Stats: 3,191,743 members, 7,945,324 topics. Date: Tuesday, 10 September 2024 at 02:37 PM |
Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Why I Don't Need Jesus. (5311 Views)
I Don't Need Any Religion - Wole Soyinka / 3 Reasons We Need Jesus In Our Marriages And Our Lives / Reasons You Need Jesus (2) (3) (4)
(1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (Reply) (Go Down)
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by sonmvayina(m): 3:16pm On Apr 15, 2022 |
budaatum: Lol..yea kind off, when people forget the rituals involved, the gods die. But they are there, waiting to be reconnected. |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by sonmvayina(m): 3:18pm On Apr 15, 2022 |
Ken4Christ: Why do you believe Paul's personal Revelation But not Muhammed personal Revelations? Do you see the disadvantage? 2 Likes |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Ken4Christ: 8:26pm On Apr 15, 2022 |
sonmvayina: Apostle had a clear encounter with Jesus. And God backed up his calling with signs and wonders. Mohammed on the other hand claimed he saw a vision of an angel who gave him a message. But the things he did and the life he lived does not affirm he was truly called of God. He spread his religion through violence. The God we serve does not force anyone. He did not have notable signs and miracles which follows servants of God. He married so many wives. The internet search reveals he married 16 wives and had about 4 concubines. He even married a minor. A true servant of God will not do that. Besides, his own statement betrayed his calling. In Sura 46:9, he said he wasn't sure of what will become of him or those following him. |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by sonmvayina(m): 12:58pm On Oct 27, 2022 |
This is when the real messiah comes at hand: Isaiah 1:26: "And I will restore your judges as at first and your counsellors as in the beginning; afterwards you shall be called City of Righteousness, Faithful City." Some Jews[12] interpret this to mean that theSanhedrin will be re-established." (Isaiah 1:26) Once he is King, leaders of other nations will look to him for guidance. (Isaiah 2:4) The whole world will worship the One God of Israel (Isaiah 2:11–17) He will be descended from King David(Isaiah 11:1) via Solomon (1 Chronicles 22:8–10, 2 Chronicles 7:18) The "spirit of the Lord" will be upon him, and he will have a "fear of God" (Isaiah 11:2) Evil and tyranny will not be able to stand before his leadership (Isaiah 11:4) Knowledge of God will fill the world (Isaiah 11:9) He will include and attract people from all cultures and nations (Isaiah 11:10) All Israelites will be returned to their homeland (Isaiah 11:12) Death will be swallowed up forever (Isaiah 25: ![]() There will be no more hunger or illness, and death will cease (Isaiah 25: ![]() All of the dead will rise again (Isaiah 26:19) The Jewish people will experience eternal joy and gladness (Isaiah 51:11) He will be a messenger of peace (Isaiah 52:7) Nations will recognize the wrongs they did to Israel (Isaiah 52:13–53:5) The peoples of the world will turn to the Jews for spiritual guidance (Zechariah 8:23) The ruined cities of Israel will be restored (Ezekiel 16:55) Weapons of war will be destroyed (Ezekiel 39:9) The people of Israel will have direct access to the Torah through their minds and Torah study will become the study of the wisdom of the heart (Jeremiah 31:33)[13] He will give you all the worthy desires of your heart (Psalms 37:4) He will take the barren land and make it abundant and fruitful (Isaiah 51:3, Amos 9:13–15, Ezekiel 36:29–30, Isaiah 11:6–9 |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Kobojunkie: 8:37pm On Dec 15, 2022 |
Myer:Jesus Christ's mission is to the lost sheep of Israel, Israel's children who were scattered, by God, to all the ends of the earth - to every tribe, every tongue, and every nation out there. 19 I will put a mark on some of the people. I will send some of these saved people to the nations of Tarshish, Libya, Lud (the land of archers), Tubal, Greece, and all the faraway lands. Those people have never heard my teachings. They have never seen my Glory. So the saved people will tell the nations about my glory.The lost sheep of Israel are gentiles too who have the blood of Jacob in them. And they are to be found in every nation. That is what God said make clear even right in His Law of Moses. He would scatter them, and He would, later on, gather them back when the time is right. So, yes, they are those recognized by God as the sinners of this world. ![]() So, as Jesus Christ made clear through His teachings and the fact that He called His followers to be fishers of men implying that He did not come for everyone, He is indeed sent only to the lost sheep of Israel, and the man standing right next to you right this minute could be one of them. ![]() |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Myer(m): 6:54pm On Dec 16, 2022 |
Kobojunkie: You're right. After the death of Christ, the lost sheep of Israel includes both Israelites and Gentiles. But during His ministry and the context of the verse, Jesus was only referring to the actual Israelites and not Gentiles. He only ministered to and healed Gentiles whose faith were too great, he could not resist. Which is corroborated by the observation that through out his ministry on earth, he never preached outside Israel (geographically). In fact Peter and the other disciples were following the template of Jesus and never even wanted the Gentiles to receive the Holy Spirit until God had to show Peter in a trance not to call unclean what he calls clean and Cornelius and his household received the Holyspirit. Peter's wasn't so comfortable with this, which was also why the Holyspirit selected Paul and Barnabas specially for that purpose, to be sent to the Gentiles. This is why Paul often refers to himself as the Apostle to the Gentiles (Uncircumcised) And after that other disciples followed suit including Philip. I'm trying to understand why you said I'm wrong, when you simply paraphrased what I said. 1. God's plan since Adam's fall and Abraham's Promise has always been to redeem and bless the whole world through Israel. 2. Jesus Himself said this but occasionally healed few Gentiles according to their great faith. 3. The book of Acts categorically teaches that the Holyspirit separated Paul and Barnabas to be sent to the Gentiles. 4. Paul refers to himself as Apostle to the circumcised and Peter as Apostle to the Uncircumcised. 5. God's plan has always been to Israel first then to the Gentiles. Which also Isaiah prophesied that the israelites will reject Jesus, thereby provoking God into jealousy to extent his salvation to the Gentiles to likewise provoke the Jews into jealousy. Paul prayer being that the israelites will by this provocation come into salvation. |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Kobojunkie: 7:25pm On Dec 16, 2022 |
Myer:1. I am afraid you still have it all wrong! What Jesus Christ said is that the Father sent Him to offer the agreement of peace only to those who have the blood of Jacob coursing through their veins meaning that if you ancestry if not of Israel, you cannot enter into the Kingdom of God. ![]() Jesus Christ came to do the Will of the Father who sent Him and the context of God's Will does not change for any man or people. Jesus Christ may have healed gentiles(none Israelites), but He did not extend the Kingdom of God to them throughout His time on earth because it is against the Will of God to give to the dogs that which is Holy - Matthew 7 vs 6. And this Will did not change even after Jesus Christ sent His disciples into the world.. ![]() 2. Yes, He did not preach outside of the borders of Judea but He also did not teach the Gentiles who were within those borders either because Salvation was sent by God only to the Israelites -- the dogs(none Israelite Gentiles) are not part of God's plan. ![]() 3. That's not entirely correct. What Peter, I believe, may have been doing at the time was, sticking to preaching only to the Jewish subset of Israel -- those from the tribe of Judah, Benjamin and part of the Levite Clan. And for this reason, the Spirit revealed to Him that those from all tribes, even those whose roots were long lost after so long in exile were also a part of God's plan. ![]() As for Cornelius and the members of His family who became born-again, they had to have had the blood of Jacob coursing through their veins in order for that to have taken place. Else, Jesus Christ was nothing but a liar and the Kingdom of God a sham. ![]() 4. I disagree with this since the same mandate was given by Jesus Christ to all of His followers which is to go and teach His Gospel to the world(Israel in exile). That Peter had problems grasping the stated does not mean Paul and Barnabas were specifically called or anything like that. After all we read in the same books of Acts that of Philip, one of the disciples who walked with Jesus Christ, matching directly to the Gentiles from the beginning to spread the news to those in the Gentile world. ![]() |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Myer(m): 7:59am On Dec 17, 2022 |
Kobojunkie: I gave a comprehensive reply to this last night, but it didn't drop. In summary, we're saying the same thing, you just don't get it. God's plan since the fall of Adam and Blessing of Abraham has been to redeem and bless the whole world, starting with Israel first. Acts 2:39 But before the death of Christ, he was only sent to the physical Israel. When they rejected him as prophesied by Isaiah, God sent his disciples to the Gentiles to provoke them into jealousy. Which by so doing Paul prays that his fellow Israelites would finally come to accept Christ. Pas: We are the Gentiles. But in Christ, there's no Jew or Gentile. We are all the same in Christ. |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Kobojunkie: 8:08am On Dec 17, 2022 |
Myer:1. Jesus Christ was born in Judae -- no such as physical israel. God had already cursed and scattered Israel across the Nations at that time. ![]() 2. This is false! God didn't send the disciples to the gentiles to provoke the Jews. He instead sent them into the Gentile world to begin gathering the rest of the lost sheep of Israel to Himself. That is what God said would happen in both the Law of Moses and also through the prophet Isaiah among others. ![]() As for Paul's supposed prayer, I don't know about that given God already said, from the time of Moses, that He would gather His Israel back to Himself So such a prayer is meaningless. ![]() 3. In Jesus Christ, there are only Israelites - those who have the blood of Jacob coursing through their veins. That is what Jesus Christ explained to His followers when He said that He was sent only to the Lost sheep of Israel. So, if you are of the ancestry of Jacob, you cannot be of Jesus Christ is what Jesus Christ Himself said. ! ![]() |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Myer(m): 11:04am On Dec 17, 2022 |
Kobojunkie: I understand from your interactions on NL that you only regaled the Synoptics as gospel. But I also know that until you accept the whole bible as the Word of God, you will not grasp the true intent of God. Paul's epistles were written for the Gentiles, except the book of Hebrews which was written for both the Jews and matured Gentiles. When you truly let the Holyspirt guide your study of the Bible, the Word truly becomes flesh to you. Be careful how you disparage and dishonor your Apostle Paul, because truly, he is the Apostle (Sent) to the Gentiles (us). 1 Like |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Kobojunkie: 11:17am On Dec 17, 2022 |
Myer:1. I have no clue what you mean by that at all. I process everything written in scripture weighing it all against the very Word out of God's mouth to determine Truth from lies. ![]() 2. So, what you are saying is that since Jesus Christ said He is sent by God, the Father, only to the lost sheep of Israel meaning the Kingdom of God is only open to the lost sheep of israel, Paul has another Kingdom, of his own, which he offers to the non-isrealites then? ![]() 3. According to Jesus Christ, the Holyspirit who happens to be the very same Spirit of Truth that lives on the inside of Him is subject to Him, Jesus Christ- John 14 vs 15 - 27 & John 15 vs 26 - 27 & John 16 vs 4 - 15 . As a result, the Spirit of Truth will never contradict or contravention Jesus Christ as He will only teach that taught by Jesus Christ and give revelation which pertains to Jesus Christ and the Kingdom of God to those in whom He dwells in. So, when you say the Holyspirit will guide my study, are you somehow insinuating He will reveal me that which violates the Truth of God as declared by Jesus Christ Himself? ![]() 4. I don't worship any man regardless of his rank or title. I am a follower of Jesus Christ and my work is to believe in the one who the Father sent, and that is Jesus Christ. Any idea that contradicts His Truth is simply not of Him. ![]() |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Myer(m): 1:29pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Kobojunkie: I have only 1 question at this juncture; Do you agree that Paul is an Apostle of Christ selected by the Holyspirit? Acts 13:2 |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Kobojunkie: 4:38pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Myer:Jesus Christ said of His followers to His followers that by their fruits you shall know them. I never met the man Paul personally so how could I know if He was of Christ or not given the impossibility of the situation here --- I can't examine the fruits of a dead man. ![]() Look, God is my compass and all things are meant to be sifted through His Word, not through the words of any man or men. I don't worship nor witness on behalf of any other. ![]() |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Myer(m): 4:59pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Kobojunkie: I can't believe you just said this. Did you meet Jesus Christ? Did you meet Peter? Did youbmeet John? Did you meet Moses? Did you meet David? Did you meet Abraham? Did you meet Isaiah? Did you meet Jeremiah? Did you meet Ezekiel? Why do you believe the accounts of the Bible in the synoptic gospels but have issues with the accounts of the Bible concerning Paul? I don't know why we are having this discourse. But trust be, it's an important one One that ushers both of us into a deeper understanding of the Mind of Christ. |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Kobojunkie: 5:05pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Myer:1. I see that you don't pay attention much. I am neither a follower of any of the men who you conveniently listed up there. I am not a witness for any of them. ![]() 2. I believe you and I have already been through this and many others like it here before. So why do you think asking me the same set will change my response? Kindly reach back through the archives to revisit my responses rather than continue derailing the thread, please. ![]() The focus here should remain on Jesus Christ and His message. ![]() |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Myer(m): 5:13pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Kobojunkie: 1. You don't believe in Jesus Christ anymore? Cos he's on the list and you've never met him yet but you believe what the Bible says about him. 2. Here's what Peter had to say about our apostle (to the gentiles). 2Peter 3:15-16 Bear in mind that our Lord's patience means salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him.16He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction. So once again I ask this cogent question; Do you believe Paul is an Apostle of Christ and selected by the Holy Spirit? |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Kobojunkie: 5:22pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Myer:1. I didn't see that first mention. ![]() 2. For the umpteenth time, I am not a witness for any man. I am called by Jesus Christ to witness only Jesus Christ. ![]() And as Jesus Christ made clear, He was sent by the Father only to the lost sheep of Israel. The implication of this is that even from among the Gentiles, only those of them whose ancestry traces back to Israel — the blood of Jacob is in their veins — can partake of God's mercy to mankind in Jesus Christ. This is to say that the Kingdom of God belongs only to those who are the lost sheep of Israel. ![]() |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Myer(m): 5:32pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Kobojunkie: Meaning you dont accept the word of God exvept where he suits you. But 2 Tim 3:16-17 ahas the nswer for you. |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Kobojunkie: 5:35pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Myer:Jesus Christ, according to Scripture, is the Word of God. I wholly accept Him as God's Truth aka Word - John 14 vs 6 ![]() And as Jesus Christ made clear, He was sent by the Father only to the lost sheep of Israel. The implication of this is that even from among the Gentiles, only those of them whose ancestry traces back to Israel — the blood of Jacob is in their veins — can partake of God's mercy to mankind in Jesus Christ. This is to say that the Kingdom of God belongs only to those who are the lost sheep of Israel.
|
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by nocera(m): 7:36pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Kobojunkie: I have read your comments, replies and postulations and interjections in different posts and even on mine – and it's very much without doubt that two things remain consistent with you; you're very confused, and secondly, you possess an amazingly high degree of "adult ignorance". I therefore submit that anyone who takes the risk of considering your tirades, and wild scriptural arguments serious is headed to a more confused state than yourself. 2 Likes |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Kobojunkie: 7:38pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
nocera:Again, Jesus Christ, according to Scripture, is the Word of God. I wholly accept Him as God's Truth aka Word - John 14 vs 6 ![]() And as Jesus Christ made clear, He was sent by the Father only to the lost sheep of Israel. The implication of this is that even from among the Gentiles, only those of them whose ancestry traces back to Israel — the blood of Jacob is in their veins — can partake of God's mercy to mankind in Jesus Christ. This is to say that the Kingdom of God belongs only to those who are the lost sheep of Israel. |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Myer(m): 9:13pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Kobojunkie: But you just disqualified yourself from your interpretation of "the lost sheep" You obviously do not have the blood of Jacob running in your veins, or do you? |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Myer(m): 9:24pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Kobojunkie: You believe in Jesus Chist based on what was written about him. You never saw Jesus Christ. So why don't you believe in the others? Since they were selected by the same God that sent Jesus. 1 Like |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Kobojunkie: 9:28pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Myer:How do you know that I do not have the blood of Jacob coursing through my veins? ![]() |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Kobojunkie: 9:29pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Myer:I already more than answered this question of yours. ![]() Anyways, as Jesus Christ made clear, He was sent by the Father only to the lost sheep of Israel. The implication of this is that even from among the Gentiles, only those of them whose ancestry traces back to Israel — the blood of Jacob is in their veins — can partake of God's mercy to mankind in Jesus Christ. This is to say that the Kingdom of God belongs only to those who are the lost sheep of Israel. ![]() |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Myer(m): 10:08pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Kobojunkie: More importantly, how do you portend that you have the blood of Jacob running through your veins? Have you confirmed through DNA test or carbon dating? |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Kobojunkie: 10:15pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Myer:Have you not been paying attention at all? As Jesus Christ made clear, He was sent by the Father only to the lost sheep of Israel. The implication of this is that even from among the Gentiles, only those of them whose ancestry traces back to Israel — the blood of Jacob is in their veins — can partake of God's mercy to mankind in Jesus Christ. This is to say that the Kingdom of God belongs only to those who are the lost sheep of Israel. ![]() |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Myer(m): 10:17pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Kobojunkie: So what does the story of Cornelius mean to you? Or Philip's conversion of the Eyhiopian Eunuch? |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Kobojunkie: 11:51pm On Dec 17, 2022 |
Myer:Since the story claims the Holy Spirit led both apostles to those others, it could only mean one thing, and that is that both Cornelius and the Ethiopian Eunuch were of the lost sheep of Israel. Below excerpt from a post on another thread should more than help you since you seem to think this is about me or something. Cornelius was an Israelite:The Spirit of Truth is a guide and helper to direct each follower of Jesus Christ to others who are of the same flock. So the Spirit of Truth would never lead a follower of Jesus Christ to fellowship in the manner those men did with anyone who isn't of the lost sheep of Israel, to begin with. He can send a follower to heal a Gentile or cast out demons but not to fellowship as Peter and Phillip were recorded to have, in my opinion. ![]() |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Myer(m): 6:03am On Dec 19, 2022 |
Kobojunkie: All I'll say is this- don't be full. Be open and keep learning of God. God is multifaceted and his ways are higher than we could ever fathom. I'm not someone who should be talking about God anymore cos I was angry with him for some time. But when more understanding came, I realised he's God afterall and I'm just flesh. Read the book of Job whenever you can, it's very humbling. |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by Kobojunkie: 6:34am On Dec 19, 2022 |
Myer:1. What do you mean when you say God is multifaceted? Is this another one of those 6-blind-men-and-an-elephant situations where we conclude that people perceive and worship different aspects of the same God and somehow God is OK with all of that? ![]() 2. Angry with God? I laugh! I used to think like that until I realized how foolish I was in my assumptions of these things. Why should you be angry with God when you have never ever done that which He asked you to do from even your beginning? What makes you think He owes you anything? ![]() 3. Oh, I read the book of Job— several times too— until I realized my foolishness. Job was at least a man who did as God commanded of Him — God deemed Him righteous after all. I, on the other hand, had nothing but my self-righteousness— my ideas of goodness drowned in a thick batter of sin a result of self-prescribed ideas of holiness, a worthless lump— to present in my case before God. The best thing I ever did was to submit to Him in the end in order to learn His Truth from all the lies I had learned from men. ![]() |
Re: Why I Don't Need Jesus. by MaxInDHouse(m): 7:00am On Dec 19, 2022 |
Don't bother about JESUS as long as you believe in CHRIST that will be sent to make the earth a better place i'm OK with your submission! ![]() |
(1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (Reply)
How To Attract Money With Sugar, Rice, And Salt. / Jesus, son of man? Read This. / Millions Are Leaving Islam Every Year
(Go Up)
Sections: politics (1) business autos (1) jobs (1) career education (1) romance computers phones travel sports fashion health religion celebs tv-movies music-radio literature webmasters programming techmarket Links: (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) (9) (10) Nairaland - Copyright © 2005 - 2024 Oluwaseun Osewa. All rights reserved. See How To Advertise. 137 |