raumdeuter:

226 points over 20yrs vs 180 points over 12yrs

Do the Math while I wait

This your point has no basis, seeing that Fergie, Wenger, Ancelloti at Al, are on the list

handelex:
Rubbish.

A good manager leaves a solid foundation for his successor to build on and continue the winning culture not burning everything down and leaving a toxic environment behind.

That Mourinho won something in his first season at United was the work of Van Gaal which he destroyed and we are here today.

From your Logic, Ancelloti et al Madrid coaches built on Mourinho Madrid legacy?

Lol...

Some toxic fans on Twitter though

"I applied for a job at the local dinosaur museum. I got the job and when I got there I saw the Josesauras. I asked my boss, "what is that?" "That's the Josesauras he's a finished dinosaur who uses tactics from 2004 and thinks it still works in 2021."

Illimitable:


There’s nothing like easiest route. You can only beat what is put in front of you. Did Mourinho decide who United will play?
Why couldn’t SAF beat Bilbao in 2012? You mean Bilbao was bigger than SAF’s United?

Why then do we have terms like "group of death" if there's no easier route. When the strongest team we faced in that tourney was a young Ajax team, that should tell you alot.

If he didn’t overachieve by winning 3 trophies and finishing 2nd(81 points), why did Ole spend £150m on the defence? He should have thought he could win with what Jose won with, don’t you think?

So that United overpaid for Maguire and AWB now gives credence to your misguided point that Mourinho overachieved? Are you even reading what you're typing right now
You just lost it here.

That’s not even remotely true.

Jose was sacked in 2007 with only 2 points behind the leaders(Arsenal) in September. Are you suggesting Mourinho was no longer performing with just being 2 points behind the leaders in September?

If we use the same yardstick for every manager, do you know how many times Ole, Pep or Klopp would have been sacked in the last 3 years?

What of when he was sacked during his 2nd stint at Chelsea or United?
Normally when differences are unreconcilable, there is an inevitable parting of ways either through sacking or mutual agreement, however Jose has been sacked in his last 3 jobs because of how shit he became on the job and wanting to burn everything to the ground.

Illimitable:


It’s about progression - a concept you lacked.

Mourinho met a team that cannot get past round of 16 for 6 consecutive seasons and got them into semis 3 times. It’s inevitable that they will win it as soon as they are 1 goal or one penalty shootout away from the final.

Pep met Bayern after they had just completed a TREBLE and baba couldn’t get them past semifinal in 3 attempts.

That’s regression. Bayern had already won the CL, they were in form when Pep(the supposed best manager on the planet) joined them and yet, the team deteriorated under him.

It was no wonder Bayern parted company with the fraud.

What are you even saying. As if, it is easy to win the champions league every season, Mention any manager apart from Zidane that have win the champions league in consecutive years. Same Mourinho that has always been relieved of his duties, mention one club that has sacked Guardiola in between the season.
What happen to Mourinho that he won only a league title with Madrid with world class players that later won the champions league 4 times after he was sack.

A season before Mourinho was employed to Chelsea, they have finished second and in the previous season, they have been eliminated in the semi final, why didn't Mourinho win a champions league trophy with them or a premier League title after his return to premier League.

Currently, Mourinho have lost his winning touch, Most top clubs would go for Guardiola before considering Mourinho.

obonujoker:


From your Logic, Ancelloti et al Madrid coaches built on Mourinho Madrid legacy?

For that it's very correct. Jose gets some credit for the work he did there and the rewards that followed later.

obonujoker:


This your point has no basis, seeing that Fergie, Wenger, Ancelloti at Al, are on the list

out of the 20yrs in consideration how many of those years did Ferguson and Wenger coach

handelex:

Why then do we have terms like "group of death" if there's no easier route. When the strongest team we faced in that tourney was a young Ajax team, that should tell you alot.

SAF wasn’t beaten in a group of death. He faced Bilbao in the knockout and he was destroyed home and away by Bielsa.

United were better and bigger than Bilbao in 2012 and still SAF lost - so even if any of Ole or SAF had managed United in 16/17 season, they could still have lost to any of the teams United faced that year.

SAF was eliminated in a CL group that contained Benfica, Basel and Otelul Galati - that wasn’t a group of death. It was the easiest group that season so there’s no proof SAF or Ole wouldn’t have been eliminated in 2017.

handelex:

So that United overpaid for Maguire and AWB now gives credence to your misguided point that Mourinho overachieved? Are you even reading what you're typing right now
You just lost it here.

Whose fault was it that United overpaid? Since Mourinho left, United have made significant changes to the team and yet they seem further from the trophy than any time under Mourinho.

United played in 3 finals under Mourinho before the first two years. It’s been more than 2 years under Ole and his team that has been pumped with enough money but still, the Norwegian fraud can’t get into a final.

Give your head a wobble, handelex.

handelex:

What of when he was sacked during his 2nd stint at Chelsea or United?
Normally when differences are unreconcilable, there is an inevitable parting of ways either through sacking or mutual agreement, however Jose has been sacked in his last 3 jobs because of how shit he became on the job and wanting to burn everything to the ground.

I am just letting you know getting sacked isn’t always about performance. You watch enough football to know this. Villas-Boas was recently sacked because he didn’t want a certain player that the board of his club wanted - that had nothing to do with the results on the pitch.

IFFHS has proven my point that Jose is the best manager this century. Nothing you say matters here. You will just continue to dance around the bush after getting buried with facts and logic.

I am tired of this argument now. When you have something fresh to say concerning Mourinho, holla at me. IFFHS claimed Mourinho is the best amongst his peers in the last 20 years, I checked my workings and it agrees with the organization.

If you think Pep or Ole or Allardyce are better, take your matter to IFFHS.

handelex:
For that it's very correct. Jose gets some credit for the work he did there and the rewards that followed later.

Indirectly, he destroys both Porto and Inter Milan which make both team not being able to reach the semifinal or finals after he left.

Illimitable:


Mourinho had gap years in those 20 years and he managed plenty of underdog clubs while Pep only goes where failure is impossible.

Mourinho has 4 IFFHS awards in 20 years
Guardiola has 2 IFFHS awards in 12 years

Do the math while I wait.

How many years gap did Mourinho have between 2000 and 2020

Do the Math I wait

TrebleChamp:
For the purpose of this argument, the rating shows Jose as the best and Pep a distant 4th. But my main point was that Jose bested Pep in La liga, beating him in a Cup Final and breaking La liga points winning record.

Ratings have contexts to them.


Let me ask Allardyce 178 EPL wins, Klopp 133 EPL wins. Who is the better coach?

While Mourinho was in Madrid Pep won the league beating Mourinho, Won the CL beating Mourinho on the way
Now compare these to what Mourinho won when Pep was there

Illimitable:


Matic is finished as a DM. He’s got no recovery pace to catch up when the opponents break.

We can as well bring Schmeichel back as a goalkeeper.




The two of them are not good enough as CMs or DMs. They should be substitutes at their very best if the club really wants to go to the next level.

Matic and Carrick have nothing in their brains to teach or rehabilitate Fred or Scott. If they can do it, they would have done it.

How many erratic passes does Fred make in a single game? What have Carrick/Matic done to improve Fred’s passes?

A good DM must be positionally aware, must be excellent in interceptions, blocks, tackles and a good recovery pace even when he’s caught upfield. A good DM must also have composure in possession and the ability to pass or dribble when pressed.

Fred or McTominay lack each of these qualities.




Bruno couldn’t have done what Pogba did to Hojberg for the 3rd goal and Bruno couldn’t have found Cavani like Pogba did for the disallowed goal.

I don’t know why you guys can’t get it that a squad needs more than Bruno OR Pogba. A squad needs Bruno + Pogba + 2 other quality midfielders.

Bruno struggled in plenty of games without Pogba. All those 0-0 games that widened the gap between United and City are because Bruno cannot do it alone sometimes. Only United fans want one of the two when you should be clamoring for both and maybe 3 more.

City have KDB, Foden, Gundogan, Bernardo Silva in their midfield. If one or two of them get injured or suspended, there isn’t any loss of quality. At United, if Bruno should get injured, everything collapses.

That’s why City are miles ahead and United are on their longest run without a trophy in the PL era.

Oga city are not miles ahead because they have 3 to 4 quality midfielders, what city have that every other clubs doesn't have are quality replacements; that's all.
in my United team, the only out and out DM is Matic. Both Fred and mctominay are CMs and have to be played side by side. There is also an imbalance in right side of United's team. The goalie is another big reason, for the past 2 seasons Sergio Romero should have been our no.1 same way Henderson has benched de Gea; but the higher found the call to tough to make.

BARAJ92:
What are you even saying. As if, it is easy to win the champions league every season, Mention any manager apart from Zidane that have win the champions league in consecutive years. Same Mourinho that has always been relieved of his duties, mention one club that has sacked Guardiola in between the season.
What happen to Mourinho that he won only a league title with Madrid with world class players that later won the champions league 4 times after he was sack.

Nobody said Pep should have won the CL every season at Bayern. After inheriting a side that just won the TREBLE, you would expect at least one final under Pep. Pep wasn’t hired to win Bundesliga - he was brought in to win the CL.
Therefore, he failed his primary objective.

Madrid only signed world class players after Jose left. He had already won them the league, won copa del rey(after 18 years) and got them to UEFA semis(after 6 years of getting eliminated in round of 16).

Mourinho already laid a foundation and Florentino roofed the house after Jose left. I know most of you don’t remember this but it was after Jose left that they bought
Bale(£86m), Isco(£30m), Casemiro(£6m) James(£67m), Kroos(£25m), Keylor Navas(£10m), etc.

handelex:

A season before Mourinho was employed to Chelsea, they have finished second and in the previous season, they have been eliminated in the semi final, why didn't Mourinho win a champions league trophy with them or a premier League title after his return to premier League.

Mourinho won the league with Chelsea immediately he was hired. He also got into semifinal and was only eliminated by a ghost goal Liverpool scored - otherwise he would have faced Milan in the final. It was Mourinho’s Chelsea that eliminated Barcelona that season.

handelex:

Currently, Mourinho have lost his winning touch, Most top clubs would go for Guardiola before considering Mourinho.

He hasn’t lost his winning touch. He’s won a trophy in every club he’s been and I have no doubt he will win at Spurs too - it will just take longer because Spurs FC are bottlers.

It seems he’s lost his touch because he takes difficult jobs, he takes jobs from clubs that are in trouble. Pep takes ready made jobs. SAF approached Pep in America and the rumor was that the Glazers couldn’t match Pep’s ambitions. He dumped SAF for Bayern Munich(the softest job in the world).

McTominay:

Oga city are not miles ahead because they have 3 to 4 quality midfielders, what city have that every other clubs doesn't have are quality replacements; that's all.
in my United team, the only out and out DM is Matic. Both Fred and mctominay are CMs and have to be played side by side. There is also an imbalance in right side of United's team. The goalie is another big reason, for the past 2 seasons Sergio Romero should have been our no.1 same way Henderson has benched de Gea; but the higher found the call to tough to make.

When Mourinho asked for this depth in the squad, United fans told him he moans too much that he should coach what he’s got.

City were already miles ahead of United when Pep/Jose arrived in the summer of 2016 and yet the Glazers refused to back Mourinho by signing him 10 players while Pep signed 25 players before Jose was sacked.

One cannot say United don’t deserve their misery. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

raumdeuter:


How many years gap did Mourinho have between 2000 and 2020

Do the Math I wait

There’s no other math to be done. I have given you the ratio as things stand.

Until Pep gets above Mourinho, you should zip it.

Mourinho had gap years. He left Chelsea in Sep 2007, joined Inter in June 2008.

He left United in Dec 2018, joined Spurs in November 2019. That’s like 2 years.

Besides that, he’s managed average clubs like Porto, Inter, United & Chelsea in that period while Pep has only managed juggernaut clubs like City, Bayern and Barca.

Pep only joins the highest spender in the league. If you can’t guarantee him that you will outspend rivals, Pep isn’t interested.

Illimitable:


There’s no other math to be done. I have given you the ratio as things stand.

Until Pep gets above Mourinho, you should zip it.

Mourinho had gap years. He left Chelsea in Sep 2007, joined Inter in June 2008.

He left United in Dec 2018, joined Spurs in November 2019. That’s like 2 years.

Besides that, he’s managed average clubs like Porto, Inter, United & Chelsea in that period while Pep has only managed juggernaut clubs like City, Bayern and Barca.

Pep only joins the highest spender in the league. If you can’t guarantee him that you will outspend rivals, Pep isn’t interested.

2 yrs out of 20 makes it 18
Pep started in 2008 and took a year off making 11yrs

Mourinhos Chelsea Inter Madrid United were juggernauts

Actually before Pep and Mourinho joined, City and Man utd finished level on points in the league

Illimitable:


SAF wasn’t beaten in a group of death. He faced Bilbao in the knockout and he was destroyed home and away by Bielsa.

United were better and bigger than Bilbao in 2012 and still SAF lost - so even if any of Ole or SAF had managed United in 16/17 season, they could still have lost to any of the teams United faced that year.

SAF was eliminated in a CL group that contained Benfica, Basel and Otelul Galati - that wasn’t a group of death. It was the easiest group that season so there’s no proof SAF or Ole wouldn’t have been eliminated in 2017.

Lol I couldn't care less if Bilbao battered United, that was on Fergie, but it doesn't in any way change the fact that United had the easiest route to an Europa league win under Mourinho playing the likes of Rostov and St Etienne etc Get that into your thick skull.

Whose fault was it that United overpaid? Since Mourinho left, United have made significant changes to the team and yet they seem further from the trophy than any time under Mourinho.

United played in 3 finals under Mourinho before the first two years. It’s been more than 2 years under Ole and his team that has been pumped with enough money but still, the Norwegian fraud can’t get into a final.

Give your head a wobble, handelex.

Oga stop beating about the bush. Seems the only straw you're clutching at now is mentioning Ole. Thought you said they're not in the same league so why pitting them against each other. Pit Jose against his mates in Guardiola. Meanwhile Ole is comfortably in 2nd why he's in Europa Conference spots.

If you attend a church, tell your Pastor to deliver you from victimhood and fanboyism since you're adamant that Europa league and Carabao cup is an over achievement for Jose and a club like United.

You really need to give your head that wobble.

I am just letting you know getting sacked isn’t always about performance. You watch enough football to know this. Villas-Boas was recently sacked because he didn’t want a certain player that the board of his club wanted - that had nothing to do with the results on the pitch.

IFFHS has proven my point that Jose is the best manager this century. Nothing you say matters here. You will just continue to dance around the bush after getting buried with facts and logic.

I am tired of this argument now. When you have something fresh to say concerning Mourinho, holla at me. IFFHS claimed Mourinho is the best amongst his peers in the last 20 years, I checked my workings and it agrees with the organization.

If you think Pep or Ole or Allardyce are better, take your matter to IFFHS.

Getting sacked isn't always about performance and I agree but Jose has been sacked in his last 3 jobs because of performance.
IFFHS can give him that, he's coached more years than all the coaches there but right now the world's best coach in struggling to qualify for Europa Conference League. Now deal with that.

raumdeuter:


2 yrs out of 20 makes it 18
Pep started in 2008 and took a year off making 11yrs

Mourinhos Chelsea Inter Madrid United were juggernauts

Actually before Pep and Mourinho joined, City and Man utd finished level on points in the league

Mourinho’s Chelsea weren’t juggernauts - they hadn’t won a league title in 50 years.

Mourinho’s Inter weren’t juggernauts, they hadn’t won the champions league in 45 years.

Mourinho’s Madrid had become slaves to Pep’s Barca, they hadn’t reached UCL Q/final in 6 seasons, hadn’t won copa del Rey in 18 years.

Mourinho’s United were the worst he joined - they had won no league in 3 years by finishing 7th, 5th & 4th. They won a miserable FA cup final by beating Palace. This was a club that never finished lower than 3rd under SAF.

But you want to compare these clubs to a club that recently won the TREBLE, the Barca that won CL as recent as the previous 3 years or the City that won the PL after SAF had retired and never finished below 4th since their takeover.

City & United finished level on points in 15/16 because City’s interests were in the CL - they reached the semis and they had to rest players for more important games than top 4 that was already secure.

You want to know the last time United reached the semis? 10 years ago.

Juggernaut my ass!

handelex:


Lol I couldn't care less if Bilbao battered United, that was on Fergie, but it doesn't in any way change the fact that United had the easiest route to an Europa league win under Mourinho playing the likes of Rostov and St Etienne etc Get that into your thick skull.

Oga stop beating about the bush. Seems the only straw you're clutching at now is mentioning Ole. Thought you said they're not in the same league so why pitting them against each other. Pit Jose against his mates in Guardiola. Meanwhile Ole is comfortably in 2nd why he's in Europa Conference spots.

If you attend a church, tell your Pastor to deliver you from victimhood and fanboyism since you're adamant that Europa league and Carabao cup is an over achievement for Jose and a club like United.

You really need to give your head that wobble.

Getting sacked isn't always about performance and I agree but Jose has been sacked in his last 3 jobs because of performance.
IFFHS can give him that, he's coached more years than all the coaches there but right now the world's best coach in struggling to qualify for Europa Conference League. Now deal with that.

Look at him emotional.

Illimitable:


Look at him emotional.

Go and sleep.

handelex:
Go and sleep.

The moral of the story is - you got cooked.

Only if he can qualify for the champs with his previous titles .

2nd season stint my foot

handelex:
Go and sleep.

Na you waste your time with person wey say 2nd legged comeback isn't a comeback

Lol!!!

Mou overachieved with united ?!!

Lolz!!!!

What we will now say of sir Alex

Illimitable:


The moral of the story is - you got cooked.

Lmaoooo, you can cry all you want but your Jose is now getting cooked by the likes of Solskjaer and Co.
Now run along boy and enjoy Banik Ostrava away in the Europa Conference next season.

handelex:
Lmaoooo, you can cry all you want your Jose is now getting cooked by the likes of Solskjaer and Co.
Now run along boy.

Ole doesn’t have 25 major trophies though.....

You can manufacture 25 major medals for him in your village.

Ole should continue cooking you into oblivion. The end shall justify the means real soon.

handelex:
Lmaoooo, you can cry all you want but your Jose is now getting cooked by the likes of Solskjaer and Co.
Now run along boy and enjoy Banik Ostrava away in the Europa Conference next season.

Heartless you are

KingAlabi:


Na you waste your time with person wey say 2nd legged comeback isn't a comeback

Lol!!!

Lol, I wanted to engage him today and las las you see as e take end nau

handelex:
Lol, I wanted to engage him today and las las you see as e take end nau

The guy go just dey tie himself up for argument, from pillar to post, sounds like you are arguing with a drunk

You don't get to decide who got cooked. The spectators get to make that decision. Meanwhile, I am still waiting for your stellar Waec results.

Illimitable:


The moral of the story is - you got cooked.

KingAlabi:
Mou overachieved with united ?!!

Lolz!!!!

What we will now say of sir Alex

Overchieved with Carabao cup and Europa league

Later nitrogen and co will say we're the ones that want mediocrity for the club.
If those 2 cups and finishing 2nd were over achievements, I guess Ole's not faring badly seeing he took over from the World's BEST COACH

handelex:
Overchieved with Carabao cup and Europa league

Later nitrogen and co will say we're the ones that want mediocrity for the club.
If those 2 cups and finishing 2nd are over achievements, I guess Ole's not faring badly seeing he took over from the World's BEST COACH

I saw where he said Madrid was an underdog sef

Chia wetin Musa no go see for gate.