it, is misdirected. The public should not be venting its displeasures against overworked Doctors, who are only asking for the government to fulfil its pledges to pay them a wage somewhat more reflective of the work the Doctors put in. The rage should be against the politicians who have been squandering the common wealth of all Nigerians and still have the state of mind to pay themselves obscene wages for doing absolutely nothing . . . !

Well said.Most of us sign the opt out forms with the NHS when we resume any new post. This frees us to make a lot more money from locums. I think Nigeria's problem has to do with some people wanting exactly the same income without the same inputs with doctors hence the bad-blood.
As a SpR with one of the northern deaneries, income from locum agencies alone gross me about 2.5k monthly(average £60-80) an hour, sometimes more. This is why we left the country and sadly more people will leave with this rash decision of the Lagos state govt. I only hope people will realise early enough and call the government to other.
Fine, we all know the civil service needs reforms in nija. This would have been an opportunity for the LASG to make far reaching changes. i believe they can decide to pay more than the doctors demand but then ask for increased productivity. No more 'lifetime' employment. Make it renewable contracts and set targets. Contracts will put an end to incessant demands and contracts will be tied to performance. If indeed they are interested in making Lagosians enojy better services, this is the way to go.

childluck: These doctors have been so unreasonable by embracing strike instead of dialogue in the first place. You cannot hold people to ransom because your job is important, that is unpatriotic. In what way are they better than Policemen and Soldiers who daily loose their lives while defending the nation? Why are those not going on strike or they not Nigerians? Fashola is a real leader and has taken a leadership decision not a political one! I would sacrifice few (788 greedy doctors) to save 17million Lagosians. Fashola is working !!!

Do you know the MONTHS of dialogue before any strike?

maasoap: If hunger strike can work for real, then why not try it? At least, they would have won public sympathy. See what is happening now, the public have seen them as wicked people. What about limiting the number of patients they attend to on daily basis until govt gives in to their demand? What about reducing the number of doctors available in the hospitals (something like shifting) to the extent that the govt will be aware of it, yet won't know how to punish them because they're not completely absent from work. Yet, the patients and the govt will know that something has to be done.

So...let me get this straight.

You actually expect doctors that work rigorous shifts to go on hunger strike? You actually have no concerns with being treated by a doctor who has not eaten for days?
Truly, Nigerians are weird creatures.

its issues like this that lets u in on d thinking and intelligence(or lack thereof) of the average nigerian.
someone wants doctors on hunger strike to be carrying out overnight Caesarean sections and attending to clinic n ward patients the next day ! laff wan give me muscle pull!
for those who are too slow to understand....DOCTORS TRIED DIALOGUE WITH THE GOVERNMENT BUT NO GOVERNMENT OFFICIAL WAS READY TO MEET AND TALK WITH THE MEDICAL GUILD THROUGHOUT THE MONTHS OF FEBRUARY AND MARCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
haba or do some of these people want it in their native language?

Buhari and Idiagbon sacked doctors and evicted them from their quarters years ago. That led to the first wave of Nigerian doctors going to Saudi Arabia, those that didn't leave the country ended up Setting up private hospitals like Lagoon, Havana, Eko hospitals and the truth is they ended up better than the few who stayed behind to salvage the situation. But karma is an ass, the day Idiagbon died, he was rushed to University of Ilorin teaching hospital but alas doctors were on strike for the same reasons they had been on strike when he sacked them previously and we all know how that his story ended.
I am not God and I don't know how my own life will turn out, but I know personally I work hard and I am not one of the 100 hardest working doctors in LASUTH. At a recent accreditation exercise for the post graduate studies carried out in LASUTH, the team could not believe the number of patients we claimed to have seen in the last 3 years vis a vis the number of doctors in our unit. They insisted on going through the patients registers and checking things themselves. And the funny thing is my department is considered a light duty department by other doctors working in the hospital. So if anybody now decides that we are all stupid, greedy, incompetent murderers, good for them.
So continue abusing Nigerian doctors, jubilating over their sack, in fact have a street part and pop champagne.

Do you know that you can be a doctor yourself? Cure yourself with cheap available alternative. Visit www.NATIVEANSWER.com NOW

MOBBDEEP: @ Docs in the House,
I've always known that doctors are the most occupationally-harassed.
The populace, as evidenced by their posts here, just reek of one of the maladies afflicting the nation - misinformation & mediocrity. What is the difference between the basic salary of a newly- employed graduate & a fresh doc? They fail to realise that it is the call-duty allowance that account for the difference in the Total monthly Emolument of the docs & non-docs, which on a normal day does not even commesurate with the level of suffering & stress!

People talk as if this problem started 2wks ago. They talk as if the government is responsible. Is there any other negotiative tactics that they the government understand? The strike- action self, do they respond well? While the government is showcasing her irresponsibility, dishonesty, given to proving how much power it wields, manipulative attitudes & poli-tricky nature, people are busy spewing absurds out of sheer contempt & envy for the perceived better-living docs, having forgotten that the only well-to-do docs are the Private Practitioners.
Go to the Teaching Hospitals, GHs & FMCs to see for yourselves that the Admin Staffs are even living better off than the docs!
Have you forgotten the proverbial whip used to beat the 1st wife is awaiting the potential oncoming 'nth' wife? Siddon there dey take delight in the acrimony against the embittered docs while your own is just around the corner.
It will shock all of una.

@ Blink182,
What kind of battle or deals have you had with docs to warrant such level of animosity? Even at that, can't you still deliver logical & fair judgement as against that emotional-laden gaffes you posted?

@ Niyitogun,
I hope you are my doc from UCH. Are you?
It's your guy, Shemeh(Oosa)

Yeah bro