Since man ate of the tree of knowledge, he gained the knowledge of good and evil, right and wrong. And became supposedly like God. Genesis 3 1-4

But rummaging through the bible what do you observe?

From "my own observation" having read the bible a couple of times, there is no standard of right or wrong. What is obtainable is simply whatever God says at a specific time and situation.

1. Lying
From the very beginning. The bible teaches against lying. In fact Jesus actually referred to all who lie as children of the devil. John 8:44
- Interestingly there are instances where God lied.
When God told Adam and Eve that they would die if they ever ate of the tree of the knowledge of Good and evil.
While this is obviously a lie as neither Adam and Eve died.
There has been argument stating that death according to God is not physical death but a spiritual death.
Meaning God's disconnection from man is what is actually death.
This leaves us asking who lied, was it God who lied or the serpeant?
-Exodus 7:16
When God told Moses to inform Pharaoh to release his people just to worship him for 3 days when God's intention was to liberate them completely.
-1 Kings 22:21-23
When God sent a lying spirit to the king.

2. Righteousness
The term righteousness is one of the most argued words in the bible.
Biblically righteousness used to mean fulfilling the Laws of Moses. Now it means being in right standing with God simply by believing in Jesus.
While righteousness literally means doing what is right.
The bible distinguishes between man's righteousness and God's righteousness.
Though God himself initially gave the condition for righteousness (according to the Laws given to Moses) yet God and even Jesus proved these acts to be Self-righteousness.
According to the old testament, righteousness was by human effort at fulfilling the over 613 laws of the old testament.
But according to the new testament, righteousness simply means believing in Jesus Christ.
This has created a chasm between various factions of Christianity.
While some believe Righteousness means believing in Jesus Christ and accepting him as Lord and Saviour, also choosing to following God's principles in the old testament.
Others believe righteousness is simply believing in Jesus is what instills God's Righteousness and no human effort or works counts.

3. God of Mystery
If God was able to call Abraham his friend even though he lied and called Sarah his sister eventhough she was his wife.
God called David the man after his heart even though he committed adultery with Bathsheba and even arranged the death of her husband.
God called Paul who was his own persecutor even on his journey to persecute his followers and made him the greatest Apostle in the new testament.

4. God Denying the Righteous
Adam and Eve were born righteous, why didn't God prevent them from falling for the temptation of the serpeant even though he's omnipotent, omnipresent and omniscient.
Why didnt God save Samson who dedicated himself to the life of a Nazarene when he fell for Delilah?
Why didnt God save John the Baptist when he didnt follow Jesus Christ and ended up beheaded by Herod just to please his daughter.
Why did God reject Eli with all his service and righteousness simply for the sins of his children?

5. God overlooks standards
The truth according to the bible is that in Christianity there are no Laws.
You are no longer a slave to the laws of the flesh but led by the Law of the Spirit. Roman's 8:2
Which means God can decide he is against lying but choose to allow you lie just to have your way.

There are so many stories that prove that God does not have a standard. He can stand against lying but choose to allow lying just to save his child(ren).

He can stand against killing but allow his children kill the so called heathen.

So how do you then know what is right and what is wrong? Especially for those who do not claim the holy spirit says this or that. Cos obviously those who claim the Holyspirit says actually use that to deceive their gullible followers. Let me not mention names.

Myer:
Since man ate of the tree of knowledge, he gained the knowledge of good and evil, right and wrong. And became supposedly as wise as God.

Wrong! He did not become wise!

He only knew God knew to be Good and what God knew to be evil

Will be back!

Dtruthspeaker:


Wrong! He did not become wise!

He only knew God knew to be Good and what God knew to be evil

Will be back!

Knowing the difference between good and evil is what the dictionary defines as Wisdom.

The bible did not say man was as wise as God as you rightly corrected. But it says man would become like God, knowing Good and evil.

So by inductive reasoning man became like God by becoming wise.

The cavemen tried very hard in their stories but eventually it doesn't add up. It only makes sense to the backward humans, not to the intelligent ones.

Try to read and understand the Bible very well before making conclusions.

God never liked about their death because the death he meant was not instant death as mankind was not supposed to see death according to creation plan but death came unto mankind as a result of their disobedience which was why Adam and Eve grew old and died. Even the generations that followed up till now.

Another death is spiritual death which is separation from God. which happened the moment God discovered they disobeyed. Same still applies today. When someone is not born-again, they are dead spiritually ie separated from God.

Tell the Holy Spirit to guide you whenever you're studying the word of God.

God is never a liar! He can only bend his words sometimes to suit his purpose and no one can question him.

Go and read the book of job. You can't question God's doing. That is why He is God. THE I AM TAHT I AM.

Interesting thread. Following.

CharisEleos:
Try to read and understand the Bible very well before making conclusions.

God never liked about their death because the death he meant was not instant death as mankind was not supposed to see death according to creation plan but death came unto mankind as a result of their disobedience which was why Adam and Eve grew old and died. Even the generations that followed up till now.

Another death is spiritual death which is separation from God. which happened the moment God discovered they disobeyed. Same still applies today. When someone is not born-again, they are dead spiritually ie separated from God.

Tell to Holy Spirit to guide you whenever you're studying the word of God.

Goa is never a liar! He can only bend his words sometimes to suit his purpose and no one can question him.

Go and read the book of job. You can't question God's doing. That is why He is God. THE I AM TAHT I AM.

On the contrary, man was not created to live eternally which was why God banished man from the Garden of Eden before he could eat of the tree of life which would make him live eternally.

I believe it is you who should pray for the Holyspirit next time you read the bible or choose to defend the bible.

Myer:


On the contrary, man was not created to live eternally which was why God banished man from the Garden of Eden before he could eat of the tree of life which would make him live eternally.

I believe it is you who should pray for the Holyspirit next time you read the bible or choose to defend the bible.

You need the Holy Spirit more.

1 Corinthians 15:21-22 For since by one man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.


If man was not created to live forever, then what is the meaning of the above passage?

Study to show thyself approved.

CharisEleos:


You need the Holy Spirit more.

[b]1 Corinthians 15:21-22 For since by one man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

You did not answer my question.

Man was not created initially to live forever.
Genesis 3:22-24
And the Lord God said, “The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever.” 23 So the Lord God banished him from the Garden of Eden to work the ground from which he had been taken. 24 After he drove the man out, he placed on the east side of the Garden of Eden cherubim and a flaming sword flashing back and forth to guard the way to the tree of life.


Meaning man was going to die if he did not eat of the tree of life.
So that simply means when God said man would die from eating of the tree of Good and evil it was not referring to death in a future date since man was already meant to die unless he ate of the tree of life.

So who lied to Adam about the tree of knowledge, God or the serpeant?

Myer:


You did not answer my question.

Man was not created initially to live forever.
Genesis 3:22-24
And the Lord God said, “The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever.” 23 So the Lord God banished him from the Garden of Eden to work the ground from which he had been taken. 24 After he drove the man out, he placed on the east side of the Garden of Eden cherubim and a flaming sword flashing back and forth to guard the way to the tree of life.

This happened AFTER they had disobeyed God. Before then, God planned for them to live forever.

Read to understand not to attack.

CharisEleos:


This happened AFTER they had disobeyed God. Before then, God planned for them to live forever.

Read to understand not to attack.

It's ok to be wrong and admit to correction. It's what makes you grow as a person and even as a Christian.

What is the essence of a tree of life when they were already created to live eternally?

Myer:
Since man ate of the tree of knowledge, he gained the knowledge of good and evil, right and wrong. And became supposedly like God. Genesis 3 1-4

Adam had always been able to distinguish good from bad. The tree was simply there as a sign of authority over Adam i.e. God was to be the only person to set standards for mankind.

But rummaging through the bible what do you observe?
From "my own observation" having read the bible a couple of times, there is no standard of right or wrong. What is obtainable is simply whatever God says at a specific time and situation.
1. Lying
From the very beginning. The bible teaches against lying. In fact Jesus actually referred to all who lie as children of the devil. John 8:44
- Interestingly there are instances where God lied.
When God told Adam and Eve that they would die if they ever ate of the tree of the knowledge of Good and evil.
While this is obviously a lie as neither Adam and Eve died.
There has been argument stating that death according to God is not physical death but a spiritual death.
Meaning God's disconnection from man is what is actually death.
This leaves us asking who lied, was it God who lied or the serpeant?
-Exodus 7:16
When God told Moses to inform Pharaoh to release his people just to worship him for 3 days when God's intention was to liberate them completely.
-1 Kings 22:21-23
When God sent a lying spirit to the king.

Well, Adam and Eve actually died that day from God’s standpoint because they didn’t last up to a millennia—which is a day in God’s eyes(Psalm 90:4, 2Peter 3:8.)
From a human standpoint, look at it this way, if you cut off a branch from its source of life(tree), does it instantly disappear or continually wither until it completely fades away into nonexistence? That’s what happened with Adam and Eve. They became alienated from God the day they decided eat of the tree and so they continually to wither away until they returned back to the dust of the earth as God had said would happen. Genesis 3:19

As for Pharaoh’s case, God didn’t need ask him to do anything. The purpose for extending the plagues was so the news could spread throughout the region that the true God was backing Israel. Joshua 2:8-11

In the case of Ahab, he himself wanted to be deceived that’s why he called in several false prophets who began to tell him what he wanted to hear but Micaiah the only true prophet amongst them even gave him expo about what was truly going on yet he decided to believe the lie he was told by the false prophets and he paid dearly with life. 1Kings 22:37

2. Righteousness
The term righteousness is one of the most argued words in the bible.
Biblically righteousness used to mean fulfilling the Laws of Moses. Now it means being in right standing with God simply by believing in Jesus.
While righteousness literally means doing what is right.
The bible distinguishes between man's righteousness and God's righteousness.
Though God himself initially gave the condition for righteousness (according to the Laws given to Moses) yet God and even Jesus proved these acts to be Self-righteousness.
According to the old testament, righteousness was by human effort at fulfilling the over 613 laws of the old testament.
But according to the new testament, righteousness simply means believing in Jesus Christ.
This has created a chasm between various factions of Christianity.
While some believe Rofhteousness means believing in Jesus and accepting him as Savior and Lord, and following God's principles in the old testament. Another says believes simply believing n Jesus is what instills God's Roghteousness and no human effort or works counts.

Contrary to what you said, Jesus didn’t say observing the Law meant one was self-righteous. Those Pharisees were only cherrypicking from the Law of Moses & merging it with their man-made tradition and then using that to establish their own form of righteousness which was contrary to what God had instituted(Matthew 15:3-9) so rather than seek the righteousness of God, they sought to establish theirs. Romans 10:1-3

Besides, no man can fully be called “righteous” on his own merit because those whom God called “righteous” simply put faith in God irrespective of works(Romans 4:3) but that doesn’t mean works aren’t necessary. It is as important as the breath of life is to the human body, so to keep one’s faith alive, it needs to be accompanied by works(James 2:26) otherwise how else would we know the difference between those doing God’s will and those disguising as Satan’s agents? James 2:19

3. God of Mystery
If God was able to call Abraham his friend even though he lied and called Sarah his sister eventhough she was his wife.
God called David the man after his heart even though he committed adultery with Bathsheba and even arranged the death of her husband.
God called Paul who was his own persecutors even on his journey to persecute his followers.

How did Abraham lie exactly when Sarah was truly his half sister? Genesis 20:12
Also, didn’t God censure David for the gruesome action that he took on his own initiative?(2Samuel 11:7-15) and didn’t David prove to be repentant? 2Samuel 11:3
So what’s the fuss about?

4. God Denying the Righteous
Adam and Eve were born righteous!,why didnt God prevent them from falling for the temptation of the serpeant even though he's omnipotent, omnipresent and omniscient.
Why didnt God save Samson who dedicated himself to the life of a Nazarene when he fell for Delilah?
Why didnt God save John the Baptist when he didnt follow Jesus Christ and ended up beheaded by Herod just to please his daughter.

You know what’s funny? How you claim to have been “rummaging” the Bible and yet you still try to see the Bible through the lens of unscriptural ideas such as this omniscient and omnipresent hogwash.

Let me ask you this, you train up your son in the best possible way you can—provide him education, opportunities to excel in life, a starting point(perhaps a land or existing business)—and your son went ahead to abandon all those goodies to become an armed robber. Please are you the one at fault for how your son turned out even though you well know your son has the willpower to decide what he wants?

Similarly, Adam&Eve had the willpower to choose whether they would remain loyal to God or not and God provides them with several goodies—a home, a spouse, satisfying work, prospect of living forever—so how people manage to turn this on its head claiming that God is at fault for their actions baffles me at times because Adam and Eve were living in perfect conditions before they turned their back on God. Genesis 3:1-5

Concerning Samson, since it wasn’t stated explicitly why God didn’t intervene, we cannot know for sure but study of Job’s account helps us see that Samson’s own suffering was not caused by God and that Samson could at that point when he was blind and weak, be like Job who despite facing trials kept his integrity which will then prove Satan’s claim against humans to be a lie. Job 2:4,5; Proverbs 27:11

John the Baptist had an assignment to do and that was to prepare the way for the Messiah. Luke 3:3-6
He wasn’t sent to meddle into matters that didn’t concern him(1Thessalonians 4:11) however he is still amongst the long line of prophets who will be resurrected back to life on earth when the time is due. Isaiah 26:19, Acts 24:15

5. God overlooks standards
The truth according to the bible is that in Christianity there are no Laws.
You are no longer a slave to the laws of the flesh but led by the Law of the Spirit. Roman's 8:2
Which means God can decide he is against lying but choose to allow you lie just to have your way.

The truth is that God’s standards do not change or alter. Malachi 3:6, James 1:17
When talking about the Law, Jesus said he came to lighten our burden for us(Matthew 11:28-30) and then proposed that the entire Law of Moses was hinged on two important Laws—the love of God and love of neighbour. Mark 12:30
Jesus’ followers are still guided by the “law of the Christ”(Galatians 6:2) but this is not a long written list containing many laws but the same principles that guided the documentation of the Mosaic Law which Jesus taught his followers especially on the Sermon on the Mount and other instances. Matthew 5-7, John 13:35

There are so many stories that prove that God does not have a standard. He can stand against lying but choose to allow lying just to save his child(ren).
He can stand against killing but allow his children kill the so called heathen.
So how do you then know what is right and what is wrong. Especially for those who do not claim the holy spirit says this or that. Cos obviously those who claim the Holyspirit says actually use that to deceive their gullible followers. Let me not mention names.

This is where you completely missed the point. Righteousness simply means adhering to God’s own standard of right and wrong. Romans 1:17
Human beings have tried setting their own standards for more than 6 millennia now but what has been the outcome? Ecclesiastes 8:9
Does it not rather prove that humans need a higher Being, God to be the one to set the standards of good and bad since it is not in human nature to that without consequences? Jeremiah 10:23
It only takes one who is humble to accept God’s standards anyway so even if most people agree or not, mankind on its own without God’s guidance is just one blind man leading another blind man to their own misery. Matthew 15:14

@Myer :Beloved, the Bible must be read in light of redemption. Thus, the central message or the theme of the Bible is God’s plan of redemption for mankind. With this mindset, the Bible becomes clearer to you. This is why you’re reading the book of Genesis literarily instead of figuratively.
To start with, and in a literal sense, a tree can never give life. It’s clear that that tree is a person. That tree of life is Christ Jesus! John explains this:

“In Him was life, and the life was the light of men.”
‭‭John‬ ‭1:4‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

And again:

“And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son.”
‭‭I John‬ ‭5:11‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

So life is in the son and not a tree. A tree can never defile a man. Jesus confirms this.


“Not what goes into the mouth defiles a man; but what comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man.””
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭15:11‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

So what was responsible for their death?

Unbelief!

They refused to believe the gospel preached to them. A man is justified by faith in the finished work of Christ . Anything outside this is religion or works. This is what the tree of the knowledge of good and evil stands for.

Myer:

Knowing the difference between good and evil is what the dictionary defines as Wisdom.

Dictionary is not the Repository of Wisdom.

The Owner of Wisdom has already told you that He is the One holding Wisdom and He dispenses it at His Own Will and it can not be taken by anyone.

It is rather given! Wisdom is a Gift!

It can not be bought in the market or found by much books!

So everyone is A Fool until Wisdom enters them and changes them.!

Myer:

The bible did not say man was as wise as God as you rightly corrected. But it says man would become like God, knowing Good and evil.

The Operative Word is "Knowing" nothing more!

Myer:

So by inductive reasoning man became like God by becoming wise.

This is why your brother FoJ and co will shout "fallacy upanda" because all inductive and deductive reasoning is based on the Facts on Ground and not pulled from the air, abracadabra style.

And you Truthfully have none as you have shown!

Myer:

From "my own observation" having read the bible a couple of times, there is no standard of right or wrong. What is obtainable is simply whatever God says at a specific time and situation.

Therefore there is a Standard and to clear all doubt, the Bible still clealy Expresses the Standard which in David's words is put "Do good, Flee from evil"

But the Accurate Measurement of what is good or evil where the challenge is and this is where the Levites, whom we call Lawyers today come in.

It is their job to Dispense Rightness and to Accurately Measure it when required.

God is not a man or human being....God created both light and darkness. Good and evil. He created evil as a learning tool. Right and wrong are only a man's perspective. God does not know the difference ..

Myer:
.
1. Lying
...- Interestingly there are instances where God lied.

Eewoh! God, Lie? You are a killer like Cain indeed for you have murdered me!

Myer:

When God told Adam and Eve that they would die if they ever ate of the tree of the knowledge of Good and evil.
While this is obviously a lie as neither Adam and Eve died.

There has been argument stating that death according to God is not physical death but a spiritual death.
Meaning God's disconnection from man is what is actually death.
This leaves us asking who lied, was it God who lied or the serpeant?

First of All the Operative word is "Argument" on physical death and spiritual death.

Secondly, Christ clearly put it to rest when He said "Fear He whom after he hath killed, had power to cast in hell"

So the obvious answer beyond all argument is that God can cause both physical and spiritual death.

Myer:

-Exodus 7:16
When God told Moses to inform Pharaoh to release his people just to worship him for 3 days when God's intention was to liberate them completely.

That was not a Lie, for All Lies must be Fully and Irreversibly Implemented before it can be called A Lie.

But pharoah failed to make it A Lie

So it is you who is the Liar here!

Count 1 - "Calling an Innocent a Liar"
Count 2 - "Calling the A King, A Liar without Proof"

Myer:

-1 Kings 22:21-23
When God sent a lying spirit to the king.

Did you not hear, "every creation obeys Him? Does a King become a messenger when He sends his messenger?

No, He does not, A king is Always A King!

Count 3 "Calling an Innocent a Liar"
Count 4- "Calling the A King, A Liar

Myer:

2. Righteousness
The term righteousness is one of the most argued words in the bible.
Biblically righteousness used to mean fulfilling the Laws of Moses.
Now it means being in right standing with God simply by believing in Jesus.

The Bold is the Doing of Satan's children in changing Everything God Truly said into what God Never said.

Righteousness is in Doing Only that which is Right and Good which we can easily accomplish through and by keeping The Law as given to Moses.

Myer:

While righteousness literally means doing what is right.

By the Bibles Measurement, it is Not just Right Alone BUT RIGHT AND GOOD!

Myer:
P
The bible distinguishes between man's righteousness and God's righteousness.
Though God himself initially gave the condition for righteousness (according to the Laws given to Moses) yet God and even Jesus proved these acts to be Self-righteousness.

Proved self-righteousness? Why did you not present the proof now?

Of course it does not exist!

Count 5- "Giving False Testimony!
Count 6- "Making False Accusations!"

Myer:

According to the old testament, righteousness was by human effort at fulfilling the over 613 laws of the old testament.
But according to the new testament, righteousness simply means believing in Jesus Christ.

The Bold is the Teaching of Satan's children and not of God.

Secondly, it is humans who do "the Wrong" that is going to kill them exactly as you are doing and therefore it is them who need to do "The Right" that they might obtain Mercy, Forgiveness and Eternal Life!

Myer:

This has created a chasm between various factions of Christianity.
While some believe Righteousness means believing in Jesus Christ and accepting him as Lord and Saviour, also choosing to following God's principles in the old testament.
Others believe righteousness is simply believing in Jesus is what instills God's Righteousness and no human effort or works counts.

Just as there is no Farm without weeds, there is no gathering where Satan's children will not be there!

Myer:

5. God overlooks standards
The truth according to the bible is that in Christianity there are no Laws.
You are no longer a slave to the laws of the flesh but led by the Law of the Spirit. Roman's 8:2

Teaching of Satan's children and not what God said

Myer:

There are so many stories that prove that God does not have a standard.

More Lies!

The mere fact that you can not find the standard does not mean that it is not there

Myer:

He can stand against lying but choose to allow lying just to save his child(ren).

He can stand against killing but allow his children kill the so called heathen.

None of these are True and the mere fact that you do not know what is True, will not change that which True into a lie!

So it is you who is lying because you do not know, as you normally do not know.

Myer:

So how do you then know what is right and what is wrong?

Simple, Look to The Law!

It is The Law that says you are Wrong and Guilty it is Also The Law which says you are Right and Innocent.

The Law is the Beginning and The Law is the End and The Law is The Judge!

Dtruthspeaker:


The Bold is the Doing of Satan's children in changing Everything God Truly said into what God Never said.

Righteousness is in Doing Only that which is Right and Good which we can easily accomplish through and by keeping The Law as given to Moses.



By the Bibles Measurement, it is Not just Right Alone BUT RIGHT AND GOOD!



Proved self-righteousness? Why did you not present the proof now?

Of course it does not exist!

Count 5- "Giving False Testimony!
Count 6- "Making False Accusations!"



The Bold is the Teaching of Satan's children and not of God.

Secondly, it is humans who do "the Wrong" that is going to kill them exactly as you are doing and therefore it is them who need to do "The Right" that they might obtain Mercy, Forgiveness and Eternal Life!



Just as there is no Farm without weeds, there is no gathering where Satan's children will not be!

Offences continued!

Count 6- Defamation (Tarnishing the name and person of the Innocent)
Count 7-Murder of the Innocent using Lies and False Accusations as a Weapon
Count 8-Incitement of persons against the Innocent
Count 9-Breach of Peace
Count10-False Publication of Materials aimed at causing a Wrongful Rebellion or Treason

Myer:


It's ok to be wrong and admit to correction. It's what makes you grow as a person and even as a Christian.

What is the essence of a tree of life when they were already created to live eternally?

Simple! That's the fruit you would have taken to cure corana, malaria, snake bites, and other things which have power to kill you.

But now, they kill you and you die with no healing!

truespeak:

Offences continued!

Count 6- Defamation (Tarnishing the name and person of the Innocent)
Count 7-Murder of the Innocent using Lies and False Accusations as a Weapon
Count 8-Incitement of persons against the Innocent
Count 9-Breach of Peace
Count10-False Publication of materials aimed at causing a wrongful rebellion or treason

"All men shall give account of every word, including idle words"

So imagine the weight of his willful word thank God that he has asked about the measurement of righteousness, so he should measure himself and Judge!

Myer:


It's ok to be wrong and admit to correction. It's what makes you grow as a person and even as a Christian.

What is the essence of a tree of life when they were already created to live eternally?

Tree of Life does exactly that, give and replenish life exactly as food is to us!

Hence they were not prohibited from eating it!

Dtruthspeaker:


"All men shall give account of every word, including idle words"

So imagine the weight of his willful word thank God that he has asked about the measurement of righteousness, so he should measure himself and Judge!

Hmph!

DappaD:


Adam had always been able to distinguish good from bad. The tree was simply there as a sign of authority over Adam i.e. God was to be the only person to set standards for mankind.



Well, Adam and Eve actually died that day from God’s standpoint because they didn’t last up to a millennia—which is a day in God’s eyes(Psalm 90:4, 2Peter 3:8.)
From a human standpoint, look at it this way, if you cut off a branch from its source of life(tree), does it instantly disappear or continually wither until it completely fades away into nonexistence? That’s what happened with Adam and Eve. They became alienated from God the day they decided eat of the tree and so they continually to wither away until they returned back to the dust of the earth as God had said would happen. Genesis 3:19

As for Pharaoh’s case, God didn’t need ask him to do anything. The purpose for extending the plagues was so the news could spread throughout the region that the true God was backing Israel. Joshua 2:8-11

In the case of Ahab, he himself wanted to be deceived that’s why he called in several false prophets who began to tell him what he wanted to hear but Micaiah the only true prophet amongst them even gave him expo about what was truly going on yet he decided to believe the lie he was told by the false prophets and he paid dearly with life. 1Kings 22:37




Contrary to what you said, Jesus didn’t say observing the Law meant one was self-righteous. Those Pharisees were only cherrypicking from the Law of Moses & merging it with their man-made tradition and then using that to establish their own form of righteousness which was contrary to what God had instituted(Matthew 15:3-9) so rather than seek the righteousness of God, they sought to establish theirs. Romans 10:1-3

Besides, no man can fully be called “righteous” on his own merit because those whom God called “righteous” simply put faith in God irrespective of works(Romans 4:3) but that doesn’t mean works aren’t necessary. It is as important as the breath of life is to the human body, so to keep one’s faith alive, it needs to be accompanied by works(James 2:26) otherwise how else would we know the difference between those doing God’s will and those disguising as Satan’s agents? James 2:19




How did Abraham lie exactly when Sarah was truly his half sister? Genesis 20:12
Also, didn’t God censure David for the gruesome action that he took on his own initiative?(2Samuel 11:7-15) and didn’t David prove to be repentant? 2Samuel 11:3
So what’s the fuss about?



You know what’s funny? How you claim to have been “rummaging” the Bible and yet you still try to see the Bible through the lens of unscriptural ideas such as this omniscient and omnipresent hogwash.

Let me ask you this, you train up your son in the best possible way you can—provide him education, opportunities to excel in life, a starting point(perhaps a land or existing business)—and your son went ahead to abandon all those goodies to become an armed robber. Please are you the one at fault for how your son turned out even though you well know your son has the willpower to decide what he wants?

Similarly, Adam&Eve had the willpower to choose whether they would remain loyal to God or not and God provides them with several goodies—a home, a spouse, satisfying work, prospect of living forever—so how people manage to turn this on its head claiming that God is at fault for their actions baffles me at times because Adam and Eve were living in perfect conditions before they turned their back on God. Genesis 3:1-5

Concerning Samson, since it wasn’t stated explicitly why God didn’t intervene, we cannot know for sure but study of Job’s account helps us see that Samson’s own suffering was not caused by God and that Samson could at that point when he was blind and weak, be like Job who despite facing trials kept his integrity which will then prove Satan’s claim against humans to be a lie. Job 2:4,5; Proverbs 27:11

John the Baptist had an assignment to do and that was to prepare the way for the Messiah. Luke 3:3-6
He wasn’t sent to meddle into matters that didn’t concern him(1Thessalonians 4:11) however he is still amongst the long line of prophets who will be resurrected back to life on earth when the time is due. Isaiah 26:19, Acts 24:15



The truth is that God’s standards do not change or alter. Malachi 3:6, James 1:17
When talking about the Law, Jesus said he came to lighten our burden for us(Matthew 11:28-30) and then proposed that the entire Law of Moses was hinged on two important Laws—the love of God and love of neighbour. Mark 12:30
Jesus’ followers are still guided by the “law of the Christ”(Galatians 6:2) but this is not a long written list containing many laws but the same principles that guided the documentation of the Mosaic Law which Jesus taught his followers especially on the Sermon on the Mount and other instances. Matthew 5-7, John 13:35



This is where you completely missed the point. Righteousness simply means adhering to God’s own standard of right and wrong. Romans 1:17
Human beings have tried setting their own standards for more than 6 millennia now but what has been the outcome? Ecclesiastes 8:9
Does it not rather prove that humans need a higher Being, God to be the one to set the standards of good and bad since it is not in human nature to that without consequences? Jeremiah 10:23
It only takes one who is humble to accept God’s standards anyway so even if most people agree or not, mankind on its own without God’s guidance is just one blind man leading another blind man to their own misery. Matthew 15:14

1. How do you know Adam was able to distinguish between good and evil when the bible never stated so? Do you have a different bible? If yes, please share it.

2. Since Adam could die if uprooted it means he was never created immortal. Which justifies why God created the tree of life.

3. As for Pharaoh there's no denying that God lied to him through Moses. God knowing his intention was to liberate Israel completely lied that he only needed him to release them to worship him for only 3 days.

truespeak:


Tree of Life does exactly that, give and replenish life exactly as food is to us!

Hence they were not prohibited from eating it!

Don't just listen to what your pastor says but be like the Bereans and study to know what the bible says.

Genesis 3:22
And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever."

Myer:


Don't just listen to what your pastor says but be like the Bereans and study to know what the bible says.

Genesis 3:22
And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever."

You asked what was the essence of the Tree of Life, which I verily answered, now you have fled to Genesis 3:22 which only occurred after eating the Fruit of the Only Tree Prohibited which made them lose their Right of Eating and to Eat of the Tree of Life, hence the Taking Away of this Right as Evident in the said Genesis 3:22.

madegreatbygrace:
@Myer :Beloved, the Bible must be read in light of redemption. Thus, the central message or the theme of the Bible is God’s plan of redemption for mankind. With this mindset, the Bible becomes clearer to you. This is why you’re reading the book of Genesis literarily instead of figuratively.
To start with, and in a literal sense, a tree can never give life. It’s clear that that tree is a person. That tree of life is Christ Jesus! John explains this:

“In Him was life, and the life was the light of men.”
‭‭John‬ ‭1:4‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

And again:

“And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son.”
‭‭I John‬ ‭5:11‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

So life is in the son and not a tree. A tree can never defile a man. Jesus confirms this.


“Not what goes into the mouth defiles a man; but what comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man.””
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭15:11‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

So what was responsible for their death?

Unbelief!

They refused to believe the gospel preached to them. A man is justified by faith in the finished work of Christ . Anything outside this is religion or works. This is what the tree of the knowledge of good and evil stands for.

Was the gospel of Christ preached to Adam and Eve?

Myer:

1. How do you know Adam was able to distinguish between good and evil when the bible never stated so? Do you have a different bible? If yes, please share it.

Do you think Adam wouldn’t know the consequence of his disobedience after God told him clearly that if he ate of the tree, he would die? Genesis 2:17
If Adam didn’t know the consequences of disobedience, why is blame heaped on his head that he brought sin and death into the world? Romans 5:12

2. Since Adam could die if uprooted it means he was never created immortal. Which justifies why God created the tree of life.

Adam was never created immortal. As at that point in time, only God was/is immortal(Habakkuk 1:12)so none of the angels are immortal even though they do not wear out and die like humans that’s why Satan and his demons are subject to destruction. Matthew 25:46, Romans 16:20
There’s a big difference between immortality(deathlessness/indestructibility) and living forever as a perfect creature. Adam had the prospect of living forever had it been he kept taking in instruction from God but he was never immortal that’s why he could return to nonexistence. Genesis 3:19

3. As for Pharaoh there's no denying that God lied to him through Moses. God knowing his intention was to liberate Israel completely lied that he only needed him to release them to worship him for only 3 days.

It can only be a lie if God didn’t have the power to liberate Israel without going through all that rigorous process. Even God said the reason why he kept Pharaoh alive was so he could show his power before the eyes of the nations(Exodus 9:16) so God did not need to bargain with Pharaoh, the reason for all that was to see whether he would oblige but he only continued to harden his heart(Psalm 105:25) so if God chose to eliminate him in an instant nothing stops him(Job 34:14,15) but he chose to go through diplomatic process first by tolerating Pharaoh. Romans 9:22

DappaD:


Do you think Adam wouldn’t know the consequence of his disobedience after God told him clearly that if he ate of the tree, he would die? Genesis 2:17
If Adam didn’t know the consequences of disobedience, why is blame heaped on his head that he brought sin and death into the world? Romans 5:12



Adam was never created immortal. As at that point in time, only God was/is immortal(Habakkuk 1:12)so none of the angels are immortal even though they do not wear out and die like humans that’s why Satan and his demons are subject to destruction. Matthew 25:46, Romans 16:20
There’s a big difference between immortality(deathlessness/indestructibility) and living forever as a perfect creature. Adam had the prospect of living forever had it been he kept taking in instruction from God but he was never immortal that’s why he could return to nonexistence. Genesis 3:19



It can only be a lie if God didn’t have the power to liberate Israel without going through all that rigorous process. Even God said the reason why he kept Pharaoh alive was so he could show his power before the eyes of the nations(Exodus 9:16) so God did not need to bargain with Pharaoh, the reason for all that was to see whether he would oblige but he only continued to harden his heart(Psalm 105:25) so if God chose to eliminate him in an instant nothing stops him(Job 34:14,15) but he chose to go through diplomatic process first by tolerating Pharaoh. Romans 9:22

No matter how you try to spin it, God lied to Pharaoh through Moses.
Since it was still God who hardened his heart it meant he had no reason to even lie to him in the first place.

To assume Adam, the very first of human race knew the consequences of disobeying God only makes you sound very juvenile. He obviously never knew what the consequences meant.
God did not even warn him of the devil and his cunning and manipulative ways. So in his shoes any one would fall just the same.

Myer:

No matter how you try to spin it, God lied to Pharaoh through Moses.
Since it was still God who hardened his heart it meant he had no reason to even lie to him in the first place.

God never lied to anyone. He has no business with Pharaoh if not for the sake of His people nothing will bring JEHOVAH to have any dealings with Satan's worshipers.
You can't expect Him to divulge all things to that pagan nah! So JEHOVAH dealt with Pharaoh the same way you will deal with a total stranger!

To assume Adam, the very first of human race knew the consequences of disobeying God only makes you sound very juvenile. He obviously never knew what the consequences meant.
God did not even warn him of the devil and his cunning and manipulative ways. So in his shoes any one would fall just the same

Job has proved the highlighted to be untrue!

While God and Satan were bargaining over whose side Job will take, the imperfect man Job wasn't informed neither forewarned about what Satan will do to him yet Job remain faithful to God under the most challenging circumstances!
So Adam whose condition was even far better than that of Job knew what he was doing. Remember it was Eve that came to tell Adam to disobey God whereas both of them knew the consequences of disobedience {Genesis 3:2-3} but Job on the other hand is already suffering when his wife (just as Eve advice Adam) told her husband to turn against God! Job 2:9
Job's wife spoke from a logical point of view, if Job should curse God he will die and go to rest but Job said "NO!" So what stops Adam a man whose body Satan has no right to touch from remaining steadfast unlike Job (a sinner) that Satan has every right to torment?

MaxInDHouse:

God never lied to anyone. He has no business with Pharaoh if not for the sake of His people nothing will bring JEHOVAH to have any dealings with Satan's worshipers.
You can't expect Him to divulge all things to that pagan nah! So JEHOVAH dealt with Pharaoh the same way you will deal with a total stranger!



Job has proved the highlighted to be untrue!

While God and Satan were bargaining over whose side Job will take, the imperfect man Job wasn't informed neither forewarned about what Satan will do to him yet Job remain faithful to God under the most challenging circumstances!
So Adam whose condition was even far better than that of Job knew what he was doing. Remember it was Eve that came to tell Adam to disobey God whereas both of them knew the consequences of disobedience {Genesis 3:2-3} but Job on the other hand is already suffering when his wife (just as Eve advice Adam) told her husband to turn against God! Job 2:9
Job's wife spoke from a logical point of view, if Job should curse God he will die and go to rest but Job said "NO!" So what stops Adam a man whose body Satan has no right to touch from remaining steadfast unlike Job (a sinner) that Satan has every right to torment?

Max I thought we agreed you'd avoid my threads? What happened? Lack of self control?
You know self control is one of the fruit of the Spirit.

I'll answer you just the same though.
If only you truly were diligent with your bible study you'll know that you cant even blame Pharaoh for what he did to the Israelites by making them slaves. Why?

God himself revealed to Abraham that he would make Israelites slaves in a foreign land (Egypt) for over 400 years. So apparently it was God's will.
Also was he not God that hardened his heart?
Whether he worshipped the same God or not l, was it not the same God that revealed dreams to the past Pharoah so that Joseph could be blessed by interpreting it to him?

Also the bible said that God himself hardened the heart of Pharoah so that he may be glorified.
Meaning you cant even blame Pharoah since it was Gods plan. Can any man resist God?
Even Paul was a persecutor of Chrostians until God decided to convert him by himself.

Meaning how can you blame the man when he is simply a puppet under the whims of his puppeteer, God.

2. How can you even compare Job to Adam?
Are you intentionally trying to derail this topic?
Adam was the first man. He knew nothing if the consequences of his actions and what we now call sin (disobedience to God's instructions).

Job lived many millennia after Adam and being studious already knew the consequences of sin and having learnt from history was able to stand firm.
Even though God still found fault in him for trying to justify his righteousness.

So you can't compare anyone to Adam.
Any human being would fall the same way Adam and Eve fell. Why?

1. They were the first. What we call pilot test.

2. Adam and Eve though God told Adam the consequence of disobeying him, they never understood what it meant.

3. The bible never mentioned how long before they disobeyed God meaning they were probably very righteous for millennia before they eventually fell. Cut them some slack. Ordinary one year you yourself know how many times you've sinned and disobeyed God.