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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Politics / Foreign Affairs / People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu (18123 Views)
Netanyahu Vows ISRAEL Will 'STAND ALONE' If It Has To After Biden's Threats. / Israel Will Pay 'A Heavy Price' After Gaza Attacks - Iran Warns / Israel Will Not Join America In War Against Iran - Benjamin Netanyahu (2) (3) (4)
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Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 12:46am On Dec 24, 2023 |
Baatunde: Ewu!. You've shifted the goal post to the modern day Jews ?. ![]() The Y chromosome of most Ashkenazi(Europeans Jews) and Sephardi(African Jews) Jews contains mutations that are common among Middle Eastern peoples, but uncommon in the general European population, according to a study of haplotypes of the Y chromosome by geneticists namely; Michael Hammer, Harry Ostrer and others, published in 2000. According to Hammer et al. this suggests that the paternal lineages of Ashkenazi Jews could be traced mostly to the Middle East. In Ashkenazi (and Sephardi) Jews, the most common paternal lineages generally are E1b1b, J2, and J1, with others found at lesser rates. meaning they are paternally related to Palestinian Jews. Nb: The Jews are the real Palestinians. Arabs are just tenants of Ottoman. Palestine is a Hebrew word, a secular name given to the Jews by the Romans some 500 years before the birth of Muhammed Source: wikipedia secondly, the Palestinian Jews accept Jews in diaspora as brothers and you are not the one to decide who the Palestinian Jews accept as citizens. They've never segregated amongst themselves one more, Israel has never fought an offensive war in modern history, you can make your research, they are always fighting to defend themselves from attacks from the Arabs. So it's the Arabs who are the wicked souls as they never stop war even amongst themselves and it took USA for peace to exist in Mecca; Yemen would have wiped them out. And also Kuwait, UAE, and other peaceful Arab countries buy the Jews never fought themselves God doesn't do partial. Whoever doesn't accept christ for remission of sin will die in Hell including the Jews Jesus didn't write any book it was is disciples that wrote books. So if you are looking for what Jesus wrote you'd never find it. It's ahistorical. The disciples accepted Paul, the early church fathers accepted him, Christians generally accept him. Early muslims scholars and historians like Ibn Kathir and Ibn Ishaq, Ibn Hisham, Al-Tabari etc all confirmed that Paul was sent by Allah forget about the bible can you tell me any historical writing or any historical figure that make claim that the Jews are not the owner of Palestine?!. If you would argue, argue with fact stop crying like a cry baby
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Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 2:47am On Dec 24, 2023 |
Baatunde: You are a camel urine drinker ser!. Daniel 9:25-27 [25]Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. [26]And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. [27]And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate. Can you tell me which messiah was around in 457BC?!. Or Mordecai was the Messiah?!. Was the Messiah cut-off. Tell me how the prophecy of the Messiah was fulfilled in 457 and the Israelites were still subjected to Artaxerxe command?!. Secondly, Mark 13:30 [30]Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done. the word translated as generation in the verse as broader meaning. "γενεᾶς (genea)" is the word used there and it could also mean "race" or "nation. what Jesus said in the verse is that the race of Israel will not perish till he comes back
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Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 3:02am On Dec 24, 2023 |
Baatunde: You are a camel urine drinker ser!. God didn't bless Jacob because he fraudulently took Esua's blessings. God has blessed Jacob from the time his mother conceived him. Genesis 25:23-26 [23]And the LORD said unto her, Two nations are in thy womb, and two manner of people shall be separated from thy bowels; and the one people shall be stronger than the other people; and the elder shall serve the younger. [24]And when her days to be delivered were fulfilled, behold, there were twins in her womb. [25]And the first came out red, all over like an hairy garment; and they called his name Esau. [26]And after that came his brother out, and his hand took hold on Esau's heel; and his name was called Jacob: and Isaac was threescore years old when she bare them. the birthright fraud was just the humanly way of confirming God's blessings not the cause of God's covenant go and study the term "anthropomorphism" and how Judaism used it in their religion" before we can start the discussion of how God rested, regretted or is pained. Don't be an ignorant. I won't spoon-feed you |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by gaskiyamagana: 9:03am On Dec 24, 2023 |
OLAADEGBU:With your Western support why have not finished the elimination? |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 12:56pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
Baatunde:Stop drinking camel urine ser. You said the prophecy of Daniel was fulfilled in 457BC yet you made mention that Jesus said it shall be fulfilled in his generation. Did Jesus live in 457 BC?!. Provide evidence that Jesus lived at the time of Artaxerxe in 457 BC. You are just too dulll. Jesus that lived as a human in the antiquity period( around 4BC-33AD precisely). Mumu boy you have to pick one, did the prophecy get fulfilled before Jesus was born(457BC) or during the generation of Jesus?!. I see you know nothing. Na to do copy and paste full your head. I blame myself for engaging you sef. Ibn mutah |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 1:01pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
gaskiyamagana:there's something they call international humanitarian laws(laws of war) that allows Israel to transfer the war to generations instead of eliminating the Arabs once and for all |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by gaskiyamagana: 3:51pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
smokinloud:Just as anger of Allah will endure with present and transfer to the yet to be born generation of murderous Israel. |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 4:30pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
gaskiyamagana:No, Allah said it in his revelation that he gave the land to the Jews till the judgement day and the Arabs are the rebels according to Allah. Surah:17:104; M١٠٤ وَقُلْنَا مِنْ بَعْدِهِ لِبَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ اسْكُنُوا الْأَرْضَ فَإِذَا جَاءَ وَعْدُ الْآخِرَةِ جِئْنَا بِكُمْ لَفِيفًا104 After him, We said to the Children of Israel, “Inhabit the land, and when the promise of the Hereafter arrives, We will bring you all together.”
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Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by Eneye4me: 8:03pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
orohbirodeysmel:U need to the taken to psychiatric for mental care because U a mad. Slave. |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by Eneye4me: 8:05pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
tunwumi:Ur family will make up the number. |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by Baatunde(m): 8:49pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
I swear to God you are either very dumb or you are playing stupid but I sincerely think you are very dumb. Honestly I do not like insulting people on social media and I have condemned others for it but your case is beyond redemption. You gave two prophecies one from the Book of Mark and another from the book of Daniel and my responses were very clear to each, but it appears your brain find it too much to process. Go back and read my responses, I told you that what you were quoting from the book of Mark was supposed to have happened in the generation of Jesus " As for the Prophecy of Daniel you have quoted how does that transl;ate to a future event. Most Bible commentaries have placed this event in the past. In 457 B.C., in the seventh year of his reign, King Artaxerxes issued a decree giving Ezra permission to return to Jerusalem to complete the efforts to rebuild the city (Ezra 7:6-10; Ezra 9:9)" This was my separate responses to the two prophecies you have quoted but you dull brain was not able to distinguish the two as separate and you just decided to bunch them together. I am really and sincerely sorry for you, please comment on social media if only you have the mental capacity to make sensible observations. Waaoh of all the dumb people I have being ion contact with on this Nairaland , your dumbness is top notch smokinloud: |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by tunwumi: 9:25pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
Eneye4me: After going through some of your hatred filled series of comments I I understand that you are Yaba left patient. I won't dignify a psychiatric patient with an answer. |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by Baatunde(m): 9:33pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
Dont get me started on who wrote the Bible because the earliest book of the New Testament was not written until at least six decades after Jesus supposedly died and since you like Wikipedia so much go and read about it from here. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dating_the_Bible#:~:text=Internal%20evidence%20within%20the%20texts,Thessalonians%2C%20written%20around%2050%20CE. Also, who told you that the Matthew for instance wrote the Book of Mathew, what is your evidence for that because if Matthew wrote the book , would he have written 9 As Jesus went on from there, he saw a man named Matthew sitting at the tax collector’s booth. “Follow me,” he told him, and Matthew got up and followed him. 10 While Jesus was having dinner at Matthew’s house, many tax collectors and sinners came and ate with him and his disciples. 11 When the Pharisees saw this, they asked his disciples, “Why does your teacher eat with tax collectors and sinners?” (Matthew 9:9-10) Why would the writer of a book supposedly dictated by God write in a third person unless the book was written by others. And what about the contradiction in the genealogy of Jesus between Matthew and Luke which you people have never been able to reconcile for millennia. You said the Palestinian Jews accepted their fellow Jews in Diaspora and so whats anybody'd hassles with that? You see the problem is that pre-1948 the Jews living in Palestine were a minority who had no authority to grant land to anyone excpet what they legally possessed, but the British forcefully carved out Israel from the land of the Palestinian Christain and Muslims and forced and massacred their way to take control of the lands, go and read about the Nakba and how the state of Israel was established and you wont be asking me question about when has Israel conducted war of aggression. As for Paul the impostor, you said everyone accepted him, oh that's probably why he constantly fought with Peter whom Jesus supposedly said would be the rock upon which his mission would stand and also Barnabas who were both APPOINTED by Jesus himself according to your story book called Bible. All of Paul's narration of his so called meeting with Jesus was filled with contradictions and lies At Acts 9:3-8, Paul was blinded by a light and fell down, then heard Jesus, who told Paul that he would be told what to do when he was in the city. His men did not see the light, but heard the voice. They remained standing. At Acts 22:6-11, Paul told the people he was blinded by a light and fell down, then heard Jesus, who again told Paul that he would be told what to do when he was in Damascus. This time, his men saw the light but, unlike Paul, were not blinded, and did not hear the voice. At Acts 26.13-19, Paul told Agrippa that he saw a brilliant light and heard Jesus, who gave him his mission, but did not command him to go to Damascus. He fell down, but there is no mention of blindness, nor is there any mention of the men seeing or hearing anything, although for some reason they also fell down. He told those at Damascus and Jerusalem about his conversion experience. Which of the three account is correct. Anyways Paul has made it the poitn of his theology to contradict and oppose Jesus's supposed sayings at every turn and that was why he was eventually beheaded as the false Prophet he was, as fulfilment of Deuteronomy 18: 20 "But the prophet who presumes to speak a word in my name that I have not commanded him to speak, or who speaks in the name of other gods, that same prophet shall die.’ Can you quote me the books and page number of those Muslim scholars who said Paul was sent by Allah...... laughable ![]() AS for the proof you have asked for about the ownership of Palestine, I have quoted several times in may threads that the land presently called Palestine was not virgin or empty when your racist God decided to seize it violently and give it to the Israelite, there were the Canaanites, Girgashite, Amorites already living and flourishing on the land. In modern day , you don't claim ownership of land based on the historical promise of one God in books written by obscure people. The Jews have not lived and control the land for over a millenium until the state of Israel was established in 1948. If that was to be the case, then you should tell the White Evangelical Christian nation of USA to evacuate and leave everywhere to the Native Indians who originally owned the land before the Pilgrim Fathers killed and plundered their way towards establishing their nation. You see , simple we do not believe that God is the one talking in your Bible, so we cannot accept that as evidence of giving other people's land to his "beloved" Which kind of "God" gives this instruction - The people of Samaria must bear the consequences of their guilt because they rebelled against their God . They will be killed by an invading army, their little ones dashed to death against the ground, their pregnant women ripped open by swords." Hosea 13:16 (New Living Translation) Is this the God whose word you are using as evidence? No way smokinloud: |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by Baatunde(m): 9:35pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
The best your God can do is to authorize "fraud" to confirm his blessing. I wonder which kind of God you people have in your Bible, he appears to be clueless and no wonder he need to drink his own son's blood because he could forgive Adam smokinloud: |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by Baatunde(m): 9:37pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
See this mumu , he wants to be EQUAL with GOD.... I swear you lots have absolutely no idea of what God is smokinloud: |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by Baatunde(m): 9:40pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
So this is your understanding of what you quoted there.... I can't blame you lots, your own Bible alone you are reading you still cannot comprehend....... smokinloud: |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by orohbirodeysmel: 9:59pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
Eneye4me: Werey...I want fight for what I believe in, and you dey call me slave... you're a bush meat 1 Like |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 10:26pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
Baatunde:You are a goa.t mehhhh. Do you think you're having this discourse with a twa.t?!. 17.104 Abbas - Tanwîr al-Miqbâs min Tafsîr Ibn ‘Abbâs (And We said unto the Children of Israel after him) after his destruction: (Dwell in the land) the land of Jordan and Palestine; (but when the promise of the Hereafter) when resurrection after death; and it is also said that this means: when Jesus son of Mary descends (cometh to pass we shall bring you as a crowd gathered out of various nations.) That's tafsir Ibn Abbas I challenge you to bring any tafsir that say otherwise. You can't even play taqiyya on me because I have the knowledge of Islam than your imam
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Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 10:29pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
Baatunde:We are made EQUAL with God by the virtue of christ's blood. We have the very spirit of God inside of us |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 10:39pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
Baatunde:Ibn mutah God did not authorize fraud. He did it as a human who is fallible and he paid for it. He served his uncle for 14 years while is brother Esau was fvcking rich without serving anybody Adam sin and it's God that will decide the standard for forgiving him. If I owe you money na you go decide wetin I go do to make you forgive me of my debt and God's standard is blood. Because blood carries life. Leviticus 17:11 [11]For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul. God only value souls. He doesn't value anything else on earth because the soul comes from inside of him. From his breathe afterall, Islam preaches that Christians and Jews souls will be made ransom for the soul of Muslims on judgement day |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 10:54pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
Baatunde: You are just a foooooollll, an ignorant one at that. Jesus made reference to the prophecy in Mark 13 that you made reference to[/b] we were talking about Al-aqsa mosque being the abomination in the book of Daniel that Jesus talked about. You nor go school?! Abi the spirit of illiteracy of your prophet has possessed you ni?!. Mark 13:14 [14]But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains: and the prophecy of Daniel that Jesus was refering to is this: Daniel 9:25-27 [25]Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. [26]And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. [27] And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.. 2 Thessalonians 2:3-4 [3]Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; [4]Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. IF JESUS, THAT LIVED IN THE ANTIQUITY, IS MAKING REFERENCE TO THIS PROPHECY AS FUTURE OCCURRENCE WHAT THEN IS YOUR CLAIM?!. NB: The prophecy is not fully fulfilled yet and Christians are paying heed to the fulfilment. |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 11:02pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
Baatunde: You don't even know Islam. Islam teaches that allah created Adam in his own height and that you'll all see allah in Jannah and you'll be made the same height(EQUAL) with almighty allah😁😁😂🤣😀 having the same height with Adam is what oyinbo call being identical in height with allah😁😂 |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 11:32pm On Dec 24, 2023 |
Baatunde:if you studied literature you'd have known that there's no crime in writing in third person point of view or having scribes to write for you, moreover the disciples were still very much around when Matthew and other gospels were written and nobody objected its veracity. they've deceived you a lot. The Jews lived not just as minority but as dhimmi (second class city) "aboki" under the Arabs. The Arabs on the land of Palestine were tenants of the Ottoman. The Ottoman were Turkish Islamists. The land was bought from the land owners by the Zionists. Make research and stop crying like a cry babe I would have replied you on Paul but you didn't quote biblical verse and I can't be disputing what you didn't support with biblical Quotations. Quote out the verses and let me teach you the bible the funny thing is that allah claimed he was the God that chased the people out of the land for the Jews in the Quran. Surah 5:20-26 Picktall translation: And (remember) when Moses said unto his people: O my people! Remember Allah's favour unto you, how He placed among you prophets, and He made you kings, and gave you that (which) He gave not to any (other) of (His) creatures. O my people! Go into the holy land which Allah hath ordained for you. Turn not in flight, for surely ye turn back as losers: They said: O Moses! Lo! a giant people (dwell) therein and lo! we go not in till they go forth from thence. When they go forth from thence, then we will enter (not till then). Then out spake two of those who feared (their Lord, men) unto whom Allah had been gracious: Enter in upon them by the gate, for if ye enter by it, lo! ye will be victorious. So put your trust (in Allah) if ye are indeed believers. They said: O Moses! We will never enter (the land) while they are in it. So go thou and thy Lord and fight! We will sit here. He said: My Lord! I have control of none but myself and my brother, so distinguish between us and the wrong-doing folk. (Their Lord) said: For this the land will surely be forbidden them for forty years that they will wander in the earth, bewildered. So grieve not over the wrongdoing folk. The Jews lived on their land and the Arabs Palestinians lived there too but the land was controlled by the Ottoman until Britain defeat them. None of the Jews or Arab Palestinians control the land prior to 1948 |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 2:27am On Dec 25, 2023 |
Baatunde: Al-Qurtubi in his tafsir of surah 61:14 said Paul was amongst the disciples of Jesus Christ sent by allah He was quoting Ibn Ishaq; the earliest islamic work
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Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by hammed71(m): 5:36am On Dec 25, 2023 |
Religious people are some of the dumbest people I have ever seen displaying affection for the foreign gods their slave masters came to force on them in order to colonize them believing in the history books of some certain people. Africans still have a long way to go. |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 11:04am On Dec 25, 2023 |
hammed71:Christianity was founded by Jews and accepted by Africans when Europeans was still killing Christians. As a matter of fact, Egypt and Ethopia accepted Christianity before Europe |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by Baatunde(m): 5:43pm On Dec 26, 2023 |
Laughable, you are indeed an Islamic scholar, Your arrogance posture already says a lot about you. However you and your fellow orientalists have not just started today fabricating words and attributing them to notable companions, the same thing you did with you Bible, written by anonymous people but attributed to disciples. Your answer is here below, if you know anything about chain of narration then you would know that you have failed with your citation. To confirm that your indeed know Islam more than the Imams, why dont you give me the tafsir of the same ayah from Ibn Kathee [b]There is no doubt that this commentary is not the work of Ibn ‘Abbas. The chain of transmitters of this commentary goes back to Muhammad Ibn Marwan <– Al-Kalbi <– Abu Salih which is described by Hadith experts as the chain of lies (silsilat al-kadhib), for this line of transmission is utterly dubious and unreliable. .Abu Salih was described as a liar by his own student Isma’il ibn Abi Khalid, the reason being that Salih actually confessed this fact to him (Abu Ja’far al-’Uqayli, ad-Du’afa’ al-Kabir vol. 1 p. 165). Al-Kalbi, was one of the most notorious liars of Kufa. His biography in al-Mizzi’s Tahdhib al-Kamal is filled with statements of the scholars of his time who denounced him as an extremely unreliable reporter, and even a blatant liar. (See al-Mizzi, Tahdhib al-Kamal vol. 25 pp. 246-253). There exists a very interesting statement in the biography by his kinsman who records Abu Salih as saying that he never narrated any Tafsir to Kalbi. The second is an admission of guilt by Abu Salih. Sufyan ath-Thawri narrates that al-Kalbi said, “Whatever Tafsir I narrated from Abu Salih is untrue. Do not narrate it from me.” Muhammad ibn Marwan (AKA as-Suddi as-Saghir) was a notorious forger whose lies were noted by both his contemporaries and the scholars after him. (Tahdhib al-Kamal vol. 26 pp. 392-394). Another piece of evidence against tanwir Al-Miqbas’s attribution to Ibn Abbas is the fact that it mentions people by name who lived after Ibn Abbas, sometimes hundreds of years later and that it can suddenly say that “Ibn Abbas said such-and-such” even though this is meant to be a hadith tafsir:[/b] And also o noble scholar! do you even know what Taqiyyah means? becasue it appears youy like to flaunt words about to project erudition whereas you an ignoramus [/b] smokinloud: |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by Baatunde(m): 6:34pm On Dec 26, 2023 |
I am confused here please help me out, you mentioned Qurtubi but you have quoted Ibn Ishaq, in any case Qurtubi merely mentioned that PAul was a companion of Peter and that did not make him an appointed Apostle excpet self-appointed anyways through lie and deceit as I have shown from the story of his supposed conversion. Anyways, I am well aware of your reference it is from Sam Shanoun and I want to lift something from the tafsir that Sam was trying to quote and you will tell me what your take is on that Noted Muslim commentator Ibn Kathir’s statements are most interesting. Commenting on S. 3:55, he writes: "This is what happened. When Allah raised ‘Isa to heaven, his followers divided into sects and groups. Some of them believed in what Allah sent ‘Isa as, a servant of Allah, His Messenger, and the son of His female-servant. However, some of them went to the extreme over ‘Isa, believing that he was the son of Allah. Some of them said that ‘Isa was Allah Himself, while others said that he was one of a Trinity. Allah mentioned these false creeds in the Qur’an and refuted them. The Christians remained like this until the third century CE, when a Greek king called, Constantine, became a Christian for the purpose of destroying Christianity. Constantine was either a philosopher, or he was just plain ignorant. Constantine changed the religion of ‘Isa by adding to it and deleting from it. He established the rituals of Christianity and the so-called Great Trust which is in fact the Great Treachery. He also allowed them to eat the meat of swine, changed the direction of the prayer that ‘Isa established to the east, built churches for ‘Isa, and added ten days to the fast as compensation for a sin that he committed, as claimed. So the religion of ‘Isa became the religion of Constantine, who built more than twelve thousand churches, temples and monasteries for the Christians as well as the city that bears his name, Constantinople (Istanbul). THROUGHOUT THIS TIME, the Christians had the upper hand and dominated the Jews. ALLAH AIDED THEM AGAINST THE JEWS BECAUSE THEY USED TO BE CLOSER TO THE TRUTH THAN THE JEWS, even though both groups were and still are disbelievers, may Allah’s curse descend on them." (Tafsir Ibn Kathir (Abridged), Volume 2, Parts 3, 4, & 5 (Surat Al-Baqarah, Verse 253, to Surat An-Nisa, Verse 147), abridged by a group of scholars under the supervision of Shaykh Safiur-Rahman Al-Mubarakpuri [Darussalam Publishers & Distributors Riyadh, Houston, New York, Lahore; First Edition: March 2000], p. 171; bold and capital emphasis ours; cf. online edition)[/b] IF you want I can send you the whole works of Sam Shanoun on this and instead of lifting pieces from it, you can read the whole lot and convince yourself if has made any valid point. The confused guy was just jumping from tafsir to tafsir trying to pick what suits him smokinloud: [b]Al-Qurtubi in his tafsir of surah 61:14 said Paul was amongst the disciples of Jesus Christ sent by allah He was quoting Ibn Ishaq; the earliest islamic work |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by Baatunde(m): 7:14pm On Dec 26, 2023 |
Go a bit back before the Ottomans sir, the Byzantine were also in charge of Palestine for many centuries an d the Jews were still a minority in this period. True the Zionist bought some land but over 70% of what constitutes the present state of Israel were forcibly seized from the remaining Palestinians ( Christians and Muslims) during the Nakba from about 1949. Even when the UN have settled the matter of East Jerusalem and West Bank, did Israel comply? Modern day ownership of land is not determined by an historical promise in a ' book of God' Resolution 298: September 25, 1971, confirmed in “the clearest possible terms” that all actions taken by Israel to change the status of Jerusalem, such as land confiscation, were illegal. Resolution 465: March 1, 1980, demanded Israel to stop the planning and construction of settlements in territories occupied since 1967, including Jerusalem. It also called on Israel to “dismantle the existing settlements”. Are you aware of the Western Wall Decree of 1931 confirming the ownership of the Wailing Wall of the Temple to the Muslims after successfully proving their case with the International Court of Justice (ICJ)? This is how things are done in modern times as we are no longer in the era of might is right https://ecf.org.il/issues/issue/1412 As for Paul, below is what I have presented from your Bible about the contradictions in the narration of his conversion At Acts 9:3-8, Paul was blinded by a light and fell down, then heard Jesus, who told Paul that he would be told what to do when he was in the city. His men did not see the light, but heard the voice. They remained standing. At Acts 22:6-11, Paul told the people he was blinded by a light and fell down, then heard Jesus, who again told Paul that he would be told what to do when he was in Damascus. This time, his men saw the light but, unlike Paul, were not blinded, and did not hear the voice to go to Damascus. He fell down, but there is no mention of blindness, nor is there any mention of the men seeing or hearing anything, although for some reason they also fell down. He told those at Damascus and Jerusalem about his conversion experience.So can you reconcile it for me thanks? And If Jesus really sent Paul why did he dedicate all his energy to continue thwarting Jesus's messages, for instance Jesus said he has not come to destroy the law but to fufill it, Paul says you are no longer under the law. Paul was bold enough to ask that you leave the elementary doctrines of Jesus and apply common sense ( even though others think Paul might not be the author, leaving us again the issue of the anonymity of writers) Therefore let us move beyond the elementary teachings about Christ and be taken forward to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from acts that lead to death, and of faith in God, Hebrews 6:1 smokinloud: |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 10:37pm On Dec 26, 2023 |
Baatunde: Arab Palestinians never controlled the region at any time. That's my point, most of them were just tenants. where did you get your figure of 70% from?. Israel even forgo portions their land to Arab Palestinians. Tho some Arab that wage war against Israel in 1948 were not allowed access to their land after the war which is a normal consequence of war Israel is a secular state and they never claim the land based on biblical history, they claimed the land based on historical facts and archeological artefacts. well, let me break your heart, the 1931 commission or any commission prior to the Arab-Israeli war is lost to the war, at the commission the Jews didn't claim ownership but just the right to worship there freely but the Arab Palestinians rejected every offer and declared war.That's what they call the consequence of war. If Arab Palestinians had agreed to their portion of the land partition by UN and not resort to war they would probably have had legal control of the Western wall but no they thought they could destroy Israel in war and gain control of the entire land. There are consequences to war!. on Paul, you never quoted any text of the bible so I can school you... There's no contradiction in Paul's account. It's just ignorance of words that you have. Quote the words and let me school you what does Jesus mean by fulfilling the law?!. Matthew 5:17 [17]Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to FULFIL. Jeremiah 31:31 [31]Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: He came to fulfil the promises of new covenant in the law. Hebrews 6:1 [1]Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, Paul calls for maturity in the verses ni. There's maturity in Christ, when you move from declaring Jesus as your lord to manifesting him. Leave the foundation and get to work |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 10:53pm On Dec 26, 2023 |
Baatunde:[b]I didn't quote any text from Sam Shamoun. I downloaded alqurtubi and use google translate for it. Al-Qurtubi was making exegesis of surah 61:14 which endorse the disciples of christ and in his exegesis he quoted Ibn Ishaq to support his claims that Jesus, via Allah, sent Paul. M يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا كُونُوا أَنْصَارَ اللَّهِ كَمَا قَالَ عِيسَى ابْنُ مَرْيَمَ لِلْحَوَارِيِّينَ مَنْ أَنْصَارِي إِلَى اللَّهِ ۖ قَالَ الْحَوَارِيُّونَ نَحْنُ أَنْصَارُ اللَّهِ ۖ فَآمَنَتْ طَائِفَةٌ مِنْ بَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ وَكَفَرَتْ طَائِفَةٌ ۖ فَأَيَّدْنَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا عَلَىٰ عَدُوِّهِمْ فَأَصْبَحُوا ظَاهِرِينَ14 O ye who believe! Be Allah's helpers, even as Jesus son of Mary said unto the DISCIPLES: Who are my helpers for Allah? They said: We are Allah's helpers. And a party of the Children of Israel believed, while a party disbelieved. Then We strengthened those who believed against their foe, and they became the uppermost. It's tafsir Al-Qurtubi and not just any work of a muslim. A renowned scholar of Islam. He was making exgesis of the verse of Qur'an and supporting his claim that Paul was a true disciple of christ. All you quoted was surah3:55 and I'm not making reference to that. My reference is surah 61:14 |
Re: People Thinking Israel Will Stop Gaza War Are Detached From Reality - Netanyahu by smokinloud(m): 10:56pm On Dec 26, 2023 |
Baatunde:I'm using Al-Qurtubi not Sam Shamoun. |
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