NinjaMetahuman:
You are the one digressing when the point is clear enough.

Already told you, the games Liverpool lost, they could have won if Alex and Robertson were at their best. They were not at their best because VVd was not at the back to give them confidence to go forward and join the attack.
And they could have drawn some of the games self if they didn't score. Also they will be less vulnerable to counter attack like 2 seasons ago..

I think You just want to extend the argument for some reason.
Me no get strength for long argument o.

VVd might not be the best for you, but you people should stop making it look like VVd is some insignificant defender or some gbegbe defender.

Which best are you talking about? Liverpool forwards don't score! How else will I say this for you to get me? Full backs are still doing their job BUT the forwards can score!

If TAA stopped attacking, he will not have 2 goals and 6 assists AFTER VVD left the team.

The team as a whole lost form, but even at that, the full backs still contribute to attack. The forwards have majority of the blame in that slump. They just couldn't score. With VVD, Liverpool concede goals same as without him so the problem was not VVD. It's the forward players.

But if you want to pin it on the defenders, the screenshot below will tell you that's its not only VVD that missed a large part of the season. No matter how you put it, VVD's absence only is not the cause of their slump.

timbros:


Trajectory is not the issue here.

You said that after VVD injury, the full backs don't go forward again. Stats prove otherwise. They attack, and they score/assist.

I keep telling you that Liverpool attack became blunt. If you dig deep, you will probably see that those full backs create chances that the forwards fluff.

Does the full backs sit back after VVD injury? No. Stats prove otherwise.

nope stat didn't prove otherwise.

Full season with VVd
Alex had more than 20 goals contributions
Robertson also pulled good numbers.

Season without VVd they both had 7-6 respectively
Big difference.

You refused to answer, why did attackers suddenly become blunt after VVd's departure? Why did it happen right after VVd had injury?

raumdeuter:


Actually he is

If you can be conceding 7 to Aston Villa then you be gbegbe

well to you sha.


Gbegbe defender don't come close to wining balon Dior that's for sure.

raumdeuter:


When you are the last man outside the box, best option is to engage sharply, Every attacker will try to get into the box quickly so that any contact becomes a penalty

In that clip the best thing will be to engage Kane and stop or foul him when he is still outside the box backing off means Kane will enter the box get closer to the keeper. The other defenders are already behind Kane so all things being equal will not catch up or have to tackle from behind and get a red

As a defender the aim is to quickly engage and resolve the issue before he gets closer to the keeper and enter the box which makes the danger more. The more you wait, the higher the danger

I disagree with this position.

As the last man, you should slow down the attacker, even before he gets to the box. That is the best option.

Others can nick the ball of him as they catch up. There is always strength in numbers.

Every attacker will want to get into the box but none of them will run into a path where they know they will lose the ball. Getting ready and poised for such outcome will deter any attacker from going on that run.

Making the tackle is way riskier. You either give the attacker a 1v1 situation if you miss the tackle, get a red card if your touch is too heavy or if you timed it right you save the day. And that is rare with fast and tricky strikers.

As a defender your aim is not to quickly engage and clear danger. Your main aim is to protect the GK and stop goals. You will achieve that by delaying the striker. It’s not compulsory to do it all alone.

The more the wait, the better your chances because your teammates will regroup and come back to aid you.

raumdeuter:


When you are the last man outside the box, best option is to engage sharply, Every attacker will try to get into the box quickly so that any contact becomes a penalty

In that clip the best thing will be to engage Kane and stop or foul him when he is still outside the box backing off means Kane will enter the box get closer to the keeper. The other defenders are already behind Kane so all things being equal will not catch up or have to tackle from behind and get a red

As a defender the aim is to quickly engage and resolve the issue before he gets closer to the keeper and enter the box which makes the danger more. The more you wait, the higher the danger

Omo!! You will make a very terrible defender

Normal thing to do when your players are close by is to slow the attacker down. Kane cannot run at full speed because he would be conscious of VVD-- a reservation other southampton players don't have which gives them advantage to recover.

Na simple defending

BlueMann:
Expecting the first team tonight to be similar to what we've seen in preseason, cos TT said most if the players who arrived late will not start.

That rules out Silva, Emerson, Mount, Jorginho, James and Chilwell. I'm not sure about Azpilicueta and Chris, and I don't know if TT will trust Trevor Chalobah. Rudiger and Zouma will definitely start.

Alonso and CHO as wingbacks, Kova and Kante in midfield.

Ziyech, Havertz and Werner will most likely lead the line - I'd personally start Pulisic over Werner cos Villarreal will likely build a moat in the defence, and Pulisic's dribbling ability will be useful in breaking them down.

E be like say this man wan gamble this match... The small hype don dey enter that his stabilizer shape head. If he dare loose this match and make these scumies tears us shreds ,I will never forgive him walahi

raumdeuter:


Correct compilation but I think Henry was the best of them

Kane could have been if he had left Spurs 3-4yrs ago

See the defender who taught Vidic Stam and Maldini

Van Djik was acclimatizing to the PL after. coming from scotland.
The most important thing here is the moment he got used to the league, he became the best defender in England and the world as a whole.
Keep bringing up vids of 5-6 yrs ago.
At least anything to prove you're right.

Ebukacute:

E be like say this man wan gamble this match... The small hype don dey enter that his stabilizer shape head. If he dare loose this match and make these scumies tears us shreds ,I will never forgive him walahi

Omo, I never still fully forgive TT for losing against Leicester o.

If he lost tonight, I dey go mountain for em head straight up

NinjaMetahuman:
nope stat didn't prove otherwise.

Full season with VVd
Alex had more than 20 goals contributions
Robertson also pulled good numbers.

Season without VVd they both had 7-6 respectively
Big difference.

You refused to answer, why did attackers suddenly become blunt after VVd's departure? Why did it happen right after VVd had injury?

We are not arguing amount of numbers here. The numbers I pulled out is to prove to you that the full backs still attack even after VVD. You said they lost confidence and stopped going forward. If that's true, how did TAA get the goals and assists after VVD left? However meagre the numbers are is not my concern. I have used the numbers to prove to you that they still attack.

@the bolded....The slump didnt happen immediately after VVD injury. VVD got injured October when they were 3rd in the log. It didn't affect them immediately. Infact Liverpool topped the table at some point till around January... Then gradually the slump started. Remember, their injury problems continued piling up and it finally caught up with them.

kendrick93:

Van Djik was acclimatizing to the PL after. coming from scotland.
The most important thing here is the moment he got used to the league, he became the defender in England and the world as a whole.
Keep bringing up vids of 5-6 yrs ago.
At least anything to prove you're right.

What was he acclamatizing to here?

raumdeuter:


From this chart, How much could Aguero be drawing to make them top Man Utd or Chelsea

gap between Chelsea and City is 21M, So unless Aguero was drawing 22M a yr which would be 423k Pounds a week then City will still remain 3rd

Based on the chart you posted

Aguero was actually doing £11,960,000 annually, which is half of what could have seen Citeh leapfrog Chelsea on that chart. that counts as a key factor.

But then that's not the chief reason Citeh are behind us on the payroll chart. It's the 2021/22 session, and we have all of our loanees back on our payroll, that's just it.

Bakayoko is commanding £5,720,000 annually, Sarr £6,240,000, Drinkwater £5,200,000, Rahman £4,919,200, Barkley £5,000,000. Zappacosta £3,640,000. Then you have RLC, Baker, Musonda and Ampadu drawing nearly 10million pounds amongst themselves.

We currently have 33 players on our payroll active roster, compared to Citeh's 25. Once we sell some of those deadwoods up there, we go balance the book and leave City's spot for them.

TheLequte:


I disagree with this position.

As the last man, you should slow down the attacker, even before he gets to the box. That is the best option.

Others can nick the ball of him as they catch up. There is always strength in numbers.

Every attacker will want to get into the box but none of them will run into a path where they know they will lose the ball. Getting ready and poised for such outcome will deter any attacker from going on that run.

Making the tackle is way riskier. You either give the attacker a 1v1 situation if you miss the tackle, get a red card if your touch is too heavy or if you timed it right you save the day. And that is rare with fast and tricky strikers.

As a defender your aim is not to quickly engage and clear danger. Your main aim is to protect the GK and stop goals. You will achieve that by delaying the striker. It’s not compulsory to do it all alone.

The more the wait, the better your chances because your teammates will regroup and come back to aid you.

Backing away means the attacker is advancing and getting closer into dangerous areas. The attacker is gaining in confidence able pick his spot and closer to the keeper. That is why its better to foul early and up the field

The more you wait, the worse it gets for you

timbros:


Let's try not to digress.

I specifically mentioned matches Liverpool lost 1-0 to "lesser" teams. They had a large chunk of possession.

Where was TAA and Robertson positioned averagely in such matches? Do they sit back in their own half of the pitch because VVD is not around? Also, was it VVD's absence that made them lose those games 1-0 to Burnley, Brighton, Fulham, Everton (2-0)? Did you see TAA and Robertson outputs AFTER VVD got injured? Honest answers to these questions will tell you exactly what was Liverpool's problem last season.

To chip in on this-
I would say losing Van Djik meant the team was more vulnerable to counters, not just VVD but Gomez & matip also.
Van Djik leadership, one on one ability, pace were crucial to the way Liverpool set up.
The high line operated by klopp wasn't effective anymore cos teams could just play a long ball and they would get in behind Liverpool's backline, so in this instance Liverpool missed Van Djik aerial presence and his ability to hold & organise a high line.
Don't forget also that VVD is Liverpool's best long ball passer, I couldn't count the amount of times where Van Djik would spray out a long ball to Salah or TAA and suddenly Liverpool would be up one one one in a threatening position.
That variety of play was severely missed.
Did Liverpool missed Van Djik last season? absolutely yes.
Was he the sole reason why there season was poor?
No, Van Djik and the other host of injuries combined were responsible.

Griffon:


Aguero was actually doing £11,960,000 annually, which is half of what could have seen Citeh leapfrog Chelsea on that chart. that counts as a key factor.

But then that's not the chief reason Citeh are behind us on the payroll chart. It's the 2021/22 session, and we have all of our loanees back on our payroll, that's just it.

Bakayoko is commanding £5,720,000 annually, Sarr £6,240,000, Drinkwater £5,200,000, Rahman £4,919,200, Barkley £5,000,000. Zappacosta £3,640,000. Then you have RLC, Baker, Musonda and Ampadu drawing nearly 10million pounds amongst themselves.

We currently have 33 players on our payroll active roster, compared to Citeh's 25. Once we sell some of those deadwoods up there, we go balance the book and leave City's spot for them.

Adding 12M of AGuero still leaves Chelsea in second and Citeh 3rd

BlueRayDick:


U disrepect Thierry Henry with this harry Kane talks abeg!

Igwe played 8 seasons in the league and won golden boot 4 times. He won it back to back to back in 2003/2004, 2004/2005 and 2005/2006.
Until Harry Kane does this, any attempt to put him in the same sentence with Igwe will be regarded as blashpemy.

Did you even read my post at all? Oga I am not TheLequte who drew up the comparisons.

raumdeuter:


Backing away means the attacker is advancing and getting closer into dangerous areas. The attacker is gaining in confidence able pick his spot and closer to the keeper. That is why its better to foul early and up the field

The more you wait, the worse it gets for you

This can’t be more wrong.

The defender is backing and watchful. Slowly. He’s not fleeing at full speed for the love of God.

He’s slowing down the attacker so that others can catch-up and disposes him or so that he makes a mistake.

Don’t look at the situation in isolation. There are more than 2 people on the field.

Griffon:


Did you even read my post at all? Oga I am not TheLequte who drew up the comparisons.

Maybe he meant to quote me. Was a bit puzzled when I saw his take addressed to you.

But then it’s his opinion.

Griffon:


Did you even read my post at all? Oga I am not TheLequte who drew up the comparisons.

Oops! Sorry I thought I quoted Thelequte.

TheLequte:


Maybe he meant to quote me. Was a bit puzzled when I saw his take addressed to you.

But then it’s his opinion.

Yeah...I thought I quoted Ur original post actually

swiz123:


Omo!! You will make a very terrible defender

Normal thing to do when your players are close by is to slow the attacker down. Kane cannot run at full speed because he would be conscious of VVD-- a reservation other southampton players don't have which gives them advantage to recover.

Na simple defending

The best time to have stopped that attack above was when Morata was in his half, but VVD backed off Morata that was hesistant probably trying to win a cheap free kick to waste time, but the more Morata went he gained confidence and it became harder for VVD and this was what led to the goal

kendrick93:

To chip in on this-
I would say losing Van Djik meant the team was more vulnerable to counters, not just VVD but Gomez & matip also.
Van Djik leadership, one on one ability, pace were crucial to the way Liverpool set up.
The high line operated by klopp wasn't effective anymore cos teams could just play a long ball and they would get in behind Liverpool's backline, so in this instance Liverpool missed Van Djik aerial presence and his ability to hold & organise a high line.
Don't forget also that VVD is Liverpool's best long ball passer, I couldn't count the amount of times where Van Djik would spray out a long ball to Salah or TAA and suddenly Liverpool would be up one one one in a threatening position.
That variety of play was severely missed.
Did Liverpool missed Van Djik last season? absolutely yes.
Was he the sole reason why there season was poor?
No, Van Djik and the other host of injuries combined were responsible.

The bolded is the point many VVD supporters refuse to accept. VVD was not the only player out injured for long period. I don't know why people will say Liverpool slumped just because of VVD.

Few pages ago, we see a gif of VVD vs Morata, his premium leadership quality and one on one ability and how it played out.

Edith: look at the gif above sef

raumdeuter:

What was he acclamatizing to here?

Yeah,
first game since a 7-8months lay off in a pre season friendly.
Great point

raumdeuter:




The best time to have stopped that attack above was when Morata was in his half, but VVD backed off Morata that was hesistant probably trying to win a cheap free kick to waste time, but the more Morata went he gained confidence and it became harder for VVD and this was what led to the goal

Morata's last touch (heavy touch) before he passed is the perfect opportunity for VVD to nip the ball off him. But he was busy organising traffic as the warden that he is...

timbros:


The bolded is the point many VVD supporters refuse to accept. VVD was not the only player out injured for long period. I don't know why people will say Liverpool slumped just because of VVD.

Few pages ago, we see a gif of VVD vs Morata, his premium leadership quality and one on one ability and how it played out.

Edith: look at the gif above sef

A fit VVD and Liverpool challenge for the league last season.
make no mistake about that

kendrick93:
A fit VVD and Liverpool challenge for the league last season.
make no mistake about that

More like a more sharp forward line... Salah dipped form. Firmino is just being Firmino. Mane was anonymous for a large part of the season. We only started to see the lethal Mane we use to know at the tail end of the season. Jota came in firing on all cylinders then got injured.

Forget VVD. Liverpool's problem was attack.

BlueRayDick:


Yeah...I thought I quoted Ur original post actually

Okay.

But how many golden boots has Henry got? And how much does Harry Kane have?

Not saying one is greater than the other. Just comparing notes.

Harry Kane would’ve been closer to Thierry H. if he’d moved to a top club 3-4 years ago.

kendrick93:
A fit VVD and Liverpool challenge for the league last season.
make no mistake about that

A fit VVD Liverpool was chopping 7-2 and in 4th position

Without VVD Liverpool was able to rally back to 3rd

raumdeuter:


Adding 12M of AGuero still leaves Chelsea in second and Citeh 3rd

Obviously, but then again, we look healthy on paper. We just need to jettison our returning loanees to reduce our wage costs. It's that simple.

Na manure own worse pass, they're already doing £194,366,200. By the time dem add Varane to their payroll, they'll be sitting close to PSG on that chart.

Griffon:


Obviously, but then again, we look healthy on paper. We just need to jettison our returning loanees to reduce our wage costs. It's that simple.

Na manure own worse pass, they're already doing £194,366,200. By the time dem add Varane to their payroll, they'll be sitting close to PSG on that chart.

Just 2 days ago, Patickmuf and larride were analyzing wage bill not knowing say na from their nyansh mess dey smell

BlueRayDick:


Oops! Sorry I thought I quoted Thelequte.

The only time I get to quote wrongly is when I'm high on weed. Bro I understand

raumdeuter:


Just 2 days ago, Patickmuf and larride were analyzing wage bill not knowing say na from their nyansh mess dey smell

Varane is hanging around, waiting to be drafted in.