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| Islam Concept Of Peace by benalvino1: 4:03pm On Dec 28, 2014 |
Peace comes through submission (Islam). This submission, of course, is submission to Muhammad and his concept of Allah in the Quran, in other words, Islam. Theoretically, peace exists inside Dar ul-Islam, the House of Submission. I say theoretically, because we all know that Muslims, even though they are not supposed to, do fight fellow Muslims. The most recent examples are the civil war in Afghanistan between the Pushtuns on one side and the Northern Alliance (Uzbeks, Tajiks, etc.) on the other. Other recent exceptions were the Iraqi attack on Iran, the Iraqi attack on Kuwait, the West Pakistani attack on East Pakistan which subsequently became Bangladesh, the Yemeni Civil War with Egypt and Saudi Arabia interfering, the civil war in Algeria, the war between Morocco and Algeria over the Saharan Republic, etc. Peace with pagans, that is, not the People of the Book, is impossible, as they are all to be given a chance to accept Islam or be killed. This is illustrated by the recent killing of pagans in the South Sudan by northern Muslims attempting to impose Islamic Law on them, the killing of non-Muslims in Northern Nigeria by Muslims attempting to impose Islamic law on them, the attacks of the northern Muslims on the southern pagans in Chad with Gaddafi interfering, etc. With regard to Christians and Jews, they, too, are to be fought against until they are subdued and feel themselves subdued -- that is found in Quran 9:29 (Yousuf Ali). Illustrations of this are also in Sudan, Nigeria, Chad, Indonesia and smaller atrocities against Christians in Egypt, and the heinous repression of all Christian activity in Saudi Arabia by the Wahhabis. Muslim have to fight on until there is "no more tumult or oppression" Quran 2:190-193, Q. 9:5 (Yousuf Ali). To say that Islam is a religion of peace is not true. Islam is committed to war by both the example of Muhammad who fought on until he subdued Mecca and then other tribes, and by the Quranic teaching itself, plus numerous references in the Hadith. Perhaps a quote from Amir Tahiri, the editor of Politique International of Paris would be illustrative of the current state of affairs. He says of the 30 wars going on at the present time (October 2001), 28 involve Muslim people fighting either non-Muslims or even other Muslims! The Quran, by the way, teaches that Muslims are never to initiate war. But Islam has a strange way of explaining this. For example, Muslims are supposed to offer non-Muslims an opportunity to embrace Islam. If the non-Muslims refuse, the Muslim thinking is that they have commited aggression against Allah and Islam. Therefore, the Muslim is allowed to fight these aggressors against Allah and Islam until they become Muslims or are killed. Perhaps the greatest proof that Islam is not a religion of peace is the interpretion of Quran 4:89 that says if anyone wants to leave Islam (turns renegade) he is to be put to death. This makes it the religion of fear, not peace. There will be war in the world as long as people believe in Muhammad, his example and his teaching. The Islamic concept of peace, meaning making the whole world Muslim, is actually a mandate for war. Submitted by a long-time resident in the Muslim world. 2 Likes |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by benny4wax(m): 4:05pm On Dec 28, 2014 |
Nice post op |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by domack99(m): 6:29pm On Dec 28, 2014 |
Meenh take am easy oo, somehow bump into you thread and I can see your hatred for Islam. But wait, have you never seen a Muslim with a good attitude or what. My question is not based on just this thread but your post generally. There is something call Tafsir in Islam, they explain a lot of the Quran Ayah just the way pastors try to explain Bible verses. Every chapter of the Quran was reveal Prior to and/or after certain event, you need to understand these events in order to understand the Quran. ISIS, Boko Haram and the likes are really a big issue for Islam, and lots of Muslim communities has come out to denounce them but what more can I say, until this is proving otherwise, our claim that they are not Muslims will certainly fall on deaf ears. Its very easy for Boko Haram, ISIS and the likes to quote Quran verses which most non-Muslim that doesn't understand the Tafsir of those Ayah will believe they are doing Islamic biding. You need to take it easy and learn more about Islam, I was once like you (on the Islamic side) quoting bible from context just to make a superior argument, never judge a tribe, religion etc by individual or group attitude, there are good Muslims and Christians, there are bad ones as well, there are rich people in every religion as well as poor ones, criminals and fake men/women of God in both religion. There are terrorist in both religion if only we know and remember history. You can PM me will love to chat more 1 Like |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by benalvino1: 6:40pm On Dec 28, 2014 |
domack99: I have seen... I lived with one and I have dated several Muslim girls and my girl friend now is a Norwegian... she was Muslim but never liked the religion... most of them are in bondage and can't leave or be killed... Christians follow Jesus who is kind n humble... Muslims follow Mohammad who is a criminal and rapists... when Christians are kind, they are following Jesus footstep and when boko haram are ruthless they are following Mohammad... the nice Muslims don't follow their prophet therefore they don't really practice Islam. I know much about Islam... you have seen the fight between Israel and Palestine for a land that belongs to the Jews... it causes millions of muslim to match all over the world, Jews being attacked but no one except very few is matching against Isis killing both Christians n muslim... its because they approve what Isis is doing and they know its exactly from the Qur'an 1 Like |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by domack99(m): 8:24pm On Dec 28, 2014 |
benalvino1: "She was a Muslim but never like religion" I guess your girl friend is a Christian now and also you should know that there are Christian all over the world converting to Islam as well, just as Muslim are converting to Christian too or what do you say they are not strong Christians, I have seen pastors converting to Islam after returning from Jerusalem. They all have there reasons for converting. If you read the Life history of Mohammed, you will see that people that converted to Islam during his life time where inspire by the Mohammed attitude and words not by Miracle or conquer. You need to Google some of the Hadiths that narrate his life history. Who do you think the nice Muslims as you said follow? You can't be a Muslim without following the teaching and practice of the prophet. And you are not a Muslim when you deviate or bring innovations that are not part of teaching and practice of Mohammed (Boko Haram, ISIL and the likes). Sincerely I don't know how much you know about Islam but you need to know More, There have been several write up on this that you can find on the internet, if you read with open and unbiased mind you will no the true owner on the land. The map on the link below simplified how Israel have been expanding after been accommodated by Palestine (Muslim, Christian and Hebrew) after the World War II. http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/mapstellstory.html I don't know who actually own the land, every group have been cooking up various stories to support their argument, I only wish both side stop their senseless killing of innocent people. The Palestine (Muslim, Arabs, Christians, Hebrews) have been living peacefully before the creation of Israel 68 years ago. I wonder why Hiltler hate them (Jew) so much, may be the same reason you hate Islam so much |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by benalvino1: 9:03pm On Dec 28, 2014 |
domack99: yeah Christians convert that's the thing but the bigger question is what happens if someone leaves Islam? the answer is death... you see the bondage? out of all the Muslim I know, only 2 don't drink alcohol but I know more than 20... Mohammad spread Islam by the sword and this you can't deny. about the land your Qur'an said Allah gave the Jews the land! Hitler killed Jews because of Islam... try Google the role of Islam in the holocaust. if Allah said the land belongs to the Jews that he gave it to them.. then why do Arabs want to exterminate the Jews? because it is a command in the Qur'an. Palestinians are not fighting about land but they are trying to implement Allahs command. they have said it in Egypt, Iran, morocco and many Arab countries on their spiritual TV programs that it is not about land. |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by domack99(m): 7:50am On Dec 29, 2014 |
benalvino1: Morning Sir, From your first Paragraph and as you mentioned both side get new convert and definitely all creature will die but who lives in bondage among all religion of this world am not talking of Islam and Christianity alone, Jew, Hindu, etc, this can only be proving in life after death has every religion believe the other religion are false, even the Jew don't believe in Christ but Muslim do. No man has ever gone to the great beyond and return to tell us the true religion, if you believe other religion are living in bondage so does Muslim and Jew believe as well that Christian are living in bondage and we all (all religions) have scriptures and theory to backup our believes. Thank God you know Muslims that don't drink alcohol even though they are few, Am a Muslim and I know hundreds of Muslims that don't drink alcohol and if am to start counting there would be more than 30 Muslims that I know that drink Alcohol as well, Islamic stand on Alcohol is very clear, you don't drink it, you don't work where it is been produce you don't encourage but we are all human we all have our personal opinion about life and religion. Most people that readily drink alcohol that I know are Christians and I know lots of Christians (Tense of them) that don't drink alcohol mostly because of their Christian believes and few for health reason. If am right Jehovah Witness don't drink Alcohol at all. Alcohol or no alcohol shouldn't be a criteria for religion justification/criticism and if am right there are more Christian that you know that drink Alcohol than Muslims. "Mohammed spread Islam by Sword" This is not true, you need to know the story behind all these battle fought during the life of Mohammed, they are defensive battle not offensive. You still have a lot to learn in Islam if you really want to win the heart of a Muslim. Your statements "Allah is a devil. Mohammed is a rapist" do you know they are offensive? How would you feel when those statement are directed to your beloved ones. Well Muslim will never say such to the Prophets in the Bible we believe in them as well, they are all prophet of Allah. There is something called "Articles of Faith" in Islam, you can Google that to learn more. On your last paragraph about who own Israel/Palestine land. This can go on and on, every quoting scriptures to relate their claims, I don't know who own the land only God knows. According to the two scripture, God promise Israelite a safe land but what we don't know is if this land were Virgin or pre-occupied, according to the bible Israelite wonder around four forty year or so before getting to the land, wonder if it will take forty years to trek from Egypt to Israel a boarder town, before 1946 the population of the Hebrew/Jew was 6% in Palestine, Majority were Arabs/Muslims and few Christians as well. "Islam role in the holocaust" I love to read and learn so I Google it as you said, if you read between the lines with open mind you will see Islam has no hand in this (You are mixing Religion & Tribe), Hitler see Jew and Arab as of same descendant that they are both racist (to an extent I believe this), just that Arab and Hitler has a common enemy which is the British who colonize Arabian lands. All the articles I read didn't say Muslim world played a terrible role during the period as some Muslims were found to have save Jew life. Even part of what they did was to accommodate Jew in Palestine land and create a portion for Jew to create a state know as Israel today, this is a good gesture from the Muslim world. Wonder why the catholic in Rome didn't extend such offer to the Jew? As mentioned earlier, I notice that you are confusing Religion and tribe, Arab is a tribe and Islam is a religion, there are Arab Christians as well, what play during the holocaust was politics/hatred of human not of religion, it should have been the role of Arab in Holocaust not role of Islam. Do you know that Hitler is a Christian?? Some link that I Google on the Holocaust, thanks bro we learn new things every day. http://www.jpost.com/Jewish-World/Jewish-Features/New-booklet-reveals-Muslim-acts-of-heroism-during-Holocaust http://www.projetaladin.org/holocaust/en/40-questions-40-answers/the-nazis-the-holocaust-and-muslims.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_rescue_efforts_during_the_Holocaust http://pamelageller.com/category/mufti-of-jerusalem-islams-role-in-the-holocaust/ |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by benalvino1: 9:40am On Dec 29, 2014 |
Hitler's views on Islam and the Arab world[edit] Among eastern religions, Hitler described religious leaders such as "Confucius, Buddha, and Mohammed" as providers of "spiritual sustenance".[citation needed] In speeches, Hitler made apparently warm references towards Muslim culture such as: "The peoples of Islam will always be closer to us than, for example, France".[1] A famous anecdote about Adolf Hitler's perspectives towards Islam and the Arabs is recounted by Albert Speer in his best-selling memoir, Inside the Third Reich. Speer reports that "Hitler had been much impressed by a scrap of history he had learned from a delegation of distinguished Arabs."[2] The delegation had speculated that the world would have become "Mohammedan" if the Berbers and Arabs had won the Battle of Tours in the 8th Century AD, and that the Germans would have become heirs to "a religion that believed in spreading the faith by the sword and in subjugating all nations to that faith. Such a creed was perfectly suited to the German temperament."[3] Speer then presents Hitler's own speculations on this subject: Hitler said that the conquering Arabs, because of their racial inferiority, would in the long run have been unable to contend with the harsher climate of the country. They could not have kept down the more vigorous natives, so that ultimately not Arabs but Islamized Germans could have stood at the head of this Mohammedan Empire.[4] This exchange occurred when Hitler received Saudi Arabian ruler Ibn Saud’s special envoy, Khalid al-Hud al-Gargani.[5] Earlier in this meeting Hitler noted that one of the three reasons why Germany had warm sympathies for the Arabs was: … because we were jointly fighting the Jews. This led him to discuss Palestine and conditions there, and he then stated that he himself would not rest until the last Jew had left Germany. Kalid al Hud observed that the Prophet Mohammed … had acted the same way. He had driven the Jews out of Arabia ….[6] Gilbert Achcar wryly observes that the Führer did not point out to his Arab visitors at that meeting that until then he had incited German Jews to emigrate to Palestine, and the Reich actively helped Zionist organizations get around British-imposed restrictions on Jewish immigration.[7] Achcar also points out that the German version of "Mein Kampf" designates the Arab people as one of the lowest races of humanity, though this section was not included in the Arabic translations of the book.[7] Hitler had told his military commanders in 1939, shortly before the start of the war: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relations_between_Nazi_Germany_and_the_Arab_world yes it was spread by the sword Warfare on Non-Muslims Some of the tribes in the city of Medinah (Yathrib) did accept Muhammad and he moved there for protection. There he began to rule and formed an army. Muhammad began to raid those around him. Narrated Jabir: The Prophet sent us as an army unit of three hundred warriors under the command of Abu 'Ubaida to ambush a caravan of the Quraish. ... (Bukhari: vol. 7, bk 67, no. 402, Khan) Muhammad was also involved in defensive and offensive battles. The Arabian tribes who had previously rejected Muhammad were now asked again to submit to him. For most of the tribes this was done by sending a military delegation. Before Muhammad's armies would attack a tribe they would invite them to accept Islam first: The Apostle of Allah, sent Khalid Ibn al-Walid with four hundred Muslims to Banu al-Harith ... He ordered him to invite them to Islam three times before fighting. ... They accepted what he had called them to. He stayed among them to teach them Islam, its regulations, the Book of Allah and the sunnah of His Prophet. (Ibn Sa'd, Kitab Al-Tabaqat Al-Kabir, vol. 1, p. 399) ... Ali and Ibn al-Musaffa said: The Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) sent us on an expedition. When we reached the place of attack, I galloped my horse and outstripped my companions, and the people of that locality received me with a great noise. I said to them: Say "There is no god but Allah," and you will be protected. They said this. My companions blamed me, saying: You deprived us of the booty. When we came to the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him), they told him what I had done. So he called me, appreciating what I had done, and said: Allah has recorded for you so and so (a reward) for every man of them. (Abu-Dawud: bk. 41, no. 5062, Hasan) Anas b. Malik reported: The Messenger of Allah used to attack the enemy when it was dawn. He would listen to the Adhan (Islamic call to prayer); so if he heard an Adhan, he stopped, otherwise made an attack. (Muslim: bk. 4, no. 745, Siddiqui) Muhammad said that he was commanded by Allah to spread Islam this way: Narrated Ibn 'Umar: Allah's Apostle said: "I have been ordered (by Allah) to fight against the people until they testify that none has the right to be worshipped but Allah and that Muhammad is Allah's Apostle, and offer the prayers perfectly and give the obligatory charity, so if they perform all that, then they save their lives and property from me except for Islamic laws and then their reckoning (accounts) will be done by Allah." (Bukhari: vol. 1, bk. 2, no. 24, Khan) Fight those who believe not in God and the Last Day and do not forbid what God and His Messenger have forbidden -- such men as practise not the religion of truth ... It is He who has sent His Messenger with the guidance and the religion of truth, that He may uplift it above every religion, though the unbelievers be averse. (Qur'an 9:29-33, Arberry) It was easy to become Muhammad's enemy. If you did not acknowledge him as your ruler and prophet then you were his enemy. Those who joined Muhammad joined the fight against those who did not accept Muhammad's religion: Surad Ibn `Abd Allah al-Azdi arrived with about thirteen to nineteen members of his people in a deputation to the Apostle of Allah ... The Apostle of Allah, may Allah bless him, appointed him (Surad) amir of those of his people who had embraced Islam, and enjoined him to wage war against the polytheists of the tribe of Yaman, who were living in the adjoining territories. He set out and alighted at Jurash which was a strongly fortified city and where the tribes of Yaman had taken shelter. He (Surad) invited them to embrace Islam but they declined. He besieged them for a month and used to raid their animals and seize them. Then he retreated to a mountain, called Shakar. They thought that he had fled, and came out to pursue him. He arrayed his forces, and attacked them. Muslims put them to the sword as they liked. They seized twenty of their horses and fought them all day long. The people of Jurash had sent two men to the Apostle of Allah, who were waiting for an opportunity to meet him. The Apostle of Allah, Allah bless him, informed them of this combat and the victory of Surad. The two men came to their people and informed them of the circumstances, along with other incidents. So a deputation of them set out, and they waited on the Apostle of Allah, may Allah bless him, and embraced Islam. (Ibn Sa'd, Kitab Al-Tabaqat Al-Kabir, vol. 1, pp. 397-398) |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by domack99(m): 11:47am On Dec 29, 2014 |
Your quote above about Hitler on Arab is a political statement just to gain Arab support and nothing more. Hitler personally hated all non-Aryans, and since Arabs are Semites, they fall into the same category as Jews. Nonetheless, various Arab countries were sympathetic to the Nazis not because of Hitler's Anti-Jewish policies, but because in the late 30s, the Nazis promised to rid the Arabs of their French and British rulers. Because of this, there was some Arab support of the Nazis, but once Halter's actual agenda became clear, Arab support dried up very rapidly. Hitler did actually make alliances with some Arab nations - but this was based upon anti-Jewish and anti-British policies and declarations - which the Arab nations were all too pleased to swallow and run with - despite what Hitler was doing to achieve his objectives. There is no doubt, however, that when those alliances had fulfilled his needs he would have turned on them as they did not fit his Aryan ideal. We see our politician forming alliance and saying all sort of things just to please the other group, tribe and religion, we don't need to go far to know that Hitler was lying, those close to him know that he love know race apart from Aryan. This is purely a game of policy does not quantify the justification of hatred to other religion, We all know who OBJ and IBB are in this country, suddenly one become APC friend and the other become GEJ father all because the enemy of my enemy is my friend so they say. On the second part and also I mentioned earlier that you keeping quoting from the context, do you know the background story, how the Quraish persecute the Muslims out of Mecca and sold their properties, there is far more to what you quote and you know that. All the point put together by Samuel green from where you draw your article are without background history, we need to stop quoting from context in order not to mislead people, if we are to sincerely call people to our religion lets base it on fact and there is no fact without proof and no proof without storyline either simple or extensive. Assuming I quote the following bible verse to a Muslims and Non-Muslims alike just to drive home my argument with out the true background story, just what you are doing on Nairaland and what Samuel Green is doing with his article. Hosea 13:16 "Samaria shall bear her guilt, because she has rebelled against her God; they shall fall by the sword; their little ones shall be dashed in pieces, and their pregnant women ripped open." Deuteronomy 7:2 And when the Lord your God gives them over to you, and you defeat them, then you must devote them to complete destruction.[a] You shall make no covenant with them and show no mercy to them Bros, this is a two way thing, you need background understanding for you to comprehend that the God in the Bible is a merciful God but direct judging from the above bible verses will make it difficult for anyone to agree except with background knowledge. |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by benalvino1: 12:58pm On Dec 29, 2014 |
domack99: you quote two verse from the old testament, yes the old testament is full of violence, could be more violent than the Qur'an but Christians live their lives based on the new testament... the teaching of Jesus. [b]7 When the Lord thy God shall bring thee into the land whither thou goest to possess it, and hath cast out many nations before thee, the Hittites, and the Girgashites, and the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites, seven nations greater and mightier than thou; 2 And when the Lord thy God shall deliver them before thee; thou shalt smite them, and utterly destroy them; thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor shew mercy unto them: 3 Neither shalt thou make marriages with them; thy daughter thou shalt not give unto his son, nor his daughter shalt thou take unto thy son. 4 For they will turn away thy son from following me, that they may serve other gods: so will the anger of the Lord be kindled against you, and destroy thee suddenly. 5 But thus shall ye deal with them; ye shall destroy their altars, and break down their images, and cut down their groves, and burn their graven images with fire. 6 For thou art an holy people unto the Lord thy God: the Lord thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth. [/b] the verses is talking about some ancient nation in ancient time... it doesn't go past those times. Unlike nearly all of the Old Testament verses of violence, the verses of violence in the Quran are mostly open-ended, meaning that they are not restrained by the historical context of the surrounding text. They are part of the eternal, unchanging word of Allah, and just as relevant or subjective as anything else in the Quran. The context of violent passages is more ambiguous than might be expected of a perfect book from a loving God, however this can work both ways. Most of today's Muslims exercise a personal choice to interpret their holy book's call to arms according to their own moral preconceptions about justifiable violence. Apologists cater to their preferences with tenuous arguments that gloss over historical fact and generally do not stand up to scrutiny. Still, it is important to note that the problem is not bad people, but bad ideology. Unfortunately, there are very few verses of tolerance and peace to abrogate or even balance out the many that call for nonbelievers to be fought and subdued until they either accept humiliation, convert to Islam, or are killed. Muhammad's own martial legacy - and that of his companions - along with the remarkable stress on violence found in the Quran have produced a trail of blood and tears across world history. The Quran: Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief] is worse than killing... but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah [disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah] and worship is for Allah alone. But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)" (Translation is from the Noble Quran) The historical context of this passage is not defensive warfare, since Muhammad and his Muslims had just relocated to Medina and were not under attack by their Meccan adversaries. In fact, the verses urge offensive warfare, in that Muslims are to drive Meccans out of their own city (which they later did). The use of the word "persecution" by some Muslim translators is thus disingenuous (the actual Muslim words for persecution - "idtihad" - and oppression - a variation of "z-l-m" - do not appear in the verse). The actual Arabic comes from "fitna" which can mean disbelief, or the disorder that results from unbelief or temptation. Taken as a whole, the context makes clear that violence is being authorized until "religion is for Allah" - ie. unbelievers desist in their unbelief. Quran (2:244) - "Then fight in the cause of Allah, and know that Allah Heareth and knoweth all things." Quran (2:216) - "Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth, and ye know not." Not only does this verse establish that violence can be virtuous, but it also contradicts the myth that fighting is intended only in self-defense, since the audience was obviously not under attack at the time. From the Hadith, we know that this verse was narrated at a time that Muhammad was actually trying to motivate his people into raiding merchant caravans for loot. Quran (3:56) - "As to those who reject faith, I will punish them with terrible agony in this world and in the Hereafter, nor will they have anyone to help." Quran (3:151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority". This speaks directly of polytheists, yet it also includes Christians, since they believe in the Trinity (ie. what Muhammad incorrectly believed to be 'joining companions to Allah'). Quran (4:74) - "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, on him We shall bestow a vast reward." The martyrs of Islam are unlike the early Christians, who were led meekly to the slaughter. These Muslims are killed in battle as they attempt to inflict death and destruction for the cause of Allah. This is the theological basis for today's suicide bombers. Quran (4:76) - "Those who believe fight in the cause of Allah…" Quran (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks." Quran (4:95) - "Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and those who strive and fight in the cause of Allah with their goods and their persons. Allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit (at home). Unto all (in Faith) Hath Allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath He distinguished above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-" This passage criticizes "peaceful" Muslims who do not join in the violence, letting them know that they are less worthy in Allah's eyes. It also demolishes the modern myth that "Jihad" doesn't mean holy war in the Quran, but rather a spiritual struggle. Not only is the Arabic word used in this passage, but it is clearly not referring to anything spiritual, since the physically disabled are given exemption. (The Hadith reveals the context of the passage to be in response to a blind man's protest that he is unable to engage in Jihad and this is reflected in other translations of the verse). Quran (4:104) - "And be not weak hearted in pursuit of the enemy; if you suffer pain, then surely they (too) suffer pain as you suffer pain..." Is pursuing an injured and retreating enemy really an act of self-defense? Quran (5:33) - "The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His messenger and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement" Quran (8:12) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them" No reasonable person would interpret this to mean a spiritual struggle. Quran (8:15) - "O ye who believe! When ye meet those who disbelieve in battle, turn not your backs to them. (16)Whoso on that day turneth his back to them, unless maneuvering for battle or intent to join a company, he truly hath incurred wrath from Allah, and his habitation will be hell, a hapless journey's end." Quran (8:39) - "And fight with them until there is no more fitna (disorder, unbelief) and religion should be only for Allah" Some translations interpret "fitna" as "persecution", but the traditional understanding of this word is not supported by the historical context (See notes for 2:193). The Meccans were simply refusing Muhammad access to their city during Haj. Other Muslims were allowed to travel there - just not as an armed group, since Muhammad had declared war on Mecca prior to his eviction. The Meccans were also acting in defense of their religion, since it was Muhammad's intention to destroy their idols and establish Islam by force (which he later did). Hence the critical part of this verse is to fight until "religion is only for Allah", meaning that the true justification of violence was the unbelief of the opposition. According to the Sira (Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 324) Muhammad further explains that "Allah must have no rivals." Quran (8:57) - "If thou comest on them in the war, deal with them so as to strike fear in those who are behind them, that haply they may remember." Quran (8:67) - "It is not for a Prophet that he should have prisoners of war until he had made a great slaughter in the land..." Quran (8:59-60) - "And let not those who disbelieve suppose that they can outstrip (Allah's Purpose). Lo! they cannot escape. Make ready for them all thou canst of (armed) force and of horses tethered, that thereby ye may dismay the enemy of Allah and your enemy." Quran (8:65) - "O Prophet, exhort the believers to fight..." Quran (9:5) - "So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captive and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them." According to this verse, the best way of staying safe from Muslim violence is to convert to Islam (prayer (salat) and the poor tax (zakat) are among the religion's Five Pillars). This popular claim that the Quran only inspires violence within the context of self-defense is seriously challenged by this passage as well, since the Muslims to whom it was written were obviously not under attack. Had they been, then there would have been no waiting period (earlier verses make it a duty for Muslims to fight in self-defense, even during the sacred months). The historical context is Mecca after the idolaters were subjugated by Muhammad and posed no threat. Once the Muslims had the power, they violently evicted those unbelievers who would not convert. notice most of these verse are not giving commands to a particular person or attack a particular nation... it always use unbelievers! which means believers of Allah should attack unbelievers of Allah! all this verses are not restricted by historical context that's why you see boko haram, Isis, al-shebab etc. following their prophets foot steps. when the command was given to kill the Jews and Christians where ever you find them... is that not waging war against all Jews and Christians from the 4 corners of the world? |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by domack99(m): 3:15pm On Dec 29, 2014 |
benalvino1: O God here we go again, first am totally against you that Old testament is full of violence, God in the bible (old testament) is not a violent God as you assume (New testament God=Old Testament God), I only quote from context (I know the true story, just feeding a dose of your medicine), Good that you research to gain the background knowledge (But not enough), I employ you to do the same for the Quranic verses you are quoting out of context. I think there is more you need to learn about the bible itself, I don't expect a knowledgeable Christian to say the old testament is full of violence except you don't understand the background story of some of the verses. If you say Christians follow the new testament remember that Jesus said in the book of Matthew "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them". word for the wise I don't want to start the issue about the validity of the new testament as a word of God apart from Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. You still have a lot to learn, your claim that some old testament verses are violent statement is not Good for a Christian believe. Again you have quoted out of context Quran Ayah claiming it contain violence, you need to listen to the Tafsir of these verses to know while and whom these verses were directed to, just the way Hosea 13:16 and Deuteronomy 7:2 were directed to some group. If you need help in understanding better am ready to help. Speaking of Violence in the new testament "Am not against what Jesus did" but some people believe that as a Messenger He should have preach to them rather than taking law in His own hand and destroying source of livelihood of these people, he should have report them to the authority of the land. Matthew 21:12 Jesus entered the temple courts and drove out all who were buying and selling there. He overturned the tables of the money changers and the benches of those selling doves. I know we will have justification for what Jesus did because we believe in Him ( I do believe in Him and I support his action), the Jew were angry with him because they don't believe in Him. See verses below, don't try to explain to me, I understand those verses better and the actual meaning of it, just following your foot step by quoting out of context. Matthew 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. Matthew 15:4 For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death. Luke 22:35-38 And he said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing. Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one. For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end. And they said, Lord, behold, here are two swords. And he said unto them, It is enough Luke 12:49 I have come to cast fire upon the Earth; and how I wish it were already kindled! But I have a baptism to undergo, and how distressed I am until it is accomplished! Do you suppose that I came to grant peace on earth? I tell you, no, but rather division; for from now on five members in one household will be divided, three against two and two against three. They will be divided, father against son and son against father, mother against daughter and daughter against mother, mother-in-law against daughter-in-law and daughter-in-law against mother-in-law Do you also know that Quran chapters were reveal in two different locations, Mecca and Medina, the location of the revelation and the present situation of the Muslim then determine what is reveal. Need to Know the Tafsir, you have more to learn than you Imagine. Below is link to background story of Surah Al-Masadd from Wordpree but first the English translation of the Chapter, read the chapter then read the reason while the chapter was release (Tafsir) from wordpress and other sources attached 1. http://www.noblequran.com/translation/surah111.html 2.http://versebyversequranstudycircle./2012/07/24/tafseer-of-surah-al-masad/ 2. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Masadd |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by benalvino1: 5:00pm On Dec 29, 2014 |
domack99:where did I say GOD is violence? I said the book is full of violence. reading it shows what am saying starting from Cain and Abel... I did not assume old testament is a different God from new testament I think there is more you need to learn about the bible itself, I don't expect a knowledgeable Christian to say the old testament is full of violence except you don't understand the background story of some of the verses. If you say Christians follow the new testament remember that Jesus said in the book of Matthew "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them". word for the wise dude when I say it is full of violence I quote verses that says shows it, when God ask Deuteronomy 7:2 And when the Lord your God gives them over to you, and you defeat them, then you must devote them to complete destruction.[a] You shall make no covenant with them and show no mercy to them... he is giving a command to destroy them and it will be done through war or violence that is what I meant... the problem you face and which you try to deceive us with is the fact you said Jesus came to fulfill the laws of the prophets... so I beg to ask the laws you are talking about? you brought this up because I said Christians follows Jesus footsteps and we are bound by the principles (humbleness) Speaking of Violence in the new testament "Am not against what Jesus did" but some people believe that as a Messenger He should have preach to them rather than taking law in His own hand and destroying source of livelihood of these people, he should have report them to the authority of the landyou are finding fault so bad against Jesus right? their only source of livelihood you say, how about they do their business outside of the temple? yes this verse Matthew 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. has a meaning I don't know... but could you show me where Jesus used a sword? he who doesn't honor mom and dad let him die, did he ask you to kill him? or did he say you must kill he who doesn't? people who don't listen to their parents often lose their life... the verses you quoted is true... people often get into family problems because of Jesus, if one believes and the other have different believes there will be division. why don't you present a full context in the Qur'an verses you claimed I took out of context? Mohammed said Jesus is not the son of Allah he is right, Allah never had any son but Jesus is the only begotten son of YHWH. you follow Mohammad is it right for him to have sex with Aisha? why does he have up to 50 wives? answer this two questions first or you would want to say it never happened? and all those verses you quote about Jesus none is violent unlike Mohammad who behead up to 900 Jews in one day. |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by domack99(m): 9:27pm On Dec 29, 2014 |
My apology if I quote you wrong, is it right for him to have sex with Aisha? I believe you wanted to say He had sex with Aisha at under age, Right? NO, though Aisha was betrothed to Him at a young age but He never had sex with her until she was matured and even agreed to marry the prophet. Again you need to get the fact and stop listening to hear say. Don't expect you to believe whatever I say anyway. why does he have up to 50 wives? NO, Google is you friend on this one, very obvious that your accept any word that tannish the image of Islam without cross checking for fact. But where do you get all this lies from bro, Mohammed married 11 wives during his life time. Well since you don't believe in the old testament, I will have ask you how many wives the great King Solomon, David, Jacob, etc has and God never condemn them and God never condemn the act even in the new testament. About the LAW: Look at the verse again it says Prophets (in Plural form) David, Abraham, Jacob etc not Mosses alone. all the prophets bring God guardians (Law) which compliment one another and never contradict each other except for people who don't understand God verses and believe the book is full of violence. They all bring their Laws and Jesus also fulfilled them. And if you know better you can tell me which Prophets (in plural as in the verse) is Jesus talking about?, You don't need to explain the meaning of those verse to me, I thought I stated that in my reply clearly that I know their meaning, Jesus didn't meant violence I know, I only which and pray you understand the meaning of some of the Quran verses as I do with bible. Am a Muslim and I take my time to understand and investigate Bible verses when some people (Muslims & Christian) try to quote verses out of context. "Quoting the Quran out of Context". There was a link on my last reply, did you take you time to go through the Chapter and the Tafsir (Background story), One of the verses you quoted was Quran 4:76, the Surah is An-Nisa, you can search for the Tafsir on Google the way you search for all those Verses you are quoting, believe Islam is not for Lazy one, God might be given you a chance right now showing you the light if only you can research for fact. Matthew 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. has a meaning I don't know... but could you show me where Jesus used a sword? The link below help to explain the verse above better, you can't understand the verse without understanding the historical culture of Israelites (Tafsir), same thing happen to the Quran verses, you need to understand the Arab culture, situation and circumstances the Muslims were in when the verses were reveal. Jesus meant no arm with the word sword but verses like this are not for lazy people. http://www.answering-islam.org/Authors/Arlandson/matthew_10_34.htm John 3:16 on the only begotten son, this argument can go on and on with the issue of David coming in to play as well, I have met different Christian with different interpretation of the word Begotten, sincerely I have heard enough, some will say begotten not made, David is begotten not the only begotten, David adopted begotten, it is old testament, etc. Again just like the Matthew 10:34, you need to understand the Tafsir, before you understand the meaning of the word begotten as used by Jesus. First translate the word to Hebrew (Jesus speak Hebrew not English) and relate it with Jewish culture, you will be surprise how often such word is use among Hebrew just the way Naija use the word WAHALA DEY. 1 Like |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by benalvino1: 12:50pm On Dec 30, 2014 |
My apology if I quote you wrong, are you just telling me stories or what? what do you mean by young age? what do you mean by old enough? you don't even show any text or quote any text to affirm your point. he married her at 6 and had sex with her at 9 what is old enough? Sahih al-Bukhari 3896—Narrated Hisham’s father: Khadija died three years before the Prophet departed to Al-Madina. He stayed there for two years or so and then he wrote the marriage (wedding) contract with Aishah when she was a girl of six years of age, and he consummated that marriage when she was nine years old. Sahih al-Bukhari 5158—Narrated Urwa: The Prophet wrote the (marriage contract) with Aisha while she was six years old and consummated his marriage with her while she was nine years old and she remained with him for nine years (i.e. till his death). Sahih Muslim 3310—Aisha reported: Allah’s Apostle married me when I was six years old, and I was admitted to his house when I was nine years old. Sahih Muslim 3311—Aisha reported that Allah’s Apostle married her when she was seven years old, and she was taken to his house as a bride when she was nine, and her dolls were with her; and when he (the Holy Prophet) died she was eighteen years old. Sunan Abu Dawud 2116—Aishah said: The Apostle of Allah married me when I was seven years old. (The narrator Sulaiman said: Or six years.) He had intercourse with me when I was nine years old. you keep deviating from the real topic... the laws of the prophets Jesus already fulfilled... learn what fulfilled means it means the laws were abolished by Christ. Accordingly, such components as the Sabbath-day requirement must be operative still, along with perhaps numerous other elements of the Mosaic Law. This assumption is grounded in a misunderstanding of the words and intent of this passage. Christ did not suggest here that the binding nature of the law of Moses would remain forever in effect. Such a view would contradict everything we learn from the balance of the New Testament see the verses Romans 10:4 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.2 Galatians 3:23–25 Now before faith came, we were held captive under the law, imprisoned until the coming faith would be revealed. 24 So then, the law was our guardian until Christ came, tin order that we might be justified by faith. 25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian, Ephesians 2:15 15 by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances, that he might create in himself one view man in place of the two, so making peace abolish.” It translates the Greek term kataluo, literally meaning “to loosen down.” The word is found seventeen times in the New Testament. It is used, for example, of the destruction of the Jewish temple by the Romans (Matthew 26:61; 27:40; Acts 6:14), and of the dissolving of the human body at death (2 Corinthians 5:1). The term can carry the extended meaning of “to overthrow,” i.e., “to render vain, deprive of success.” In classical Greek, it was used in connection with institutions, laws, etc., to convey the idea of “to invalidate.” It is especially important to note how the word is used in Matthew 5:17. In this context, “abolish” is set in opposition to “fulfill.” Christ came “...not to abolish, but to fulfill.” Jesus did not come to this earth for the purpose of acting as an opponent of the law. His goal was not to prevent its fulfillment. Rather, He revered it, loved it, obeyed it, and brought it to fruition. He fulfilled the law’s prophetic utterances regarding Himself (Luke 24:44 Then he said to them, these are my words that I spoke to you while I was still with you, that everything written about me in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms must be fulfilled.”) Christ fulfilled the demands of the Mosaic law, which called for perfect obedience under threat of a “curse” (see Galatians 3:10, 13 10 For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them.” 13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree). In this sense, the law’s divine design will ever have an abiding effect. It will always accomplish the purpose for which it was given. If, however, the law of Moses bears the same relationship to men today, in terms of its binding status, then it was not fulfilled, and Jesus failed at what He came to do. On the other hand, if the Lord did accomplish His goal, then the law was fulfilled, and it is not a binding legal institution today. Further, if the law of Moses was not fulfilled by Christ and thus remains as a binding legal system for today then it is not just partially binding. Rather, it is a totally compelling system. Jesus plainly said that not one “jot or tittle” (representative of the smallest markings of the Hebrew script) would pass away until all was fulfilled. Consequently, nothing of the law was to fail until it had completely accomplished its purpose. Jesus fulfilled the law. Jesus fulfilled all of the law. We cannot say that Jesus fulfilled the sacrificial system, but did not fulfill the other aspects of the law. Jesus either fulfilled all of the law, or none of it. What Jesus' death means for the sacrificial system, it also means for the other aspects of the law. you are trying to make Jesus look like Mohammad but you keep failing... you brought the peoples livelihood you brought the sword now the law... we are under Jesus covenant not Moses stop acting like you understand the bible. why kill those who live Islam? why kill those who insult Islam? why kill those who insult Mohammad? how is it a peaceful religion with these commands? |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by domack99(m): 4:21pm On Dec 30, 2014 |
benalvino1: First Glory be to Almighty Allah the Most Perfect, am happy that the narration you quote are not Quran verses but Hadiths, that narrate the life history of the prophet compiled by HUMAN BEING, you can even see the conflicts in the narrations you quoted (See bolded part above). This are human we are prone to error just as you see some conflicts of narration in Matthew, Mark, Luke and John in the New Testament reporting same event in different ways. Sir, if you really want to know the truth about the true age of Aisha, you must be ready to read, again Islam is not for Lazy ones, please see the link below to brush up your knowledge, Aisha should be around 17-19 when she marry the Prophet. http://www.fountainmagazine.com/Issue/detail/At-What-Age-Did-Aisha-Marry-the-Prophet You might want to argue that 18, 19 is a young age because we are in a jet age now but that will be a story after you comprehend the story on the link above. Even our mothers marry at early age. On the Law: So you own Fulfilled equal Abolished, am adding this to my dictionaries of encounter, nothing we no go hear. Funny you didn't even quote verse from Matthew, Mark, Luke and John, four of the twelve disciples that move around with Jesus during his life time. You are quoting Saul (Paul) letters to the people of Romans, Galatians and Ephesians. Matthew narrate his story about Jesus, a disciple that met Jesus one on one and protect him from persecutor like Saul (Paul), now you are quoting Paul who claim he saw Jesus and accepted him into his life 25 years after Jesus death. Paul now telling you fulfilled is abolished, bro you should no better. Despite Jesus warning on fake prophecy. Please when you are quoting verses from the bible to support your argument stop quoting Paul letters, it will be good to quote from old testament self. On your last four questions, again I told you to read the Tafsir of the verses, you will understand the meaning better. You have not been doing so, are you? I can provide you with links and their are android apps as well. Sir, you listen too much to lies without further investigation, I will employ you to go through links I provided and read with open mind. Some of the answers you seek require lots of explanation, you need to read a lot to understand and to get satisfied with some answer. Sincerely Aisha marriage age as been narrated by some hadith baffle some Muslim, I took my time reading several articles to understand the truth, reality, culture and wisdom behind it. Please do so as well. |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by benalvino1: 5:23pm On Dec 30, 2014 |
domack99: Hahaha so the hadith is erroneous and Bukhari* are all wrong? your excuse failed... you acknowledged they were right when they write about him marrying Aisha but claim they are wrong when they said the age she was... Your own statement is it right for him to have sex with Aisha? I believe you wanted to say He had sex with Aisha at under age, Right? NO, though Aisha was betrothed to Him at a young age but He never had sex with her until she was matured and even agreed to marry the prophet. Again you need to get the fact and stop listening to hear say. Don't expect you to believe whatever I say anyway. Young age? You agree then went to say he never had sex till she was old enough... please give a reference to that claim! You agreed Mohammad marry Aisha but she was never mentioned in the Qur'an meaning you take what the hadith says about his life literally... how come suddenly they are humans and not perfect? Mohammad cannot read and write so can we all say those everything In the Qur'an is err? Remember that he did not write the text. I gave you comprehensive explanation that we don't live on the mosaic law if you don't want to take it leave it... adding it to your dictionary is your own problem... I never mention fulfill = abolish You closed your eyes on this Romans 10:4 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.2 Galatians 3:23–25 Now before faith came, we were held captive under the law, imprisoned until the coming faith would be revealed. 24 So then, the law was our guardian until Christ came, tin order that we might be justified by faith. 25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian, Ephesians 2:15 15 by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances, that he might create in himself one view man in place of the two, so making peace It is especially important to note how the word is used in Matthew 5:17. In this context, “abolish” is set in opposition to “fulfill.” Christ came “...not to abolish, but to fulfill.” Jesus did not come to this earth for the purpose of acting as an opponent of the law. His goal was not to prevent its fulfillment. Rather, He revered it, loved it, obeyed it, and brought it to fruition. He fulfilled the law’s prophetic utterances regarding Himself Luke 24:44 Then he said to them, these are my words that I spoke to you while I was still with you, that everything written about me in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms must be fulfilled.”) see Galatians 3:10, 13 10 For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them.” 13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree). In this sense, the law’s divine design will ever have an abiding effect. It will always accomplish the purpose for which it was given. You have no argument here... What's there to understand? The text is clear... kill anyone who insult Mohammad Kill any one who insult Islam. Its funny how the link you gave did not mention the hadith was wrong or Bukhari*... funny thing is that he reference Bukhari* which I quote saying she was 9 when he had sex with her... how come the writer did not mention hadith and Bukhari was wrong? Instead he admitted to the claim with this excuse In short, regardless of whether Aisha’s age at marriage was 9 or 17 or 18, there is nothing strange about it. It is necessary to evaluate every society according to its own rules. When we look at examples, it was quite a widespread custom to marry both boys and girls at a young age. However, when we look at information passed down to us, it should not be forgotten that this information to the effect that Aisha, may God be pleased with her, was born in 605, engaged at the age of 14 or 15 and married at the age of 17 or 18 is too strong to be ignored. |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by domack99(m): 6:56pm On Dec 30, 2014 |
benalvino1: There are verse in Quran directed to Aisha, one of these verses was reveal as a result of false allegation against her, So the Quran is not wrong and Bukhari is also right, ( Check Surah An-Nur, Chapter 24. Also remember to read the Tafsir ( Reason why the Surah was reveal)). if you don't know please ask. The age Aisha got married to Prophet was not mentioned in the Quran, Hadith narration MIGHT not be perfect as these are HUMAN reporting not revelation like the Quran and are subject to error, this happens in bible as well don't need to stress so much on Hadiths. benalvino1: Sir, read between the line and stop taking us back, I have provided a claim that Aisha didn't get marry until 17-19, I also made mentioned of a chapter of the Quran that was reveal to prove her innocent. If you think 17-19 is an under age that is left to you, you might google the Law of marriage in Texas to see the acceptable age for marriage for Male and Female [b]On Fulfill, Abolish and Mosaic Law Am not going to swallow this, it just doesn't add up, so what Law Jesus brought to the world, give me an example of the law Mosaic Law that was Abolish and new one replace by Jesus, you are just forming stories, Saul tell a whole lots of lies and you all put the main Gospel of Jesus aside (Matthew, Mark, Luke and John) benalvino1: Always read between the lines, please read the last bolded sentence above and tell me what that means sir |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by Weah96: 11:36pm On Dec 30, 2014 |
benalvino1: Be a decent human being, provide a citation for the work that you copied. The person you're talking to is using his own words. Use your own or provide a link to the words you copy. It's what Jesus would have done. |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by benalvino2(m): 2:43pm On Dec 31, 2014 |
Narrated Aisha: The Prophet engaged me when I was a girl of six (years). We went to Medina and stayed at the home of Bani-al-Harith bin Khazraj. Then I got ill and my hair fell down. Later on my hair grew (again) and my mother, Um Ruman, came to me while I was playing in a swing with some of my girl friends. She called me, and I went to her, not knowing what she wanted to do to me. She caught me by the hand and made me stand at the door of the house. I was breathless then, and when my breathing became all right, she took some water and rubbed my face and head with it. Then she took me into the house. There in the house I saw some Ansari women who said, "Best wishes and Allah's Blessing and a good luck." Then she entrusted me to them and they prepared me (for the marriage). Unexpectedly Allah's Apostle came to me in the forenoon and my mother handed me over to him, and at that time I was a girl of nine years of age. (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 5, Book 58, Number 234) [size=18pt]you said he is right remember[/size] Dude if most of the people the writer of that article is saying she was six or seven when he married her and had sex with her at nine then they are all correct... after all he is reference from them in his article... if they are wrong on that then he couldn't tell she was 17 or 19 from their own words. See his references from the site you gave Then compare the authors from his references to the authors I will quote below and see how all of them said she was 6 or 7 years old when he married her then had sex with her at 9... I am not quoting only from the hadith and I am quoting from people he is quote who all stated the age she was and non said she was 17 or 19... see my next post! I hope the spam system don't block me again |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by benalvino2(m): 3:01pm On Dec 31, 2014 |
SAHIH AL-BUKHARI Narrated Aisha: The Prophet engaged me when I was a girl of six (years). We went to Medina and stayed at the home of Bani-al-Harith bin Khazraj. Then I got ill and my hair fell down. Later on my hair grew (again) and my mother, Um Ruman, came to me while I was playing in a swing with some of my girl friends. She called me, and I went to her, not knowing what she wanted to do to me. She caught me by the hand and made me stand at the door of the house. I was breathless then, and when my breathing became all right, she took some water and rubbed my face and head with it. Then she took me into the house. There in the house I saw some Ansari women who said, "Best wishes and Allah's Blessing and a good luck." Then she entrusted me to them and they prepared me (for the marriage). Unexpectedly Allah's Apostle came to me in the forenoon and my mother handed me over to him, and at that time I was a girl of nine years of age. (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 5, Book 58, Number 234) Narrated Hisham's father: Khadija died three years before the Prophet departed to Medina. He stayed there for two years or so and then he married 'Aisha when she was a girl of six years of age, and he consumed that marriage when she was nine years old. (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 5, Book 58, Number 236) Narrated 'Aisha: Allah's Apostle said to me, "You were shown to me twice (in my dream) before I married you. I saw an angel carrying you in a silken piece of cloth, and I said to him, 'Uncover (her),' and behold, it was you. I said (to myself), 'If this is from Allah, then it must happen.' Then you were shown to me, the angel carrying you in a silken piece of cloth, and I said (to him), 'Uncover (her), and behold, it was you. I said (to myself), 'If this is from Allah, then it must happen.'" (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 9, Book 87, Number 140; see also Number 139) Narrated 'Aisha: that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old, and then she remained with him for nine years (i.e., till his death). (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 64; see also Numbers 65 and 88) SAHIH MUSLIM 'A'isha (Allah be pleased with her) reported: Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) married me when I was six years old, and I was admitted to his house at the age of nine. She further said: We went to Medina and I had an attack of fever for a month, and my hair had come down to the earlobes. Umm Ruman (my mother) came to me and I was at that time on a swing along with my playmates. She called me loudly and I went to her and I did not know what she had wanted of me. She took hold of my hand and took me to the door, and I was saying: Ha, ha (as if I was gasping), until the agitation of my heart was over. She took me to a house, where had gathered the women of the Ansar. They all blessed me and wished me good luck and said: May you have share in good. She (my mother) entrusted me to them. They washed my head and embellished me and nothing frightened me. Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) came there in the morning, and I was entrusted to him. (Sahih Muslim, Book 008, Number 3309; see also 3310) 'A'isha (Allah be pleased with her) reported that Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) married her when she was seven years old, and he was taken to his house as a bride when she was nine, and her dolls were with her; and when he (the Holy Prophet) died she was eighteen years old. (Sahih Muslim, Book 008, Number 3311) SUNAN ABU DAWUD Aisha said: The Apostle of Allah (may peace be upon him) married me when I was seven years old. The narrator Sulaiman said: Or six years. He had intercourse with me when I was nine years old. (Sunan Abu Dawud, Number 2116) Narrated Aisha, Ummul Mu'minin: The Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) married me when I was seven or six. When we came to Medina, some women came. According to Bishr's version: Umm Ruman came to me when I was swinging. They took me, made me prepared and decorated me. I was then brought to the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him), and he took up cohabitation with me when I was nine. She halted me at the door, and I burst into laughter. (Sunan Abu Dawud, Book 41, Number 4915) Narrated Aisha, Ummul Mu'minin: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) used to kiss her and suck her tongue when he was fasting. (Sunan Abu Dawud, Book 13, Number 2380) SUNAN NASA‘I … When Hadrat Aisha passed nine years of marriage life, the Holy Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) fell in mortal sickness… ‘A’isha was eighteen years of age at the time when the Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) passed away and she remained a widow for forty-eight years till she died at the age of sixty-seven. She saw the rules of four Caliphs in her lifetime. She died on Ramadan 58 A.H. during the Caliphate of Hadrat Amir Mu‘awiya… (Sunan Nasa'i: English translation with Arabic Text, compiled by Imam Abu Abd-ur-Rahman Ahmad Nasa'i, rendered into English by Muhammad Iqbal Siddiqui [Kazi Publication, 121-Zulqarnain Chambers, Gampat Road, Lahore, Pakistan; first edition, 1994], Volume 1, p. 108) SUNAN IBN-I-MAJAH 1876. ‘A’isha (Allah be pleased with her) is reported to have said: Allah’s Messenger (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) contracted marriage with me while I was (yet) a six years [sic] old girl. Then we arrived at Medina and stayed with Banu Harith b. Khazraj. I fell victim to fever; then my hair (of the head fell off (and became scattered). Then they became plenty and hanged down upto [sic] the earlobes. My mother ‘Umm Ruman came to me while I was (playing) in a swing alongwith [sic] my play-mates. She (the mother) called me loudly. I went to her and I did not know what he [sic] wanted. She seized my hand and stopped me at the door of the house and I was hearing [sic] violently until the agitation of my heart was over. Then she took some water and wiped it over my face and head. Then she admitted me to the house when some woman [sic] of Ansar were present in the house. They said, "You have entered with blessings and good fortune." Then she (the mother) entrusted me to them. So they embellished me and nothing frightened me but Allah’s Messenger (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) (when he came there) in the morning and they (the women) entrusted me to him. On that day, I was a nine years [sic] old girl." 1877. Abdullah (Allah be pleased with him) is reported to have said, "The Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) married ‘A’isha while she was a seven years [sic] old girl and took him [sic] to his house as a bride when she was nine years old and he parted with her (after his demise) when she was eighteen years old." According to Al-Zawa‘id its isnad is sahih in accordance with the condition prescribed by Bukhari, but munqata because Abu ‘Ubaida did not hear from his father. Shu‘ba Abu Hatim and Ibn Hibban mentioned him amongst the authentic and reliable authorities. Tirmidhi in al-Jami’ and al-Mazzi in al-Atraf (has expressed the same opinion). Nasa‘i has transmitted this hadith in al-Sughra from the hadith ‘A’isha (Allah be pleased with her). (Sunan Ibn-I-Majah, Imam Abdullah Muhammad B. Yazid Ibn-I-Maja Al-Qazwini, English version by Muhammad Tufail Ansari [Kazi Publications, 121-Zulqarnain Chambers, Gampat Road, Lahore Pakistan, first edition, 1995], volume III, pp. 133-134) IBN HISHAM He married ‘A’isha in Mecca when she was a child of seven and lived with her in Medina when she was nine or ten. She was the only virgin that he married. Her father, Abu Bakr, married her to him and the apostle gave her four hundred dirhams. (Ibn Ishaq, Sirat Rasulullah (The Life of Muhammad), translated by Alfred Guillaume [Oxford University Press, Karachi, tenth impression 1995], p. 792) AL-TABARI In this year also the Messenger of God consummated his marriage with ‘A’ishah. This was in Dhu al-Qa‘dah (May-June 623) eight months after his arrival in Medina according to some accounts, or in Shawwal (April-May 623) seven months after his arrival according to others. He had married her in Mecca three years before the Hijrah, after the death of Khadijah. At that time she was six or, according to other accounts, seven years old. According to ‘Ab al-Hamid b. Bayan al-Sukkari- Muhammad b. Yazid- Isma‘il (that is, Ibn Abi Khalid)- ‘Abd al-Rahman b. Abi al-Dahhak- a man from Quraysh- ‘Abd al-Rahman b. Muhammad: ‘Abd Allah b. Safwan together with another person came to ‘A’ishah, and ‘A’ishah said (to the latter), "O so-and-so, have you heard what Hafsah has been saying?" He said, "Yes, O Mother of the Faithful." ‘Abd Allah b. Safwan asked her, "What is that?" She replied, "There are nine special features in me that have not been in any woman, except for what God bestowed on Maryam bt. ‘Imran. By God, I do not say this to exalt myself over any of my companions." "What are these?" he asked. She replied, "The angel brought down my likeness; the Messenger of God married me when I was seven; my marriage was consummated when I was nine; he married me when I was a virgin, no other man having shared me with him; inspiration came to him when he and I were in a single blanket; I was one of the dearest people to him, a verse of the Qur’an was revealed concerning me when the community was almost destroyed; I saw Gabriel when none of his other wives saw him; and he was taken (that is, died) in his house when there was nobody with him but the angel and myself." According to Abu Ja‘far (Al-Tabari): The Messenger of God married her, so it is said, in Shawwal, and consummated his marriage to her in a later year, also in Shawwal. (The History of Al-Tabari: The Foundation of the Community, translated by M.V. McDonald annotated by W. Montgomery Watt [State University of New York Press, Albany 1987], Volume VII, pp. 6-7) |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by benalvino2(m): 3:04pm On Dec 31, 2014 |
Sa‘id b. Yahya b. Sa‘id al-Umawi- his father- Muhammad b. ‘Amr- Yahya b. ‘Abd al-Rahman b. Hatib- ‘A’isha: When Khadijah died, Khawlah bt. Hakim b. Umayyah b. al-Awqas, wife of ‘Uthman b. Maz‘un, who was in Mecca, said [to the Messenger of God], "O Messenger of God, will you not marry?" He replied, "Whom?" "A maiden," she said, "if you like, or a non-maiden." He replied, "Who is the maiden?" "The daughter of the dearest creature of God to you," she answered, "‘A’ishah bt. Abi Bakr." He asked, "And who is the non-maiden?" "Sawdah bt. Zam‘ah b. Qays," she replied, "she has [long] believed in you and has followed you." [So the Prophet] asked her to go and propose to them on his behalf. She went to Abu Bakr’s house, where she found Umm Ruman, mother of ‘A’ishah, and said, "O Umm Ruman, what a good thing and a blessing has God brought to you!" She said, "What is that?" Khawlah replied, "The Messenger of God has sent me to ask for ‘A’ishah’s hand in marriage on his behalf." She answered, "I ask that you wait for Abu Bakr, for he should be on his way." When Abu Bakr came, Khawlah repeated what she had said. He replied, "She is [like] his brother’s daughter. Would she be appropriate for him?" When Khawlah returned to the Messenger of God and told him about it he said, "Go back to him and say that he is my brother in Islam and that I am his brother [in Islam], so his daughter is good for me." She came to Abu Bakr and told him what the Messenger of God had said. Then he asked her to wait until he returned. Umm Ruman said that al-Mut‘im b. ‘Adi had asked ‘A’ishah’s hand for his son, but Abu Bakr had not promised anything. Abu Bakr left and went to Mut‘im while his wife, mother of the son for whom he had asked ‘A’ishah’s hand, was with him. She said, "O son of Abu Quhafah, perhaps we could marry our son to your daughter if you could make him leave his religion and bring him in to the religion which you practice." He turned to her husband al-Mut‘im and said, "What is she saying?" He replied, "She says [what you have heard]." Abu Bakr left, [realizing that] God had [just] removed the problem he had in his mind. He said to Khawlah, "Call the Messenger of God." She called him and he came. Abu Bakr married [‘A’ishah] to him when she was [only] six years old. (The History of Al-Tabari: The Last Years of the Prophet, translated and annotated by Ismail K. Poonawala [State University of New York Press, Albany 1990], Volume IX, pp. 129-130) ‘A’ishah states: We came to Medina and Abu Bakr took up quarters in al-Sunh among the Banu al-Harith b. al-Khazraj. The Messenger of God came to our house and men and women of the Ansar gathered around him. My mother came to me WHILE I WAS BEING SWUNG ON A SWING BETWEEN TWO BRANCHES AND GOT ME DOWN. Jumaymah, my nurse, took over and wiped my face with some water and started leading me. When I was at the door, she stopped so I could catch my breath. I was then brought [in] while the Messenger of God was sitting on a bed in our house. [My mother] made me sit on his lap and said, "These are your relatives. May God bless you with them and bless them with you!" Then the men and women got up and left. The Messenger of God consummated his marriage with me in my house when I was nine years old. Neither a camel nor a sheep was slaughtered on behalf of me. Only Sa‘d b. ‘Ubaidah sent a bowl of food which he used to send to the Messenger of God. ‘Ali b. Nasr- ‘Abd al-Samad b. ‘Abd al-Warith- ‘Abd al-Warith b. ‘Abd al-Samad- his father- Aban al-‘Attar- Hisham b. ‘Urwah- ‘Urwah: He wrote to ‘Abd al-Malik b. Marwan stating that he had written to him about Khadijah bt. Khuwaylid, asking him about when she died. She died three years or close to that before the Messenger of God’s departure from Mecca, and he married ‘A’ishah after Khadijah’s death. The Messenger of God saw ‘A’ishah twice- [first when] it was said to him that she was his wife (she was six years old at that time), and later [when] he consummated she was nine years old. (The report goes back to Hisham b. Muhammad. See above, I, 1766). Then the Messenger of God married ‘A’ishah bt. Abi Bakr, whose name is ‘Atiq b. Abi Quhafah, who is ‘Uthman, and is called ‘Abd al-Rahman b. ‘Uthman b. ‘Amir b. ‘Amir b. Ka‘b b. Sa‘d b. Taym b. Murrah: [The Prophet] married her three years before the Emigration, when she was seven years old, and consummated the marriage when she was nine years old, after he had emigrated to Medina in Shawwal. She was eighteen years old when he died. The Messenger of God did not marry any maiden except her. (The History of al-Tabari, Volume IX, pp. 130-131) ‘A’ishah, daughter of Abu Bakr. Her mother was Umm Ruman bt. ‘Umayr b. ‘Amr, of the Banu Duhman b. al-Harith b. Ghanm b. Malik b. Kinanah. The Prophet married ‘A’ishah in Shawwal in the tenth year after the [beginning of his] prophethood, three years before Emigration. He consummated the marriage in Shawwal, eight months after Emigration. On the day he consummated the marriage with her she was nine years old. According to Ibn ‘Umayr [al-Waqidi]- Musa b. Muhammad b. ‘Abd al-Rahman- Raytah- ‘Amrah [bt. ‘Abd al-Rahman b. Sa’d]: ‘A’ishah was asked when the Prophet consummated his marriage with her, and she said: The Prophet left us and his daughters behind when he emigrated to Medina. Having arrived at Medina, he sent Zayd b. Harithah and his client Abu Rafi’ for us. He gave them two camels and 500 dirhams he had taken from Abu Bakr to buy [other] beasts they needed. Abu Bakr sent with them ‘Abdallah b. Urayqit al-Dili, with two or three camels. He wrote to [his son] ‘Abdallah b. Abi Bakr to take his wife Umm Ruman, together with me and my sister Asma’, al-Zubayr’s wife, [and leave for Medina]. They all left [Medina] together, and when they arrived at Qudayd Zayd b. Harithah bought three camels with those 500 dirhams. All of them then entered Mecca, where they met Talhah b. ‘Ubaydallah on his way to leave town, together with Abu Bakr’s family. So we all left: Zayd b. Harithah, Abu Rafi’, Fatimah, Umm Kulthum, and Sawdah bt. Zam‘ah. Ayd mounted Umm Ayman and [his son] Usamah b. Zayd on a riding beast; ‘Abdallah b. Abi Bakr took Umm Ruman and his two sisters, and Talhah b. ‘Ubaydallah came [too]. We all went together, and when we reached Bayd in Tamanni my camel broke loose. I was sitting in the litter together with my mother, and she started exclaiming "Alas, my daughter, alas [you] bride"; then they caught up with our camel, after it had safely descended the Lift. We then arrived at Medina, and I stayed with Abu Bakr’s children, and [Abu Bakr] went to the Prophet. The latter was then busy building the mosque and our homes around it, where he [later] housed his wives. We stayed in Abu Bakr’s house for a few days; then Abu Bakr asked [the Prophet] "O Messenger of God, what prevents you from consummating the marriage with your wife?" The Prophet said "The bridal gift (sadaq)." Abu Bakr gave him the bridal gift, twelve and a half ounces [of gold], and the Prophet sent for us. He consummated our marriage in my house, the one where I live now and where he passed away. (The History of Al-Tabari: Biographies of the Prophet’s Companions and Their Successors, translated by Ella Landau-Tasseron [State University of New York Press, Albany 1998], Volume XXXIX, pp. 171-173; underline emphasis ours) IBN KATHIR Yunus b. Bukayr stated, from Hisham b. ‘Urwa, from his father who said, "The Messenger of God (SAAS) married ‘A’isha three years after (the death of) Khadija. At that time (of the contract) ‘A’isha had been a girl of six. When he married her she was nine. The Messenger of God (SAAS) died when ‘A’isha was a girl of eighteen. " This tradition is considered gharib (unique in this line). Al-Bukhari had related, from ‘Ubayd b. Isma‘il, from Abu Usama, from Hisham b. ‘Urwa, from his father, who said, "Khadija died three years before the emigration of the Prophet (SAAS). He allowed a couple of years or so to pass after that, and then he contracted marriage with ‘A’isha when she was six, thereafter consummating marriage with her when she was nine years old." What ‘Urwah stated here is mursal, incomplete, as we mentioned above, but in its content it must be judged as muttasil, uninterrupted. His statement, "He contracted marriage with ‘A’isha when she was six, thereafter consummating marriage with her when she was nine" IS NOT DISPUTED BY ANYONE, and is well established in the sahih collections of traditions and elsewhere. He consummated marriage with her during the second year following the emigration to Medina. His contracting marriage with her took place some three years after Khadija’s death, though there is disagreement over this. The hafiz Ya‘qub b. Sufyan stated, "Al-Hajjaj related to us, that Hammad related to him, from Hisham b. ‘Urwa, from his father, from ‘A’isha, who said, ‘The Messenger of God (SAAS), contracted marriage with me (after) Khadija’s death and before his emigration from Mecca, when I was six years old. After we arrived in Medina some women came to me while I was playing on a swing; my hair was like that of a boy. They dressed me up and put make-up on me, then took me to the Messenger of God (SAAS), and he consummated our marriage. I was a girl of nine.’" The statement here "muttawaffa Khadija", "Khadija’s death" has to mean that it was shortly thereafter. Unless, that is, the word, ba‘da, "after", originally preceded this phrase and had been omitted from the account. The statement made by Yunus b. Bukayr and Abu Usama from Hisham b. ‘Urwa, from his father, is, therefore, not refuted. But God knows best. (Ibn Kathir, The Life of the Prophet Muhammad (Al-Sira al-Nabawiyya), Volume II, translated by professor Trevor Le Gassick, reviewed by Dr. Muneer Fareed [Garnet Publishing Limited, 8 Southern Court, south Street Reading RG1 4QS, UK; The Center for Muslim Contribution to Civilization, first paper edition, 2000], pp. 93-94) IBN QAYYIM Next, the Prophet… married Um Abdallah, Aishah, as-Siddiqah (the truthful one), daughter of as-Siddiq (the truthful one) Abu Bakr ibn Abi Qu’hafah, whom Allah has exonerated from above the seven heavens. ‘Aishah bint Abu Bakr was the beloved wife of the Prophet… The angel showed Aishah… to the Prophet… while she was wrapped in a piece of silk cloth, before he married her, and said to him. "This is your wife." The Prophet… married Aishah… during the lunar month of Shawwal, when she was six, and consummated the marriage in the first year after the Hijrah, in the month of Shawwal, when she was nine. The Prophet… did not marry any virgin, except Aishah… and the revelation never came to him while he was under the blanket with any of his wives, except Aishah. (Ibn Qayyim Al-Juaziyyah, Zad-ul Ma’ad fi Hadyi Khairi-l ‘Ibad (Provisions for the Hereafter, From the Guidance of Allah’s Best Worshipper), translated by Jalal Abualrub, edited by Alaa Mencke & Shaheed M. Ali [Madinah Publishers & Distributors, Orlando, Fl: First edition, December 2000], Volume I, pp. 157-158) MARTIN LINGS During the same year that followed Khadijah’s death, the Prophet dreamed that he saw a man who was carrying someone wrapped in a piece of silk. The man said to him: "This is thy wife, so uncover her." The Prophet lifted the silk and there was ‘A’ishah. But ‘A’ishah was only six years old, and he had passed his fiftieth year. Moreover Abu Bakr had promised her to Mut‘im for his son Jubayr. The Prophet simply said to himself: "If this be from God, He will bring it to pass." … Meantime Abu Bakr approached Mut‘im, who was persuaded without difficulty to forgo the marriage of ‘A’ishah to his son; and, some months after the marriage of Sawdah, ‘A’ishah also became the Prophet’s wife, through a marriage contracted by him and her father, at which she herself was not present. She said afterwards, that she had her first inkling of her new status when one day she was playing with her friends outside, not far from their house, and her mother came and too her by the hand and led her indoors, telling her that henceforth she must not go out to play, and that her friends must come to her instead. ‘A’ishah dimly guessed the reason, though her mother did not immediately tell her that she was married; and apart from having to play in their courtyard instead of in the roads, her life continued as before. (Lings, Muhammad: His Life Based on the Earliest Sources [Inner Traditions, International, Ltd.; Rochester Vermont, 1983], pp. 105-106) The Prophet and his daughters now went to live with Sawda in her new house; and after a month or two it was decided that ‘A’ishah’s wedding should take place. She was then only nine years old, a child of remarkable beauty, as might have been expected from her parentage… Small preparations were made for the wedding- not enough, at any rate for ‘A’ishah to have had a sense of a great and solemn occasion, and shortly before they were due to leave the house she had slipped out into the courtyard to play with her passing friend. In her own words: "I was playing on a see-saw and my long streaming hair was disheveled. They came and took me from my play and made me ready." Abu Bakr had bought some fine red-striped cloth from Bahrain and it had been made into a wedding-dress for her. In this they now clothed her. Then her mother took her to the newly built house where some women of the Helpers were waiting for her outside the door. They greeted her with the words "For good and for happiness- may all be well!" and led her into the presence of the Prophet. He stood their smiling and combed her hair and decked her with ornaments. Unlike his other marriages, at this there was no wedding feast… then they all went their ways, and the bridegroom and the bride were left together. For the last three years scarcely a day had passed by without one or more of ‘A’ishah’s friends coming to play with her in the courtyard adjoining her father’s house. Her removal to the Prophet’s house changed nothing in this respect. Friends now came every day to visit her in her own apartment – new friends made since her arrival in Medina and also some of the old ones whose parents, like hers, had emigrated. "I would be playing with my dolls," she said, "with the girls who were my friends, and the Prophet would come in and they would steal out of the house and he would go out after them and bring them back, for he was pleased for my sake to have them there." Sometimes he would say "Stay where ye are" before they had time to move. He would also join in their games sometimes, FOR HE LOVED CHILDREN [Sam- meaning Aisha was only a child like them] and had often played with his own daughters. The dolls of puppets had many different roles. "One day," said ‘A’ishah, "the Prophet came in when I was playing with the dolls and he said: ‘O ‘A’ishah, whatever game is this?’ I said: ‘It is Solomon’s horses,’ and he laughed." But sometimes as he came in he would simply screen himself with his cloak so as not to disturb them. (Ibid., pp. 132-134) SAIF-UR-RAHMAN AL-MUBARAKPURI 3. 'Aishah bint Abu Bakr: He married her in the eleventh year of Prophethood, a year after his marriage to Sawdah, and two years and five months before Al-Hijra. She was six years old when he married her. However, he did not consummate the marriage with her till Shawwal seven months after Al-Hijra, and that was in Madinah. She was nine then. She was the only virgin he married, and the most beloved creature to him. As a woman she was the most learnèd woman in jurisprudence. (Ar-Raheeq Al-Makhtum (THE SEALED NECTAR) Biography of the Noble Prophet, [Maktaba Dar-us-Salam Publishers & Distributors, First Edition 1995], "The Prophetic Household", p. 485; online source; underline emphasis ours) And here is a religious fatwah that mentions Muhammad’s physical relations with Aisha: Praise be to Allah and peace be upon the one after whom there is no [further] prophet. After the permanent committee for the scientific research and fatwahs (religious decrees) reviewed the question presented to the grand Mufti Abu Abdullah Muhammad Al-Shemary, the question forwarded to the committee by the grand scholar of the committee with reference number 1809 issued on 3/8/1421 (Islamic calendar). The inquirer asked the following: It has become wide spread these days, and especially during weddings, the habit of mufa’khathat of the children (mufa’khathat literally translated means "placing between the thighs" which means placing the male member between the thighs of a child). What is the opinion of scholars knowing full well that the prophet, the peace and prayer of Allah be upon him, also practiced the "thighing" of Aisha - the mother of believers - may Allah be please with her. After the committee studied the issue, they gave the following reply: It has not been the practice of the Muslims throughout the centuries to resort to this unlawful practice that has come to our countries from pornographic movies that the kufar (infidels) and enemies of Islam send. As for the prophet, peace and prayer of Allah be upon him, thighing his fiancée Aisha. She was six years of age and he could not have intercourse with her due to her small age. That is why [the prophet] peace and prayer of Allah be upon him placed HIS [MALE] MEMBER BETWEEN HER THIGHS AND MASSAGED IT SOFTLY, as the apostle of Allah had control of his [male] member not like other believers.. |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by benalvino2(m): 3:06pm On Dec 31, 2014 |
Weah96: Am sorry I am not providing any citation... this is not university stuff. You can search it if you like. |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by domack99(m): 4:11pm On Dec 31, 2014 |
Sorry about the spam blocker. benalvino2: Is am not mistaken you are referring to Aisha marrying the Prophet being mentioned by Bukhari? Yes Bukhari is 100% right do you know why?, its because it was confirmed in the Quran as well. If only Aisha age was mentioned in the Quran there would have been no debate at all. This situation could be related to the issue of Trinity in the bible, Christmas as Jesus birthday, Age of Mary when she gave birth to Jesus, etc. All these were not categorically mentioned in the bible which leave room for debating and division among scholars. No Christian (all denominations) debate that Mary gave birth to Jesus and the Miracle surrounding it, Why? because this was mentioned in the bible. To show how human we are you can see some differences even in Bukhari reporting on either 6 or 7. These people are scholars and work on fact to make meaning out of it, there books are not revelation you know. Bukhari contribution to Islam cannot be over emphasized he his a great scholar but he his human as well. Do you know how old Mary was when she gave birth to Jesus (Peace be on him). Even though not mentioned in the bible but Christian Scholars just like (Bukhari) have come up with different figure base on fact. let me know what your search his. benalvino2: Most times we search for what we want to believe, there are scholars who with fact believe that the age was not nine, not sure if you understand the writer or refuse to read between the lines again, the writer quote others and put in his own fact mostly around the age of Aisha elder sister and the death of the Prophet (SAW). Do you read or just scan through. And you don't need to copy and paste those verses, I know but what you don't know is that most of the Hadith are the same, what I mean is either Bukhari extract from them or they extract from Bukhari. Go an understand Hadith compilation, which include chain of Hadith, Weak and Strong Hadith, etc. You have a lot to learn you know. |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by benalvino2(m): 4:32pm On Dec 31, 2014 |
domack99: 15 to 16 years of age at the time of Jesus’ birth. According to Jewish customs at the time, a young woman might become betrothed to a young man as early as 12 years of age, though the consummation of their marriage through ceremony and physical intimacy would not happen until they were legally married, many months or even years later. And she was still a virgin when Jesus was born |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by domack99(m): 4:40pm On Dec 31, 2014 |
benalvino2: Bros you sabi copy and paste sha, if only you read through the line, some of your question would have been answered. See the colored part above, that means that Bukhari is right because the Quran mentioned it first about Aisha as wife of the Prophet (SAW), Bukhari compilation start years after the death of the Prophet (SAW). Please I challenge you to go and copy an paste as usual the passage of the Quran that says Aisha married at 6 or 9, then there will be no more debate. benalvino2: Again look at the last Hadith on you copy and paste work, I guess you didn't read this or refuse to read between the lines or else I believe you would have deleted it. This is an Hadith reported about Aisha marriage as well and no age was mentioned. Do you know why? |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by benalvino2(m): 4:57pm On Dec 31, 2014 |
domack99: So how does this support your point? A later year is the jump from 6 to 9... And I still don't see how this support your stands... all keeps saying she was 6 or 7 and mind you... most of these guys knows Mohammad personally. They wrote about his life and you guys use the hadith to aid you on the Qur'an yet you want to claim they have presented the prophet wrongfully |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by domack99(m): 5:08pm On Dec 31, 2014 |
benalvino2: Okay Good to hear, but remember this was not mentioned in the Bible just some scholars putting one and two together just like Bukhari to make it a meaningful fact. Yes some Christian scholar peg it as 15 or 16 others go lower like 10 or 12, I will quote a write up below and put the link as well. In ancient Israel, girls married in their teens, even early teens. [2] For Mary to be betrothed (engaged) but not yet formally married, yet old enough to have and nurse the Messiah, she would have been 12-14. The Zondervan Pictorial Encyclopedia of the Bible points out, “It appears that both boys and girls were married very young. Later [after the New Testament period] the rabbis fixed the minimum age for marriage at twelve for girls and thirteen for boys.” [3] http://www.truthortradition.com/articles/mary-a-teenage-bride-and-mother I have seen some Christian scholar also going further saying if Mary gave birth to Jesus at the age of 12 -14, she must have been pregnant earlier than that. See age of Mary is not mentioned in the bible just like Aisha age of marriage not mentioned in the Quran leaving room for human error/discussion. We human leave the important message of God that was passed through these Women and start unnecessary debate that we do us no good nor draw us closer to God faith. Bro your hatred for Islam is really alarming. |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by domack99(m): 5:32pm On Dec 31, 2014 |
benalvino2: Seriously you don't know how it support my point, sincerely I don't know how much I can spoon feed you. my advise is you avoid copy and paste and read between the lines. On the bolded part above, not all says 6 or 7, some where silence even one of the copied and paste work you did prove that it is not all, please check my previous reply. Go an understand the chain of Hadith, I mentioned that earlier. Those that did the final compilation didn't know the prophet personally. Bukhari was born years after the death of the Prophet (SAW), if am not mistaken it should be more than 100 years after. Though is father is an Islamic scholar as well which I believe makes learning easier for him. Bukhari is a great scholar of Islam and he did and excellent work in hadith compilation. Do you know he also belong to a particular school of thought.You have a lot to learn about Islam and Muslim brother. Know before you judge |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by benalvino2(m): 6:15pm On Dec 31, 2014 |
domack99: There is nothing for me to prove here... I have showed you everything and I understand it is hard for you to digest but it is true... You may want to read this http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Polemics/aishah.html |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by Weah96: 6:16pm On Dec 31, 2014 |
benalvino2: You are a dishonest person and the truth is not in you. |
| Re: Islam Concept Of Peace by benalvino2(m): 6:27pm On Dec 31, 2014 |
Weah96: Hahaha... look I am not claiming it is my work!!! Am not getting paid for it or getting academic points for it so I don't care providing any link. The person am debating with have tried to make Jesus look similar and violent like Muhammad and he failed then he turned to Mary upon knowing Aisha was just six. Mary was a teenager but her birth was a miracle... no one had sex with her. She shouldn't be brought into this debate |
Any Evidence That Christ Really Exists Without A Bible Backing / Shiloh 2009 Is Here Again, (8-12 December) You Are Invited! / Where Is God?
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