Emmy450:
the Spanish team didn't have much goals in them just possession and pressing,just as their 2010 world cup campaign

andrewbaba44:


And they still beat teams that have much goal in them

It’s very hard to even score against them at the 2010 World Cup

charlesemeka85:
I will be extremely happy if Onyedika moves to Milan. Having more players in bigger leagues and clubs will help the profile of this current super eagles going forward

Players that worth hyping not dullards struggling to make it in lower leagues over the past 6 seasons now

Imagine these midfielders in good/decent clubs in top leagues in our ranks

Ndidi- leicester (epl)
Aribo- Southampton (epl)
Alhassan- royal antwep (Belgian league)
Onyedika- ac milan (serie A if deal is completed)
Iwobi- Everton (epl)
Onyeka- brentford (epl)
Ishaq- anderlecht (Belgian league)
Bonke- lorient (ligue 1)

Zanistico78:

Is this true?

TheGoodJoe:


The better side lost. If they play that game ten times, Barcelona will win far more.

chrisooblog:
The Spanish team weren't all that invincible in 2010 jare. Remember they lost their first game. If not for some wayward finishing from Robben in the final we probably wouldn't be having this debate.

TheLoneCitizen:
Galatasaray sign world class Dries Martins and Lucas Torriera.

Turkish league the best outside top 5.

TheGoodJoe:


Despite the goals in the France team, it will mean nothing if they can not see the ball. The Spanish team were far tactically superior and would win the French team more.

TheGoodJoe:


How will they score the goals without seeing the ball?

codemaniacs:

Football is about goals not just tactics.

A possession based prime Barcelona was annihilated by a goal scoring Bayern Munich the year it was an all German UCL final.

That Barcelona will have 68% possession while the opposition will have 22% and the opposition will win by 4 goals.

Even recently goal scoring Bayern beat Barcelona by 8 goals.

codemaniacs:




Football is about goals not just tactics.

A possession based prime Barcelona was annihilated by a goal scoring Bayern Munich the year it was an all German UCL final.

That Barcelona will have 68% possession while the opposition will have 22% and the opposition will win by 4 goals.

Even recently goal scoring Bayern beat Barcelona by 8 goals.

Hanibal:

I hate this statement, and it's the favorite of possession football fans.
But there's no football rule that says the team with the better possession will be awarded the win!
So what made you better if you hug 98% of the ball and I still beat you?
Your strategy is to play to your strengths which is hugging the Ball, my strength is to stay solid at the back and hit you on the counter... You play to your strengths, and I play to mine, so who says you're better than me?

Abeg the better team is the team that wins on the day, anybody wey like make e hug the ball, na their wahala be that.

PS: defensive football also involves a lot of tactical discipline and know how abeg

TheGoodJoe:


First, you are using the wrong game to make your judgment.

By the time Bayern beat Barcelona, Bayern Munich had made loads of tactical adjustments to get to par with Barcelona. That was why they got Hynckes who used to coach Real Madrid and understood the tactical setup of Barcelona. It took months of intense study after Barcelona earlier blew Bayern Munich to pieces which led to the sacking of Jurgen Klinsmann. This also led to Bayern Munich making tactical changes to their system from the grassroots. Even after Hynckes, they still got Guardiola to continue the tactical revolution of the team.

So, trying to play down tactics is off. The Bayern team you are using has made a lot of growth with respect to tactics by that time.

That France team there were tactical novices to the modern way of playing and would be destroyed by the Spanish side.

TheGoodJoe:


Football today is all about tactics. That is why loads of teams play in a more possessive tactical fashion today. It is hard to find a top team that has not adopted to it. Why? Because, it is now king of the game.

codemaniacs:


I am using the right game and it wasn't Bayern tactical adjustments that made them to be better than Barcelona.. it was the entire German football tactical adjustments that made Bayern better because Germany went on to win the world cup.

Just like the Liverpool vs Crystal Palace match if Crystal Palace had better finishers they would have torn Liverpool apart..

In summary,
A possession based team cannot beat a counter attacking team with prolific finishers. It will be a massacre.

codemaniacs:


Top teams are not possessive. Top teams have better players so the average teams tend to give top teams more possession and use counter attacking tactics.

TheGoodJoe:


You are running in circles. You tried to play down tactics. Below is your statement.

---

Football is about goals not just tactics.

---

Then look at what you wrote on top.

---

Bayern tactical adjustments that made them to be better than Barcelona

---

Please, Guardiola had a big influence on Low and German football.

German football needed a revolution and Löw would be the man to lead it, changing the fate of the country's football forever. With a revamped, streamlined youth academy system and a pacey, dominating brand of possession football, Löw was a coach who advanced the profession.

https://www.dw.com/en/joachim-l%C3%B6w-germanys-greatest-coach-but-a-man-who-stayed-too-long/a-58102452

---

So even the Germany you are trying to praise adopted the possession game too. It was all thanks to Barcelona.

That France team did not have the tactical acumen to match Spain in any way. The Spanish side was far tactically advanced and would win the France team repeatedly.

codemaniacs:


I said "not just tactics" I didn't play down tactics..

That era had multiple special talents in their prime in one team.

That France team beat prime Brazil ( without Ronaldo) 3 - 0.

That France team will tear the Spanish team apart..

That Spanish team can't beat the Brazil that the France team beat.

TheGoodJoe:


Please, explain to me why the top teams in England today play with a possessive fashion. Manchester City, Liverpool, Chelsea, Arsenal, Tottenham Hotspur. Even struggling Mancheter United went for Ten Hag that plays in that fashion.

You will see the same in other top leagues.

No one says you must play in a possessive fashion. The fact is that the possessive sides do better in a long run.

codemaniacs:


I said "not just tactics" I didn't play down tactics..

That era had multiple special talents in their prime in one team.

That France team beat prime Brazil ( without Ronaldo) 3 - 0.

That France team will tear the Spanish team apart..

That Spanish team can't beat the Brazil that the France team beat.

TheGoodJoe:


That France team can not tear or come close. They could beat Brazil then because of tactical deficiencies of both parties. The Spanish team had advanced too far compared to 98. 98 is like Stone age tactics to the revolution that took place from 2008.

I will repeat something I posted here earlier.

Graeme Le Saux who used to be England and Chelsea's left back interviewed Toby Alderweireld. Alderweireld told Me Saux some tactical defending concepts and Le Saux exclaimed, IF I KNEW THIS EARLIER IN MY CAREER, I WOULD HAVE BEEN ONE OF THE BEST LEFT BACKS OF MY TIME".

This tells you the gulf in class between tactics of the past and today.

That is why Guardiola could drop Ronaldinho. It was no more about just how good you are with the ball. Advanced knowledge of tactical concepts is now key.

TheGoodJoe:


When you say 3-0, two goals were corner kicks. Scored by Zidane. The late goal was a counter after Brazil committed most men to try to salvage the game.

Ronaldo de Lima had a convulsion before the match and was unconscious. He was still knocked out unconscious on the field by Fabian Barthez.

A fit Ronaldo would have likely won't the game. With his team.

Hanibal:


I agree with you that the top sides now play possessive football.
But let's also agree that a team is not necessarily better than another because it plays possesive football and the other does not.

But the logic of football even at amateur level is if you have the better players chances are, you are going to have the ball more, if your team has a better number 6, a better number 8, and a better number 5 and 4 you'll naturally dominate possession all things being equal... These days with money comes better players and with better players comes ball dominance

Antonio Conte for example isn't a possession freak, yet a really good tactician...
If Tottenham plays Nottingham forest today, naturally Tottenham will dominate simple logic!

But when he wants to play Man City, he'll play to his/ his team's strength, defensive discipline!

Guardiola on the other hand will rather loose 10 nil but have the major share of possession, that's his strength... Doesn't necessarily make him better than Conte

codemaniacs:


Goal is goal whether corner kicks or free kicks e.t.c.. France beat an extra-ordinary Brazil ( without Ronaldo ) ... that's what matters..

TheGoodJoe:


If you have average players that are advanced in tactical concepts, and play it well, they will outclass a side with top players that have average understanding of the tactical game.

An excerpt from Jurgen Klopp;
Too often the team with the better individuals won the game because it was all one-versus-one challenges all over the pitch, so if the other player was better than you, how could you win?

Sacchi's organisation made it completely different.

It meant I watched 500 videos of AC Milan.

Pretty much overnight we became a successful football team. We were not easy to deal with. We defended really well and it opened my mind.

That was the basis for me when I became a manager, and still is. Organisation is the basis of football.

So, tactical understanding bridged the gap between skill and intelligence. Now it has even advanced.

So it is no more about talent but understanding of the game. Couple with talents, you advance even more.

TheGoodJoe:


I am just pointing out that it was not overwhelming display by France. It also highlights the point that there is more to the game than quality of players.

How ever, the Spanish side was too advanced tactically for the France team. So the Spaniards get the nod.

codemaniacs:


Guardiola dropped Ronaldinho because he is a racist and there was another finisher called Messi in the team.. or is Messi , Xavi , Iniesta bad with the ball..

Football is always about how good you are with the ball and what you bring to the team...

codemaniacs:


you're contradicting yourself...

the France team beat a super Brazil team 3 - 0...

The france team had very good headers of the ball that's one of the reasons they scored corners.. so If the France team scores 5 corner kicks against your Tactically advanced Spanish team you'll say " It also highlights the point that there is more to the game than quality of players. "

you're a clown

codemaniacs:


don't ever compare different eras in football ...

Infact don't ever compare football team A of 2018 to the same football team A of 2022... In football 4 years is a lot of time..

that same Spanish team got thrashed by Holland and Chile in 2014 world cup and didn't make it out of the group stage...

that's one of the reasons Super Eagles missing this years Qata:r 2022 is very bad because by 2026 most of the current players will be 4 years older and may not be as effective as they are now while some of them will be more effective... but by 2026 Super Eagles will have new players to pick from..

Hanibal:

See I play defensive and you play possessive doesn't necessarily mean you understand the game more than me!
I play football the way I understand it tactically (defensive) you play football the way you understand it (possession) now who told you my understanding is interior to yours?

codemaniacs:


don't ever compare different eras in football ...

Infact don't ever compare football team A of 2018 to the same football team A of 2022... In football 4 years is a lot of time..

that same Spanish team got thrashed by Holland and Chile in 2014 world cup and didn't make it out of the group stage...

that's one of the reasons Super Eagles missing this years Qata:r 2022 is very bad because by 2026 most of the current players will be 4 years older and may not be as effective as they are now while some of them will be more effective... but by 2026 Super Eagles will have new players to pick from..