vooks:
What happened to this Hagin? Was he trying to correct his errors like Derek Prince and his submission to authority heresy?
I can't believe this is Hagin's work

There's a signature on NL i love so much. Its on Markmiwerds profile. It says

"An honestly mistaken man, when presented with the truth, Has two choices...Stop being mistaken or cease being honest."

I think the above quote happened to Hagin. He was a honest man who was wrong and decided to correct the wrongs when he discovered them thankfully before he passed on. A lot of the 'prosperity gospel' crooners of today have their consciences seared with hot irons and dead. They know the truth but will never admit it so they don't lose the gains of fraud and crookedness.

How do you explain the fact that for 3 years of attending WOF churches, I never heard of 'Midas touch'? I still buy books from LFC bookshop in my city(bought unmerited favour by Joseph Prince and a book on selling by Brian Tracy there some weeks ago) but I've never set eyes on 'Midas touch' there even once despite the number of Hagin books on display?

Could it be that they don't want any alternative view? Methinks this is the case.

Candour:


There's a signature on NL i love so much. Its on Markmiwerds profile. It says

"An honestly mistaken man, when presented with the truth, Has two choices...Stop being mistaken or cease being honest."

I think the above quote happened to Hagin. He was a honest man who was wrong and decided to correct the wrongs when he discovered them thankfully before he passed on. A lot of the 'prosperity gospel' crooners of today have their consciences seared with hot irons and dead. They know the truth but will never admit it so they don't lose the gains of fraud and crookedness.

How do you explain the fact that for 3 years of attending WOF churches, I never heard of 'Midas touch'? I still buy books from LFC bookshop in my city(bought unmerited favour by Joseph Prince and a book on selling by Brian Tracy there some weeks ago) but I've never set eyes on 'Midas touch' there even once despite the number of Hagin books on display?

Could it be that they don't want any alternative view? Methinks this is the case.

The problem is that you will not find this book on the list of his books he has written.

look here and than I know why.

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_E._Hagin

christemmbassey:
@Oga Candour, a blessed Sunday to u sir! Hope family is ok.

Blessed sunday to you too my bro. The family is very OK. Trust yours are too?

Cheers

nora544:


The problem is that you will not find this book on the list of his books he has written.

look here and than I know why.

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_E._Hagin

Chineke me!!! Nora directed me to wiki in German abi na dutch Wahala ya zo!!!!

Thanks anyway. I saw the list (with their English titles) but couldn't find 'Midas touch' there. Maybe that's why.

Thanks

nora544:


He is one of the fathers of the WOF movement,

He is the founder of the prayer and healing centers, he make money with this centers and his church belong to his children

that shows that it is only a business to sell the gospel.

Hagin started the whole WoF "name it...claim it, financial prosperity etc" teaching backed up with his outlandish claims or statements and with books such as "How To Write Your Own Ticket with God".

Hagin could see that the "chicken was soon about coming home to roost" and soon will get blown up in his face, meaning the WoF movement he started years ago, was turning into nothing less than a pack of werewolves, and fingers will be pointed at him as the architect

The wolves, apart from already marauding the church, and gone viral, have now become infected with rabies, and soon will start biting people

So Hagin figured, three things needed to be done about these werewolves:
1) Euthanise or put down the "aberrant WoF wolves in sheep’s clothing fleecing the sheep"
2) Give the church a vaccine to use for the "aberrant WoF ravening wolves in sheep’s clothing" fatal bite to protect against infection
(i.e. Hagin gave the public a book; titled Midas Touch, written in 1999, published in 2000)
3) Give the rabid "aberrant WoF wolves in sheep’s clothing" a cure.
(i.e. Hagin gave the 1999 Tulsa meeting and topic titled: Excesses and error present within the “prosperity” message being taught by the major Word of Faith ministries)

Hagin went for #2 and #3, and the following are some of the prominent and well known WoFists or WoF teachers that attended the 1999 Tulsa meeting called by Hagin:

Kenneth Copeland (i.e. the heir to Hagin’s WoF movement empire)
Creflo Dollar (i.e. Kenneth Copeland's protégé)
Jerry Savelle (i.e. Kenneth Copeland's protégé)
Jesse Duplantis
Leroy Thompson (Absent)
Mac Hammond
Steve Parson
Charles Capps etc

Although Leroy Thompson of the "Money Cometh To Me, Now" pulpit stunt fame starring Creflo Dollar alongside was invited to the meeting, he, [size=24pt]Leroy Thompson declined and refused to show up[/size].

According to Steve Parson, Mac Hammond reported a "comedy of errors" story to the group in the Tulsa meeting attendance, that he, Mac, had previously called Leroy Thompson to find out, why he, Leroy Thompson, was refusing to attend the Tulsa meeting organised by Hagin “God told me not to come,” was Leroy Thompson's reply.
“That’s funny,” Mac Hammond said he answered back, and adding “God told me to call you and tell you to come. So one of us is missing it.”

You see, Hagin was trying to control the frankenstein of a WoF movement he created before it escapes control and destroys him, Hagin, its creator and architect "sugbon epa o boro but it was too little, too late, too late as the horse had bolted

The below is a paraphrased snippet of Hagin's explanation to the meeting attendees:

“I called you all together to this special meeting because I need to address some error and excess in within the Word of Faith "camp" regarding the prosperity message. I have written a book entitled, The Midas Touch: A Balanced Approach to Biblical Prosperity, and it will be coming out very soon.

In order to avoid strife and confusion among our ranks, however, I wanted to convene this meeting and address these issues with you
- the major Word of Faith ministries teaching this doctrine - in person first.

That way, you all can adjust your messages accordingly before the book comes out, and there will be no contention among us.”

The blue and red above, was Hagin, trying to close the barn door shut, after the undesirable WoF movement horse has bolted

Kenneth Copeland's response before the group in the Hagin Tulsa meeting was:
“If I am in error in any way, please feel free to correct me.”

No sooner had Hagin died, Kenneth Copeland is already right back at his vomit, as Hagin's body has hardly been lowered in the grave before Kenneth Copeland, Creflo Dollar (i.e. Kenneth Copeland's protégé) and others started re-enjoyment and enthusiastically doing something they are best at doing - hustle and scam

After watching the below video, determine for yourself whether any correction or not, was taken on board by Kenneth Copeland
h t t p://youtu.be/4ArA_2y2zVk

Benny Hinn another famous WoFist who once renounced the Word of Faith teachings years ago in an interview, but no sooner he declared abandoning fake healings or WoF "name it... claim it teaching, financial or prosperity gospel etc " teachings, he changed his mind and reverted to his WoF scamming old ways (i.e. the appeal of the strong liquid lucre was too strong for him to resist, he had to return to the vomit)

Hagin's efforts were not enough help to save the WoF situation (i.e. efforts to clean up the "name it...claim it" financial prosperity scams, fake healings etc menace) and his clarion call, done too late, it was Dead On Arrival - DOA, besides, it was also a ploy appearing to tackling the issue but actually the motive was a last ditch effort to make money out of the situation (i.e. damage control/limitation by killing two birds with one stone, appear addressing the issue and making money too, out of it)

The WoF movement is a moneymaking machine, a platform and haven for snake oil salesmen running rackets of selling filth merchandise via television and books. It is a hotbed of frausters, hustlers, pulpit pimps, charlatans etc

WoF scamming (e.g. "name it...claim it" financial prosperity teachings, healing school scams etc) is still a danger to the public at large

Hagin, chiefly and along with his collaborators (e.g. TBN, Oral Roberts, Benson Idahosa etcetera) is responsible for bringing the cult of Word-Faith into mainstream Christianity, while most Christian leaders stood by and let it happen.

This is why we are plagued by WoFists like Benny Hinn, Kenneth Copeland, Rodney Howard-Browne, Creflo Dollar and thousands of others locally today influenced by the doctrine.

Candour:


Chineke me!!! Nora directed me to wiki in German Wahala ya zo!!!!

Thanks anyway. I saw the list (with their English titles) but couldn't find 'Midas touch' there. Maybe that's why.

Thanks

soory that was to fast but that is my mother toungue.

I have also a book about healing it is written in german from a doctor who look at healings what we call miracel healings and it shows that sometimes the body can heal himself and that it has nothing to do if you are a christian or not. I got it from the University library here in vienna because it is out of print.

vooks:
Here is Keneth Hagin's Midas Touch book, not sure of copyrights or not
http://www.ekklesia.lt/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/Kenneth-E-Hagin-The-Midas-Touch.pdf

this is the link, the size is about 4.58mb

please take out time to go through this link

http://kennethcopelandblog.com/2008/11/11/rev-hagins-previous-rebuke-of-copeland/

Candour:


Hear Hagin on the mathematics of starting 'sowing' with $1

"At the time of this writing, the man with the most financial wealth in the world is considered to be Bill Gates of Microsoft; his net worth is estimated to be as much as $85 billion. So a person for whom the hundredfold return worked as described above would have 1,176 times more money than Bill Gates!

If the hundredfold return worked literally and mathematically for everyone who gave money in an offering, we would have Christians walking around with not billions or trillions of dollars, but quadrillions of dollars!"

At least Hagin; their hero said this not me. Those who use Bill Gates, Warren Buffet and others to point out the lie of this 'gospel' are accused of being carnal. I hope they'll be able to describe Hagin in similar terms.

Those that will be wise will be wise.

What you do not realize is that some of Hagins protege would have thought that "Baba" was thinking carnally. That maybe old age had depleted Baba a bit of the Spirit. That's why the book was unpopular.

My take on the text by nanny is that if Hagin condemned firstfruit, why are his people practising it?

WinsomeX:


What you do not realize is that some of Hagins protege would have thought that "Baba" was thinking carnally. That maybe old age had depleted Baba a bit of the Spirit. That's why the book was unpopular.

At least they should be bold enough to say it here abi are they fearing "touch not my anointed"?

My take on the text by nanny is that if Hagin condemned firstfruit, why are his people practising it?

The bible didn't teach it as a christian doctrine which is what he pointed out. As to why his followers and worshippers still preach it, I'll say its due to #thief-thief things

nannymcphee:
please take out time to go through this link

http://kennethcopelandblog.com/2008/11/11/rev-hagins-previous-rebuke-of-copeland/

Than read this that nobody know how rich he is and he still is preaching the heresy gospel what a fake leader.

Pointing with fingers to an other scam pastor he is not better.

Thank you BabaG for that submission on WoF. It answers my question: they returned to their vomit after Hagins death.

Assuming BabaG is correct about the quotes in the meeting, a lot of other things still do not add up.

I think that meeting was in the 2000 before Hagin passed in 2003. In 1998, Jim Baker had written his book on why he was wrong with the Prosperity message. Was this what Hagin saw that led him to write the book?

Another thing is that I am convinced that Hagin was not entirely honest about writing that book. Like BBG wrote, it seem he was trying to kill two birds with one stone. He wanted to correct his followers and at the same time make money from book sales. Whatever he wrote in that book could have been conveyed to his proteges in a private and honest, one on one, meeting that will conclude with repentance and prayers. The meeting looked like farewell to his followers and something like "take it easy".

If he was sincere he would have discovered a lot more errors and shut shop. A lot of ministers have written books pointing out their errors to them. All he needed to do was say he was wrong, they were right.

It is this incomplete repentance that never produced lasting fruit in his followers.

Today, WoF is a monster. A raving one. Thanks to Hagin himself.

I hope Image123 is following the discussion.

think that meeting was in the 2000 before Hagin passed in 2003. In 1998, Jim Baker had written his book on why he was wrong with the Prosperity message. Was this what Hagin saw that led him to write the book?

Disgraced televangelist Jim Bakker now selling ENEMA KITS and apocalyptic survivalist gear to his followers to help make up money he owes to the IRS

Televangelist Jim Bakker, known best for losing his multi-million dollar empire amid a sex and embezzlement scandal, is building his new brand around the end of the world.

The disgraced pastor is now selling pricey cordless generators and survivalist food packs on his website in an effort to help earn money to pay off his debts to the IRS.

The most unusual item on the docket are the collection of enema kits for sale, perhaps in a nod to his late wife Tammy Faye who died after a long battle with colon cancer in 2007.

Bakker made headlines in the 1980s when he and his wife Tammy Faye took the airwaves by storm with their Christian evangelical broadcast and development of the Praise The Lord Television Network.

After amassing millions of viewers and becoming household names, their fortunes turned when Jim was accused of raping then-21-year-old secretary Jessica Hahn. He denied the charges, saying that their sex was consensual, and they settled out of court.

However, an indictment for fraud and conspiracy was what landed him in jail for six years.

Those charges accused him of keeping millions from the donation money his company accrued, and later sought after by the IRS for $6million in tax liens dating back to the 1980s.

Tammy Faye divorced Bakker while he was in jail, and a few years after his 1994 release, he married his new wife Lori.

Together, the new Mrs and Mr Bakker have begun their own television program and ensuing product line.

Among his books is Prosperity And The Coming Apocalypse, in which he touts his belief in the undetermined return of Jesus, and urges his followers to be prepared.

In that vein, he and his wife are selling a number of apocalypse-themed products aimed at helping their fans prepare, while undoubtedly helping earn back some of the money he still owes the government.

Emergency room and board kits- that cost $500 or $1,000 a pop- are for sale, along with foldable fuel-less generators for $1,700 and packages of long-lasting food supplies.

The Jerry Jones Special is an unusual $2,000 grouping of 37 buckets of corn, green beans, tomato flakes and raspberries that are said to provide enough ingredients for 480 meals.

He even has an entire section dedicated to health products, including a variety of vitamins, protein shakes and exercise equipment.

The strangest by far is the so-called 'Silver Solution' enema kits, selling for $100.

'He appears to have no shame. He's milking his worshippers for "end of the world" products and enemas too, which is bizarre,' a source told The National Enquirer.

so now this fake pastor try to make money with the fear of the people so that is not better than what he make before.

WinsomeX:
Assuming BabaG is correct about the quotes in the meeting, a lot of other things still do not add up.

I think that meeting was in the 2000 before Hagin passed in 2003. In 1998, Jim Baker had written his book on why he was wrong with the Prosperity message. Was this what Hagin saw that led him to write the book?

Another thing is that I am convinced that Hagin was not entirely honest about writing that book. Like BBG wrote, it seem he was trying to kill two birds with one stone. He wanted to correct his followers and at the same time make money from book sales. Whatever he wrote in that book could have been conveyed to his proteges in a private and honest, one on one, meeting that will conclude with repentance and prayers. The meeting looked like farewell to his followers and something like "take it easy".

If he was sincere he would have discovered a lot more errors and shut shop. A lot of ministers have written books pointing out their errors to them. All he needed to do was say he was wrong, they were right.

It is this incomplete repentance that never produced lasting fruit in his followers.

Today, WoF is a monster. A raving one. Thanks to Hagin himself.

I hope Image123 is following the discussion.

The Tulsa meeting was in 1999 and a topic titled: Excesses and error present within the “prosperity” message being taught by the major Word of Faith ministries was delivered to the attendees

The book, "Midas Touch: A Balanced Approach to Biblical Prosperity", was written in 1999, expected to be published the following year (i.e. in 2000) so in 1999, he called the meeting with a "Excesses and error present within the “prosperity” message being taught by the major Word of Faith ministries" topic/theme , which according to him or his quote below, was to give them advance warning:

“I called you all together to this special meeting because I need to address some error and excess in within the Word of Faith "camp" regarding the prosperity message.

I have written a book entitled, "The Midas Touch: A Balanced Approach to Biblical Prosperity", and it will be coming out very soon.

In order to avoid strife and confusion among our ranks, however, I wanted to convene this meeting and address these issues with you
- the major Word of Faith ministries teaching this doctrine - in person first.

That way, you all can adjust your messages accordingly before the book comes out, and there will be no contention among us.”

The saying "There is honor among thieves" rings true in this instance, notice the "...In order to avoid strife and confusion among our ranks...". It primarily was about them, their ranks, their investments, their interests etc

Yes, you're right, he doesn't miss a trick, he wrote the book after Jim Bakker, to save face, and seized the chance to leave an inheritance (i.e. via royalties)

Yes, he admitted a few bad mistakes in the book but he glossed over a great deal more, hence the insincerity claim.

It was a sham to start with, not even an incomplete repentance that never produced lasting fruit in his followers

The link I provided contains what BabaGnoni pasted in the post before this, it also contains a critique of other false teachings by Hagin that he didn't correct

That being said, we should focus on the correction on the prosperity message, maybe there are other corrections(I don't know)
I earlier stated it that everyone seems to be getting it wrong in one area or the other

interpretation of scriptures also has to do with your level in Christ, Paul said when he was a child, he spake like a child & when he became man, he put away childish things

Imagine what ones interpretation of the scriptures will be as a child, it is my opinion that though we have same Holy Spirit but our interpretation of scriptures will never be the same because we are different level of walk with God

God told Moses that his fathers(abraham, isaac etc) knew him as elshaddai, but by my name Jehovah was I not know to them, I can say that a new aspect/dimension of God was being introduced to Moses

yes everything has been made plain to us in Christ but not all will take out time to search it out, some are graced in the area of teaching & exhortation. Etc


I wasn't there when hagin wrote his book, neither was I in the meeting & I cannot arrived at the conclusion that it was done with an sellfish motive.


We should learn from this correction by him while we seek correction on his other teachings from other minister

Paul said we know in parts(inspite of the fact that we have the Holy Spirit)

nannymcphee:
please take out time to go through this link
http://kennethcopelandblog.com/2008/11/11/rev-hagins-previous-rebuke-of-copeland/

This website has got information!!!

kai...

WinsomeX:


This website has got information!!!

kai...

The book and the site no doubt reveals some of the gimmicks, fakeries, absurdities, scams, etcetera used in the WoF industry
but the way the guy is persistently waving "Baba's" book into view (i.e. subtle suggestive advertising) and the pimping, makes it look like they are all birds of the same feather
Since "Baba" has passed on, it's no surprise some will be snapping on the heels of the Kenneth Copeland, out of wanting a piece of the WoF empire cake "Baba" left behind which Kenneth Copeland seemingly inherited.

Candour:


No. Elijah wanted to die because he thought he was the only person with truth in Isreal. He ran from Jezebel because he didn't want to die then, after considering everything, he decided death was better than being alone in a fully 'pagan' Isreal.

Try spend more time studying bible instead of thinking and dreaming money

Candor ehhhhhhhh, you can fit argue blindly sha. To be mild on you, it is like Mr A says that If you wants to enter Nigeria, you go through Murtala Mohammed Airport. Mr B comes along and says Ta, you pass through Cotonou border side to enter Nigeria. In a way, we are both correct. Elijah wanted to die because of Jezebel's actions. It cumulatively led to his depression and discouragement. Talking of Bible study, here it is.
1Ki 19:2 Then Jezebel sent a messenger unto Elijah, saying, So let the gods do to me, and more also, if I make not thy life as the life of one of them by tomorrow about this time.
1Ki 19:3 And when he saw that, he arose, and went for his life, and came to Beer-sheba, which belongeth to Judah, and left his servant there.
1Ki 19:4 But he himself went a day's journey into the wilderness, and came and sat down under a juniper tree: and he requested for himself that he might die; and said, It is enough; now, O LORD, take away my life; for I am not better than my fathers.

Elijah saw the threat and ran, then went A DAY's journey and requested to die. This is as plain and straight forward as comprehension gets. But no wahala if you go for a far fetched answer. It's not damning, and its even correct in a sense, okay?
It was AFTER this wish to die that angel gave him food twice, then he went and journeyed FORTY DAYS and nights to Horeb. That is over a month, compared to the earlier one day journey after seeing Queen J's threat. It is here God was asking him for what he's doing there. And so forth.
1Ki 19:10 And he said, I have been very jealous for the LORD God of hosts: for the children of Israel have forsaken thy covenant, thrown down thine altars, and slain thy prophets with the sword; and I, even I only, am left; and they seek my life, to take it away.


Apparently he was trying to save his life here(some others were seeking his life). He wasn't trying to die, he was strengthened earlier. Anyway, i'll leave it for you whatever you think, have the last word. You deserve it. Know sha, it is only you that knows whether you typed that post n.aked or not, after the order of Saul

Of course it will be irrelevant to you just as 'Midas touch' escaped your radar despite your proffessed 'love' for Hagin until nannymcphee 'mercifully' brought it to your view.

It is irrelevant because it is irrelevant, deal with it if you please. i don't recall my professed 'love' for Hagin, tell me about it. You find it easier to lie these days and make false and baseless accusations. Is that the freedom and true gospel your fellows are always calling us to? i don't think i've read ANY Hagin book (i've heard him though). i didn't even read the portion nanny posted, i glanced through. i've heard of the book before and since nanny said earlier that she would give a ebook link or so, i asked her here. Hagin is not irrelevant to me, your burdens are irrelevant to me, NOTE the difference.

Also, why do you always think you're the only one i write to when i post? Have you forgotten this is a public forum? Pls close your eyes to this post I beg you. Its surely 'irrelevant' to you. Others who need it will read it.

Cheers

When you quote or mention a person in a post, it is taken for granted that that post is PRIMARILY addressed to, or requires the attention of the mentioned. You can type your frustrations without mentioning my name, yes you can. At least you didn't mention me here. Learn from Jesus, you are too full of your self.

shdemidemi:


Notice how you have pushed a request for an introspective check of where your allegiance lie back to what I believe or not believe. I admit to whatever speculations and assumptions you throw at me, after all, the worse form of information comes from assumptions.

Can we now get back to my earlier post. Please address it appropriately.

demisquare, an introspective check is supposed to take how many minutes exactly? Is an introspective check supposed to be necessarily broadcast on a 'public forum'? i read you well the first time, and i also asked you questions which i needed to see the answers. Your answers were incongruent with your well known positions on this forum. You DO NOT believe the bible, if you did you would not say that the Bible is not written to you. You do not know or believe Jesus to be same today as He was yesterday. If you did, you would know that Jesus can still do today what He did yesterday. These are not assumptions or speculations, these are facts visible to anybody who goes through your posts on NL.
Okay, you want me to answer your post AGAIN, i'll oblige you again. It's your lucky day.

I am sure you don't know how much of an enemy you are to the faith, I also doubt if you care or have any concern for the gospel Of Christ. Your post are rarely post that glorify God but messages that glorify the body. Where exactly does your fidelity lie, in God or in your fallen structure?
Even if you lie and front like you have love for God, you shouldn't be lying to yourself. I am too sure you are in this for what you think you can gain and you do a very fervent job at twisting scriptures to validate your lustful agenda.
Please my friend, look introspectively and make an honest evaluation of why you are a 'Christian'- is it for God or for self!

-How am i an enemy to the faith, please explain lucidly and biblically, thanks.
-What is the gospel of Christ, please be brief.
-What does it mean to glorify the body. Please give me two or three examples of posts that glorify the body and another two that glorify God, i'm learning everyday. Thanks.
-My fidelity lies with and in God, not in my fallen structure, whatever that means.
-Don't be too sure of yourself. Mention one scripture i have twisted on this thread to validate my lustful agenda. Then give the untwisted meaning of that scripture, thanks.
- My introspective and honest evaluation results are out oh. i am a christian for God.

nora544:


He is one of the fathers of the WOF movement,

He is the founder of the prayer and healing centers, he make money with this centers and his church belong to his children

that shows that it is only a business to sell the gospel.

But you told me earlier this year that John Lake is the founder of healing centers. What kind of thing is this? Are you deliberately trying to confuse me?

Remember this, and then this one.

I got caught up in this thread again, and I must say, you guys are well cunning. In ths said book, I've read it and you all decided to twist it, some even acting a script as if they were in the meeting, assuming it held.

Now, why did you lot skip the other wonderful topics like
1.was Jesus poor (I loved the way the man explained it all)

2. The purpose of prosperity (another classic)

3. Should preachers prosper? (Another wonderful display of wisdom of God)

4. 24 principles from the Epistles regarding money, givin and receiving (A must read) . Weird enough, folks here didn't see it.

Then the Almighty chapter 6. Hagin was simply saying avoiding abuses and false practice, and he was so right. Never was he against giving or seed sowing. I thank you all for this book, gonna recommend it to alot of people. Hagin was indeed a blessing to the body.

Let me pm gombs, a thread on this book won't be a bad idea. He knows how to make it juicy!

I don't see why you guys are twisting what he said. Read the book and be wiser in regards giving. How on earth did you guys make some of your conclusions here makes me marvel. It's a 196 paged book, 2 hours is too much to finish it.

LambanoPeace:
I got caught up in this thread again, and I must say, you guys are well cunning. In ths said book, I've read it and you all decided to twist it, some even acting a script as if they were in the meeting, assuming it held.

Now, why did you lot skip the other wonderful topics like
1.was Jesus poor (I loved the way the man explained it all)

2. The purpose of prosperity (another classic)

3. Should preachers prosper? (Another wonderful display of wisdom of God)

4. 24 principles from the Epistles regarding money, givin and receiving (A must read) . Weird enough, folks here didn't see it.

Then the Almighty chapter 6. Hagin was simply saying avoiding abuses and false practice, and he was so right. Never was he against giving or seed sowing. I thank you all for this book, gonna recommend it to alot of people. Hagin was indeed a blessing to the body.

Let me pm gombs, a thread on this book won't be a bad idea. He knows how to make it juicy!

I don't see why you guys are twisting what he said. Read the book and be wiser in regards giving. How on earth did you guys make some of your conclusions here makes me marvel. It's a 196 paged book, 2 hours is too much to finish it.

Got the book, expect a thread tomorrow. Thanks for the shout out.

I hope the world learns from these great topics. Keep shining.

WinsomeX:


I hope Image123 is following the discussion.

What exactly am i supposed to follow in the discussion? i don't do unfounded claims and gossips, neither do i dwell on discussing people especially if they are not around. i stand on the fact that YOU and the OP are wrongfully opinionated to stand at the edge of the cliff and oppose God prospering His children. Follow that.

Image123:

Candor ehhhhhhhh, you can fit argue blindly sha. To be mild on you, it is like Mr A says that If you wants to enter Nigeria, you go through Murtala Mohammed Airport. Mr B comes along and says Ta, you pass through Cotonou border side to enter Nigeria. In a way, we are both correct. Elijah wanted to die because of Jezebel's actions. It cumulatively led to his depression and discouragement. Talking of Bible study, here it is.
1Ki 19:2 Then Jezebel sent a messenger unto Elijah, saying, So let the gods do to me, and more also, if I make not thy life as the life of one of them by tomorrow about this time.
1Ki 19:3 And when he saw that, he arose, and went for his life, and came to Beer-sheba, which belongeth to Judah, and left his servant there.
1Ki 19:4 But he himself went a day's journey into the wilderness, and came and sat down under a juniper tree: and he requested for himself that he might die; and said, It is enough; now, O LORD, take away my life; for I am not better than my fathers.

Elijah saw the threat and ran, then went A DAY's journey and requested to die. This is as plain and straight forward as comprehension gets. But no wahala if you go for a far fetched answer. It's not damning, and its even correct in a sense, okay?
It was AFTER this wish to die that angel gave him food twice, then he went and journeyed FORTY DAYS and nights to Horeb. That is over a month, compared to the earlier one day journey after seeing Queen J's threat. It is here God was asking him for what he's doing there. And so forth.
1Ki 19:10 And he said, I have been very jealous for the LORD God of hosts: for the children of Israel have forsaken thy covenant, thrown down thine altars, and slain thy prophets with the sword; and I, even I only, am left; and they seek my life, to take it away.


Apparently he was trying to save his life here(some others were seeking his life). He wasn't trying to die, he was strengthened earlier. Anyway, i'll leave it for you whatever you think, have the last word. You deserve it. Know sha, it is only you that knows whether you typed that post n.aked or not, after the order of Saul

as usual, you leave the entire discussion and start chasing shadows. if you believe the bolded, why the need for the long epistle? abi you're getting high BP? If you agree we are seeing it from different angles, then so be it. That isn't even material to the issue being discussed here.

Also with the persistent reference to an unclad Saul, i hope all is well with you?

It is irrelevant because it is irrelevant, deal with it if you please. i don't recall my professed 'love' for Hagin, tell me about it. You find it easier to lie these days and make false and baseless accusations. Is that the freedom and true gospel your fellows are always calling us to? i don't think i've read ANY Hagin book (i've heard him though). i didn't even read the portion nanny posted, i glanced through. i've heard of the book before and since nanny said earlier that she would give a ebook link or so, i asked her here. Hagin is not irrelevant to me, your burdens are irrelevant to me, NOTE the difference.

then let it stay irrelevant to you. Why this immaturity to always run back to your vomit? You claim a post is irrelevant but your itchy fingers will always betray you into replying. You didnt read the portion Nanny posted yet you hypocritically asked for the link? If it pleases you, you can deny Hagin now because ''Midas Touch'' has just showed you up for the liar that you are.

Na you get burdens my dear, plenty burdens that have made you very unstable.

When you quote or mention a person in a post, it is taken for granted that that post is PRIMARILY addressed to, or requires the attention of the mentioned. You can type your frustrations without mentioning my name, yes you can. At least you didn't mention me here. Learn from Jesus, you are too full of your self.

When i say you're confused and unstable, you go begin vex. who first quoted each other on this glorious thread? try and internalise this: you and i aren't having a private conversation. I've been telling you since forever that i post here for the benefit of the larger public. You quoted my post and i replied with the NL community in mind like i always do. If you find my post irrelevant, simply ignore it. Thats what i do. Thats what mature people do. You dont have to reply every mention. I don't. If that diminishes you, it isnt my fault.

Image123:


demisquare, an introspective check is supposed to take how many minutes exactly? Is an introspective check supposed to be necessarily broadcast on a 'public forum'? i read you well the first time, and i also asked you questions which i needed to see the answers. Your answers were incongruent with your well known positions on this forum. You DO NOT believe the bible, if you did you would not say that the Bible is not written to you. You do not know or believe Jesus to be same today as He was yesterday. If you did, you would know that Jesus can still do today what He did yesterday. These are not assumptions or speculations, these are facts visible to anybody who goes through your posts on NL.

Gosh! You have a knack of tiptoeing around issues without saying anything substantial.

Image123:

Okay, you want me to answer your post AGAIN, i'll oblige you again. It's your lucky day.

Okay sir.

Image123:

-How am i an enemy to the faith, please explain lucidly and biblically, thanks.

I called you an enemy of the faith because of your obvious love for self which influence almost all of your interpretation of scripture. Jesus said if you do not hate self, you are not fit to be my disciple. It is obvious you need to check yourself and who you put first- GOD OR SELF.

Image123:

-What is the gospel of Christ, please be brief..

The gospel is the story about the death, burial and resurrection of Christ. It is the news that pave a way to the jews and the gentile in the present administration of grace. It is the gateway for eternal life that must be heralded primarily to unbelievers.

NB- belief in the gospel is the key to the door of salvation but doctrine is needed for spiritual growth of believers.

Image123:

-What does it mean to glorify the body. Please give me two or three examples of posts that glorify the body and another two that glorify God, i'm learning everyday. Thanks..

Any doctrine that does not point man to God but to self and what self can do to get health, wealth, lucre et al is a 'body glorifying message'. We glorify God when all we say and teach point people to God's goodness regardless of experiential or physical proof.

Sorry, I won't pâste any post...

Image123:

-My fidelity lies with and in God, not in my fallen structure, whatever that means.

The fallen structure is the present sinful and decaying body of man.

If you think your loyalty lies with God, I humbly exhort you to check again because it does not reflect in your posts.

Image123:

-Don't be too sure of yourself. Mention one scripture i have twisted on this thread to validate my lustful agenda. Then give the untwisted meaning of that scripture, thanks.
- My introspective and honest evaluation results are out oh. i am a christian for God.

Like I said, your posts reek of one who got the entire fundamentals of the Christian Faith wrong. Like you, even apostle Peter asked Jesus what was in there for them as they followed christ, guess what Jesus told Peter...

Image123:

What exactly am i supposed to follow in the discussion? i don't do unfounded claims and gossips, neither do i dwell on discussing people especially if they are not around. i stand on the fact that YOU and the OP are wrongfully opinionated to stand at the edge of the cliff and oppose God prospering His children. Follow that.

Still not disappointing... don't worry your own moment of truth will reach you; same as it came to most of us and to nannymcphee.

Unfounded claims and gossips... lol. They will remain so as long as you don't have the courage to open those links and study the evidenced provided there.

Which of the people did you say are not around... the WoF brood of vipers that litter the Lag/Ibad expressway , the ones on TBN or the ones whose billboard are all over our streets and television? Oh, if you mean Hagin, ah... I get you. We don't need him. We have enough of him around to answer queries on his behalf, if they can.

Fortunately a lot more people are talking here than me and the OP. Just shine your eyes and you may see the light.

I got this quote from the link nannymcphee provided here. I felt it is very instructive to our discuss here. I am going to ask Image123 tI tell me what he thinks of it:

"I have talked with missionaries from around the world. One interesting thing they have noticed in places like India and elsewhere where bona fide pagan idolatry is practiced openly is that often they will come across someone who added a cross or crucifix among their idols. When asked about it, the idolater will typically answer, “Oh, a man came and told me about this Jesus who loved me and died for my sins…and who wants to bless me and heal me. I thought, ‘He is so nice. I’ll add Him to my collection of gods.'” In other words, whenever an idolater is not told he needs to repent of his idolatry, he or she simply adds Jesus to their “deity collection.”

Culled from http://richvermillion.com/2008/01/01/the-real-gospel/

Image123:


But you told me earlier this year that John Lake is the founder of healing centers. What kind of thing is this? Are you deliberately trying to confuse me?

Remember this, and then this one.

When you have read the devil who could heal you would know that he didnot belong to the prosperity preachers and that he died 1935.
He is more known for fake healing but I know you didnot read this from the guy from the University of south africa. John Lake is well know for his fake healings and Benny Hinn wrote a book about him and Hinn is also in the prosperity gospel and he makes fake healings.

Hagin is the father of the prosperity gospel and this are two pair of shoes.

First the book come out from this fake Pastor who was in jail and when you have nothing you try to finde a new way to make money so he wrote about the fake of the prosperity gospel.

Hagin has fear that this coud be a new movement in America so he write his book where he want if this movement will became big he can say, sorry I was wrong here you see I write that is was not okay.

read this book Health, Wealth and Happiness, theologians David Jones and Russell Woodbridge characterize the doctrine as poor theology.

nora544:


When you have read the devil who could heal you would know that he didnot belong to the prosperity preachers and that he died 1935.
He is more known for fake healing but I know you didnot read this from the guy from the University of south africa. John Lake is well know for his fake healings and Benny Hinn wrote a book about him and Hinn is also in the prosperity gospel and he makes fake healings.

Hagin is the father of the prosperity gospel and this are two pair of shoes.

First the book come out from this fake Pastor who was in jail and when you have nothing you try to finde a new way to make money so he wrote about the fake of the prosperity gospel.

Hagin has fear that this coud be a new movement in America so he write his book where he want if this movement will became big he can say, sorry I was wrong here you see I write that is was not okay.

read this book Health, Wealth and Happiness, theologians David Jones and Russell Woodbridge characterize the doctrine as poor theology.

Well done, chop knuckle nora544.
You've sussed out the deceit and sham
- Hagin was very frightened and worried about a backlash, especially after the book that came out from the fake Pastor who was in jail (i.e. Jim Bakker)
Also many, as read from previous post above, do not want to believe the Tulsa Oklahoma 1999 meeting took place
They wish the hurriedly put together meeting for the panic stricken written book never happened
Let's just thank God for the fly on the wall at the meeting...

"Jesus" is a name we believe, but not just a name, but a man, who we know as the son of God. who died for us shedding his blood so we can have life eternity, Jesus say's he will never leave you, he will never for sake you, in our troubles he warns us and promised us he won't abandon you, Jesus loves you, and he protects you. And while reading your bible he speaks to you in word, and sometimes out of word, you hear a soft gentle "voice" teaching you his truth & showing you his ways. So as we walk through the shadows of death, we fear no evil? But if you really believe, above, if you really believe Jesus, if you really believe he had died for you. Then you need to really believe Jesus is the bread of life, the light of the world, the gate, the good shepherd, the resurrection & the life, the way & the truth & the life, the true vine, I tell you the truth," Jesus answered, "before Abraham was born, I AM.
Then ask Jesus to show you truth, their are to different doctrines, you either believe in truth, or you believe in the lie. Listen brothers & sisters. The lord say's seek his kingdom and his righteous-and all these things shall be added to you. Ask and it will be given, seek you will find. You either follow the old laws on Tithing giving a small percentage? Or you follow the truth on giving all? Jesus is worth much more then a tithe.Give him all you have....The truth will set you free.

Health, Wealth and Happiness, theologians David Jones and Russell Woodbridge characterize the doctrine as poor theology.

It is a tragedy that the so called prosperity movement has become so influential. What is even more tragic though is that many Christians are unable to recognize that these teachers are proclaiming is a serious distortion of the Gospel. Because teachers like Joel Osteen, T.D. Jakes, and Joyce Meyer have combined their eclectic teaching with Biblical elements many people are confused into thinking that what they are hearing from them is Christian teaching. It is not. This book by David W. Jones and Russell S. Woodbridge is a gift to the Church because of the extent these teachings have not only infiltrated the culture at large but also many of our Churches.

The authors begin with a short but thorough critique of the prosperity / Word of Faith movement. The critique starts with an examination of the foundational assumptions of prosperity teaching and traces their development from their origins in the mystical “New Thought” movement through the more popular “soft” prosperity teaching found in various churches today. The authors’ then move on to an examination of specific elements of the teaching that includes many direct quotes from popular prosperity teachers and the errors they involve.

Once they convincingly make the case that prosperity teaching is unbiblical and spiritually dangerous they then present a Biblically based corrective to those distorted doctrines. They discuss the Bible’s teaching on suffering, wealth, poverty, and giving in a way that is positive, accessible, and balanced. The book also contains resources for further study for those who wish to learn more.

The value of this book is that it is brief, easy to read, and well written yet it manages to deal with the major errors in prosperity teaching in an effective way. I pray that this book will be widely read by those who think that these teachings properly fall within the broad range of “Evangelical Christianity”. I pray that we would take up the challenge that the authors give us to go to the Bible and understand what God has said about these issues so that we might be more knowledgeable about how to understand these issues. I pray also that many who are followers of these prosperity teachers would be led to look carefully at what they are being taught and believe. I gladly recommend this book. It should be widely read and widely shared.